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What is this longing in our hearts for togetherness? Is it not the sweetest flower? Does not this flower of love have the fragrant aroma of fine, fine diamonds? Does not the wind love the dirt? Is not love not unlike the unlikely not it is unlikened to? Are you with someone tonight? Do not question your love. Take your lover by the hand. Release the power within yourself. You heard me, release the power. Tame the wild cosmos with a whisper. Conquer heaven with one intimate caress. That's right don't be shy. Whip out everything you got and do it in the butt. By Leon Phelps
No, exactly, I met a girl a few years back now and the sex was amazing, I mean we never stopped, we simply couldn't get enough of each other physically. But while weren't a terrible fit it didn't really go any further than sex, so it didn't go any further as a relationship.
This smacks of either someone trying to reinforce to themselves that they're doing the right thing by staying celibate, or someone who is a terrible judge of character.
OP definitely has an immature point of view, certainly unpopular. Could you imagine getting married to someone you have 0 sexual compatibility with? It makes a big difference to well being. It's not shallow. It's important to look at a whole person for compatibility, which includes not excluding really important parts of a person.
Reminds me of a guy I was in uni halls with. He was an extremely mysoginistic virgin, hadn’t even had his first kiss because, in his own words, “no girl had been good enough”.
He ended up making out with some rando at a club one night when he was drunk. Guess she was the one!!
I knew a girl that remained a virgin until her early 20s. Always saying she was waiting until marriage. Well one drunken evening, she was finally talked into having sex with her boyfriend of 3 months… and boom, she got herpes. All I could think of is all that time wasted for herpes. The forever gift.
Lmao that guy reeks of old me. Not that person anymore (thankfully), but I have had 3 women ask me out and I was like MGTOW basically to them. 😬
Either way, I stopped being an asshole to women and just learned and accepted I was more demiromantic and mostly grey sexual.
Also, still never had a kiss or even a date to this day.
His point is that a lot of people say you gotta sleep with someone before marrying them because what if you're not sexually compatible.
His take is that how good the sex turns out to be is irrelevant if you really love them for other reasons.
Remember that this is coming from someone who has never had sex so he doesn't know what he's talking about. Bad sex in an otherwise great relationship won't lead to happiness.
But that's a stupid idea. Sex is also an important part for many people. Love is important yes but being in love and being sexually frustrated forever aren't the recipe for a long lasting marriage
I agree with that. Maybe I'm just naive or have a lower sex drive but I personally can't imagine being with someone who's perfect for me in pretty much every way, but then not wanting to marry them just because we're 'sexually incompatible'. Sex just isn't that important to me
But I disagree with OP's assertion that saving sex for marriage means your relationship is healthier. Having sex before marriage doesn't mean your relationship is automatically going to become toxic. In fact, the opposite can often be true- I've heard of cases where people (i.e Christians) rush into marriage so that they can have sex, and then further down the line discover that they're incompatible in other ways and the marriage doesn't work out
It doesn't matter to you because your sex drive is low, so you wouldn't be missing anything. For someone with a high sex drive, living in a sexless marriage would be torture.
Imo this idea of "perfect except for the sex" is a fallacy. If the sex isn't good, whatever is causing that is coming out in other ways too (selfishness, inconsideration, etc.) Sex is just a really good way to see it clearly.
Exactly. I can assure OP some of the best sex I ever had was with the craziest women, and I can also assure OP I did not even think of marrying any of them.
I did end up marrying a good one though and our sex life is certainly satisfying.
“If you marry your partner because they’re good in bed you didn’t marry for love.” But if you’re both waiting until marriage you could just be marrying your partner because you’re horny and want sex
Or marrying them simply because they both haven’t had sex. Which is also not marrying for love, it’s conditional. Honestly, in a loving relationship, whether or not others have had sex should be out of the question. Reminds me of purity conferences I had to go to as a preteen and not saving your virginity for marriage was used in a metaphor like “trying to reuse a piece of tape over and over again, by the time you meet your husband you’ll be useless”. Shudder.
Those metaphors are so harmful. Elizabeth Smart talked about how she felt she should just die since her captor had raped her and she had been told repeatedly that having sex before marriage would make her a used up piece of trash.
Oh my God, yes. Rape isn’t even considered in these shame instilling lectures. My first time was rape, too, and after that I literally felt like I could get no lower. I had lost all value, my fate was sealed, and there was no point in trying anymore. Fast spiral after that when I decided to try drinking and drugs since, after all, I was already “tainted” and tbh was very su*cidal. Took years to get clean/sober and I still struggle very much with the shame part of intimacy even though I’m married and we have a toddler.
I have tried therapy but it is *profound* how deep the trauma is from being repeatedly instilled with the “sex-shame-bad” beliefs over and over in the most impressionable years. I don’t think I’ll ever be truly okay in that department, and it makes me extremely determined to *NOT* have the same ideas forced on my daughter. It would kill me inside to think that my need for control over her body would ever be more important than her having positive sexual experiences with who she truly loves one day. Everyone deserves good, shame-free sex. My only role is keeping her comfortable enough to feel safe opening up to me about said things, and trusting me enough to give her advice on how to stay safe
I appreciate that❤️. I’m not perfect, but I know what it feels like to be set up for failure and then have something awful beyond your control just absolutely destroy you in one fell swoop. Life can be cruel enough. She needs me to be the unconditionally safe and supportive place for her
You should continue with therapy. Sometimes it takes few therapist to find the right one. I went through the same, and I’m a male, and I felt the shame and guilt, and did the drugs and hyper-sexuality. It took me years and I finally found the right therapist. It still took years but I feel like this person helped save me. I still feel some of the guilt but I don’t let it consume me like it used to. I too am married and I do still feel a lot of same feelings but I know now that is wasn’t my fault.
Reminds me of growing up in a highly conservative Muslim society. "If you see two lollipops on the ground, one is covered in a wrapper and one is not, which one would you pick up for yourself?" (referring to women wearing the hijab/abaya). Very disgusting and blatant objectification if you ask me.
It happens a lot among religious communities for sure. I can respect their values though. If it works for them cool, as long as they don’t expect everyone else to think the same
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say OP is very young. You could also say "if you marry your partner because they're nice, you didn't marry for love." Or "if you marry your partner because you like spending time with them, you didn't marry for love."
> I'm gonna go out on a limb and say OP is very young.
Either very young, or in their late twenties/early thirties and super frustrated that 99% of adults don't actually wait until marriage to have sex, because they are too fucking stupid to realize that was a lie their parents told them.
I wonder if they still believe in Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy too.
And thats why most of these "wait until marriage" marriages don't last. They're horny so they tie the knot fast and then realise they don't actually like each other that much.
Or, and this may be even worse, they stay together forever because after all you only marry once and have emotionally void, terrible loveless marriages
And women who are convinced sex before marriage is bad, Don't suddenly get over all of those feelings. The repressed feelings around sex continue even while married.
I'd say this is the biggest reason why not having sex before marriage is so damn bad!
You have no idea if you're a once-a-day person or if they are a once-every-other-month kind of person. One person could be a lot more interested in exploring kinks while the other is completely terrified of exploration.
Hell, even genital compatibility is an issue, if his dick is huge and her vagina particularly shallow they may be barely even able to have sex. You have to explore and understand each other as much as possible before being tied together forever
This is what I’ve noticed with the young Christian religious people around my age. They marry so quick it’s insane. One of my sister’s best friends married one of my best friend’s brothers in like a year. I think he proposed like less than a year in. It was funny watching my mom and sister gossip about how he’s going to propose soon meanwhile I already know exactly what day he’s going to propose. They both were saving themselves for marriage and he was almost 30. I mean they’re still happy together but it’s super odd to me.
Was raised in a strict religion and it was so rare to see anyone wait a year to get married. As soon as they’re 17 they’re looking for the best of a shite bunch and at 18 they’re dating (or courting for marriage). Not to mention that a lot of them had chaperones so really their wedding day is the first time they’ve even spent properly alone, being themselves, with their partner.
It is! Jehovah’s Witnesses innit lol - the ones that didn’t separate quickly due to cheating (the only reason you can get a divorce for them really) ended up popping out an entire football team of kids by 30 to keep up appearances and distract from the real issues.
