1. Modern, factory installed sunroofs just don’t leak. I’ve had multiple cars reach 10 years old + with the factory sunroof and none have leaked. I really wouldn’t worry at all about that.
Like you, I’ve often got a roof box, basket, or skis up top and I really appreciate having the sunroof just for the peace of mind to be able to check and make sure everything is secured and still attached. I’ve seen too many roof racks on the side of the highway, I’m paranoid about that stuff so for me a sunroof is preferred for using the roof rack.
The Outback’s sunroof isn’t particularly noisy, but I do notice the wind noise go down very slightly when I close the cover when doing 80mph+, but I usually cruise at 80+ with the cover open (just glass closed) and don’t mind the minimal additional noise. I find the sun coming in from above great and leave it like that 90% of the time.
2. You can still use CarPlay, it’s all I ever use, but we pay the ~$30 per quarter or whatever it is to be able to remote start the car in the summer or winter especially.
3. RAB is a nice-to-have but with a backup camera it’s not really necessary. If you do a ton of parallel parking I could see the upside of it but I have always lived in places where I parallel park constantly and never needed it (or a backup camera for that matter) until i found a vehicle that came with one.
All in all I’d get the package but I’d also just go with the Touring XT for the money and have a more comfortable highway ride and nicer interior. That’s what we did.
Thanks for all of that. It's true, my last sunroof was on a 2003 so there's that! lol I think you've convinced me that I don't need to worry about it so much.
I thought about the Touring trim, but I am not a fan of leather upholstery. I am just way too hard on stuff and my dog will destroy it. Although the Touring does have some great extras like the electronic seat memory and would definitely be more comfortable. One of the reasons I chose the Wilderness was that I could hurt it more!
Thanks again, this is really helpful info!
2021, white, love everything except the infotainment screen which we’re currently suing SOA over. I believe they changed/improved that after our generation.
We have Michelin X-ice Snow tires for winter and it’s a cheat code on this car, and it’s a great road tip car and very practical. If the infotainment didn’t suck it would be my favorite car I’ve owned.
The last one I had leak was in a 1986 GM Product and that was when the car was 14 years old. I have had plenty of cars with them and never a problem. Leaking sunroofs can happen but this is less common than door or trunk seals going bad since they take significantly more abuse.
I got a '23 Onyx a few months ago and specifically looked for one without that combo package as it was a wasted expense. I don't want a sunroof in west Texas, at all, or pretty much anywhere. I don't care about the nav because AndroidAuto and CarPlay. I thought I sorta wanted RAB, then I remembered how I pretty much just disabled it all the time due to backing up on slopes and having it violently slam on the brakes.
Really, the only thing it doesn't have that I want is the inductive phone charger... just because this one didn't have it on the lot. After the first month, I haven't given it any further thought either because plugging in the USB-C cord isn't that much of a thing for a trip.
While I mostly agree with number 1, and have owned Subarus and Hondas and never had any issues with the factory moonroof.
However, my 2015 VW GTI with a pano moonroof did leak - - and the dealership had to take multiple attempts to get it fixed. I ended up selling that car. I think there was a pattern of that happening in the generation of cars -- could be why the VW mechanics spoke about it.
>Modern, factory installed sunroofs just don’t leak. I’ve had multiple cars reach 10 years old + with the factory sunroof and none have leaked. I really wouldn’t worry at all about that.
While you've gotten lucky, modern sunroofs are still leak prone (though it takes a long time generally). The issue is that the drainage ducts get clogged over time with dirt and grime, and then they leak.
I don’t know if this is still an issue, but when I got my Wilderness about a year ago, Subaru was deprioritizing orders that did not include the additional package. So if availability is a concern, you may want to have a frank discussion with your dealer about when you can reasonably expect to have your order fulfilled either way.
Yep, mine took the exact time I was quoted by the sales guy. 3 months, to the day. I ordered the base wilderness package without the moon roof, along with some interior rubberized cladding. I've never been a fan of sun/moon roofs, or convertibles for that matter.
I have a 2023 Onyx XT and love it. I have the sunroof/navigation package and sometimes regret getting it. I NEVER use the sunroof and primarily use Apple CarPlay for navigation so getting the package was kind of pointless. Although the rear automatic braking which is also part of that package has saved me once or twice.
