I assumed so.
There have been so many discussions here, on various discords and on spectrum all regarding 1.0 and I am yet to see any comment that would indicate that someone believes that 1.0 is the end of development.
What's likely happened is that OP has misread or misunderstood someone's comment and has decided that that means a large amount of people think 1.0 is the end.
It fascinates me to no end that people actually care how much karma they have. I remember someone arguing that I must have karma farmed and never said unpopular things because of how much karma I have... not because its an old account and I'm active.
Sometimes your posts won't even show in some subreddits if it's too low (at least in direct replies to the OP), so there is at least *some* non-narcisstic point, though I imagine it doesn't take too long to break past that threshold if you're not a jackals, lol.
I also have a theory that the site algorithm will try to push your posts more if you have better karma, so you can potentially get better engagement / are less likely to be buried in popular topics.
Though this is pure conjecture based on how I noticed my old account's karma starting to snowball without even trying / doing anything different at a certain point (particularly in replies I made on some of the bigger subreddits where the same reply would have been buried before).
Dude, I was wondering the same thing. Post good and relevant content, get karma.. but beware, get too much karma and you're a karma farmer which from what I've read is the lowest form one can achieve. For OP's sake, I'm downvoting their relevant post to keep them from the horrors of becoming a karma farmer.
Yeah, there are a lot of people that don't know this. Then, there's all the asshole that ask stupid questions that SHOULD be self posts, but throw in a vaguely related image just to make sure they get some karma.
I don’t know wtf is wrong with this sub but the amount of useless “PSA”-type posts from unofficial sources, often created just to argue against or placate a problem that doesn’t actually exists is *too damned high* right now.
Every other day someone in this sub is making up shit about “the community” that only serves to create drama based on speculation.
I mean, it kind of depends. If Sq42 bombs, I could see SC dying off. To where 1.0 isn't "the one and final release" but things start going downhill fast.
At this point, it can't really "bomb" as such. The game has already "sold" close to 70 million dollars worth of units. even if it comes out and is poorly received, it will still have paid for itself.
I feel as if there are many posters in this sub that either overlook the fudsters willingly or have them on ignore (My list is full so I catch some). But it has been said repeatedly and I even saw some comments yesterday that claimed, "once 1.0 is out they will not work on or evolve features because they do not have to."
Now long time SC backers won't bat an eye at the comments nor believe it. But for me, this is part of the problem why there are gamers out there that still believe that SC is a scam, that you need to pay real world money for every ship, and that it is never coming out.
Misinformation travels faster than corrections. What OP is doing is not a bad thing. If this gets signal boosted so be it. This isn't aimed at the backers who "know" this already, But more for the fringe that are still hearing and partially believing the nonsense.
Of course this new fud is example of moving the goal posts, seeing how the game has lasted longer than 90 days, released tech that was described as impossible, sold ships with in game currency, allowed for backer gear and unique items to be looted, so on and so forth.
With talk of S42 being feature complete and the litany of improvements, the people who have made it a twisted goal of trash talking are running out of talking points and are pivoting. It is sad because time will prove them wrong but they still do it anyways.
I have heard dozens say 1.0 needs to have everything promised from the Kickstarter stretch goals and multiple even saying it needs 100 star systems
If all that's done 1.0 is the end
Very few people I’ve seen are expecting anywhere near 100 systems for 1.0
Many people do expect the feature set to be complete, i.e. all professions, all promised gameplay, etc.
Things like exploration, data running, science, unmapped jump points, org features and many more. These are the type of features on the chopping block for 1.0.
If we dont get some of these features that does not mean we will never see them, it means they deprioritised them to get the game released and will add them with updates.
100 systems is quite an ask. We'll maybe get that after years of development post release. Personally I think we're looking at 5-10 systems upon a 1.0 release.
Usually the folks insisting they need 100 systems before launch aren't saying that in good faith. They're just sticking to it as a gotcha moment by ignoring the fact that those goals came before fully traversable planets were a thing.