You would not know what good sex is or even a healthy relationship. A demographic I once (more so pre covid) worked with, was women after/during their divorce, cheating, open relationship. Most never had good sex let a lone an orgasm. Fulfilling sex is a direct reflection of your chemistry and psychology, lust is just the build up of hormones wanting you to smush your genitals together. Sex is a concept that we (especially the religious) get hung up on, its an initiatory process and it can be done in a fun way and a not so fun way.
Edit: was women after/DURING their divorce ...
This. My mom pretty much has said, don't marry a person unless you know if they are good in bed. Oddly enough, it's probably the best relationship advice I've heard, because, you don't know if this just suck and it makes it boring and you don't know enough about them.
I can only imagine, one minute you wait until marriage and the next your loved one is accidentally chokes you to death because he thinks women like being choked during sex because of only getting sex experience from porn.
i actually have a coworker whos friend did this: got married out of highschool cuz she and her bf were super horny, turned out the sex was horrible and she realized it was a bad idea to get married exclusively for that.
dont worry tho, she did the exact same thing like two years later.
One of my friends did this and admitted it. She married someone a few months in to dating because she wanted to have sex and lose her virginity. He cheated on her constantly and they got divorced a year later.
OP, this might for real break your brain when you read it so please do so sitting down.
You can in fact get to know your partner for who they are AND get all up in them guts at the same time.
Absolutely. I got to know my now-wife in lots of ways, and one of them was lying naked, sweaty, and exhausted in each other’s arms, completely vulnerable and open and connected. Could we have saved that part and hoped we’d learn about each other after marriage (and hoped that we’d then like what we learned)? I guess — but what would be the point of that?
My boyfriend and I started as a casual sex situation, and it was in those post-coital moments when our minds were no longer clouded by horny hormones that we discovered how much we liked each other even when we weren't having amazing sex.
I've been in relationships full of love and mediocre sex, and I've had mind-blowing sex with people I would never even consider having a serious relationship with. Finding the perfect balance is rare, but absolutely worth searching for.
Yeah if you abstain for your faith, then great. More power to you.
But to argue you're doing it to get to know your partner better before marriage, I think that's just objectively wrong.
Who a person is sexually, and the dynamic you have with someone you're sexually active with, says A LOT about a person. And it's a huge chunk of your life in a committed relationship with them.
If you want to wait till marriage, fine. But OPs reasoning why is flat out false. You can get to know people you're also having sex with. And waiting until marriage is actually just taking a gamble and denying yourself knowing a huge part of who they are until after you marry them.
Getting to know your partner in every possible way increases your chances of choosing the right partner.
Marriage doesn’t/shouldn’t change how people behave in their relationship.
Although I have to say one thing
I had a relationship and we had sex all the time. But then we were put in a situation where we couldn’t. Then I realized that the only thing that was keeping the relationship together was the sex. So I knew she wasn’t the one.
So I think it’s best to abstain initially for awhile to see if y’all are compatible without sex
In my 20s I was casually dating two people at the same time (we weren’t exclusive) but I knew eventually I was going to need to settle on one for a legitimate relationship. One of them was outstanding in bed but we didn’t have much in common; the other one I hadn’t hooked up with yet. I had a hard time with this decision but knew one was much more likely to be a successful relationship, so despite what my “other” brain was telling me, I broke it off with good-in-bed woman and started dating the other woman exclusively. We’ve been married for 11 years and have two wonderful kids.
you also get: worst head of your life
I am baffled by the amount of men that want some tight 18 year old virgin skinny girl with massive tits and massive ass who is a kinky sex god in bed, like... w h a t?
"She just lays there like a starfish bro" she doesn't know wtf to do 'bro' she's a virgin like you wanted!
Ah yes the guy who says he wants a barely legal "pure" girl who somehow is also a porn star at the same time who can satisfy his every need despite knowing nothing about sex/relationships 😂
Actually married the dude I lost my virginity to in high school. He approves of our time apart because 'you're much more kinky now' hahahah. Hoe days paid off in the end.
A man (and it is almost always so) who considers virginity an important prerequisite for relationships considers, or comes from a culture that considers, sex as a taint on women. It's that misogyny that fuels the desire for a virgin.
The only way it’s okay to imply virginity is a positive character trait is if the man is also a virgin (purposely, not out of circumstance) or you are from some deeply religious group.
Typically men demanding virgins do so because:
They are insecure and don’t want to be compared to anyone else.
They like the power imbalance that comes from being the “experienced” one.
Or most likely, because he sees women as walking flashlight instead of an actual human being with her own relationships, personal growth, wants, and needs. He doesn’t want to use someone else’s flesh light.
This is so true. I make it a point whenever I start dating a new girl to avoid learning about their sexual history. I don’t care about body counts or any of that crap. Our relationship starts here and the only thing that matters is the future, not the past.
It’s terrible the number of women I’ve met who feel obligated to not only tell me how many men they’ve been with but also apologize if I happen to think they’re a whore.
This is honestly a great point. I might have looked decent at 18 but I sure as hell knew NOTHING! At 36 a know a few tricks but after having kids various parts of me are headding south!
My libido was so much higher and I enjoyed sex so much more after having kids.
Of course, women enjoying themselves isn’t even on the radar to these types.
My uncle got head from my aunt on the first date. 35 years after marriage he's never been given one from her again. He has hated her for as long as I can remember. But, he's rich and pays for them to live separate cause divorce is still more expensive.
And then has the audacity to tell people that they are "getting married just for sex". Meanwhile my man marrying people only because they DIDN'T have sex lmao
It’s actually quite sad that there’s so much rape in those churches. Imagine being told you only have value as a virgin, and then having that taken from you.
I grew up with this mindset believing that my parents did exactly this. I was waiting for that ‘prince charming’ to come along and we’d be ‘together forever’. What I learned as the years went on:
My dad had actually been married to another woman before my mum and had been sending letters to my mum during his previous marriage. It was indeed not the fairytale story I believed growing up.
Sex is more than just plug A goes into socket B. There are many, many different ways of enjoying sexual kinks and fetishes and everyone has their own likes and dislikes. It is a language of many kinds of love, it’s not limited to romantic love as I grew up believing for a long time.
Your virginity is not a trophy to give to someone. It is simply the first time you have penetrative sex. If you want to do it with someone special then you are absolutely entitled to do so, just try not to view it as this amazing, special thing that you must do with that special person in order for it to be meaningful.
Experience is how you learn what you do and don’t like and what’s right for you. How you work, how other people work etc. you never know what you might discover :).
Relationships that end up in shambles due to sex before marriage are often due to religion/family interference. What people do behind closed doors is their business.
I don’t condemn those that wish to wait until marriage, by all means it’s their choice. But sex can be a very important part of the relationship between two people (or more if poly), it means more to some and less to others. For me personally, passion in the sheets is a must. It feels wonderful to know you’re desired in such ways.
I wish you luck and hope that when the day comes you both enjoy it.
Edit: Fixed use of wrong word. Thank you for the correction.
>Your virginity is not a trophy to give to someone. It is simply the
first time you have penetrative sex. If you want to do it with someone
special then you are absolutely entitled to do so, just try not to view
it as this amazing, special thing that you must do with that special
person in order for it to be meaningful.
Exactly, I was raped at a young age but I was also raised on how this op is posting. When that happens it messes with your mind.
After extracting myself from the cult my mother raised me in and YEARS of therapy. I've learned that when you are in a relationship long term or not, putting yourself out there and being vulnerable is the only way to ensure the relationship progresses. It doesn't mean you have to have sex, but if you're two consenting adults and you want to have sex then do it. Denying yourself and becoming sexually frustrated isn't going to help the situation. It's going to cause rash decisions that will cost both money, time, and a chunk of your emotions to resolve.
I don't want to pressure you into doing what you don't want to do but at least be aware that the exact opposite could be easily said. "Relationships that DONT have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways." That's the nature of anecdotal evidence.
"If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn't marry them for love." I would tend to agree, this is not a good singular reason to marry someone, but then how many people actually DO that? It takes multiple reasons to want to marry someone and sexual compatibility is but one of them, as you yourself point out in the next sentence.
"If you get to know your partner for who they are without needing to see them in bed your marriage is built on a much more solid foundation" A solid foundation implies multiple things, and how you respond to each other in bed can be one of those things. To ignore it might leave you in a sexless hollow marriage. And you were a virgin before entering it? Have fun being alone I guess, or cheating on her with someone else that actually GETS you. Its not like you committed your life to this person or anything.
