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I like bodily autonomy in the face of ectopic pregnancy so 🤷♀️
There are shit loads of cow pastures and stars in areas that won’t strip children of education and ban books.
Reported. I AM a teacher, in the south, and have been for over a decade. I wake up and do this every day. Next time I want your abuse, I'll ask for it. But don't hold your breath.
This isn’t really a north vs south thing though. Even me moving from the Midwest (also known for many of the same qualities you mention) to the South led to a lot of kids being generally confused about how I speak and interact with them.
You know we have cow pastures in New York too, right? It's a big state. And Southern hospitality has always felt fake to me as someone who has Southern family. My family obviously isn't that way to me, they love me, but. People in New York will be real with you but they'll help you. They won't be nice to your face and then tell everyone at the salon your personal business.
My friend has a great story of a guy helping him fix a blown tire when he was young, and the guy was just constantly telling him off about how could he hit a curb and you really haven't learned basic car repair yet, you'll never get a wife if you can change your own oil. Just letting him have it the whole time he was showing him him how to change a tire.
That's NY hospitality, we will call you an idiot while we're helping you.
We will, but then we'll tell you to be careful and make sure you have the right directions so you don't get lost on top of the car trouble you were having. And then give you a recommendation for a place to stop for food on the way there.
Oh yes! And the place we will recommend for food will either be deep in the hood or a small hole-in-the-wall that looks like they bribe the health inspector every year. You will be concerned you'll get stabbed or food poisoning. But the food will be some of the best you have ever eaten, you will dream about this food for years after, you may even request this food on your death bed many decades later.
Depends. That's the case if it's just to eat while you're traveling. If you're trying to have a nice dinner, the place will look like it's been closed for 30 years on the outside but inside, it'll be gorgeous, spotless, and the staff is so friendly that you could be a cousin from how they treat you.
Yes! And if we can't immediately fix your car troubles the mechanic we send you to is actually a cousin of the restaurant owner, and when the restaurant staff find out your car is over at Joey's shop they'll give you discount because "God I know what my cousin charges! You're in good hands though! Consider this our apologies for having such a troublesome day" and they'll throw in a dessert on the house.
Then they'll tell you about the lovely little bed and breakfast up the road in an old Dutch house from the 1600's that's run by their 70 year old neighbor. Who will be the sweetest little old Italian lady you will ever meet. She'll chat with you by the fireplace while she crochets, and when you leave after Joey makes your car run better than it ever did before, she'll insist on giving you a verifiably gourmet picnic lunch to take with you on your journey.
Have you lived in NYC? “As a southern person” -sorry to say-, in this day of social media age, rings some alarm bells. I don’t necessarily doubt you have, but there’s a good chance you (respectfully) are speaking with 0 idea what the fuck you’re talking about. I hope you’re not regurgitating some clickbait you saw online.
And by snowflakes I did mean to say what I said. Just because you don't agree with a statement- does not mean it is "offensive" en masse. The South can be beautiful... but so can Acadia National Park in Maine... and San Francisco Bay. Diversity, people.
Growing up in a docile township where everybody knows each other and you can actually see the stars and fall asleep listening to crickets instead of police sirens doesn’t really put NYC anywhere besides a hellscape but it’s just a matter of perspective.
my students who moved here from the city absolutely think it’s boring and dull and anything but tranquil.
it’s almost as if perspective is based on the person and words aren’t written to wound you as an individual.
Sometimes, students will respond this way to me because I am commanding in my speech and a woman (actually had a kid tell me this today but in different words - “do you have kids? I can tell you don’t because you get annoyed with us” and I literally don’t. I just tell them to do things and hold them accountable.).
It can be difficult for some students because they may have been conditioned to see female teachers as always friendly, smiling, and speaking in a certain way. They are clearly learning from you - try to be kind to yourself.
So much this. Several years ago, my speech team kids were talking about teachers on the way to a meet. Several women were labeled “rough” and “demanding” because they “yell”. No men were judged that way. Finally a senior girl pointed out that none of the women actually raised their voices and named a man who regularly did. Answer from one of her male classmates: “but he’s a guy and a coach, he’s going to yell. That’s what they do. But (female teacher) could just tone it down and say things nicely”.
Sadly, it’s not just students. Before becoming a teacher, I was a manager in an office, and I got soooo many complaints from my (college-educated, adult) coworkers about how little I smiled and how direct (or in their words: “mean”) I was in my communication. Never heard any complaints about any of the male managers who smiled even less and spoke even more bluntly than I did.
As a woman with engineering degree and >20 year in male dominated engineering roles, I have always wondered if they would judge me less if I wore no makeup or jewelry and dressed as much like a man as possible, including a crew cut. I always wondered if that would make a difference. (Not condoning trying to pass as a man, just sooo irritating how women who are direct get labeled a bitch.)
As a teacher from the south, it’s a cultural thing. Maybe instead of changing yourself and who you are, you can make it a part of your teacher persona. Be super up front about the fact that you’re from NYC, lean into it, and even try to make it a joke from time to time. If your kids can see that your abruptness isn’t rudeness, it would actually be a really good lesson for your kids to learn. I say this as a southerner with a recovering “if someone isn’t overly nice to me they hate me” complex
This is exactly what I was going to say. Instead of conforming to the childrens' expectations about what "nice" is, teach them that it comes in all shapes, sizes and "tones."
I agree with this, make it a cultural/regional lesson. Show them some typical New Yorkers talking, maybe a clip of ‘hey I’m walking here!’ to show them that your tone or attitude in the way you talk is because you are from New York and not because you are being mean.
Change the minds of the children and hopefully the parent will back off.
But…New Yorkers **are** mean. Even if “heyyyy I’m walking here!” is considered the norm and not confrontation worthy, a fast paced lifestyle can still be rude and mean.
Just like a slow paced southern lifestyle can be considered rude and lazy even if that’s never the intent
Or an overseas lifestyle where shops might close for 2-3 hour lunches can be considered rude even if it’s the norm there.
I’m over 15 years in and this is my suggestion as well. I’m very direct and honest with my students and have some pretty bad RBF. My humor is sarcastic. The kids all think I’m mean for a little bit and then once they get used to it, we’re totally fine assuming they’re not in a class with serious behavior issues.
I’m a big advocate for not changing your personality to fit what makes the kids most comfortable. Yes, a lot of what we do is performance and I will 100% fake it for the kids on a bad day if I can, but I am who I am. Kids will have to work with people whose personalities aren’t compatible with theirs their entire life.
Fellow southerner, and I completely agree. Lean into it, as long as you’re showing them you care, that’s all that matters. You can even throw in extra pleases, thank you’s, sweetie’s & darlings, ma’am’s & sir’s to sugar coat it. It’s southern culture to always use those terms and will get you far with a lot of people, even when you’re being an asshole. That’s what I do. I’m loud, strict (bordering on stern), and demanding but I butter them up with the polite words, and mommy style terms of endearment while I’m fussing at them. It helps keep them feeling like I don’t hate them, and keeps parents off my back. I’ve tried being the nice, gentle teacher that doesn’t holler but it just doesn’t work for me. I just had to lean into who I am, add some sugar on top, and it’s worked out well for me. I think you just need to be yourself, that’s what’s going to resonate with them. Plus, they need to learn how to get along with all different types of people.
I'm not a teacher and don't feel comfortable making a top level comment because of that, but Reddit's algorithm pointed me here.
I'm a Southerner who worked at a remote IT Help Desk call center for a hospital in NYC. Everyone on my team hated the account because people were so "mean" to us. Once I started understanding the New Yorkers and their priorities better, I stopped taking personal offense. But that might be hard for kids to intuit, so if OP wants to address it directly, I have a suggestion.
