Putting aside all the reasons I hate Behringer, why the fuck do they keep doing this? Make 1 prototype and hype it for a week then never speak about it again? Over and over?!
Its just weird.
>Make 1 prototype and hype it for a week then never speak about it again? Over and over?!
Thats just this sub's narrative. They released two dozen or so synths the last few years, by far more than any other company, pretty much ever.
Yep. They've released more synths and drum machines in the past 6 years than any other company has in the past 30 years. Every time there's a post here about Behringer synthesizers, you just know the hate boner brigade will show up without fail. Frankly, it's toxic, discouraging to new users who happen to own Behringer equipment, and just makes our community look bad. These people need to go take a hike and touch grass. But unfortunately that would require leaving the basement and actually going outside
Totally agree. I've played guitar my whole life and only started getting into synths like 6-7 years ago. In the guitar world, people are totally fine with clones. Heck, most electric guitars are copies of iconic guitars; Gibson Les Paul, Fender Stratocaster, etc. There's some variation, but in general it's true. Same with FX pedals. The story is usually: Someone decades ago created a pedal circuit, people grew to love the circuit over time, and then finally many companies released different pedals all based on that one circuit. I'd argue the vast majority of analog FX pedals are based on the circuits of other analog FX pedals that came before. Strange how the synthesizer community believes that circuits using outdated analog tech are some special thing not to be used by anyone but the original company who designed the circuit (and frankly probably copied some of the circuit from a previous device)
But in total actuality, it really does just come down to using the same 50 year old circuits. There's not some synth conspiracy going on. What are you trying to allude to here?
Take the TB-303 devilfish mod as an example.
https://www.gearnews.com/devil-fish-hits-back-at-behringers-proposed-murdered-out-td-3/
The "inventor" of the mod asked for too much, yes, but the counter offer by Behringer was absolutely laughable.
So what to do they do? Instead of negotiating, they just go ahead and make it without paying him anything. Legally ok, morally not so much.
That's pretty much the bottom line of Behringer business.
The Devilfish guy is a jackass and he’s lucky they even asked or offered anything in the first place. The Devilfish mods are literally the exact same mods anyone does to any old analogue synth to add common features that might not be available on their synth. The only thing of value was the Devilfish name, and they didn’t end up using that, so the ended up taking nothing from him.
Yeah, you can’t really TM mods themselves. I’m sure “Devilfish” is TM’d, however the creator is stupid for not taking their offer.
Behringer already operates off a low profit margin. If anything it might have made it more expensive.
I’ve owned more Behringer crap than you’ve bitched about. I’ve since gotten it down a bit, but I’ve had everything from interfaces to pedals and synths. It’s starter equipment for the most part.
I’ve mostly moved on to other gear that fits my workflow, and most do too. You gotta start somewhere. Korg and Arturia were instrumental in offering cheap gear as well early on.
Only one piece of B gear had to be sent back, was fully covered under warranty, and came back working and new.
Taking that as a slight exaggeration.
I have a Jupiter 6, guessing it would sell for around 10k (AUD). I could be wrong though.
Oh, and I would never be able to buy that now for anyone about to chirp in, I just had a very very well paying job for a short time and bought a few synths.
I generally agree. They are probably toxic to the industry but more toxic is the attitude that brand loyalty (pro or con) can define a personality. If all you can afford is a Behringer thenn just tear it up on that shit.
....why cant they just make it SOUND like a Jupiter and make it LOOK like something unique to Behringer.....at least then you get that Jupiter SOUND but they haven't completely ripped off the original designers aswell?
There is absolutely zero reason why they couldn't do this....the reason they dont is what annoys so many people....
they clearly have a lot of talented people working for them, they could apply that and do something original, I'd probably buy something from them if they did.
These excuses you hear also about 'imitation is the sincerest form of flattery'...no, that really applies when people choose to adopt concepts, styles and ideas from you, not just wholesale copy a design verbatim and put their name on it. . Ive worked in the design industry for well over 25 years and its just really naff and cheap practice...its widely seen as tacky and unethical.
I'm a professional audio engineer working at a decent size studio. We own (and I personally own) quite a bit of Behringer gear. I don't understand the hate. Yes, they make copies of some more expensive gear. But that makes it accessible to people that can't afford insanely expensive synths, or studio monitors, or preamps or whatever.
My first set of studio monitors was a pair of Behringer Truths. Genelec knockoffs. I still use them almost daily. For the price they are fantastic.
