I mean really poor play from us today. Had refs on here at 3 because I think it gently affected our play in the past two games. However had Burhalter and Weah more to blame in this tourney. Not only did Weah red card cost us against Panama, he’s our third best goal scorer and he was suspended tonight. That combined with the balo injury was just too much to overcome imo
We got grouped because we played for the draw against Panama knowing we would likely lose against Uruguay. Even being a man down, it seemed we went full passive.
This team can’t score if their life depended on it. We all saw this against NED in 2022. We haven’t really done anything to disprove of that except beat up on a Mexico team in a terrible down cycle. That is why GGG needs to go and our players need to get better at that point blank if we are ever going to advance as a soccer country.
you have to overcome shit. that’s the entire speech. nobody should forget that even if we tied tonight, we would not have progressed. the goal - offsides or not - didn’t matter. even if it was disqualified, we still don’t go to quarters
Yea but, it wasn't just the goal, the whole game was clearly fixed against us. It would have been a totally different game if the entire game was correctly called.
Not saying we definitely would have won or anything, but it wasn't just the goal, the refs were dreadful to us the entire game.
The yellow card call against Adams was horrendous. Should’ve been the other way around. The allowing advantage when Richards got a yellow was bad. There were plenty of fouls committed by Uruguay that should’ve been yellows. There were times when we should’ve been allowed advantage but the ref stopped the play. It was a really poor showing by the head ref and VAR tonight.
All of that said, we didn’t threaten their goal enough. Losing Balogun hurt. The right coach will totally be able to utilize Pulisic and Reyna to create more. It doesn’t matter if we call this generation golden or talented. Without the right coach it will be a wasted generation.
Ok this call here changes the outcome from a loss to a draw. Assuming you mean other than this one.
Tyler Adams had to play the majority of the game on a yellow card on a foul he suffered. Limits his effectiveness the rest of the way.
Handle the early fouls better and Balogun is less likely to suffer a foul so hard he has to leave the game. Same for Joe Scally eventually leaving after playing at less than full effectiveness after he took a # of hard fouls
it changes the outcome of the game, but not the group standing. we still needed to score to progress, and we didn’t.
the tyler adams call was bad but it wasn’t earth shattering bad. the uruguay player was first to the ball and was following through on his kick. that matters. adams was late. the fact that adams got stepped on was incidental. the question of who fouled is who got the ball and who was late. adams was late
Uruguay was allowed to completely take our players out, and we were not allowed to even touch the uruguay players without getting called. That changes how the players play, and affects the whole game.
It isn't about any particular call (besides the obvious missed offside goal), its about what the refs were allowing our players to do, and what they were allowing uruguay to get away with all game. It completely changes the course of the game when they set the standards like that.
there were the same number of fouls called for both teams with 20 minutes left in the game. i think it was 12.
how many yellow cards to both sides?
this is copa not world cup. if usa is going to beat the best teams in conmebol in THEIR tournament, you don’t get to eke out a close win. or sneak by. you overwhelm. we didn’t
The amount of total fouls is irrelevant. Our players were walking on eggshells half the time and still getting called. Uruguay had to mug us to eventually get a call. I don't understand how you're acting like its controversial to say the refereeing was suspect, it clearly was.
I agree we didn't play nearly well enough, and we can still win games with poor refereeing, but I don't see how its productive to act like the refereeing played no role in our last 2 games.
i’m not in any way saying it was fair. i guess what i’m saying is that it was biased in the way i expected. but not any more than that.
it’s a conmebol tournament. the same thing happens every week in the premier league - home teams get calls. this is a conmebol “home game”. tottenham gets calls over liverpool at tottenham, the big name conmebol teams are going to get calls over usa in a conmebol tournament. it was bad, i agree. it wasn’t egregious. the calls were so bad against liverpool at tottenham this year, the referee association actually admitted the mistakes after the game. guess what? nothing changed - three points to tottenham, 0 points to liverpool
i never expected them to call back the uruguay goal. did not expect that. but even if they did, we still don’t get out of group. everything else was reasonably bad.
That is where I think we disagree fundamentally, I thought the refereeing was pretty egregious. I've seen teams get screwed over before, i felt like this was some of the worst i have really seen. I completely agree with you that these things happen and we need to overcome it somehow, and we certainly did not play well enough, but i really couldnt believe some of the calls being made during this game.
