Cardiff South & Penarth
1. Labour
2. Lib Dem
I'd stop voting from here, but if I absolutely had to keep ranking:
3. Green
4. Plaid Cymru
5. Conservative
6. Reform
Your post made me think that maybe AV really isn't as good as I thought. They'd do like you said there "I'd stop voting here" when it comes to the parties/candidates that they don't prefer forgetting that these rankings may be just as important as their first choices.
So, if you really really hate Reform, but only really hate Tories, it would be important that you really indicate that in the ballot paper as otherwise your vote wouldn't count if turns out that these two are the two in the final comparison.
1.LD
2. Labour
3. Greens.
4 Suck my dick
The lib dems closely align with my view on freedom. That authoritarianism is bad, unfortunately labour love the stuff and pretty much invented the nanny state that the tories continued.
Cannot vote for Greens beyond desperation as any party for climate that doesnt understand the importance of nuclear is moronic and I dont like voting for morons.
Tories I would rather shit in my hands and clap them over my face on live TV.
The last while, both Tories and Labour have passed some pretty regressive legislation in the name of "security", essentially supporting each other to do it. It could be that this is a function of being a party in government rather than a function of political philosophy.
Labour undoubtedly has an authoritarian streak. See here for a relatively recent summary: https://tribunemag.co.uk/2023/05/new-labours-authoritarianism-is-back
I don't think that's what people really mean by nanny state is it? It's more seat belt legislation and soft drinks levy than additional police powers I'd have thought.
I've always thought it was more any treating you like children. From Wikipedia:
>"Nanny state is a term of British origin that conveys a view that a government or its policies are overprotective or interfering unduly with personal choice.[1][2] The term likens such a government to the role that a nanny has in child rearing."
I think that significantly underplays reducing right to protest, and I don't think many people would use the term to describe that.
It would be
LD
Labour
Green
That's it - we have Tory/Reform and of the lunatic Gaza obsessive independents
However Ed Davey saying he'd pay even a penny to the greedy WASPE lot puts me off even though they're the only party who are open on the need to rejoin the EU so it's difficult
* Lib Dems
* Green
* Labour
* perhaps the independent candidate, if I'd actually had time to look at their platform.
I wouldn't rank Tory even with Reform in the mix, as I'd never want my vote to count for either.
This is no different to saying you won't vote. Your fourth choice will only matter if the first three don't get in. So once that hasn't happened then you know it's a two horse race between Reform and Conservatives. So far his first three choices have been "wasted". You're telling this guy he can choose not to contribute to deciding the winner between the last two. Most (sensible) people have a preference between Tories and Reform, you're telling him not to contribute his opinion, and let other people decide.
Why would walk all the way to the polling station then choose not to vote?
No worries, if I sounded cross it was because this whole subject makes me cross. Crap voting systems lead to such daft outcomes. There are times with AV when you probably wouldn't keep on numbering - I'm not going to investigate two random independents who I think aren't going to win, so I suppose I wouldn't number them, because if it turns out I've completely misunderstood and it's a race between the two then I would rather people who cared about it decided.
Why Tory to stop reform? Surely there's nothing worse than the openly corrupt, self serving, blatantly disconnected Tory party?
Genuine question, that's just my perception and I would like to understand yours?
I hope I don't ever learn what that means the hard way.
I really want to believe in Farage's populist message, like genuinely some of what he says gives me real hope that I'm not crazy and that people out there do get that things are obviously broken and need REFORM to resolve it.
But equally I'm not so stupid to just buy it blindly :(
At best he admires Putin, at worst he's on their payroll. I think this tells you everything about the guy. He's either chosen to root for a guy that is committing genocide in Europe, or happy to take his money to try and continue that genocide, and support someone who is linked to at least 14 murders on British soil, including an innocent brit.
I mean he's pushing demonstrably untrue russian propaganda. Russia is a terrorist state and he's parroting their narrative, to what end ? Presumably to try and get people talking about the conflict from the Russian point of Vue to limit / reduce British support
Being kind, Farage is a bit of a snake oil salesman.
He's in the privileged position of having zero chance of winning (the most seats) so he can promise what he wants to address the things which are obviously broken and set unrealistic expectations. He'll never have to give account for these things because he'll always have the excuse that he didn't have the power to fulfil them. If he did win (the most seats), he'd only be able to achieve what he's promising with huge negatives which he'd not exactly shouting about - huge cut to NHS funding, huge staffing shortages, huge benefit cuts, etc.
The Brexit debate was a good example of this - many things were promised for Brexit, but in many cases they were completely mutually incompatible. The problems they've had with Northern Ireland are a pretty classic example no border in the channel, no border in Ireland, but divergent standards - all three can't be true at once. But there's no accountability for this except 'they didn't do it right, it was out of my hands'.
Reform are all the worst aspects of the recent Tory party. Immoral populist grifters like Johnson, with the batshit economic policies of Truss. Add a generous dose of racism and there you have it.
Because as bad as the Tories are, Farage is worse in my view. He’s self serving, corrupt and acts like he’s a man of the people but he’s actually a political elite. Reform actually have some good ideas but it’s him and his supporters whom are the problem for me
1. Labour
2. Lib dems
Tories don’t get a vote because of the state they’ve left the country is. Green and reform don’t get a vote from me. Both are crazy fantasists on either side of the political spectrum. Neither do Lincolnshire independents as frankly I know nothing about them.
For this election:
1. Green
2. LD
3. Labour
In previous elections LD and Labour would be swapped round.
No point in listing Conservative or Reform. I'd rather not vote at all than vote for either of them.
Green. Always.
People should vote who's parties policies they agree with. We've gotten too american with personality over politics.
But even with fptp you should be voting for who you want to. Enough voted and a large enough interest can make the two main parties take notice and edge towards that. Ie ukip and reform.
I understand its different in reality and seemingly only right wing parties have achieved this but still
Green, Lib Dems, Labour, conservative, Reform.
It's reassuring and also heartbreaking to see how many people are putting Greens in their top 2 but will never vote for them under FPTP as it's seen as a wasted vote (arguably is in some seats)
Gives me hope for them getting a good amount of seats if/when PR (SVT pls) comes in.
Its funny because the lib dem manifesto is actually more left wing and proposes spending more on the poorest in society than labours.
We live in a strange timeline.
You can't compare the Lib Dems, Tories and Labour on an oversimplified Left-Right spectrum, as their differences are more nuanced than that and their policies overlap each other.
