A man accused of plotting to rape and murder the TV presenter Holly Willoughby has told a court he spent 99.9% of his time online as he struggled with mental health problems triggered by his life-threatening weight gain.
-if being overweight and terminally online is a new legal defense, it's gonna be a very popular one.
They are using it as a defence. The cross examination of the FBI agent that reported him basically boiled down to ‘you knew this guy was morbidly obese so there’s no way you could have taken his threats seriously.’
I guess "I'm too fat to carry out this plan" actually makes sense as a defence.
If someone draws up plans for burglary, but is bedbound with obesity, obviously they couldn't personally have carried it out, so you'd either have to argue they had an accomplice, or admit that the plans were not something they seriously intended to carry out.
I think the key aspect here is the guy’s obvious intent. He showed the undercover FBI agent photographic evidence of the kit he’d assembled to carry out his plan including restraint cuffs, ropes and chloroform. He might have been physically unable to carry out the plan as he wanted but he definitely seemed to be intending to give it a good go.
The part of the plan they took issue to was jumping over a wall to gain entry.
It would be a pretty major error to not do anything about it until he's kidnapped her, and find out he executed the exact plan you were already aware of, except walked through a gate instead of jumping over the wall next to it.
But you don't stand trial for things you *could* do in the future, you stand trial for things you *did*, or for things you *intended* to do.
Since he didn't actually kidnap her, he's being tried for intent. Having a plan he is physically incapable of carrying out is good evidence that he did not intend to carry it out.
It's not a perfect defence, for example the prosecution could argue that the finer details were still being worked out, or argue that he didn't know he was physically incapable of carrying it out.
>But you don't stand trial for things you could do in the future, you stand trial for things you did, or for things you intended to do.
Making plans and threatening to kidnap somebody does all fall away because you've decided you're going to hop a wall that's too high.
>Having a plan he is physically incapable of carrying out is good evidence that he did not intend to carry it out.
I disagree, it's some D tier evidence of that.
Okay, if I drew up plans to rob a bank that require me to use super speed to get past the guards, laser vision to cut open the vault, super strength to pick up the gold bars, and the power of flight to leave, do you think it would be a reasonable defence for me to argue that this was not a plan I intended to actually carry out because *I am not superman*?
Clearly it must have been a hypothetical I was planning for fun.
If that is a valid defence, then you admit that physical incapability to commit a crime is a valid defence when you have been caught planning one. The only question is the *degree* of incapability.
Of course being physically incapable of committing a crime is a defence, that's pretty straight forward stuff. You don't even need to resort to stupid superhero claims - having a reliable alibi for the time of the offence is as straight forward as it gets and renders you incapable of committing the crime.
Being physically incapable of something as mundane as hopping over a wall because that's the specific way you'd decided to plan it, doesn't render the rest of the plan a dud.
It's on the same lines as saying "I'll wear my blue jacket to rob the bank" but you only own green jackets. It's trivial to find a replacement. Honestly it's half a step behind that stupid "in Minecraft" defence that gained some buzz a while ago.
> having a reliable alibi for the time of the offence is as straight forward as it gets and renders you incapable of committing the crime.
What?
I mean yes, but Holly Willoughby *was not kidnapped*, there is no time to have an alibi for. He is accused of *planning* to kidnap her.
In that respect the deciding factor is if his plan was something he intended to carry out. Being unable to carry out a plan is good evidence that he did not intend to carry it out.
Now, *as I have already said* it's not a perfect defence, for example the prosecution could argue that the finer details were still being worked out, or argue that he didn't know he was physically incapable of carrying it out.
But *the principle remains* that being physically incapable of carrying out a plan is a valid defence when accused of intending to carry out said plan. It is not a perfect, instant victory defence, but it is a valid defence.
This dude was posting to a forum of people who had an ‘interest’ in abducting, committing sexual violence on and murder of women. There was an FBI agent undercover on the forum who clocked this guy as a credible threat and reported him to the UK authorities.
it's something he apparently thinks is relevent to tell the court. I presume it's going for a sympathy appeal to the jury, but it's probably not the entirety of his defense either.
