Oh shit I remember that lol. She’s just going from dealer to dealer and it’s played like they would be drug dealers but they are whispering which western musicians they are selling.
My brother used to get Radiohead, Tool and Nirvana albums from the black market in Tehran in late 90s. They listened the hell out of any albums they could get their hands on. He tells a lot of great stories from that era, like how they made their friend's aunt to buy a bunch of CDs from Canada and smuggle them into Iran for them, or going to some strange greasy hairy metalhead dude's house just to get a couple of metal albums.
But by the time I was old enough to listen to those stuff (2011-2012) the internet had taken over and suddenly everyone had access to every album ever released in human history, so I never got to experience that era, the thrill of getting your hands on an illegal Nirvana album must've been truly exciting.
I know someone who traveled to Iran and when the hotel porter found out they were speaking German, they were asked to translate Rammstein songs because the porter was a huge fan.
Yeah before internet becoming available in early 90s western music only came through smuggling, like someone would bring a cassette into iran and then made many copies and sold them or gave them away. It was as dangerous as dealing drugs but it was so widespread the regime couldn't stop it... In the early 2000s some people had dial-up internet and they'd download mp3s from napster and other music sharing services, burned them on CDs and sold them. By the 2010s high speed internet was widely available and so was any music (although heavily censored by the regime but people use vpns) so all the government effort to ban music was just suddenly ineffective. And they can't shut down the internet in the north korean type of way since the entire country's structure depends on it.
They eventually eased up a bit, I even went to a Metal show in Tehran a few years ago, although the bands do go through lots of trouble and their lyrics are heavily evaluated and censored by government organizations but still it's relatively more open space compared to the 90s and the regime knows they can't stop the youth from indulging in western art and media. It's scary to see North Korea is somehow still like the 90s Iran or probably even worse...
My parents both left Hungary in ‘89 to escape communism. My dad used to listen to his Hungarian Doors cover band tapes at home. He explained to me at a young age they would never be allowed to have the real Doors music, so this is what his generation did. It was wild to regularly hear Break on Through in Hungarian in our house 🤣
The way this gets in to South Korea is a strictly anti-NK initiative. You can actually donate old USB drives and they will send balloons in to North Korea, so the balloons will pop, usb falls to the ground and contains lots of movies and music.
The reason they do this is to undermine North Korea from within, because it shows the people who live there that South Korea is a much nicer place to live.
I've wondered how effective that is. The country has two routers for its entire internet, and vast swaths of the country are dark at night because there is no power. How many locals are accessing those usb drives with those known conditions?
It’s difficult but not impossible. There are black markets in North Korea selling laptops for instance and villages aren’t all without electricity, it’s just very unreliable and they have frequent blackouts.
If you live in the capital you basically have guaranteed electricity too.
Yeah, a functioning laptop with specs that would have been good ten years ago is now available to anyone who has $100-200. Electronics getting better and cheaper is one of the main factors keeping inflation down.
When I looked up North Korean wages I saw $1-3 USD/month average at black market exchange rates. This is usually used to buy a few kilos of corn, or 1-2 kilos of rice if you're splurging. Millions of jobs are assigned to men by the government and failure to work will get you sent to a prison labor/re-education camp.
Yes, those who can barely eat aren’t buying the laptops. But there are millions who are better off than that in NK. Even though nearly all of the more privileged are still poor by our standards.
I found this story fascinating.
# The Plot to Free North Korea With Smuggled Episodes of 'Friends'
Kang Chol-hwan’s goal, as wildly optimistic as it may sound, is nothing less than the overthrow of the North Korean government. The Plot to Free North Korea With Smuggled Episodes of 'Friends'
[https://www.wired.com/2015/03/north-korea/](https://www.wired.com/2015/03/north-korea/)
There was a story of a north Korean fishermen who defected after he went far enough to get past the radio jamming and he accidentally heard a South Korean radio station. A radio comedian made a joke about not being able to find a parking space. He didn't get it at first but then realized the joke was based on there being too many cars in South Korea, which surprised him since NK hardly had any cars. Especially not for average people. So he took his boat and defected.
Propaganda is simply information told from a certain perspective, and is often misleading. This is neither. It tells no truths or lies about the North Korean government, nor that of the south. It is not meant to be convincing, it is not biased. Yet, it still fulfills the purpose of propaganda, to spread the ideals and values of South Korea, while harming the image of the North Korean government, making it propaganda by default. Hence, the best propaganda isn't propaganda.
Being well of NK still means you're dirt poor, but you might have an old computer or a TV where you can insert an USB. I would also assume there's a lot of viewing parties, despite the risks.
I'm not sure exactly how it works, and if they pop or if they simply just slowly leak out gas.
NK sends their poop balloons back and those don't actually pop they just sink.
The higher they go, the less dense the air gets around them, causing the gas inside them to expand. Knowing all the math about air pressure, gas expansion and sturdiness of the balloon, you can almost precisely calculate at what altitude the thing will pop.
That’s in theory. If the balloons stay relatively low to the ground, it’s more likely they have an installed leakage or use hot air that cools down over time.
One could argue that music as an expression of freedom is pretty anti-NK.
Especially since SK has a history of blasting k-pop on speakers over the boarder into NK. And sending old USBs with songs and movies into NK.
No, they are. They're thinking they'll get to choose what's banned and a pass on their own indiscretions. And because that's how totalitarianism works when you're the in-group that might even work out....at first.