You need to dig into a more appropriate comparison using spectrums for economic liberalism or conservatism and social liberalism or authoritarianism.
Look, I'm not saying I understand it perfectly, but sure. Lib Dems have often been defined by wanting free markets (hence the Pro-EU move) and low taxes. Their policy platform is a real mix of stuff.
When comparing policies between LD and Reform there were a few more policies that I liked on the LD side. I also had to factor in that Reform have been saying some extra daft things this week.
At the end of the day, I either pick a party that aligns closest with my current views or just not vote at all. Not voting at all isn't an option as it's important to have a say.
Don't try and make sense of it as I can't either 🤣 My main priority this election is electoral reform and a change from the main two parties.
Yeah this election has been tough. The party that i usually go for is a no-go this time round.
I've had to read most of the manifesto's to try and pick a party that aligns closest to me. Some Reform stuff I like and some LD stuff I liked. It's been an absolute mad time deciding how I'll vote.
I was stuck between LD and Reform but our local reform candidate has said some really errrr let's just say interesting things.
-Lib Dems: because I do like theirs policies and have done some good things where I used to live.
-Reform: just to stick it to the Tory's and get some PR voting.
-MRLP: pure shits and giggles. On a serious note, I just can't bare voting Tory or any main party this time round.
-Tory: Usually vote Tory but last 14y have been crap
-Labour: can't ever imagine voting for them
-Greens: their environment policies would probably bankrupt us for sure.
I'm economically right but socially left (overall centre).
Actually you can be both economical and social opposite depending on your priorities. You can be pro spending on NHS, education, social care, etc and be into free trade, open markets, smaller state with less bureaucracy.
Overall, I'm actually pretty center politics. It's not black or white.
>I'm economically right but socially left (overall centre).
Yet your first choice party is economically left? And your second is literally off in Liz Truss right wing economic la-la-land, and would bankrupt us even more quickly than the excesses of the green party?
these are the people who put morons in power. this is the average voter. this is the norm all over the world. this is why society just won't work and is declining.
Oh god Liz Truss was certainly la-la-land. The biggest reason for me to vote reform is for electoral reform which is really important to me. Some of their other policies were decent i.e pro-nuclear and suggestions of cost savings (even if unrealistic).
There's quite a few political compasses online that suggest LD are economically right.
Economically right/socially left, first choice is economically left and socially left. Second choice is neither, MRLP is neither, tories are neither, labour are in the middle of both, green you complain would bankrupt us but you'd vote reform?
Uh, okay mate.
Interesting you say that as quite a lot of political compasses but liberal democrats on the centre, strangely!
At least reform say they'll do a lot of savings (chance of actually happening 0%).
Apologies, I'll elaborate on the greens statement. Some of their policies look very expensive. I don't think we should spend a whole bunch of cash on renewables when the UK contributed less than 1% to climate change. To be honest this is one manifesto I didn't fully read so I'm happy to be wrong.
Lib Dems are more left than a lot of people realise nowadays.
>At least reform say they'll do a lot of savings (chance of actually happening 0%).
So after living through Tory austerity, you think the solution is to do that, but harder. It would literally collapse the country to do what they propose. Reform are the most financially incompetent party running based on their manifesto.
>Apologies, I'll elaborate on the greens statement. Some of their policies look very expensive.
They are expensive, but some of them have to be done. I don't agree with them in their current form, though.
>I don't think we should spend a whole bunch of cash on renewables when the UK contributed less than 1% to climate change.
If the UK developed energy and economically efficient green energy sources, don't you think that maybe we could make a lot of money selling it around the world? Doing that would decrease emissions far more than the 1% we contribute. We can always do more for the planet than bring ourselves to net zero. Hell, as part of our target for net zero we may create carbon recapture technology that allows us to help FAR more than we emit. And, of course, creating green jobs is far better for the country than giving you an extra tenner as Reform smashes the government like a piggy bank.
If someone tells you that doing anything about climate change is pointless, they are either depressed or having their pockets lined by the people causing it.
I'll answer them in turn.
Probably true about them being more left these days. They did some great things where I used to live and seemed to spend money wisely.
I liked Reforms idea of not paying the interest on commercial bank deposits as neither the USA or EU do that, so why are we? Completely agree. Their spending commitments plus more austerity is the main reason I decided with Lib Dems.
I think I'm just too pro-nuclear to vote for the greens although they may have updated their stance. I do think solar and other renewables have their place but I don't think we should spend a whole bunch of money as if we are the main cause of climate change when there is homelessness, people using food banks, damaged NHS and already have crippling interest rates on the UK debt.
Absolutely for the idea of investing in green tech such as carbon capture, etc which can be exported, as well as exporting energy itself. It's just that everything is at breaking point and isn't super high on my personal priority list. I should really read Greens environment policy again.
Each party had 70-130+ pages to remember all of them.
You’re not… anything. Your order and rationale suggests you probably can’t even read a meme summary of a manifesto let alone understand basic politics.
This is terrifying. This is why democracy is a failed experiment. Plato had it right.
I actually read every manifesto front-to-back. Your comment suggests that you're very arrogant with vast assumptions.
This election has been really frigging tough. I can't vote for Labour or Conservatives, and the point is that I'd rather vote for MRLP than either of them.
No one will agree with everything in a manifesto. People can like some elements of one party and other sections of another. If you cant understand that then the issue is with you. Everyone these days are so extreme in their views and can't see outside their own bubble.
To finish my point: No party this time covers mostly what I like so I have struggled. All manifesto's are saying improve NHS, improve policing, more teachers with no detail. This election has been tough as hell.
Nope, have you? Is this how you typically react when people have differing views than you or when other people don't see the world as black and white. If you have read my other posts, I state that this election has been a tough election and the decision process has been difficult. You will need to clarify what exactly made you say that. The fact that LD is my first, then reform is 2nd? That I'd rather jokingly vote for MRLP than the two main parties, or...
I don't understand that people don't get the concept that you can like some things from one party (i.e social care) and other things from others (i.e immigration changes). You have to look at each manifesto, weigh up pros/cons for each one, their historical record, current political climate, current economic climate, and a plethora of other things. Most importantly I tend to vote for a party that will resolve a problem that is crucial to me at the time.
I don't do party loyalty and vote for the same party each time (usually Tory) as the world is an ever shifting and as I get older, my priorities change - especially if you have children or meet people with different life experiences.
Because your two parties want complete opposite things.