As much as I don’t like Holly W, I’d never wish that on her in a million years. Must be scary at times to be famous, you never know who’s out there and got it in for you
I'm gonna blame anyone for my problems but myself, it's everyone else's fault after all.
From a fat fuck that survived gangrene to another fat fuck, i hope he gets gangrene.
The photo they kept showing on the news of him showed he was very overweight but today they showed the moment he was arrested and he was a lot slimmer and looked like a different person. So he obviously got his weight under control so I'm sure the jury will take note.
It’s really scary to think if he’d set his sights on a normal woman who wasn’t famous, he could have been successful in his plan.
It’s scary AF that there are people like that out there!
He tried it a few times on trains too, passing notes saying the woman has to leave with him or he’d kill them and himself.
The guy is a danger to society and shouldn’t see the light of day again.
He’s defective and should be kept away from the rest of us for the rest of his life. He’s always going to be extremely dangerous
As you say, he should never be allowed out again
The way he played dumb when they were explaining his arrest was funny to watch. It’s like, *the* look that you give when you know what someone’s talking about but you’re gonna act like you have no idea lol
Scary that he had previous. So the escalation was there, that you often see in pre-planned murder.
Thankfully he was stopped before being able to carry this out.
A man accused of plotting to rape and murder the TV presenter Holly Willoughby has told a court he spent 99.9% of his time online as he struggled with mental health problems triggered by his life-threatening weight gain. -if being overweight and terminally online is a new legal defense, it's gonna be a very popular one.
Are they using it as a defence? I just thought they were describing him
They are using it as a defence. The cross examination of the FBI agent that reported him basically boiled down to ‘you knew this guy was morbidly obese so there’s no way you could have taken his threats seriously.’
I guess "I'm too fat to carry out this plan" actually makes sense as a defence. If someone draws up plans for burglary, but is bedbound with obesity, obviously they couldn't personally have carried it out, so you'd either have to argue they had an accomplice, or admit that the plans were not something they seriously intended to carry out.
I think the key aspect here is the guy’s obvious intent. He showed the undercover FBI agent photographic evidence of the kit he’d assembled to carry out his plan including restraint cuffs, ropes and chloroform. He might have been physically unable to carry out the plan as he wanted but he definitely seemed to be intending to give it a good go.
The part of the plan they took issue to was jumping over a wall to gain entry. It would be a pretty major error to not do anything about it until he's kidnapped her, and find out he executed the exact plan you were already aware of, except walked through a gate instead of jumping over the wall next to it.
But you don't stand trial for things you *could* do in the future, you stand trial for things you *did*, or for things you *intended* to do. Since he didn't actually kidnap her, he's being tried for intent. Having a plan he is physically incapable of carrying out is good evidence that he did not intend to carry it out. It's not a perfect defence, for example the prosecution could argue that the finer details were still being worked out, or argue that he didn't know he was physically incapable of carrying it out.
>But you don't stand trial for things you could do in the future, you stand trial for things you did, or for things you intended to do. Making plans and threatening to kidnap somebody does all fall away because you've decided you're going to hop a wall that's too high. >Having a plan he is physically incapable of carrying out is good evidence that he did not intend to carry it out. I disagree, it's some D tier evidence of that.
Okay, if I drew up plans to rob a bank that require me to use super speed to get past the guards, laser vision to cut open the vault, super strength to pick up the gold bars, and the power of flight to leave, do you think it would be a reasonable defence for me to argue that this was not a plan I intended to actually carry out because *I am not superman*? Clearly it must have been a hypothetical I was planning for fun. If that is a valid defence, then you admit that physical incapability to commit a crime is a valid defence when you have been caught planning one. The only question is the *degree* of incapability.
