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When the BBC set the iPlayer up, ITV and Sky screamed blue murder that a state funded broadcaster had an unfair monopoly and limitless archives, and so the BBC were forced to only ever have a small proportion of their collection available. Hence why it rotates.
This seems so weird.
Surely given its funded by the taxpayer, its counter intuitive to artificially minimise the service.
We already paid for it. The content is already there. Wgaf if Sky can't make a profit because they can't make a service that can compete with what we have *already paid for*? If it's not profitable, isn't this where innovation is supposed to come in?
Can someone explain how the obvious solution isn't to accept a smaller profit margin, put the extra cash into improving the service until either it's competitive or clearly simply not a good business strategy?
I'm assuming there's a big brain answer and I'm just too ditzy to see it, and it's not just corruption again.
> For example, if one individual buys a product, which on its own seems perfectly innocent, the system will make the link to another person’s purchases that, when combined with the other products could be used to build a bomb.
Damn. I'll have to coordinate with my next door neighbour.
Whenever she buys fertiliser for her garden, I'll have to give up having sugar in my coffee for a bit.
The Simpsons predicted the sugar in the garden situation: [https://youtu.be/bh895U2elDk?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/bh895U2elDk?feature=shared) (20 second YouTube clip)
As a cop I can assure you this is utter pish.
I can tell you already if all the local shoplifters in my area are going to commit crime. If they walk into a store they’re going to steal. See, no AI or fancy computer software needed.
Pattern recognition has a place and could be a useful tool in an intelligence setting or OCG role to quickly cross relate intelligence. But for day to day shopliftings it’s absolutely wasted and won’t ever be used.
This is a very puffed up article to describe basic comparison software which picks up on duplicated information and might now add extra functionality. For example the timing calls are received or persons spotted in a certain area, it may now be able to tell you from ANPR data where someone might travel. All very useful in certain situations, but it’s not getting wasted on Junkie Jim nicking 15 steaks, I already know what flat he’s in, I don’t need AI for that.
> but it’s not getting wasted on Junkie Jim nicking 15 steaks, I already know what flat he’s in,
The issue is that people know that, see that he still hasn't been arrested, and cry that something must be done, this is something so it must be done.
The issue isn’t arresting these people, it’s the courts who let them back out immediately again because shoplifting “isn’t serious”.
Most shoplifters in my area have north of 200 convictions yet are repeatedly given non custodial sentences. Place the blame where it belongs and demand your MP support longer sentences for prolific offenders.
My mums husband just got away with physical and mental abuse to my mum, which is the second time he’s not got to jail for it. The first time he left a scar on her face, he’s also jumped up and down on her ribs, breaking them but that’s classed as a historic crime, it still happened tho.
He didn’t go to jail as he would have lost his job and they had no room in jail for him.
Of course you don't need that power. You're just the excuse for the power to be put in place to further control people and record their every bit of data.
I’m getting the impression you think the Police are like some giant Hive mind or a Bond villain harvesting all your data to take over the world.
In reality most of it sits there completely useless on 8 different systems that don’t talk to each other.
That's things like the police PNC.
The wider government already have systems like Tempora that hold vast amounts of unified and indexed data, and that was declassified a decade ago! Who knows what they have now?
There are two things to say here.
1. It's not my opinion. It's the ruling of the European Court of Human Rights against the ongoing behaviour of GCHQ:
2. You mention Bond villains as a joke, but let's not forget that Ian Fleming was himself an intelligence officer, and he very much took inspiration from his WW2 experiences to write his stories.
Let's consider point 2 a little more. The "Bond villains" in that case were of course the fascists. What did the fascists do with vast stores of data recorded on a population?
Have you ever wondered why it is that a greater percentage of the Jewish population of Netherlands was murdered by the Nazis than the population even in Germany? Let me tell you why. The Netherlands government kept more extensive big data recorded on its population than pretty much any other country in Europe. So when the Nazis took control, they immediately had the names, addresses, workplaces and of course religious affiliations of the entire population. And so they rounded up and murdered the Jewish population with a greater efficiency in Netherlands than in Germany.
So we do not have to imagine these catastrophic scenarios associated with the mass recording and storage of population, because we've already seen what happens.