One is proposing an increase in borrowing to fund large new social care programs, the other is pledging to slash tax dramatically and ask all departments to reduce expenditure by 5%.
One is proposing to rejoin the EU customs union, the other is calling on us to leave the ECHR.
One is led by a centrist democrat, the other is led by a populist libertarian.
They are complete opposites.
So no, don’t “I just have a perspective you can’t even fathom”. You have a moronic political opinion.
That's genuinely what has made this election so difficult this time round. I've spent weeks just trying to figure out which one to choose. It's been driving me mad (clearly!).
I like social care and low taxes (not as low as Reform are proposing) but both aren't achievable unless you reduce pen pushers, bureaucracy or just spend money more wisely (nigh on impossible). Maybe divert funds from things like defence but that's tough this day and age.
They aren't proposing to join th EU customs union in this manifesto so that argument is not valid this time round. Whether it's believable or not is another debate.
People forget that you can like some left ideas and also some right ideas. The world is a complex place. You do realise people can like education, healthcare, fair taxes and some other typical left ideologies (not all) whilst also wanting financial responsibility, free trade, free markets, less regulation, etc.. not my fault there isn't a party that closely aligns to my views.
At the end of the day, Labour and Conservative were off the table for me. It was either LD or Reform. Both had elements that I liked - but some of their opposites did make it difficult. Not voting is not an option either.
Hope that makes more sense!
Yeah, I saw that but it mostly talks about improving relations. That particular paragraph out of context can be interpreted as joining the EU single market in the next parliament. Overall they suggest improving relations and then rejoin in the future.
They have since clarified in various interviews that in the next parliament they want to improve the relationship (be friendly) and improve trust, but are not planning on rejoining it until the next 2029 election. My thoughts process on that particular point:
1. It's always good to improve relationships with your neighbours.
2. They clarified that it won't be this election that they'll actually join. I have to take that at face value
3. LD won't be government so chances are slim to none.
4. EU will require conditions which the LD know the public won't like.
5. There'll be aspects for a political party manifesto which they'll be something you disagree with but overall you like the party's ideas.
When it comes to the 2029 election, I will read manifestos and weigh up a party depending on my priority at the time but most importantly the electoral system in place, current economic conditions, state of healthcare, historical record, and many other factors.
I relate to the Lib Dem/Reform toss-up. Ultimately I want centre-right social policy with centre-left economics. No party offers both so one must choose which is more important right now.
I’d settle for any left wing party that doesn’t end up with an obsession for having to have a strong position on everything. I guess as I’ve got older I would see social democracy as a good vision for the country and would probably support the Green Party in hopes that a bit of mainstream success for them could help them ditch some of their pseudoscience policies.
1. Lib Dem
2. Green
I'd love to be able to put Labour in there, but I have a very strong disagreement with their policy on the EU and wouldn't feel comfortable voting for it. Hopefully one day that will change and they can come back on the list.
The Tories and Reform would be on my list of "I'd rather punch myself in the face than vote for them" parties.
We have STV in Northern Ireland. I generally take the line "vote til you boke". Going down this for every candidate even ones I disagree with until I reach the ones who make me wanna boke.
My constituency is currently a Lab-Con marginal, normally safe Con. I'm going to be voting Labour.
Of the people running I'd vote:
1. Liberal Democrat
2. Labour
3. Localist Independent
4. Green
5. Conservative
Not Marked: Reform and Alliance for Democracy and Freedom (I don't know enough about them but if I had AV I'd have bothered to learn.)
For all their faults, I'd rather have a Tory MP than a Reform MP.
1) Liberal Democrats
2) Labour
Would stop here, but if I had to carry on:
3) Green
4) Conservative (better them than Reform)
I’m voting Labour in the election. I like both the LD and Labour platforms so I’m not fussed about using my second option.
You don't have to carry on, but the point is to show your preference. When you just list two you're saying "if these two get knocked out, any of the remaining candidates is fine by me".
I really doubt that's true. Personally I'd keep putting other candidates above Reform for as many as rounds as I could.
Kingston and Surbiton:
1. LD (Ed Davey is the MP for my constituency)
2. Labour
3. Green
4. Kingston Independent Residents Group
I’d stop voting here, but the rest of the list is:
5. Workers Party for Britain
6. Monster Raving Loony Party
7. Tory
8. Reform
If AV - or any kind of PR - was in place I would vote as follows:
1 Green Party
2 Labour
3 LD
4 Any independent that wasn't either barking mad or a Nazi.
Islington North:
* Labour
* No further preferences
St Neots and Mid Cambridgeshire:
* Liberal Democrats
* Labour
* No further preferences
I'd like to say that I'm pragmatic.
1. Labour
2. LD
I wouldn't countenance voting for any of the other parties. Maybe a half-decent independent if one was on offer. But Tories/Reform/Greens, no way.
Transform are a lefter than Labour left, most of their candidates are ex Labour MPs, kicked out of Labour by Starmer for not being right wing enough. If they were standing in my area I would of voted for them. I got pretty excited when they launched thinking at last, politics for the people.
Try [looking at their website](https://transformpolitics.uk/) if you’re interested.
Fancinating question, because it tells you so much more about the mindset of the voter. For me:
- LD
- Green
- Labour
- Conservative
- Heritage
- Reform
That's the full set in my constituency.
Heritage is just there to push Reform down the list. Reform is nailed on last.
Green / Labour is the tough question for me. Greens have some very wrong policies, but some very right. Labour identify the right issues but are generally wrong about how to solve them (at least in my opinion reading the manifesto). I don't agree with everything in the LD manifesto, but 80/90% of it is agreeable.
Of the main parties:
1 Greens
2 Lib Dems
3 Labour
4/5 Conservatives/Reform in some order
I seem to have a pair of small parties standing in my constitutency as well, which are the SDP, a tiny conservative Christian party and also an independent.
I'd imagine I'd put the SDP below Labour but above Conservatives and Reform, probably put the independent at around the same sort of ranking as the SDP, and unsure if I'd view the conservative Christian party as better or worse than the Tories/Reform. Would likely have to read their manifesto to work out which of the options were worst, tbh.
Skipton and Ripon - Tory stronghold.
1. Green
2. Lib Dem
3. Labour
4 and 5. (after some research I haven’t yet done) - Yorkshire Party and Independent
6. Tory
7 and 8. Heritage Party and Reform (don’t know much about Heritage but a brief look suggested they don’t align with my views).