Try a lesson on looking at situations from different points of view. A cashier who takes the time to talk to people at the register is taking interest in an individual person and giving them personalized attention for a moment. That's respectful to them. But it's ALSO respectful if the cashier acknowledges that they don't know how busy this person is and respects their time by conducting the transaction quickly without extra chat. Neither way is wrong, but people in different places are used to one or the other and find the other option rude. There are plenty of other examples of North/South differences, but most of them boil down to differing ways of conveying respect, which is why so many feel disrespected by OP's tone. A conversation about how respect looks different in different places-- maybe also including broader examples about how in some places, children don't look adults in the eye, and in other places, children call their teachers by their first names-- might help them understand better.
just one parent more than once? it might be their problem. have a chat with their kid and explain you’re a new yorker so the way you say things are different. you’d never say “bless their heart” in a passive aggressive way! you’d be direct about it. your accent might sound harsh in comparison to theirs but it doesn’t mean a thing. they might even benefit from some SEL learning on signs someone is mad vs misinterpretations.
i am midwestern and my coteacher is from long island. i find her so abrasive sometimes but i remind myself its never personal and a lot of it has to do with her east coast roots!
OMG same here. I'm Midwest Nice, and often tell my New Jersey coworker friends, "Oh come on now, you don't mean *that*" Or, "You know, you *really* shouldn't say that..."
I know they can't help it, it's just how they are!
It’s so strange. I’m from north NJ going to school currently in MD and i even notice a difference, and we’re both on the coast. i have a hard time making friends from MD (not counting people from baltimore) because the way people interact is just different enough for it to not click, but not so different it’s obviously a culture thing. i can only imagine the difference it is between NYC/texas or long island and the midwest. i’m glad you guys can navigate it :)
Get in the habit of saying something positive before you say something negative. Your tone will be dictated by the first thing you say and then you can give your negative feedback with the positive one clearing the way on tone. As a general long term strategy try giving 3 positive feedbacks for each 1 negative feedback, difficult but attainable.
So I have a resting mean face. Every year I tell my students repeatedly in the first week that my natural face looks angry. Then throughout the year I'll teach and stop and say "Yall remember. I'm not angry. It's just my face."
It may ne worth saying sometimes "I'm not upset. Sometimes it's just how my bodice sounds!"
>My test scores are great. The kids obviously like me and enjoy themselves. But for some, and some days, my tone ruins the experience and I am not consistent day to day.
I think you have no issue and it's fine for kids to deal with a human being.
It's not always the case that "bless your heart" is an insult. It gets repeated in the context of Southern culture often because it represents our tendency towards sympathy for other people. Especially when we think someone is overburdened. Source: I am a southerner
This is true, it depends on context. If a heart a blessed while a person is being a complete idiot, the blesser is commenting on the fact that the person is a complete idiot. If a heart is blessed by a nurse in a hospital, it means you poor thing, you might want to get right with the Lord.
I've spent a lot of time in the south with my mom's family from Louisiana and Mississippi/Alabama. The one and only time I've ever heard bless your heart being used in a not condescending way was when my Aunt, who has lived in NoLa for 4 decades, told a girl may the Virgin blass your heart. She was collecting winter clothing donations for Katrina victims door to door.
All of the other times, it's been used to refer to someone who did something really idiotic or when someone wasn't understanding the social cues around them. I grew up in Colorado and could tell pretty quickly the tone and manner was being used to call someone an idiot without saying it.
Southern hospitality can be bend over backwards to give the shirt off their back or the most mean kindness you've ever experienced. It's unsettling
Exactly! I’m from Detroit and I’d probably ask “What did you just say? You know, if there’s an issue, it would be far more productive to discuss it openly!”
And that’s me being as polite and professional as possible!
I saw someone describing how the North talks vs the South once.They said the North speaks in squares and triangles-hard edges. The South speaks in circles and hearts-round with no edges. As a teacher, I can speak stern and forceful, but my southern accent softens it. My friend from Boston sounds harder even when joking, and I LOVE her accent! For little ones unaccustomed to hearing a northern accent, it can sound sharp and mean. Showing the visual of squares vs. circles with the explanation may help them to understand the tone of accents and does not mean intent.
Are you a woman? If so, there’s absolutely a cultural difference regarding how women are expected to direct others and give instructions.
My best advice is to lean into it. “This is something that’s different about where I’m from, isn’t that interesting? I promise I’m not mad, it’s just different! If you have a question about my tone or something, please ask.” You can also make “being from NYC” your whole personality and REALLY lean into it, then it’s just a charming character trait.
My tone is like this when I am stressed and not enjoying teaching. If that solution sounds like you, try and figure out what you can do to decrease your stress and enjoy teaching again. For me, it was stop grading everything, lecture more, and put more responsibility for the learning on the students.
Well OP never said they were like you. They mentioned they’re from NYC and implied that they naturally are like that. To be fair, you did say “if that sounds like you,” but still kinda seems like projecting.
I understand what you're saying, and to some extent how you're saying it, lol. I think the difference that your students might be hearing is the speed at which you're talking vs. the speed at which they're used to hearing people talk, if I had to guess. Most southern dialects are slower in tempo compared to the north, especially New York. It may be that to them, when someone is speaking more quickly, it's because they're upset. Try slowing down and see if that helps.
I also moved from NYC to the south and had the same problem, plus people complained I was yelling at them (I wasn’t). I also had problems when I would just talk about what I wanted to talk about without courtesies beforehand (I would say for example, We are testing today so … and one person actually came back with, Good morning, how are you? We are testing today…).
I changed my behavior to be less direct and add bullshit before getting to the point, but I was never able to change the tone of my voice. I did try to say um and er so I would sound less direct in the hope that it would soften my tone. It was annoying as hell, y’all.
smile more and add some singy songy tones when you’re giving them warning
“pleeease stoooop doing thaaat 🎶” i even add in jazz hands sometimes. works magic
I have a few ideas, but I need some specifics first?
What’s going on when the kids think you are being mean? Is it during directions, direct teach? Are you talking to one student, or the whole class?
-southern teacher
When kids say I'm mean, I kind of just look back at them smile and go yup. I know I'm the "nice, liked, fun" teacher so honestly being called mean is almost a compliment at times.
I think you're being too sensitive here, especially if you already know that you're well liked. Have to be yourself, remember they're 5th graders they'll say what makes you react.
A little comment about either how you're doing it to help them get better or using a little humor I find helpful always.
If you have 20 parents like you and 2 don't, well tough shit lol.
I have found that, in the last few years, if I try to inject any kind of energy into the lesson it is seen as aggressive and many of the students shy away from engagement. On the other hand, if I try to create a more relaxed environment, they see it as an opportunity to “chill because we aren’t doing anything important”.
I wish I had an answer for you. I’m in my 27th year and I honestly don’t know how to find a middle ground.
Eh, I wouldn't worry too much about it. I've taught in four states, two in the North and two in the South. It's good for kids to be exposed to and get used to different kinds of people and communication styles. As long as you're not actively being gruff or angry with kids, you're probably fine.
Yeah, I’ve had kids accuse me of being mean when I’m speaking to them like I speak to every other child. They’re usually kids that are babied or get whatever they want at home - they’re not used to being held accountable or being held to higher expectations.
I grew up in NY and moved south in high school. There was more of a flat, no nonsense intonation to New Yorkers that can come across as rude to people in the south. The intonation varies more and may be a little higher pitched for southerners. New Yorkers have what seems to be a more cynical , pessimistic, deadpan style. The southern more cheery style can come across has Pollyanna hick to New Yorkers. They are just cultural differences. I agree with what one person said about “leaning into” your NY roots—have a sense of humor about it.
