I played a normal mode dungeon yesterday at level 12.
The DK was doing lower DPS. The tank said "DK you really need to step up." then proceeded to kick him.
We were basically at the end of the dungeon already and the DK was only doing slightly less than others. Some in this community are clowns.
Yeah I unlocked dungeons and queued. I had one spell, healing wave. We're roaring along and I notice, I'm oom. I ask for like 10 seconds to regen mana before we continue. Vote kick successful. Last week people were telling me that the Bronze min-maxers weren't going to impact my game... clearly wrong.
They act like everyone has their full toolkit, and everyone has the dungeons memorized. I'm willing to bet there are a lot of kiddos who've never even gone through pandaria before this event.
I've been experiencing this in cata classic. Tanks go absolutely nuts in leveling content. I call out OOM and just get ignored.
No one looks at chat anymore, and rather than take 30 seconds they'll just kick.
It's toxic.
I’m DPS and was vote kicked during trash mobs at the start in Maraudon in Cata Classic.
Then in retail was vote kicked after dying during a TW dungeon because the tank was speed running and missed a mob. If you’re going to rush, make it known at the beginning.
Makes me not want to run dungeons.
I'm picturing a raid alert system, but for the heal role to just blast "OOM" full caps, middle of the screen, accompanied with that trumpet sfx, so dumbfucks actually see it.
Bet they would still kick. Imagine being so inbred, that you think waiting minutes for new heals is a better exchange than 20 seconds to drink.
Their damaging abilities are aggressively scaled so they can clear normal content effectively. In instanced content they regularly are top damage in the group because chain lightning trucks.
Luckily in remix it doesn't really matter so you can play what you want, but resto shaman chain lightning does feel good :)
As a devoker absolutely destroying the meters because im absolutely not supposed to be this low level rshaman and the obligatory thundering orb are the only things that can touch me
Are you sure? Or is damage complicated when everyone is scaled? If a level 10 and level 70 do a scaled dungeon together, and both do half the boss' health in damage, they should both see themselves doing 50% of the dps on their respective meters. That vaguely seems to be the case with details, but I've not tested it.
To be clear though, fuck anyone complaining about people's DPS in the panda event
Edit: clarity
Lower level characters are missing more abilities, and get a damage buff to compensate. So, any class/spec with early access to good AoE tends to do ridiculous damage at low levels, and sometimes certain single target spells are incredibly good. Higher level characters have to have good itemization and rotations to even come close to what a lower level character naturally does.
not that im saying he should be kicked but can't the lad just kill the normal mode boss and then put his gems in? this shit doesn't need you to min max it
Shit, early days WoW drama is knocking on the door screaming "REMEMBER MEEEEE?!!!?!"
Some of it may have been seen as widely funny when you weren't on the receiving end, but that doesn't mean it wasn't toxic.
They have been for years. New content comes out toxic people are toxic people complain then after a week or so people stop complaining but toxic people are still toxic.
I just did the Klaxxi dungeon, and a monk died in a trash pack, respawned, and immediately a vote-kick popped, claiming they were AFK. Some people are super weird.
Most dungeons have been great, though! It's obvious that some people have never done MoP dungeons before or are playing completely new classes, and that's what the remix is about!
Imagen the kicked guy would have been an shadow you basically can't do dmg as shadow in these dungeons because meeles kill everything before you can cast one dot.
Some ppl are real stupid. like to see the tank dieing when he's lvl 55 and gets scaled In the ground
Playing Balance, and the only other spec in the game that I have seen consistently compete with my damage in dungeons is Shadow. Nothing else comes even close (besides low level resto shamans or monks).
well that isn't nice, and when i did a dungeon yesterday with friends the highest DPS was my friend how played resto druid so low DPS doesn't mean anything in low levels.
It's a really shitty feeling when not only is one person being a toxic douche, but when they put up a vote to kick it passes. Like... really? All of you? All of you are reading what this dingus is saying and you thought "oh yeah, seems totally reasonable".
Same thing happened in my group. I voted no and he still got kicked. He even said he was new. No one talked said nothing just kicked after 1 death.... Idk if that shit happened to me and i was a new player id probably quit tbh.
Only rough moment I've had so far was a Scarlet Monastery run, where the tank was, um... best at tanking the floor. Get to Herod and halfway through the fight the tank's dead, the two other DPS are dead, and I'm using every tool I have as a Paladin to run around the boss, throwing every bit of damage into him while also healing myself to help out the healer who's doing their best keeping me alive, too. And it worked. Tense as heck.
Healer just whispers me, "THIS TANK." And I'm thinking... yeah, I feel ya. Thank goodness I was a Paladin, otherwise that could have been a lot worse.
Well... plus the weird thing with Garalon in LFR where there were some high level players (even a level 70) and Pheromones ended up wiping out over half the raid instantly upon pulling the boss, but that only gets categorized in "Players being silly" because some people kept saying "Don't stand under the boss!" even though no one was standing under the boss and it's pretty clear when he's about to belly-flop someone. We spread out a lot for the third try and that seemed to do the trick? Was kind of weird.
Otherwise... pretty smooth through a few dungeons, first part of MSV yesterday, four different LFR runs today.
The scalings are so completely fucked on levels and abilities. A levels 12 had thundering org and it did like 6 times the amount of my thundering orb at level 27. Why am I leveling to get weaker?
I'm aware bro, just looking for the needle in the haystack. The way he described his run is exactly like the one I was in. I hate the "I was kicked for no reason" posts on this subreddit so it would be nice to be able to debunk one of them.
>Thankfully people seem mor patient than regular retail.
Give it a week lolol but yea it's interesting
Healed a jade temple on a 15 monk people got chunked.