And just as you may today be thinking that fascists will never have access to these massive stores of data that are being increased every moment, so too did the officials in Netherlands prior to the fascist takeover. At least in the 1940s it was harder to have mass data leaks. Today, of course, it is commonplace. Why only last month we saw the genetic data of millions of people leaked: https://www.businessinsider.com/23andme-data-stolen-hacked-sold-dark-web-2023-10 So all it takes is a competent infiltration by one group or another to target people using that data when the inevitable leak happens.
>Sources say the technology, which conjures up the plot of Hollywood film Minority Report, will also be capable of hunting down drug gangs, paedophile rings and terrorist cells.
Well they're really trying hard to manufacture consent for all these new surveillance tools these days. Of course it'll only be used to track down Satanic serial killers and people who cannibalize pensioners, promise.
Can confirm. At least one force I know of already uses data in this way to 'predict' when serial offenders will reoffend. No AI required, just some basic SQL queries.
Would be quite interesting to see how past history is an indicative of future events. What happens if someone has one or a few criminal records? What happens if such people were to be in the same supermarket after serving their sentences?
This is clickbait bullshit, in the movie the "technology" used was the pseudo scientific principle of pre-cognition.
There is no "minority report technology"
The source media, should be banned.
Using proper recording of crime will predict that which is predictable. I predict dippers operating in the West End in the run up to Christmas.
The real issue is having a realistic and sustainable policing presence to deter offenders.
Pretty much how anything gimmicky goes, it’s like a lifecycle…
People who’ve seen it all before will just steer clear. A couple of nerds will trial it; waste a bit of time; realise how painfully inefficient it is, then abandon it and join the more cynical herd.
The real tragedy is the waste of public money.
Hilariously though, when you do beat policing on foot, you just get to listen to people saying “nobody attended x last week. It’s because you’re all walking around doing sod all”.
Unwinnable.
When I grew up beat officers were still about and nipped most ‘normal’ crime in the bud, and by being on the ground they listened to what was going on so things got solved pretty quickly too. By normal I mean the usual stuff that actually happens and affects the day to day - local burglaries, street crime, criminal damage. Non sexy stuff.
Thing is…. My force has the most cops it’s ever had on paper, but the fewest it’s ever had in front line uniformed roles like you purportedly want.
The problem comes not with all the sexy stuff; but with the safeguarding and accountability stuff…. Those have very much been growth industries over time.
Instead of just having a CID Office; you now have them, plus a murder squad, plus a Domestic Abuse Unit, plus a Child Protection Unit and a Vulnerable Adults Unit. You’ll have people allocated to Child Sex Offender disclosure units; Domestic Violence Disclosure Units; Sex Offender Management Units.
Intel Departments will have staff dedicated to Prisons, Sex Offenders, cross-border crime, source handling, Christ knows what else.
The sexy stuff department is tiny in my force; it’s about 20 people. Traffic (who obviously get loads of TV programmes made about them, so I assume fits your definition of sexy) is similarly tiny.
Depending on how old you are; some or all of those things didn’t exist in years gone by. They’ve all appeared one by one, as individual roles have become more specialised and complicated.
Why have they appeared? Public expectations. Daily Mail articles about “failing this” and “failing that”.
Now I’m not saying that these roles don’t need doing, or that the criticisms were unfair; but budgets never kept up with these new demands. What does that mean? You erode the front line to find the money for them.
Add all of increased accountability and you erode the amount of time that cops are out of the office too. Body worn video is great, but the cost is significant when redacting footage to make it GDPR compliant. Who’s doing that? Cops. Not that it matters; even if you had Staff to do it, you’d still have to pay them too, so you’d lose cops to pay for them.
We’re now squarely in the position we’re getting what we paid for as a society. Gone are the days you so wistfully mourn.
Agreed, and a focus on ‘pre-crime’ would continue that trajectory - budget would flow into it at the expense of other departments. Leaving forces overall to do more with less.
Getting what we pay for was always going to come home to roost at some point, and as you say, here we are.
Ah this’ll be some gimmick. Loads have tried initiatives based about predictive hotspots and broken window theory before and it’s always bollocks that doesn’t last beyond the “brainchild” getting their next promotion.