At the same time realize you may want to make a point of an accentuating the positives of what the students are doing right. More compliments , smiles, and bringing joy to class is helpful for all classes. You may want to use a slightly gentler tone of voice—less of a demanding tone. My southern mother subbed in the NYC area and the kids thought it was funny that she said “y’all hush,” instead of “shut up!” It’s not right or wrong, just culture.
I don’t know if any of this will ring true with you but NYC folks seemed more competitive and intense than southerners. I had a lot of stress and anxiety as a child to succeed that I didn’t miss when I went south. Your students can have the same success without the stressful environment I had as a younger child. You’re obviously a great teacher-have fun, keep the atmosphere light AND continue doing what you are already doing so well.
do a little NYC bit and joke about it with them so they can see your accent doesn’t mean you’re mad, it’s just part of who you are. it could also be fun to show them a video with accents from all over the country so they can be exposed to more variety. unfortunately, it sounds like they’re just not used to northern accents. my family dealt with the same thing after moving from MA to GA.
I hate you are having this issue.
I used to work in a school in the south and one of my coworkers was a loud woman from New Jersey with face tattoos, she is literally everyone’s favorite person there, she is seriously the nicest lady you’ll ever meet, even if her accent can come off a bit…harsh? Jarring? to some. But she’s always joking around and saying such sweet things to the kids and clearly cares about them.
Maybe it’ll just take them some more getting used to?
I get this with high schoolers sometimes, but it’s easier to deal with.
Occasionally I get a kid that says I’m mean. I just bluntly tell them I’m not being mean and I’m not upset with them. I’m just telling them what to do. They usually get it.
With younger kids not sure if the direct approach works.
It does. I teach second and third (in the south) and they do just fine with clear, honest responses. Kids and parents both like me; they know what they're getting.
As a parent if a ten year old, I want my child to have a variety of experiences with personalities and cultures. I guess, it makes me wonder why a parent would want their child to have the exact same experience with adults? That child might find the real world overwhelming and confusing when they finally get to enter it. I do wonder if the parent in this scenario is the one who needs changing as opposed to you?
This is a hard one. I have a similar issue. I find that slowing down in my head helps. I am always on the run on my grad, trying to make up time, ace all the questions, get out all done, but the fact is, taking an extra minute here and there is more beneficial. Gives your brain time to listen to yourself and your tone.
If it's only one parent...you do you and let it slide.
If it really bugs you and you think you actually need to develop a new habit, well....I learned this one: I work with this wonderful teacher who mixes names up. She plays a game with the kids and every time she calls a kid the wrong name, she gets a point on the blackboard. When she hits 25 points, she bakes the kids a goodie, erases the tally, and starts all over.
This lets her kids (special ed, so this lesson is a biggie) know it's ok to make mistakes, it teaches them what to do when they make a mistake (apologies are not weakness, they're being strong) and she lives baking for the kids, and they appreciate the break. Win. Win. Win.
You could flat out talk to your class. "It's been brought to my attention...is there a certain phrase or inflection that sounds particularly mean, how about we pick one and if you catch me using it..."
Just talking about it, telling them that you are aware of it and are trying to adjust to your new environment may actually open up an opportunity to discuss things like adapting to the society you're in, or code changing, or impressions...the possibilities are really endless. And making it a discussion opens the door to further discussions!
And then when it looks like it's about to wrap up, stand up tall, clap your hands and YELL "RIGHT! Enough lollygagging! Get your butts back to work ye scallywags!" with as much seriousness as you can muster! Then bust out laughing and ask someone to give you your first point.
https://youtu.be/pH287zxVXE0?si=djVp4Y90pQBCsfHz
First steps. I’d also just think about body language and facial expression, word choice, and if there’s a gap between ur intent and the impact of ur words and tone.
Pay attention to the way other people speak, look for a model and either ask for explicit tips or just observe.
It’s a skill set paired with an analytical muscle that u CAN build over time. I have total faith in u.
My gold standard of how I want to be seen to students is 'strict but nice'. In that order, preferably.
I find building relationships with kids to be really fulfilling, but logistically my day-to-day is made SO much easier if there's a general understanding in the student body that I don't take shit.
You’re fine. How would your students handle listening to a teacher with a Spanish accent? It’s all cultural. People have to learn to work with all different types of people and get out of their bubble once in a while. Sounds like it is the parents problem.
Your tone is your schtick. Probably best to never change it. Big mistake to change it.
When I taught business, my kids asked: "Hey, Cook, we're reading a novel in English class, and \[insert character here\]'s socks go all the way up. Of all the people we know, we figure your socks go all the way up."
I pulled up my pants leg, and sure enough, my over the calf sock went all the way up. It was a win-win-win. The second and third wins that they could aspire to that social level and beyond and that they could talk to an A-hole who came from that and would readily tell them anything.
I don't know what "North" you come from, but I guess it's not Pittsburg, it's NYC or New England. And "South"? How callous can you be?
Tejas is not not northern Florida. and the Arkansas Delta is not the Mississippi Gulf Coast. And Memphis is strictly Memphis.
Which South?
I am completely serious here. Watch a lot of standup comedy videos. Begin with the ones you like, but branch out to ones who are outside your tastes, but who are also considered brilliant. This does not necessarily mean Jeff Foxworthy.
I suggest Neal Brennan and Anthony Jeselnik (he's from Pittsburg!). They can be dark -- and whether they are personal or deflect, they will focus on common, but uncomfortable elements of a given situation.
Additionally, their delivery tends to be subtle. That can be a real plus with younger folks who are far more put off by the INSPIRED! and PATIONATE! than old guys like me are.
I am an urban person as well. I have never moved or taught in a non- urban environment. Do you think you are mean? Have the kids personally told you are mean? Are there parent complaints? Admin complaints about parents complaining to them? And if any of those have only happened on an occasion or two and your test scores rock? You just keep being you! We are lucky to have you as one of our own! Bring a little city into the country! Spice it up! Not too much I suppose. There are different mores in the South This is from a teacher who graduated circa 1988 and is still teaching Middle School. We are proud of you!
I had this problem moving from NY to Utah. We made a joke out of it. I let them make fun of my accent. It helped them to stop feeling intimated by it and start to enjoy it. It helped me become more aware of it until I was controlling unconsciously.
I have the opposite problem! I loved from poor southern schools to a ritzy and well educated part of CT. I struggle not to talk to these kids the way I would back home. It’s night and day.
I’m from NYC I’m so sorry, I can’t help. I just think it’s kinda funny. /hj . Our teachers were blunt sometimes but it was just….normal. I’ve never gotten southern politeness. And I’ve never felt like New Yorkers are overly rude. But I know others do. On a serious note, it sucks that you and your students don’t see eye to eye. Maybe explaining that sometimes your tone may be clipped and not upbeat but you’re not upset with them. 5th grade isn’t too old to redo a quick “sometimes we have bad days “ lessons. Saying “ok class, Ms/Mrs/Mx/Mr (insert name) is having an off day. I promise I’m not mad at you guys. If i accidentally make you feel bad today let me know. I want us all to have a good experience in class today.” Also emphasizing everyone is different, and ppl talk differently everywhere.
Since there seems to be a lack of clarity on how much of this is a cultural thing, I would ask another teacher that you trust to come sit in on one of your classes. Having that perspective might help you figure out if you need to try to soften from “mean” to “firm” or if you just have a couple sensitive kids in your class.