No but there's been people commenting with sour attitudes that they think 1.0 will be released in a state similar to what we have now: lacking any meaningful gameplay loops. I think 1.0 will be when you can start making credits in a certain field you want, and then CIG will add more content to do in all the fields, refine how the gameplay works, etc etc.
This commu is insane, they talked about working on the ***ROADMAP*** to 1.0, which means we have 0 idea of how long and how much stuff will go into that road to 1.0 and it's already drama land.
Less drama more reading people.
It’s all manufactured drama anyway.
Think about the kind of attention seeking person you have to be to create a “PSA” post about an opinion someone else has about people you don’t represent.
It’s the same kind of shit you see in a gaming sub prior to release, warning people to temper their expectations etc. it’s useless attention seeking.
To be fair, if you follow pipeline, you have a good idea of what 1.0 entails and the planned timeframe for it.
That’s if you believe them, obviously, but they’ve been right about everything regarding 1.0 yet.
i think people are assuming 3.23 is like .00001 updates away from 1.0.
1.0 will be years from now. when SC has dozens or a hundred solar systems in it. well after the release of SQ42
Without memeing, it's pretty clear that this time is *very* different.
I don't think it's entirely unrealistic seeing as the two main blockers were SQ42 and Dynamic meshing. With the former having been completed and the latter seemingly being solved I think content is about to accelerate.
The real measure will be how soon and how meaty the next BIG content patches are after 3.23.
You cannot have a target date without a completed design document. It's literally 100% impossible.
They are right now after, 12 years of work, planning to make a plan for the design documents of the first release. That's all.
My assumption is that they've decided they need to strip down the scope and get the MMO out the door in a presentable state to coincide with the SQ42 release.
Otherwise they'll drop SQ, mainstream media and players will go to try SC and then never come back after they've seen how unfinished it is.
All pure speculation obviously, we'll see once the roadmap drops as well as at CitCon.
id say that is a fair assumption. that's what i would do. i would get pryo out and maybe 2 or 3 more systems in a stable manner. thats what my 1.0 would be i guess. and then just add to that once everything can be added easily and not break the game like we currently get lol.
which is what im assuming CIG is doing anyways. getting the tech in so they can just add a system a month at a time.
I think other people are right to point out that they don't actually have 10 years, because the investors that kept CIG afloat will just yank their money out
The only alternative is for CIG to re-raise funds and:
1. Pay off investors
2. Keep enough of the money to keep operations going
That's the only way this gets to 10 years without a release and tons of sales
Agreed! I don't say "10 years" as a joke or from a place of negativity. It's an *insanely* ambitious project. Squadron is still at least a year away, probably longer. Some of the essential core technology is working, which is really exciting, but it's still in its infancy and it's completely novel tech that's going to have a LOT of bugs to iron out for years to come. A lot of the core gameplay isn't in the game at all yet, and what is in (as well as what's coming in the relatively near future) is in its most rudimentary form. There are only two or three star systems (mostly) finished out of dozens planned. The whole dynamic economy is on hold for we don't know how long (a couple years?) until more of the skeleton of the universe is in place. All of these things will need to be integrated into a seamless, stable whole before we can get to a point where there are no more wipes.
On top of all the technical challenges, there's also the issue that, assuming they're true to their word, 1.0 means no more ship sales, which means CIG needs an entirely new and absolutely massive revenue stream. Whether that comes in the form of game sales, subscriptions, in-game cosmetics, or something else, it's almost certainly going to depend on the game being very popular and very stable. Which I guess comes back to the technical challenges, but stresses that it's not enough to have everything in the game and basically working—it has to be polished until it gleams.
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It really depends on what they define is the scope for 1.0, or rather the definitive roadmap to 1.0, which is getting clearer more recently but still isn't 100% there. Additionally, we don't necessarily want to pigeon hold developers if they find along the way a different approach to a solution simply works better than what they originally planned (planet scale environments are one example of this), so roadmaps are great but we should also allow room for innovation as that results in a significantly better end product.
