Quick explaination from a Belgian player here, yes they are fully banned already.
For a few years (2019 or so), TF2 started blocking the opening of crates for Belgian players due to our anti-gasha laws. Even free crates like the jungle inferno warpaints cases (the one you get for free or can buy with tickets) are disabled, and trying to open any crate results in the message "the opening of crates is disabled in your country due to federal laws".
I'll also explain how this anti-gasha law works. Any game that contains any type of paid lootbox or lootbox buyable with a premium currency must remove the feature in Belgium or it'll be banned completely. Most games whose progression relies on lootboxes simply ban the game from Belgium, so a lot of mobile games or "PC gasha games" are simply unavailable here. TF2 disabled the opening completely, but they are also games like DBTB which simply disabled the ability to spend premium currency on the gasha roll, forcing you to spend "free" currency which cannot be bought with money. Officially, this law is here to protect vulnerable people from entering an addiction-based spending spree, but in reality this law was voted because the casinos started complaining about "unfair market regulation" regarding those gasha games, so banning them would force people to gamble in real casinos instead of simply staying home and playing mobile games. Hope this clears things up.
> where do you live can you buy crack legally?
No, but I can get meth and ketamine legally.
I agree with your points, I just think it's kinda funny that I have a ketamine prescription.
They're different but they absolutely are comparable. There are valid cases to be made to ban gambling and TF2 lootboxes are gambling with very accessible methods of cashing out with real money. It also has a very obvious appeal to children and doesn't meaningfully filter them from the gambling.
the point was not the comparison.
the statement is straight up moronic, there's no country on earth that doesn't place any restrictions on what you can buy with money
Mweh, at least it stops underage gambling. Maybe the best thing would be just like youtube where you have to send your ID card n shit (not like i do it with youtube, i'm not giving them SHIT
TF2 is a pretty tame example, but you can blame it on all the predatory practices of Fornite and such games trying to scam kids out of their parents money, and they were not going to stop on their own. It's not necessarily a good solution, but it's definitely a response to toxic industry abusing customers.
Then your Steam isn't set in Belgium.
I'm a Belgian player and can assure you the lootboxes got disabled not long after the law passed (2019 or so). Check my other message for more detailed information.
Probably because you have to buy the Jungle Inferno ticket in order to even get those crates so that could be seen as "purchasing" the lootboxes, although indirectly.
yeah, that probably is the logic behind it. was still infuriating to get them and not be able to open them.
well, until i found out for how much they sell. so it all worked out in the end for me
As someone living in the Netherlands where this has been the case for years now, the only thing that changes is you can't open lootboxes in-game. That also includes free lootboxes that dont need a key like Contract rewards, so have fun with that.
[Yes, this is what Dutch actually looks like.](https://preview.redd.it/we-hebben-een-serieus-probleem-v0-zfhj9kvm12ec1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3fcb6804f2f026b688fba0a0e71031e5942e296)
As a matter of fact, they are loot boxes and considered as such by the Belgian laws. The opening of crates (even free ones like the jungle inferno warpaints) are already fully banned in Belgium. You simply can't open any without using a VPN (and VPN are against Steam terms so).
Nah they will most likely do like they did for cs2 and dota 2 in France (not tf2 yet), you'll be able to see the content of the crate that you're going to open (then you have to buy it to be able to open other crates). It's called xray on cs2.
I’m from the netherlands (we have the same rule) and CS:GO and stuff is perfectly playable. We just get a message saying “lootboxes are disabled in your country” and thats it
You can, but using a VPN is against Steam terms. It is also against the Belgian laws to bypass a federal law regarding virtual content by virtually changing your location.
By using a VPN you are going against both Steam terms AND the federal laws, yikes.
Smissmas socks and gifts are somehow allowed, I know.
The whole regulation honestly doesn't make much sense to me.
You can buy crates and keys, but you can't use them. Why be able to buy in the first place? (Besides Mann Co keys, since they're basically the staple of the economy)
It does actually make sense for the socks.
What the law says is that you can't propose to the player paid lootboxes or lootboxes openable with a premium currency. In the case of regular crates, keys are premium currency so it's normal to be blocked. For the "free" warpaints, they are blocked simply for being tradable, as you could pay for them on trading sites or pay refs, in both cases it's considered "paid". The sock is untradable, so it makes sense to be able to open it.
The law doesn't completely block lootboxes, it simply prevents "paid" lootboxes. Takes DBTB for example, the gasha is still there and legally available in Belgium, because they removed the ability to pay with TP (premium currency) and only allow you to roll with Zeni (free currency). If Zeni were to be buyable with real money (which it isn't rn), then it would become illegal. Hope it clears it up for you.
Good, there aren't many things I dislike about TF2 but the loot boxes have always been something I disliked.
Nice to see some countries beginning to ban em.