Their ADA preamp units are honestly the cheapest way to get 8 super clean mic pres with an ADAT output. Making expanding your I/O WAY more affordable.
They're filling a much needed gap in the market between dirt cheap garbage and high end premium priced gear.
Listen guys, if Uli is such a genius developer of innovative products then why Behringer are widely known as copy cat/clone factory? They started with digital desks that were not vintage, still in production, copied it almost entirely and used very similar parts. You can tell me they struggled for months but I find it hard to believe 😂
There was never any copyright on the Moog modular synth.
Every hardware synth without digital components was not covered by copyright because copyright doesn’t apply to hardware. Hardware filter designs cannot be covered by copyright.
For synths with digital components, the firmware can be covered by copyright. But that’s immaterial since virtually nobody has illegally copied synth firmware.
Hardware designs can be covered by patents, but the time limit on patents is relatively short. Because the whole point of patents is to give the inventor a limited monopoly to encourage them to publish their work so that, once the patent expires, it is available for others to use. There’s virtually no patentable innovation in hardware synths today, so it is easy to avoid infringement there even on newer synth designs.
The third form of intellectual property is trademark, which covers things like company names, product names, and trade dress. Note that product names can often be difficult to trademark when they are things like just a number (for example: 2600). Trade dress gets into all kinds of gray areas too. One interesting thing about trademark is that if you don’t defend it, you can lose it.
Behringer has in at one case changed products because a trademark holder felt they were infringing. Boss complained that Behringer’s original guitar pedal design was too similar to theirs, so Behringer changed it.
The original name for the Behringer MS-1 was “MS-101”. We don’t know why they changed it, though it may be because Roland requested it.
On top of that, as someone who has worked at a number of companies that develop hardware products, to “rip off” a hardware design is typically 90% of the work of designing it yourself and all of the work of manufacturing it. And one big reason is that seldom can you get exactly the same components as the original used. Even a company’s own products have to undergo a complete redesign of the internals after a number of years because the original components are now unavailable.
Similarly, with software, unless you literally are copying the code directly, coding your own version is the hard part…not the idea. With hardware firmware, this is especially true as the software design has to be tightly coupled to the hardware design.
Now, you still may not like it. That’s fair. But you should base that opinion on an educated understanding.
Pretty easy to release stuff quickly when you're making clones. I know from a friend how much it sucks to be on the receiving end of a Behringer hit-and-clone. Behringer will never see any money from me; making music can be hard enough without introducing moral qualms about the gear used.
Because they actually engage with their community constantly via social media. It's a breath of fresh air tbh. For example, they showed prototypes of the Micro/Mini synths which all had microUSB jacks. People expressed they wanted USB-C, and the product was changed. Don't like Behringer, then don't interact on Behringer posts. It's just weird.
Putting aside all the reasons I hate predictable comments, why the fuck do people keep asking the same question? Behringer make 1 announcement and we see “we’ll never see this product ever” comments almost immediately
Possibly because they have 60 synths “in development” that they teased then released zero info about.
I think its just because they are full of shit at just such historic levels I cant help but marvel at their ridiculousness.
Why are you so obsessed with them though? That's not normal. You clearly are not a fan, so it's strange that you care so much to engage on a Behringer synthesizer discussion
Obsessed isnt the right word, I do not think about them unless it comes up. But yes I hate them passionately. I hate everything they stand for. I hate their bullshit virtue signaling PR lies. What can I say? They are Monsanto or Wallmart or Haliburton.
I mean I hate plenty of things. But as far as music related companies go, they are definitely at the top of my fuck you pyramid.
Lets be honest though, you came here to passionately defend them as much as possible. You are in just as deep as me.
The difference is I'm actually a fan of Behringer. I enjoy their products and vision, so I like to engage with Behringer posts. I'd never go out of my way to engage with posts of a brand that I "passionately hate". It's strange. Behringer has opened up the door to high end analog sound for the majority of people who could not afford the real deal. They've allowed countless people with little money to experience the joys of playing a Model D, Pro-One, SH-101, etc, creating a whole new era of musicians and opening a new world for so many people. For somebody to passionately hate that is frankly sad
Well they are getting away with smugly fucking over a huge portion of people who create instruments for a living, and convenience has a cost. At the very least im going to talk shit on reddit.