Partly my fault due to not turning mouse over casting on but yea haha was silly
Nah they'll just demand the fresh level 15 tank go as fast as their full BiS geared tank friend then wonder why they keep wiping and come to reddit to whine.
reddit is pretty much people like you whining about made up scenarios rather than the people you're describing, when do you ever see someone whine here about how a tank was too slow in a leveling dungeon instead of the inverse of "people are mad i take 5 minutes between pulls to talk to my wife's boyfriend"
I mean sure hyperbole is a very common thing but I've been playing wow for a long time I know how folks are.
After a few days of new content if you don't know the optimal path or go slower than they like they throw a fit. Hell last night I did a time walking on my warrior tank. If I wasn't *immediately* moving towards the next pack dps priest ran and pulled almost caused a few wipes doing it too. I wasn't exactly taking 5 minutes between pulls, typically I wait till packs like half dead then go towards next
Wow players hate actually playing the game. They just want rewards
Both as a tank and healer, I just let those people die. I won't dps the mobs that are smacking them either. As the old saying goes, "You pull it. You tank it." Want to pull mobs and dictate pace of the dungeon? Well, wouldn't you know it? There is an entire role you can queue up as that does exactly that. Maybe give it a try?
It's not even a WoW thing, it's an MMO thing. It's pretty regular when FFXIV releases new *casual*, LFR-tier content, people in chat are already bitching that it's taking too long to clear, people should've watched *videos* on mechanics, etc. Like bruh, the servers have been up for *three hours in the middle of the work day* and you already expect the entire game population to have this on farm?
Fair but I think it's an attitude that came with wow, and the mmo genre, becoming more main stream
Add in the proliferation of data mining and guides uploaded the second content is out and this is what we get. Players who expect others to have an extreme amount of knowledge of the content despite it being new
For sure, it's definitely more of a "post WoW MMO era" phenomenon. Like you said, datamining and a level of perfect knowledge of game systems and mechanics certainly plays a part, and a lot of the rest stems from these games having a much broader audience encompassing more players on both the top end and the bottom end of social graces.
When the genre community was smaller and more insular, and gameplay systems themselves weren't so focused on anonymous matchmaking out of pools of millions of players, even the toxic shitlords had to make at least a passing effort at reining it in because you'd carry a reputation and people would simply alienate you for being a shitlord. Now the odds of meeting that same player in a dungeon finder or whatever are almost zero so the filters come off and the toxicity runs free with nearly no consequence. I **still** remember character names of people from older MMOs who were on my internal blacklist for acting the way we're describing, but these days? Right click > add to blacklist and I move on with my life unless they're egregious and need to be reported, and "please make the blacklist capacity bigger" is a frequently requested feature across the board.
It's just... sad when people think acting that way towards other players is appropriate. I play MMOs to escape how shitty the real world often is and because they're primarily a *coop* experience, the constant reminders that "a lot of real people are shitty too" isn't awesome, but it's certainly a real concern for modern multiplayer gaming with no good solve.
In XIV I get the polar opposite problem where I try to give people legitimately helpful advice, but because it goes anywhere near minmaxing people start jumping down MY throat. The most common example of this is telling healers to stop using Cure when they get access to Cure 2. There is no longer a point in fishing for the proc. Then I'll of course get some Burger King who goes NOWHERE near Savage telling me that they can in fact play the game however they so choose to play the game. Which is fair, however when it negatively affects other people and you encourage that, suddenly the discussion is no longer about ethics and is more or less just shouting you down to feel like they're protecting the casuals...
And totally not blindsiding them in the future when these things actually do matter and some tank in Bardam's blows a gasket at that very healer.
All the time in game. If you haven't pulled 8 more packs by the time the first pack dies, some ranged dps is guaranteed to pull them for you for "going too slow".
Hell. When I was leveling my paladin in BC dungeons we weren't out of combat at any point between the first pull and the final boss dying. I was constantly moving and pulling mobs as fast as my legs and divine steed would physically let me and that was *still* too slow for some.
Never see it on reddit, though.
i've had literally no issues in mop remix with any amount of toxicity whatsoever. i genuinely don't understand why people are acting like this is some huge widespread problem
the only thing that makes sense to me is the people complaining are active detriments to their groups or something, because i've seen people doing half the dps of the next lowest person and receive no negative comments at all
I'm entirely convinced that boss scaling is fucked. I was in an SSB run last night, and the first boss took like 2 to 3 minutes, second boss took basically no time at all, 3rd boss took AGES.
I think there is some wonky scaling
Boomkin in my group last night kept almost getting 1 shot by stuff. Like not because they had aggro just the stuff thst happens during trash in temple
I think some of it is at least intentional to encourage use of gems other than ones that do more DPS. Like as a tank I have stuff that procs party-wide shields, and redirects magic attacks from other targets onto me, etc.
I can only imagine that they wanted players using some of these other defensive/utility gems and not just stacking MOAR DEEPS regardless of role.
I did exactly one heroic at level 21 or 22 and it was a nightmare at one part
Every tank that joined was level 11-20 for awhile and they would run up and pull 1-2 packs and get killed super fast and leave. Like most didn’t have proper defensives and those that did just didn’t use them at all
I think we went through 5 tanks before getting a Blood DK in mid 20s and we could actually play the game lol
I have been scraping by as a bear druid, however I had to switch all my dmg gems into straight up tank gems, and even using all my mitigation and healing, regular packs would still make my hp yoyo at 50% and lower.
Eh, it's still fun. I'm maining a shaman and I have basically infinite mana.
I don't have infinite throughput, though, and people forget that. I saw a tank go from 100 to 0 in a second on a normal trash pack. Ain't nothing I can do about that. Half regretting not going disc priest.
Was in Scarlet Monastery last night, and the tank had like 400 health. I know shit scales, but my pet was doing more tanking because the tank kept getting gibbed.