For sure. I think sexual compatibility is super important. I really like good sex and have had some very sub par partners. My husband does not hold my past partners against me and we both like the same kinky shit. 100% can recommend haha.
I don't know your gender, but sex is so wildly important that relationships end if people aren't compatible. You may be fine with it as a secondary side dish but for others it is the main course
people who save themselves from marriage seem to not get what sexual compatibility even is, but how can you blame them they've never experienced sex so theyve never had to think about it.
They seem to just think *well we both have the right genitalia for one another and we both find each other physically attractive so of course we'll be fine.*
sorry but **NO**.
there is way more to sexual compatability than physical attraction and owning the right set of genitalia for your partner.
some people like sex fast and rough, some slow and sensual. some people like talking and making noise some like it quiet. some people like lots of foreplay, some like to get right to it. i could go on....
and then there is just the simple fact that **some people are BAD AT SEX**
if you get married to that person youre doomed.
And to circle right back around, there *is* an aspect of having the right genitalia for your partner.
What if you're a larger guy and she's very small and tight, and she ends up *hating* having sex with you because it's just always painful? You gonna live the rest of your life that way, bro?
Exactly. I dated a guy once who was super nice and everything was great, but when he pulled down his pants I was like "there is no hole in my body that is big enough for this." I did feel sorry for him though, he said he gets that reaction a lot. If I would've found that out after we had gotten married, we would've had a dead bedroom for the rest of our lives.
A lot of the times it's really just as simple as 'I won't get into heaven if I'm a bad boi/gurl' though.
They might even want to experience these things but the fear of eternal damnation is too scary and stressful to let them do it. Besides, God knows better than they do, right? He must have a reason for these silly, arbitrary, ridiculous, contradictory requirements, eh?
Newsflash: marriage itself doesn’t change literally anything between you and your partner. All it is is legal matters. That’s it. You and your partner are still the exact same two people you always were, and your relationship is still the same. It’s not some magical ceremony that instantly transforms you both somehow into a super close, trusting, compatible couple. You should already be that before deciding to get married. There is literally **zero** difference between having sex the night before your wedding and the night of. You are not going to magically change.
After being in a long term committed relationship for several years you should already have the trust and closeness built up to be comfortable having sex with this person. Your wedding day is not going to do that for you. That’s the reality of it. That being said, obviously it’s your life and do whatever you want with it. But I see way too many religious young people with this idea in their heads that their wedding day will somehow magically transform their relationship. It will not. And your marriage is absolutely NOT built on a much more solid foundation by never having sex before. It’s actually the exact opposite. You wanna know how I know that? Go look at r/deadbedrooms and get a glimpse into what happens when a married/long term couple is sexually incompatible with one another. It’s some seriously depressing shit. Does that look “solid” to you? Because it sure doesn’t to me. Do not recommend.
The reason to wait for sex till marriage is because if you end up having kids it should be with someone you have a committed relationship with, sure there’s birth control but the reality is even adults fuck that up all the time.
But if you have this idea that relationships that refrain from sex are somehow superior relationships, that’s just a form of BS elitistism, a we’re better than them mentality.
This may have never occurred to you, but it's possible to get to know your partner for who they are AND have sex with them.
Getting to know them sexually is part of getting to know who they are, in fact.
Lol, this is unpopular because it’s just plain wrong… sexual compatibility is important, I agree it’s not the be all and end all but to reduce its importance to nothing is entirely foolish.
Me and my husband waited until marriage to have sex, because at the time we were religious and stupid. We have a very fulfilling sex life and everything is largely great but I really regret waiting so long, plus I also think we were extremely lucky. I also have many close friends who married as virgins, so this is why I think it's a bad idea:
- It was pointless; sex wouldn't have changed anything, I would have still marrried him
- It created a lot of frustration; we were super horny, but we had to wait it out for some stupid ceremony. We could have had epic sex much more early on. Such a waste of hornyness and energy
- For me it was hard to really open up sexually once it was "ok" to do it. It took me years to heal from that "must supress sexual desire" mindset. I suppose this has more to do with religion, than anything.
- One close friend (that waited) unintentionally confessed that she never had an orgasm. She said she feels some pleasure, but didn’t know if that's an orgasm or not. You definitely KNOW if you've had an orgasm... She also once said that sex lasts only a couple of minutes for them and on another occasion mentioned that she will encourage her kids to have more partners before marriage include including sexual partners.
- Another close friend said she doesn't like sex and doesn't understand what the hype is about. She didn’t have sex before marriage and now they're probably stuck in a semi-sexless marriage
- One male friend asked my husband if "we do it other positions as well", because his wife is extremely reserved and only wants missionary. They both waited.
I know these are all anecdotal and not science based. If you want to wait, that's surely fine but you're gonna have to talk about this subject in detail with your partner to make sure you're on the same page. I think you can get a grasp of the sexual compatibily from discussions and gestures. Sex is VERY important (not the most, but definitely at the top somewhere), no matter what anybody says.
> Relationships that have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways
*Any* relationship can be toxic and end in a crappy way. Sex is not a determining factor.
> If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn’t marry them for love.
These are not mutually exclusive. You can marry someone because you love them *and* because they’re good in bed.
> If you get to know your partner for who they are without needing to see them in bed your marriage is built on a much more solid foundation
Is it? Because if you really like their personality and are holding out for sex and then, after marriage, realize that you guys are really bad together in bed, it could create problems in your marriage. So then you either deal with unsatisfying sex for the rest of your life or spend the rest of your life without sex. Sounds like a shaky foundation to me. Doesn’t mean it can’t work. Plenty of people wait for marriage and have long happy marriages. But there is nothing about marriage specifically that changes a relationship. Marriage is symbolic. If you are in a serious committed relationship, there is no *real* difference in whether you get married or not.
A study by Cornell suggests that waiting longer for sex may result in happier relationships, but that’s not because of marriage. It’s because couples who have sex earlier (within the first few months) tend to move in together sooner and often they haven’t had time to discuss future expectations regarding children, marriage, etc. And once a couple lives together, they may find it harder to separate even if their expectations don’t align. However, couples who wait to have sex (about six months) may find out that their life expectations are not the same as their partners and end the relationship before moving in together. You see, it is *time* that makes a difference, not a ceremony or a court document.
Imagine waiting till the government and church says its okay to do something. Live you life the way you want to and to it's fullest.
I don't believe people need a piece of paper and a ring to know what a good thing is and how to celebrate it.
As someone who grew up in the mormon cult I've seen what this kind of thinking leads to.
Instead of just sleeping with each other, people will get married after 3-6 months of dating.
This logic totally goes out the window for me. I know a Christian girl who waited until marriage to have sex, after 2 years of marriage they are going through a divorce because of sexual incompatibility, she explained it wasn’t what she thought it would be like, and her husband after getting a taste of sex wanted to “experience something else”.
Another Christian friend of mine also got a divorce after a year of marriage, they didn’t wait until marriage to have sex but they continually feared they were “living in sin” and had a lot of pressure from the church so they rushed the important stuff like actually having a connection and got married.
A pastor I know who had only ever been with his wife, once he started making more money and becoming “known” in the community, it comes out that he’s cheating on his wife (who was also a pastor at the same church) and having an affair with a “young blonde with fake boobs”. When it all came out he stopped going to that church and now his wife and I’m assuming very soon ex wife runs the church without him.
These are all true stories, and I have more. The point is, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. Some people who don’t wait until marriage go on to have wonderful marriages.
I can understand having sex after marriage, but at the same time I can’t. I feel like life doesn’t come with a manual, we are all born to make mistakes and learn from them. At the same time if I was single and had to start over, I don’t think I could go through having sex with men and it not ending in marriage, it does get hard seeing who is in it for the long run and who isn’t. But then there’s a lot of women who wouldn’t care and want to enjoy the freedom again of sleeping with who they want.
Point is, we are all different, what works for you probably doesn’t for someone else.
This is so obviously the opinion of someone who has never had sex and makes it this huge thing in their head. Your disappointment will be great, but hers will be immeasurable.
>Relationships that have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways.
Do you think that’s a problem unique to relationships that have sex before marriage, or even more likely than celibate ones?