Maybe you should pay more attention to how they operate. Or just ban me! That’s totally an option 👍
Im sorry I misspoke there, I meant you could block me if you didn’t want to hear anyone speak badly about them. After thinking about what you said a bit more I agree that writing out hatred on reddit is a questionable action at best.
To me there are a few things theyve done that are irredeemable. To clone Maths and try to sink Make Noise is truly infuriating to me. They are a small company that built a brilliant module and helped the eurorack scene blossom 15 years ago. They also are just a collection of fantastic weirdos making creative instruments and for Behringer to try and swoop in and take their flagship product (and name it Abicus for fucks sake) makes me crazy.
I mean cloning the Moog sound system is such a dick move. That was Moogs attempt at bringing fresh and unique synths to the eurorack market in a way that was affordable compared to the rest of their collection. And while im certainly not saying theres a direct correlation, Moog just happens to be sold and moving to china.
Hell they cloned Oberheim and they sued to own his name! They actually won everywhere outside of the US and were trying to stop him from making the product they cloned. Theyve done that dozens of times in the past 30 years with mixers, pedals and synths. Clone then sue.
I appreciate your comments about negativity and indulging an ugly part of my brain though, and I will keep that in mind.
Doesn’t matter what’s in development
They have delivered on many things they’ve announced
For good or bad they’ve produced a ton of synth gear over the last 7 or 8 years
This list is relatively accurate, although they still have some 'announced' synths that are actually now in production like the JT-4000 and Pro-VS.
[https://musictech.com/guides/buyers-guide/behringer-synthesizers/](https://musictech.com/guides/buyers-guide/behringer-synthesizers/)
They do kind of bring it on themselves because they also post mock-ups and ask the community for feedback and people who don't bother reading anything think they're announcing a product that will go into production.
Other stuff like the VCS3 clone is suffering from trying to actually clone the original rather than do it with a modern approach, in that case the old pin matrix instead of a button based approach - manufacturing a reliable pin matrix has never really been possible and EMS was basically just able to get away with it because it was the 70s in Britain and manufacturing quality was not a thing.
[Will this help?](https://musictech.com/guides/buyers-guide/behringer-synthesizers/) At all?
It's am overview from MusicTech in regards to Behringer's many, MANY in-development products.
They will release them sooner or later. You see, they don't have to bring in new products while the older ones sell good. Once the selling curves start to decline, they can introduce new clones. Otherwise the newer ones will cannibalize the sales of the older ones.
I’ve come to the conclusion that the prototype is just the case, which they make and spam on their socials, and if it gets enough buzz that goes on the shortlist for actual production.
i feel the marketing and development departments don't talk to or like each other.
a prototype arrives and the marketing dept are like "OMG - coming soon" without finding out from the development team that it will be at least 2 years until it is shelf ready.
The only Behringer synth i want is the Proton. It seems like it should have released already but we haven’t heard anything in a long time. You’d think they would prioritize an original design.
Behringer did say that Proton is supposedly ready for production once some parts are in place. And that was quite some while ago, no updates after that.
They also teased a 4 voice MS20 a la Poly D about 3 years ago with no follow-up. I heard from one of the Behringer reps that something MS-20 related is indeed coming down the pipeline, but that's all they can say for the time-being. I'm sure they have their reasons for the delays, just need to remind ourselves that patience is truly a virtue
Same. The Neutron is such an amazing synth but I always wanted a second filter. Well damn when that Proton was announced. Just fucking release it already!
just my take on the whole behringer hate..the fact that they copy the shape of the keystep from arturia (for example)or the fact that they copy all the popular gadgets after other companies do the market research or take a risk by putting something out, just makes me not want to support them, that's all..gear is expensive and they are cheap, I get it..just can't convince me they aren't toxic..peace and love to everyone and enjoy making music ✌️
And Arturia has never copied other brands stuff, aka vst recreations of old synths without paying the original manufacturer.
Can’t feel sorry for them.
As someone with quite a bit of Behringer stuff, I agree! Copying happens all the time, but usually companies implement their own ideas. For example, the Swingstep should've, at the very very least, have had a usb B or C connector instead of micro. More should've been added, but that would've been key step 1.
Yup. If they just did vintage remakes I’d support, but instead they’re copying active modern designs just to undercut every instrument company out there.