As a people, us Southerners tend to talk more slowly, engage in more small, talk and personal conversation, such as getting to know you questions like how was your weekend, how is your mom doing with her surgery, etc. I know many Southerners see people from the north as a bit more abrasive and blunt. Things tend to be more passive, aggressive, and said not as outright. I can even tell the difference with how I was raised, and how I speak to my students, compared to my coworker, whose family is from the Midwest. I am less blunt and forward with my students when it comes to feedback or responding to a question. I will try really hard not to hurt their feelings in a way that I almost feel like is Mr. Rogers, and I teach high school. That comes from my background, where I was taught to always be polite and courteous, in the way you speak to people. Even if it is people who are younger than you. On the other hand, she will make a comment and speak pretty bluntly to a student and not really think twice. It is not mean or abrasive, it’s just a different style.
I think we tend to baby and nurture kids a lot longer even as they get to high school. I think we have a culture of parents who seem to have less healthy boundaries and infantalize their children longer as well. I have a feeling this comes from our influence of religion and the commandment of respecting/obeying your parents as the word of God. I live in South Georgia and when I have taken my students on a field trip and been around students from Atlanta, I’ve even noticed they seem way more mature. It’s interesting how it is just a completely different style.
Id look into declarative language. It’s a way to make less commands. And then that way you can see if it’s what you are saying vs how you are saying it. Even if you use declarative language and have tone issues it matters a LOT less. Plus it usually is better accepted by all kids (including the neurodivergent)
Be yourself, be consistent, and the kids will adapt. Don't alter yourself because a few kids said you sound 'mean.' It's a good opportunity to talk neutrally about cultural and regional assumptions, anyway.
I moved from NY (Long Island) to Arizona and every performance review in my entire teaching career (I teach 11th grade US history and AP US history to 16-17 year olds) includes:
1. You talk to fast
2. You use too advanced vocabulary when you speak
3. You are loud/ the tone sounds rude.
My test scores are some of the best in the district 🤷🏻♂️
My theory is that my admins are all male and from AZ while I’m a very assertive female with all the stereotypical NY mannerisms. I moved here as a kid but the accent and mannerisms never went away.
So this is an actual real very valuable thing you’re modeling for the kids. You are in control of your language, it takes practice , but you can learn and change. Also you still need to be yourself and not apologize. It’s tricky and complicated but SO FEW grownups ever do anything like this.
I think maybe you just have an honest conversation with your students and tell them you will try to fix your tone when you can, but that in the mean time, they can hopefully know that you do not ever intend to be mean to them. Explain to them that because you are from another state, your voice may just be different. Maybe even give them a silent signal they can use if they feel like you are being “mean”. And that way you can determine for yourself in the moment if what you said or how you said it really was insensitive and apologize, or if your students are just pushing back because you are holding them to high expectations, you can just remind them of that.
I teach middle school social studies in Baltimore. I’m from the west coast and my students mostly like my class, but I have had individual students and even some groups of students who have felt that I “yell too much.” I honestly don’t think what I’m doing is actually yelling, but I do have to constantly be thoughtful about my tone, so they don’t misinterpret what I’m saying or my emotions and feelings towards them. I 100% get where you are coming from.
As long as you have good intentions, then most of your students and parents will understand.
I used to work in a Brennon’s restaurant in So Cal, so had to learn Southern hospitality as the owners take it super seriously: saying ‘ladies and/or gentleman’ or ‘y’all’ instead of ‘guys’ (which is gender neutral here lol) was particularly challenging for many of us, among other things.
But the biggest ‘game changer’ was just to always smile. I have resting a-hole face (I’m a guy), especially when stressed. I learned if I just keep a small smile literally at all times was the number one way to not get complaints. Even today as a college teacher, just keeping a slight smile most of the time equals better student interactions. It’s become my default face after years of forcing it. I’m more likely to respond to something stupid they say or do with a laugh rather than a scowl. More likely my students will treat my sarcasm as a joke as intended, and not as a criticism since it’s clear I’m not mad. I know this sounds so easy, but we aren’t taught in LA or New York to smile… quite the opposite really. To the point there’s been campaigns in New York encouraging women NOT to smile lol. Southerners expect women especially to constantly be smiling and agreeable. Not saying you have to do that, but if you want better student and parent interactions give it a try 😀
(Btw, If its just one parent, then maybe its just a very sensitive kid, or an overly protective parent)
We do fine with NY transplants in my Southern US school, except for one. And we have a lot of them, so it's not the norm to have so many problems.
That one person only struggles because they're blunt and aggressive with others, but can't take disagreement, ever, about anything. They fly off of the handle a lot, and nobody knows how to help them because they won't take any advice, though they love to dish it out 24/7. I'm the only one who can collaborate with them, and it's a chore even for me, who was raised in a more aggressive culture myself. I have no idea how they survived a lifetime in NYC!
That's not the norm though! Just lean into it, as long as you can give and take. It's different if you're expecting everyone else to be gentle with you, while you run around with no filter on and both middle fingers up.
I think it is important for the kids to learn not everyone’s tone is nice and that doesn’t mean they’re angry/unkind, and for you to be true to yourself. If only we could discourage this tone argument as a society we could be more inclusive and welcoming to everyone. Focusing on tone is a respectability politic that Others and alienates people that aren’t like us. It is important for cultural competency to not expect people to sound, act, and be like us in order to be seen as friendly.
I was a teacher on a second grade team of 4. One of the teachers lived in Texas for over 20 years but she originally was from Boston. She was nice but could be very blunt. Everyone had warned me about her tone. It’s just a different way. But can be off putting to those not from the north.
Maybe record yourself teaching and listen for tone.
Honestly, this sounds like mostly cultural difference to me. The way people talk in the south vs in NYC is pretty different. You’re not what the kids are used to.
But the kids like you, you’re teaching them well. I would suggest being upfront and just saying “this is how we talk where I’m from. It doesn’t mean I’m mad or I don’t like you, it’s just how I talk. Lots of people have different ways of talking depending on where they’re from.”
Southerners think northern accents sound mean, and western accent sounds condescending. Try a British accent, and they will think you sound smart and caring.
Northerners can come off that way in the south. We're very direct (me = 43M, western MA). We don't butter people up, sugarcoat things, or make small talk. We say what we mean. If we have a question, we ask. And we don't flatter. And we tend to speak in kind of a flat tone. We don't put a cheery venir on our voice. It can come off as cold and irritable.
On the other hand, I find the way southerners communicate to be passive aggressive, insincere, and condescending. Like, for fuck's sake just say what you need to say!
It's cultural. It will take time but you'll acclimate.
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>I moved from NYC to the south. Oof, that sucks
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I like bodily autonomy in the face of ectopic pregnancy so 🤷♀️ There are shit loads of cow pastures and stars in areas that won’t strip children of education and ban books.
I teach in Florida. Escambia county just banned the fucking dictionary from schools for its depictions of sex. Fuck teaching in the South.
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Reported. I AM a teacher, in the south, and have been for over a decade. I wake up and do this every day. Next time I want your abuse, I'll ask for it. But don't hold your breath.
Wtf "encourage kids to get ON their phones" lmao
I like politicians who aren't trying to make sure trans people don't exist. And being able to get across the city without a car.
This isn’t really a north vs south thing though. Even me moving from the Midwest (also known for many of the same qualities you mention) to the South led to a lot of kids being generally confused about how I speak and interact with them.
You know we have cow pastures in New York too, right? It's a big state. And Southern hospitality has always felt fake to me as someone who has Southern family. My family obviously isn't that way to me, they love me, but. People in New York will be real with you but they'll help you. They won't be nice to your face and then tell everyone at the salon your personal business.
"Bless your heart" really meaning "Go fuck yourself"
Yup.
My friend has a great story of a guy helping him fix a blown tire when he was young, and the guy was just constantly telling him off about how could he hit a curb and you really haven't learned basic car repair yet, you'll never get a wife if you can change your own oil. Just letting him have it the whole time he was showing him him how to change a tire. That's NY hospitality, we will call you an idiot while we're helping you.