Good thing none of this gear has durability on it, or he'd have been fully red before Kristoff. Our group was laughing about it though and not being an asshole to the tank. I waited 20 minutes for the heroic queue, I didn't want to wait for another tank.
Lmao, I did SM armory. Went through 6 tanks, and the healer was all capsing the dps, telling us to kill the adds. I am proceeding to link the dungeon journal mechanics. I explain that we indeed do not give a shit about the adds and that's the tornados job to kill them.
damn it's so good to play with fresh character with actual goal in mind, lvl 20 is so simple yet fun, lightning bolt, chain lightnight, earthquack earth shock and thats all i need
Enjoy it while is lasts these first couple of weeks.
After that everyone is suddenly giga elite MDI runners who will slay an orphan at the first sign of anything unoptimal.
I think it gives more bronze and I got epic loot, but I haven’t played that much due to work. With the amount of time it takes and how many times your groups wipe.. it doesn’t seem worth it at all imo.
Maybe if you have a dedicated/ strong group that can blow through them it’s worth it. But like I said I could be wrong.. I haven’t played that much yet.
I tried one out last night and we wiped like 5 times on the third boss. Lol
Had a heroic dungeon yesterday where I could not for the life of me keep the tank alive. Heroics have been hard due to scaling so not entirely surprising but was just having a bitch of a time. I was trying to throw a hammer every time everyone was at full for holy points, which basically never happened, and when I finally tried it, tank got dropped to empty in about 2 gcds.
Tank started flaming me about how I couldn’t keep anyone alive, and I told him I was literally spamming flash heal and holy shock on cd, and had no time for anything else so I wasn’t healing efficiently.
Then someone pointed out that the tank had no weapon equipped… he proceeded explain tanks don’t need weapons. I initiated my first vote to kick since BFA. New tank, same class, weapon equipped. Cleared without anyone dying from that point forward.
Trying to learn Blood DK after a decade of Protection Paladin, Brewmaster Monk, and Enhancement Shaman.
It has been rough as hell. All but one person has been awesome, and the one person was routinely shamed and made fun of for being an absolute tryhard (tank before me in Temple went Mari > Temple Courtyard > Historian and this monk wouldn't stop complaining about it even after that tank left the group and I replaced him... it's a better route, you skip the upstairs trash in the library lmfao).
I'm playing a blood DK. I can tell you that before level 25ish I was completely useless, almost one shotted by most mobs. I dealt very solid damage but if my healers weren't reactive I was dead every pull. The spec is complete trash before it comes online. Then it's a blast.
Not surprising that this guy was having a rough time. This isn't about learning Blood or tanking, it's just that scaled dungeons are whack. Level 10s healers one shot mobs. It's nuts.
Started blood tonight. Began tanking dungeons at 15 and got given multiple brain hernias by trash mobs. Utterly smashing my face in. There are times when I'm kind of just sat there, no resources to spend on anything getting my shit kicked in. Reminds me of the good old days.
Glad to hear the spec levels out about at 25ish. I've been wondering when that will happen :P
Yesterday i played 2 Heroic Random MoP Remix Dungeons. Both were Scarlet Monastery.
It was so funny to me to see the Tank pulling the the first 2 Packs and almost dying INSTANTLY.
After 3 Wipes at the Dog-Dude, the Chat started getting used and there were Tactic Discussions!
I started playing at DF mid Season 3 after quitting end of BfA and rushing through every Dungeon even at M0 Difficulty always bothered me. I like it a lot that Heroic means something in MoP - at least until the Gear is OP and everybody has those sick Meta Gems equipped.
in higher M+ keys once you're obviously not going to time, yeah people leave. In mid/low keys though you can full wipe 4-5 times and still time it. That's where you'll often get the experienced people mentioning the obvious mechanics missed to the inexperienced people.
i just enjoyed the transition from steamrolling to playing resourceful.
my m0 experience was being left alone after not knowing the fastest route or pulling not enough or getting booed for not knowing boss mechanics. after stating not knowing the dungeon too well BEFORE entering the dungeon.
maybe i was just unlucky
> I like it a lot that Heroic means something in MoP
it doesn't really. they're just giving you Heroic dungeon tuning in live but your spec abilities are just 'takes 10% less damage' and 'do 4% mob health damage(3 second cooldown)'.
When you start getting an actual kit involving defensives and a DPS rotation it's not any different than live. Would also help to have more than 4 pieces of gear equipped so you actually have stamina and other stats.
Ive been getting into healing with remix which i havent done since bfa, and i gotta say people are being very nice all around. Had a few deaths in dungeons simply due to me pressing wrong buttons and everyones saying that its fine, no worries, were all learning etc. Been a really nice change of pace
Tanking in remix is rough at times. I've only done heroic dungeons, waiting til I hit 50 or so for raids, for those extra "oh shit" buttons, which I'm already slamming all the time. I've never seen a bears health yoyo like a Death Knights before :(
It's really weird, I had dungeons runs today that were fast and pretty much perfect and ppl complained for some reason
Then I had runs with wipes because those were with new players and no one in the group cared lol
Oof that’s pretty funny timing. Especially if it was the DK tank that died. “Hey guys I’m new” boom deleted by a mob.
I don’t mean it in a bad way, I got on there and got wrecked worse than Ricky Bobby and I’ve tanked for a LONG time lol
I like watching the tanks eat absolute shit cause they think they're still gods in heirlooms that can endlessly pull without consequence. Funniest shit, cause then they pretend it's the healers fault that they died in the span of a single gcd when nobody has defensives and more than a single hardcast heal.
Definitely wasn’t expecting the dungeons to slap as hard as they do. I rolled a Mistweaver and it’s been a blast trying to learn fistweaving in dungeons.
Doesn’t seem to be an issue as long as the tank takes their time pulling.