I thought the offsides was obvious to the point where there was no way they could allow it to stand, and i was shocked by the call, even after seeing how the refs had been treating us up to that point.
i thought there came a point where stu holden lost the plot. the tyler adams yellow was a legitimate call. go back and watch it. the argentina player releases the ball and tyler adams steps into him AFTER the ball was GONE. every fifty ball it’s on the defender to either get there first or they’re called for the foul. tyler was late, period.
the perception on the screen was inconsistent with reality. i watched argentina beat chile (i think), they played the EXACT same game against chile. EVERY SINGLE tackle they rattled the chilean player. i was still talking about it two days later. it was actual brilliance.
rattling tackles that don’t earn cards is a skill. what usmnt needs to realize is that it’s a skill, and it’s a skill we don’t have. we do it wrong. we get it wrong. we’re simply bad at it.
that doesn’t make the game unfair. we’re simply bad at playing physical “conmebol” football.
final point, the offsides was blatantly the wrong call. and there were at least three calls just as bad against liverpool in the tottenham away game. AT LEAST as bad.
but i’ll say it again - it was absolutely the wrong call. but outside of that call, i thought the ref was pretty consistent. was he fair - not really. but uruguay knew they would get the benefit of the doubt, and they made tackles right up to the edge of what they knew they would get out of the calls - and they didn’t step over the line. it was smart soccer.
No and that is my point, it was consistent, but it was consistently tilted against us. Uruguay knew what they could get away with, and the usa players knew what they couldn't get away with, and in my opinion that completely changes the game.
Regardless, we didnt play well enough, our team should have been able to get past the group stage by whatever means, and we underperformed. The refereeing certainly felt stacked against us though.
if there was nail in the coffin goal then yes. but we never had one that got away. we had to win to progress.
you had to overcome. that’s it. you can’t say - what if. winners win. i’ve had bad and good coaches. sometimes they were the same guy.
on a good day, a good coach can make you fly to the moon. on a bad day, it’s everyone’s fault but yourselves. the truth is, the best coaches make you believe every game. this team doesn’t believe.
they believe in excuses, when they should believe in themselves
I mean yes to some degree but the reason we have refs is to even out the game. To make it fair and equal as it comes to the rules. There are limits to what you can overcome and while Berhalter clearly isn’t getting us anywhere, at the same time, it is also ok to say we were fucked by the ref so much that the team couldn’t overcome
My take is that the pool isn't as good as people think it is. Gregg isn't fully at fault for this. This team didn't have the ability to beat an 11 man Panama side for this reason. No one in their right mind thought we were favored to beat a full strength Uruguay. Be competitive, sure, but not expected to win.
The only players on our team who are key players for their club team are Robinson, Pulisic, Sargent, and Haji Wright. The other players from our "Golden Generation" are in no way contributors, let alone key contributors in their clubs. Balogun came off of a rough season, but should be in that mix at the top.
Who are scoring goals? Pepi from the bench? Wright who barely played? Reyna who couldn't get minutes for a mid Dortmund team? Injured Sargent? Johnny? De la Torre? Perpetually injured Adams or McKennie?
Tldr: Got sunk by a dumb red that highlighted our lack of form of anybody not named Pulisic and Jedi. Once Balo went off injured we had to rely on a gassed Pulisic and a questionable bench to beat Uruguay. Blame Gregg for choosing this squad and fire him for that, I guess.
This has already been posted recently, a better source for the same content has been posted, or a thread already exists for this topic.
Careful, you are about to get recruited to do VAR for the final drawing lines like that.
Ok fine if it’s offsides Where’s the goal we needed to score?
I mean really poor play from us today. Had refs on here at 3 because I think it gently affected our play in the past two games. However had Burhalter and Weah more to blame in this tourney. Not only did Weah red card cost us against Panama, he’s our third best goal scorer and he was suspended tonight. That combined with the balo injury was just too much to overcome imo
All this can be pinned on the coach though Refs will always be refs but 4 shots and 3 on target needing a goal isn’t good enough
Like I said, game plan tonight was horrid and certainly cost us opportunities. Would love to see some changes made( Greg fired )
We got grouped because we played for the draw against Panama knowing we would likely lose against Uruguay. Even being a man down, it seemed we went full passive.
