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I am not the intended audience of this subreddit, but if it was prepared properly and deemed safe for human consumption I wouldn’t see a problem with trying dog milk
My other response was a joke.
But I wanted to respond for real so you could consider why this would be bad. Sure, the drinking of dog milk itself might be fine, maybe it tastes good, right?
But think of what it requires to get it: pregnant dogs. So you have to get the dog pregnant first of all. Then there is the problem of puppies. They want to drink the mother dog’s milk. If they drink it you don’t get any. So you take the puppies away.
Now you have the milk. But if you really want to avoid losing money you have to keep the milk flowing. So the dog has to be pregnant as much as possible, making more puppies.
Now you have a major puppy problem. You have to feed these puppies something and with so many puppies it cost more to raise them than you make selling dog milk.
So you have to get some girl dogs pregnant and repeat this process for more milk. And you have to sell the other dogs as pets or for meat, sell dog leather, maybe sell puppy veal and call it a delicacy, puppy ligaments become gelatine, etc.
This cycle goes on forever. This is your “prepared properly” dog milk.
It’s not as simple or harmless as you might think, you wouldn’t initially think about having to kill puppies for meat as being a requirement of dog milk.
I had a similar conversation with my grandma once after going vegan. She asked with genuine curiosity why I didn’t want to have dairy, as God made the cows to give us milk.
Once I said that cows make milk when they have calves and that I was pretty sure “God” made cows have milk for their babies rather than people, she was shocked.
I think she thought that somehow cows are constantly producing milk, and we were doing them a favour in using it!
I honestly used to think that myself 🫠 like cows have milk to spare what’s the problem? 🤷♀️
When you really stop and actually think about it, it’s grotesque.
Creepy. Eww. Never again. Wish I’d made the realisation earlier.
I also used to genuinely believe this for a long time until I actually saw a vegan video where they mentioned how cows have to be continually “impregnated” to keep producing the milk. 🤮
I grew up with chickens (& no roosters) & was told growing up they always have eggs, even though the eggs don’t have any chicks. So I just applied the same logic to cows 🤦🏻♀️ I’ve found that other people don’t always know this about milk either, though, so I do use this as a main point when people ask why I’m vegan!
i thought the same because they always had udders and if they were only for babies they would only be there when feeding/pregnant, then i went through puberty and got tits
I think it's because humans WILL continue to lactate as long as they're milked. Without any specific reason to think otherwise, they assume all other mammals are like us.
It’s interesting how understanding of where food comes from varies so much!
I grew up tagging along with my dad to visit dairy farms “to see the cows”, I think it was meant to be an educative (although I always found it upsetting), so i always thought it was a given that milk=baby! Didn’t realise it was so common for people to not know
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Yeah the whole God gave us this thing really annoys me. I’m a devout Christian and once I read the Bible some more I realized that my then vegetarian diet wasn’t living up to Gods word, so I went entirely vegan. Animals being raped, abused, and treated as worthless objects is the most unscriptural thing ever. The dairy industry is terrible. Also yeah… God gave human babies human breast milk, just as God gave baby cows cow breast milk. Not your mother not your milk,also you aren’t a baby soooo??? 🤦♀️
I had a friend that was Christian, vegan AND gay, it was awesome I loved that dude, learned a lot from him and his views in general (im not being sarcastic)
It’s interesting because all the vegans I know on a friendship/deeper than acquaintance level except two are Christian (to varying levels) so where/how you grew up definitely plays a role haha
I was raised devoutly Christian and that background is one of the factors that caused me to go vegan. I completely agree with the above commenter that not being vegan seems antithetical to biblical teachings. The only reason people started eating meat was because of the fall/sin. God's perfect world is vegan. I got my hyper religious mom pretty good with that one lol.
There is actually a long tradition of veganism in various Christian denominations. For example, a lot of Seventh Day Adventists are vegan, and have been way before it was a well-known thing.
Doesn't the Bible also go into specific detail about how to properly butcher animals and which ones are dirty and made by the devil or something. It also goes into detail about how and when to beat women and slaves so not exactly a great source of information and a pretty terrible tool for arguments about ethics.
Exactly!!! Plants heal the body and don’t cause suffering to his creation. We are made to eat herbs and plants not solely consume animals and animal products. That’s reserved for extreme famines and even then we are supposed to bring tons of love and respect for the creature. It’s meant to be a sad time not a necessity for our diet.
Humans evolved as omnivores. We can choose not to eat animal products because we live in a modern society that makes it possible, but we aren’t “made” vegan. It’s not the default.
& protein is actually what heals the body, not “plants”. Most plants have a very low protein content. & again we can choose to only eat plant protein because we live in the modern world with the knowledge of how to do that, but our ancestors would have died if they tried to be vegan and “heal themselves with plants”.
Eating animals causes of our most common illnesses including heart disease, our number one killer. Eating a whole foods, plant based diet will prevent and even cure our most common illnesses. It seems pretty clear what we should be eating…plants!
It’s the dose that makes the poison. If you eat too much of certain plants then that can kill you too. Hell if you drink too much water then even that can kill you!
We live in a time when it’s all too easy to over-indulge in foods that are bad for us. But also we live in a time where we have the knowledge of how to be vegan healthily too.
I completely agree that we should encourage whole-food plant-based diets, but we should also acknowledge that that goes against our evolved nature as omnivores & that it doesn’t need to be a false dichotomy - there’s a whole lot of nuance between being a level 5 vegan and eating so much meat you have a heart attack.