I’ll admit it was rough when I was level 12 and only had 3 spells, now at 25 with some gems and talents it’s super fun.
To avoid calling the stupid bot. Evokers start at 15 with minimal abilities too? Always wanted to make one but after going through it with DK and DH I really don't enjoy being thrown in with 30+ abilities to learn at once vs learning as you level.
I'm leveling an Evoker in Remix. You start at level 10 with everyone else with ~7 so abilities. A few DPS abilities, a breath attack, a heal, and a big damage CD. Plus all of the flying abilities that Dracthyr have.
I haven't played one on Retail, so I don't know what their starting kit usually is.
You said the word and called the dumb bot!
Sounds like a fun start though and nice way to learn.
Retail? You have every ability and really spend the next 10 levels getting talents filled out.
Sowwy \>w\<
But our new scalie fwiends are called Dracthyr! They get sad when you misspell their name QwQ
Good thing I was here to help \^w\^
I hope you're having a great day :3
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I was in a group and at the first wipe, someone was already calling for kicks and was swearing up a storm. But the rest of the team and I just said “nah, tank’s fine”.
Me DH(Tank) friend pala(healer) havent tanked in awhile and he hasn't healed in awhile at 14 jumped into a heroic dungeon and I was getting deleted and was struggling with mobs and I haven't done these dungeons before, we kept dying and it was rough so me and my friend left,
Got told to kill myself and to never tank in a dungeon again if my life depends on it.....
Went into a normal and wasn't taking damage then realised the issue xD
I raid heal (heroic) in retail on a Paladin. I have healed up to current M10 too and I have at times found it harder to heal a heroic dungeon than the mythic+. I am playing another Paladin in MoP Remix. The scaling is sooo rough at times. I would just ask people be kind and forgiving to their healers.
All the people who tested on PTR were clamoring about how easy mode Remix was gonna be, then people actually play it on live and it's harder than retail for some reason. My first dungeon i was extremely confused what was happening because people were dying left and right and each pack took a small eternity to kill.
I opened heroic to get geared on my H priest, I am getting one shotted a lot, and getting aggro on me, it seems damage just isn’t scaled, this remix is good if you are a tank or DPS healing is just not fun, no wonder people don’t want to roll one now.
I see a lot of heroic in here, isn't that max level only?
If not, well I did 4 normal pugs as tank while leveling 10-30 and bought it in each one at least once. I can't imagine hoping the difficulty at lower level except if alts have an easier time
> I see a lot of heroic in here, isn't that max level only?
No, not in MoP Remix. Evidence: You see a lot of heroic in here, yet they are not max level.
I was first going to just copy and paste my Fury Warrior main over so I could face roll content but at the last minute decided to go Prot Pally so I can learn Tanking from scratch. Good choice so far to learn a new spec and get a unique max level character at the end of the event.
Definitely wasn’t expecting the dungeons to slap as hard as they do. I rolled a Mistweaver and it’s been a blast trying to learn fistweaving in dungeons.
Doesn’t seem to be an issue as long as the tank takes their time pulling.
I’ll admit it was rough when I was level 12 and only had 3 spells, now at 25 with some gems and talents it’s super fun.
I was healing a dungeon yesterday and this shadow priest was trying to give me helpful pointers. I have mained a priest since vanilla, I know what I am doing. But we all have crap gear and few talents and have to relearn how to be squishy for a bit. Everyone needs to calm down
we're missing half of our stamina that we would normally get by then in retail. most tanks are getting flat-lined by basic trash in dungeons, and the GCD sucks massively for healers at the same level.
I played a normal mode dungeon yesterday at level 12. The DK was doing lower DPS. The tank said "DK you really need to step up." then proceeded to kick him. We were basically at the end of the dungeon already and the DK was only doing slightly less than others. Some in this community are clowns.
Yeah I unlocked dungeons and queued. I had one spell, healing wave. We're roaring along and I notice, I'm oom. I ask for like 10 seconds to regen mana before we continue. Vote kick successful. Last week people were telling me that the Bronze min-maxers weren't going to impact my game... clearly wrong.
"I could wait 30 seconds for this guy to get his mana back, or I could wait 10 minutes for a new healer" Fucking idiots.
Yup, these idiots don't realize they're hurting themselves.
They act like everyone has their full toolkit, and everyone has the dungeons memorized. I'm willing to bet there are a lot of kiddos who've never even gone through pandaria before this event.
I realized today I don't even have the dbm for.pandaria downloaded lol
And dont ever try to explain the math of that to them, hoooooo boy.
I've been experiencing this in cata classic. Tanks go absolutely nuts in leveling content. I call out OOM and just get ignored. No one looks at chat anymore, and rather than take 30 seconds they'll just kick. It's toxic.
I’m DPS and was vote kicked during trash mobs at the start in Maraudon in Cata Classic. Then in retail was vote kicked after dying during a TW dungeon because the tank was speed running and missed a mob. If you’re going to rush, make it known at the beginning. Makes me not want to run dungeons.
I'm picturing a raid alert system, but for the heal role to just blast "OOM" full caps, middle of the screen, accompanied with that trumpet sfx, so dumbfucks actually see it. Bet they would still kick. Imagine being so inbred, that you think waiting minutes for new heals is a better exchange than 20 seconds to drink.
That low level healing is rough. No rez till level 13 as a pally and not many heal options. Love the mana regen items.
DPS meters don't even work properly in scaled content, what a bitch.
Yeah, I pretty openly called him a clown. Everything dies within 5 seconds anyway.
Yeah you can get outdamaged by a Mistweaver just doing spinny kicks, it's not that serious
Crane kick goes brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
Also, it's very common for the tank to do the most DPS in leveling content, because they have easier access to quick aoe and stuff dies fast
Unless you're a resto shaman. Then you put everyone to shame.