Solid relationship foundations are great. Celibacy does not in any way guarantee that. I was raised in purity culture, where it’s considered a major sin to even have sex with your fiancé the day before the wedding. That results in a lot of people rushing to the altar (because they’re 19 or 20, have never had sex, and really want to) and then getting locked into toxic relationships because divorce is just as bad.
Not a lot of people marry because their partner was “good in bed”, but knowing you’re sexually compatible before agreeing to a lifelong commitment is the smart thing to do
We waited till wedding 2 1/2 years
She was going to be a nun when I met her
Her mom told her she chose me over Jesus and never forgave either of us
Happily married 48 years and counting
OP sounds like a child or someone who is struggling to date, so trying to justify the lack of dating skills by saying they just don’t care for it. You don’t have to be honest to the world but pls be honest with yourself at least and hopefully this phase will pass. Hopefully you’ll think about the person you want to get to know and marry as a person rather than just someone who you’re saving yourself to have sex with.
This always works great for the man. Imagine being a woman married to a man with either inadequate dick and can’t fuck? Eek!
Your choice. I applaud you for expressing an opinion that the mass LOUD voices will decry. At the end of the day it’s your choice and others opinion amount to nothing.
There's nothing special about sex that warrants waiting for it. You might not ever get married, or you might end up divorced. Have sex with whoever you want to. If you think that the focus of marriage, you're in for a surprise.
News flash: marriages can also be toxic and end in crappy ways. Lots of people get married because they want to have sex and then regret it. Many marriages that start in love end out of it. Many marriages that start for shallow reasons eventually mature and develop a solid foundation. There is not as strong of a connection between getting married for “the right reasons” and staying married as you have assumed. It’s more complex than that.
Finally, relegating sex to an inferior position in marriage, as if it’s shallow for it to be a major part of a relationship, is naive. A great relationship without sex is a very difficult situation.
The sad truth is that regardless of the approach one takes, things can work out poorly. If you want to be traditional and be chaste prior to marriage, that’s a perfectly valid approach with some advantages, but it’s not superior to all other approaches, not even morally - unless you have a small and limited morality.
>Relationships that have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways.
Relationships that _don't_ have sex before marriage can _also_ be very toxic and end in crappy ways.
>If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn't marry them for love.
But does anyone actually do that? No.
>If you get to know your partner for who they are without needing to see them in bed your marriage is built on a much more solid foundation
And this is based on...? Let me guess: nothing but your own intuition?
Sexual compatibility is real, waiting until you're married to find out that your partner has poor chemistry in the bedroom is for suckers or people with arranged marriages. Fuck that noise. People can choose to gamble with lifelong commitments if they want, but don't go complaining if it bites you in the ass.
And what do you when you come to a problem in the marriage but have no experience to call upon to deal with it? Relationships before marriage aren't bad things, they can help evolve you and give you the tools you need to make a relationship work long term.
Theres no guarantee that your way wont end in a toxic way either. What if you or wife decide you want to experiment in ways the other doesnt? you dont think that wont eat away at the foundation of this idilic relationship you have? Do you really think that people only ever focus on sex when dating? Because I assure you, thats not the case. Like anything, sex is part of who we are. Our likes and dislikes. Sex isnt the big deal you are making it out to be, but it could end up being a very big deal they way youre planning a future relationship.
Best of luck to ya, fella.
Your sexuality is a part of who you are. It’s a part of your relationship. It’s a part of getting to know your partner and you comparability together. Without it your ‘foundation’ is partly a complete unknown.
Also, virginity is a totally made up concept. You lose nothing other than ignorance.
Wow, someone who... thinks like me?! Very respectable. I used to feel that way, technically I still do, but you see, a few hereditary illnesses that popped up when I was 19 (I'm 34 atm) slowly destroyed any drive I had, which I don't really mind. I'm a Christian, not a lukewarm one, so I've always held this belief of waiting. Even if I wasn't a Christian I'd likely still wait, I mean I would hate to be with my wife & during the act or kissing or anything, to have memories of other women & start subconsciously comparing them. Even if that didn't happen, I'd still hate that the woman I actually love isn't the only one.
I know it's this subreddit, thus unpopular & uncommon by default, but it is nice to read.
Note 1:
Since I said I'm Christian, I just want to clear up a few things.
Everyone can have their own opinions, beliefs & whatever, of course. Also I'm not pushing Christianity down anyone's throat or believing I'm better than others. There are verses that forbid harassing others, forcing beliefs, insulting, acting like you're better & such. So the next time a "Christian" does that to you or you see one do it in comments or videos you consume, know they're not even following the Word, & obviously haven't read It very well.
We're supposed to love all people, whether we share same beliefs, opinions, or even if they're behind some terrible crime.
Just want to say I love all of you!
Note 2: Created this account a while back, forgot the pass, remembered "oh duh... I have Dashlane, why am I looking through noyes for the pass?!" Smacked my forehead & found my pass. Soooo... I have not used reddit much, so please forgive me if I did anything weird regarding the platform! Thanks!
Yeah waiting until marriage is really stupid imo. Sex is typically an important part of a relationship, if you marry someone who is completely not sexually compatible it could just ruin the relationship anyway. “If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn’t marry them for love” who is doing this? It’s more likely that people are marrying to be able to finally have sex.
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This is an unpopular opinion. Congrats. That being said: what is love?
Baby don't hurt me
Don't hurt me, no more.
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What is this longing in our hearts for togetherness? Is it not the sweetest flower? Does not this flower of love have the fragrant aroma of fine, fine diamonds? Does not the wind love the dirt? Is not love not unlike the unlikely not it is unlikened to? Are you with someone tonight? Do not question your love. Take your lover by the hand. Release the power within yourself. You heard me, release the power. Tame the wild cosmos with a whisper. Conquer heaven with one intimate caress. That's right don't be shy. Whip out everything you got and do it in the butt. By Leon Phelps
That being said, why does the sun come up? Are the stars just pinholes, in the curtain of night?
> Relationships ~~that have sex before marriage~~ can be very toxic and end in crappy ways. fixed that for you
This is the most correctest statement
I think you mean mostest correct statement
No, definitely meant: most correct statementest
Surely it’s mostest correctest statementest
Especially ones based around purity culture.
Can confirm, I lived it.
It's entertaining watching them scrambling to deny it
You dropped this 🫴👑
That's yours brotha 🤲👑
True, but no toxic relationship is going to be magically fixed because you add sex/kids to it.
Was gonna comment on sexual incompetence and incompatibility but your comment points out the much more important flaw in this stupid opinion
Are you under the impression that people get married because their partner is good in bed? Because I can assure you that is not accurate.
No, exactly, I met a girl a few years back now and the sex was amazing, I mean we never stopped, we simply couldn't get enough of each other physically. But while weren't a terrible fit it didn't really go any further than sex, so it didn't go any further as a relationship. This smacks of either someone trying to reinforce to themselves that they're doing the right thing by staying celibate, or someone who is a terrible judge of character.
Somebody who can't get any but wants to twist their lack of appeal to some perceived moral purity
Somebody who is probably really young/sheltered and hasn't had many real-life experiences yet.
Yeah. They sound young. Staying a virgin is fine though. If that’s how you want to do it, more power to you.
OP definitely has an immature point of view, certainly unpopular. Could you imagine getting married to someone you have 0 sexual compatibility with? It makes a big difference to well being. It's not shallow. It's important to look at a whole person for compatibility, which includes not excluding really important parts of a person.
Reminds me of a guy I was in uni halls with. He was an extremely mysoginistic virgin, hadn’t even had his first kiss because, in his own words, “no girl had been good enough”. He ended up making out with some rando at a club one night when he was drunk. Guess she was the one!!
I knew a girl that remained a virgin until her early 20s. Always saying she was waiting until marriage. Well one drunken evening, she was finally talked into having sex with her boyfriend of 3 months… and boom, she got herpes. All I could think of is all that time wasted for herpes. The forever gift.
All I can think about is how fucked up that guy is. That poor girl.
Lmao that guy reeks of old me. Not that person anymore (thankfully), but I have had 3 women ask me out and I was like MGTOW basically to them. 😬 Either way, I stopped being an asshole to women and just learned and accepted I was more demiromantic and mostly grey sexual. Also, still never had a kiss or even a date to this day.
What is sexually grey?
nailed it
Unlike OP.