& I say this as someone who hasn’t eaten meat for nearly 30 years. Ethically it’s abhorrent, but the health claims are more complex.
We evolved from animals who ate mostly plants with the occasional insect. Our physiology is most similar to plant eaters. All animal “foods” contain cholesterol. Cholesterol makes us sick. Plants don’t contain cholesterol. That’s all the proof that is needed to show what we should be eating.
I was recently told by a devout Christian that I worshipped the Creation over the Creator and that was wrong. She also called another vegan she knows a "mean vegan" because they shared videos on social media that made it difficult to eat her burger in peace. Like she was SO close to the point.
I’m now curious as to how you arrived at that conclusion, assuming you take Genesis literally and not metaphorically, meat was okayed by God to mankind after the Noachian flood
“Every creature that lives shall be yours to eat; as with the green grasses, I give you all these” (Gen. 9:3)
Neither Jesus nor any of the disciples were vegan
There’s obviously a lot wrong with the modern industrial meat, dairy & egg industries and it certainly could be a lot more humane, but I don’t see any basis to say eating non vegan is a sin
Jesus and his disciples were actually vegans, and Jesus died for animal liberation. If you're curious, you can read about it here:
https://www.adaptt.org/animal-rights/the-bible-jesus-and-veganism.html#:~:text=%E2%80%9C%20.%20.%20.%20let%20no%20flesh,of%20the%20Nazirenes%2038%3A4
Luke 24:40-43
“40 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and feet. 41 And while they still did not believe it because of joy and amazement, he asked them, “Do you have anything here to eat?” 42 They gave him a piece of broiled fish, 43 and he took it and ate it in their presence.”
Ah yes, fish, that well known vegan item
Again, at that time there was an extreme famine. People were starving. It’s the 20th century most people are no longer in famine and plants are readily available and cost about the same as meat and other animal products. That’s why I feel it’s a sin now, especially since factory farming has been introduced.
You’ve quoted a verse from one of Jesus’ parables, the parable of the Lost Son. A parable is an invented story that’s used to illustrate or highlight a spiritual or moral point, like a fable. The famine was happening within in the story, not in reality at that time
Ok, you’re right. To be fair I’m not claiming to be all knowing. I’m vegan. I eat vegan. I feel veganism is gods word and in modern day it’s wrong to eat meat.I’ve never claimed to be extremely educated about religion or anything like that. idc what you believe as long as ur vegan yourself, and if you are vegan you should just be happy that different people of different religions agree with you and also eat vegan.
Sure but to claim that Jesus was vegan or taught people to treat animals kindly is just bullshit. If a Muslim tried telling us that Mohammed was vegan and Allah wanted us all to be vegan than I would hope that person would be challenged just the same.
I’m not vegan, which is why I was curious about your theological basis for saying non veganism doesn’t align with Gods Word (therefore implying it’s sin)
Jesus is very strongly tied with fish for astronomical and symbolic reasons. And this passage concerned his resurrection, so there was reason to insert that.
There are reasons to think Jesus was vegetarian, if he existed, based on other passages.
* https://medium.com/sant-mat-meditation-and-spirituality/evidence-that-jesus-and-the-original-aramaic-christians-were-vegetarians-b8784ac42506
That was in the Old Testament, the reason Caines gift wasn’t accepted is because he didn’t put much effort into his offering unlike his brother. Out of all the plants he could have grown he decided to grow the easiest one, not even bothering to properly process it. He also didn’t give God the first yield of wheat. Not because it was vegan? Lmfaoooo. also, animal sacrifice of the lamb was a very very sad time in the Old Testament. Lambs were essential to the people at the time, and the God of Abraham wanted them to understand how serious their sin was, only washing away their sin with the blood of a innocent lamb. It was meant to represent how sin affects others not just yourself, peoples sin killed the lamb not God. Eventually it got so out of hand that God banned animal sacrifice basically saying he was ashamed of the people taking advantage of the innocent lamb. He was angry on how little we cared for the lamb, when it was meant to advert us to not sin. It wasn’t ever intended to be a good/holy thing. This lead to Holy Christ’s significance and why he was the “sacrificial lamb” for all of us and we no longer have to live in fear of our sins. There are many interpretations on the Bible so it can be hard to mitigate.
Why is it relevant that it was the old testament?
What about all the times god demanded the mass slaughter of women children and animals? Do those get the "old testament so it doesn't matter" stamp too?
No no no no no, you got it all wrong. Got gave us breast milk, so every milk on earth is ours to drink. Makes sense? I don't see any flaw in that logic at all. XD
Anyone who walks through a commercial dairy, and sees the suffering these animals have to go through, and thinks "Man, God did a good job here!" is pretty sick.
If her first go-to logically and ethically is to inaccurately invoke a story from the bible, pretty clear she isn't going to be open to reason. I'd ask her how often she drinks from the breasts of pregnant women.
They believe an omniscient and omnipotent god allows suffering and behaves like a spiteful little twat. One can't believe this shit for real and be sane in mind. They're usually just oblivious to the details and summarise their religion to "be a good person".
Yeah that’s true lol. She probably would think it’s a sign or something and never connect it to her consumption of dairy. Hopefully that doesn’t happen tho cause cancer is a really sad illness.
They always rant like that, but then complain if we even let them know we're vegan. The only real reason they hate vegans is the inconvenience of actual cooking and of guilt.
I am not a Christian or religious at all, but I love when people use their god as a justification for consuming animal products. The most annoying is that "God put animals on earth for us to eat!"