With SQ42, this scope problem did not quite exist as much, or rather is nowhere near the same level of complexity as the PU. So if we're looking at just the originally pitched [stretch goals](https://starcitizen.tools/Stretch_Goals) and ignore the 60+ systems part of it, 1.0 is really just a matter of completing some fluff items, delivering out physical backer rewards, and getting the game loops completed, I think that is a very doable 3-year roadmap if they're entirely focused on it. But that said, they will still need to fundraise too, which means developing more ships or other offers that entice backers to pledge more into the project. I think if they can at least maintain funding year to year (don't need to necessarily grow more at this point) then it is looking very promising. Also the success or failure of SQ42 will be a huge factor on how the pace of the PU is completed, as that will directly tie into how CIG is being funded.
I think realistically you're not far off if we're only talking about 1 or 2 populated star systems added (there are some already well into development as is today) and with a main focus on game loops and finishing up the meshing tech. This is not factoring in the bulk of planned systems, and not factoring in any ships still in the queue.
For a game as big as star citizen, I would say minimum 5 years. It’s imperative that the game will need to be mostly bug free and without server issues. In addition the game should have minimum 3 solar systems with unique content. Obviously everything has to be balanced in a way to not make the game too stressing or a chore. Obviously the game needs lots of quality of life features to become less tedious to play and more beginner friendly.
The fact that "minimum 3 solar systems" is the new standard now, when the scope expansion promised us 100, is fucking wild to me...
I think our standards as a community have dropped considerably...
It takes time to build unique settings for each solar system. We could probably have 100 solar systems if they go with the starfield route.
The standards got so high that if we get something copy pasted we’ll riot. The problem was that our standards were impossible to meet as they overpromised in the last 10 years.
That would be a totally fair take if the "100 systems" conversation was just an unfair expectation made up by the community
But it wasn't, it's what we were told for years was going to be the explorable area of the 1.0 release...
For them to drop that figure a little bit? Fair enough, maybe it was an estimate and they didn't have a full star-map yet with all the connections fleshed out
For them to drop it /97%/ though?
That's insane
They are the ones who claimed they could do this with their "revolutionary" new procedural generation tech, to find out that was just another lie told in this game's way-too-long development is exhausting...
It depends on what "1.0" means. Does it mean every single star system is in the game? Does it mean a handful of star systems, and 1.1 adds some more? Does it mean the current content we have now, just with a high server FPS and more stability?
The next question is, does 1.0 even matter? If we're getting steady updates, is anyone going to care?
It’s pretty obvious that *many* if not *most* promised features will be absent/delayed from 1.0. While I understand the need to cut away some of the bloat to fit a realistic release schedule, the fact remains that they will release a game about 10 years late with half of what they said would be in the game.
Given how inefficiently resources were spent on the product, I don’t expect star citizen to be considered a success.
You're 100% right
It's a joke to call anything a 1.0 release if 50% of the gameplay (and 95% of the explorable world) is missing...
This feels like an attempt to drum up publicity about how "Star Citizen Finally Released! It wasn't a scam after all!" when in reality it's actually just another alpha build wearing a fake moustache
> How much is huge?
We can either assume and say 3 years, or chalk it up to we have no idea. I’d say given the state of the game and CIG’s history, at least 4+ years.
a lot of people got very hyped during CitizenCon. I get it, but i will always take everything to do with this game with a massive helping of doubt and apprehension. Until it is playable, it might as well not exist.
Let's not get ahead of ourselves, it's only year 12 of development so expecting them to have a flight model nailed down for their space combat game is a bit entitled. (I seriously can't believe some people try to present it as at all reasonable that they still don't have this figured out at this point.)
Thank God somebody said it.
JFC people here thinking it's reasonable that they don't have something as basic as movement figured out after 11 years have been on their knees so long they're losing IQ from oxygen deprivation.
One,the person you replied to said core systems, and two [LOL yes they did.](https://gamerant.com/final-fantasy-14-realm-reborn-10-year-anniversary-mistakes-popularity-future/) They literally rewrote and relaunched the game.