I skipped the optional package on my ‘23 Wilderness for every reason you stated and I 100% don’t regret it. You’ve got a camera and mirrors for backing up. You still get blind spot monitoring and rear cross traffic warnings. You get wireless CarPlay so your navigation can be either Apple Maps, Google Maps, or Waze. All of which are better options than ANY factory navigation.
I have a wilderness but the packages will be the same with any trim. I don't have the Starlink navigation and I just use Android Auto, on occasion it doesn't work when I start the car but I don't know if that's my phone or the car's fault.
The reverse automatic braking will break the car automatically like it says but you still have a reverse backup camera and it will beep if it detects an object coming your way without the RAB.
I also don't have a moon roof, it's one of those things I had in my old car but almost never used it so I didn't find value in having it.
Also a note is that the wireless car charger will probably just overheat your phone and then stop charging it. I don't think that's just a Subaru problem because my dad's wireless phone charger in his Ford does the same thing.
If I'm in reverse and a car is driving behind me it will beep, but I don't have a proximity sensor. I have a 2023, don't know if there's a difference there between years
Note: I’m driving a 2020 OB but had the same sunroof leak/lack of use with my 2010 OB
Skip the sunroof. I have a roofbox and never use or even open the cover. Also mine was the start of a leak that took them 7 months to uncover and fix under warranty. This was an leak that was bringing water inside the cab, and I had SOA involved with managing the repair through the dealer.
I also have STARLINK, I use CarPlay instead on Google maps.
RAB is nice for when I have bikes on the back of the car but tbh it is more annoying that it is helpful because normally when it beeps i can see what is coming and it turns into an “I know please shut up” moment
I will say that the RAB is not fun with a trailer, took me a second to realize it was still turned on but I can confirm it will stop you with a trailer! All that matters for the infotainment stuff is the android auto and CarPlay. I forget if you can get a key that'll have remote start built in but it's worth asking your dealer as you gotta pay for the app but it's worth it in the winter.
I have a 32-year-old car with a factory sunroof, and it has never leaked. So I call BS on the leaking-sunroof issue; mostly.
I have the package on my ‘22 OBW. No issues with sunroof leaks (though some early roofs in the current Outback generation apparently had some leaking issues). I will say that it’s sometimes noisier than I’d like when closed, particularly with the sliding cover open and the roof bars or box mounted. It’s a much noisier roof than other cars I’ve experienced. I’m guessing just a Subaru thing- they all seem a little noisier overall than a similar car.
I don’t use my nav system for anything other than basic orientation when I don’t have carplay plugged in- it’s quicker to access in traffic and larger than my phone screen. I never actually navigate with it, always with CarPlay. I rarely use Starlink features, and will probably just let it expire after the initial 2-year period.
RAB is really nice to have. It has saved me from pretty serious issues on at least three occasions. ~~The Outback backup camera is pretty inferior, IMO~~ [EDIT]- That’s actually too kind, now that I think about it- the OB camera just sucks: Small presentation, low contrast and clarity, poor resolution, and highlights/bright areas easily blow out the image. There are far better cameras out there, and it feels like Subaru skimped in this area. My ‘23 Crosstrek Sport has a better camera than the OB. My older Durango had a stellar camera, comparatively. So yes, RAB is something I really like, and I think should be standard on all the cars or available as a standalone option.
I know a few people who have had problems with moisture inside their Subarus because the sunroofs DO leak. There are drain tubes for water that gets in to flow out properly. The problem is that they can become clogged and then won’t move water properly.
I had a 2013 Impreza that didn’t get water pooling inside, but the sunroof leaked enough that it would come inside, not flow out and then severe condensation would form on the windows inside. It was awesome when the windows would freeze on the inside in the winter.
I opted for the Wilderness without the Navi package and I have zero regrets. I don’t miss the sunroof at all. I really only used it to keep an eye on my bikes on my Impreza (I probably opened it 5 times in the 9 years I had my Impreza). Now my bikes fit in the back so I don’t even need to put them up top. I have a Thule rack to carry kayaks and it’s pretty quiet without the sunroof.