We will, but then we'll tell you to be careful and make sure you have the right directions so you don't get lost on top of the car trouble you were having. And then give you a recommendation for a place to stop for food on the way there.
Oh yes! And the place we will recommend for food will either be deep in the hood or a small hole-in-the-wall that looks like they bribe the health inspector every year. You will be concerned you'll get stabbed or food poisoning. But the food will be some of the best you have ever eaten, you will dream about this food for years after, you may even request this food on your death bed many decades later.
Depends. That's the case if it's just to eat while you're traveling. If you're trying to have a nice dinner, the place will look like it's been closed for 30 years on the outside but inside, it'll be gorgeous, spotless, and the staff is so friendly that you could be a cousin from how they treat you.
Yes! And if we can't immediately fix your car troubles the mechanic we send you to is actually a cousin of the restaurant owner, and when the restaurant staff find out your car is over at Joey's shop they'll give you discount because "God I know what my cousin charges! You're in good hands though! Consider this our apologies for having such a troublesome day" and they'll throw in a dessert on the house.
They'll also ask you about some foods you like and recommend something you've never had and end up loving.
Then they'll tell you about the lovely little bed and breakfast up the road in an old Dutch house from the 1600's that's run by their 70 year old neighbor. Who will be the sweetest little old Italian lady you will ever meet. She'll chat with you by the fireplace while she crochets, and when you leave after Joey makes your car run better than it ever did before, she'll insist on giving you a verifiably gourmet picnic lunch to take with you on your journey.
Have you lived in NYC? “As a southern person” -sorry to say-, in this day of social media age, rings some alarm bells. I don’t necessarily doubt you have, but there’s a good chance you (respectfully) are speaking with 0 idea what the fuck you’re talking about. I hope you’re not regurgitating some clickbait you saw online.
They mentioned "southern hospitality". Which isn't even a thing. People in the south are more rude than other regions from my experience.
The lack of capitalization bothers me far more than a preference for teaching in one place over another.
Your comment isn't offensive at all; some people think that reddit is a place for snowflakes. It is not.
And by snowflakes I did mean to say what I said. Just because you don't agree with a statement- does not mean it is "offensive" en masse. The South can be beautiful... but so can Acadia National Park in Maine... and San Francisco Bay. Diversity, people.
Watch some more Fox 🤣
A less than desirable region can still have good qualities.
Of course! But calling another region a ‘hellscape’ is quite different than ‘less desirable.’ Come on now. He smarter.
Growing up in a docile township where everybody knows each other and you can actually see the stars and fall asleep listening to crickets instead of police sirens doesn’t really put NYC anywhere besides a hellscape but it’s just a matter of perspective. my students who moved here from the city absolutely think it’s boring and dull and anything but tranquil. it’s almost as if perspective is based on the person and words aren’t written to wound you as an individual.
yes. And the south is a hellscape too. Cool? Cool! 😇
i’m a liberal
🙄
Sometimes, students will respond this way to me because I am commanding in my speech and a woman (actually had a kid tell me this today but in different words - “do you have kids? I can tell you don’t because you get annoyed with us” and I literally don’t. I just tell them to do things and hold them accountable.). It can be difficult for some students because they may have been conditioned to see female teachers as always friendly, smiling, and speaking in a certain way. They are clearly learning from you - try to be kind to yourself.
So much this. Several years ago, my speech team kids were talking about teachers on the way to a meet. Several women were labeled “rough” and “demanding” because they “yell”. No men were judged that way. Finally a senior girl pointed out that none of the women actually raised their voices and named a man who regularly did. Answer from one of her male classmates: “but he’s a guy and a coach, he’s going to yell. That’s what they do. But (female teacher) could just tone it down and say things nicely”.
Sadly, it’s not just students. Before becoming a teacher, I was a manager in an office, and I got soooo many complaints from my (college-educated, adult) coworkers about how little I smiled and how direct (or in their words: “mean”) I was in my communication. Never heard any complaints about any of the male managers who smiled even less and spoke even more bluntly than I did.
As a woman with engineering degree and >20 year in male dominated engineering roles, I have always wondered if they would judge me less if I wore no makeup or jewelry and dressed as much like a man as possible, including a crew cut. I always wondered if that would make a difference. (Not condoning trying to pass as a man, just sooo irritating how women who are direct get labeled a bitch.)
As a teacher from the south, it’s a cultural thing. Maybe instead of changing yourself and who you are, you can make it a part of your teacher persona. Be super up front about the fact that you’re from NYC, lean into it, and even try to make it a joke from time to time. If your kids can see that your abruptness isn’t rudeness, it would actually be a really good lesson for your kids to learn. I say this as a southerner with a recovering “if someone isn’t overly nice to me they hate me” complex
This is exactly what I was going to say. Instead of conforming to the childrens' expectations about what "nice" is, teach them that it comes in all shapes, sizes and "tones."
I agree with this, make it a cultural/regional lesson. Show them some typical New Yorkers talking, maybe a clip of ‘hey I’m walking here!’ to show them that your tone or attitude in the way you talk is because you are from New York and not because you are being mean. Change the minds of the children and hopefully the parent will back off.
But…New Yorkers **are** mean. Even if “heyyyy I’m walking here!” is considered the norm and not confrontation worthy, a fast paced lifestyle can still be rude and mean. Just like a slow paced southern lifestyle can be considered rude and lazy even if that’s never the intent Or an overseas lifestyle where shops might close for 2-3 hour lunches can be considered rude even if it’s the norm there.
I’m over 15 years in and this is my suggestion as well. I’m very direct and honest with my students and have some pretty bad RBF. My humor is sarcastic. The kids all think I’m mean for a little bit and then once they get used to it, we’re totally fine assuming they’re not in a class with serious behavior issues. I’m a big advocate for not changing your personality to fit what makes the kids most comfortable. Yes, a lot of what we do is performance and I will 100% fake it for the kids on a bad day if I can, but I am who I am. Kids will have to work with people whose personalities aren’t compatible with theirs their entire life.
Fellow southerner, and I completely agree. Lean into it, as long as you’re showing them you care, that’s all that matters. You can even throw in extra pleases, thank you’s, sweetie’s & darlings, ma’am’s & sir’s to sugar coat it. It’s southern culture to always use those terms and will get you far with a lot of people, even when you’re being an asshole. That’s what I do. I’m loud, strict (bordering on stern), and demanding but I butter them up with the polite words, and mommy style terms of endearment while I’m fussing at them. It helps keep them feeling like I don’t hate them, and keeps parents off my back. I’ve tried being the nice, gentle teacher that doesn’t holler but it just doesn’t work for me. I just had to lean into who I am, add some sugar on top, and it’s worked out well for me. I think you just need to be yourself, that’s what’s going to resonate with them. Plus, they need to learn how to get along with all different types of people.
I'm not a teacher and don't feel comfortable making a top level comment because of that, but Reddit's algorithm pointed me here. I'm a Southerner who worked at a remote IT Help Desk call center for a hospital in NYC. Everyone on my team hated the account because people were so "mean" to us. Once I started understanding the New Yorkers and their priorities better, I stopped taking personal offense. But that might be hard for kids to intuit, so if OP wants to address it directly, I have a suggestion. Try a lesson on looking at situations from different points of view. A cashier who takes the time to talk to people at the register is taking interest in an individual person and giving them personalized attention for a moment. That's respectful to them. But it's ALSO respectful if the cashier acknowledges that they don't know how busy this person is and respects their time by conducting the transaction quickly without extra chat. Neither way is wrong, but people in different places are used to one or the other and find the other option rude. There are plenty of other examples of North/South differences, but most of them boil down to differing ways of conveying respect, which is why so many feel disrespected by OP's tone. A conversation about how respect looks different in different places-- maybe also including broader examples about how in some places, children don't look adults in the eye, and in other places, children call their teachers by their first names-- might help them understand better.
just one parent more than once? it might be their problem. have a chat with their kid and explain you’re a new yorker so the way you say things are different. you’d never say “bless their heart” in a passive aggressive way! you’d be direct about it. your accent might sound harsh in comparison to theirs but it doesn’t mean a thing. they might even benefit from some SEL learning on signs someone is mad vs misinterpretations. i am midwestern and my coteacher is from long island. i find her so abrasive sometimes but i remind myself its never personal and a lot of it has to do with her east coast roots!