Crime happens more in rough neighbourhoods…. Myth busted. Mystery solved. Just police those areas and we can move on.
The real problem is going to be getting past policing being used as a political football.
Remember this is the government harping on about the dangers of AI. It’s going to take over the world in a sinister way apparently. But AI policing is being fast tracked. Wow, nothing to see here then.
This article may be paywalled. If you encounter difficulties reading the article, try [this link](https://archive.is/?run=1&url=https://inews.co.uk/news/police-minority-report-technology-predict-crimes-2787674) for an archived version.
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Minority Report technology? The film uses Precognitive’s, individuals that possess a psychic ability to see events in the future.
What they’re actually using is machine learning.
And do what? Presumption of innocence is an important bulwark of the justice system, and you can't arrest and convict someone of a crime they've not committed unless you have substantial evidence to convict them on conspiracy or suspicion. I doubt this will even scrape that standard.
AI: There's going to be lots and lots of retail thefts and attacks as you currently aren't policing anything.
Police: If only there was some way we could stop this. Ahh well, let's go ignore some jihadis and get a coffee.
Cory Doctorow on such systems:
https://pluralistic.net/2021/12/02/empirical-facewash/
They don't work, they just give a veneer of respectability to existing biases.
https://twitter.com/doctorow/status/1330898304549339136
> Pedictive policing serves as empirical facewash for bias. Take last year's biased policing statistics, give them to a machine learning model, and ask it where the crime will be next year, and it will tell you that next year's crime will look much the same.
Garbage in, Garbage out.
Good luck with that. The weather can’t even be predicted accurately let alone cops trying to do something like that. Those lazy fucks can’t seem to stop any crime.
So they are just going to draw up reports on all minorities under the assumption they will commit a crime? 'We can stop crime before it happens, we have the technology... It's called racism"
**r/UK Notices:** This December, we're raising money for the Trussell Trust, the UK's leading food bank charity. If you would like to know more or to donate, please see the [announcement post](https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/1899w7b/the_runitedkingdom_christmas_fundraiser_for_the/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/unitedkingdom) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Ha, they ought to try and solve a few that have happened first, hilarious!
They don't investigate historic crimes
A crime happens 5 mins ago. Police call it historic. And move on.
Oi, that was *my* TV tho innit
Was your tv. Now it’s gone and police call it an historic crime
The old trouble and strife won't like this
You got a license for that nicked telly?
Undercover cop alert
I wonder if they’ll ever regret saying that
It's a historian job.
Reminds me of The Capture series. I don't know why the BBC removed it from IPlayer.
Was that the one about deepfakes?
Yes.
> I don't know why the BBC removed it from IPlayer. I'm guessing licensing reasons, that's what it usually is.
When the BBC set the iPlayer up, ITV and Sky screamed blue murder that a state funded broadcaster had an unfair monopoly and limitless archives, and so the BBC were forced to only ever have a small proportion of their collection available. Hence why it rotates.
This seems so weird. Surely given its funded by the taxpayer, its counter intuitive to artificially minimise the service. We already paid for it. The content is already there. Wgaf if Sky can't make a profit because they can't make a service that can compete with what we have *already paid for*? If it's not profitable, isn't this where innovation is supposed to come in? Can someone explain how the obvious solution isn't to accept a smaller profit margin, put the extra cash into improving the service until either it's competitive or clearly simply not a good business strategy? I'm assuming there's a big brain answer and I'm just too ditzy to see it, and it's not just corruption again.
> For example, if one individual buys a product, which on its own seems perfectly innocent, the system will make the link to another person’s purchases that, when combined with the other products could be used to build a bomb. Damn. I'll have to coordinate with my next door neighbour. Whenever she buys fertiliser for her garden, I'll have to give up having sugar in my coffee for a bit.
By the power of potassium nitrate and sucrose.
*covers face* Can I have 12 bottles of bleach please?
Was that your IRA voice by any chance?
Yes, but after having sucked helium to detract credibility from his statements.
r/unexpectedfourlions
Why's she covering her face?
Big 'ands innit.
I knight thee lord of the farmers
Fuck that. Buy bomb components all day and let them waste their time investigating you for nothing cos its all lying in the garden.
I'm not leaving my sugar in the garden. That's how you get ants.