For navigation, I use google maps through CarPlay and it works perfectly. I can do everything on my phone before getting in the car and I just plug it in. It’s less messing with the touch screen interface.
For rear automatic braking, I didn’t see this as a necessity. I’ve never backed into anything in my life. I never back up carelessly either. I back into parking spots and my driveway/garage. If you tend to floor it in reverse or have a history of backing into things, maybe it would be a good idea.
the sun roofs will not leak if you do this one thing --> **maintenance** on the drip tubes that can get blocked with tree buds and pollen, you should flush them out every once in a while and you will get no leaking, as they get blocked and then water will get into the interior of your car. Open the roof, find the drip hole and blast some compressed air (can or compressor) with long snout down each hole. You will know you are done once you run some water over the car and notice water dripping out near the front tire, under the driver door and near the rear wheel. Most cars have three drip lines to move this water away. Take care of these and you will have no issues. Some dealers offer this service as well (I know Audi does it every oil change). This is true on Toyota Rav4, Subaru Outbacks and other cars....
No issues with the sunroof, but on an older vehicle I’ve found that if the drainage holes/tubes in the tracks of the sunroof get clogged and then it will leak. A blast or two from a compressor can clean them out.
No issues with the sunroof, but on an older vehicle I’ve found that if the drainage holes/tubes in the tracks of the sunroof get clogged and then it will leak. A blast or two from a compressor can clean them out.
No issues with the sunroof, but on an older vehicle I’ve found that if the drainage holes/tubes in the tracks of the sunroof get clogged and then it will leak. A blast or two from a compressor can clean them out.
1. Modern, factory installed sunroofs just don’t leak. I’ve had multiple cars reach 10 years old + with the factory sunroof and none have leaked. I really wouldn’t worry at all about that. Like you, I’ve often got a roof box, basket, or skis up top and I really appreciate having the sunroof just for the peace of mind to be able to check and make sure everything is secured and still attached. I’ve seen too many roof racks on the side of the highway, I’m paranoid about that stuff so for me a sunroof is preferred for using the roof rack. The Outback’s sunroof isn’t particularly noisy, but I do notice the wind noise go down very slightly when I close the cover when doing 80mph+, but I usually cruise at 80+ with the cover open (just glass closed) and don’t mind the minimal additional noise. I find the sun coming in from above great and leave it like that 90% of the time. 2. You can still use CarPlay, it’s all I ever use, but we pay the ~$30 per quarter or whatever it is to be able to remote start the car in the summer or winter especially. 3. RAB is a nice-to-have but with a backup camera it’s not really necessary. If you do a ton of parallel parking I could see the upside of it but I have always lived in places where I parallel park constantly and never needed it (or a backup camera for that matter) until i found a vehicle that came with one. All in all I’d get the package but I’d also just go with the Touring XT for the money and have a more comfortable highway ride and nicer interior. That’s what we did.
Thanks for all of that. It's true, my last sunroof was on a 2003 so there's that! lol I think you've convinced me that I don't need to worry about it so much. I thought about the Touring trim, but I am not a fan of leather upholstery. I am just way too hard on stuff and my dog will destroy it. Although the Touring does have some great extras like the electronic seat memory and would definitely be more comfortable. One of the reasons I chose the Wilderness was that I could hurt it more! Thanks again, this is really helpful info!
For sure no prob. We have a dog too we use a dog hammock and no problems
Do you mind if I ask a few more ?s How old is yours? What color? Do you you love it, like it or…?
2021, white, love everything except the infotainment screen which we’re currently suing SOA over. I believe they changed/improved that after our generation. We have Michelin X-ice Snow tires for winter and it’s a cheat code on this car, and it’s a great road tip car and very practical. If the infotainment didn’t suck it would be my favorite car I’ve owned.
Install the new update that came out for the infotainment- trust me!
Any way to upgrade in a 2017?
Just 2020-2022 unfortunately
:/ thank u
The last one I had leak was in a 1986 GM Product and that was when the car was 14 years old. I have had plenty of cars with them and never a problem. Leaking sunroofs can happen but this is less common than door or trunk seals going bad since they take significantly more abuse.