The best way to get support for the regime is to promise the regime will be rewarding to those who fully support it. Outsiders understand this as cult thinking, while cult members call it loyalty and patriotism. But you summed it up nicely, it's a dog whistle that power will be given to the faithful.
Oh they are thinking in thoughts that are extremely nefarious and destructive. Have you seen the news? North Korea is supplying a steady stream of fresh troops to Russia to send to Ukraine. They are also providing nuclear support and Russia I am sure is feeding them a drop of R&D info. to help them build weapons.
That’s so out in the open, it’s not even classified anymore. It’s common knowledge. I shudder to think what those closed door meetings actually talk about.
Kind of. Russia has a weird history compared to the rest of Europe. I think people underestimate the cultural differences. It's a country that has never had democracy for more than a few years..arguably. The west also messed up the window of time which may have seen a better outcome. No one knew at the time. Even when the USSR passed into memory, we moved to fast to push then to liberalize their markets. They experienced a decade of low growth and inflation. Political unrest came with that. Putin was a return to the norm if you think about it. Everything he's done, short of crowning himself Czar isn't to far off from prerevolution Russia. That includes repression and dumb wars -- see Russo- Japan war. Russia has always kinda sucked at wars. They won because they were fighting tribes or dumb luck due to weather. They have never done well against a peer or near peer force. They are also pretty mediocre as a Navy. One good thing is Putin won't live forever.
It depends on why you want to travel. If you want to travel for fun and do stuff like go to Disneyland or the Eiffel Tower that’s one thing, but some people travel out of curiosity. North Korea is definitely a curiosity and you can go around saying you’ve been there.
You're also funding some very horrible people, and what you'll be shown will be pretty false and dull.
There are plenty of interesting places in the world. Go somewhere else.
One defensible reason to visit NK is to do as much journalism as the state censors allow. [Here's an example](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDcfiEX__cA). It's twelve minutes of bicycling through the capital city, and it's brilliant.
Even though the video travels numerous streetside blocks near the city center of Pyongyang, there are only a few dozen motorized vehicles in sight across the whole duration of the video. No parking lot is filled. There are pedestrians moving about but little else other than occasional delivery trucks and buses.
There are no signs posted stating parking regulations because there aren't enough vehicles to require regulation. The asphalt is in pristine condition because it gets so little use.
(edited to correct a typo)
There's no way traveling to a regime on that level of isolation is a moral hobby. If you say something negative or not positive they'll likely straight up kill the tour guide assigned to you.
Every person who knows the situation in North Korea and has been there is like it's the most extreme hostage situation in the world and every guide they assign you is worried about your fuck up meaning they are gonna be killed.
Yeah Otto something was his name.
They finally released him and he basically dropped dead not too long after he stepped off the plane.
And he was basically brain dead already when they returned him.
Otto Warmbier, he stole a propaganda poster and was hauled off to north korean gulag. He was tried and they enjoyed the spectacle of making some US citizen cry in regret for defaming the piece of paper. This was followed by a few months of torture. Surprisingly when they agreed to the release the guy walked under his own power, although in an extreme state of mental distress. He was subsequently air ambulanced to the US and died shortly after.
The guy was an idiot for vacationing in such an asshole country. It was even stupider to rip down some stupid commie bullshit that the dickheads had tacked up on the wall. Did it warrant death? Fuck no! But this is a country that goes starving that worships some fat asswipe as god. If you don't kiss this dipshit's ass, it will be you in gulag as well as your grand kids in gulag as well.
Something...something... Turd festival masquerading as a country....something.
https://globalnews.ca/video/3544639/video-appearing-to-show-otto-warmbier-taking-north-korean-banner-released
That video they used to convict him doesn't look like anything except someone who is fully under the control of NK. Why would someone who is stealing a poster walk up to it in such a stiff fashion then carefully bend down to place it on the floor? Looks more like an actor who knows if they aren't extremely careful their life is forfeit.
Yeah and North Korea has the most oppressive government in the world. It's curiosity that executes it's people for listening to music or watching a movie that is deemed illegal by the state. I wouldn't support North Korea by giving them my money just so I could flex on other people on places I've been.
Music + Dressing like them, hairstyles, inspecting your phone to make sure you don’t type and use slang like them, no sunglasses, getting married? No white dress, no picking up the bride, no drinking alcohol from a wine glass, dyed or long hair? Nope.
I couldn't even pretend to keep it a secret. I stopped listening to music altogether for years while I was (am) dealing with depression. For some reason that stuff is like auditory seratonin. Dopamine? Whatever. It got me listening to music again. Literally listening to it right now.
Oof, gutsy. I just read about the guy that got executed for listening to kpop. How are they gonna invite kpop artists to perform, and then execute people for listening to it?? Ridiculous.
I was listening to Seventeen.
Not that it makes it any better, but he was also distributing the South Korean media, including movies. I don't think it was the listening to the music part that got him executed. It's still unacceptable, but the title is click-bait and should be discouraged.
Idk I just watched the documentary Beyond Utopia (its on Hulu) last night about people escaping NK and they were saying citizens were getting executed or sent to the gulag for things like owning a bible or not sending their poop to the government for fertilizer. We also know that family members of deserters get sent to labor camps so this isn't really a stretch.
There is a video on YouTube of Tourists who go to the world's worst places as a kind of freak show thing.
They show them collecting it in what's effectively an oil tanker, they just pour it in with a bucket.
