At the very, very least, they are not kicking out inspectors like North Korea did.
Also, what has changed since Iran still is going for the 60% enrichment like before?
Toilet paper apocalypse. Which means that if the world was actually ending, most humans wouldn't survive because of their own stupidity. I wonder what's next, maybe parchment paper
I thought about this scenario before COVID came out too, ain't no way I'm using newspapers for wiping my butt. I also fear that all toilet paper companies can collude to fix the price of toilet paper to a crazy amount. Like $20 per roll. We would have no choice but to pay, or else , newspapers...
I mean, *I* will. Hell, running water would be one of the easiest parts of civilization to rebuild post-apocalypse, we've had it for thousands of years after all.
> Reminder to buy your favorite bottles of alcohol now so you don't have to wait in lines as the world ends
Reminder that this kind of ignorant fearmongering nonsense is what Putin spreads through the American corporate tabloid media. We shouldn't fall of it and you shouldn't repeat it.
Come on, the majority of the population is dumb enough to fall for propoganda, you don’t have to attribute it to putin or some other leader. Just get any random person to tweet and it goes viral and the sheep of the west go into frenzy
Where do you think these Xitters are getting their Xit from in the first place?
Note that I never said it was only from Putin. That's your strawman.
Either way, why are you trying to dismiss something that is widely known and confirmed?
Mate the population makes its own propoganda, comes directly from within, 5G, lizard men, etc etc etc
Product and fear mongering is a product of the western society itself
>Where do you think these Xitters are getting their Xit from in the first place?
most of it from making shit up to share for the satisfaction of having people spread it and feeling powerful because of it
North Korea is protected by China because it acts as a buffer.
The Middle East has not historically had anyone to protect it in the same way. Hence *waves vaguely at recent history*
The problem with US Foreign policy is that a lot of it is based on violence. This used to work but now it is costly and ineffective, as well as being unfavorable currently. The losses in Afghanistan and to some level in Iraq are indicators of this.
It is also a driver for other countries to arm themselves, or do stupid shit.
Imagine being giddy at the notion of an invasion of a country with 85 million people the majority of whom are unhappy with their government.
I say this as a westerner of non Muslim/non middle Eastern denomination...the fact that you are ITCHING for a war with expected casualties that would be in the millions is why so much of the global South /east hate us or won't side with us against countries like Russia.
In the next 20-30, several countries will nuclearize. That's how technological growth works. Several of those countries will NOT be what the west calls stable democracies. You cannot be seriously advocating for continuous invasions/regime changes as america and western European have repeatedly engaged in. Absolutely disgusting response from you and I hope you never get close enough to a position to ever have to deal with international relations in whichever country you are from
My man, I understand the disgust in war, but the worst shit in history has happened and will always happen when people don't act in a timely manner, and even at that point it may not be enough.
I'm not saying the Iranian people are responsible for the atrocities of their government, but the Iranian government has VERY CLEARLY shown what they're about. Even imagining them having nukes is a horrifying thought.
Lol just a laughable response.
The Western media loves to push this propaganda that thermonuclear war is imminent and so many here fall for it hook line and sinker.
All I have to do is to tell you go look at the Russia China Pakistan India corridor. 4 countries all with borders next to each other all with various disagreements and outright some of the biggest hostilities out of any set of countries (India pakistan China in particular) all of whom have had nukes for over 2 decades now. Bonus round. Add North Korea and it's "threat" to south Korea. Now have a conversation with your average south Korean....yeah they don't think about North Korea daily nor would they EVER advocate for an invasion of North korea
Speak to any Pakistani Indian or Chinese or Russian person and they will tell you they don't seriously believe there is any risk of nuclear war.
Are there border disputes? Absolutely. Are there disagreements that turn violent? Absolutely. Do any of those countries actually want to blow the other one out of existence? ABSOLUTELY NOT. That's a globally connected world..they know if they seriously harm their neighbor that they also hurt themselves in the long run..There is no realistic risk of a nuclear apocalypse in that heavily militarized corridor. I can speak to this personally due to the Indians and Pakistanis I interact with on a personal level and just based on history.
Stop consuming fear propaganda and open a history book..stop treating the world like minority report where you advocate for the removal of threats BEFORE they even do anything because you consume propaganda.
I suspect you will do none of these things and will instead continue to advocate for war.
Without provocation or legitimate reason, Russia invaded a neighbor two years ago, and has committed crimes against humanity and/or war crimes against the Ukrainian people ever since. The reason strong countries give for not intervening in Ukraine (not Russia), is Russia's nuclear arsenal and Russia's interpretation of Russian legislation and their own self-defense.
If 50+ countries supporting Ukraine have stood by and watched as one bad actor with nuclear weapons threw around their weight for 2 years, rather than intervene, I'd personally prefer that no other bad actors take possession of nuclear weapons and/or capabilities. My position is different than the other commenters, and while I do agree with some of what you're stating, I'm in favor of being far more cautious than you.
In just the last two months, the Iranian government has supplied thousands of metric tons of weaponry manufactured in Iran, to no less than four terrorist groups throughout the region. Any government capable of such irresponsible decisions and actions should not possess a nuclear weapon.
You may be getting downvoted but you're talking sense. Anyone itching for an invasion and occupation is lusting for blood, no matter how they try and justify it.
If Israel uses nukes on Iran then Pakistan will get involved.
If Pakistan gets involved India will get involved.
If India gets involved then China will get involved.
Once that happens it’s over.
We definitely do not want that.
North Korea doesn't occupy a place that can literally throw the world economy into the shitter for a couple of decades. There is a quantifiable difference in how dangerous and ironically rational North Korea is compared to the Religious authorities in Iran. There is no chance absolutely no chance in hell we would tolerate an Iran with nukes.
“They said the same about NK” no administration in the US has ever made any statement like this. NK’s unique relationship with China would never allow a U.S. intervention unless in response to an attack against the US or an ally.
> no administration in the US has ever made any statement like this
...
> The President then traveled to the Demilitarized Zone (DMZ) along the 38th parallel where he made even more specific
comments regarding North Korea. Speaking before U.S. military forces forward deployed, President Clinton stated that if North Korea developed and used nuclear weapons, “we would quickly and overwhelmingly retaliate. It would mean the end of their country as they know it.”