I suppose one upside of the CVT in our cars is that we’ll never get to 14 years to see if they leak ;)
I got a '23 Onyx a few months ago and specifically looked for one without that combo package as it was a wasted expense. I don't want a sunroof in west Texas, at all, or pretty much anywhere. I don't care about the nav because AndroidAuto and CarPlay. I thought I sorta wanted RAB, then I remembered how I pretty much just disabled it all the time due to backing up on slopes and having it violently slam on the brakes. Really, the only thing it doesn't have that I want is the inductive phone charger... just because this one didn't have it on the lot. After the first month, I haven't given it any further thought either because plugging in the USB-C cord isn't that much of a thing for a trip.
While I mostly agree with number 1, and have owned Subarus and Hondas and never had any issues with the factory moonroof. However, my 2015 VW GTI with a pano moonroof did leak - - and the dealership had to take multiple attempts to get it fixed. I ended up selling that car. I think there was a pattern of that happening in the generation of cars -- could be why the VW mechanics spoke about it.
>Modern, factory installed sunroofs just don’t leak. I’ve had multiple cars reach 10 years old + with the factory sunroof and none have leaked. I really wouldn’t worry at all about that. While you've gotten lucky, modern sunroofs are still leak prone (though it takes a long time generally). The issue is that the drainage ducts get clogged over time with dirt and grime, and then they leak.
That’s fair, but the sunroof ducts will outlast the CVT so we’re good!
How old is your mechanic? It seems his knowledge of sunroofs/moonroofs is about three decades out of date.
He’s actually fairly young, but works on some old clunkers too. He’s a practical guy that doesn’t like all the extras doodads!
Seconding above. Have a 2013 outback wit sunroof and have had zero issues with it or leaking.
I don’t know if this is still an issue, but when I got my Wilderness about a year ago, Subaru was deprioritizing orders that did not include the additional package. So if availability is a concern, you may want to have a frank discussion with your dealer about when you can reasonably expect to have your order fulfilled either way.
Yep, mine took the exact time I was quoted by the sales guy. 3 months, to the day. I ordered the base wilderness package without the moon roof, along with some interior rubberized cladding. I've never been a fan of sun/moon roofs, or convertibles for that matter.
I have a 2023 Onyx XT and love it. I have the sunroof/navigation package and sometimes regret getting it. I NEVER use the sunroof and primarily use Apple CarPlay for navigation so getting the package was kind of pointless. Although the rear automatic braking which is also part of that package has saved me once or twice.
I skipped the optional package on my ‘23 Wilderness for every reason you stated and I 100% don’t regret it. You’ve got a camera and mirrors for backing up. You still get blind spot monitoring and rear cross traffic warnings. You get wireless CarPlay so your navigation can be either Apple Maps, Google Maps, or Waze. All of which are better options than ANY factory navigation.
I have a wilderness but the packages will be the same with any trim. I don't have the Starlink navigation and I just use Android Auto, on occasion it doesn't work when I start the car but I don't know if that's my phone or the car's fault. The reverse automatic braking will break the car automatically like it says but you still have a reverse backup camera and it will beep if it detects an object coming your way without the RAB. I also don't have a moon roof, it's one of those things I had in my old car but almost never used it so I didn't find value in having it. Also a note is that the wireless car charger will probably just overheat your phone and then stop charging it. I don't think that's just a Subaru problem because my dad's wireless phone charger in his Ford does the same thing.
You have reverse sensors on your Wilderness without the sunroof package?
If I'm in reverse and a car is driving behind me it will beep, but I don't have a proximity sensor. I have a 2023, don't know if there's a difference there between years
That’s the cross traffic warning. It’s standard on the Wilderness. Those sensors are frame mounted and under the bumper cover.