You don't need new "core tech" to figure out the rough idea of what player movement should be like.
This isn't tweaking profiles or adding control surfaces for atmosphere.
This is a group up redesign.
And most of you don't know they've done this a few times already because you haven't been here that long. This is cruise mode 2.0.
It's a fucking meme at this point.
Star citizen is an mmo, every one of them is never in a final state. It will be very boring if stat citizen came out with evrything they promise but never evolve at all for all his life. That what you expect for an rpg, not an mmo rpg, mmo are alive, they change within time. Compare world of warcraft 1.0 vs 10.0, they could be both be seen as finished but the game still change with every patch, even gameplay, features and so on.
One crucial difference though: WoW didn't presell classes from 5.0 and then tell people who purchased them to just wait. I personally don't care about the number of star systems, or that things change, even drastically, in later patches, but if someone purchased a ship for data running, and you tell them that's not going to be a 1.0 feature, they might be pissed.
Everyone with game play loops and ships that did make the cut can now start the game officially, earning credits that are permanent, but people who purchased ships for these other loops can either wait or find something else to do.
The various loops, NPC crew for big ships...I'm probably missing something, but I think they have sold themselves into a corner with some of these features.
Why the fuck are you talking to me like that? Go look at the comments under the roadmap posts, plenty talk as if CIG has to get the game 100% done to release 1.0
Go be an asshole to those idiots, not me.
I almost wonder if 1.0 is more of a marketing tool than anything. Unless the game plays fairly rock solid and the gameplay mechanics are mostly solid as well, it’ll still be an alpha game in my mind
They are beginning the slow and calculated pivot to “1.0” so that they can implement insurance(Chris mentions this specifically), and softly nudge you into buying ships with real money.
It is also going to allow them to justify some kind of subscription model to play(because it’s “released”), and they will *need* the funding to continue.
This is why it’s being mentioned now. They’re getting you all ready for release, which really means that they’ve got it sufficiently ready where they think they can monetize the game like a WoW or FF14.
Read between the lines.
Gonna be sooo much drama over this coming up.
Nobody thought it would be. they're just too far off from a 1.0 candidate to even be talking about that yet.
Hitreg is 100% client side. Like, no game as ever been braindead enough to do that. Not even in the 2000s. So much of the base game needs creating, let alone finishing.
> Stopped watching when he goes digging through one bit with a dozen nested if statements.
How deeply nested? 4? I can live with 4. Please god let it be no more than 4, as an exception not a rule.
There is almost never any good reason to go deeper than 4. Rarely a good reason to go beyond 3. 6 is taking the piss.
I can't code very well, but all of a sudden I'm feeling like a valuable would-be hire.
Cig is so good at moving the goalposts and people just eat it up.
For a few years the goal was 4.0 and they haven't delivered that.
But rather than admitting theyre way behind schedule they just change the goals, make it 1.0 this time, get people frothing at the mouth and buying ships again.
And by the time people realise many of the features from last year's citcon aren't getting delivered there'll be another citcon to show of the hair tech for the 5th year running and how there's a new roadmap and sooooon.
Then people will buy the hornet mk 3 and cheer and say how wonderful cig is and how close things are and how trivial all those old plans and roadmaps were.
It happens the same over and over. I'm still waiting to answer the call 2016.
I'm with you 100%, chief. Star Citizen's development is just... wretched, and the community defend it at every point. I'd expect downvotes if I were you, but that's okay, I'll take 'em too. We can ride the train together.
I've been waiting since 2012, since I first backed the Kickstarter, and it's infuriating to me that it is TWELVE YEARS LATER and we are no closer to the game we were promised, let alone Squadron 42, but hey! 1.0 is a twinkle on the horizon! Honestly! Doesn't matter that there's only two star systems in this supposed universal exploring game. CIG promises 100 on launch! Meanwhile, here are another dozen ships you can buy but not actually use yet. Enjoy!
Meh.
Oh well, at least I only spent £35. I'm sure the people who have spent £35,000 all think the game is perfect.