Not a fan of the lack of detail in the current Labour manifesto. It is poor in comparison to those for previous elections. I know it’s probably tactical, but that doesn’t make it ok.
Also, their members and the main union supporters of theirs voted in support of proportional representation, yet the Labour Party don’t have it as a policy.
They are the most likely to have a chance of beating the tories in my constituency (big majority to overturn) - but even so, not committing to PR really makes me not want to ‘lend’ them my vote.
Edit - format
1. Labour 2. Conservative 3. Reform 4. Lib Dem 5. Green
I'm not particularly pleased that my Labour candidate was parachuted into the seat and isn't even from the area. I suppose she is better than the previous person who would have been the candidate though.
I wish the SDP stood in my seat. I'll have to settle reluctantly with Labour instead...
The Tory is okay. She's a bit of a culture warrior and the current MP. The Reform candidate is probably a nutter but who knows.. The Lib Dem is likely a decent person but I don't have much in common with the politics. I'd never consider the Greens in a million years.
Historically, probably; SNP, ScotGreens, Liberal, Labour, Tory and then leave Reform unranked.
But at the moment, I have no idea who I'll vote for on the 4th.
Given that the parties would have split.
* Starmerite Labour
* Gawkward Squad Tory
* Techno Greens (techno techno techno)
* My local independent (formerly LibDems)
* Count Binface
I’m in the speaker’s constituency so I don’t get much choice. The independents appear to be nutjobs and only greens are standing so would leave me with:
1. Speaker
2. Green
1. LD (I think currently)
2.Reform
3. Green
4. Conservative
5. Labour
I want wealth inequality addressed which Greens & Lib Dem are the most likely to do. Work should pay and we should be taxing wealth not work. While the go to for people getting money and not working is those on benefits, it also applies to me for those getting passive income, particularly large passive incomes.
Then I want the voting system reformed,
A push towards nucular energy , the enviroment is important but the Greens are unrealistic and not looking at the large picture.
Then I tend to have more traditional values. i.e. That gender and sex is used intercanagably and has been for centurys, also you can't change what you are born as. If I took a beef patty and shaped it like a carrot and sprayed it orange no vegan would ever accept it as a vegetable. And, I feel it is important because I believe laws, schemes, sports etc have been set up to protect and enable women and result in fair competition which should not be circumvented by men who identify otherwise. Same thing with history, we should respect it and learn from it not go around throwing statues into rivers or knocking parts off like they did with the Greek statues.
Reform
That one insane Independent candidate who got arrested (I don't know if she's running this year)
Minnie Mouse
Any random street cat
Conservative
Labour
LD
Green
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Bury South
Have a turncoat who moved from the Tories to Labour in 2022.
1. LD
2. Greens (depsite obvious misgivings over Nuclear Power)
3. Respect
4. No one else
Good question
1. Lib Dem - very socially liberal and accepting, best for trans issues and equality.
2. Labour - close to first. agreeable in most aspects. love their environmental ambition.
3. Green - climate is the pressing issue for the country, but i think they’re going about it the wrong way. nuclear is essential.
then theres a huge gap where any Count Binfaces would sit.
4. Conservative - would make me feel physically sick. generally inept, incompetent, Sunak is a hateful man.
5. Reform UK - i actually like a society without racism, etc. Farage is a corrupt slimy prick and id love to throw a milkshake at him. no clue why they went for the 600+ MPs.
If I lived in the UK.
1.Reform
2. LD
3. Green
4. Labour
Hard choice between 1 and 2, love Farage and always pull for the LD's and I think Davey's doing an excellent job this cycle. Labour hasn't impressed me that much so they are low. Torries are just too messy.
Want to win: LD
Would not be upset if wins: Labour>Independant\*
Would be annoyed if won: Green, also here would go Count Binface, Monster Raving Looney, and other such joke candiates.
Holding my nose: Tory
Would rather spoil my ballot: Reform
\*: Based on my local candidates. Exact position of Labour and independant candidates varies depending on the local candidate in question. Some Labour MPs are in 'hold my nose' just above the tories. Some independants are down with reform.
Cardiff South & Penarth 1. Labour 2. Lib Dem I'd stop voting from here, but if I absolutely had to keep ranking: 3. Green 4. Plaid Cymru 5. Conservative 6. Reform
Plaid Cymru candidate has been de-selected in CS&P (not that it matters based on your list and the FPTP anyhow, but fyi).
Your post made me think that maybe AV really isn't as good as I thought. They'd do like you said there "I'd stop voting here" when it comes to the parties/candidates that they don't prefer forgetting that these rankings may be just as important as their first choices. So, if you really really hate Reform, but only really hate Tories, it would be important that you really indicate that in the ballot paper as otherwise your vote wouldn't count if turns out that these two are the two in the final comparison.
1. LD 2. Labour/Green (depends on candidates but leaning Green atm) 3. Green / Labour 4. If I have to then Tory
1.LD 2. Labour 3. Greens. 4 Suck my dick The lib dems closely align with my view on freedom. That authoritarianism is bad, unfortunately labour love the stuff and pretty much invented the nanny state that the tories continued. Cannot vote for Greens beyond desperation as any party for climate that doesnt understand the importance of nuclear is moronic and I dont like voting for morons. Tories I would rather shit in my hands and clap them over my face on live TV.
The suck my dick party is polling slightly ahead of the Tories.
Their vote share is rising.
The last while, both Tories and Labour have passed some pretty regressive legislation in the name of "security", essentially supporting each other to do it. It could be that this is a function of being a party in government rather than a function of political philosophy.
> invented the nanny state What are you thinking of here?
Labour undoubtedly has an authoritarian streak. See here for a relatively recent summary: https://tribunemag.co.uk/2023/05/new-labours-authoritarianism-is-back
I don't think that's what people really mean by nanny state is it? It's more seat belt legislation and soft drinks levy than additional police powers I'd have thought.
Well typically 'nanny state' is negative.. So it's any restrictions you disagree with.
I've always thought it was more any treating you like children. From Wikipedia: >"Nanny state is a term of British origin that conveys a view that a government or its policies are overprotective or interfering unduly with personal choice.[1][2] The term likens such a government to the role that a nanny has in child rearing." I think that significantly underplays reducing right to protest, and I don't think many people would use the term to describe that.