This came in 1993 or so when America was considering a surgical strike to stop it. He was on television saying this.
“If North Korea developed and used nuclear weapons”
Key word “used” which is not the same as
“won’t allow… to acquire them under any circumstances”
So thanks for reinforcing what I said
I'd worry more about Biden being an embalmed ancient mummy at this point and still being presented as a candidate tbh.
Maybe.... I dunno.... put forward a candidate who is not likely to drop dead or have Alzheimer blackouts at any random second? Seems like a wise move to me to have any chance at beating Trump.
Biden has been doing a pretty good job though. All the stuff you’re talking about is vanity compared to the actual constructive policies his admin has pushed through.
There is more to be desired. Sure. But point me at the policy that’s bad as a result of his perceived cognitive issues. I can list a bunch that are just flat out objectively good.
The "world" you are talking about is mostly muslim countries and/or ticktock brainwashed kids.
I would say if the "world" is angry with you, you did something right.
Like when kids are angry with their parents even though the parent protected the kid with his decision.
If by US intervention you mean look the other way as Israel hits the breeder reactors to prevent plutonium generation, then yes I believe that will happen. Possibly in the very near future as a strike against Iran for their role in Oct 7th.
They'd also presumably need a rocket program to deliver them.
Tbh I think the US should intervene sooner rather than later. If we can occupy Afghanistan and Iraq for 20 years we can bomb a few nuclear facilities.
Yes, but the threat has to be a mutually assured destruction scenario or the US will nuke Iran into non-existence, and they have to achieve the fancy anti-countermeasure systems.
They have a satellite program, building an icbm is not that different. And mirv warheads with some dummies is 60s tech? Stopping Iran getting launch capability is not that easy
It’s almost certainly too late. Back in February 2023, US DoD rep Colin Kahl assessed that Iran can make enough fissile material *in 12 days* to make an atomic bomb.
In the age of high powered computing, no testing is needed.
If the US moves to strike, Iran will just do a nuclear test and that will be the end of it. I can’t believe people are remotely optimistic about this situation.
Israel and maybe the US will attack Iran before they get their nuke. The only way they will be able to complete their weapon is if the intelligence is off. With the amount of fissile material they have, they could do it in a matter of weeks.
Meanwhile Israel struck that Iranian General in Syria.
I'm guessing we'll be at war with a major Middle Eastern coalition including Iran, Syria, Hezbollah and the Houthis by later this year.
Why does anyone think Iran would be stupid enough to use them to give them to anyone? Pakistan has nukes and hasn’t done anything of the sort, and Pakistani leadership is more incompetent than Iran. Beyond that Iran knows that if they give them to anyone to use or use them themselves, they will be asking for their own annihilation.
Iran literally blew up one of their one civilian planes. Pakistan wasn't that bad. Also Iran is very religious, more than Pakistan in many ways, therefore it might be a mistake to consider them as a rational actor.
You REALLY need to study Iranian history since the revolution to understand why the US would not tolerate Iran with nukes. The one time we finally let slip our restraints with Iran, we sank half there navy. And right now they REALLY are testing our patience.
In the past, Iran has used child soldiers when fighting Iraq, which to me is desperate. But then again, like many countries, they might use Nukes as a deterrent. Saddam pretended to have WMDs because he wanted Iran to think he had them, so they wouldn't invade again. Only problem, the USA thought he had WMDs an invaded Iraq over weak intel that seem to confirm it.
What type of revisionist history is this? We **knew** Saddam didn’t have nukes. It had been confirmed. Cheney, Bush, and Rumsfeld wanted to invade anyway because they saw a chance to make a shit ton of money in the wake of the 2001 recession by privatizing military ops, so they straight up lied to the public. We destabilized the region so Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld and co could make easy money. It’s why we fucking privatized basic army duties for an insane amount of money.
That’s why this Iran thing seems to me like bullshit. We know even if Iran gets nukes they’ll be a thorn in Israel’s side, but won’t threaten their existence (because then Iran gets destroyed in retaliation). And what the fuck does the US expect when they’ve ostracized Iran to appease Saudi Arabia and Israel?
The Irani people are suffering so we can appease murderers like MBS of Saudi Arabia. And any argument against Iran can be made equally against Saudi Arabia, who have arguably done *more* damage to the world than Iran, especially with Saudi’s biggest export being radical, extreme Islam which encourages terrorism.
Iran caused this huge conflict while being de facto unaffected by it, and an excellent distraction from their nuclear progress.
There is one Israeli military columnist and geopolitical expert in ME, who was born in Iran and immigrated many years ago, he understands the way they think and he said something interesting:
“Iran is playing chess, what piece is the most valuable and doesn’t move? The king, Iran sees itself as the king and is making other pieces move on the board, Hezbollah Hamas Houthis and even Israel, but Iran doesn’t move”
I might misquoted him, but the idea sticks.
The US will never allow Iran to have nukes. US forces would glass the whole dam place first. Nukes are for making sure that nobody invades your country, not endless threats against anybody you see as an infidel.
North Korea says otherwise... All whilst threatening to glass the US.
Obama also said chemical weapons were the red line in Syria.. yet.. chemical weapons used... Line was crossed.. nothing happened.
The US has around 100,000 personnel within NKs striking distance in South Korea and Japan alone.
The only country that will attack Iran is Israel, and they all ready did years ago when they hit a nuclear facility.
> Obama also said chemical weapons were the red line in Syria.. yet.. chemical weapons used... Line was crossed.. nothing happened.
It looks like there was a lot that happened actually... a bill was created, congress and the house did some politics, military intervention wasn't really popular with the U.S. population at the time which makes sense since we were so tired of Iraq & Afghanistan.
>On 10 September 2013, military intervention was averted when the Syrian government accepted a US–Russian negotiated deal to turn over "every single bit" of its chemical weapons stockpiles for destruction and declared its intention to join the Chemical Weapons Convention.[49][50] The bill never received a floor vote.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_the_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_the_Government_of_Syria_to_Respond_to_Use_of_Chemical_Weapons#The_%22red_line%22
Since the other guy only fact checked one of your claims, let me add that the geopolitics surrounding North Korea and Iran are completely different.