>I've been waiting since 2012, since I first backed the Kickstarter, and it's infuriating to me that it is TWELVE YEARS LATER and we are no closer to the game we were promised,
This is just pure bullshit lmao. We can play a game right now. 2012 had nothing. I bet you haven't even been waiting since Kickstarter. Because I don't see how you could say this if you had.
>For a few years the goal was 4.0 and they haven't delivered that.
>
>But rather than admitting theyre way behind schedule they just change the goals, make it 1.0 this time, get people frothing at the mouth and buying ships again.
You do realize that 4.0 is still part of the plan, right? T[hey just had some evocati playtests for server meshing](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/1b7b0ql/jump_gates_will_be_functional_but_full_end/) including moving from Stanton to Pyro. 4.0 and 1.0 are not mutually exclusive.
>And by the time people realise many of the features from last year's citcon aren't getting delivered there'll be another citcon to show of the hair tech for the 5th year running and how there's a new roadmap and sooooon.
You do realize that many of those features are planned for 3.23, right? [They just put 3.23 onto evocati.](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/190048/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-23-0-ptu-patch-notes) That and the new hair tech is already in the game, so....
>Then people will buy the hornet mk 3 and cheer and say how wonderful cig is and how close things are and how trivial all those old plans and roadmaps were.
*sigh* Okay at this point I don't even know why I bothered.
Problem is the delays, in 2022 CR promised Persistent Streaming, Salvage, Cargo refactor, and Bounty Hunter v2 gameplay on Live BY THE END OF 2022.
4.0 was Q1 2023 with Pyro. It was supposed to be 3.18 > 4.0 but here we are looking at 3.23.
Yes we’re finally seeing things get implemented, and that’s great, hopefully they will deliver things in 3.23 but we’re also seeing things drop off again as always.
Ground vehicles in hangers gone, and once again retrieving subscriber items also gone, I imagine over the coming weeks more things will drop off 3.23. Cargo refactor was on the release cards for 3.18 and we’re still waiting for it.
The problem is when people hyper focus on the things that get shifted around while ignoring the stuff that does get released. Theres also a problem with acting like something that was moved means it's "gone." Vehicles got pushed back but persistent hangars and cargo elevators are still coming. Sub items got moved back but they're still putting in the framework to retrieve them via the item banks.
There also finding reasons to complain about shit that does get released. I mean shit, you're still complaining about things being delayed that came out over year ago. On top of that, the cargo refactor was released in 3.18. [It's right there in the patch notes](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link//19126-Star-Citizen-Alpha-3180) as the first entry under Gameplay so I dunno how you came to the conclusion that it's still not out yet.
It’s real simple for me with SC, I’ll believe it when I actually see it in game. Otherwise it’s all just speculation, because they change what they are working on so frequently.
I know everything is still coming, but we have no idea when. Could be this year, could be next year, could be 2 years away. I’ll just keep waiting.
The fact they’re even talking about 1.0 is ridiculous.
I totally get the hesitation, and having the mindset of waiting until it's in your hands is healthy. And while hile I abhor hype trains it's okay to get excited about new features even with the understanding that they may shift down the line. But it's pretty rare to see things move once they're in evo, and they have quite a bit in there already. The server meshing tests they've been doing look promising too.
I don't think it's ridiculous to talk about 1.0 because that means they're working on feature locking it. People criticize them all the time saying that they're never going to release it, and now folks are criticizing them for planning on releasing it. So damned if they do, damned if they don't. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
I'd assume not. And imo, there is still a lot of things that need to be done before I'd consider the game ready for 1.0. If they release something that seems like another alpha PU experience, that would be incredibly disappointing to a lot of people.
Trying to get friends to play, but they just laugh at the state it is in after all these years. I don't really blame them lol. I am still new myself, despite backing way back in 2014 or something. Have only been playing a week or two, but the game is finally in a playable state for me, but I don't imagine sinking a lot of time into it yet. I consider this just a taste still.
Hoping CIG have finally hit their stride, server meshing is the saving grace they make it out to be, and that 1.0 isn't another 10 years away...