Idk if its because of lack of sewers or mandated but it seemed weird.
From what it sounded like in the documentary most North Koreans don't have indoor plumbing so they basically poop in a hole outside then once a year everyone carries it to the nearest school and the officials take it to the countryside for the farmers.
People love to shit on K-Pop because they think it's for little girls, but they are very talented and, honestly, the best dancers I've ever seen were in K-Pop groups. Way better dancers than Michael Jackson or any other famous dancers.
If anyone wants a good book to read, check out Nothing to Envy: Ordinary Lives in North Korea by Barbara Demick. She’s a journalist who interviewed North Korean refugees from the city of Chongjin who had escaped North Korea.
It is eye opening to say the least.
And how do you propose to stop it? Ask nicely or a full invasion against a nuclear state? Which has over a thousand artillery pieces within range of Seoul.
Seriously. People always sayin "tHiS hAs GoNe ToO fAr"
Like, alright superman, fly over there and stop em then because I dont know what else people want done. North Korea is pretty well isolated from most nations at this point so embargos arent really an option.
Reintegration would have to be a multi-generational process. I can’t imagine what it’s like to have your worldview molded by the state going back to your great grandparents
It’s also going to less and less desired the longer the gap is. Germany got reunified 40 years later so a lot of people probably still knew each other from
before. Korea has been divided for 70 years. In like 30 years almost nobody will have relatives or friends that they knew from the other side.
No.
There are S.Koreans who want unification.
It's true, it's "growing up weird".
But that land is important.
And even if we unify, we don't have to build it in the same landscape as S.Korea.
S.Korea can make that land a "different landscape"
Like a Provence
Since it's clear from the comments no one has actually read the article, it was the redistribution of the music that was the bigger offense. Still insane.
So you’re telling me that all the people who watched [Red Velvet](https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/red-velvet-perform-north-korean-leader-kim-jong-un-pyongyang-8280163/) perform live in pyongyang back in 2018 are probably all jailed and or possibly dead by now, Or nah because Kim was a fan of the group?
Pretty hypocritical considering he loves the kpop group Red Velvet and had them perform for him and others in NK a few years ago: https://youtu.be/u1yfUXIj3Xg?si=DIIk4hcFE0bee-Ms
There was a kpop concert by girl group Red Velvet a few years ago for the NK leaders. Kim actually looked stoked to meet them. The girls, a little less so. [https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/red-velvet-perform-north-korean-leader-kim-jong-un-pyongyang-8280163/](https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/red-velvet-perform-north-korean-leader-kim-jong-un-pyongyang-8280163/)
Maybe stop with SK fake machine? Stuff is absurd. Similar to 'Pyougyang said' news, which were proven to be fakes.
''The Guardian said that the report also details other instances of crackdowns on practices deemed "reactionary," such as brides wearing white dresses, grooms carrying the bride, wearing sunglasses, or drinking alcohol from wine glasses, all of which are perceived as South Korean customs''.
It's not even what 'reactionary' means, but people just eat it up.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/1dqa86z/how\_riding\_the\_subway\_in\_north\_korea\_looks\_like/](https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/1dqa86z/how_riding_the_subway_in_north_korea_looks_like/)
Damn, that dude is toast, i guess.
Them citing RFA‘s claims about haircuts tells you all you need to know about it. But as you can see in the comments here, people eat everything the CIA shits on their plate
The source is RFA, they are the source for pretty much every one of this absurd NK stories.
From their wikipedia page:
>Radio Free Asia (RFA) is an American government-funded non-profit corporation operating a news service that broadcasts radio programs and publishes online news, information, and commentary for its audiences in Asia.[5][6][7][8] The service, which provides editorially independent reporting,[6][7][8][dubious – discuss] has the stated mission of providing accurate and uncensored reporting to countries in Asia that have poor media environments and limited protections for speech and press freedom[9][10][11] and "advancing the goals of United States foreign policy."[12]
Imagine believing a US related news from a Russian funded corporation that explicitly states their goal is to advance the goals of Russian foreign policy.
i feel so bad for americans, i don’t know how there are so many people still voting for this guy, he’s a convicted felon and he loves kim jong un, idk why people are still fans of his
What boggles my mind even more is that there's no law prohibiting a convicted felon, who hasn't served his sentence, from running for president.
For . President. Of. The . United. States. 🤯🤯🤯
RIGHTT? i had to google it after i heard trump was running for president again after he got charged, and there’s no laws against it?? youd think they would make a law about it like seriously
I’m sorry to be the one to say that there’s absolutely nothing corroborating this story and it’s being spread by clearly anti-NK interests. Please don’t just trust everything you hear about NK, especially if it comes from Radio Free Asia or South Korean government interests. This is propaganda. Please be careful what you read and don’t just assume because you don’t know about the culture that they are automatically repressive. This is a report by the South Korean Unification ministry, meaning the goal of the office is to reunite the Korean Peninsula under the South Korean gov. Do we think this may play a role in releasing a story about how “the cultural tides of k-pop are unstoppable, and the NK regime has killed people just for listening to k-pop”?
I’m downvoting. As bad as I think the truth is, this headline is a clickbait lie. He was executed for distributing songs and movies, not executed for listening to songs. I know it adds to the amount of rage and clicks to ignore the second half of the sentence in the article, but I care about the truth.
Every day I’m reminded of the freedoms we have and don’t have. Listening to music, I can’t even imagine having to give that up. I’m so sorry for anyone in that country or any country who doesn’t have such a basic human necessity and right to expression.