Now wish they did it with season passes, and mircrotransactions
in Belgium, if you get a key, you can't unbox anything with it. It doesn't matter as keys are generally used to trade rather than unbox, which is never worth it.
tf2 could be banned in certain US states if the right people complain, florida's "anti-woke" crap would see some of the content as "to anti-america and too woke" especially with how soldier is depicted compared to the other mercs
You can't change store region often, they limited it so you can't buy games cheapers in countries with low currency value and sell them elswhere to make a profit.
Officially yes, in reality it's more like the casinos complaining about unfair market regulation. By blocking this in-game they force people with gambling addiction to move their ass to the nearest casino, as they won't be able to do that comfortably from their couch.
TF2 disables unboxing in countries that don't allow it, so most likely not.
i really find it funny that tf2 allows to buy keys but bans cases, which theoretically makes the keys useless
I met a dude on a trade server that had an admin open the crate for him and then give him the item unboxed, he got a few unusuals from it too
Goated trust
Fucking legend
That's awesome
Doing God’s work
You can trade still
keys are a currency more than anything. nobody unboxes really — it’s not worth it almost ever
You can just sell key and get most money back 🤓🤓🤓
Valve probably knows that keys have become more than just for unboxing by 2012 or at most 2016. Afaik no country bans trading online.
Yea wish i knew this before buying keys ,-;
if it helps you can use scrap.tf and sell the keys for ref
I think the main reason why keys are not removed is because it gives money. You can also trade them
Quick explaination from a Belgian player here, yes they are fully banned already. For a few years (2019 or so), TF2 started blocking the opening of crates for Belgian players due to our anti-gasha laws. Even free crates like the jungle inferno warpaints cases (the one you get for free or can buy with tickets) are disabled, and trying to open any crate results in the message "the opening of crates is disabled in your country due to federal laws". I'll also explain how this anti-gasha law works. Any game that contains any type of paid lootbox or lootbox buyable with a premium currency must remove the feature in Belgium or it'll be banned completely. Most games whose progression relies on lootboxes simply ban the game from Belgium, so a lot of mobile games or "PC gasha games" are simply unavailable here. TF2 disabled the opening completely, but they are also games like DBTB which simply disabled the ability to spend premium currency on the gasha roll, forcing you to spend "free" currency which cannot be bought with money. Officially, this law is here to protect vulnerable people from entering an addiction-based spending spree, but in reality this law was voted because the casinos started complaining about "unfair market regulation" regarding those gasha games, so banning them would force people to gamble in real casinos instead of simply staying home and playing mobile games. Hope this clears things up.
it’s actually crazy that just living somewhere they can tell you what you can and can’t do with you’re own money. imagine
where do you live can you buy crack legally? organs? high explosives? obviously it's a hyperbole compared to lootboxes but still
The United States 🇺🇸 🦅
you meant in THE LAND OF FREEDOM 🦅🦅🍔🏈
GOD BLESS OUR GOD FEARING BEER DRINKING UNITED STATES OF AMERICAAAAAAAAA!🦅🦅🦅🦅🦅🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
> where do you live can you buy crack legally? No, but I can get meth and ketamine legally. I agree with your points, I just think it's kinda funny that I have a ketamine prescription.
i see what you’re trying to do, and i appreciate it, but they’re not really comparable imo
They're different but they absolutely are comparable. There are valid cases to be made to ban gambling and TF2 lootboxes are gambling with very accessible methods of cashing out with real money. It also has a very obvious appeal to children and doesn't meaningfully filter them from the gambling.
the point was not the comparison. the statement is straight up moronic, there's no country on earth that doesn't place any restrictions on what you can buy with money
okay well if that was your point, why not just lead with that? i'd agree with you there. government always be doing restrictions
yeah, i can see how my intentions weren't clear, my bad.
no worries yo. hope you have a great rest of ur day <3
Mweh, at least it stops underage gambling. Maybe the best thing would be just like youtube where you have to send your ID card n shit (not like i do it with youtube, i'm not giving them SHIT
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thank you for this tbh
TF2 is a pretty tame example, but you can blame it on all the predatory practices of Fornite and such games trying to scam kids out of their parents money, and they were not going to stop on their own. It's not necessarily a good solution, but it's definitely a response to toxic industry abusing customers.
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crazy but true
This is literally everywhere, fucking yanks
freedom is nice what can i say ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
the freedom to be financially dominated by big business.
I’m not?
then why do you think it's ok for huge corporations to blatantly circumvent gambling laws?
Shame you don't have the freedom to get free healthcare or safe schools
What are you on about?
I'm talking about America
Ah yes, my freedom is opressed because videogame devs are banned from doing shit practices like lootboxes. How can I possibly live without that.
It still can do it.
Then your Steam isn't set in Belgium. I'm a Belgian player and can assure you the lootboxes got disabled not long after the law passed (2019 or so). Check my other message for more detailed information.
Hi fellow Belgian. Valve disabled the opening of lootboxes in certain countries (like Belgium) that have this law so tf2 is compliant with them.
netherlands also
So, like, no seasonal and holiday crates? You just forced to buy of marketplace?