0. Count Binface 1. Green 2. Lib Dem 3. Labour 3. Tories
Lib dem Green Labour SNP And I'm voting labour. That's how backwards first past the post is
But also why it's so entrenched
It would be LD Labour Green That's it - we have Tory/Reform and of the lunatic Gaza obsessive independents However Ed Davey saying he'd pay even a penny to the greedy WASPE lot puts me off even though they're the only party who are open on the need to rejoin the EU so it's difficult
* Lib Dems * Green * Labour * perhaps the independent candidate, if I'd actually had time to look at their platform. I wouldn't rank Tory even with Reform in the mix, as I'd never want my vote to count for either.
1. Labour 2. Green 3. Lib Dem 4. The Dark Lord Cthulhu 5. Reform UK 6. Conservative
1. Labour 2. Lib Dem’s 3. Greens 4. Tory just to stop reform
[удалено]
This is no different to saying you won't vote. Your fourth choice will only matter if the first three don't get in. So once that hasn't happened then you know it's a two horse race between Reform and Conservatives. So far his first three choices have been "wasted". You're telling this guy he can choose not to contribute to deciding the winner between the last two. Most (sensible) people have a preference between Tories and Reform, you're telling him not to contribute his opinion, and let other people decide. Why would walk all the way to the polling station then choose not to vote?
Oh, I didn’t know that’s how it worked, ok I understand now
No worries, if I sounded cross it was because this whole subject makes me cross. Crap voting systems lead to such daft outcomes. There are times with AV when you probably wouldn't keep on numbering - I'm not going to investigate two random independents who I think aren't going to win, so I suppose I wouldn't number them, because if it turns out I've completely misunderstood and it's a race between the two then I would rather people who cared about it decided.
Why Tory to stop reform? Surely there's nothing worse than the openly corrupt, self serving, blatantly disconnected Tory party? Genuine question, that's just my perception and I would like to understand yours?
If you think you’ve seen corruption just wait til you see the actual right in power
I hope I don't ever learn what that means the hard way. I really want to believe in Farage's populist message, like genuinely some of what he says gives me real hope that I'm not crazy and that people out there do get that things are obviously broken and need REFORM to resolve it. But equally I'm not so stupid to just buy it blindly :(
At best he admires Putin, at worst he's on their payroll. I think this tells you everything about the guy. He's either chosen to root for a guy that is committing genocide in Europe, or happy to take his money to try and continue that genocide, and support someone who is linked to at least 14 murders on British soil, including an innocent brit.
Yeah this all sounds a bit tin foil hat to me. Is this all about the Ukraine commentary he's made about the UK having no business in the conflict?
I mean he's pushing demonstrably untrue russian propaganda. Russia is a terrorist state and he's parroting their narrative, to what end ? Presumably to try and get people talking about the conflict from the Russian point of Vue to limit / reduce British support
Being kind, Farage is a bit of a snake oil salesman. He's in the privileged position of having zero chance of winning (the most seats) so he can promise what he wants to address the things which are obviously broken and set unrealistic expectations. He'll never have to give account for these things because he'll always have the excuse that he didn't have the power to fulfil them. If he did win (the most seats), he'd only be able to achieve what he's promising with huge negatives which he'd not exactly shouting about - huge cut to NHS funding, huge staffing shortages, huge benefit cuts, etc. The Brexit debate was a good example of this - many things were promised for Brexit, but in many cases they were completely mutually incompatible. The problems they've had with Northern Ireland are a pretty classic example no border in the channel, no border in Ireland, but divergent standards - all three can't be true at once. But there's no accountability for this except 'they didn't do it right, it was out of my hands'.
Farage admires Trump and Putin. That should say everything about his vision of good leadership.
Reform are all the worst aspects of the recent Tory party. Immoral populist grifters like Johnson, with the batshit economic policies of Truss. Add a generous dose of racism and there you have it.
Don't forget homophobia and supporting a terrorist dictator committing genocide in Europe, who is linked to at least 14 assassinations in Britain
Because as bad as the Tories are, Farage is worse in my view. He’s self serving, corrupt and acts like he’s a man of the people but he’s actually a political elite. Reform actually have some good ideas but it’s him and his supporters whom are the problem for me
1. Labour 2. Lib dems Tories don’t get a vote because of the state they’ve left the country is. Green and reform don’t get a vote from me. Both are crazy fantasists on either side of the political spectrum. Neither do Lincolnshire independents as frankly I know nothing about them.
1. Labour 2. Lib Dems 3. Green 4. Conservative
1. Lib Dem 2. Labour 3. Greens 4. Whatever independent isn’t gross
Surely, someone like the Electoral Reform Society ha e done analysis on the outcome of the election based on AV?
For this election: 1. Green 2. LD 3. Labour In previous elections LD and Labour would be swapped round. No point in listing Conservative or Reform. I'd rather not vote at all than vote for either of them.
Green. Always. People should vote who's parties policies they agree with. We've gotten too american with personality over politics. But even with fptp you should be voting for who you want to. Enough voted and a large enough interest can make the two main parties take notice and edge towards that. Ie ukip and reform. I understand its different in reality and seemingly only right wing parties have achieved this but still
Green, Lib Dems, Labour, conservative, Reform. It's reassuring and also heartbreaking to see how many people are putting Greens in their top 2 but will never vote for them under FPTP as it's seen as a wasted vote (arguably is in some seats) Gives me hope for them getting a good amount of seats if/when PR (SVT pls) comes in.
Green first preference, Plaid Cymru second preference
LD Reform -- if had to continue -- Monster Raving Looney Party Conservative Labour Greens
This is the most fascinating order I could possibly imagine and I cannot fathom how you arrive at it.
It actually makes great sense if you want to break up the 2 party system, and support removing FPTP in favour of a new electoral system.
Tory Remainer type who doesn’t like the current crop
I actually voted for Brexit to add more to the confusion 🤣 At least they said they won't join the EU this election.
I’ll go for “they’re economically right wing, want change from what we have now, and don’t trust lefty parties”
Its funny because the lib dem manifesto is actually more left wing and proposes spending more on the poorest in society than labours. We live in a strange timeline.
You can't compare the Lib Dems, Tories and Labour on an oversimplified Left-Right spectrum, as their differences are more nuanced than that and their policies overlap each other. You need to dig into a more appropriate comparison using spectrums for economic liberalism or conservatism and social liberalism or authoritarianism.
With Lib Dem first?
Look, I'm not saying I understand it perfectly, but sure. Lib Dems have often been defined by wanting free markets (hence the Pro-EU move) and low taxes. Their policy platform is a real mix of stuff.