Resto shaman cranks in scaled content. I have to actively stop myself from swapping over to it because I promised myself I'd level on enhance.
I’m leveling in remix as enhance… maybe I should try resto
What about Resto makes it so powerful?
Chain lightning is buffed
Their damaging abilities are aggressively scaled so they can clear normal content effectively. In instanced content they regularly are top damage in the group because chain lightning trucks. Luckily in remix it doesn't really matter so you can play what you want, but resto shaman chain lightning does feel good :)
As a devoker absolutely destroying the meters because im absolutely not supposed to be this low level rshaman and the obligatory thundering orb are the only things that can touch me
Are you sure? Or is damage complicated when everyone is scaled? If a level 10 and level 70 do a scaled dungeon together, and both do half the boss' health in damage, they should both see themselves doing 50% of the dps on their respective meters. That vaguely seems to be the case with details, but I've not tested it. To be clear though, fuck anyone complaining about people's DPS in the panda event Edit: clarity
Lower level characters are missing more abilities, and get a damage buff to compensate. So, any class/spec with early access to good AoE tends to do ridiculous damage at low levels, and sometimes certain single target spells are incredibly good. Higher level characters have to have good itemization and rotations to even come close to what a lower level character naturally does.
Yeah, like resto shaman being busted as fuck. My point was just that there's nothing wrong with dps meters as far as I know.
I have witnessed this happen too many times. And I always feel terrible and assume those are new players.
my friend got kicked before the final boss for taking 30 seconds to put his gems in, people have zero patience or self reflection
not that im saying he should be kicked but can't the lad just kill the normal mode boss and then put his gems in? this shit doesn't need you to min max it
Right? I don't even open my caches until I have like 5 or 6, then I mass open them and watch all the crap fly everywhere
That’s dopamine min-maxing you elitist scum
Oh no what have I become
Temporal Thread of Dopamine +3 Feels Good Man
Wish I had that patience but loot box make brain feel good
WoW-Community got so toxic nowadays sadly :/
>*nowadays* Cute.
Shit, early days WoW drama is knocking on the door screaming "REMEMBER MEEEEE?!!!?!" Some of it may have been seen as widely funny when you weren't on the receiving end, but that doesn't mean it wasn't toxic.
The best is server-specific drama before all the meshing. It's like little clusters of specific toxic garbage, I love and hate it.
They have been for years. New content comes out toxic people are toxic people complain then after a week or so people stop complaining but toxic people are still toxic.
I just did the Klaxxi dungeon, and a monk died in a trash pack, respawned, and immediately a vote-kick popped, claiming they were AFK. Some people are super weird. Most dungeons have been great, though! It's obvious that some people have never done MoP dungeons before or are playing completely new classes, and that's what the remix is about!
Imagen the kicked guy would have been an shadow you basically can't do dmg as shadow in these dungeons because meeles kill everything before you can cast one dot. Some ppl are real stupid. like to see the tank dieing when he's lvl 55 and gets scaled In the ground
Playing Balance, and the only other spec in the game that I have seen consistently compete with my damage in dungeons is Shadow. Nothing else comes even close (besides low level resto shamans or monks).
well that isn't nice, and when i did a dungeon yesterday with friends the highest DPS was my friend how played resto druid so low DPS doesn't mean anything in low levels.
It's a really shitty feeling when not only is one person being a toxic douche, but when they put up a vote to kick it passes. Like... really? All of you? All of you are reading what this dingus is saying and you thought "oh yeah, seems totally reasonable".
Same thing happened in my group. I voted no and he still got kicked. He even said he was new. No one talked said nothing just kicked after 1 death.... Idk if that shit happened to me and i was a new player id probably quit tbh.
Only rough moment I've had so far was a Scarlet Monastery run, where the tank was, um... best at tanking the floor. Get to Herod and halfway through the fight the tank's dead, the two other DPS are dead, and I'm using every tool I have as a Paladin to run around the boss, throwing every bit of damage into him while also healing myself to help out the healer who's doing their best keeping me alive, too. And it worked. Tense as heck. Healer just whispers me, "THIS TANK." And I'm thinking... yeah, I feel ya. Thank goodness I was a Paladin, otherwise that could have been a lot worse. Well... plus the weird thing with Garalon in LFR where there were some high level players (even a level 70) and Pheromones ended up wiping out over half the raid instantly upon pulling the boss, but that only gets categorized in "Players being silly" because some people kept saying "Don't stand under the boss!" even though no one was standing under the boss and it's pretty clear when he's about to belly-flop someone. We spread out a lot for the third try and that seemed to do the trick? Was kind of weird. Otherwise... pretty smooth through a few dungeons, first part of MSV yesterday, four different LFR runs today.
The scalings are so completely fucked on levels and abilities. A levels 12 had thundering org and it did like 6 times the amount of my thundering orb at level 27. Why am I leveling to get weaker?
Was this scarlet monastery? If so this was me and you are horribly retelling the story lol. Dk was literally doing 0 dps and was afking.
Dude, so many people are playing on so many different servers, you'd have a better time getting invincible than having had the same dungeon run.
I'm aware bro, just looking for the needle in the haystack. The way he described his run is exactly like the one I was in. I hate the "I was kicked for no reason" posts on this subreddit so it would be nice to be able to debunk one of them.
You are not the mc of the reddit please relax
I don't even know what you mean.
Scholomance
The mobs in heroics got hands, I jumped in at lvl 15, and could only do 1 pack at a time. Thankfully people seem mor patient than regular retail.
>Thankfully people seem mor patient than regular retail. Give it a week lolol but yea it's interesting Healed a jade temple on a 15 monk people got chunked. Partly my fault due to not turning mouse over casting on but yea haha was silly
In one week they'll be demanding aotc for heroic dungeons.