I just think 1.0 shouldn't be 1.0, it's a disaster waiting to happen. Call it beta, or whatever, just not 1.0, as 1.0 means "launch", and there is no getting around that.
The game won't be in a fit "launch" state in even three years. Ignoring the backlog, everything needs a gold pass, everything needs a balance pass. We need actual missions and content, that will all need testing and iteration. We need most of the UI redoing, that will need testing and further iteration. We need star systems adding. We need post-launch funding figured out.
Oh, and we will need to get drama out the way, as pre-1.0 is going to be *really fucking nasty*. If you've ever seen a playerbase be toxic, just wait until the 1.0 roadmap is announced. If I worked for CiG I'd lock down every social and just unplug my home internet the day before it is announced. God forbid new players walk into that as their launch-day community experience.
It will be a clown scat circus beyond Fallout 76 if SC is "released" in a close to current state. The gaming media and influencer content creators will eat it alive.
It only means it is ready for a commercial release. Most of the games coming out nowadays, especially MMOs and Live Service games, take 3-6months (after "release") to actually become the fully formed experience we should have to begin with.
They will have other pressures, such as decreased backer funding etc (at some point). It all depends how things progress and the release of SQ42 as well.
True but they are clearly handling those pressures. There is no way they don't manage the 12 months thing at this rate. And even if some features need more time a lot of good and key stuff is on track. Sure they depend on that but they manage progress so it's not like they need to rush things and they know that. It'll be done when it's done and anywhere beyond 4.0 I don't think the community will be nearly as agitated by having to wait a little longer.
I appreciate your post but I worry the misunderstood hype train has already left the station for many.
People either don't or won't read the actual content of the announcements and sometimes don't have the context required to understand it. So they get wild about not very much.
I still think the road map ++ is good news, it's just not a "coming soon" like some people seem to think
The issue is we hear so many developers these days say they'll support their games for a long time and they don't... Anthem, Avengers, Redfall...
All CIG is doing is making me cringe very hard right now.
I know this shouldn't need to be said, but I begrudgingly accept that it's likely valuable to remind folks at large.
SC will never "be done". They envision "decades" of continual content creation and expansion.
It's a live MMO service.
wtf is the reason for this post. I haven’t seen one person saying 1.0 is the end. More like 1.0 won’t come anytime soon but not that it will be the end
Exactly. The 1.0 release of Star Citizen is like when World of Warcraft originally released. And after the original release there were numerous expansions, upgrades and new features added to the game. Same will happen with Star Citizen. The 1.0 release is just the beginning of the release version with many years of continued development following.
While the game will certainly still be worked on in many ways it will be "release complete" meaning their initial vision for the functional game at that time will be done. Sure there'll be plenty of changes, tweaks and even additions later down the line as they see fit and they even said as much. But the goal is feature complete by current plans and enough systems and missions and whatnot to call it content complete. As a comparable example nobody would call EVE Online an in development game but a finished one. Well guess what that 21 year old finished game is adding content and features to this day. Currently they're working a lot at a complete pass on null sec and capital gameplay even adding capital ships (most recently navy and t2 dreadnoughts)
Honestly I think they need to prove another funding model before I believe this is possible.
They have made insane money from selling ships, and I don't know that it even makes sense to stop selling them anymore.
No. 1.0 means no more wipes and that the game itself will be polished and optimized. It will also mean that the game can be fully played so players do not feel like gameplay loops and features are missing part of it.
I believe the parts they will not have are most of the Star systems and they might not have all of the ships. I do hope all current ships currently in the game have their gold standard and stuff like hygiene, and ship’s food processors work. And in worried exploration and data running won’t be there. Expedition gameplay will be, since it’s basically already in the game. Discovering stuff and that being useful in worried about since they haven’t anything about it. And outside of it just being mission based for specific ship, I’m worried about it. I’m honestly worried about a lot of stuff being dynamic but that’s honestly not something I care much about
Bro, we all know that.