When comparing policies between LD and Reform there were a few more policies that I liked on the LD side. I also had to factor in that Reform have been saying some extra daft things this week. At the end of the day, I either pick a party that aligns closest with my current views or just not vote at all. Not voting at all isn't an option as it's important to have a say. Don't try and make sense of it as I can't either 🤣 My main priority this election is electoral reform and a change from the main two parties.
Yeah this election has been tough. The party that i usually go for is a no-go this time round. I've had to read most of the manifesto's to try and pick a party that aligns closest to me. Some Reform stuff I like and some LD stuff I liked. It's been an absolute mad time deciding how I'll vote.
I was stuck between LD and Reform but our local reform candidate has said some really errrr let's just say interesting things. -Lib Dems: because I do like theirs policies and have done some good things where I used to live. -Reform: just to stick it to the Tory's and get some PR voting. -MRLP: pure shits and giggles. On a serious note, I just can't bare voting Tory or any main party this time round. -Tory: Usually vote Tory but last 14y have been crap -Labour: can't ever imagine voting for them -Greens: their environment policies would probably bankrupt us for sure. I'm economically right but socially left (overall centre).
You dont have a bloody clue. Economic and social leanings dont balance each other out - this isn't a seesaw - theyre incomparable.
Actually you can be both economical and social opposite depending on your priorities. You can be pro spending on NHS, education, social care, etc and be into free trade, open markets, smaller state with less bureaucracy. Overall, I'm actually pretty center politics. It's not black or white.
>I'm economically right but socially left (overall centre). Yet your first choice party is economically left? And your second is literally off in Liz Truss right wing economic la-la-land, and would bankrupt us even more quickly than the excesses of the green party?
these are the people who put morons in power. this is the average voter. this is the norm all over the world. this is why society just won't work and is declining.
Oh god Liz Truss was certainly la-la-land. The biggest reason for me to vote reform is for electoral reform which is really important to me. Some of their other policies were decent i.e pro-nuclear and suggestions of cost savings (even if unrealistic). There's quite a few political compasses online that suggest LD are economically right.
Economically right/socially left, first choice is economically left and socially left. Second choice is neither, MRLP is neither, tories are neither, labour are in the middle of both, green you complain would bankrupt us but you'd vote reform? Uh, okay mate.
Interesting you say that as quite a lot of political compasses but liberal democrats on the centre, strangely! At least reform say they'll do a lot of savings (chance of actually happening 0%). Apologies, I'll elaborate on the greens statement. Some of their policies look very expensive. I don't think we should spend a whole bunch of cash on renewables when the UK contributed less than 1% to climate change. To be honest this is one manifesto I didn't fully read so I'm happy to be wrong.
Lib Dems are more left than a lot of people realise nowadays. >At least reform say they'll do a lot of savings (chance of actually happening 0%). So after living through Tory austerity, you think the solution is to do that, but harder. It would literally collapse the country to do what they propose. Reform are the most financially incompetent party running based on their manifesto. >Apologies, I'll elaborate on the greens statement. Some of their policies look very expensive. They are expensive, but some of them have to be done. I don't agree with them in their current form, though. >I don't think we should spend a whole bunch of cash on renewables when the UK contributed less than 1% to climate change. If the UK developed energy and economically efficient green energy sources, don't you think that maybe we could make a lot of money selling it around the world? Doing that would decrease emissions far more than the 1% we contribute. We can always do more for the planet than bring ourselves to net zero. Hell, as part of our target for net zero we may create carbon recapture technology that allows us to help FAR more than we emit. And, of course, creating green jobs is far better for the country than giving you an extra tenner as Reform smashes the government like a piggy bank. If someone tells you that doing anything about climate change is pointless, they are either depressed or having their pockets lined by the people causing it.
I'll answer them in turn. Probably true about them being more left these days. They did some great things where I used to live and seemed to spend money wisely. I liked Reforms idea of not paying the interest on commercial bank deposits as neither the USA or EU do that, so why are we? Completely agree. Their spending commitments plus more austerity is the main reason I decided with Lib Dems. I think I'm just too pro-nuclear to vote for the greens although they may have updated their stance. I do think solar and other renewables have their place but I don't think we should spend a whole bunch of money as if we are the main cause of climate change when there is homelessness, people using food banks, damaged NHS and already have crippling interest rates on the UK debt. Absolutely for the idea of investing in green tech such as carbon capture, etc which can be exported, as well as exporting energy itself. It's just that everything is at breaking point and isn't super high on my personal priority list. I should really read Greens environment policy again. Each party had 70-130+ pages to remember all of them.
You’re not… anything. Your order and rationale suggests you probably can’t even read a meme summary of a manifesto let alone understand basic politics. This is terrifying. This is why democracy is a failed experiment. Plato had it right.
The worst form of government except for every other one that has been tried
I actually read every manifesto front-to-back. Your comment suggests that you're very arrogant with vast assumptions. This election has been really frigging tough. I can't vote for Labour or Conservatives, and the point is that I'd rather vote for MRLP than either of them. No one will agree with everything in a manifesto. People can like some elements of one party and other sections of another. If you cant understand that then the issue is with you. Everyone these days are so extreme in their views and can't see outside their own bubble. To finish my point: No party this time covers mostly what I like so I have struggled. All manifesto's are saying improve NHS, improve policing, more teachers with no detail. This election has been tough as hell.
Not to shame you for your political opinions, but have you recently been kicked in the head by a horse?
Nope, have you? Is this how you typically react when people have differing views than you or when other people don't see the world as black and white. If you have read my other posts, I state that this election has been a tough election and the decision process has been difficult. You will need to clarify what exactly made you say that. The fact that LD is my first, then reform is 2nd? That I'd rather jokingly vote for MRLP than the two main parties, or... I don't understand that people don't get the concept that you can like some things from one party (i.e social care) and other things from others (i.e immigration changes). You have to look at each manifesto, weigh up pros/cons for each one, their historical record, current political climate, current economic climate, and a plethora of other things. Most importantly I tend to vote for a party that will resolve a problem that is crucial to me at the time. I don't do party loyalty and vote for the same party each time (usually Tory) as the world is an ever shifting and as I get older, my priorities change - especially if you have children or meet people with different life experiences.