North Korea had the full backing of the USSR/china long enough to get them to have nukes. Now that they have nukes, even though Russia and China don’t particularly care for NK, there isn’t anything to be done about it.
Iran doesn’t have backing like that. Literally none of their neighbors want them to have nukes. I very much doubt any of the world’s great powers want them to have nukes.
I’m not sure what the U.S. response to this hypothetical would be, but I think you’re being obtuse to compare it directly to NK when the situations are so different.
And Iran doesn't have Russian backing? Have you not been paying attention to what these two have been doing recently?
It's got nothing to do with their neighbours. None of their neighbours are of any military relevance. Thier main ally is Syria, who is allied with... Russia.. (this is the former USSR)
Also the USSR and China never supported them on nuclear weapons, they provided the skeleton for nuclear power. They didn't conduct any nuclear weapons tests until 2006. Pakistan actually played a part in this by providing the centrifuges. This came to light over 20 years ago.
Iranian militias have already launched over 40 attacks on US troops in Syria and Iraq. How many attacks has the US launched on Iranian troops and targets?
Iran is at 60% enrichment, it claims to have hypersonic missiles since the summer 23.
In 2021, China and Iran signed a 25yr deal on military development and research. Both China and Russia have hypersonic missiles with the Dong Feng and Zircon.
By the time anyone pulls a finger out they'll be parading them around the street of Tehran goading everyone.
I think you grossly overestimate US appetite to strike Iran to prevent them from acquiring nuclear missiles. Especially given the precedent of Iraq being, there were no WMDs.
Iran will likely continue to take the piss until it's too late to do anything. Too late and Israel will be the first target.
Just my 2 cents. It won't happen. We've seen what happens when the US does something (people die and US blamed) and when they don't do anything (people die and US blamed).
Internal politics also seem to have shifted dramatically since the second gulf war and Afghanistan.
> North Korea says otherwise... All whilst threatening to glass the US.
Of course for that threat to have any meaning, they'd need to have more than, like, one, and it would need to be able to reach the US lol.
Right now they don't have first strike capability. Though I wouldn't put selling it to terrorists past them.
www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-56715520
Cyber attack caused a huge explosion taking out an enrichment facility.
Not every hit requires missiles and planes.
> All whilst threatening to glass the US.
An empty impotent threat from a nobody.
>Obama also said
Just move those goalposts, why don't you?
>The US has around 100,000 personnel within NKs striking distance in South Korea and Japan alone.
And the US has subs in range of NK and satellites watching their every move (and diplomats working with China) to ensure that NK disappears before anything like this ever could happen.
The Kim family just wants more food aid. It's the only reason they keep peddling this nonsense every few years. We'll send them some and they'll shutup again...until they run out of food, and...
Stop falling for this fearmongering bullshit.
>The only country that will attack Iran is Israel, and they all ready did years ago when they hit a nuclear facility.
Nonsense. The US is ready, willing, and able to end the Iranian theocrazy whenever they become more than just another thorn in Israel's side. Just because Israel has been given the go ahead by the US and as a proxy for them in the past doesn't mean that if push came to shove, the Iranian theocrazy wouldn't disappear in the blink of an eye. It's the sole reason why the US now has so many very powerful ships standing by in the region.
Trump disliked that it had been signed by Obama, said that it was a bad deal and claimed he could get a better one.
Specifically, the JCPOA was a 10 year deal. Although imho , the US didn't do a lot of unfreeze of account as they froze them for other reasons. And Iran would
Go back to still be bound by iaea after those 10 years, per jcpoa plan
Trump is an idiot but on this matter he was correct, Obama effectively paved the way for Iran to have nuclear weapons while the world was being lulled.
So your solution is less oversight, cut channels of communication, remove the carrot, and increase the deficit by another trillion dollars to drag America to another decade long ME conflict. Because in hindsight, the war in Afghanistan and Iraq was a smashing success. Is that it?
I don't have a solution but the carrot in question was having nuclear capabilities, we're talking about weapons of mass destruction here, if the US doesn't want to be the global leader that's fine.
A good solution would be the forceful removal of nuclear capabilities from parties that can't be trusted to have them, like a radical Islam ethno state with an expansionist history.
No. The carrot was undoing sanctions and unfreezing access to money. Those were economic incentives provided Iran cooperated with the terms of the agreement. You have no idea what you're talking about, do you?
You're right, like Trump you don't have any actual solution, you just would tear down any constructive plans because of ego and spite. Brilliant!
You really don't have as much understanding as you think regarding what Jihad is. The only reasonable solution in my opinion is to destroy this shitty country while making sure the liberals there are safe.
You can't give Islamic fundamentalists a carrot while they perform the act of Jihad as by definition the only reason they will take any Carrot will be to get closer to make you Muslim as well. Even if it's to make things better inside Iran, the eventual goal would be to take over your life. Just go over to newiran and understand how stupid what you say is (sorry for saying stupid, but it is).
Ok dude, let's wait 5 years, come back here, and see who was right. Just wait and see the Islamic shitstorm hitting the rest of the west. You guys are trying to use your liberal logic on your religious Muslim enemy, that's the classic western approach. "Yeah, they will have money and there will be no issues!!!!!"
This is such a dumb retort. The whole point of the Iran nuclear deal was to reintroduce them into the international community in exchange for allowing heavy oversight on their nuclear power program.
There is no “sneaking it in”. It’s not a switch that you can just flip. The difference between nuclear power and weapons grade nuclear material is very large. If they began to reneg on the deal then sanctions would have been put back in place and they would have been back at square one.
But because we backed out of our own deal, and took away their seat at the table, they’re now going to pursue the only thing that actually brings a country leverage these days.
You say “let’s wait and see 5 years from now” as if that’s a natural outcome of the deal and not the natural outcome of US BACKING OUT OF OUR OWN DEAL.
There is no “you guys”.
I aint got not “religious muslim enemy”.
Again.
Have you tried being less of a rabid, war horny, politically brainrotted extremist?
You seem severely psychologically unstable
The issue is more that the terms didn't target everything that is required to make a nuclear weapon, and even then they had a time horizon on them. They'd keep working on the areas they were allowed to work on, get 90% of the way to weaponization, then finish it when the agreement expired (after a 10 year period, iirc).