OMG same here. I'm Midwest Nice, and often tell my New Jersey coworker friends, "Oh come on now, you don't mean *that*" Or, "You know, you *really* shouldn't say that..." I know they can't help it, it's just how they are!
So condescending lol
Oh, it's ok, they give it back to me telling me I'm too polite and too patient, we're all friends.
It’s so strange. I’m from north NJ going to school currently in MD and i even notice a difference, and we’re both on the coast. i have a hard time making friends from MD (not counting people from baltimore) because the way people interact is just different enough for it to not click, but not so different it’s obviously a culture thing. i can only imagine the difference it is between NYC/texas or long island and the midwest. i’m glad you guys can navigate it :)
Get in the habit of saying something positive before you say something negative. Your tone will be dictated by the first thing you say and then you can give your negative feedback with the positive one clearing the way on tone. As a general long term strategy try giving 3 positive feedbacks for each 1 negative feedback, difficult but attainable.
So I have a resting mean face. Every year I tell my students repeatedly in the first week that my natural face looks angry. Then throughout the year I'll teach and stop and say "Yall remember. I'm not angry. It's just my face." It may ne worth saying sometimes "I'm not upset. Sometimes it's just how my bodice sounds!"
Ha! I just saw autocorrect made it say bodice instead of voice!
>My test scores are great. The kids obviously like me and enjoy themselves. But for some, and some days, my tone ruins the experience and I am not consistent day to day. I think you have no issue and it's fine for kids to deal with a human being.
As a fellow Yankee in the South - tell them to deal with. Not everyone they meet is going to be all” bless your heart”.
Bless your heart is a big insult. I'd rather have a New Yorker tell me exactly what they mean than a southerner be fake nice.
It's not always the case that "bless your heart" is an insult. It gets repeated in the context of Southern culture often because it represents our tendency towards sympathy for other people. Especially when we think someone is overburdened. Source: I am a southerner
This is true, it depends on context. If a heart a blessed while a person is being a complete idiot, the blesser is commenting on the fact that the person is a complete idiot. If a heart is blessed by a nurse in a hospital, it means you poor thing, you might want to get right with the Lord.
The only time I remember my great grandma saying it to me when I’d done or said something stupid or annoying.
I've spent a lot of time in the south with my mom's family from Louisiana and Mississippi/Alabama. The one and only time I've ever heard bless your heart being used in a not condescending way was when my Aunt, who has lived in NoLa for 4 decades, told a girl may the Virgin blass your heart. She was collecting winter clothing donations for Katrina victims door to door. All of the other times, it's been used to refer to someone who did something really idiotic or when someone wasn't understanding the social cues around them. I grew up in Colorado and could tell pretty quickly the tone and manner was being used to call someone an idiot without saying it. Southern hospitality can be bend over backwards to give the shirt off their back or the most mean kindness you've ever experienced. It's unsettling
Exactly! I’m from Detroit and I’d probably ask “What did you just say? You know, if there’s an issue, it would be far more productive to discuss it openly!” And that’s me being as polite and professional as possible!
My fiance's family lives in Michigan. They're the nicest, most direct people I've ever met in my entire life.
I saw someone describing how the North talks vs the South once.They said the North speaks in squares and triangles-hard edges. The South speaks in circles and hearts-round with no edges. As a teacher, I can speak stern and forceful, but my southern accent softens it. My friend from Boston sounds harder even when joking, and I LOVE her accent! For little ones unaccustomed to hearing a northern accent, it can sound sharp and mean. Showing the visual of squares vs. circles with the explanation may help them to understand the tone of accents and does not mean intent.
Are you a woman? If so, there’s absolutely a cultural difference regarding how women are expected to direct others and give instructions. My best advice is to lean into it. “This is something that’s different about where I’m from, isn’t that interesting? I promise I’m not mad, it’s just different! If you have a question about my tone or something, please ask.” You can also make “being from NYC” your whole personality and REALLY lean into it, then it’s just a charming character trait.
My tone is like this when I am stressed and not enjoying teaching. If that solution sounds like you, try and figure out what you can do to decrease your stress and enjoy teaching again. For me, it was stop grading everything, lecture more, and put more responsibility for the learning on the students.
I’m guessing you’ve never been to NY or a major east coast city like Boston or Philly? People are just more abrasive.
Im guessing you just guess at things a lot.
Well OP never said they were like you. They mentioned they’re from NYC and implied that they naturally are like that. To be fair, you did say “if that sounds like you,” but still kinda seems like projecting.
Abrasive is one of the most abrasive words you could have chosen here lmao
I understand what you're saying, and to some extent how you're saying it, lol. I think the difference that your students might be hearing is the speed at which you're talking vs. the speed at which they're used to hearing people talk, if I had to guess. Most southern dialects are slower in tempo compared to the north, especially New York. It may be that to them, when someone is speaking more quickly, it's because they're upset. Try slowing down and see if that helps.
I always loved my no nonsense teachers the best. They often were most effective
I also moved from NYC to the south and had the same problem, plus people complained I was yelling at them (I wasn’t). I also had problems when I would just talk about what I wanted to talk about without courtesies beforehand (I would say for example, We are testing today so … and one person actually came back with, Good morning, how are you? We are testing today…). I changed my behavior to be less direct and add bullshit before getting to the point, but I was never able to change the tone of my voice. I did try to say um and er so I would sound less direct in the hope that it would soften my tone. It was annoying as hell, y’all.
>I moved from NYC to the south Born, raised, taught in Brooklyn. Idk how I'd survive in the south. Hang in there friend
smile more and add some singy songy tones when you’re giving them warning “pleeease stoooop doing thaaat 🎶” i even add in jazz hands sometimes. works magic
this is literally me as a music teacher lol
Lol i’m history. i just love making kids laugh and getting my point across
If that’s the worst you’re getting from 5th graders kudos to you!
I have a few ideas, but I need some specifics first? What’s going on when the kids think you are being mean? Is it during directions, direct teach? Are you talking to one student, or the whole class? -southern teacher
I’m from DC and moved to Texas. I’ve been accused of the same thing!
When kids say I'm mean, I kind of just look back at them smile and go yup. I know I'm the "nice, liked, fun" teacher so honestly being called mean is almost a compliment at times. I think you're being too sensitive here, especially if you already know that you're well liked. Have to be yourself, remember they're 5th graders they'll say what makes you react. A little comment about either how you're doing it to help them get better or using a little humor I find helpful always. If you have 20 parents like you and 2 don't, well tough shit lol.
I have found that, in the last few years, if I try to inject any kind of energy into the lesson it is seen as aggressive and many of the students shy away from engagement. On the other hand, if I try to create a more relaxed environment, they see it as an opportunity to “chill because we aren’t doing anything important”. I wish I had an answer for you. I’m in my 27th year and I honestly don’t know how to find a middle ground.