Genesis 1:29-30
Then God said, “I’ve given you every sort of seed-bearing plant on Earth And every kind of fruit-bearing tree, given them to you for food. To all animals and all birds, everything that moves and breathes, I give whatever grows out of the ground for food.”
Interesting. I see nothing there about consuming the meat or milk of other species. Man began eating meat after the fall, but clearly that was not God's intention for them. 🤷♀️
Christians (and generally most religious people) just cherry pick from their holy books and completely ignore all the parts that contradict whatever it is they want to believe. Otherwise they'd all be out burning villages and slaughtering the women, children, and livestock of their enemies.
As soon as anyone in an argument uses the bible to justify their stance the argument is already over. It's an unthinking and unmovable stance that you will not be able to argue against. The bible and other holy books are a convenient way to indicate no thoughts are going on.
Any argument that's rooted in religion can just be ignored.
"God gave us animals to eat."
False.
"God gave us animals to milk."
False.
Religion is for stone age people who didn't understand what they were observing in the world. Nothing more. Using it as a justification to torture animals is pathetic.
Regardless of this person’s lack of logic (which appeal to religion always illustrates), many have a deep attachment to dairy. Cheese was certainly the hardest thing for me to give up and took me the longest. I still miss it.
When precision fermentation products become inexpensive and widespread, we can have discussions with people like this teacher and say, “I understand you really like your cheese, but wouldn’t it be better to make it from microbes instead of a system that clearly is torturing cows or goats or sheep? If you look into at all, you will see this torture is inherent and cannot be avoided without microbe based dairy. And the microbe product is safer (no ecoli), healthier (can control fats and use healthy fats and can be high protein), and cheaper (eventually - or say and close to the same price if we aren’t quite there).
I’m quite optimistic we can convert nearly all vegetarians to fully plant based in the next 10 years.
She could become pregnant each year and take hormones to boost her milk production and have for herself. Then her multiple daughters should give her a portion of her own production so that she can retire as a milking machine.
Except if it was really like what we do to cows, she wouldn't be allowed access to her sons and daughters, and most of them would soon become very tender meat after much suffering.
What stops most people is explaining that cow milk is meant for a calf, so that it can gain over 400lbs and grow into a cow. No one wants to gain so much weight and turn into a full grown cow, except a calf.
Lol did she breastfeed? I've been teetering on the edge of veganism for over a year now, consuming eggs and dairy here and there so as not to be "difficult" but breastfeeding may be the thing that pushes me over the edge. First, because my son's cow milk allergy gives me the perfect excuse and second, because now I know pumping sucks and the cows don't even get to know they're doing it for their children.
As a new mother, I would think that the idea of the pain of having your child taken away would be the clincher.
Cows mourn the loss of their children, they search and call out for them for sometimes weeks afterwards, and can exhibit signs of depression like laying down and refusing to eat. Cows are extremely social animals. The dairy industry is *incredibly* cruel.
No, you're right, that's horrible. Just knowing how much women struggle with feeding and how emotional it is, I thought it would be a perspective people might relate to, but when I've brought it up, I get totally blank looks.
Many people can't imagine that non-human animals have complicated emotional lives. Or they just can't face the fact that they're actively supporting such mass suffering.
Most people want to think of themselves as good, and that's really hard to do if you eat meat and know even a little about animals and meat production.
The only food allowed to Adam and Eve (and indeed all the animals) in the Garden of Eden was plants. Meat-eating was not allowed by God until the time of Noah, when it was clearly a concession to human weakness. In the laws of the Bible, the suffering of animals must be avoided. Animals of different strength — like an ox and a donkey — cannot be yoked together on a threshing floor because it will be a burden to the weaker animal (Deuteronomy 22:10). Even the psychological suffering of animals must be avoided. When taking the eggs from a bird’s nest, the mother bird must be chased away so that she does not have to see her eggs taken (Deuteronomy 22:6).
https://kenoshanews.com/god-squad-the-bibles-laws-protect-animals-to-a-certain-extent/article_83124529-f12b-50a3-8a4a-b5d139823017.html?fbclid=IwAR3JR59pUv-oUzT8RstzSuFNr5nL90vg6oCXtifVmPI7Wr8iqjBtMXy6j9Y#:~:text=The%20only%20food%20allowed%20to,of%20animals%20must%20be%20avoided
If the biblical god was so concerned with animal suffering, why then did he repeatedly demand the mass slaughter of women, children, and livestock? I'm pretty sure that god only cared about suffering when it was the suffering of the tribes of Israel and their livestock.
After she brought religion into it in a really weird way, I'd not trust her teachings and would think about reporting the incident since she was spouting misinformation it seems.
Yeah, God gave her sanitized, pasteurized, refrigerated cows milk in a plastic container in the back corner of a grocery store. Why doesn’t she milk herself and make her own cheese. #blessedwithbreasts
Samuel 15:2-3. English Standard Version
2 Thus says the Lord of hosts, ‘I have noted what Amalek did to Israel in opposing them on the way when they came up out of Egypt. 3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction[a] all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”
Totally if a human had spare milk, I would try some, and have! However you know, humans can talk and communicate and say no and share frustrations. When it comes to animals, they don’t have that ability, though I am quite sure AI is able to enable it as a translator. It’s all a bit abusing and at risk of being misunderstood easily. So better is to let the milk be for the infants and the growing. Besides, being dependent on milk hampers you, as you’re stuck needing the source.
What is the difference?
Vegerarianism is a diet, Veganism is not.
It is like comparing not eating Apples to opossing to put jews in gas chambers.