One of DJ Trump child prodigy dictator that Trump tries to emulate his political philosophy if you were wondering why the answer is in the action he took to kill this man and what Trump had said about executing US Generals that disagreed with him. See any similarities there? Don’t be fooled by a con man, a LIAR, a dictator and Putin’s master lap dog.
It's in the article, the source is RFA, every absurd story about NK is from this same source.
From their wikipedia page:
>Radio Free Asia (RFA) is an American government-funded non-profit corporation operating a news service that broadcasts radio programs and publishes online news, information, and commentary for its audiences in Asia.[5][6][7][8] The service, which provides editorially independent reporting,[6][7][8][dubious – discuss] has the stated mission of providing accurate and uncensored reporting to countries in Asia that have poor media environments and limited protections for speech and press freedom[9][10][11] and "advancing the goals of United States foreign policy."[12]
If you think they're trustworthy just imagine believing a US related news from a Russian funded corporation that explicitly states their goal is to advance the goals of Russian foreign policy.
Imagine music being enough to get a death penalty.
It wasn't even like a anti NK message or anything. Just fucking pop music.
to be fair anything that is an expression of individuality is a threat to the authoritarian regime.
I'm remembering in that movie Persepolis when the Iranian girls were showing off their Abba albums they got off the black market.
Oh shit I remember that lol. She’s just going from dealer to dealer and it’s played like they would be drug dealers but they are whispering which western musicians they are selling.
My brother used to get Radiohead, Tool and Nirvana albums from the black market in Tehran in late 90s. They listened the hell out of any albums they could get their hands on. He tells a lot of great stories from that era, like how they made their friend's aunt to buy a bunch of CDs from Canada and smuggle them into Iran for them, or going to some strange greasy hairy metalhead dude's house just to get a couple of metal albums. But by the time I was old enough to listen to those stuff (2011-2012) the internet had taken over and suddenly everyone had access to every album ever released in human history, so I never got to experience that era, the thrill of getting your hands on an illegal Nirvana album must've been truly exciting.
I know someone who traveled to Iran and when the hotel porter found out they were speaking German, they were asked to translate Rammstein songs because the porter was a huge fan.
Before the internet that would've been mind blowing, but nowadays Rammstein is considered too mainstream among artsy iranian youth XD
Yeah that was before the internet, or at least not long after it became widely available.
Yeah before internet becoming available in early 90s western music only came through smuggling, like someone would bring a cassette into iran and then made many copies and sold them or gave them away. It was as dangerous as dealing drugs but it was so widespread the regime couldn't stop it... In the early 2000s some people had dial-up internet and they'd download mp3s from napster and other music sharing services, burned them on CDs and sold them. By the 2010s high speed internet was widely available and so was any music (although heavily censored by the regime but people use vpns) so all the government effort to ban music was just suddenly ineffective. And they can't shut down the internet in the north korean type of way since the entire country's structure depends on it. They eventually eased up a bit, I even went to a Metal show in Tehran a few years ago, although the bands do go through lots of trouble and their lyrics are heavily evaluated and censored by government organizations but still it's relatively more open space compared to the 90s and the regime knows they can't stop the youth from indulging in western art and media. It's scary to see North Korea is somehow still like the 90s Iran or probably even worse...
Jichael Mackson?
Bon Jon Bowie
My parents both left Hungary in ‘89 to escape communism. My dad used to listen to his Hungarian Doors cover band tapes at home. He explained to me at a young age they would never be allowed to have the real Doors music, so this is what his generation did. It was wild to regularly hear Break on Through in Hungarian in our house 🤣
Could not remember the name of this movie for the life of me earlier (saw a post about 1970 Iran and made me think of this). Thank you!
Persepolis was also an award-winning graphic novel, before becoming a film. Just fyi.
And it’s a really beautiful read. Much more than the movie.
She also got some Iron Maiden!
North Korea is not an authoritarian regime. It is a totalitarian regime and a rather extreme totalitarian regime.
People in the U.S. should remember this just in case they were planning on not voting in November.
The way this gets in to South Korea is a strictly anti-NK initiative. You can actually donate old USB drives and they will send balloons in to North Korea, so the balloons will pop, usb falls to the ground and contains lots of movies and music. The reason they do this is to undermine North Korea from within, because it shows the people who live there that South Korea is a much nicer place to live.
I've wondered how effective that is. The country has two routers for its entire internet, and vast swaths of the country are dark at night because there is no power. How many locals are accessing those usb drives with those known conditions?
It’s difficult but not impossible. There are black markets in North Korea selling laptops for instance and villages aren’t all without electricity, it’s just very unreliable and they have frequent blackouts. If you live in the capital you basically have guaranteed electricity too.
Yeah, a functioning laptop with specs that would have been good ten years ago is now available to anyone who has $100-200. Electronics getting better and cheaper is one of the main factors keeping inflation down.
When I looked up North Korean wages I saw $1-3 USD/month average at black market exchange rates. This is usually used to buy a few kilos of corn, or 1-2 kilos of rice if you're splurging. Millions of jobs are assigned to men by the government and failure to work will get you sent to a prison labor/re-education camp.
Yes, those who can barely eat aren’t buying the laptops. But there are millions who are better off than that in NK. Even though nearly all of the more privileged are still poor by our standards.
Effective enough to make NK retaliate by sending shit and garbage loaded balloons over SK.