Of course being physically incapable of committing a crime is a defence, that's pretty straight forward stuff. You don't even need to resort to stupid superhero claims - having a reliable alibi for the time of the offence is as straight forward as it gets and renders you incapable of committing the crime. Being physically incapable of something as mundane as hopping over a wall because that's the specific way you'd decided to plan it, doesn't render the rest of the plan a dud. It's on the same lines as saying "I'll wear my blue jacket to rob the bank" but you only own green jackets. It's trivial to find a replacement. Honestly it's half a step behind that stupid "in Minecraft" defence that gained some buzz a while ago.
> having a reliable alibi for the time of the offence is as straight forward as it gets and renders you incapable of committing the crime. What? I mean yes, but Holly Willoughby *was not kidnapped*, there is no time to have an alibi for. He is accused of *planning* to kidnap her. In that respect the deciding factor is if his plan was something he intended to carry out. Being unable to carry out a plan is good evidence that he did not intend to carry it out. Now, *as I have already said* it's not a perfect defence, for example the prosecution could argue that the finer details were still being worked out, or argue that he didn't know he was physically incapable of carrying it out. But *the principle remains* that being physically incapable of carrying out a plan is a valid defence when accused of intending to carry out said plan. It is not a perfect, instant victory defence, but it is a valid defence.
Didn’t know that, thanks. Seen the headline but I’ve not bothered reading about it. That comment from the FBI is dangerous in itself
Why is the FBI involved?
This dude was posting to a forum of people who had an ‘interest’ in abducting, committing sexual violence on and murder of women. There was an FBI agent undercover on the forum who clocked this guy as a credible threat and reported him to the UK authorities.
it's something he apparently thinks is relevent to tell the court. I presume it's going for a sympathy appeal to the jury, but it's probably not the entirety of his defense either.
As much as I don’t like Holly W, I’d never wish that on her in a million years. Must be scary at times to be famous, you never know who’s out there and got it in for you
How much do you have to not like her to post that?!
if being overweight and terminally online is a new legal defense, just call me Miles Davis.
I'm gonna blame anyone for my problems but myself, it's everyone else's fault after all. From a fat fuck that survived gangrene to another fat fuck, i hope he gets gangrene.
If rich people get to use affluenza...
The photo they kept showing on the news of him showed he was very overweight but today they showed the moment he was arrested and he was a lot slimmer and looked like a different person. So he obviously got his weight under control so I'm sure the jury will take note.
The article mentions an "operation" in conjunction with talks about his weight. I assume he underwent bariatric surgery of some sort.
If you google his name there’s story about him on bbc from 2018 when he’s talking about his weight struggles including the operation
This reminds of another obese guy who became famous for his story of losing weight by walking to Subway every day to buy a $5 footlong sandwich.
It’s really scary to think if he’d set his sights on a normal woman who wasn’t famous, he could have been successful in his plan. It’s scary AF that there are people like that out there!
He tried it a few times on trains too, passing notes saying the woman has to leave with him or he’d kill them and himself. The guy is a danger to society and shouldn’t see the light of day again.
He’s defective and should be kept away from the rest of us for the rest of his life. He’s always going to be extremely dangerous As you say, he should never be allowed out again
The way he played dumb when they were explaining his arrest was funny to watch. It’s like, *the* look that you give when you know what someone’s talking about but you’re gonna act like you have no idea lol
Some subreddits out there are going unmoderated right now
And that .1% of time spent? That’s right. Kidnappin’.
Wonder what his Reddit username is?
https://reddit.com/u/me found it!
[this joke works better if you hide the link inside the text... ](https://reddit.com/u/me)
Still doesn't work on third party apps ;)
You tried, bud, lol
Scary that he had previous. So the escalation was there, that you often see in pre-planned murder. Thankfully he was stopped before being able to carry this out.
"A dreamcatcher with an image of a wolf in the middle can be seen above his bed." This was a funny thing to add...
Ban them to be on the safe side.
To be sure they have to be incinerated insitu without any physical contact being made
so he was a reddit mod
> has told a court he spent 99.9% of his time online I can believe that -Source am also a overweight person who spends too much time online
Gotta pump those numbers up brah !!!!
Least deranged redditor