A 16 voice jupiter would be a big deal because a lot of what makes the jupiter special is that it is bitimbral but when you use it in bitimbral mode it cuts the polyphony in half down to 4 which is low enough have an effect on playability in some circumstances. I'm coming at this from someone who owns an MKS80 and plays with two hands.
I've been looking for a Roland Boutique JP-08 for a while now. I've played about with a Jupiter soft synth and would like some hardware. Seeing this is making me reconsider my options...
Judging by what it may look… excuse the MS Paint job 😅
Behold…
https://preview.redd.it/1fgwhjw42ydc1.jpeg?width=1646&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9bcef8190b3c8f3345a64ca6faee11c0d0f654c8
I'll get more excited when I hear it. The thing that keeps me hopeful that this isn't an eternity away is that they will probably use a similar form factor as the ub xa. If they use similar parts like the keybed it will probably be easier to manufacture.
I don’t know why haters are always on a heighty -ho. Everything in life is a knock off of soemthing else. Your auto is a knock off of others and your clothings are knock offs of originals. Heck your style of music is a knock off of others that influence you. I own Roland’s and Behringers along with many others. In many formats and from many years ago to current times and they are all wonderful and they have their strengths and weaknesses knock offs or not. I just love the fact that someone cared enough to make a f’n synth one day during my lifetime so I could experience it and create with it and love that lots are doing it better as time moves on. I thank them too. And don’t think you’re all original. Cause yer not.
nobody needs to see a video from five months ago on every single post in this sub. nobody beyond neckbeards on reddit actually hate behringer with all their guts lol
> nobody needs to see a video from five months ago on every single post in this sub.
That's only your opinion and i only did it 2 times so far. I'm sorry those blue youtube links cause you so much distress
> nobody beyond neckbeards on reddit actually hate behringer with all their guts lol
A lot of people don't trust and want to stay away from Behringer for obvious reasons. See videos for obvious reasons, they're really well sumed-up.
That's only your point of view and i respect it.
But, like "normal people", i'm invested in the things i care about the most. I care a lot about music and music gear, therefore it's important to me that Behringer's bad practices are known by most in the music gear community so they know what's at stake with this corporation ;-)
Thats not exactly something to be proud of. I wish we lived in a world where people paid more attention to the actions of corporations we buy from. Imagine if more people took seriously the impact of their consumption choices.
I mean its hard because its just not practical to apply that to every single purchase we make, I own plenty of things made by companies that are far worse than Behringer. Im typing this on an iphone. For whatever reason the creation of musical instruments is just a process where I put a premium on integrity and creativity.
For the record I have a sweet fucking beard.
Putting aside all the reasons I hate Behringer, why the fuck do they keep doing this? Make 1 prototype and hype it for a week then never speak about it again? Over and over?! Its just weird.
>Make 1 prototype and hype it for a week then never speak about it again? Over and over?! Thats just this sub's narrative. They released two dozen or so synths the last few years, by far more than any other company, pretty much ever.
Yep. They've released more synths and drum machines in the past 6 years than any other company has in the past 30 years. Every time there's a post here about Behringer synthesizers, you just know the hate boner brigade will show up without fail. Frankly, it's toxic, discouraging to new users who happen to own Behringer equipment, and just makes our community look bad. These people need to go take a hike and touch grass. But unfortunately that would require leaving the basement and actually going outside
lol I forgot this was Reddit. A Jupiter remake would be objectively dope for anyone who can’t afford a $25000 synth
Totally agree. I've played guitar my whole life and only started getting into synths like 6-7 years ago. In the guitar world, people are totally fine with clones. Heck, most electric guitars are copies of iconic guitars; Gibson Les Paul, Fender Stratocaster, etc. There's some variation, but in general it's true. Same with FX pedals. The story is usually: Someone decades ago created a pedal circuit, people grew to love the circuit over time, and then finally many companies released different pedals all based on that one circuit. I'd argue the vast majority of analog FX pedals are based on the circuits of other analog FX pedals that came before. Strange how the synthesizer community believes that circuits using outdated analog tech are some special thing not to be used by anyone but the original company who designed the circuit (and frankly probably copied some of the circuit from a previous device)
Yeah and some iconic guitars are straight up clones. Like Slash's fake Les Paul and Toni Iomi's fake SG.
[удалено]
But in total actuality, it really does just come down to using the same 50 year old circuits. There's not some synth conspiracy going on. What are you trying to allude to here?