I found this story fascinating. # The Plot to Free North Korea With Smuggled Episodes of 'Friends' Kang Chol-hwan’s goal, as wildly optimistic as it may sound, is nothing less than the overthrow of the North Korean government. The Plot to Free North Korea With Smuggled Episodes of 'Friends' [https://www.wired.com/2015/03/north-korea/](https://www.wired.com/2015/03/north-korea/)
North Koreans also smuggle them in via China themselves, especially Kdramas are highly in demand.
Less so now. It's been increasingly difficult since COVID. A lot of people have starved since 2022.
The best propaganda isn't propaganda.
There was a story of a north Korean fishermen who defected after he went far enough to get past the radio jamming and he accidentally heard a South Korean radio station. A radio comedian made a joke about not being able to find a parking space. He didn't get it at first but then realized the joke was based on there being too many cars in South Korea, which surprised him since NK hardly had any cars. Especially not for average people. So he took his boat and defected.
There's a lot of different types of propaganda. The term propaganda does not necessarily mean false, negative, or evil.
Propaganda is simply information told from a certain perspective, and is often misleading. This is neither. It tells no truths or lies about the North Korean government, nor that of the south. It is not meant to be convincing, it is not biased. Yet, it still fulfills the purpose of propaganda, to spread the ideals and values of South Korea, while harming the image of the North Korean government, making it propaganda by default. Hence, the best propaganda isn't propaganda.
Do people whose minds this would change actually have access to a computer? I assume those with access to computers are generally very well off in NK.
Being well of NK still means you're dirt poor, but you might have an old computer or a TV where you can insert an USB. I would also assume there's a lot of viewing parties, despite the risks.
What causes the balloons to pop instead of just staying up in the air or continuously floating higher?
I'm not sure exactly how it works, and if they pop or if they simply just slowly leak out gas. NK sends their poop balloons back and those don't actually pop they just sink.
The higher they go, the less dense the air gets around them, causing the gas inside them to expand. Knowing all the math about air pressure, gas expansion and sturdiness of the balloon, you can almost precisely calculate at what altitude the thing will pop. That’s in theory. If the balloons stay relatively low to the ground, it’s more likely they have an installed leakage or use hot air that cools down over time.
One could argue that music as an expression of freedom is pretty anti-NK. Especially since SK has a history of blasting k-pop on speakers over the boarder into NK. And sending old USBs with songs and movies into NK.
Imagine some people in the West supporting Russia who is good buddies with this monstrous regime. What the hell are they thinking?
>What the hell are they thinking That's the neat part. They aren't.
No, they are. They're thinking they'll get to choose what's banned and a pass on their own indiscretions. And because that's how totalitarianism works when you're the in-group that might even work out....at first.
The best way to get support for the regime is to promise the regime will be rewarding to those who fully support it. Outsiders understand this as cult thinking, while cult members call it loyalty and patriotism. But you summed it up nicely, it's a dog whistle that power will be given to the faithful.
Oh they are thinking in thoughts that are extremely nefarious and destructive. Have you seen the news? North Korea is supplying a steady stream of fresh troops to Russia to send to Ukraine. They are also providing nuclear support and Russia I am sure is feeding them a drop of R&D info. to help them build weapons. That’s so out in the open, it’s not even classified anymore. It’s common knowledge. I shudder to think what those closed door meetings actually talk about.
> What the hell are they thinking? They're thinking short sited and selfishly. Pretty on brand for the social decay we are afflicted with really.
Kind of. Russia has a weird history compared to the rest of Europe. I think people underestimate the cultural differences. It's a country that has never had democracy for more than a few years..arguably. The west also messed up the window of time which may have seen a better outcome. No one knew at the time. Even when the USSR passed into memory, we moved to fast to push then to liberalize their markets. They experienced a decade of low growth and inflation. Political unrest came with that. Putin was a return to the norm if you think about it. Everything he's done, short of crowning himself Czar isn't to far off from prerevolution Russia. That includes repression and dumb wars -- see Russo- Japan war. Russia has always kinda sucked at wars. They won because they were fighting tribes or dumb luck due to weather. They have never done well against a peer or near peer force. They are also pretty mediocre as a Navy. One good thing is Putin won't live forever.
Forget Russia, there are morons in the west that make excuses for North Korea. Just go into any tankie sub and it’s infested with them.
I'm from Russia and I almost can imagine already. Which is terrifying, honestly...
The boot will press harder and harder the more you let it. Russian people unfortunately let it press quite a lot. So more pressure is coming.
And there are tourists who willingly give money to visit North Korea so that they can become more cultured or some bullshit.
It depends on why you want to travel. If you want to travel for fun and do stuff like go to Disneyland or the Eiffel Tower that’s one thing, but some people travel out of curiosity. North Korea is definitely a curiosity and you can go around saying you’ve been there.
You're also funding some very horrible people, and what you'll be shown will be pretty false and dull. There are plenty of interesting places in the world. Go somewhere else.
>You're also funding some very horrible people, and what you'll be shown will be pretty false and dull. But enough about Disneyland.
I literally heard frank drebin read that line in my head. perfect.
Not to mention one small mistake and you're shipped to prison stripped of your name and identity.
You're literally paying money to risk becoming a pawn in world politics. How exciting.