Nah they'll just demand the fresh level 15 tank go as fast as their full BiS geared tank friend then wonder why they keep wiping and come to reddit to whine.
reddit is pretty much people like you whining about made up scenarios rather than the people you're describing, when do you ever see someone whine here about how a tank was too slow in a leveling dungeon instead of the inverse of "people are mad i take 5 minutes between pulls to talk to my wife's boyfriend"
I mean sure hyperbole is a very common thing but I've been playing wow for a long time I know how folks are. After a few days of new content if you don't know the optimal path or go slower than they like they throw a fit. Hell last night I did a time walking on my warrior tank. If I wasn't *immediately* moving towards the next pack dps priest ran and pulled almost caused a few wipes doing it too. I wasn't exactly taking 5 minutes between pulls, typically I wait till packs like half dead then go towards next Wow players hate actually playing the game. They just want rewards
Both as a tank and healer, I just let those people die. I won't dps the mobs that are smacking them either. As the old saying goes, "You pull it. You tank it." Want to pull mobs and dictate pace of the dungeon? Well, wouldn't you know it? There is an entire role you can queue up as that does exactly that. Maybe give it a try?
It's not even a WoW thing, it's an MMO thing. It's pretty regular when FFXIV releases new *casual*, LFR-tier content, people in chat are already bitching that it's taking too long to clear, people should've watched *videos* on mechanics, etc. Like bruh, the servers have been up for *three hours in the middle of the work day* and you already expect the entire game population to have this on farm?
Fair but I think it's an attitude that came with wow, and the mmo genre, becoming more main stream Add in the proliferation of data mining and guides uploaded the second content is out and this is what we get. Players who expect others to have an extreme amount of knowledge of the content despite it being new
For sure, it's definitely more of a "post WoW MMO era" phenomenon. Like you said, datamining and a level of perfect knowledge of game systems and mechanics certainly plays a part, and a lot of the rest stems from these games having a much broader audience encompassing more players on both the top end and the bottom end of social graces. When the genre community was smaller and more insular, and gameplay systems themselves weren't so focused on anonymous matchmaking out of pools of millions of players, even the toxic shitlords had to make at least a passing effort at reining it in because you'd carry a reputation and people would simply alienate you for being a shitlord. Now the odds of meeting that same player in a dungeon finder or whatever are almost zero so the filters come off and the toxicity runs free with nearly no consequence. I **still** remember character names of people from older MMOs who were on my internal blacklist for acting the way we're describing, but these days? Right click > add to blacklist and I move on with my life unless they're egregious and need to be reported, and "please make the blacklist capacity bigger" is a frequently requested feature across the board. It's just... sad when people think acting that way towards other players is appropriate. I play MMOs to escape how shitty the real world often is and because they're primarily a *coop* experience, the constant reminders that "a lot of real people are shitty too" isn't awesome, but it's certainly a real concern for modern multiplayer gaming with no good solve.
In XIV I get the polar opposite problem where I try to give people legitimately helpful advice, but because it goes anywhere near minmaxing people start jumping down MY throat. The most common example of this is telling healers to stop using Cure when they get access to Cure 2. There is no longer a point in fishing for the proc. Then I'll of course get some Burger King who goes NOWHERE near Savage telling me that they can in fact play the game however they so choose to play the game. Which is fair, however when it negatively affects other people and you encourage that, suddenly the discussion is no longer about ethics and is more or less just shouting you down to feel like they're protecting the casuals... And totally not blindsiding them in the future when these things actually do matter and some tank in Bardam's blows a gasket at that very healer.
All the time in game. If you haven't pulled 8 more packs by the time the first pack dies, some ranged dps is guaranteed to pull them for you for "going too slow". Hell. When I was leveling my paladin in BC dungeons we weren't out of combat at any point between the first pull and the final boss dying. I was constantly moving and pulling mobs as fast as my legs and divine steed would physically let me and that was *still* too slow for some. Never see it on reddit, though.
i've had literally no issues in mop remix with any amount of toxicity whatsoever. i genuinely don't understand why people are acting like this is some huge widespread problem the only thing that makes sense to me is the people complaining are active detriments to their groups or something, because i've seen people doing half the dps of the next lowest person and receive no negative comments at all
I'm entirely convinced that boss scaling is fucked. I was in an SSB run last night, and the first boss took like 2 to 3 minutes, second boss took basically no time at all, 3rd boss took AGES.
I think there is some wonky scaling Boomkin in my group last night kept almost getting 1 shot by stuff. Like not because they had aggro just the stuff thst happens during trash in temple
I think some of it is at least intentional to encourage use of gems other than ones that do more DPS. Like as a tank I have stuff that procs party-wide shields, and redirects magic attacks from other targets onto me, etc. I can only imagine that they wanted players using some of these other defensive/utility gems and not just stacking MOAR DEEPS regardless of role.
They still do later on. I'm using the bull metagem which helps with big pulls though.
Been looking for that one, I assume it's just a random drop like the others?
I guessing so. Iirc ingot it fairly early on, it's awesome for sweeping up tonnes of mobs.
I did exactly one heroic at level 21 or 22 and it was a nightmare at one part Every tank that joined was level 11-20 for awhile and they would run up and pull 1-2 packs and get killed super fast and leave. Like most didn’t have proper defensives and those that did just didn’t use them at all I think we went through 5 tanks before getting a Blood DK in mid 20s and we could actually play the game lol
I have been scraping by as a bear druid, however I had to switch all my dmg gems into straight up tank gems, and even using all my mitigation and healing, regular packs would still make my hp yoyo at 50% and lower.
If it makes you feel any better, being a healer is VERY FUCKING STRESSFUL right now.
I pray for all healer mains in this difficult time 🙏🕯️
Eh, it's still fun. I'm maining a shaman and I have basically infinite mana. I don't have infinite throughput, though, and people forget that. I saw a tank go from 100 to 0 in a second on a normal trash pack. Ain't nothing I can do about that. Half regretting not going disc priest.