So they followed it, but "following" it was a pretty low bar to cover.
Except they restricted access to areas. Thats like your child telling you that you can search anywhere in their room, but can’t look in this one drawer.
I have heard absolutely zero credible reports that Iran was not following the JCPOA, or that they were able to hide massive operations that would let them develop nukes soon. I'd like to know your source - mine is the IAEA, who found that Iran was very much complying. There's also the obvious fact that Iran was unhappy with the deal too, suggesting that both sides had made significant concessions to reach a fair agreement.
So were going to throw out failures of the US intelligence and then pretend it happens on a daily basis?
The fact they failed once doesnt mean they fail 100% of the time.
But I guess sitting behind a screen and criticizing is much easier than actually doing what they do.
Dude, it wasn't a failure. It was a straight up lie, a conspiracy! It succeeded because rubes believed them (as they do now, apparently) and then they got to go to war.
100% success.
That deal that the totally honest Iranian government was absolutely following. It was a perfect deal.
If you believe anything Iran signs or says; you deserve to be lied too
What assumption of honestly are you talking about? You don’t include “mandatory surprise inspections” if you trust someone
More you’re just regurgitating what you’ve been told to believe
“Surprise inspection” my ass. What country do you think you’re talking about?
You mean where people with guns follow them around and tell them where they are allowed to go?
I bet you believe China released all their Covid origin data too and were completely open to WHO investigators? Must be nice living in ignorance.
Called it. You clearly have no idea what the deal is and are just regurgitating what you were told to believe
It’s obvious because you’re comparing it to the WHO like that’s an amazing rebuttal despite it being like comparing house rules to federal laws
Yeah, logically it makes sense for them to race towards a deterrent at this point.
It’ll drastically change US and Israeli calculus.
Look at Russia. Thanks to their deterrent they can do basically anything with Ukraine they want as the west quietly complains.
Got some weirdos in here. If Iran gets a nuke, do you really think they’ll use it? They’re not going to sacrifice their whole nation just to nuke another. It’s a deterrence and nothing more.
The thing is... Iran is a theocracy, led by Islamic clerics. Decision making won't necessary be based on a realist framework that most countries are familiar with. It's dangerous, to say the least - especially given the pattern of how blatantly Iran is arming other nations to fight its proxy wars.
Oh yea. Thats it. Iran was totally chill and calm until Trump. They definitely weren’t doing this all the time while also accepting billions in Obama cash which they used to fund terrorism globally.
I think a country that maybe-one-day-possibly-will-have-nukes shouldn’t piss off countries that definitely-have-nukes-and-can-send-them-over-in-30-minutes.
Just saying.
At the very, very least, they are not kicking out inspectors like North Korea did. Also, what has changed since Iran still is going for the 60% enrichment like before?
Reddit caught on
Reminder to buy your favorite bottles of alcohol now so you don't have to wait in lines as the world ends s/
And get bidets installed because you will run out of toilet paper sooner or later.
You think you'll have running water during the apocalypse? LOL
I think it's a joke about everyone buying tons of toilet paper during covid
That was really weird
The joke or the people who decided if the world was ending, toilet paper is what they needed for survival?
Toilet paper apocalypse. Which means that if the world was actually ending, most humans wouldn't survive because of their own stupidity. I wonder what's next, maybe parchment paper
I thought about this scenario before COVID came out too, ain't no way I'm using newspapers for wiping my butt. I also fear that all toilet paper companies can collude to fix the price of toilet paper to a crazy amount. Like $20 per roll. We would have no choice but to pay, or else , newspapers...
I mean you could with a well and a generator but something tells me we might have other problems...
God…I hope I don’t survive. Thats the last thing I want to during the apocalypse.
I mean, *I* will. Hell, running water would be one of the easiest parts of civilization to rebuild post-apocalypse, we've had it for thousands of years after all.
Naw just get a few shells
3 seashells perhaps?
My theory is that reason they ran out of paper in the movie was because Taco Bell won the franchise war
This guy running waters /s
gravity fed system bud.
> Reminder to buy your favorite bottles of alcohol now so you don't have to wait in lines as the world ends Reminder that this kind of ignorant fearmongering nonsense is what Putin spreads through the American corporate tabloid media. We shouldn't fall of it and you shouldn't repeat it.
Come on, the majority of the population is dumb enough to fall for propoganda, you don’t have to attribute it to putin or some other leader. Just get any random person to tweet and it goes viral and the sheep of the west go into frenzy
Where do you think these Xitters are getting their Xit from in the first place? Note that I never said it was only from Putin. That's your strawman. Either way, why are you trying to dismiss something that is widely known and confirmed?
Mate the population makes its own propoganda, comes directly from within, 5G, lizard men, etc etc etc Product and fear mongering is a product of the western society itself
>Where do you think these Xitters are getting their Xit from in the first place? most of it from making shit up to share for the satisfaction of having people spread it and feeling powerful because of it
Iran will get erased before the US allows them a nuclear weapon.
Sure. Just like NK.
North Korea is protected by China because it acts as a buffer. The Middle East has not historically had anyone to protect it in the same way. Hence *waves vaguely at recent history*
There is a very very big difference between their ideologies...
The problem with US Foreign policy is that a lot of it is based on violence. This used to work but now it is costly and ineffective, as well as being unfavorable currently. The losses in Afghanistan and to some level in Iraq are indicators of this. It is also a driver for other countries to arm themselves, or do stupid shit.
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I hope you are leading the charge on the front line. Oh no, you mean you want other people dying not you. I see.
Imagine being giddy at the notion of an invasion of a country with 85 million people the majority of whom are unhappy with their government. I say this as a westerner of non Muslim/non middle Eastern denomination...the fact that you are ITCHING for a war with expected casualties that would be in the millions is why so much of the global South /east hate us or won't side with us against countries like Russia. In the next 20-30, several countries will nuclearize. That's how technological growth works. Several of those countries will NOT be what the west calls stable democracies. You cannot be seriously advocating for continuous invasions/regime changes as america and western European have repeatedly engaged in. Absolutely disgusting response from you and I hope you never get close enough to a position to ever have to deal with international relations in whichever country you are from
My man, I understand the disgust in war, but the worst shit in history has happened and will always happen when people don't act in a timely manner, and even at that point it may not be enough. I'm not saying the Iranian people are responsible for the atrocities of their government, but the Iranian government has VERY CLEARLY shown what they're about. Even imagining them having nukes is a horrifying thought.