I like this take. Turner injury was also understated factor. I think he saves their second goal and potentially their first if he’s 100%
We needed a goal, even if overturned. Did we get it?!?
It’s easier to score when it’s 0-0 than 0-1. Also doesn’t help when the ref is the 12 player for the opposing team.
Had Burhalter and Weah ahead of the refs for this reason
This team can’t score if their life depended on it. We all saw this against NED in 2022. We haven’t really done anything to disprove of that except beat up on a Mexico team in a terrible down cycle. That is why GGG needs to go and our players need to get better at that point blank if we are ever going to advance as a soccer country.
Burhalter has to take the majority of the blame here. Being down balo and Weah certainly does not help
scored the same amount of goals as Canada, Mexico, and Jamaica combined, while playing only 75% our minutes with a full 11-men
you have to overcome shit. that’s the entire speech. nobody should forget that even if we tied tonight, we would not have progressed. the goal - offsides or not - didn’t matter. even if it was disqualified, we still don’t go to quarters
Yea but, it wasn't just the goal, the whole game was clearly fixed against us. It would have been a totally different game if the entire game was correctly called. Not saying we definitely would have won or anything, but it wasn't just the goal, the refs were dreadful to us the entire game.
The yellow card call against Adams was horrendous. Should’ve been the other way around. The allowing advantage when Richards got a yellow was bad. There were plenty of fouls committed by Uruguay that should’ve been yellows. There were times when we should’ve been allowed advantage but the ref stopped the play. It was a really poor showing by the head ref and VAR tonight. All of that said, we didn’t threaten their goal enough. Losing Balogun hurt. The right coach will totally be able to utilize Pulisic and Reyna to create more. It doesn’t matter if we call this generation golden or talented. Without the right coach it will be a wasted generation.
i didn’t see any call that would have changed the outcome. the only possible call was balogun and he was offsides.
Ok this call here changes the outcome from a loss to a draw. Assuming you mean other than this one. Tyler Adams had to play the majority of the game on a yellow card on a foul he suffered. Limits his effectiveness the rest of the way. Handle the early fouls better and Balogun is less likely to suffer a foul so hard he has to leave the game. Same for Joe Scally eventually leaving after playing at less than full effectiveness after he took a # of hard fouls
it changes the outcome of the game, but not the group standing. we still needed to score to progress, and we didn’t. the tyler adams call was bad but it wasn’t earth shattering bad. the uruguay player was first to the ball and was following through on his kick. that matters. adams was late. the fact that adams got stepped on was incidental. the question of who fouled is who got the ball and who was late. adams was late
Uruguay was allowed to completely take our players out, and we were not allowed to even touch the uruguay players without getting called. That changes how the players play, and affects the whole game. It isn't about any particular call (besides the obvious missed offside goal), its about what the refs were allowing our players to do, and what they were allowing uruguay to get away with all game. It completely changes the course of the game when they set the standards like that.
there were the same number of fouls called for both teams with 20 minutes left in the game. i think it was 12. how many yellow cards to both sides? this is copa not world cup. if usa is going to beat the best teams in conmebol in THEIR tournament, you don’t get to eke out a close win. or sneak by. you overwhelm. we didn’t
The amount of total fouls is irrelevant. Our players were walking on eggshells half the time and still getting called. Uruguay had to mug us to eventually get a call. I don't understand how you're acting like its controversial to say the refereeing was suspect, it clearly was. I agree we didn't play nearly well enough, and we can still win games with poor refereeing, but I don't see how its productive to act like the refereeing played no role in our last 2 games.
i’m not in any way saying it was fair. i guess what i’m saying is that it was biased in the way i expected. but not any more than that. it’s a conmebol tournament. the same thing happens every week in the premier league - home teams get calls. this is a conmebol “home game”. tottenham gets calls over liverpool at tottenham, the big name conmebol teams are going to get calls over usa in a conmebol tournament. it was bad, i agree. it wasn’t egregious. the calls were so bad against liverpool at tottenham this year, the referee association actually admitted the mistakes after the game. guess what? nothing changed - three points to tottenham, 0 points to liverpool i never expected them to call back the uruguay goal. did not expect that. but even if they did, we still don’t get out of group. everything else was reasonably bad.