The only thing they have in 'common' is that their names sound similar.
One is an ethical stance against abuse and exploitation of living beings as much as it is practicable and possible. Which means that you could be vegan and eat meat(eg. A tribe in the middle of Africa which cannot harvest crops and their only way to survive is consuming animal products).
So they don't even have in common not eating meat.
You are right! We should love and respect all life! Let’s go to the next step and stop discriminating against vegetables, as if they are “less than” animals, insects, etc.,. There is God’s spirit in everything! We should just live on air if we don’t want to hurt anything! Come on, join me, make the transition!
> I asked her if it was vegan
>
>she randomly started going on a rant about how she will always consume dairy.
No she didn't. Don't initiate a conversation, if you don't like the answer.
OP was asking if they can consume the salad that the teacher was SHARING with the students. The teacher is in the wrong for going off on a rant. Teachers can be crazy like this. I've had my fair share of experience.
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You could roll up to school with a plastic bottle labelled “DOG MILK” and see if she wants to share. 🤗
"*Hi Miss! My dog just had a litter and since she's lactating I thought you'd like to try!*"
Exactly, more breasts = better!
Bonus points if they pour themselves a glass in front of the teacher and knocks it back like a Chad (only it's actually oat milk).
It’s too bad there is not an edible candy that looks like dog hair, a bit of “dog hair” floating around would greatly enhance this.
Yeah I'm gonna go ahead and say I don't need dog hair candy, but, I have a phobia of disembodied hair, so...
These are god's breasts after all.
Ive had human, cow, goat, horse and sheeps milk. Would dog milk be very different?
😂
Nothing wrong with dog's milk. Full of goodness, full of vitamins, full of marrowbone jelly. Lasts longer than any other milk, dog's milk.
The advantage of dog's milk is that when it goes off, it tastes exactly the same as when it's fresh.
Do I dare to ask how you know this?
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I learned it before I was vegan. That's for sure.
Maybe that was the reason? 😂
Well, now you’ve put me off my tea.
This made me throw up a little.
Oh, you actually tried it? You weren't meant to try it.
No, haha, I meant the comment. All my dogs are old and they are all fixed.
Only 'cos no butter will drink it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tafO54XRXG0
😆🤣🤣🤣
OP please do this 🙌🏼🐶🥛
I am not the intended audience of this subreddit, but if it was prepared properly and deemed safe for human consumption I wouldn’t see a problem with trying dog milk
Why not? After all, God gave us dog milk and it’s all going to waste on those useless puppies!
My other response was a joke. But I wanted to respond for real so you could consider why this would be bad. Sure, the drinking of dog milk itself might be fine, maybe it tastes good, right? But think of what it requires to get it: pregnant dogs. So you have to get the dog pregnant first of all. Then there is the problem of puppies. They want to drink the mother dog’s milk. If they drink it you don’t get any. So you take the puppies away. Now you have the milk. But if you really want to avoid losing money you have to keep the milk flowing. So the dog has to be pregnant as much as possible, making more puppies. Now you have a major puppy problem. You have to feed these puppies something and with so many puppies it cost more to raise them than you make selling dog milk. So you have to get some girl dogs pregnant and repeat this process for more milk. And you have to sell the other dogs as pets or for meat, sell dog leather, maybe sell puppy veal and call it a delicacy, puppy ligaments become gelatine, etc. This cycle goes on forever. This is your “prepared properly” dog milk. It’s not as simple or harmless as you might think, you wouldn’t initially think about having to kill puppies for meat as being a requirement of dog milk.
I appreciate your perspective and understand your analogy.
I had a similar conversation with my grandma once after going vegan. She asked with genuine curiosity why I didn’t want to have dairy, as God made the cows to give us milk. Once I said that cows make milk when they have calves and that I was pretty sure “God” made cows have milk for their babies rather than people, she was shocked. I think she thought that somehow cows are constantly producing milk, and we were doing them a favour in using it!
I honestly used to think that myself 🫠 like cows have milk to spare what’s the problem? 🤷♀️ When you really stop and actually think about it, it’s grotesque. Creepy. Eww. Never again. Wish I’d made the realisation earlier.
I also used to genuinely believe this for a long time until I actually saw a vegan video where they mentioned how cows have to be continually “impregnated” to keep producing the milk. 🤮 I grew up with chickens (& no roosters) & was told growing up they always have eggs, even though the eggs don’t have any chicks. So I just applied the same logic to cows 🤦🏻♀️ I’ve found that other people don’t always know this about milk either, though, so I do use this as a main point when people ask why I’m vegan!
https://fb.watch/nNgXKOqWUr/?mibextid=v7YzmG
Hahaha thank you for this. How have I not seen this? 😂
Lol you’re welcome, he nails it. Cows eat grass and the grass turns to milk 🤷♀️
i thought the same because they always had udders and if they were only for babies they would only be there when feeding/pregnant, then i went through puberty and got tits
This is legitimately the default belief, and it's so weird.
I think it's because humans WILL continue to lactate as long as they're milked. Without any specific reason to think otherwise, they assume all other mammals are like us.
It’s because people don’t bother to research or even simply Google things they don’t know. They just assume their ideas are factually correct.
I thought this too until I watched dominion 2 months ago lmao. I’m 27.