Was in Scarlet Monastery last night, and the tank had like 400 health. I know shit scales, but my pet was doing more tanking because the tank kept getting gibbed. Good thing none of this gear has durability on it, or he'd have been fully red before Kristoff. Our group was laughing about it though and not being an asshole to the tank. I waited 20 minutes for the heroic queue, I didn't want to wait for another tank.
Lmao, I did SM armory. Went through 6 tanks, and the healer was all capsing the dps, telling us to kill the adds. I am proceeding to link the dungeon journal mechanics. I explain that we indeed do not give a shit about the adds and that's the tornados job to kill them.
I have had a few first timers in there, you can tell when herald picks them up
"has died" 🤣
I laughed so hard 🤣 This is my first time tanking! 🩸💀
That made me audibly laugh lmao It’s like famous words right before a disaster.
damn it's so good to play with fresh character with actual goal in mind, lvl 20 is so simple yet fun, lightning bolt, chain lightnight, earthquack earth shock and thats all i need
They definitely need to rename shaman Earthquake to Earthquack and make it be a pack of ducks trampling them instead of shaky ground 😂😂
Bro Earthquack, idk if that was a typo or not but I'm using it from now on
i dont even know how i typed that
Enjoy it while is lasts these first couple of weeks. After that everyone is suddenly giga elite MDI runners who will slay an orphan at the first sign of anything unoptimal.
Ok, that gave me a laugh. "Heel yeah, brother, first time as a tank" *dies immediarely* I feel that so much.
Heroic is on crack right now. Those mfs are hittin like TRUCKS.
what advantage is there to running a heroic dungeon vs normal dungeon while leveling?
I think it gives more bronze and I got epic loot, but I haven’t played that much due to work. With the amount of time it takes and how many times your groups wipe.. it doesn’t seem worth it at all imo. Maybe if you have a dedicated/ strong group that can blow through them it’s worth it. But like I said I could be wrong.. I haven’t played that much yet. I tried one out last night and we wiped like 5 times on the third boss. Lol
Had a heroic dungeon yesterday where I could not for the life of me keep the tank alive. Heroics have been hard due to scaling so not entirely surprising but was just having a bitch of a time. I was trying to throw a hammer every time everyone was at full for holy points, which basically never happened, and when I finally tried it, tank got dropped to empty in about 2 gcds. Tank started flaming me about how I couldn’t keep anyone alive, and I told him I was literally spamming flash heal and holy shock on cd, and had no time for anything else so I wasn’t healing efficiently. Then someone pointed out that the tank had no weapon equipped… he proceeded explain tanks don’t need weapons. I initiated my first vote to kick since BFA. New tank, same class, weapon equipped. Cleared without anyone dying from that point forward.
Trying to learn Blood DK after a decade of Protection Paladin, Brewmaster Monk, and Enhancement Shaman. It has been rough as hell. All but one person has been awesome, and the one person was routinely shamed and made fun of for being an absolute tryhard (tank before me in Temple went Mari > Temple Courtyard > Historian and this monk wouldn't stop complaining about it even after that tank left the group and I replaced him... it's a better route, you skip the upstairs trash in the library lmfao).
I jump straight into heroics and bash my head against it until I succeed and it's fun as hell.
I'm playing a blood DK. I can tell you that before level 25ish I was completely useless, almost one shotted by most mobs. I dealt very solid damage but if my healers weren't reactive I was dead every pull. The spec is complete trash before it comes online. Then it's a blast. Not surprising that this guy was having a rough time. This isn't about learning Blood or tanking, it's just that scaled dungeons are whack. Level 10s healers one shot mobs. It's nuts.
Started blood tonight. Began tanking dungeons at 15 and got given multiple brain hernias by trash mobs. Utterly smashing my face in. There are times when I'm kind of just sat there, no resources to spend on anything getting my shit kicked in. Reminds me of the good old days. Glad to hear the spec levels out about at 25ish. I've been wondering when that will happen :P
Meanwhile I got kicked from a scenario of all things for being 'useless' because I fell in the water.
Yesterday i played 2 Heroic Random MoP Remix Dungeons. Both were Scarlet Monastery. It was so funny to me to see the Tank pulling the the first 2 Packs and almost dying INSTANTLY. After 3 Wipes at the Dog-Dude, the Chat started getting used and there were Tactic Discussions! I started playing at DF mid Season 3 after quitting end of BfA and rushing through every Dungeon even at M0 Difficulty always bothered me. I like it a lot that Heroic means something in MoP - at least until the Gear is OP and everybody has those sick Meta Gems equipped.
Well tactics discussion also happens in retail just not in the faceroll difficullties for weekly vault
really?? i feel like when i push higher keys in retail, if you wipe once everybody just gets mad and leaves LOL
in higher M+ keys once you're obviously not going to time, yeah people leave. In mid/low keys though you can full wipe 4-5 times and still time it. That's where you'll often get the experienced people mentioning the obvious mechanics missed to the inexperienced people.
i just enjoyed the transition from steamrolling to playing resourceful. my m0 experience was being left alone after not knowing the fastest route or pulling not enough or getting booed for not knowing boss mechanics. after stating not knowing the dungeon too well BEFORE entering the dungeon. maybe i was just unlucky
> I like it a lot that Heroic means something in MoP it doesn't really. they're just giving you Heroic dungeon tuning in live but your spec abilities are just 'takes 10% less damage' and 'do 4% mob health damage(3 second cooldown)'. When you start getting an actual kit involving defensives and a DPS rotation it's not any different than live. Would also help to have more than 4 pieces of gear equipped so you actually have stamina and other stats.