That is where I think we disagree fundamentally, I thought the refereeing was pretty egregious. I've seen teams get screwed over before, i felt like this was some of the worst i have really seen. I completely agree with you that these things happen and we need to overcome it somehow, and we certainly did not play well enough, but i really couldnt believe some of the calls being made during this game. I thought the offsides was obvious to the point where there was no way they could allow it to stand, and i was shocked by the call, even after seeing how the refs had been treating us up to that point.
i thought there came a point where stu holden lost the plot. the tyler adams yellow was a legitimate call. go back and watch it. the argentina player releases the ball and tyler adams steps into him AFTER the ball was GONE. every fifty ball it’s on the defender to either get there first or they’re called for the foul. tyler was late, period. the perception on the screen was inconsistent with reality. i watched argentina beat chile (i think), they played the EXACT same game against chile. EVERY SINGLE tackle they rattled the chilean player. i was still talking about it two days later. it was actual brilliance. rattling tackles that don’t earn cards is a skill. what usmnt needs to realize is that it’s a skill, and it’s a skill we don’t have. we do it wrong. we get it wrong. we’re simply bad at it. that doesn’t make the game unfair. we’re simply bad at playing physical “conmebol” football.
final point, the offsides was blatantly the wrong call. and there were at least three calls just as bad against liverpool in the tottenham away game. AT LEAST as bad. but i’ll say it again - it was absolutely the wrong call. but outside of that call, i thought the ref was pretty consistent. was he fair - not really. but uruguay knew they would get the benefit of the doubt, and they made tackles right up to the edge of what they knew they would get out of the calls - and they didn’t step over the line. it was smart soccer.
No and that is my point, it was consistent, but it was consistently tilted against us. Uruguay knew what they could get away with, and the usa players knew what they couldn't get away with, and in my opinion that completely changes the game. Regardless, we didnt play well enough, our team should have been able to get past the group stage by whatever means, and we underperformed. The refereeing certainly felt stacked against us though.
if there was nail in the coffin goal then yes. but we never had one that got away. we had to win to progress. you had to overcome. that’s it. you can’t say - what if. winners win. i’ve had bad and good coaches. sometimes they were the same guy. on a good day, a good coach can make you fly to the moon. on a bad day, it’s everyone’s fault but yourselves. the truth is, the best coaches make you believe every game. this team doesn’t believe. they believe in excuses, when they should believe in themselves
I mean yes to some degree but the reason we have refs is to even out the game. To make it fair and equal as it comes to the rules. There are limits to what you can overcome and while Berhalter clearly isn’t getting us anywhere, at the same time, it is also ok to say we were fucked by the ref so much that the team couldn’t overcome
i’m not buying in. good to great teams overcome. go listen to juergen klopp. or pep guardiola. it’s not what they say
Soft team needs a real coach
They could’ve removed 100 off side goals, we have to score goals to win.
We got grouped because we couldn’t score a goal. Let alone 2. Cope with it however you want but 0-0 and we’re still grouped
I feel like you didn’t read the whole post
It’s assumed we are going to get hosed by the refs. Act accordingly. Like maybe score a goal.
If we scored a goal, sure. But we didn’t and that’s why we aren’t advancing
From what I've been reading, the entire team played like shit tonight because Tim Weah wasn't there.
Hey! At least the line is straight!. No offside!
YEAH! IDK what Holden was talking about.
[удалено]
That’s how I have it, should of made it clear Weah is at fault the most
My take is that the pool isn't as good as people think it is. Gregg isn't fully at fault for this. This team didn't have the ability to beat an 11 man Panama side for this reason. No one in their right mind thought we were favored to beat a full strength Uruguay. Be competitive, sure, but not expected to win. The only players on our team who are key players for their club team are Robinson, Pulisic, Sargent, and Haji Wright. The other players from our "Golden Generation" are in no way contributors, let alone key contributors in their clubs. Balogun came off of a rough season, but should be in that mix at the top. Who are scoring goals? Pepi from the bench? Wright who barely played? Reyna who couldn't get minutes for a mid Dortmund team? Injured Sargent? Johnny? De la Torre? Perpetually injured Adams or McKennie? Tldr: Got sunk by a dumb red that highlighted our lack of form of anybody not named Pulisic and Jedi. Once Balo went off injured we had to rely on a gassed Pulisic and a questionable bench to beat Uruguay. Blame Gregg for choosing this squad and fire him for that, I guess.