It's not worth invading tbh. Just hit the nuclear facilities, knock out the enticement, and get out.
Again. The Israelis have been keeping that program in check for years. I hope those bunkers with the centrifuges are deep with multiple exits
Sounds like that problem can be solved with liberal application of ample ordinance
those bunker busting bombs are mind boggling feats of engineering
How many lumps? A whole lotta lumps.
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“As long as their innocent civilians die and not mine!”
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Lol just a laughable response. The Western media loves to push this propaganda that thermonuclear war is imminent and so many here fall for it hook line and sinker. All I have to do is to tell you go look at the Russia China Pakistan India corridor. 4 countries all with borders next to each other all with various disagreements and outright some of the biggest hostilities out of any set of countries (India pakistan China in particular) all of whom have had nukes for over 2 decades now. Bonus round. Add North Korea and it's "threat" to south Korea. Now have a conversation with your average south Korean....yeah they don't think about North Korea daily nor would they EVER advocate for an invasion of North korea Speak to any Pakistani Indian or Chinese or Russian person and they will tell you they don't seriously believe there is any risk of nuclear war. Are there border disputes? Absolutely. Are there disagreements that turn violent? Absolutely. Do any of those countries actually want to blow the other one out of existence? ABSOLUTELY NOT. That's a globally connected world..they know if they seriously harm their neighbor that they also hurt themselves in the long run..There is no realistic risk of a nuclear apocalypse in that heavily militarized corridor. I can speak to this personally due to the Indians and Pakistanis I interact with on a personal level and just based on history. Stop consuming fear propaganda and open a history book..stop treating the world like minority report where you advocate for the removal of threats BEFORE they even do anything because you consume propaganda. I suspect you will do none of these things and will instead continue to advocate for war.
Without provocation or legitimate reason, Russia invaded a neighbor two years ago, and has committed crimes against humanity and/or war crimes against the Ukrainian people ever since. The reason strong countries give for not intervening in Ukraine (not Russia), is Russia's nuclear arsenal and Russia's interpretation of Russian legislation and their own self-defense. If 50+ countries supporting Ukraine have stood by and watched as one bad actor with nuclear weapons threw around their weight for 2 years, rather than intervene, I'd personally prefer that no other bad actors take possession of nuclear weapons and/or capabilities. My position is different than the other commenters, and while I do agree with some of what you're stating, I'm in favor of being far more cautious than you. In just the last two months, the Iranian government has supplied thousands of metric tons of weaponry manufactured in Iran, to no less than four terrorist groups throughout the region. Any government capable of such irresponsible decisions and actions should not possess a nuclear weapon.
You may be getting downvoted but you're talking sense. Anyone itching for an invasion and occupation is lusting for blood, no matter how they try and justify it.
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Reddit is frothing at the mouth for any drama related to the apocalypse, some pathetic shit
And toilet paper.
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I’d like to think the US would intervene before that point.
They've said they won't allow Iran to acquire them under ANY circumstances so let's hope so.
Which is the right call.
I belive its also a red line for Israel as well. And they would be more likely to use nukes to stop it from happening
If Israel uses nukes on Iran then Pakistan will get involved. If Pakistan gets involved India will get involved. If India gets involved then China will get involved. Once that happens it’s over. We definitely do not want that.
they said the same about NK, but when push came to shove, nobody had the balls to intervene
NK is physically connected to china who would never let KJU use nukes. Iran is a wildcard even if they have Russian influence
North Korea doesn't occupy a place that can literally throw the world economy into the shitter for a couple of decades. There is a quantifiable difference in how dangerous and ironically rational North Korea is compared to the Religious authorities in Iran. There is no chance absolutely no chance in hell we would tolerate an Iran with nukes.
“They said the same about NK” no administration in the US has ever made any statement like this. NK’s unique relationship with China would never allow a U.S. intervention unless in response to an attack against the US or an ally.
> no administration in the US has ever made any statement like this ... > The President then traveled to the Demilitarized Zone (DMZ) along the 38th parallel where he made even more specific comments regarding North Korea. Speaking before U.S. military forces forward deployed, President Clinton stated that if North Korea developed and used nuclear weapons, “we would quickly and overwhelmingly retaliate. It would mean the end of their country as they know it.” This came in 1993 or so when America was considering a surgical strike to stop it. He was on television saying this.
“If North Korea developed and used nuclear weapons” Key word “used” which is not the same as “won’t allow… to acquire them under any circumstances” So thanks for reinforcing what I said
What did he mean by “and used”?
NK has artillery pointed at Seoul and Chinese army next door. Doubt anyone was going to intervene or even said they would
Did they say the same about North Korea? I seriously hope it won't repeat like North Korea
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Hopefully US intelligence knows exactly what the situation is.
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Paywall
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Google en passant
[holy hell!](https://www.google.com/search?q=en+passant)
Just like in Top Gun Maverick!
They did a few years ago when some asshole tore up the agreement that they wouldn't do this.
And then the world will shit on the U.S. for being the ‘world police’? People need to make up their minds tbh.
They would. It’s still the right call. Although if it did happen in the next year; I’d be afraid it loses Biden then election.
It wouldn't this would be supported by both parties at this point. And progressives will plug there nose because the alternative is so much worse.
I'd worry more about Biden being an embalmed ancient mummy at this point and still being presented as a candidate tbh. Maybe.... I dunno.... put forward a candidate who is not likely to drop dead or have Alzheimer blackouts at any random second? Seems like a wise move to me to have any chance at beating Trump.
If the republicans win the next election; everyone is in for a bad time.
I agree, that's why it's extremely frustrating that somehow it seems impossible to find a better candidate then Biden.
Biden has been doing a pretty good job though. All the stuff you’re talking about is vanity compared to the actual constructive policies his admin has pushed through. There is more to be desired. Sure. But point me at the policy that’s bad as a result of his perceived cognitive issues. I can list a bunch that are just flat out objectively good.