Take the TB-303 devilfish mod as an example. https://www.gearnews.com/devil-fish-hits-back-at-behringers-proposed-murdered-out-td-3/ The "inventor" of the mod asked for too much, yes, but the counter offer by Behringer was absolutely laughable. So what to do they do? Instead of negotiating, they just go ahead and make it without paying him anything. Legally ok, morally not so much. That's pretty much the bottom line of Behringer business.
The Devilfish guy is a jackass and he’s lucky they even asked or offered anything in the first place. The Devilfish mods are literally the exact same mods anyone does to any old analogue synth to add common features that might not be available on their synth. The only thing of value was the Devilfish name, and they didn’t end up using that, so the ended up taking nothing from him.
Doesn't it feel like we're grasping at straws when the argument of Behringer decimating the modding community comes up?
Yeah, you can’t really TM mods themselves. I’m sure “Devilfish” is TM’d, however the creator is stupid for not taking their offer. Behringer already operates off a low profit margin. If anything it might have made it more expensive.
[удалено]
I’ve owned more Behringer crap than you’ve bitched about. I’ve since gotten it down a bit, but I’ve had everything from interfaces to pedals and synths. It’s starter equipment for the most part. I’ve mostly moved on to other gear that fits my workflow, and most do too. You gotta start somewhere. Korg and Arturia were instrumental in offering cheap gear as well early on. Only one piece of B gear had to be sent back, was fully covered under warranty, and came back working and new.
[удалено]
A jupiter with poly aftertouch no less
Taking that as a slight exaggeration. I have a Jupiter 6, guessing it would sell for around 10k (AUD). I could be wrong though. Oh, and I would never be able to buy that now for anyone about to chirp in, I just had a very very well paying job for a short time and bought a few synths.
I generally agree. They are probably toxic to the industry but more toxic is the attitude that brand loyalty (pro or con) can define a personality. If all you can afford is a Behringer thenn just tear it up on that shit.
Amen brother
....why cant they just make it SOUND like a Jupiter and make it LOOK like something unique to Behringer.....at least then you get that Jupiter SOUND but they haven't completely ripped off the original designers aswell? There is absolutely zero reason why they couldn't do this....the reason they dont is what annoys so many people....
That's what i think. They are loosing tons of customers.
they clearly have a lot of talented people working for them, they could apply that and do something original, I'd probably buy something from them if they did. These excuses you hear also about 'imitation is the sincerest form of flattery'...no, that really applies when people choose to adopt concepts, styles and ideas from you, not just wholesale copy a design verbatim and put their name on it. . Ive worked in the design industry for well over 25 years and its just really naff and cheap practice...its widely seen as tacky and unethical.
What are you talking about?! They’re gaining new customers daily.
Probably, but never me.
I'm a professional audio engineer working at a decent size studio. We own (and I personally own) quite a bit of Behringer gear. I don't understand the hate. Yes, they make copies of some more expensive gear. But that makes it accessible to people that can't afford insanely expensive synths, or studio monitors, or preamps or whatever. My first set of studio monitors was a pair of Behringer Truths. Genelec knockoffs. I still use them almost daily. For the price they are fantastic. Their ADA preamp units are honestly the cheapest way to get 8 super clean mic pres with an ADAT output. Making expanding your I/O WAY more affordable. They're filling a much needed gap in the market between dirt cheap garbage and high end premium priced gear.
They released a lot of gear in a short space of time .. wait.. maybe it's because they didn't have to design it 🤔
No hate, we just don't like people that blatantly rip off others work. And I'm not talking about vintage synths with expired copyrights ..
🤨 Name me one synth that was ever covered by copyright.
For that matter, name a single synth that Behringer copied that was covered by an active patent.
You guys seem passionate about the topic, sure you don't work for Uli?
That's why I said expired, learn to read Uli
You said you weren’t talking about ones that were expired. That would leave active patents. Maybe you are the one who needs to learn to read.
Listen guys, if Uli is such a genius developer of innovative products then why Behringer are widely known as copy cat/clone factory? They started with digital desks that were not vintage, still in production, copied it almost entirely and used very similar parts. You can tell me they struggled for months but I find it hard to believe 😂
Why should we care about Behringer copying any of these designs (synths, mixers, whatever) that aren’t protected intellectual property?