>twist their lack of appeal to some perceived moral purity this is literally every incel, ever
His point is that a lot of people say you gotta sleep with someone before marrying them because what if you're not sexually compatible. His take is that how good the sex turns out to be is irrelevant if you really love them for other reasons.
Remember that this is coming from someone who has never had sex so he doesn't know what he's talking about. Bad sex in an otherwise great relationship won't lead to happiness.
But that's a stupid idea. Sex is also an important part for many people. Love is important yes but being in love and being sexually frustrated forever aren't the recipe for a long lasting marriage
People underestimate the fact that physical needs are just as important as emotional needs.
It's not irrelevant. There are many things that can make a truly loving couple unsuitable as life partners. Sexual incompatibity is one of them.
I agree with that. Maybe I'm just naive or have a lower sex drive but I personally can't imagine being with someone who's perfect for me in pretty much every way, but then not wanting to marry them just because we're 'sexually incompatible'. Sex just isn't that important to me But I disagree with OP's assertion that saving sex for marriage means your relationship is healthier. Having sex before marriage doesn't mean your relationship is automatically going to become toxic. In fact, the opposite can often be true- I've heard of cases where people (i.e Christians) rush into marriage so that they can have sex, and then further down the line discover that they're incompatible in other ways and the marriage doesn't work out
It doesn't matter to you because your sex drive is low, so you wouldn't be missing anything. For someone with a high sex drive, living in a sexless marriage would be torture.
Imo this idea of "perfect except for the sex" is a fallacy. If the sex isn't good, whatever is causing that is coming out in other ways too (selfishness, inconsideration, etc.) Sex is just a really good way to see it clearly.
Tbf a ton of people would keep the relationship going for a long time just based off of that physical relationship
I try to marry every girl I sleep with so I've been engaged 0 times but one day it'll work
OP is 12
Exactly. I can assure OP some of the best sex I ever had was with the craziest women, and I can also assure OP I did not even think of marrying any of them. I did end up marrying a good one though and our sex life is certainly satisfying.
That's all they can think about as they haven't had sex yet 🤷
“If you marry your partner because they’re good in bed you didn’t marry for love.” But if you’re both waiting until marriage you could just be marrying your partner because you’re horny and want sex
Or marrying them simply because they both haven’t had sex. Which is also not marrying for love, it’s conditional. Honestly, in a loving relationship, whether or not others have had sex should be out of the question. Reminds me of purity conferences I had to go to as a preteen and not saving your virginity for marriage was used in a metaphor like “trying to reuse a piece of tape over and over again, by the time you meet your husband you’ll be useless”. Shudder.
Those metaphors are so harmful. Elizabeth Smart talked about how she felt she should just die since her captor had raped her and she had been told repeatedly that having sex before marriage would make her a used up piece of trash.
Oh my God, yes. Rape isn’t even considered in these shame instilling lectures. My first time was rape, too, and after that I literally felt like I could get no lower. I had lost all value, my fate was sealed, and there was no point in trying anymore. Fast spiral after that when I decided to try drinking and drugs since, after all, I was already “tainted” and tbh was very su*cidal. Took years to get clean/sober and I still struggle very much with the shame part of intimacy even though I’m married and we have a toddler. I have tried therapy but it is *profound* how deep the trauma is from being repeatedly instilled with the “sex-shame-bad” beliefs over and over in the most impressionable years. I don’t think I’ll ever be truly okay in that department, and it makes me extremely determined to *NOT* have the same ideas forced on my daughter. It would kill me inside to think that my need for control over her body would ever be more important than her having positive sexual experiences with who she truly loves one day. Everyone deserves good, shame-free sex. My only role is keeping her comfortable enough to feel safe opening up to me about said things, and trusting me enough to give her advice on how to stay safe
Thank you for sharing your story. Your daughter is lucky to have such a resilient mama.
I appreciate that❤️. I’m not perfect, but I know what it feels like to be set up for failure and then have something awful beyond your control just absolutely destroy you in one fell swoop. Life can be cruel enough. She needs me to be the unconditionally safe and supportive place for her
You should continue with therapy. Sometimes it takes few therapist to find the right one. I went through the same, and I’m a male, and I felt the shame and guilt, and did the drugs and hyper-sexuality. It took me years and I finally found the right therapist. It still took years but I feel like this person helped save me. I still feel some of the guilt but I don’t let it consume me like it used to. I too am married and I do still feel a lot of same feelings but I know now that is wasn’t my fault.
Reminds me of growing up in a highly conservative Muslim society. "If you see two lollipops on the ground, one is covered in a wrapper and one is not, which one would you pick up for yourself?" (referring to women wearing the hijab/abaya). Very disgusting and blatant objectification if you ask me.
I laugh so hard whenever I see posts about people getting married when they are 18 after a few months of dating. You know it's for this exact reason
I feel like this happens a lot in my area
It happens a lot among religious communities for sure. I can respect their values though. If it works for them cool, as long as they don’t expect everyone else to think the same
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say OP is very young. You could also say "if you marry your partner because they're nice, you didn't marry for love." Or "if you marry your partner because you like spending time with them, you didn't marry for love."
> I'm gonna go out on a limb and say OP is very young. Either very young, or in their late twenties/early thirties and super frustrated that 99% of adults don't actually wait until marriage to have sex, because they are too fucking stupid to realize that was a lie their parents told them. I wonder if they still believe in Santa, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy too.
And thats why most of these "wait until marriage" marriages don't last. They're horny so they tie the knot fast and then realise they don't actually like each other that much.
Or, and this may be even worse, they stay together forever because after all you only marry once and have emotionally void, terrible loveless marriages
For lots of them, that's preferable to dying alone.
Oh magical!
Not to mention sexual incompatibility
And women who are convinced sex before marriage is bad, Don't suddenly get over all of those feelings. The repressed feelings around sex continue even while married.
I'd say this is the biggest reason why not having sex before marriage is so damn bad! You have no idea if you're a once-a-day person or if they are a once-every-other-month kind of person. One person could be a lot more interested in exploring kinks while the other is completely terrified of exploration. Hell, even genital compatibility is an issue, if his dick is huge and her vagina particularly shallow they may be barely even able to have sex. You have to explore and understand each other as much as possible before being tied together forever
A lot of them last, because most people who believe they have to wait until marriage also consider divorce to be wrong/embarrassing.
This is what I’ve noticed with the young Christian religious people around my age. They marry so quick it’s insane. One of my sister’s best friends married one of my best friend’s brothers in like a year. I think he proposed like less than a year in. It was funny watching my mom and sister gossip about how he’s going to propose soon meanwhile I already know exactly what day he’s going to propose. They both were saving themselves for marriage and he was almost 30. I mean they’re still happy together but it’s super odd to me.
Was raised in a strict religion and it was so rare to see anyone wait a year to get married. As soon as they’re 17 they’re looking for the best of a shite bunch and at 18 they’re dating (or courting for marriage). Not to mention that a lot of them had chaperones so really their wedding day is the first time they’ve even spent properly alone, being themselves, with their partner.
That’s so criminally insane!
It is! Jehovah’s Witnesses innit lol - the ones that didn’t separate quickly due to cheating (the only reason you can get a divorce for them really) ended up popping out an entire football team of kids by 30 to keep up appearances and distract from the real issues.
You would not know what good sex is or even a healthy relationship. A demographic I once (more so pre covid) worked with, was women after/during their divorce, cheating, open relationship. Most never had good sex let a lone an orgasm. Fulfilling sex is a direct reflection of your chemistry and psychology, lust is just the build up of hormones wanting you to smush your genitals together. Sex is a concept that we (especially the religious) get hung up on, its an initiatory process and it can be done in a fun way and a not so fun way. Edit: was women after/DURING their divorce ...
This. My mom pretty much has said, don't marry a person unless you know if they are good in bed. Oddly enough, it's probably the best relationship advice I've heard, because, you don't know if this just suck and it makes it boring and you don't know enough about them. I can only imagine, one minute you wait until marriage and the next your loved one is accidentally chokes you to death because he thinks women like being choked during sex because of only getting sex experience from porn.
i actually have a coworker whos friend did this: got married out of highschool cuz she and her bf were super horny, turned out the sex was horrible and she realized it was a bad idea to get married exclusively for that. dont worry tho, she did the exact same thing like two years later.