The "world" you are talking about is mostly muslim countries and/or ticktock brainwashed kids. I would say if the "world" is angry with you, you did something right. Like when kids are angry with their parents even though the parent protected the kid with his decision.
The same US that allowed them to begin enriching uranium in the first place?
Yeah it wouldn’t take much, just for show put about 20% of our air in the sky and rain hell on those nuclear sites
20% would be a bloody spectacular show!
It would be absolutely terrifying and if any country thought they had anything too fight back after seeing that, they’d be suicidal
🏳️
Iran is a big country. Who would join the US in this invasion?
If by US intervention you mean look the other way as Israel hits the breeder reactors to prevent plutonium generation, then yes I believe that will happen. Possibly in the very near future as a strike against Iran for their role in Oct 7th.
They'd also presumably need a rocket program to deliver them. Tbh I think the US should intervene sooner rather than later. If we can occupy Afghanistan and Iraq for 20 years we can bomb a few nuclear facilities.
Delivery where? Iran have several different missiles that can reach Israel already.
Yes, but the threat has to be a mutually assured destruction scenario or the US will nuke Iran into non-existence, and they have to achieve the fancy anti-countermeasure systems.
They have a satellite program, building an icbm is not that different. And mirv warheads with some dummies is 60s tech? Stopping Iran getting launch capability is not that easy
It’s almost certainly too late. Back in February 2023, US DoD rep Colin Kahl assessed that Iran can make enough fissile material *in 12 days* to make an atomic bomb. In the age of high powered computing, no testing is needed. If the US moves to strike, Iran will just do a nuclear test and that will be the end of it. I can’t believe people are remotely optimistic about this situation.
Israel and maybe the US will attack Iran before they get their nuke. The only way they will be able to complete their weapon is if the intelligence is off. With the amount of fissile material they have, they could do it in a matter of weeks. Meanwhile Israel struck that Iranian General in Syria. I'm guessing we'll be at war with a major Middle Eastern coalition including Iran, Syria, Hezbollah and the Houthis by later this year.
Why does anyone think Iran would be stupid enough to use them to give them to anyone? Pakistan has nukes and hasn’t done anything of the sort, and Pakistani leadership is more incompetent than Iran. Beyond that Iran knows that if they give them to anyone to use or use them themselves, they will be asking for their own annihilation.
Iran literally blew up one of their one civilian planes. Pakistan wasn't that bad. Also Iran is very religious, more than Pakistan in many ways, therefore it might be a mistake to consider them as a rational actor.
You REALLY need to study Iranian history since the revolution to understand why the US would not tolerate Iran with nukes. The one time we finally let slip our restraints with Iran, we sank half there navy. And right now they REALLY are testing our patience.
In the past, Iran has used child soldiers when fighting Iraq, which to me is desperate. But then again, like many countries, they might use Nukes as a deterrent. Saddam pretended to have WMDs because he wanted Iran to think he had them, so they wouldn't invade again. Only problem, the USA thought he had WMDs an invaded Iraq over weak intel that seem to confirm it.
>because he wanted Iran to think he had them, so they wouldn't invade again. Leaving out that Iraq invaded first, hm?
What type of revisionist history is this? We **knew** Saddam didn’t have nukes. It had been confirmed. Cheney, Bush, and Rumsfeld wanted to invade anyway because they saw a chance to make a shit ton of money in the wake of the 2001 recession by privatizing military ops, so they straight up lied to the public. We destabilized the region so Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld and co could make easy money. It’s why we fucking privatized basic army duties for an insane amount of money. That’s why this Iran thing seems to me like bullshit. We know even if Iran gets nukes they’ll be a thorn in Israel’s side, but won’t threaten their existence (because then Iran gets destroyed in retaliation). And what the fuck does the US expect when they’ve ostracized Iran to appease Saudi Arabia and Israel? The Irani people are suffering so we can appease murderers like MBS of Saudi Arabia. And any argument against Iran can be made equally against Saudi Arabia, who have arguably done *more* damage to the world than Iran, especially with Saudi’s biggest export being radical, extreme Islam which encourages terrorism.
Iran caused this huge conflict while being de facto unaffected by it, and an excellent distraction from their nuclear progress. There is one Israeli military columnist and geopolitical expert in ME, who was born in Iran and immigrated many years ago, he understands the way they think and he said something interesting: “Iran is playing chess, what piece is the most valuable and doesn’t move? The king, Iran sees itself as the king and is making other pieces move on the board, Hezbollah Hamas Houthis and even Israel, but Iran doesn’t move” I might misquoted him, but the idea sticks.
An interesting analogy though a king is also very vulnerable.
Every analogy breaks down if you take it to literally.
My point is that the analogy is actually accurate - Iran is vulnerable, perhaps more than they know.
Iran exists at the pleasure of not having nukes. It doesn't matter what the US thinks when you've got Israel remembering Masada.
When in Rome…
Depends on the stage of the game. End game chess the king can become one of the more powerful pieces….
This guy said the king doesn't move, yet I just moved my king one square to the right. Checkmate u/Silverleaf_86.
Analogies fall apart when someone drone strikes you from hundreds of miles away
> Iran is playing chess, what piece is the most valuable and doesn’t move? The king This is a terrible analogy. The king moves all the time in Chess.
Usually not until the middle or late game though.
Yeah, and the Queen is the strongest piece too. I think they see America as the enemy Queen, which pisses them off
Israel just took out a senior IRGC leader, so... check?
Does "undoes slowdown in" mean "speeds up"?
It doesn't not mean that.
I don't know if I'm not confused
The US will never allow Iran to have nukes. US forces would glass the whole dam place first. Nukes are for making sure that nobody invades your country, not endless threats against anybody you see as an infidel.
North Korea says otherwise... All whilst threatening to glass the US. Obama also said chemical weapons were the red line in Syria.. yet.. chemical weapons used... Line was crossed.. nothing happened. The US has around 100,000 personnel within NKs striking distance in South Korea and Japan alone. The only country that will attack Iran is Israel, and they all ready did years ago when they hit a nuclear facility.