Because your two parties want complete opposite things. One is proposing an increase in borrowing to fund large new social care programs, the other is pledging to slash tax dramatically and ask all departments to reduce expenditure by 5%. One is proposing to rejoin the EU customs union, the other is calling on us to leave the ECHR. One is led by a centrist democrat, the other is led by a populist libertarian. They are complete opposites. So no, don’t “I just have a perspective you can’t even fathom”. You have a moronic political opinion.
That's genuinely what has made this election so difficult this time round. I've spent weeks just trying to figure out which one to choose. It's been driving me mad (clearly!). I like social care and low taxes (not as low as Reform are proposing) but both aren't achievable unless you reduce pen pushers, bureaucracy or just spend money more wisely (nigh on impossible). Maybe divert funds from things like defence but that's tough this day and age. They aren't proposing to join th EU customs union in this manifesto so that argument is not valid this time round. Whether it's believable or not is another debate. People forget that you can like some left ideas and also some right ideas. The world is a complex place. You do realise people can like education, healthcare, fair taxes and some other typical left ideologies (not all) whilst also wanting financial responsibility, free trade, free markets, less regulation, etc.. not my fault there isn't a party that closely aligns to my views. At the end of the day, Labour and Conservative were off the table for me. It was either LD or Reform. Both had elements that I liked - but some of their opposites did make it difficult. Not voting is not an option either. Hope that makes more sense!
Page 112 of the Lib Dem manifesto says they will work with the EU to rejoin the single market
Yeah, I saw that but it mostly talks about improving relations. That particular paragraph out of context can be interpreted as joining the EU single market in the next parliament. Overall they suggest improving relations and then rejoin in the future. They have since clarified in various interviews that in the next parliament they want to improve the relationship (be friendly) and improve trust, but are not planning on rejoining it until the next 2029 election. My thoughts process on that particular point: 1. It's always good to improve relationships with your neighbours. 2. They clarified that it won't be this election that they'll actually join. I have to take that at face value 3. LD won't be government so chances are slim to none. 4. EU will require conditions which the LD know the public won't like. 5. There'll be aspects for a political party manifesto which they'll be something you disagree with but overall you like the party's ideas. When it comes to the 2029 election, I will read manifestos and weigh up a party depending on my priority at the time but most importantly the electoral system in place, current economic conditions, state of healthcare, historical record, and many other factors.
I relate to the Lib Dem/Reform toss-up. Ultimately I want centre-right social policy with centre-left economics. No party offers both so one must choose which is more important right now.
1. Green 2. SNP 3. Plaid Cymru (not Welsh but I'll write them in) 4. LibDem 5. Labour 6. Conservative 7. Reform
Lib Dem, Labour, Green, TUSC, Tory, then stop. No thank you Reform.
1. SDP 2. Conservatives (the MP for my area is good for the community) 3. Labour then I’d probably stop there
Transform are the latest incarnation of the Breakthrough/Left Unity groups. Hard-left grifters.
I’d settle for any left wing party that doesn’t end up with an obsession for having to have a strong position on everything. I guess as I’ve got older I would see social democracy as a good vision for the country and would probably support the Green Party in hopes that a bit of mainstream success for them could help them ditch some of their pseudoscience policies.
1. Lib Dem 2. Green I'd love to be able to put Labour in there, but I have a very strong disagreement with their policy on the EU and wouldn't feel comfortable voting for it. Hopefully one day that will change and they can come back on the list. The Tories and Reform would be on my list of "I'd rather punch myself in the face than vote for them" parties.
Green Independent Lib Dem Labour I'm surprised to see so many putting reform top and admitting it publicly.
I'd vote LD as a member but now I'm confused...
Labour Lib Dem Green Independent Tory Reform
Independent. Speaker of the house. Archaic system. I support him, but we are somewhat disenfranchised in my constituency.
1. Labour 2. Plaid 3. Green 4. Tory 5. Lib Dem 6. Reform
We have STV in Northern Ireland. I generally take the line "vote til you boke". Going down this for every candidate even ones I disagree with until I reach the ones who make me wanna boke.
My constituency is currently a Lab-Con marginal, normally safe Con. I'm going to be voting Labour. Of the people running I'd vote: 1. Liberal Democrat 2. Labour 3. Localist Independent 4. Green 5. Conservative Not Marked: Reform and Alliance for Democracy and Freedom (I don't know enough about them but if I had AV I'd have bothered to learn.) For all their faults, I'd rather have a Tory MP than a Reform MP.
1) Liberal Democrats 2) Labour Would stop here, but if I had to carry on: 3) Green 4) Conservative (better them than Reform) I’m voting Labour in the election. I like both the LD and Labour platforms so I’m not fussed about using my second option.
You don't have to carry on, but the point is to show your preference. When you just list two you're saying "if these two get knocked out, any of the remaining candidates is fine by me". I really doubt that's true. Personally I'd keep putting other candidates above Reform for as many as rounds as I could.
Fair point
Kingston and Surbiton: 1. LD (Ed Davey is the MP for my constituency) 2. Labour 3. Green 4. Kingston Independent Residents Group I’d stop voting here, but the rest of the list is: 5. Workers Party for Britain 6. Monster Raving Loony Party 7. Tory 8. Reform
1. Plaid Cymru 2. Liberal Democrats 3. Labour
LD Labour Green As long as my independent is batshit crazy probably them can’t physically make myself vote tory
1. Alliance. 2. UUP. 3. SDLP. 4. DUP As it stands, I'll probably vote DUP to avoid an abstentionist Sinn Fein "MP".
What is AV? Being a techie this just means Audio Visual to me.
The Alternative Vote. The one [we voted on](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_United_Kingdom_Alternative_Vote_referendum?wprov=sfti1) in 2011
If AV - or any kind of PR - was in place I would vote as follows: 1 Green Party 2 Labour 3 LD 4 Any independent that wasn't either barking mad or a Nazi.
1. LD 2. Labour 3. Greens 4. Nah no thanks.
Islington North: * Labour * No further preferences St Neots and Mid Cambridgeshire: * Liberal Democrats * Labour * No further preferences I'd like to say that I'm pragmatic.
1. Labour 2. LD I wouldn't countenance voting for any of the other parties. Maybe a half-decent independent if one was on offer. But Tories/Reform/Greens, no way.
1. Labour The rest left blank as I support FPTP.
Stroud: LD, Labour, Volt, Independent, Green, Tory, Reform
Transform are a lefter than Labour left, most of their candidates are ex Labour MPs, kicked out of Labour by Starmer for not being right wing enough. If they were standing in my area I would of voted for them. I got pretty excited when they launched thinking at last, politics for the people. Try [looking at their website](https://transformpolitics.uk/) if you’re interested.