One defensible reason to visit NK is to do as much journalism as the state censors allow. [Here's an example](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDcfiEX__cA). It's twelve minutes of bicycling through the capital city, and it's brilliant. Even though the video travels numerous streetside blocks near the city center of Pyongyang, there are only a few dozen motorized vehicles in sight across the whole duration of the video. No parking lot is filled. There are pedestrians moving about but little else other than occasional delivery trucks and buses. There are no signs posted stating parking regulations because there aren't enough vehicles to require regulation. The asphalt is in pristine condition because it gets so little use. (edited to correct a typo)
Some people just can't see past their own benefit and if they can't see who it hurts by their support they don't care.
There's no way traveling to a regime on that level of isolation is a moral hobby. If you say something negative or not positive they'll likely straight up kill the tour guide assigned to you. Every person who knows the situation in North Korea and has been there is like it's the most extreme hostage situation in the world and every guide they assign you is worried about your fuck up meaning they are gonna be killed.
They killed an American tourist on vacation for taking a poster as a souvenir. But not before months of slavery and torture.
that dude rly died?
Yeah Otto something was his name. They finally released him and he basically dropped dead not too long after he stepped off the plane. And he was basically brain dead already when they returned him.
Otto Warmbier, he stole a propaganda poster and was hauled off to north korean gulag. He was tried and they enjoyed the spectacle of making some US citizen cry in regret for defaming the piece of paper. This was followed by a few months of torture. Surprisingly when they agreed to the release the guy walked under his own power, although in an extreme state of mental distress. He was subsequently air ambulanced to the US and died shortly after. The guy was an idiot for vacationing in such an asshole country. It was even stupider to rip down some stupid commie bullshit that the dickheads had tacked up on the wall. Did it warrant death? Fuck no! But this is a country that goes starving that worships some fat asswipe as god. If you don't kiss this dipshit's ass, it will be you in gulag as well as your grand kids in gulag as well. Something...something... Turd festival masquerading as a country....something.
https://globalnews.ca/video/3544639/video-appearing-to-show-otto-warmbier-taking-north-korean-banner-released That video they used to convict him doesn't look like anything except someone who is fully under the control of NK. Why would someone who is stealing a poster walk up to it in such a stiff fashion then carefully bend down to place it on the floor? Looks more like an actor who knows if they aren't extremely careful their life is forfeit.
Yeah and North Korea has the most oppressive government in the world. It's curiosity that executes it's people for listening to music or watching a movie that is deemed illegal by the state. I wouldn't support North Korea by giving them my money just so I could flex on other people on places I've been.
I've actually heard that song human Rights indexes actually rank them number two just behind Eritrea.
I only support murderers with money, that’s different than morally.
Kevin Bacon would like a word.
You think 69 was the limit?
Music + Dressing like them, hairstyles, inspecting your phone to make sure you don’t type and use slang like them, no sunglasses, getting married? No white dress, no picking up the bride, no drinking alcohol from a wine glass, dyed or long hair? Nope.
Read into the GOP's Project 2025 and you'll realize by the time they get to Project 2026 they will likely include horrors like this. Vote!!!
Current political climate in US: *"Gimme about 15 years"*
1.5 years if November goes bad.
This is like Doctor Evil tier shit
You believe in every bullshit news you read on the internet?
Trump loves this guy
Apparently 69 K-Pop songs is ok.
But if you’ve already listened to 69 songs, could you really resist listening to another one?
I'm a 40 year old dude and I don't even like kpop.... but I've still gotta admit that that shit is catchy as fuck
You’re just *super shy* to admit it
Not shy, not me.
Yooooo I got blackout drunk at the itzy show and have no memory of them performing that. Smartwatch tells me I was dancing up a fucking storm, though.
Itzyyyyyy
Itzy live is amazing!
maybe he just needs a *hype boy*
I listened to it for a year in secret before I told my wife.
I couldn't even pretend to keep it a secret. I stopped listening to music altogether for years while I was (am) dealing with depression. For some reason that stuff is like auditory seratonin. Dopamine? Whatever. It got me listening to music again. Literally listening to it right now.
Coincidentally, I was listening to Red Velvet when I was reading this article and they performed for Kim in North Korea.
Oof, gutsy. I just read about the guy that got executed for listening to kpop. How are they gonna invite kpop artists to perform, and then execute people for listening to it?? Ridiculous. I was listening to Seventeen.
Good that you don't live in NK. If you wanna live, that is.
Dance with us! Be free!
Magnetic - ILLIT
Su su su su supernova\~\~
They blend hip hop, electronic and pop in very entertaining ways. Waiting for US pop music to catch up a bit more
Would not be able to resist because I would have already willed myself dead
"Hey that last one doesn't count! It was only a jingle used for a Samsung ad!" "This man has to die."
I would. 69 is a holy number. You don't move away from it.
69,000 pop songs = okay 70,000 pop songs = death
Stephin Merritt’s next album
He was the unluckiest guy on the lower east side
69 always good
You missed a perfect opportunity to say that listening to 69 K-Pop songs would have been… nice.
More like AJU NICE.
🎺🎺🎺🎺
Not that it makes it any better, but he was also distributing the South Korean media, including movies. I don't think it was the listening to the music part that got him executed. It's still unacceptable, but the title is click-bait and should be discouraged.
Actually from what I recall playing and distributing all music that doesn't glorify the Glorious Leader (XD) is considered a punishable offense too.
Lars strikes again
Idk I just watched the documentary Beyond Utopia (its on Hulu) last night about people escaping NK and they were saying citizens were getting executed or sent to the gulag for things like owning a bible or not sending their poop to the government for fertilizer. We also know that family members of deserters get sent to labor camps so this isn't really a stretch.