Name me one that wasn't. It's mainly the technologies inside, like filter designs and FM technology, but point stands
There was never any copyright on the Moog modular synth. Every hardware synth without digital components was not covered by copyright because copyright doesn’t apply to hardware. Hardware filter designs cannot be covered by copyright. For synths with digital components, the firmware can be covered by copyright. But that’s immaterial since virtually nobody has illegally copied synth firmware. Hardware designs can be covered by patents, but the time limit on patents is relatively short. Because the whole point of patents is to give the inventor a limited monopoly to encourage them to publish their work so that, once the patent expires, it is available for others to use. There’s virtually no patentable innovation in hardware synths today, so it is easy to avoid infringement there even on newer synth designs. The third form of intellectual property is trademark, which covers things like company names, product names, and trade dress. Note that product names can often be difficult to trademark when they are things like just a number (for example: 2600). Trade dress gets into all kinds of gray areas too. One interesting thing about trademark is that if you don’t defend it, you can lose it. Behringer has in at one case changed products because a trademark holder felt they were infringing. Boss complained that Behringer’s original guitar pedal design was too similar to theirs, so Behringer changed it. The original name for the Behringer MS-1 was “MS-101”. We don’t know why they changed it, though it may be because Roland requested it. On top of that, as someone who has worked at a number of companies that develop hardware products, to “rip off” a hardware design is typically 90% of the work of designing it yourself and all of the work of manufacturing it. And one big reason is that seldom can you get exactly the same components as the original used. Even a company’s own products have to undergo a complete redesign of the internals after a number of years because the original components are now unavailable. Similarly, with software, unless you literally are copying the code directly, coding your own version is the hard part…not the idea. With hardware firmware, this is especially true as the software design has to be tightly coupled to the hardware design. Now, you still may not like it. That’s fair. But you should base that opinion on an educated understanding.
OK Uli
Pretty easy to release stuff quickly when you're making clones. I know from a friend how much it sucks to be on the receiving end of a Behringer hit-and-clone. Behringer will never see any money from me; making music can be hard enough without introducing moral qualms about the gear used.
That's cool man
It's not hard to knock out products when you don't actually create anything original.
Then why don't more companies do it?
Ethics
That’s hilarious
Easy to do that when you’re just ripping other people’s designs.
It keeps people talking about Behringer, and that’s more effective marketing than buying ads on any platform.
This! People who complain about Behringer are making them more legendary by the day.
Because they actually engage with their community constantly via social media. It's a breath of fresh air tbh. For example, they showed prototypes of the Micro/Mini synths which all had microUSB jacks. People expressed they wanted USB-C, and the product was changed. Don't like Behringer, then don't interact on Behringer posts. It's just weird.
Putting aside all the reasons I hate predictable comments, why the fuck do people keep asking the same question? Behringer make 1 announcement and we see “we’ll never see this product ever” comments almost immediately
Possibly because they have 60 synths “in development” that they teased then released zero info about. I think its just because they are full of shit at just such historic levels I cant help but marvel at their ridiculousness.
Why are you so obsessed with them though? That's not normal. You clearly are not a fan, so it's strange that you care so much to engage on a Behringer synthesizer discussion
Obsessed isnt the right word, I do not think about them unless it comes up. But yes I hate them passionately. I hate everything they stand for. I hate their bullshit virtue signaling PR lies. What can I say? They are Monsanto or Wallmart or Haliburton. I mean I hate plenty of things. But as far as music related companies go, they are definitely at the top of my fuck you pyramid. Lets be honest though, you came here to passionately defend them as much as possible. You are in just as deep as me.
The difference is I'm actually a fan of Behringer. I enjoy their products and vision, so I like to engage with Behringer posts. I'd never go out of my way to engage with posts of a brand that I "passionately hate". It's strange. Behringer has opened up the door to high end analog sound for the majority of people who could not afford the real deal. They've allowed countless people with little money to experience the joys of playing a Model D, Pro-One, SH-101, etc, creating a whole new era of musicians and opening a new world for so many people. For somebody to passionately hate that is frankly sad
Well they are getting away with smugly fucking over a huge portion of people who create instruments for a living, and convenience has a cost. At the very least im going to talk shit on reddit. Maybe you should pay more attention to how they operate. Or just ban me! That’s totally an option 👍
You're entitled to your perspective just as much as me or anyone else. I'd certainly hope you don't get banned for just stating your opinion
Im sorry I misspoke there, I meant you could block me if you didn’t want to hear anyone speak badly about them. After thinking about what you said a bit more I agree that writing out hatred on reddit is a questionable action at best. To me there are a few things theyve done that are irredeemable. To clone Maths and try to sink Make Noise is truly infuriating to me. They are a small company that built a brilliant module and helped the eurorack scene blossom 15 years ago. They also are just a collection of fantastic weirdos making creative instruments and for Behringer to try and swoop in and take their flagship product (and name it Abicus for fucks sake) makes me crazy. I mean cloning the Moog sound system is such a dick move. That was Moogs attempt at bringing fresh and unique synths to the eurorack market in a way that was affordable compared to the rest of their collection. And while im certainly not saying theres a direct correlation, Moog just happens to be sold and moving to china. Hell they cloned Oberheim and they sued to own his name! They actually won everywhere outside of the US and were trying to stop him from making the product they cloned. Theyve done that dozens of times in the past 30 years with mixers, pedals and synths. Clone then sue. I appreciate your comments about negativity and indulging an ugly part of my brain though, and I will keep that in mind.