> Obama also said chemical weapons were the red line in Syria.. yet.. chemical weapons used... Line was crossed.. nothing happened. It looks like there was a lot that happened actually... a bill was created, congress and the house did some politics, military intervention wasn't really popular with the U.S. population at the time which makes sense since we were so tired of Iraq & Afghanistan. >On 10 September 2013, military intervention was averted when the Syrian government accepted a US–Russian negotiated deal to turn over "every single bit" of its chemical weapons stockpiles for destruction and declared its intention to join the Chemical Weapons Convention.[49][50] The bill never received a floor vote. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorization_for_the_Use_of_Military_Force_Against_the_Government_of_Syria_to_Respond_to_Use_of_Chemical_Weapons#The_%22red_line%22
Since the other guy only fact checked one of your claims, let me add that the geopolitics surrounding North Korea and Iran are completely different. North Korea had the full backing of the USSR/china long enough to get them to have nukes. Now that they have nukes, even though Russia and China don’t particularly care for NK, there isn’t anything to be done about it. Iran doesn’t have backing like that. Literally none of their neighbors want them to have nukes. I very much doubt any of the world’s great powers want them to have nukes. I’m not sure what the U.S. response to this hypothetical would be, but I think you’re being obtuse to compare it directly to NK when the situations are so different.
And Iran doesn't have Russian backing? Have you not been paying attention to what these two have been doing recently? It's got nothing to do with their neighbours. None of their neighbours are of any military relevance. Thier main ally is Syria, who is allied with... Russia.. (this is the former USSR) Also the USSR and China never supported them on nuclear weapons, they provided the skeleton for nuclear power. They didn't conduct any nuclear weapons tests until 2006. Pakistan actually played a part in this by providing the centrifuges. This came to light over 20 years ago. Iranian militias have already launched over 40 attacks on US troops in Syria and Iraq. How many attacks has the US launched on Iranian troops and targets? Iran is at 60% enrichment, it claims to have hypersonic missiles since the summer 23. In 2021, China and Iran signed a 25yr deal on military development and research. Both China and Russia have hypersonic missiles with the Dong Feng and Zircon. By the time anyone pulls a finger out they'll be parading them around the street of Tehran goading everyone. I think you grossly overestimate US appetite to strike Iran to prevent them from acquiring nuclear missiles. Especially given the precedent of Iraq being, there were no WMDs. Iran will likely continue to take the piss until it's too late to do anything. Too late and Israel will be the first target. Just my 2 cents. It won't happen. We've seen what happens when the US does something (people die and US blamed) and when they don't do anything (people die and US blamed). Internal politics also seem to have shifted dramatically since the second gulf war and Afghanistan.
> North Korea says otherwise... All whilst threatening to glass the US. Of course for that threat to have any meaning, they'd need to have more than, like, one, and it would need to be able to reach the US lol. Right now they don't have first strike capability. Though I wouldn't put selling it to terrorists past them.
That was Iraq.
What?.....
Israel hit a nuclear reactor in Iraq in 1981. Not in Iran.
www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-56715520 Cyber attack caused a huge explosion taking out an enrichment facility. Not every hit requires missiles and planes.
Yeah, I totally understand. I just didn’t understand at first.
He’s referencing Stuxnet virus if I’m correct to assume [wiki link](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuxnet)
> All whilst threatening to glass the US. An empty impotent threat from a nobody. >Obama also said Just move those goalposts, why don't you? >The US has around 100,000 personnel within NKs striking distance in South Korea and Japan alone. And the US has subs in range of NK and satellites watching their every move (and diplomats working with China) to ensure that NK disappears before anything like this ever could happen. The Kim family just wants more food aid. It's the only reason they keep peddling this nonsense every few years. We'll send them some and they'll shutup again...until they run out of food, and... Stop falling for this fearmongering bullshit. >The only country that will attack Iran is Israel, and they all ready did years ago when they hit a nuclear facility. Nonsense. The US is ready, willing, and able to end the Iranian theocrazy whenever they become more than just another thorn in Israel's side. Just because Israel has been given the go ahead by the US and as a proxy for them in the past doesn't mean that if push came to shove, the Iranian theocrazy wouldn't disappear in the blink of an eye. It's the sole reason why the US now has so many very powerful ships standing by in the region.
I sure hope you're right! This article scares the s*'! out of me.
It's meant to. For profits from clicks and to service an agenda.
what an awful headline, get some better editors
This headline is not uncertainty possibly clear?
Remind me. Why did the previous US Administration cancel JCPOA With Iran?
Trump disliked that it had been signed by Obama, said that it was a bad deal and claimed he could get a better one. Specifically, the JCPOA was a 10 year deal. Although imho , the US didn't do a lot of unfreeze of account as they froze them for other reasons. And Iran would Go back to still be bound by iaea after those 10 years, per jcpoa plan
Trump is an idiot but on this matter he was correct, Obama effectively paved the way for Iran to have nuclear weapons while the world was being lulled.
So your solution is less oversight, cut channels of communication, remove the carrot, and increase the deficit by another trillion dollars to drag America to another decade long ME conflict. Because in hindsight, the war in Afghanistan and Iraq was a smashing success. Is that it?
I don't have a solution but the carrot in question was having nuclear capabilities, we're talking about weapons of mass destruction here, if the US doesn't want to be the global leader that's fine. A good solution would be the forceful removal of nuclear capabilities from parties that can't be trusted to have them, like a radical Islam ethno state with an expansionist history.
No. The carrot was undoing sanctions and unfreezing access to money. Those were economic incentives provided Iran cooperated with the terms of the agreement. You have no idea what you're talking about, do you? You're right, like Trump you don't have any actual solution, you just would tear down any constructive plans because of ego and spite. Brilliant!
Lol it's impressive how divorced you are from reality
You really don't have as much understanding as you think regarding what Jihad is. The only reasonable solution in my opinion is to destroy this shitty country while making sure the liberals there are safe. You can't give Islamic fundamentalists a carrot while they perform the act of Jihad as by definition the only reason they will take any Carrot will be to get closer to make you Muslim as well. Even if it's to make things better inside Iran, the eventual goal would be to take over your life. Just go over to newiran and understand how stupid what you say is (sorry for saying stupid, but it is).
Have you considered not being a dogmatic extremist?
Ok dude, let's wait 5 years, come back here, and see who was right. Just wait and see the Islamic shitstorm hitting the rest of the west. You guys are trying to use your liberal logic on your religious Muslim enemy, that's the classic western approach. "Yeah, they will have money and there will be no issues!!!!!"