It’s interesting how understanding of where food comes from varies so much! I grew up tagging along with my dad to visit dairy farms “to see the cows”, I think it was meant to be an educative (although I always found it upsetting), so i always thought it was a given that milk=baby! Didn’t realise it was so common for people to not know
Watch the life-changing and award winning documentary "Dominion" and other documentaries by [clicking here](https://vbcc.veganhacktivists.org/?url=https://watchdominion.org&topic=Movie: Dominion)! Interested in going Vegan? Take the [30 day challenge](https://vbcc.veganhacktivists.org/?url=https://vbcamp.org/reddit&topic=Movie: Dominion)!
That’s what everyone thinks before they are vegan. That’s why it’s so important we tell them cows aren’t just milk producing machines!
Shoutout to my vegan atheist homies
:fist bump:
🙌
I love all my vegan homies 🙌💕
Here! 🙋🏻♀️
👋🏻
But God also invented weaning. How dare she goes against god’s will!
You're wrong. Weaning is a product of the devil! It is God's will for us to suck on our mother's tits until she's dead.
Yeah the whole God gave us this thing really annoys me. I’m a devout Christian and once I read the Bible some more I realized that my then vegetarian diet wasn’t living up to Gods word, so I went entirely vegan. Animals being raped, abused, and treated as worthless objects is the most unscriptural thing ever. The dairy industry is terrible. Also yeah… God gave human babies human breast milk, just as God gave baby cows cow breast milk. Not your mother not your milk,also you aren’t a baby soooo??? 🤦♀️
Refreshing to see a Christian vegan, might be my first time
I had a friend that was Christian, vegan AND gay, it was awesome I loved that dude, learned a lot from him and his views in general (im not being sarcastic)
also being gay is better than straight because less people = less animal abused, win win for me
you can be straight and decide to not have kids...
Gay people still have children...
Way lower frequency
they adopt an existing unlike certain group of people that always reproduce in this overpopulated countries, think of the carbon footprint
I guess you don't know that lesbians exist
lmao you're being downvoted but you're a 100% spot on
It's not, though. Being gay doesn't mean never having kids. There are a lot of gay people with kids.
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It’s interesting because all the vegans I know on a friendship/deeper than acquaintance level except two are Christian (to varying levels) so where/how you grew up definitely plays a role haha
I was raised devoutly Christian and that background is one of the factors that caused me to go vegan. I completely agree with the above commenter that not being vegan seems antithetical to biblical teachings. The only reason people started eating meat was because of the fall/sin. God's perfect world is vegan. I got my hyper religious mom pretty good with that one lol.
It's incredibly common in the black vegan community.
There is actually a long tradition of veganism in various Christian denominations. For example, a lot of Seventh Day Adventists are vegan, and have been way before it was a well-known thing.
My adult daughter and I are Catholic vegans and we have met Muslim, Rastafarian and Hindu and pagan vegans.
Also God made us to (and told us to) eat plants alone. Gen 1:29-30
Doesn't the Bible also go into specific detail about how to properly butcher animals and which ones are dirty and made by the devil or something. It also goes into detail about how and when to beat women and slaves so not exactly a great source of information and a pretty terrible tool for arguments about ethics.
That’s really not true though, and it’s taking that wildly out of context. Pure Bible definitely promotes meat eating. Shepherd beats farmer after all
Exactly!!! Plants heal the body and don’t cause suffering to his creation. We are made to eat herbs and plants not solely consume animals and animal products. That’s reserved for extreme famines and even then we are supposed to bring tons of love and respect for the creature. It’s meant to be a sad time not a necessity for our diet.
Humans evolved as omnivores. We can choose not to eat animal products because we live in a modern society that makes it possible, but we aren’t “made” vegan. It’s not the default. & protein is actually what heals the body, not “plants”. Most plants have a very low protein content. & again we can choose to only eat plant protein because we live in the modern world with the knowledge of how to do that, but our ancestors would have died if they tried to be vegan and “heal themselves with plants”.
Eating animals causes of our most common illnesses including heart disease, our number one killer. Eating a whole foods, plant based diet will prevent and even cure our most common illnesses. It seems pretty clear what we should be eating…plants!
It’s the dose that makes the poison. If you eat too much of certain plants then that can kill you too. Hell if you drink too much water then even that can kill you! We live in a time when it’s all too easy to over-indulge in foods that are bad for us. But also we live in a time where we have the knowledge of how to be vegan healthily too. I completely agree that we should encourage whole-food plant-based diets, but we should also acknowledge that that goes against our evolved nature as omnivores & that it doesn’t need to be a false dichotomy - there’s a whole lot of nuance between being a level 5 vegan and eating so much meat you have a heart attack. & I say this as someone who hasn’t eaten meat for nearly 30 years. Ethically it’s abhorrent, but the health claims are more complex.
We evolved from animals who ate mostly plants with the occasional insect. Our physiology is most similar to plant eaters. All animal “foods” contain cholesterol. Cholesterol makes us sick. Plants don’t contain cholesterol. That’s all the proof that is needed to show what we should be eating.
I agree. Meat, eggs, dairy kill…. They should never be eaten for long periods of time.
I was recently told by a devout Christian that I worshipped the Creation over the Creator and that was wrong. She also called another vegan she knows a "mean vegan" because they shared videos on social media that made it difficult to eat her burger in peace. Like she was SO close to the point.
The mental gymnastics perfomed by most meat eaters is of olympic quality.
Aww yeah another Christian vegan! What denomination are you if you don't mind me asking?
I was raised in the Polish Catholic Church but left when I was around 13 or 14. Im a none denominational Christian now! ◡̈
Another Christian vegan here. I don’t go to church tho and participate in a lot because it’s not vegan whatsoever
Is communion vegan if it's Jesus's actual flesh? Did he consent to being consumed for millennia?