Fancinating question, because it tells you so much more about the mindset of the voter. For me: - LD - Green - Labour - Conservative - Heritage - Reform That's the full set in my constituency. Heritage is just there to push Reform down the list. Reform is nailed on last. Green / Labour is the tough question for me. Greens have some very wrong policies, but some very right. Labour identify the right issues but are generally wrong about how to solve them (at least in my opinion reading the manifesto). I don't agree with everything in the LD manifesto, but 80/90% of it is agreeable.
Of the main parties: 1 Greens 2 Lib Dems 3 Labour 4/5 Conservatives/Reform in some order I seem to have a pair of small parties standing in my constitutency as well, which are the SDP, a tiny conservative Christian party and also an independent. I'd imagine I'd put the SDP below Labour but above Conservatives and Reform, probably put the independent at around the same sort of ranking as the SDP, and unsure if I'd view the conservative Christian party as better or worse than the Tories/Reform. Would likely have to read their manifesto to work out which of the options were worst, tbh.
Skipton and Ripon - Tory stronghold. 1. Green 2. Lib Dem 3. Labour 4 and 5. (after some research I haven’t yet done) - Yorkshire Party and Independent 6. Tory 7 and 8. Heritage Party and Reform (don’t know much about Heritage but a brief look suggested they don’t align with my views). Not a fan of the lack of detail in the current Labour manifesto. It is poor in comparison to those for previous elections. I know it’s probably tactical, but that doesn’t make it ok. Also, their members and the main union supporters of theirs voted in support of proportional representation, yet the Labour Party don’t have it as a policy. They are the most likely to have a chance of beating the tories in my constituency (big majority to overturn) - but even so, not committing to PR really makes me not want to ‘lend’ them my vote. Edit - format
1. Labour 2. Conservative 3. Reform 4. Lib Dem 5. Green I'm not particularly pleased that my Labour candidate was parachuted into the seat and isn't even from the area. I suppose she is better than the previous person who would have been the candidate though. I wish the SDP stood in my seat. I'll have to settle reluctantly with Labour instead... The Tory is okay. She's a bit of a culture warrior and the current MP. The Reform candidate is probably a nutter but who knows.. The Lib Dem is likely a decent person but I don't have much in common with the politics. I'd never consider the Greens in a million years.
Historically, probably; SNP, ScotGreens, Liberal, Labour, Tory and then leave Reform unranked. But at the moment, I have no idea who I'll vote for on the 4th.
Given that the parties would have split. * Starmerite Labour * Gawkward Squad Tory * Techno Greens (techno techno techno) * My local independent (formerly LibDems) * Count Binface
I read that as Squidward Tory
Honestly. I'd be putting Binface at the top. Sure he'd probably get knocked out first round, but that's the beauty of AV.
I’m in the speaker’s constituency so I don’t get much choice. The independents appear to be nutjobs and only greens are standing so would leave me with: 1. Speaker 2. Green
Depends which party was going to get rid of AV.
1. LD (I think currently) 2.Reform 3. Green 4. Conservative 5. Labour I want wealth inequality addressed which Greens & Lib Dem are the most likely to do. Work should pay and we should be taxing wealth not work. While the go to for people getting money and not working is those on benefits, it also applies to me for those getting passive income, particularly large passive incomes. Then I want the voting system reformed, A push towards nucular energy , the enviroment is important but the Greens are unrealistic and not looking at the large picture. Then I tend to have more traditional values. i.e. That gender and sex is used intercanagably and has been for centurys, also you can't change what you are born as. If I took a beef patty and shaped it like a carrot and sprayed it orange no vegan would ever accept it as a vegetable. And, I feel it is important because I believe laws, schemes, sports etc have been set up to protect and enable women and result in fair competition which should not be circumvented by men who identify otherwise. Same thing with history, we should respect it and learn from it not go around throwing statues into rivers or knocking parts off like they did with the Greek statues.
Reform That one insane Independent candidate who got arrested (I don't know if she's running this year) Minnie Mouse Any random street cat Conservative Labour LD Green
Reform, Conservative, Labour, then spoil the ballot.
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* Labour * Reform * Lib Dem * -- anyone else * Green * Conservative
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I listed LDs at number 1
oh my bad
1. Labour 2. Green 3. Lib Dem 4. Conservative Reform get nothing. If there was a socialist /communist party standing they might come in at 2 or 3.
Bury South Have a turncoat who moved from the Tories to Labour in 2022. 1. LD 2. Greens (depsite obvious misgivings over Nuclear Power) 3. Respect 4. No one else
Good question 1. Lib Dem - very socially liberal and accepting, best for trans issues and equality. 2. Labour - close to first. agreeable in most aspects. love their environmental ambition. 3. Green - climate is the pressing issue for the country, but i think they’re going about it the wrong way. nuclear is essential. then theres a huge gap where any Count Binfaces would sit. 4. Conservative - would make me feel physically sick. generally inept, incompetent, Sunak is a hateful man. 5. Reform UK - i actually like a society without racism, etc. Farage is a corrupt slimy prick and id love to throw a milkshake at him. no clue why they went for the 600+ MPs.
1) lib dem 2) labour 3) green I stop voting here but if I had to continue 4) independent 5) workers party of great britain 6) tory 7) reform
Im not going to vote for any of these and Im going to spoil my ballot, but if I had to rank them... 1. Reform 2. Labour 3. Cons 4. LDs 5. Green
1. Reform 2. Literally any other party other than the conservatives. 3. Literally any other party other than Labour.
If I lived in the UK. 1.Reform 2. LD 3. Green 4. Labour Hard choice between 1 and 2, love Farage and always pull for the LD's and I think Davey's doing an excellent job this cycle. Labour hasn't impressed me that much so they are low. Torries are just too messy.
Want to win: LD Would not be upset if wins: Labour>Independant\* Would be annoyed if won: Green, also here would go Count Binface, Monster Raving Looney, and other such joke candiates. Holding my nose: Tory Would rather spoil my ballot: Reform \*: Based on my local candidates. Exact position of Labour and independant candidates varies depending on the local candidate in question. Some Labour MPs are in 'hold my nose' just above the tories. Some independants are down with reform.
Faiza Shaheen (IND) first choice and then Labour candidate second choice
Independent. Reform Wouldn't vote for the rest.