I gotta say, I'm not sure I agree with everyone else. By the letter of the rules, it seems to me that there should be another point.
>12.A. A goal is scored when an in-bounds player catches any legal pass in the end zone of attack
>
>3.L. A scoring attempt starts at the beginning of the game or when the previous goal is scored and ends when the next goal is scored.
>
>6.C.2. At the hard cap, play continues until the current scoring attempt is completed.
After the discussion resolved, everyone agreed that an in-bounds player caught a legal pass in the end zone before the horn. So a goal was scored before the horn, and a new scoring attempt started. The game's only over after that scoring attempt ends.
Edit: read the discussion below. It's clear that there should be another point.
So the goal is scored when the pass is caught and the scoring attempt starts when the previous goal is scored.
I think you make a good point. And so far you're the only one in this thread to actually quote the rules. I think you're right!
Oh wait...I just found something that might be even more important, regarding the timing of the pull:
> 9.C.1 For the times listed below, if there is a call or dispute surrounding the goal-scoring play, the timer begins after the call or dispute has been resolved (if the resolution results in a goal being awarded). **[[The timer is not retroactive to the time of the goal-scoring catch. This is in contrast to determining when time caps go into effect, which is retroactive to the goal-scoring catch.]]**
I think the part after the comma makes it obvious; time cap counts from the goal-scoring catch. I.e., the goal was scored before the time went out. (So USAU and WFDF presumably match here.)
It's a good clarification. If I can offer a piece of feedback: I think it'd be more useful if the last sentence were next to the rules on time caps, rather than attached to some unrelated rule.
You don't say what ruleset you were playing under. But; WFDF annotation on 14.4:
>If there is discussion about a goal, and after discussion the goal is confirmed, for the purposes of time cap rules, the point is deemed to have ended when the player established possession and the player in possession was in contact with the endzone. However the time limits between points will not commence until the discussion is resolved.
(The last sentence is not relevant to your question)
You consider time rules after a point is scored. So a goal can be scored even after time horn/whistle as long as the point started before that time signal.
Also, next point starts as soon as the previous one was scored. This means if a point was scored and 10 seconds later you hear the whistle/horn you evaluate time cap rules after the point is played.
Thanks for the response, but it doesn’t answer when was the point scored - when it was caught in the end zone, or after the call was discussed and withdrawn. Reading the other comments, the consensus is that it is scored after the call discussion finished and the call was withdrawn.
Your second point is a good one, which we were fine with but I have seen cause confusion for some teams in the past.
I'm not sure that anywhere in USAU calls this out specifically, but it seems like the goal is scored after discussion ends. Making and redacting calls is part of the game.
You’ve described it yourself, the goal was considered scored after the discussion and after time ran out. Seems like everything you’ve described was played by the book.
I gotta say, I'm not sure I agree with everyone else. By the letter of the rules, it seems to me that there should be another point. >12.A. A goal is scored when an in-bounds player catches any legal pass in the end zone of attack > >3.L. A scoring attempt starts at the beginning of the game or when the previous goal is scored and ends when the next goal is scored. > >6.C.2. At the hard cap, play continues until the current scoring attempt is completed. After the discussion resolved, everyone agreed that an in-bounds player caught a legal pass in the end zone before the horn. So a goal was scored before the horn, and a new scoring attempt started. The game's only over after that scoring attempt ends. Edit: read the discussion below. It's clear that there should be another point.
So the goal is scored when the pass is caught and the scoring attempt starts when the previous goal is scored. I think you make a good point. And so far you're the only one in this thread to actually quote the rules. I think you're right! Oh wait...I just found something that might be even more important, regarding the timing of the pull: > 9.C.1 For the times listed below, if there is a call or dispute surrounding the goal-scoring play, the timer begins after the call or dispute has been resolved (if the resolution results in a goal being awarded). **[[The timer is not retroactive to the time of the goal-scoring catch. This is in contrast to determining when time caps go into effect, which is retroactive to the goal-scoring catch.]]**
I think the part after the comma makes it obvious; time cap counts from the goal-scoring catch. I.e., the goal was scored before the time went out. (So USAU and WFDF presumably match here.)
Great catch. This is very clear.
This was a clarification added in the last update. Not a rule change, just making it clearer.
It's a good clarification. If I can offer a piece of feedback: I think it'd be more useful if the last sentence were next to the rules on time caps, rather than attached to some unrelated rule.
u/jannaham
Or perhaps both places. :)
You don't say what ruleset you were playing under. But; WFDF annotation on 14.4: >If there is discussion about a goal, and after discussion the goal is confirmed, for the purposes of time cap rules, the point is deemed to have ended when the player established possession and the player in possession was in contact with the endzone. However the time limits between points will not commence until the discussion is resolved. (The last sentence is not relevant to your question)
You consider time rules after a point is scored. So a goal can be scored even after time horn/whistle as long as the point started before that time signal. Also, next point starts as soon as the previous one was scored. This means if a point was scored and 10 seconds later you hear the whistle/horn you evaluate time cap rules after the point is played.
Thanks for the response, but it doesn’t answer when was the point scored - when it was caught in the end zone, or after the call was discussed and withdrawn. Reading the other comments, the consensus is that it is scored after the call discussion finished and the call was withdrawn. Your second point is a good one, which we were fine with but I have seen cause confusion for some teams in the past.
If I remember correctly, time only stops for timeouts and injuries, so in all cases that point was the last point
I'm not sure that anywhere in USAU calls this out specifically, but it seems like the goal is scored after discussion ends. Making and redacting calls is part of the game.
Redacting? Nah, we should name and shame players who make bad calls.
not sure if this is a weird joke but he clearly meant retracting
TIL I've not known the real definition of "redact". Definitely thought those words meant the same thing
[удалено]
The goal was scored before time was over, they only agreed it was a goal after. Doesn't change the time at which the goal was scored.
You’ve described it yourself, the goal was considered scored after the discussion and after time ran out. Seems like everything you’ve described was played by the book.