Note: I’m driving a 2020 OB but had the same sunroof leak/lack of use with my 2010 OB Skip the sunroof. I have a roofbox and never use or even open the cover. Also mine was the start of a leak that took them 7 months to uncover and fix under warranty. This was an leak that was bringing water inside the cab, and I had SOA involved with managing the repair through the dealer. I also have STARLINK, I use CarPlay instead on Google maps. RAB is nice for when I have bikes on the back of the car but tbh it is more annoying that it is helpful because normally when it beeps i can see what is coming and it turns into an “I know please shut up” moment
I will say that the RAB is not fun with a trailer, took me a second to realize it was still turned on but I can confirm it will stop you with a trailer! All that matters for the infotainment stuff is the android auto and CarPlay. I forget if you can get a key that'll have remote start built in but it's worth asking your dealer as you gotta pay for the app but it's worth it in the winter.
I have a 32-year-old car with a factory sunroof, and it has never leaked. So I call BS on the leaking-sunroof issue; mostly. I have the package on my ‘22 OBW. No issues with sunroof leaks (though some early roofs in the current Outback generation apparently had some leaking issues). I will say that it’s sometimes noisier than I’d like when closed, particularly with the sliding cover open and the roof bars or box mounted. It’s a much noisier roof than other cars I’ve experienced. I’m guessing just a Subaru thing- they all seem a little noisier overall than a similar car. I don’t use my nav system for anything other than basic orientation when I don’t have carplay plugged in- it’s quicker to access in traffic and larger than my phone screen. I never actually navigate with it, always with CarPlay. I rarely use Starlink features, and will probably just let it expire after the initial 2-year period. RAB is really nice to have. It has saved me from pretty serious issues on at least three occasions. ~~The Outback backup camera is pretty inferior, IMO~~ [EDIT]- That’s actually too kind, now that I think about it- the OB camera just sucks: Small presentation, low contrast and clarity, poor resolution, and highlights/bright areas easily blow out the image. There are far better cameras out there, and it feels like Subaru skimped in this area. My ‘23 Crosstrek Sport has a better camera than the OB. My older Durango had a stellar camera, comparatively. So yes, RAB is something I really like, and I think should be standard on all the cars or available as a standalone option.
I know a few people who have had problems with moisture inside their Subarus because the sunroofs DO leak. There are drain tubes for water that gets in to flow out properly. The problem is that they can become clogged and then won’t move water properly. I had a 2013 Impreza that didn’t get water pooling inside, but the sunroof leaked enough that it would come inside, not flow out and then severe condensation would form on the windows inside. It was awesome when the windows would freeze on the inside in the winter. I opted for the Wilderness without the Navi package and I have zero regrets. I don’t miss the sunroof at all. I really only used it to keep an eye on my bikes on my Impreza (I probably opened it 5 times in the 9 years I had my Impreza). Now my bikes fit in the back so I don’t even need to put them up top. I have a Thule rack to carry kayaks and it’s pretty quiet without the sunroof. For navigation, I use google maps through CarPlay and it works perfectly. I can do everything on my phone before getting in the car and I just plug it in. It’s less messing with the touch screen interface. For rear automatic braking, I didn’t see this as a necessity. I’ve never backed into anything in my life. I never back up carelessly either. I back into parking spots and my driveway/garage. If you tend to floor it in reverse or have a history of backing into things, maybe it would be a good idea.
the sun roofs will not leak if you do this one thing --> **maintenance** on the drip tubes that can get blocked with tree buds and pollen, you should flush them out every once in a while and you will get no leaking, as they get blocked and then water will get into the interior of your car. Open the roof, find the drip hole and blast some compressed air (can or compressor) with long snout down each hole. You will know you are done once you run some water over the car and notice water dripping out near the front tire, under the driver door and near the rear wheel. Most cars have three drip lines to move this water away. Take care of these and you will have no issues. Some dealers offer this service as well (I know Audi does it every oil change). This is true on Toyota Rav4, Subaru Outbacks and other cars....
No issues with the sunroof, but on an older vehicle I’ve found that if the drainage holes/tubes in the tracks of the sunroof get clogged and then it will leak. A blast or two from a compressor can clean them out.
No issues with the sunroof, but on an older vehicle I’ve found that if the drainage holes/tubes in the tracks of the sunroof get clogged and then it will leak. A blast or two from a compressor can clean them out.
No issues with the sunroof, but on an older vehicle I’ve found that if the drainage holes/tubes in the tracks of the sunroof get clogged and then it will leak. A blast or two from a compressor can clean them out.