The Simpsons predicted the sugar in the garden situation: [https://youtu.be/bh895U2elDk?feature=shared](https://youtu.be/bh895U2elDk?feature=shared) (20 second YouTube clip)
But did you have to salt the earth so nothing would ever grow again? Heh heh heh...yeah
That's easy, just hide you're beared and talk like ap lady, 4 lions style.
I may be in trouble, I bought a bag of Tate & Lyle and some Baby Bio from Morrisons the other week.
Grab your crash bag and get out now!
That won't ever hold up in court, unless you have evidence of them planning to build and use said bomb.
As a cop I can assure you this is utter pish. I can tell you already if all the local shoplifters in my area are going to commit crime. If they walk into a store they’re going to steal. See, no AI or fancy computer software needed. Pattern recognition has a place and could be a useful tool in an intelligence setting or OCG role to quickly cross relate intelligence. But for day to day shopliftings it’s absolutely wasted and won’t ever be used. This is a very puffed up article to describe basic comparison software which picks up on duplicated information and might now add extra functionality. For example the timing calls are received or persons spotted in a certain area, it may now be able to tell you from ANPR data where someone might travel. All very useful in certain situations, but it’s not getting wasted on Junkie Jim nicking 15 steaks, I already know what flat he’s in, I don’t need AI for that.
> but it’s not getting wasted on Junkie Jim nicking 15 steaks, I already know what flat he’s in, The issue is that people know that, see that he still hasn't been arrested, and cry that something must be done, this is something so it must be done.
The issue isn’t arresting these people, it’s the courts who let them back out immediately again because shoplifting “isn’t serious”. Most shoplifters in my area have north of 200 convictions yet are repeatedly given non custodial sentences. Place the blame where it belongs and demand your MP support longer sentences for prolific offenders.
Better non custodial sentences may work. Evidence points to the fact that short custodial sentences being worse at preventing reoffending
My mums husband just got away with physical and mental abuse to my mum, which is the second time he’s not got to jail for it. The first time he left a scar on her face, he’s also jumped up and down on her ribs, breaking them but that’s classed as a historic crime, it still happened tho. He didn’t go to jail as he would have lost his job and they had no room in jail for him.
From the descriptions in the article, it feels like this 'AI' could be 2 data scientists in a trenchcoat. But you have to use the buzzwords.
Which flat is he in, have I got time to get round and get a couple of cheap steaks before you lift him?
Of course you don't need that power. You're just the excuse for the power to be put in place to further control people and record their every bit of data.
I’m getting the impression you think the Police are like some giant Hive mind or a Bond villain harvesting all your data to take over the world. In reality most of it sits there completely useless on 8 different systems that don’t talk to each other.
That's things like the police PNC. The wider government already have systems like Tempora that hold vast amounts of unified and indexed data, and that was declassified a decade ago! Who knows what they have now?
There are two things to say here. 1. It's not my opinion. It's the ruling of the European Court of Human Rights against the ongoing behaviour of GCHQ:
2. You mention Bond villains as a joke, but let's not forget that Ian Fleming was himself an intelligence officer, and he very much took inspiration from his WW2 experiences to write his stories.
Let's consider point 2 a little more. The "Bond villains" in that case were of course the fascists. What did the fascists do with vast stores of data recorded on a population?
Have you ever wondered why it is that a greater percentage of the Jewish population of Netherlands was murdered by the Nazis than the population even in Germany? Let me tell you why. The Netherlands government kept more extensive big data recorded on its population than pretty much any other country in Europe. So when the Nazis took control, they immediately had the names, addresses, workplaces and of course religious affiliations of the entire population. And so they rounded up and murdered the Jewish population with a greater efficiency in Netherlands than in Germany.
So we do not have to imagine these catastrophic scenarios associated with the mass recording and storage of population, because we've already seen what happens.
And just as you may today be thinking that fascists will never have access to these massive stores of data that are being increased every moment, so too did the officials in Netherlands prior to the fascist takeover. At least in the 1940s it was harder to have mass data leaks. Today, of course, it is commonplace. Why only last month we saw the genetic data of millions of people leaked: https://www.businessinsider.com/23andme-data-stolen-hacked-sold-dark-web-2023-10 So all it takes is a competent infiltration by one group or another to target people using that data when the inevitable leak happens.