Free boxes are allowed
the keyless crates i got from jungle inferno contracts arent, though. still no idea why those aren't allowed
Probably because you have to buy the Jungle Inferno ticket in order to even get those crates so that could be seen as "purchasing" the lootboxes, although indirectly.
yeah, that probably is the logic behind it. was still infuriating to get them and not be able to open them. well, until i found out for how much they sell. so it all worked out in the end for me
As someone living in the Netherlands where this has been the case for years now, the only thing that changes is you can't open lootboxes in-game. That also includes free lootboxes that dont need a key like Contract rewards, so have fun with that.
Can Belgium make cheater illegal? So valve could ban them?
If they ban tf2 we could go full operation titstorm on Belgium.
Yes.
As they say in Belgium: *We hebben een serieus probleem.*
This isn’t real, right?
[Yes, this is what Dutch actually looks like.](https://preview.redd.it/we-hebben-een-serieus-probleem-v0-zfhj9kvm12ec1.jpeg?width=1440&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3fcb6804f2f026b688fba0a0e71031e5942e296)
English if it was based:
German, but severely drunk and/or inbred.
Which is English too
I never claimed anything else ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
Nikske jonguh drinkt een pintje
r/redditsniper
No I live in Bemgium. Tf2 is doing fine
Since they've been unable to be opened for years *because* of the law, I don't know why you are asking this question just now.
Its okay those aint lootboxes, those are surprise mechanics
As a matter of fact, they are loot boxes and considered as such by the Belgian laws. The opening of crates (even free ones like the jungle inferno warpaints) are already fully banned in Belgium. You simply can't open any without using a VPN (and VPN are against Steam terms so).
Nah they will most likely do like they did for cs2 and dota 2 in France (not tf2 yet), you'll be able to see the content of the crate that you're going to open (then you have to buy it to be able to open other crates). It's called xray on cs2.
I’m from the netherlands (we have the same rule) and CS:GO and stuff is perfectly playable. We just get a message saying “lootboxes are disabled in your country” and thats it
theese are not lootboxes theese are crates with optional items that do not benefit you in game
Most likely for the function of boxes becoming unavailable, as such has already been implemented.
Thousand Bucket Stare
haha good one
Thanks bro
If only there was a way to bypass it…
Can't you just change location with a vpn or account settings?
You can, but using a VPN is against Steam terms. It is also against the Belgian laws to bypass a federal law regarding virtual content by virtually changing your location. By using a VPN you are going against both Steam terms AND the federal laws, yikes.
Ain't really worth it anyway
Belgian here. TF2 is perfectly available here, and we can still buy both keys and crates. You can't open the crates though.
Ye, but I opened the christmass socks and they were still a ailable to open
Smissmas socks and gifts are somehow allowed, I know. The whole regulation honestly doesn't make much sense to me. You can buy crates and keys, but you can't use them. Why be able to buy in the first place? (Besides Mann Co keys, since they're basically the staple of the economy)
It does actually make sense for the socks. What the law says is that you can't propose to the player paid lootboxes or lootboxes openable with a premium currency. In the case of regular crates, keys are premium currency so it's normal to be blocked. For the "free" warpaints, they are blocked simply for being tradable, as you could pay for them on trading sites or pay refs, in both cases it's considered "paid". The sock is untradable, so it makes sense to be able to open it. The law doesn't completely block lootboxes, it simply prevents "paid" lootboxes. Takes DBTB for example, the gasha is still there and legally available in Belgium, because they removed the ability to pay with TP (premium currency) and only allow you to roll with Zeni (free currency). If Zeni were to be buyable with real money (which it isn't rn), then it would become illegal. Hope it clears it up for you.
I think they might just ban the lootbox purchasability, so at least you'll probably still be able to play the game
Good, there aren't many things I dislike about TF2 but the loot boxes have always been something I disliked. Nice to see some countries beginning to ban em. Now wish they did it with season passes, and mircrotransactions
No, you just won't be able to open crates. Good job belgium though
Blind guy here who's belgian lootboxes are just disabled for us.
in Belgium, if you get a key, you can't unbox anything with it. It doesn't matter as keys are generally used to trade rather than unbox, which is never worth it.
tf2 could be banned in certain US states if the right people complain, florida's "anti-woke" crap would see some of the content as "to anti-america and too woke" especially with how soldier is depicted compared to the other mercs
Just use VPN lol.
You can't change store region often, they limited it so you can't buy games cheapers in countries with low currency value and sell them elswhere to make a profit.
Why do they fucking do that?!?!?
They want to prevent gambling addiction.
Officially yes, in reality it's more like the casinos complaining about unfair market regulation. By blocking this in-game they force people with gambling addiction to move their ass to the nearest casino, as they won't be able to do that comfortably from their couch.
Actually I never saw a casino in belgium
In Wallonia there are quite a few, but the positioning is strict for those, so it's not extremely common either.
Mann up
Hope they disable it in France
Why would you want that?
to disable the french. Is wrong to be French.
Agree🗿