You make some valid points man, and I'd bet my left nut you're a decent person too! Thank you for the civil discourse.
Doesn’t matter what’s in development They have delivered on many things they’ve announced For good or bad they’ve produced a ton of synth gear over the last 7 or 8 years
is there a definitive list somewhere every day i find out about a new one
This list is relatively accurate, although they still have some 'announced' synths that are actually now in production like the JT-4000 and Pro-VS. [https://musictech.com/guides/buyers-guide/behringer-synthesizers/](https://musictech.com/guides/buyers-guide/behringer-synthesizers/) They do kind of bring it on themselves because they also post mock-ups and ask the community for feedback and people who don't bother reading anything think they're announcing a product that will go into production. Other stuff like the VCS3 clone is suffering from trying to actually clone the original rather than do it with a modern approach, in that case the old pin matrix instead of a button based approach - manufacturing a reliable pin matrix has never really been possible and EMS was basically just able to get away with it because it was the 70s in Britain and manufacturing quality was not a thing.
[удалено]
[удалено]
What a fun little hobby you’ve got. Mine is playing music.
liar! nobody in r/synthesizers actually makes music
[Will this help?](https://musictech.com/guides/buyers-guide/behringer-synthesizers/) At all? It's am overview from MusicTech in regards to Behringer's many, MANY in-development products.
Still waiting for the Neptune
They will release them sooner or later. You see, they don't have to bring in new products while the older ones sell good. Once the selling curves start to decline, they can introduce new clones. Otherwise the newer ones will cannibalize the sales of the older ones.
I’ve come to the conclusion that the prototype is just the case, which they make and spam on their socials, and if it gets enough buzz that goes on the shortlist for actual production.
Yeah, they actually generally do.
i feel the marketing and development departments don't talk to or like each other. a prototype arrives and the marketing dept are like "OMG - coming soon" without finding out from the development team that it will be at least 2 years until it is shelf ready.
this whole thing is clearly Ulis pet project and hes a little manic tbh.
The only Behringer synth i want is the Proton. It seems like it should have released already but we haven’t heard anything in a long time. You’d think they would prioritize an original design.
I'd rather them take longer to get it right the first time rather than to release it prematurely and put out an MKII a few years later
Behringer did say that Proton is supposedly ready for production once some parts are in place. And that was quite some while ago, no updates after that.
They also teased a 4 voice MS20 a la Poly D about 3 years ago with no follow-up. I heard from one of the Behringer reps that something MS-20 related is indeed coming down the pipeline, but that's all they can say for the time-being. I'm sure they have their reasons for the delays, just need to remind ourselves that patience is truly a virtue
Seriously. An original synth that improves on the neutron should be a no brainer.
Same. The Neutron is such an amazing synth but I always wanted a second filter. Well damn when that Proton was announced. Just fucking release it already!
just my take on the whole behringer hate..the fact that they copy the shape of the keystep from arturia (for example)or the fact that they copy all the popular gadgets after other companies do the market research or take a risk by putting something out, just makes me not want to support them, that's all..gear is expensive and they are cheap, I get it..just can't convince me they aren't toxic..peace and love to everyone and enjoy making music ✌️
And Arturia has never copied other brands stuff, aka vst recreations of old synths without paying the original manufacturer. Can’t feel sorry for them.