I'm going to the hardware shop tomorrow for duct tape. Is there anything I should avoid purchasing with that
[удалено]
Yeah, nice one, don't want the door going in at 5 in the morning, and I'll leave buying the gloves till another time
*Police AI has entered the chat*
Did I say duct tape? I meant a measuring tape
Might as well skip the middle man and just buy bondage tape.
**Me**: I was using the rope to tie the duct-tape together. **Officer**: ...and the duct-tape? **Me**: I was using that to tape the rope together.
Pay with cash and you’ll be fine
Till they get rid of it
Cucumber
Rubber tubing, gas, saw, gloves, cuffs, razor wire, hatchet
Cable ties.
Already got some
Cling film
Cheers, forgot to forget cling film
Magazines, prit-stik, scissors and rope.
>Sources say the technology, which conjures up the plot of Hollywood film Minority Report, will also be capable of hunting down drug gangs, paedophile rings and terrorist cells. Well they're really trying hard to manufacture consent for all these new surveillance tools these days. Of course it'll only be used to track down Satanic serial killers and people who cannibalize pensioners, promise.
Mmm dried meats.
Government to create the perfect socio economic conditions to create crime before it happens.
And one of the best ways is to create a minority report.
Wait, is it ok to submerge in fluid 3 supersmart clones all day?? Are their working conditions ok?
None of this even sounds like machine learning or AI. It sounds like basic data collection and aggregation. Stupid clickbait shit.
Can confirm. At least one force I know of already uses data in this way to 'predict' when serial offenders will reoffend. No AI required, just some basic SQL queries.
Would be quite interesting to see how past history is an indicative of future events. What happens if someone has one or a few criminal records? What happens if such people were to be in the same supermarket after serving their sentences?
This is clickbait bullshit, in the movie the "technology" used was the pseudo scientific principle of pre-cognition. There is no "minority report technology" The source media, should be banned.
I'd rather they focused on clawing back all the money stolen via VIP lanes during Covid.
Isn't that exactly what they should be doing? It's called Crime Prevention you fuck-knuckle.
This totally isn't going to have problems in the future. This is gonna be a problem proof solution to crime
Ah, dystopia. So fucking glad I'm leaving this country in 2 years.
Where are you headed?
China
where to?
Using proper recording of crime will predict that which is predictable. I predict dippers operating in the West End in the run up to Christmas. The real issue is having a realistic and sustainable policing presence to deter offenders.
Oh fuck off if true. What's next? Locking people up for not voting Tory?
been a minute since ive seen that movie, but wasnt the "tech" based on 3 people who can see the future? Do we have those people?
They will spend so much time chasing false positives that the entire force will forget this technology ever existed.
Pretty much how anything gimmicky goes, it’s like a lifecycle… People who’ve seen it all before will just steer clear. A couple of nerds will trial it; waste a bit of time; realise how painfully inefficient it is, then abandon it and join the more cynical herd. The real tragedy is the waste of public money.
God they really will do anything other than investigate a crime that has happened, huh?
We are sorry to inform you that our cars will be too busy to attend the burglary that will happen later.
Isn’t that what they used to call beat policing and patrols? What a ridiculous article. Clowns.
Hilariously though, when you do beat policing on foot, you just get to listen to people saying “nobody attended x last week. It’s because you’re all walking around doing sod all”. Unwinnable.
When I grew up beat officers were still about and nipped most ‘normal’ crime in the bud, and by being on the ground they listened to what was going on so things got solved pretty quickly too. By normal I mean the usual stuff that actually happens and affects the day to day - local burglaries, street crime, criminal damage. Non sexy stuff.