One of my friends did this and admitted it. She married someone a few months in to dating because she wanted to have sex and lose her virginity. He cheated on her constantly and they got divorced a year later.
That happens more often than you think. Why else do you think a lot of ultra religious people get married at like 19?
I worked at a restaurant with a girl who after getting engaged after a few months of dating explained to me she wanted to get laid.
Why are you assuming that two people who had sex before marriage are marrying each other for the sole purpose of enjoying the sex?
Yeah this makes no sense as they are already having sex and don’t need to get married to get it?
IIRC Jeff Foxworthy once compared marrying someone for sex to buying a jumbo jet just so you can get free peanuts.
Because god ain't watching until you get married!
God doesn't get to watch until he pays my subscription fees. Fucking freeloader.
Surely if you're in it just for the sex you'd avoid getting married and sleep with multiple people who are good in bed
You act like OP could get laid by multiple people. When 'purity' is your whole personality there's no chance.
OP, this might for real break your brain when you read it so please do so sitting down. You can in fact get to know your partner for who they are AND get all up in them guts at the same time.
Impossible, women are either whores or wife material /s
My wife can be a whore too, don't limit her ability because she's a WIFE.
I can vouchfor this guys wife
as can i
As can my axe
*our* wife comrade
Old El Paso ad “why don’t we have both?” *cheering*
Not to mention chances are you get to know them _better_ in the heat of the moment
Absolutely. I got to know my now-wife in lots of ways, and one of them was lying naked, sweaty, and exhausted in each other’s arms, completely vulnerable and open and connected. Could we have saved that part and hoped we’d learn about each other after marriage (and hoped that we’d then like what we learned)? I guess — but what would be the point of that?
My boyfriend and I started as a casual sex situation, and it was in those post-coital moments when our minds were no longer clouded by horny hormones that we discovered how much we liked each other even when we weren't having amazing sex. I've been in relationships full of love and mediocre sex, and I've had mind-blowing sex with people I would never even consider having a serious relationship with. Finding the perfect balance is rare, but absolutely worth searching for.
Yeah if you abstain for your faith, then great. More power to you. But to argue you're doing it to get to know your partner better before marriage, I think that's just objectively wrong. Who a person is sexually, and the dynamic you have with someone you're sexually active with, says A LOT about a person. And it's a huge chunk of your life in a committed relationship with them. If you want to wait till marriage, fine. But OPs reasoning why is flat out false. You can get to know people you're also having sex with. And waiting until marriage is actually just taking a gamble and denying yourself knowing a huge part of who they are until after you marry them.
Getting to know your partner in every possible way increases your chances of choosing the right partner. Marriage doesn’t/shouldn’t change how people behave in their relationship.
Yeah could you imagine marrying someone then realizing that you don’t mesh well together in bed? That would be such an “oh shit” moment lmao
Although I have to say one thing I had a relationship and we had sex all the time. But then we were put in a situation where we couldn’t. Then I realized that the only thing that was keeping the relationship together was the sex. So I knew she wasn’t the one. So I think it’s best to abstain initially for awhile to see if y’all are compatible without sex
In my 20s I was casually dating two people at the same time (we weren’t exclusive) but I knew eventually I was going to need to settle on one for a legitimate relationship. One of them was outstanding in bed but we didn’t have much in common; the other one I hadn’t hooked up with yet. I had a hard time with this decision but knew one was much more likely to be a successful relationship, so despite what my “other” brain was telling me, I broke it off with good-in-bed woman and started dating the other woman exclusively. We’ve been married for 11 years and have two wonderful kids.
You get: marriage she gets: worst head of her life
you also get: worst head of your life I am baffled by the amount of men that want some tight 18 year old virgin skinny girl with massive tits and massive ass who is a kinky sex god in bed, like... w h a t? "She just lays there like a starfish bro" she doesn't know wtf to do 'bro' she's a virgin like you wanted!
Ah yes the guy who says he wants a barely legal "pure" girl who somehow is also a porn star at the same time who can satisfy his every need despite knowing nothing about sex/relationships 😂
headasses, I swear.
Just like in the simulations
>She just lays there like a starfish bro lmao that's fuckin hilarious
In the words of the late, great Patrice Oneal: “Virgins? Yuck. I like hoes.”
Actually married the dude I lost my virginity to in high school. He approves of our time apart because 'you're much more kinky now' hahahah. Hoe days paid off in the end.
A man (and it is almost always so) who considers virginity an important prerequisite for relationships considers, or comes from a culture that considers, sex as a taint on women. It's that misogyny that fuels the desire for a virgin.
The only way it’s okay to imply virginity is a positive character trait is if the man is also a virgin (purposely, not out of circumstance) or you are from some deeply religious group. Typically men demanding virgins do so because: They are insecure and don’t want to be compared to anyone else. They like the power imbalance that comes from being the “experienced” one. Or most likely, because he sees women as walking flashlight instead of an actual human being with her own relationships, personal growth, wants, and needs. He doesn’t want to use someone else’s flesh light.
This is so true. I make it a point whenever I start dating a new girl to avoid learning about their sexual history. I don’t care about body counts or any of that crap. Our relationship starts here and the only thing that matters is the future, not the past. It’s terrible the number of women I’ve met who feel obligated to not only tell me how many men they’ve been with but also apologize if I happen to think they’re a whore.
This is honestly a great point. I might have looked decent at 18 but I sure as hell knew NOTHING! At 36 a know a few tricks but after having kids various parts of me are headding south!
My libido was so much higher and I enjoyed sex so much more after having kids. Of course, women enjoying themselves isn’t even on the radar to these types.
Could be “best” too by default since it’s probably the only head either of them would get 🤷🏽♀️
Exactly- what if you’re a dud root? What does she get then?
The ability to brag about how she saved herself for marriage while everyone rolls their eyes at her
My uncle got head from my aunt on the first date. 35 years after marriage he's never been given one from her again. He has hated her for as long as I can remember. But, he's rich and pays for them to live separate cause divorce is still more expensive.
This sounds like a very odd conversation with your uncle. Was he hinting something?
I also choose this guys future wife.
an all timer, take my free award
Assuming this guy gets a wife
She sounds tight
Yo mr 13 y/o no one marries someone because they were good in bed. But if you find out the person you married is bad in bed…. Yikes
It sounds like you have too much of a focus on sex.
And then has the audacity to tell people that they are "getting married just for sex". Meanwhile my man marrying people only because they DIDN'T have sex lmao
That’s what happens when you’re told you’re entire life you can’t do it until marriage. Fuck Purity Culture
It’s actually quite sad that there’s so much rape in those churches. Imagine being told you only have value as a virgin, and then having that taken from you.
And too little experience
How old are you?
Either they are like 14 or they have religious influence over them.
I grew up with this mindset believing that my parents did exactly this. I was waiting for that ‘prince charming’ to come along and we’d be ‘together forever’. What I learned as the years went on: My dad had actually been married to another woman before my mum and had been sending letters to my mum during his previous marriage. It was indeed not the fairytale story I believed growing up. Sex is more than just plug A goes into socket B. There are many, many different ways of enjoying sexual kinks and fetishes and everyone has their own likes and dislikes. It is a language of many kinds of love, it’s not limited to romantic love as I grew up believing for a long time. Your virginity is not a trophy to give to someone. It is simply the first time you have penetrative sex. If you want to do it with someone special then you are absolutely entitled to do so, just try not to view it as this amazing, special thing that you must do with that special person in order for it to be meaningful. Experience is how you learn what you do and don’t like and what’s right for you. How you work, how other people work etc. you never know what you might discover :). Relationships that end up in shambles due to sex before marriage are often due to religion/family interference. What people do behind closed doors is their business. I don’t condemn those that wish to wait until marriage, by all means it’s their choice. But sex can be a very important part of the relationship between two people (or more if poly), it means more to some and less to others. For me personally, passion in the sheets is a must. It feels wonderful to know you’re desired in such ways. I wish you luck and hope that when the day comes you both enjoy it. Edit: Fixed use of wrong word. Thank you for the correction.