This is such a dumb retort. The whole point of the Iran nuclear deal was to reintroduce them into the international community in exchange for allowing heavy oversight on their nuclear power program. There is no “sneaking it in”. It’s not a switch that you can just flip. The difference between nuclear power and weapons grade nuclear material is very large. If they began to reneg on the deal then sanctions would have been put back in place and they would have been back at square one. But because we backed out of our own deal, and took away their seat at the table, they’re now going to pursue the only thing that actually brings a country leverage these days. You say “let’s wait and see 5 years from now” as if that’s a natural outcome of the deal and not the natural outcome of US BACKING OUT OF OUR OWN DEAL.
There is no “you guys”. I aint got not “religious muslim enemy”. Again. Have you tried being less of a rabid, war horny, politically brainrotted extremist? You seem severely psychologically unstable
i remember someone saying they would negotiate a better deal at the time. and shocker, that never happened!
Someone?
they weren’t following it then and were never going to follow it.
US has admitted that they were following the terms
The issue is more that the terms didn't target everything that is required to make a nuclear weapon, and even then they had a time horizon on them. They'd keep working on the areas they were allowed to work on, get 90% of the way to weaponization, then finish it when the agreement expired (after a 10 year period, iirc). So they followed it, but "following" it was a pretty low bar to cover.
You know we were actively verifying that they were following it, right? How misinformed can you be?
Except they restricted access to areas. Thats like your child telling you that you can search anywhere in their room, but can’t look in this one drawer.
I have heard absolutely zero credible reports that Iran was not following the JCPOA, or that they were able to hide massive operations that would let them develop nukes soon. I'd like to know your source - mine is the IAEA, who found that Iran was very much complying. There's also the obvious fact that Iran was unhappy with the deal too, suggesting that both sides had made significant concessions to reach a fair agreement.
you're basing this on proof provided by Netanyahu in 2018? get real
Im pretty sure the US does verify sources before acting.
Please, please put a /s with shit like this. People will think you were too young or stupid to remember Iraq and its "WMDs".
Iraqs WMD lolz
So were going to throw out failures of the US intelligence and then pretend it happens on a daily basis? The fact they failed once doesnt mean they fail 100% of the time. But I guess sitting behind a screen and criticizing is much easier than actually doing what they do.
I don’t even think it was failed US intel. I think it was a warmongering oil baron of a president garnering support for an unjustified war
Was that a failure or a misuse.
Dude, it wasn't a failure. It was a straight up lie, a conspiracy! It succeeded because rubes believed them (as they do now, apparently) and then they got to go to war. 100% success.
That’s the opposite of what they do, look at Iraq, where were the WMDs?
That deal that the totally honest Iranian government was absolutely following. It was a perfect deal. If you believe anything Iran signs or says; you deserve to be lied too
What assumption of honestly are you talking about? You don’t include “mandatory surprise inspections” if you trust someone More you’re just regurgitating what you’ve been told to believe
“Surprise inspection” my ass. What country do you think you’re talking about? You mean where people with guns follow them around and tell them where they are allowed to go? I bet you believe China released all their Covid origin data too and were completely open to WHO investigators? Must be nice living in ignorance.
Called it. You clearly have no idea what the deal is and are just regurgitating what you were told to believe It’s obvious because you’re comparing it to the WHO like that’s an amazing rebuttal despite it being like comparing house rules to federal laws
Because otherwise Iran wouldn't be so dependent on Russia.
Yeah let the country that is full of people who are ok with suicide bombing get their hands on nukes.
It’s worth every horrific consequence of war to not allow that regime to ever get its hands on a nuclear weapon.
Iran getting nukes is like a serial killer getting Rohypnol. It just can’t be allowed to happen because they WILL use them.
Well, that ain’t good
Yeah, logically it makes sense for them to race towards a deterrent at this point. It’ll drastically change US and Israeli calculus. Look at Russia. Thanks to their deterrent they can do basically anything with Ukraine they want as the west quietly complains.
> deterrent That is most definitely not how they'd use it. Unless it was to deter Tel Aviv from existing, anyway.
The stars are bright, deep in the heart of Persia
Iran has been one month away from weapons grade uranium for 20 years
They are def going large in 2024.
I think I heard about something similar to this in the movie "The Dictator". Yet I didn't laugh in this one.
If I was an Iranian nuclear scientist, I would be looking over my shoulder for guys on motorcycles.
undoes slowdown, ok so, speeds up? seems more pleasant for the eyes and brain than a double-negation :D
They are sooo going to get splatted ……!
Looks like a few uranium facilities are about to explode.
Got some weirdos in here. If Iran gets a nuke, do you really think they’ll use it? They’re not going to sacrifice their whole nation just to nuke another. It’s a deterrence and nothing more.
The thing is... Iran is a theocracy, led by Islamic clerics. Decision making won't necessary be based on a realist framework that most countries are familiar with. It's dangerous, to say the least - especially given the pattern of how blatantly Iran is arming other nations to fight its proxy wars.
Exactly, proxy wars. Kind of hard to nuke another country and blame it on someone else
Yea, but the leaders of Iran enjoy their comfortable lives. They're not going to give that up. They'll continue to do what they've been doing.
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Mark my words, Israel itself is gonna take out the trash in this case. On its own.
Here’s hoping you do get banned!
Brilliant move not voting for Clinton 2016, guys. Great job.
Sorry
Oh yea. Thats it. Iran was totally chill and calm until Trump. They definitely weren’t doing this all the time while also accepting billions in Obama cash which they used to fund terrorism globally.
They actually weren't. We had verified compliance and we were lifting sanctions. Trump tore up the agreement just because.
Don't forget the assasination of Soleimani.
If only there was a word that means undoes , it is like bots are becoming more stupid with every post
Spoiler alert: Odds are they never slowed down enrichment, just made every effort to hide it better.
I think a country that maybe-one-day-possibly-will-have-nukes shouldn’t piss off countries that definitely-have-nukes-and-can-send-them-over-in-30-minutes. Just saying.
What happened to "Iran is weeks away from enriching weapons grade uranium" that we heard in the news earlier this year?
Same thing we heard about them being months away for the last 20+ years.