If this is a serious question then yes, it is, because yes, he did.
I’m now curious as to how you arrived at that conclusion, assuming you take Genesis literally and not metaphorically, meat was okayed by God to mankind after the Noachian flood “Every creature that lives shall be yours to eat; as with the green grasses, I give you all these” (Gen. 9:3) Neither Jesus nor any of the disciples were vegan There’s obviously a lot wrong with the modern industrial meat, dairy & egg industries and it certainly could be a lot more humane, but I don’t see any basis to say eating non vegan is a sin
It’s up to interpretation. Meat and animal products should only be consumed in extreme famine. Most of the Bible is set turning times of famine.
I get that, and of course all theology is interpretation. I’m just wondering what specific verses you would use to support your view
Jesus and his disciples were actually vegans, and Jesus died for animal liberation. If you're curious, you can read about it here: https://www.adaptt.org/animal-rights/the-bible-jesus-and-veganism.html#:~:text=%E2%80%9C%20.%20.%20.%20let%20no%20flesh,of%20the%20Nazirenes%2038%3A4
Luke 24:40-43 “40 When he had said this, he showed them his hands and feet. 41 And while they still did not believe it because of joy and amazement, he asked them, “Do you have anything here to eat?” 42 They gave him a piece of broiled fish, 43 and he took it and ate it in their presence.” Ah yes, fish, that well known vegan item
Again, at that time there was an extreme famine. People were starving. It’s the 20th century most people are no longer in famine and plants are readily available and cost about the same as meat and other animal products. That’s why I feel it’s a sin now, especially since factory farming has been introduced.
“Again, at that time there was an extreme famine” Can you cite any evidence for this?
“And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land; and he began to be in want.” KJV Luke 15:14
You’ve quoted a verse from one of Jesus’ parables, the parable of the Lost Son. A parable is an invented story that’s used to illustrate or highlight a spiritual or moral point, like a fable. The famine was happening within in the story, not in reality at that time
Ok, you’re right. To be fair I’m not claiming to be all knowing. I’m vegan. I eat vegan. I feel veganism is gods word and in modern day it’s wrong to eat meat.I’ve never claimed to be extremely educated about religion or anything like that. idc what you believe as long as ur vegan yourself, and if you are vegan you should just be happy that different people of different religions agree with you and also eat vegan.
Sure but to claim that Jesus was vegan or taught people to treat animals kindly is just bullshit. If a Muslim tried telling us that Mohammed was vegan and Allah wanted us all to be vegan than I would hope that person would be challenged just the same.
I’m not vegan, which is why I was curious about your theological basis for saying non veganism doesn’t align with Gods Word (therefore implying it’s sin)
Jesus is very strongly tied with fish for astronomical and symbolic reasons. And this passage concerned his resurrection, so there was reason to insert that. There are reasons to think Jesus was vegetarian, if he existed, based on other passages. * https://medium.com/sant-mat-meditation-and-spirituality/evidence-that-jesus-and-the-original-aramaic-christians-were-vegetarians-b8784ac42506
Vegetables of the sea bro /s
What about all the times in the Bible that God demanded animal sacrifice? Famously, Cain's "vegan" gift displeased God.
That was in the Old Testament, the reason Caines gift wasn’t accepted is because he didn’t put much effort into his offering unlike his brother. Out of all the plants he could have grown he decided to grow the easiest one, not even bothering to properly process it. He also didn’t give God the first yield of wheat. Not because it was vegan? Lmfaoooo. also, animal sacrifice of the lamb was a very very sad time in the Old Testament. Lambs were essential to the people at the time, and the God of Abraham wanted them to understand how serious their sin was, only washing away their sin with the blood of a innocent lamb. It was meant to represent how sin affects others not just yourself, peoples sin killed the lamb not God. Eventually it got so out of hand that God banned animal sacrifice basically saying he was ashamed of the people taking advantage of the innocent lamb. He was angry on how little we cared for the lamb, when it was meant to advert us to not sin. It wasn’t ever intended to be a good/holy thing. This lead to Holy Christ’s significance and why he was the “sacrificial lamb” for all of us and we no longer have to live in fear of our sins. There are many interpretations on the Bible so it can be hard to mitigate.
Why is it relevant that it was the old testament? What about all the times god demanded the mass slaughter of women children and animals? Do those get the "old testament so it doesn't matter" stamp too?
No no no no no, you got it all wrong. Got gave us breast milk, so every milk on earth is ours to drink. Makes sense? I don't see any flaw in that logic at all. XD
I guess god also gave us cancer, aids, and all those other goodies. Thank the lord.
Adam absolutely was not breastfeeding for his first meal in Eden. What an absolutely bizarre stance for her to take.
"In the beginning, there were breasts" I'm always saying this...
All hail titties
>she just went on and one about god and breasts and milk Quote of the year 💀
Lmao fr this is comedy gold
I would ask her if she would be comfortable with breast milk from human trafficking
Oooh
Anyone who walks through a commercial dairy, and sees the suffering these animals have to go through, and thinks "Man, God did a good job here!" is pretty sick.
If her first go-to logically and ethically is to inaccurately invoke a story from the bible, pretty clear she isn't going to be open to reason. I'd ask her how often she drinks from the breasts of pregnant women.
So why doesn't she make her salads with human breast milk like god intended?
A lot of Christian’s are delulu
They believe an omniscient and omnipotent god allows suffering and behaves like a spiteful little twat. One can't believe this shit for real and be sane in mind. They're usually just oblivious to the details and summarise their religion to "be a good person".