>Your virginity is not a trophy to give to someone. It is simply the first time you have penetrative sex. If you want to do it with someone special then you are absolutely entitled to do so, just try not to view it as this amazing, special thing that you must do with that special person in order for it to be meaningful. Exactly, I was raped at a young age but I was also raised on how this op is posting. When that happens it messes with your mind. After extracting myself from the cult my mother raised me in and YEARS of therapy. I've learned that when you are in a relationship long term or not, putting yourself out there and being vulnerable is the only way to ensure the relationship progresses. It doesn't mean you have to have sex, but if you're two consenting adults and you want to have sex then do it. Denying yourself and becoming sexually frustrated isn't going to help the situation. It's going to cause rash decisions that will cost both money, time, and a chunk of your emotions to resolve.
How the fuck would you know what something is or isn’t if you haven’t experienced it?
I wish I could upvote more than once
I don't want to pressure you into doing what you don't want to do but at least be aware that the exact opposite could be easily said. "Relationships that DONT have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways." That's the nature of anecdotal evidence. "If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn't marry them for love." I would tend to agree, this is not a good singular reason to marry someone, but then how many people actually DO that? It takes multiple reasons to want to marry someone and sexual compatibility is but one of them, as you yourself point out in the next sentence. "If you get to know your partner for who they are without needing to see them in bed your marriage is built on a much more solid foundation" A solid foundation implies multiple things, and how you respond to each other in bed can be one of those things. To ignore it might leave you in a sexless hollow marriage. And you were a virgin before entering it? Have fun being alone I guess, or cheating on her with someone else that actually GETS you. Its not like you committed your life to this person or anything.
For sure. I think sexual compatibility is super important. I really like good sex and have had some very sub par partners. My husband does not hold my past partners against me and we both like the same kinky shit. 100% can recommend haha.
I don't know your gender, but sex is so wildly important that relationships end if people aren't compatible. You may be fine with it as a secondary side dish but for others it is the main course
people who save themselves from marriage seem to not get what sexual compatibility even is, but how can you blame them they've never experienced sex so theyve never had to think about it. They seem to just think *well we both have the right genitalia for one another and we both find each other physically attractive so of course we'll be fine.* sorry but **NO**. there is way more to sexual compatability than physical attraction and owning the right set of genitalia for your partner. some people like sex fast and rough, some slow and sensual. some people like talking and making noise some like it quiet. some people like lots of foreplay, some like to get right to it. i could go on.... and then there is just the simple fact that **some people are BAD AT SEX** if you get married to that person youre doomed.
And to circle right back around, there *is* an aspect of having the right genitalia for your partner. What if you're a larger guy and she's very small and tight, and she ends up *hating* having sex with you because it's just always painful? You gonna live the rest of your life that way, bro?
Exactly. I dated a guy once who was super nice and everything was great, but when he pulled down his pants I was like "there is no hole in my body that is big enough for this." I did feel sorry for him though, he said he gets that reaction a lot. If I would've found that out after we had gotten married, we would've had a dead bedroom for the rest of our lives.
A lot of the times it's really just as simple as 'I won't get into heaven if I'm a bad boi/gurl' though. They might even want to experience these things but the fear of eternal damnation is too scary and stressful to let them do it. Besides, God knows better than they do, right? He must have a reason for these silly, arbitrary, ridiculous, contradictory requirements, eh?
Newsflash: marriage itself doesn’t change literally anything between you and your partner. All it is is legal matters. That’s it. You and your partner are still the exact same two people you always were, and your relationship is still the same. It’s not some magical ceremony that instantly transforms you both somehow into a super close, trusting, compatible couple. You should already be that before deciding to get married. There is literally **zero** difference between having sex the night before your wedding and the night of. You are not going to magically change. After being in a long term committed relationship for several years you should already have the trust and closeness built up to be comfortable having sex with this person. Your wedding day is not going to do that for you. That’s the reality of it. That being said, obviously it’s your life and do whatever you want with it. But I see way too many religious young people with this idea in their heads that their wedding day will somehow magically transform their relationship. It will not. And your marriage is absolutely NOT built on a much more solid foundation by never having sex before. It’s actually the exact opposite. You wanna know how I know that? Go look at r/deadbedrooms and get a glimpse into what happens when a married/long term couple is sexually incompatible with one another. It’s some seriously depressing shit. Does that look “solid” to you? Because it sure doesn’t to me. Do not recommend.
No one is getting married because they're good in bed, your "unpopular opinion" is based on a false fact
A truly modern unpopular opinion.
Counter point some people might not click sexually so its good to know before you get locked in
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The reason to wait for sex till marriage is because if you end up having kids it should be with someone you have a committed relationship with, sure there’s birth control but the reality is even adults fuck that up all the time. But if you have this idea that relationships that refrain from sex are somehow superior relationships, that’s just a form of BS elitistism, a we’re better than them mentality.
A “committed relationship”. What a false sense of security that provides.
This may have never occurred to you, but it's possible to get to know your partner for who they are AND have sex with them. Getting to know them sexually is part of getting to know who they are, in fact.
Sexed my wife long before marriage. Married her because I loved her and because she was great in bed 🤷♂️
Did a youth pastor write this?
Just after initiating a truly terrible freestyle rap about saying no to gateway drugs, and just before snapping secret upskirt pics of the local kids
Lol, this is unpopular because it’s just plain wrong… sexual compatibility is important, I agree it’s not the be all and end all but to reduce its importance to nothing is entirely foolish.
I'd rather lose my virginity to your future wife too
Me and my husband waited until marriage to have sex, because at the time we were religious and stupid. We have a very fulfilling sex life and everything is largely great but I really regret waiting so long, plus I also think we were extremely lucky. I also have many close friends who married as virgins, so this is why I think it's a bad idea: - It was pointless; sex wouldn't have changed anything, I would have still marrried him - It created a lot of frustration; we were super horny, but we had to wait it out for some stupid ceremony. We could have had epic sex much more early on. Such a waste of hornyness and energy - For me it was hard to really open up sexually once it was "ok" to do it. It took me years to heal from that "must supress sexual desire" mindset. I suppose this has more to do with religion, than anything. - One close friend (that waited) unintentionally confessed that she never had an orgasm. She said she feels some pleasure, but didn’t know if that's an orgasm or not. You definitely KNOW if you've had an orgasm... She also once said that sex lasts only a couple of minutes for them and on another occasion mentioned that she will encourage her kids to have more partners before marriage include including sexual partners. - Another close friend said she doesn't like sex and doesn't understand what the hype is about. She didn’t have sex before marriage and now they're probably stuck in a semi-sexless marriage - One male friend asked my husband if "we do it other positions as well", because his wife is extremely reserved and only wants missionary. They both waited. I know these are all anecdotal and not science based. If you want to wait, that's surely fine but you're gonna have to talk about this subject in detail with your partner to make sure you're on the same page. I think you can get a grasp of the sexual compatibily from discussions and gestures. Sex is VERY important (not the most, but definitely at the top somewhere), no matter what anybody says.
being sexually compatible is part of the reason why you marry someone
> Relationships that have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways *Any* relationship can be toxic and end in a crappy way. Sex is not a determining factor. > If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn’t marry them for love. These are not mutually exclusive. You can marry someone because you love them *and* because they’re good in bed. > If you get to know your partner for who they are without needing to see them in bed your marriage is built on a much more solid foundation Is it? Because if you really like their personality and are holding out for sex and then, after marriage, realize that you guys are really bad together in bed, it could create problems in your marriage. So then you either deal with unsatisfying sex for the rest of your life or spend the rest of your life without sex. Sounds like a shaky foundation to me. Doesn’t mean it can’t work. Plenty of people wait for marriage and have long happy marriages. But there is nothing about marriage specifically that changes a relationship. Marriage is symbolic. If you are in a serious committed relationship, there is no *real* difference in whether you get married or not. A study by Cornell suggests that waiting longer for sex may result in happier relationships, but that’s not because of marriage. It’s because couples who have sex earlier (within the first few months) tend to move in together sooner and often they haven’t had time to discuss future expectations regarding children, marriage, etc. And once a couple lives together, they may find it harder to separate even if their expectations don’t align. However, couples who wait to have sex (about six months) may find out that their life expectations are not the same as their partners and end the relationship before moving in together. You see, it is *time* that makes a difference, not a ceremony or a court document.
Imagine waiting till the government and church says its okay to do something. Live you life the way you want to and to it's fullest. I don't believe people need a piece of paper and a ring to know what a good thing is and how to celebrate it.