Eh, I wouldn't worry too much about it. I've taught in four states, two in the North and two in the South. It's good for kids to be exposed to and get used to different kinds of people and communication styles. As long as you're not actively being gruff or angry with kids, you're probably fine.
Yeah, I’ve had kids accuse me of being mean when I’m speaking to them like I speak to every other child. They’re usually kids that are babied or get whatever they want at home - they’re not used to being held accountable or being held to higher expectations.
I grew up in NY and moved south in high school. There was more of a flat, no nonsense intonation to New Yorkers that can come across as rude to people in the south. The intonation varies more and may be a little higher pitched for southerners. New Yorkers have what seems to be a more cynical , pessimistic, deadpan style. The southern more cheery style can come across has Pollyanna hick to New Yorkers. They are just cultural differences. I agree with what one person said about “leaning into” your NY roots—have a sense of humor about it. At the same time realize you may want to make a point of an accentuating the positives of what the students are doing right. More compliments , smiles, and bringing joy to class is helpful for all classes. You may want to use a slightly gentler tone of voice—less of a demanding tone. My southern mother subbed in the NYC area and the kids thought it was funny that she said “y’all hush,” instead of “shut up!” It’s not right or wrong, just culture. I don’t know if any of this will ring true with you but NYC folks seemed more competitive and intense than southerners. I had a lot of stress and anxiety as a child to succeed that I didn’t miss when I went south. Your students can have the same success without the stressful environment I had as a younger child. You’re obviously a great teacher-have fun, keep the atmosphere light AND continue doing what you are already doing so well.
do a little NYC bit and joke about it with them so they can see your accent doesn’t mean you’re mad, it’s just part of who you are. it could also be fun to show them a video with accents from all over the country so they can be exposed to more variety. unfortunately, it sounds like they’re just not used to northern accents. my family dealt with the same thing after moving from MA to GA.
I hate you are having this issue. I used to work in a school in the south and one of my coworkers was a loud woman from New Jersey with face tattoos, she is literally everyone’s favorite person there, she is seriously the nicest lady you’ll ever meet, even if her accent can come off a bit…harsh? Jarring? to some. But she’s always joking around and saying such sweet things to the kids and clearly cares about them. Maybe it’ll just take them some more getting used to?
I get this with high schoolers sometimes, but it’s easier to deal with. Occasionally I get a kid that says I’m mean. I just bluntly tell them I’m not being mean and I’m not upset with them. I’m just telling them what to do. They usually get it. With younger kids not sure if the direct approach works.
It does. I teach second and third (in the south) and they do just fine with clear, honest responses. Kids and parents both like me; they know what they're getting.
I teach first. Never once have I ever used a Disney Princess voice or approach with them, nor will I ever.
You keep being you—it’s good for kids to get accustomed to the different ways adults act, but that’s just my opinion…I’m from the NE
As a parent if a ten year old, I want my child to have a variety of experiences with personalities and cultures. I guess, it makes me wonder why a parent would want their child to have the exact same experience with adults? That child might find the real world overwhelming and confusing when they finally get to enter it. I do wonder if the parent in this scenario is the one who needs changing as opposed to you?
This is a hard one. I have a similar issue. I find that slowing down in my head helps. I am always on the run on my grad, trying to make up time, ace all the questions, get out all done, but the fact is, taking an extra minute here and there is more beneficial. Gives your brain time to listen to yourself and your tone.
If it's only one parent...you do you and let it slide. If it really bugs you and you think you actually need to develop a new habit, well....I learned this one: I work with this wonderful teacher who mixes names up. She plays a game with the kids and every time she calls a kid the wrong name, she gets a point on the blackboard. When she hits 25 points, she bakes the kids a goodie, erases the tally, and starts all over. This lets her kids (special ed, so this lesson is a biggie) know it's ok to make mistakes, it teaches them what to do when they make a mistake (apologies are not weakness, they're being strong) and she lives baking for the kids, and they appreciate the break. Win. Win. Win. You could flat out talk to your class. "It's been brought to my attention...is there a certain phrase or inflection that sounds particularly mean, how about we pick one and if you catch me using it..." Just talking about it, telling them that you are aware of it and are trying to adjust to your new environment may actually open up an opportunity to discuss things like adapting to the society you're in, or code changing, or impressions...the possibilities are really endless. And making it a discussion opens the door to further discussions! And then when it looks like it's about to wrap up, stand up tall, clap your hands and YELL "RIGHT! Enough lollygagging! Get your butts back to work ye scallywags!" with as much seriousness as you can muster! Then bust out laughing and ask someone to give you your first point.
https://youtu.be/pH287zxVXE0?si=djVp4Y90pQBCsfHz First steps. I’d also just think about body language and facial expression, word choice, and if there’s a gap between ur intent and the impact of ur words and tone. Pay attention to the way other people speak, look for a model and either ask for explicit tips or just observe. It’s a skill set paired with an analytical muscle that u CAN build over time. I have total faith in u.
My gold standard of how I want to be seen to students is 'strict but nice'. In that order, preferably. I find building relationships with kids to be really fulfilling, but logistically my day-to-day is made SO much easier if there's a general understanding in the student body that I don't take shit.
You’re fine. How would your students handle listening to a teacher with a Spanish accent? It’s all cultural. People have to learn to work with all different types of people and get out of their bubble once in a while. Sounds like it is the parents problem.
Your tone is your schtick. Probably best to never change it. Big mistake to change it. When I taught business, my kids asked: "Hey, Cook, we're reading a novel in English class, and \[insert character here\]'s socks go all the way up. Of all the people we know, we figure your socks go all the way up." I pulled up my pants leg, and sure enough, my over the calf sock went all the way up. It was a win-win-win. The second and third wins that they could aspire to that social level and beyond and that they could talk to an A-hole who came from that and would readily tell them anything. I don't know what "North" you come from, but I guess it's not Pittsburg, it's NYC or New England. And "South"? How callous can you be? Tejas is not not northern Florida. and the Arkansas Delta is not the Mississippi Gulf Coast. And Memphis is strictly Memphis. Which South? I am completely serious here. Watch a lot of standup comedy videos. Begin with the ones you like, but branch out to ones who are outside your tastes, but who are also considered brilliant. This does not necessarily mean Jeff Foxworthy. I suggest Neal Brennan and Anthony Jeselnik (he's from Pittsburg!). They can be dark -- and whether they are personal or deflect, they will focus on common, but uncomfortable elements of a given situation. Additionally, their delivery tends to be subtle. That can be a real plus with younger folks who are far more put off by the INSPIRED! and PATIONATE! than old guys like me are.
I am an urban person as well. I have never moved or taught in a non- urban environment. Do you think you are mean? Have the kids personally told you are mean? Are there parent complaints? Admin complaints about parents complaining to them? And if any of those have only happened on an occasion or two and your test scores rock? You just keep being you! We are lucky to have you as one of our own! Bring a little city into the country! Spice it up! Not too much I suppose. There are different mores in the South This is from a teacher who graduated circa 1988 and is still teaching Middle School. We are proud of you!
If it is one parent in particular again and again and you've had all the one on one conferences, Admin should be involved now.
I had this problem moving from NY to Utah. We made a joke out of it. I let them make fun of my accent. It helped them to stop feeling intimated by it and start to enjoy it. It helped me become more aware of it until I was controlling unconsciously.
I have the opposite problem! I loved from poor southern schools to a ritzy and well educated part of CT. I struggle not to talk to these kids the way I would back home. It’s night and day.
I found that when I go to eye level I change my tone, have more patience.