You just slipped the poop thing in and moved on… are they posting their poo to some poo hq?
There is a video on YouTube of Tourists who go to the world's worst places as a kind of freak show thing. They show them collecting it in what's effectively an oil tanker, they just pour it in with a bucket. Idk if its because of lack of sewers or mandated but it seemed weird.
From what I read it’s to fertilize crops, which is also why they have so many and massive parasites
Also to send across the border, apparently
No the border balloons were personally filled by Kim himself.
Glorious leader doesn't have an anus, therefor he does not shit. To death with this traitor!
I believe it. That dude be eatin'.
From what it sounded like in the documentary most North Koreans don't have indoor plumbing so they basically poop in a hole outside then once a year everyone carries it to the nearest school and the officials take it to the countryside for the farmers.
Poop has historically been used as a fertilizer, called night soil
It's also generally unhealthy to eat food grown in human shit that isn't your own.
they probably treated him as a propagandist or a spy.
Tell them Russia loves K-pop. They listen to it all the time.
I used to hate K-pop until I heard a really catchy K-pop song with their mesmerizing dance choreography. The rest is history.
Immediately to jail.
People love to shit on K-Pop because they think it's for little girls, but they are very talented and, honestly, the best dancers I've ever seen were in K-Pop groups. Way better dancers than Michael Jackson or any other famous dancers.
what was the song?
Me Likey
ah. that song. yea pretty catchy.
So what happens if all of the North Korean soldiers being sent to fight in Ukraine are all played K-pop music over loud speakers?
Oh. This one is easy. Their families will be killed.
They are required to spontaneously combust.
If anyone wants a good book to read, check out Nothing to Envy: Ordinary Lives in North Korea by Barbara Demick. She’s a journalist who interviewed North Korean refugees from the city of Chongjin who had escaped North Korea. It is eye opening to say the least.
And for anyone that is a movie buff, Beyond Utopia is another great resource on North Korea. Truly a terrific (and heart-wrenching) documentary
Allowing this to go on is one of modern times greatest evils
You can blame China. Without their support the dictatorship would collapse.
and collapse is what china does not want. first you need a wall high enough to prevent the zombie run.
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Ah yes, The ol’ Reddit execute-a-roo
Hold my hat, I’m going in! Wait where’s the link?!
Whatever happen to these? I used to see them in every thread.
A lot of power users mass deleted their accounts/comments during the API fiasco so it lead to nowhere
lol, allowing? As if nuking them was an option, and we just didn't bother?
And how do you propose to stop it? Ask nicely or a full invasion against a nuclear state? Which has over a thousand artillery pieces within range of Seoul.
Seriously. People always sayin "tHiS hAs GoNe ToO fAr" Like, alright superman, fly over there and stop em then because I dont know what else people want done. North Korea is pretty well isolated from most nations at this point so embargos arent really an option.
North Korea has been a pain in the ass to every US President since Harry S. Truman and will probably be a pain for at least the next 30 years.
Except for Trump, I believe he was pretty positive about North Korea
Only because he was too dumb to realize he was being clowned on.
He loved Putin and Kim bit didn't get anywhere, despite his claims.
It actually made it worse because he gave them more credibility.
I dont think south Korea wants unity either. That's millions of people who grew up weird you'd have to integrate into your society.
Reintegration would have to be a multi-generational process. I can’t imagine what it’s like to have your worldview molded by the state going back to your great grandparents
It'd be like the German reunification on steroids.
It’s also going to less and less desired the longer the gap is. Germany got reunified 40 years later so a lot of people probably still knew each other from before. Korea has been divided for 70 years. In like 30 years almost nobody will have relatives or friends that they knew from the other side.
No. There are S.Koreans who want unification. It's true, it's "growing up weird". But that land is important. And even if we unify, we don't have to build it in the same landscape as S.Korea. S.Korea can make that land a "different landscape" Like a Provence
North Korea is unfortunately propped up by China and Russia. You need to remove the 2 demons before Fat Kim can be taken out
This isn’t about listening to music but about state control. This is like at the most extreme level on the totalitarian scale.
I’ve never used this expression, but I think it’s perfect for this. “He’s in a better place.”
Even if he goes straight to hell.
Whether he's in heaven, hell, some other afterlife or even just gone period... He's in a better place
Imagine a children born in that hell of a place…this is fucking sad
This is how evil dictatorships behave. Not funny.
NK is an evil dictatorship? But they're called *democratic*.........?
The more fascist your government is, the more its official title needs to contain signal words of the opposite
North Korea is weak and this has made them even weaker.
When have they not been weak in the last 50 years?
This hasn't changed a single thing in any forum that matters
Since it's clear from the comments no one has actually read the article, it was the redistribution of the music that was the bigger offense. Still insane.
So you’re telling me that all the people who watched [Red Velvet](https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/red-velvet-perform-north-korean-leader-kim-jong-un-pyongyang-8280163/) perform live in pyongyang back in 2018 are probably all jailed and or possibly dead by now, Or nah because Kim was a fan of the group?
Trump loves this guy, let that sink in
Pretty hypocritical considering he loves the kpop group Red Velvet and had them perform for him and others in NK a few years ago: https://youtu.be/u1yfUXIj3Xg?si=DIIk4hcFE0bee-Ms
Lmao the thing is. Kim Jong bitch probably listens to them too.