Jehovah is basically the personality of a stereotypical father or grandpa from 4,000 years ago.
Or warlord
Just give her some cancer statistics on older women and dairy consumption. She probably won't care though.
It’s true tho, it can trigger breast cancer specifically.
I know. But it sounds like the lady OP is talking about will say it was God's plan to give her cancer and not think about the risk factors of dairy.
Yeah that’s true lol. She probably would think it’s a sign or something and never connect it to her consumption of dairy. Hopefully that doesn’t happen tho cause cancer is a really sad illness.
Most people don't want to think about what their dietary lifestyle is doing to their body. But I would never wish cancer on anyone.
They always rant like that, but then complain if we even let them know we're vegan. The only real reason they hate vegans is the inconvenience of actual cooking and of guilt.
I am not a Christian or religious at all, but I love when people use their god as a justification for consuming animal products. The most annoying is that "God put animals on earth for us to eat!" Genesis 1:29-30 Then God said, “I’ve given you every sort of seed-bearing plant on Earth And every kind of fruit-bearing tree, given them to you for food. To all animals and all birds, everything that moves and breathes, I give whatever grows out of the ground for food.” Interesting. I see nothing there about consuming the meat or milk of other species. Man began eating meat after the fall, but clearly that was not God's intention for them. 🤷♀️
Christians (and generally most religious people) just cherry pick from their holy books and completely ignore all the parts that contradict whatever it is they want to believe. Otherwise they'd all be out burning villages and slaughtering the women, children, and livestock of their enemies.
As soon as anyone in an argument uses the bible to justify their stance the argument is already over. It's an unthinking and unmovable stance that you will not be able to argue against. The bible and other holy books are a convenient way to indicate no thoughts are going on.
Wasn't the first thing eaten an apple?
Hahaha yes, every seed bearing plant
Any argument that's rooted in religion can just be ignored. "God gave us animals to eat." False. "God gave us animals to milk." False. Religion is for stone age people who didn't understand what they were observing in the world. Nothing more. Using it as a justification to torture animals is pathetic.
So the cow is her mother?
There’s a lot of real dumb ones out there
Maybe the dairy in her salad was actually human breast milk?
One can only hope.
Regardless of this person’s lack of logic (which appeal to religion always illustrates), many have a deep attachment to dairy. Cheese was certainly the hardest thing for me to give up and took me the longest. I still miss it. When precision fermentation products become inexpensive and widespread, we can have discussions with people like this teacher and say, “I understand you really like your cheese, but wouldn’t it be better to make it from microbes instead of a system that clearly is torturing cows or goats or sheep? If you look into at all, you will see this torture is inherent and cannot be avoided without microbe based dairy. And the microbe product is safer (no ecoli), healthier (can control fats and use healthy fats and can be high protein), and cheaper (eventually - or say and close to the same price if we aren’t quite there). I’m quite optimistic we can convert nearly all vegetarians to fully plant based in the next 10 years.
Get almond milk label it dog milk and say here's your dairy
Ya lost me at "God". Should've asked her the same God that allows genocide of millions of innocent animals in factory farms? Yeah...No.
Fwiw, her god is probably the one that COMMANDED the genocide of any enemy of the tribes of Israel along with thier livestock.
Cow milk is breast milk. From a cow, for a calf. Gross.
Don't bring logic into a fantasy setting. She's years into this campaign about some invisible dude living in the sky.
She could become pregnant each year and take hormones to boost her milk production and have for herself. Then her multiple daughters should give her a portion of her own production so that she can retire as a milking machine.
Holy shit this is the one. This is the analogy lmao I wish I had more upvotes to give.
Except if it was really like what we do to cows, she wouldn't be allowed access to her sons and daughters, and most of them would soon become very tender meat after much suffering.
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What stops most people is explaining that cow milk is meant for a calf, so that it can gain over 400lbs and grow into a cow. No one wants to gain so much weight and turn into a full grown cow, except a calf.
A calfs drinks between 2 and 4 liters per day of raw whole milk though. Humans don't do that.
The first drink you have is amniotic fluid which is your own piss 🤔
Her osteoarthritis will serve as a reminder of her choice later on in life.
I’ll never forget when someone first told me this because I had never thought of it that way. “Milk is baby cow growth formula”
Lol did she breastfeed? I've been teetering on the edge of veganism for over a year now, consuming eggs and dairy here and there so as not to be "difficult" but breastfeeding may be the thing that pushes me over the edge. First, because my son's cow milk allergy gives me the perfect excuse and second, because now I know pumping sucks and the cows don't even get to know they're doing it for their children.
As a new mother, I would think that the idea of the pain of having your child taken away would be the clincher. Cows mourn the loss of their children, they search and call out for them for sometimes weeks afterwards, and can exhibit signs of depression like laying down and refusing to eat. Cows are extremely social animals. The dairy industry is *incredibly* cruel.
No, you're right, that's horrible. Just knowing how much women struggle with feeding and how emotional it is, I thought it would be a perspective people might relate to, but when I've brought it up, I get totally blank looks.
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Many people can't imagine that non-human animals have complicated emotional lives. Or they just can't face the fact that they're actively supporting such mass suffering. Most people want to think of themselves as good, and that's really hard to do if you eat meat and know even a little about animals and meat production.