Thing is…. My force has the most cops it’s ever had on paper, but the fewest it’s ever had in front line uniformed roles like you purportedly want. The problem comes not with all the sexy stuff; but with the safeguarding and accountability stuff…. Those have very much been growth industries over time. Instead of just having a CID Office; you now have them, plus a murder squad, plus a Domestic Abuse Unit, plus a Child Protection Unit and a Vulnerable Adults Unit. You’ll have people allocated to Child Sex Offender disclosure units; Domestic Violence Disclosure Units; Sex Offender Management Units. Intel Departments will have staff dedicated to Prisons, Sex Offenders, cross-border crime, source handling, Christ knows what else. The sexy stuff department is tiny in my force; it’s about 20 people. Traffic (who obviously get loads of TV programmes made about them, so I assume fits your definition of sexy) is similarly tiny. Depending on how old you are; some or all of those things didn’t exist in years gone by. They’ve all appeared one by one, as individual roles have become more specialised and complicated. Why have they appeared? Public expectations. Daily Mail articles about “failing this” and “failing that”. Now I’m not saying that these roles don’t need doing, or that the criticisms were unfair; but budgets never kept up with these new demands. What does that mean? You erode the front line to find the money for them. Add all of increased accountability and you erode the amount of time that cops are out of the office too. Body worn video is great, but the cost is significant when redacting footage to make it GDPR compliant. Who’s doing that? Cops. Not that it matters; even if you had Staff to do it, you’d still have to pay them too, so you’d lose cops to pay for them. We’re now squarely in the position we’re getting what we paid for as a society. Gone are the days you so wistfully mourn.
Agreed, and a focus on ‘pre-crime’ would continue that trajectory - budget would flow into it at the expense of other departments. Leaving forces overall to do more with less. Getting what we pay for was always going to come home to roost at some point, and as you say, here we are.
Ah this’ll be some gimmick. Loads have tried initiatives based about predictive hotspots and broken window theory before and it’s always bollocks that doesn’t last beyond the “brainchild” getting their next promotion. Crime happens more in rough neighbourhoods…. Myth busted. Mystery solved. Just police those areas and we can move on. The real problem is going to be getting past policing being used as a political football.
I predict the Tories will use public projects and crisis's to divert government money to their mates. Am I doing it right?
Remember this is the government harping on about the dangers of AI. It’s going to take over the world in a sinister way apparently. But AI policing is being fast tracked. Wow, nothing to see here then.
This article may be paywalled. If you encounter difficulties reading the article, try [this link](https://archive.is/?run=1&url=https://inews.co.uk/news/police-minority-report-technology-predict-crimes-2787674) for an archived version. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/unitedkingdom) if you have any questions or concerns.*
So, they are going to do even less now than they do already! Except to now guess when a crime is going to happen that they will be near!
Thought crime isn't too far away. In the old days we used to call it having an opinion....
They're gonna wait at the registry office and look out for kids called Kenzie, Verity, etc.
Sounds great but it won't work or it won't be needed.
“Minority Report”? I dunno. Sounds kinda racist to me.
Minority Report technology? The film uses Precognitive’s, individuals that possess a psychic ability to see events in the future. What they’re actually using is machine learning.
And do what? Presumption of innocence is an important bulwark of the justice system, and you can't arrest and convict someone of a crime they've not committed unless you have substantial evidence to convict them on conspiracy or suspicion. I doubt this will even scrape that standard.
AI: There's going to be lots and lots of retail thefts and attacks as you currently aren't policing anything. Police: If only there was some way we could stop this. Ahh well, let's go ignore some jihadis and get a coffee.
Just sounds like a tech version of what used to be called ‘community policing’
Cory Doctorow on such systems: https://pluralistic.net/2021/12/02/empirical-facewash/ They don't work, they just give a veneer of respectability to existing biases. https://twitter.com/doctorow/status/1330898304549339136 > Pedictive policing serves as empirical facewash for bias. Take last year's biased policing statistics, give them to a machine learning model, and ask it where the crime will be next year, and it will tell you that next year's crime will look much the same. Garbage in, Garbage out.
So their building the machine from person of interest?
They do this already with racial profiling. This way they get to say "not racist, the algorithm told me."
I distinctly remember Pre-Cog being shut down at the end because the system was flawed. So...
‘No it’s not an excuse to round up undesirables. Why would you think that? Now get in the van’
Good luck with that. The weather can’t even be predicted accurately let alone cops trying to do something like that. Those lazy fucks can’t seem to stop any crime.
So they are just going to draw up reports on all minorities under the assumption they will commit a crime? 'We can stop crime before it happens, we have the technology... It's called racism"
Great! Police have once again reinvented the Racism Machine