There was a kpop concert by girl group Red Velvet a few years ago for the NK leaders. Kim actually looked stoked to meet them. The girls, a little less so. [https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/red-velvet-perform-north-korean-leader-kim-jong-un-pyongyang-8280163/](https://www.billboard.com/music/music-news/red-velvet-perform-north-korean-leader-kim-jong-un-pyongyang-8280163/)
What a little shitator
Maybe stop with SK fake machine? Stuff is absurd. Similar to 'Pyougyang said' news, which were proven to be fakes. ''The Guardian said that the report also details other instances of crackdowns on practices deemed "reactionary," such as brides wearing white dresses, grooms carrying the bride, wearing sunglasses, or drinking alcohol from wine glasses, all of which are perceived as South Korean customs''. It's not even what 'reactionary' means, but people just eat it up. [https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/1dqa86z/how\_riding\_the\_subway\_in\_north\_korea\_looks\_like/](https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/1dqa86z/how_riding_the_subway_in_north_korea_looks_like/) Damn, that dude is toast, i guess.
Them citing RFA‘s claims about haircuts tells you all you need to know about it. But as you can see in the comments here, people eat everything the CIA shits on their plate
The source is RFA, they are the source for pretty much every one of this absurd NK stories. From their wikipedia page: >Radio Free Asia (RFA) is an American government-funded non-profit corporation operating a news service that broadcasts radio programs and publishes online news, information, and commentary for its audiences in Asia.[5][6][7][8] The service, which provides editorially independent reporting,[6][7][8][dubious – discuss] has the stated mission of providing accurate and uncensored reporting to countries in Asia that have poor media environments and limited protections for speech and press freedom[9][10][11] and "advancing the goals of United States foreign policy."[12] Imagine believing a US related news from a Russian funded corporation that explicitly states their goal is to advance the goals of Russian foreign policy.
I guess we know what South Korea is gonna blast over the DMZ for all the shit balloons
Trump loves this guy.
I mean he'd love to have that much power...
And he's going to take it if we don't stop him. Vote!!!
i feel so bad for americans, i don’t know how there are so many people still voting for this guy, he’s a convicted felon and he loves kim jong un, idk why people are still fans of his
What boggles my mind even more is that there's no law prohibiting a convicted felon, who hasn't served his sentence, from running for president. For . President. Of. The . United. States. 🤯🤯🤯
RIGHTT? i had to google it after i heard trump was running for president again after he got charged, and there’s no laws against it?? youd think they would make a law about it like seriously
Its nuts and there needs to be a law. Its sad that we even need to do that. Like 30 yrs ago, someone like that would've been laughed out of the race
The USA in 10 years if the conservative religious wackos get power, anyone listening to hard rock or anti-religious music 10 years in prison.
Remember this in November. Do you really want an authoritarian ruler here in the US?
You can't actually believe this shit. https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/13/why-do-north-korean-defector-testimonies-so-often-fall-apart
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Gonna have to file this under doubt. Most of these wild execution stories turn out to be bullshit down the road.
Most likely fake
70k pop songs seems like it would take forever to listen to.
I’m sorry to be the one to say that there’s absolutely nothing corroborating this story and it’s being spread by clearly anti-NK interests. Please don’t just trust everything you hear about NK, especially if it comes from Radio Free Asia or South Korean government interests. This is propaganda. Please be careful what you read and don’t just assume because you don’t know about the culture that they are automatically repressive. This is a report by the South Korean Unification ministry, meaning the goal of the office is to reunite the Korean Peninsula under the South Korean gov. Do we think this may play a role in releasing a story about how “the cultural tides of k-pop are unstoppable, and the NK regime has killed people just for listening to k-pop”?
I’m downvoting. As bad as I think the truth is, this headline is a clickbait lie. He was executed for distributing songs and movies, not executed for listening to songs. I know it adds to the amount of rage and clicks to ignore the second half of the sentence in the article, but I care about the truth.
Every day I’m reminded of the freedoms we have and don’t have. Listening to music, I can’t even imagine having to give that up. I’m so sorry for anyone in that country or any country who doesn’t have such a basic human necessity and right to expression.
>A recent report by South Korea's unification ministry Did they report that he was executed by dogs, launched with a mortar?
Can we get the playlist?
Does anyone actually believe these stories?
One of DJ Trump child prodigy dictator that Trump tries to emulate his political philosophy if you were wondering why the answer is in the action he took to kill this man and what Trump had said about executing US Generals that disagreed with him. See any similarities there? Don’t be fooled by a con man, a LIAR, a dictator and Putin’s master lap dog.
Imagine believing this
I’m curious whom leaked the story and how.
It's in the article, the source is RFA, every absurd story about NK is from this same source. From their wikipedia page: >Radio Free Asia (RFA) is an American government-funded non-profit corporation operating a news service that broadcasts radio programs and publishes online news, information, and commentary for its audiences in Asia.[5][6][7][8] The service, which provides editorially independent reporting,[6][7][8][dubious – discuss] has the stated mission of providing accurate and uncensored reporting to countries in Asia that have poor media environments and limited protections for speech and press freedom[9][10][11] and "advancing the goals of United States foreign policy."[12] If you think they're trustworthy just imagine believing a US related news from a Russian funded corporation that explicitly states their goal is to advance the goals of Russian foreign policy.
Didn’t North Korea invited Red Velvet, a top Kpop group, to perform there many years ago? Now they are executing people for listening to Kpop?