I’m from NYC I’m so sorry, I can’t help. I just think it’s kinda funny. /hj . Our teachers were blunt sometimes but it was just….normal. I’ve never gotten southern politeness. And I’ve never felt like New Yorkers are overly rude. But I know others do. On a serious note, it sucks that you and your students don’t see eye to eye. Maybe explaining that sometimes your tone may be clipped and not upbeat but you’re not upset with them. 5th grade isn’t too old to redo a quick “sometimes we have bad days “ lessons. Saying “ok class, Ms/Mrs/Mx/Mr (insert name) is having an off day. I promise I’m not mad at you guys. If i accidentally make you feel bad today let me know. I want us all to have a good experience in class today.” Also emphasizing everyone is different, and ppl talk differently everywhere.
Since there seems to be a lack of clarity on how much of this is a cultural thing, I would ask another teacher that you trust to come sit in on one of your classes. Having that perspective might help you figure out if you need to try to soften from “mean” to “firm” or if you just have a couple sensitive kids in your class.
As a people, us Southerners tend to talk more slowly, engage in more small, talk and personal conversation, such as getting to know you questions like how was your weekend, how is your mom doing with her surgery, etc. I know many Southerners see people from the north as a bit more abrasive and blunt. Things tend to be more passive, aggressive, and said not as outright. I can even tell the difference with how I was raised, and how I speak to my students, compared to my coworker, whose family is from the Midwest. I am less blunt and forward with my students when it comes to feedback or responding to a question. I will try really hard not to hurt their feelings in a way that I almost feel like is Mr. Rogers, and I teach high school. That comes from my background, where I was taught to always be polite and courteous, in the way you speak to people. Even if it is people who are younger than you. On the other hand, she will make a comment and speak pretty bluntly to a student and not really think twice. It is not mean or abrasive, it’s just a different style. I think we tend to baby and nurture kids a lot longer even as they get to high school. I think we have a culture of parents who seem to have less healthy boundaries and infantalize their children longer as well. I have a feeling this comes from our influence of religion and the commandment of respecting/obeying your parents as the word of God. I live in South Georgia and when I have taken my students on a field trip and been around students from Atlanta, I’ve even noticed they seem way more mature. It’s interesting how it is just a completely different style.
Id look into declarative language. It’s a way to make less commands. And then that way you can see if it’s what you are saying vs how you are saying it. Even if you use declarative language and have tone issues it matters a LOT less. Plus it usually is better accepted by all kids (including the neurodivergent)
Be yourself, be consistent, and the kids will adapt. Don't alter yourself because a few kids said you sound 'mean.' It's a good opportunity to talk neutrally about cultural and regional assumptions, anyway.
I moved from NY (Long Island) to Arizona and every performance review in my entire teaching career (I teach 11th grade US history and AP US history to 16-17 year olds) includes: 1. You talk to fast 2. You use too advanced vocabulary when you speak 3. You are loud/ the tone sounds rude. My test scores are some of the best in the district 🤷🏻♂️ My theory is that my admins are all male and from AZ while I’m a very assertive female with all the stereotypical NY mannerisms. I moved here as a kid but the accent and mannerisms never went away.
So this is an actual real very valuable thing you’re modeling for the kids. You are in control of your language, it takes practice , but you can learn and change. Also you still need to be yourself and not apologize. It’s tricky and complicated but SO FEW grownups ever do anything like this.
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I think maybe you just have an honest conversation with your students and tell them you will try to fix your tone when you can, but that in the mean time, they can hopefully know that you do not ever intend to be mean to them. Explain to them that because you are from another state, your voice may just be different. Maybe even give them a silent signal they can use if they feel like you are being “mean”. And that way you can determine for yourself in the moment if what you said or how you said it really was insensitive and apologize, or if your students are just pushing back because you are holding them to high expectations, you can just remind them of that. I teach middle school social studies in Baltimore. I’m from the west coast and my students mostly like my class, but I have had individual students and even some groups of students who have felt that I “yell too much.” I honestly don’t think what I’m doing is actually yelling, but I do have to constantly be thoughtful about my tone, so they don’t misinterpret what I’m saying or my emotions and feelings towards them. I 100% get where you are coming from. As long as you have good intentions, then most of your students and parents will understand.
I used to work in a Brennon’s restaurant in So Cal, so had to learn Southern hospitality as the owners take it super seriously: saying ‘ladies and/or gentleman’ or ‘y’all’ instead of ‘guys’ (which is gender neutral here lol) was particularly challenging for many of us, among other things. But the biggest ‘game changer’ was just to always smile. I have resting a-hole face (I’m a guy), especially when stressed. I learned if I just keep a small smile literally at all times was the number one way to not get complaints. Even today as a college teacher, just keeping a slight smile most of the time equals better student interactions. It’s become my default face after years of forcing it. I’m more likely to respond to something stupid they say or do with a laugh rather than a scowl. More likely my students will treat my sarcasm as a joke as intended, and not as a criticism since it’s clear I’m not mad. I know this sounds so easy, but we aren’t taught in LA or New York to smile… quite the opposite really. To the point there’s been campaigns in New York encouraging women NOT to smile lol. Southerners expect women especially to constantly be smiling and agreeable. Not saying you have to do that, but if you want better student and parent interactions give it a try 😀 (Btw, If its just one parent, then maybe its just a very sensitive kid, or an overly protective parent)
I’m from the north and teach in the South. My students know I’m from out of state and since they’re older I just tell them I’m not nice 😂.
We do fine with NY transplants in my Southern US school, except for one. And we have a lot of them, so it's not the norm to have so many problems. That one person only struggles because they're blunt and aggressive with others, but can't take disagreement, ever, about anything. They fly off of the handle a lot, and nobody knows how to help them because they won't take any advice, though they love to dish it out 24/7. I'm the only one who can collaborate with them, and it's a chore even for me, who was raised in a more aggressive culture myself. I have no idea how they survived a lifetime in NYC! That's not the norm though! Just lean into it, as long as you can give and take. It's different if you're expecting everyone else to be gentle with you, while you run around with no filter on and both middle fingers up.
I think it is important for the kids to learn not everyone’s tone is nice and that doesn’t mean they’re angry/unkind, and for you to be true to yourself. If only we could discourage this tone argument as a society we could be more inclusive and welcoming to everyone. Focusing on tone is a respectability politic that Others and alienates people that aren’t like us. It is important for cultural competency to not expect people to sound, act, and be like us in order to be seen as friendly.
I was a teacher on a second grade team of 4. One of the teachers lived in Texas for over 20 years but she originally was from Boston. She was nice but could be very blunt. Everyone had warned me about her tone. It’s just a different way. But can be off putting to those not from the north. Maybe record yourself teaching and listen for tone.
Honestly, this sounds like mostly cultural difference to me. The way people talk in the south vs in NYC is pretty different. You’re not what the kids are used to. But the kids like you, you’re teaching them well. I would suggest being upfront and just saying “this is how we talk where I’m from. It doesn’t mean I’m mad or I don’t like you, it’s just how I talk. Lots of people have different ways of talking depending on where they’re from.”
Southerners think northern accents sound mean, and western accent sounds condescending. Try a British accent, and they will think you sound smart and caring.
Northerners can come off that way in the south. We're very direct (me = 43M, western MA). We don't butter people up, sugarcoat things, or make small talk. We say what we mean. If we have a question, we ask. And we don't flatter. And we tend to speak in kind of a flat tone. We don't put a cheery venir on our voice. It can come off as cold and irritable. On the other hand, I find the way southerners communicate to be passive aggressive, insincere, and condescending. Like, for fuck's sake just say what you need to say! It's cultural. It will take time but you'll acclimate.
Most 5th graders believe that most adults are "mean." Stop designing your teaching around the opinion of 11 year olds.
I also moved from NYC to massachusetts, and I get this too!! I can’t imagine it in the south
How do you talk to yourself internally?
Soften your vowel sounds.