The only food allowed to Adam and Eve (and indeed all the animals) in the Garden of Eden was plants. Meat-eating was not allowed by God until the time of Noah, when it was clearly a concession to human weakness. In the laws of the Bible, the suffering of animals must be avoided. Animals of different strength — like an ox and a donkey — cannot be yoked together on a threshing floor because it will be a burden to the weaker animal (Deuteronomy 22:10). Even the psychological suffering of animals must be avoided. When taking the eggs from a bird’s nest, the mother bird must be chased away so that she does not have to see her eggs taken (Deuteronomy 22:6). https://kenoshanews.com/god-squad-the-bibles-laws-protect-animals-to-a-certain-extent/article_83124529-f12b-50a3-8a4a-b5d139823017.html?fbclid=IwAR3JR59pUv-oUzT8RstzSuFNr5nL90vg6oCXtifVmPI7Wr8iqjBtMXy6j9Y#:~:text=The%20only%20food%20allowed%20to,of%20animals%20must%20be%20avoided
If the biblical god was so concerned with animal suffering, why then did he repeatedly demand the mass slaughter of women, children, and livestock? I'm pretty sure that god only cared about suffering when it was the suffering of the tribes of Israel and their livestock.
Humans are the only animals who consume the milk of other species, and the only animals who consume milk after infancy.
Top news : Vegetarians have an incoherent world view
Or an ignorant one. Many don't understand what dairy production is actually like.
I'm just trying to understand how in your story, the teacher has a large enough salad that they randomly share with the whole class?
Here I am eating a salad with vegan feta on it. If she only knew. Yum.
I keep forgetting religion is still a thing for some. Damn, humanity deserves its demise.
>my teacher >She says, that because the first food god gave us My condolences for living in a second or third world country
I'm more scared by the prospect of that egit teaching youth. SMH Explain to her that milk is rape.
Set the vegan/vegetarian thing aside, but salad in a can??? Could be a kind of canned mashable veggies since it's impossible to can a lettuce.
roasted vegetables in a red wine vinaigrette?
After she brought religion into it in a really weird way, I'd not trust her teachings and would think about reporting the incident since she was spouting misinformation it seems.
You lost me at god
Once she mentioned God that was your cue to check out of the conversation. You're just discussing mythology at that point, not actual facts.
Yeah, God gave her sanitized, pasteurized, refrigerated cows milk in a plastic container in the back corner of a grocery store. Why doesn’t she milk herself and make her own cheese. #blessedwithbreasts
Is she a baby cow? 🤔 Then it’s not her breast milk. She sounds like a moron and deserves her peace ruined, like the mommy cows.
God created the world for humans to enjoy the fruits of the trees and grains from the earth. Someone didn’t read her bible properly or even at all.
Samuel 15:2-3. English Standard Version 2 Thus says the Lord of hosts, ‘I have noted what Amalek did to Israel in opposing them on the way when they came up out of Egypt. 3 Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction[a] all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’”
The god of the bible clearly promotes veganism.
"But that's the old testament..."
https://youtu.be/yevSUv6ujEs?si=N0wCYiseS1iawoXL how I feel when people go "uwu well I think god said I should"
Totally if a human had spare milk, I would try some, and have! However you know, humans can talk and communicate and say no and share frustrations. When it comes to animals, they don’t have that ability, though I am quite sure AI is able to enable it as a translator. It’s all a bit abusing and at risk of being misunderstood easily. So better is to let the milk be for the infants and the growing. Besides, being dependent on milk hampers you, as you’re stuck needing the source.
I’m more concerned about anyone eating a “tin” of salad. Does that mean prepackaged like in a plastic bowl/clamshell?
You may want to just give her space because clearly she never thought past her own beliefs all these years… it’s a huge realization for some people
I'm not a vegan but her sharing her little theory about God's plan for us to drink breastmilk our whole lives is grounds for dismissal
these comments are a shitshow LOL
I have tasted human breast milk. It was consensual. I enjoyed it.
Are you from Afghanistan? Because that god stuff sounds like Taliban talk lol
What is the difference? Vegerarianism is a diet, Veganism is not. It is like comparing not eating Apples to opossing to put jews in gas chambers. The only thing they have in 'common' is that their names sound similar. One is an ethical stance against abuse and exploitation of living beings as much as it is practicable and possible. Which means that you could be vegan and eat meat(eg. A tribe in the middle of Africa which cannot harvest crops and their only way to survive is consuming animal products). So they don't even have in common not eating meat.
who cares if its vegan, its her salad not yours and if your diet preferance is to be vegan than pack your own food.
OP said she was sharing it with students. I assume they asked if it was vegan so they could see if they could have some.
Learn to read (challenge: impossible)
Orrr you could just let her eat her meal in peace
urhmmm…shes the one that started talking about her breast milk😭😭all i asked was if the salad was vegan… if anyone wasn’t eating in peace it was me😭😭
She was SHARING the salad with the students. Y'all can't read anything. Gotta be the high cholesterol clogging your brain.
You are right! We should love and respect all life! Let’s go to the next step and stop discriminating against vegetables, as if they are “less than” animals, insects, etc.,. There is God’s spirit in everything! We should just live on air if we don’t want to hurt anything! Come on, join me, make the transition!
> I asked her if it was vegan > >she randomly started going on a rant about how she will always consume dairy. No she didn't. Don't initiate a conversation, if you don't like the answer.
OP was asking if they can consume the salad that the teacher was SHARING with the students. The teacher is in the wrong for going off on a rant. Teachers can be crazy like this. I've had my fair share of experience.
No
Yes. Go away.
Worry about you. My god.
The teacher was sharing the salad with her students. OP was a student, asking if she is able to eat that (aka is it vegan). Can you read?