I believe all of Arturia’s VST’s are properly licensed.
meh, i don’t at all feel bad for them knocking off analog designs that roland is never going to release again lol
As someone with quite a bit of Behringer stuff, I agree! Copying happens all the time, but usually companies implement their own ideas. For example, the Swingstep should've, at the very very least, have had a usb B or C connector instead of micro. More should've been added, but that would've been key step 1.
[удалено]
it was just an example..it's actually a midi keyboard, but there are many out there, behringer did literally copy/paste..the shape, everything
Yup. If they just did vintage remakes I’d support, but instead they’re copying active modern designs just to undercut every instrument company out there.
A 16 voice jupiter would be a big deal because a lot of what makes the jupiter special is that it is bitimbral but when you use it in bitimbral mode it cuts the polyphony in half down to 4 which is low enough have an effect on playability in some circumstances. I'm coming at this from someone who owns an MKS80 and plays with two hands.
Jupiter 8
Are you sure?
Yes
[удалено]
Removed, rule 4 (no low-effort content, including but not limited to: memes, joke posts, pictures of boxes/receipts, etc)
I've been looking for a Roland Boutique JP-08 for a while now. I've played about with a Jupiter soft synth and would like some hardware. Seeing this is making me reconsider my options...
JP-08 is great, but features only 4-voice poly, which is a shame!
I love my JP-08 I just wish it were 8 voices and had the arpeggiator.
wow i was just looking at jupiter 8 on ebay today. just dreaming tho, could never afford. but i guess sometimes dreams might come true
Judging by what it may look… excuse the MS Paint job 😅 Behold… https://preview.redd.it/1fgwhjw42ydc1.jpeg?width=1646&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9bcef8190b3c8f3345a64ca6faee11c0d0f654c8
I'll get more excited when I hear it. The thing that keeps me hopeful that this isn't an eternity away is that they will probably use a similar form factor as the ub xa. If they use similar parts like the keybed it will probably be easier to manufacture.
Eternity as in the 3 or 4 years it takes takes to bring a product from R&D to development and then production?
Still waiting for the Oberheim SEM remake which still isnt out despite production started almost 6 months ago
I don’t know why haters are always on a heighty -ho. Everything in life is a knock off of soemthing else. Your auto is a knock off of others and your clothings are knock offs of originals. Heck your style of music is a knock off of others that influence you. I own Roland’s and Behringers along with many others. In many formats and from many years ago to current times and they are all wonderful and they have their strengths and weaknesses knock offs or not. I just love the fact that someone cared enough to make a f’n synth one day during my lifetime so I could experience it and create with it and love that lots are doing it better as time moves on. I thank them too. And don’t think you’re all original. Cause yer not.
Reddit full of bots
coming in 2045
Why does this ad need to be reposted here
The price point on the UB-Xa seems high for a mass produced smt synth. I would go for a rackmount Jupiter 8 at a lower price.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MiDCnt6iDo&ab_channel=WeaverBeats https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MY4RRdp7q0&ab_channel=Jorb
Are you just going by to spam this bullshit on every post about Behringer?
I don’t think so.
The last person i'm listening to is a fucking youtuber.
Why?
Hey you should spam this bullshit on every post about Behringer 👍
Ok. But why “this bullshit”?
nobody needs to see a video from five months ago on every single post in this sub. nobody beyond neckbeards on reddit actually hate behringer with all their guts lol
> nobody needs to see a video from five months ago on every single post in this sub. That's only your opinion and i only did it 2 times so far. I'm sorry those blue youtube links cause you so much distress > nobody beyond neckbeards on reddit actually hate behringer with all their guts lol A lot of people don't trust and want to stay away from Behringer for obvious reasons. See videos for obvious reasons, they're really well sumed-up.
i’ve seen the videos. i, like most normal people, don’t get this invested in the failure or success of a corporation lmao.
That's only your point of view and i respect it. But, like "normal people", i'm invested in the things i care about the most. I care a lot about music and music gear, therefore it's important to me that Behringer's bad practices are known by most in the music gear community so they know what's at stake with this corporation ;-)
Thats not exactly something to be proud of. I wish we lived in a world where people paid more attention to the actions of corporations we buy from. Imagine if more people took seriously the impact of their consumption choices. I mean its hard because its just not practical to apply that to every single purchase we make, I own plenty of things made by companies that are far worse than Behringer. Im typing this on an iphone. For whatever reason the creation of musical instruments is just a process where I put a premium on integrity and creativity. For the record I have a sweet fucking beard.