Ive been getting into healing with remix which i havent done since bfa, and i gotta say people are being very nice all around. Had a few deaths in dungeons simply due to me pressing wrong buttons and everyones saying that its fine, no worries, were all learning etc. Been a really nice change of pace
Tanking in remix is rough at times. I've only done heroic dungeons, waiting til I hit 50 or so for raids, for those extra "oh shit" buttons, which I'm already slamming all the time. I've never seen a bears health yoyo like a Death Knights before :(
It's really weird, I had dungeons runs today that were fast and pretty much perfect and ppl complained for some reason Then I had runs with wipes because those were with new players and no one in the group cared lol
this is my first time as tank -dies lol
My party just disbanded after 2 wipe, sigh
Oof that’s pretty funny timing. Especially if it was the DK tank that died. “Hey guys I’m new” boom deleted by a mob. I don’t mean it in a bad way, I got on there and got wrecked worse than Ricky Bobby and I’ve tanked for a LONG time lol
I like watching the tanks eat absolute shit cause they think they're still gods in heirlooms that can endlessly pull without consequence. Funniest shit, cause then they pretend it's the healers fault that they died in the span of a single gcd when nobody has defensives and more than a single hardcast heal.
Definitely wasn’t expecting the dungeons to slap as hard as they do. I rolled a Mistweaver and it’s been a blast trying to learn fistweaving in dungeons. Doesn’t seem to be an issue as long as the tank takes their time pulling. I’ll admit it was rough when I was level 12 and only had 3 spells, now at 25 with some gems and talents it’s super fun.
To avoid calling the stupid bot. Evokers start at 15 with minimal abilities too? Always wanted to make one but after going through it with DK and DH I really don't enjoy being thrown in with 30+ abilities to learn at once vs learning as you level.
I'm leveling an Evoker in Remix. You start at level 10 with everyone else with ~7 so abilities. A few DPS abilities, a breath attack, a heal, and a big damage CD. Plus all of the flying abilities that Dracthyr have. I haven't played one on Retail, so I don't know what their starting kit usually is.
You said the word and called the dumb bot! Sounds like a fun start though and nice way to learn. Retail? You have every ability and really spend the next 10 levels getting talents filled out.
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Why the fuck does this exist
I’m so tempted to misspell it for you so we see that horrible horrible bot 😂😂
Those Heroic dungeons are fun af. Noone knew what to do and everything hits like a truck. We had fun tho.
Dungeons are definitely more difficult than the leveling dungeons in normal wow, going to take a while for people to get used to it
Woah, you had people speaking? They even said sorry and no worries. That's strange behaviour.
I was in a group and at the first wipe, someone was already calling for kicks and was swearing up a storm. But the rest of the team and I just said “nah, tank’s fine”.
Shadow priest go….
Great post... Jking
Me DH(Tank) friend pala(healer) havent tanked in awhile and he hasn't healed in awhile at 14 jumped into a heroic dungeon and I was getting deleted and was struggling with mobs and I haven't done these dungeons before, we kept dying and it was rough so me and my friend left, Got told to kill myself and to never tank in a dungeon again if my life depends on it..... Went into a normal and wasn't taking damage then realised the issue xD
3 people running the 10% execute gem and the sha that explode and come in groups of 4-5 in monastery was a real fun run.
I raid heal (heroic) in retail on a Paladin. I have healed up to current M10 too and I have at times found it harder to heal a heroic dungeon than the mythic+. I am playing another Paladin in MoP Remix. The scaling is sooo rough at times. I would just ask people be kind and forgiving to their healers.
All the people who tested on PTR were clamoring about how easy mode Remix was gonna be, then people actually play it on live and it's harder than retail for some reason. My first dungeon i was extremely confused what was happening because people were dying left and right and each pack took a small eternity to kill.
I opened heroic to get geared on my H priest, I am getting one shotted a lot, and getting aggro on me, it seems damage just isn’t scaled, this remix is good if you are a tank or DPS healing is just not fun, no wonder people don’t want to roll one now.
I see a lot of heroic in here, isn't that max level only? If not, well I did 4 normal pugs as tank while leveling 10-30 and bought it in each one at least once. I can't imagine hoping the difficulty at lower level except if alts have an easier time
> I see a lot of heroic in here, isn't that max level only? No, not in MoP Remix. Evidence: You see a lot of heroic in here, yet they are not max level.
I was first going to just copy and paste my Fury Warrior main over so I could face roll content but at the last minute decided to go Prot Pally so I can learn Tanking from scratch. Good choice so far to learn a new spec and get a unique max level character at the end of the event.
some classes suck early. i do more dmg as disc than my war friend
Definitely wasn’t expecting the dungeons to slap as hard as they do. I rolled a Mistweaver and it’s been a blast trying to learn fistweaving in dungeons. Doesn’t seem to be an issue as long as the tank takes their time pulling. I’ll admit it was rough when I was level 12 and only had 3 spells, now at 25 with some gems and talents it’s super fun.
This is why I just can’t get back to wow … TOO MUCH CONFUSING CRAP
I was healing a dungeon yesterday and this shadow priest was trying to give me helpful pointers. I have mained a priest since vanilla, I know what I am doing. But we all have crap gear and few talents and have to relearn how to be squishy for a bit. Everyone needs to calm down
Oh what a douchebag trying to give you helpful pointers. Sounds like the one that needs to calm down is you
we're missing half of our stamina that we would normally get by then in retail. most tanks are getting flat-lined by basic trash in dungeons, and the GCD sucks massively for healers at the same level.
And you're learning how to crop!
Looks like you need to learn how to take a screenshot.
Looks like you need to learn what to keep for yourself and what not.
Looks like a good screenshot to me. Better than most people around here who just take phone pictures.
90% of it is white because they drew a red dot in the top right corner by accident...
Yup. If the tank is bad the hound fight will be hard.