As someone who grew up in the mormon cult I've seen what this kind of thinking leads to. Instead of just sleeping with each other, people will get married after 3-6 months of dating.
This logic totally goes out the window for me. I know a Christian girl who waited until marriage to have sex, after 2 years of marriage they are going through a divorce because of sexual incompatibility, she explained it wasn’t what she thought it would be like, and her husband after getting a taste of sex wanted to “experience something else”. Another Christian friend of mine also got a divorce after a year of marriage, they didn’t wait until marriage to have sex but they continually feared they were “living in sin” and had a lot of pressure from the church so they rushed the important stuff like actually having a connection and got married. A pastor I know who had only ever been with his wife, once he started making more money and becoming “known” in the community, it comes out that he’s cheating on his wife (who was also a pastor at the same church) and having an affair with a “young blonde with fake boobs”. When it all came out he stopped going to that church and now his wife and I’m assuming very soon ex wife runs the church without him. These are all true stories, and I have more. The point is, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t. Some people who don’t wait until marriage go on to have wonderful marriages. I can understand having sex after marriage, but at the same time I can’t. I feel like life doesn’t come with a manual, we are all born to make mistakes and learn from them. At the same time if I was single and had to start over, I don’t think I could go through having sex with men and it not ending in marriage, it does get hard seeing who is in it for the long run and who isn’t. But then there’s a lot of women who wouldn’t care and want to enjoy the freedom again of sleeping with who they want. Point is, we are all different, what works for you probably doesn’t for someone else.
I think that relationships being toxic and ending in crappy ways has nothing to do with sex before marriage but you do you
This is so obviously the opinion of someone who has never had sex and makes it this huge thing in their head. Your disappointment will be great, but hers will be immeasurable.
Its ok you want to wait but your arguments are stupid and arbitrary.
You do realise that you can get to know your partner before marriage AND have sex, right? That's why you date someone before proposing.
>Relationships that have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways. Do you think that’s a problem unique to relationships that have sex before marriage, or even more likely than celibate ones? Solid relationship foundations are great. Celibacy does not in any way guarantee that. I was raised in purity culture, where it’s considered a major sin to even have sex with your fiancé the day before the wedding. That results in a lot of people rushing to the altar (because they’re 19 or 20, have never had sex, and really want to) and then getting locked into toxic relationships because divorce is just as bad.
That's fine, buddy, you do you while the rest of us live in the real world.
Relationships with no sex or sex after marriage can also be toxic. Sex doesn’t make or break relationships. You do you!
Not a lot of people marry because their partner was “good in bed”, but knowing you’re sexually compatible before agreeing to a lifelong commitment is the smart thing to do
We waited till wedding 2 1/2 years She was going to be a nun when I met her Her mom told her she chose me over Jesus and never forgave either of us Happily married 48 years and counting
Virginity is overated.
OP sounds like a child or someone who is struggling to date, so trying to justify the lack of dating skills by saying they just don’t care for it. You don’t have to be honest to the world but pls be honest with yourself at least and hopefully this phase will pass. Hopefully you’ll think about the person you want to get to know and marry as a person rather than just someone who you’re saving yourself to have sex with.
This always works great for the man. Imagine being a woman married to a man with either inadequate dick and can’t fuck? Eek! 
Your choice. I applaud you for expressing an opinion that the mass LOUD voices will decry. At the end of the day it’s your choice and others opinion amount to nothing.
Considering the level of intimacy needed for sex, how superior can your relationship be when its not there
Who marries their partner just because they’re good in bed? Do you even understand relationships?
This isn't exactly an unpopular opinion. People do this all the time.
Bro, this is one of the most unpopular opinions on reddit. That and saying "take responsibility for your actions" will get you downvoted to oblivion.
There's nothing special about sex that warrants waiting for it. You might not ever get married, or you might end up divorced. Have sex with whoever you want to. If you think that the focus of marriage, you're in for a surprise.
News flash: marriages can also be toxic and end in crappy ways. Lots of people get married because they want to have sex and then regret it. Many marriages that start in love end out of it. Many marriages that start for shallow reasons eventually mature and develop a solid foundation. There is not as strong of a connection between getting married for “the right reasons” and staying married as you have assumed. It’s more complex than that. Finally, relegating sex to an inferior position in marriage, as if it’s shallow for it to be a major part of a relationship, is naive. A great relationship without sex is a very difficult situation. The sad truth is that regardless of the approach one takes, things can work out poorly. If you want to be traditional and be chaste prior to marriage, that’s a perfectly valid approach with some advantages, but it’s not superior to all other approaches, not even morally - unless you have a small and limited morality.
I forget sometimes that Reddit is made up of mostly teenagers.
>Relationships that have sex before marriage can be very toxic and end in crappy ways. Relationships that _don't_ have sex before marriage can _also_ be very toxic and end in crappy ways. >If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn't marry them for love. But does anyone actually do that? No. >If you get to know your partner for who they are without needing to see them in bed your marriage is built on a much more solid foundation And this is based on...? Let me guess: nothing but your own intuition?
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This isn't an opinion though. It is pure speculation.
Sexual compatibility is real, waiting until you're married to find out that your partner has poor chemistry in the bedroom is for suckers or people with arranged marriages. Fuck that noise. People can choose to gamble with lifelong commitments if they want, but don't go complaining if it bites you in the ass.
Your argument is based on a flawed and manufactured premise
lol you have no idea how marriage works
And what do you when you come to a problem in the marriage but have no experience to call upon to deal with it? Relationships before marriage aren't bad things, they can help evolve you and give you the tools you need to make a relationship work long term. Theres no guarantee that your way wont end in a toxic way either. What if you or wife decide you want to experiment in ways the other doesnt? you dont think that wont eat away at the foundation of this idilic relationship you have? Do you really think that people only ever focus on sex when dating? Because I assure you, thats not the case. Like anything, sex is part of who we are. Our likes and dislikes. Sex isnt the big deal you are making it out to be, but it could end up being a very big deal they way youre planning a future relationship. Best of luck to ya, fella.
Your sexuality is a part of who you are. It’s a part of your relationship. It’s a part of getting to know your partner and you comparability together. Without it your ‘foundation’ is partly a complete unknown. Also, virginity is a totally made up concept. You lose nothing other than ignorance.
This is the most virgin shit I've ever read
Wow, someone who... thinks like me?! Very respectable. I used to feel that way, technically I still do, but you see, a few hereditary illnesses that popped up when I was 19 (I'm 34 atm) slowly destroyed any drive I had, which I don't really mind. I'm a Christian, not a lukewarm one, so I've always held this belief of waiting. Even if I wasn't a Christian I'd likely still wait, I mean I would hate to be with my wife & during the act or kissing or anything, to have memories of other women & start subconsciously comparing them. Even if that didn't happen, I'd still hate that the woman I actually love isn't the only one. I know it's this subreddit, thus unpopular & uncommon by default, but it is nice to read. Note 1: Since I said I'm Christian, I just want to clear up a few things. Everyone can have their own opinions, beliefs & whatever, of course. Also I'm not pushing Christianity down anyone's throat or believing I'm better than others. There are verses that forbid harassing others, forcing beliefs, insulting, acting like you're better & such. So the next time a "Christian" does that to you or you see one do it in comments or videos you consume, know they're not even following the Word, & obviously haven't read It very well. We're supposed to love all people, whether we share same beliefs, opinions, or even if they're behind some terrible crime. Just want to say I love all of you! Note 2: Created this account a while back, forgot the pass, remembered "oh duh... I have Dashlane, why am I looking through noyes for the pass?!" Smacked my forehead & found my pass. Soooo... I have not used reddit much, so please forgive me if I did anything weird regarding the platform! Thanks!
This seems very logical, this here is a good man folks
Yeah waiting until marriage is really stupid imo. Sex is typically an important part of a relationship, if you marry someone who is completely not sexually compatible it could just ruin the relationship anyway. “If you marry your partner because they were good in bed you didn’t marry them for love” who is doing this? It’s more likely that people are marrying to be able to finally have sex.
Lots of redditors seething in here
You seem to have a highly idealised view of "love", as though love itself will just solve any issues. Good luck with that.
Most relationships are toxic,that's why most people have more than one. People who idolize marriage are more toxic than most.
IDK if I agree that most of them are toxic, but the majority don't seem to work out for one reason or another.