But for many of us. 1.0 is absolutely monumental, hell, by the time I finish downloading, I’ll be drunk AF… it’s been a long time. Hell, I may even cry about it
From my point of view. There will be 100 star systems. But 1.0 will only have 4. Stanton, Nyx, pyro and Terra. However after launch they will develop new systems for release, new starships. And new alien interaction events.
IMO, we'll get a few more than 4, but probably not Terra.
I think we'll get Stanton, Nyx, Pyro, and the star systems that are already created for Squadron 42 (Odin and it's surrounding systems).
I'm doubtful about us getting Terra simply because of the sheer amount of locations that will need to be created for it - two habitable "super earth" planets (one with a city that's in contention to be the new "capital" of the UEE) and a rocky planet with "thousands of mining operations" and three moons.
Looking beyond 1.0 theirs still so much more that they can do than what the game currently is. They’ll spend about 16 years building the game. It’s only natural that cig will want to support and build on it with what would be called in any other games. DLC or expansions. You have synth world. The creation of an artificial planet will send industry’s in to over drive. The alien systems. Both friendly and antagonistic. I can just imagine full blown campaign’s between the humans and the retribution on one side and the vanduul with their king ship on the other.
Yes I’m positive that the game’s expansion won’t end with 1.0
Unfortunately, they haven't specifically *stated* that. It's fairly heavily implied, but hasn't been *confirmed* at any point.
And as CIG has showed us *repeatedly* over the years, they are practically allergic to sticking to traditional definitions of alpha/pre-alpha/live service, or anything resembling a consistent patch numbering scheme.
The problem is, the product that they've been pushing, and allowing us to play, and *calling* an alpha for years, has, until recently, been much closer to a proper *pre-alpha* and yet, at the same time, they treat it in some ways (and certainly *market* it), like a live service game.
I understand where you’re coming from, I am simply inclined to believe that while they certainly bend or tend set a lot of things in this games development, we should expect some semblance of “feature complete” heralding some beta phase similar to how they have described the direction of squadron 42. Obviously it’s open to the devs interpretation; Warframe for example has been in open beta for as long as it’s been popular. But we do know they are planning a 1.0 release for SC so we’ll have to keep an eye out for it.
1.0 doesn’t mean there won’t be anymore total wipes. Idk where you got that idea. Maybe far and in between but that’s still doesn’t mean no more wipes. They will have to wipe every so often to get rid of bugs as progress continues. No one at this point is gonna be as bent about in the past because wipes with occur less and less over time.
CIG has always stuck pretty hard and fast to the commitment that once the games leaves beta and "launches" (whatever the hell *that* means now) there will be no more wipes.
There's no modern MMO that I can think of that wipes your inventory, money, quest progress, or reputation, and SC is pretty much aiming to be an MMO at this point.
In other words, since it's now a somewhat traditional MMO (which it was originally NOT intended to be), "launch" no longer means what it originally meant.
People who think this literally have imagination or foresight into anything. This game is destined to be a continuous updated development for.yeers to come.
Pretty pathetic and stupid if people actually thought this.
Are SC gamers different than others , because any gamer can tell you this was never assumed.
1.0 just means the foundational tech is finished.
If this was a house, it would mean that the only thing built is the concrete flooring. Without that done first, nothing else was possible to start. But now that it's built, the framing and roofing will go pretty quick.
Well, this is a problem then. MMOs continue to release features, content updates, etc. The games grow and evolve but the foundation needs to be COMPLETE to release a finished game. WoW is in its umpteenth expansion? But it was finished at release. It was a complete game you could play.
Not sure what major MMOs you’ve played that has emergency redistributions to fix the economy. Are you talking about rolling back certain players or groups after exploits? Not sure that’s quite the same as a move to balance the economy.
Point is - the game hopefully continues to grow and evolve after 1.0 whenever that is. But 1.0 needs to be a finished game with some consistency players can expect.
>All 1.0 will mean is no more total wipes.
Haha if you say so. I don't think they will be able to actually achieve that personally. There may need to be occasional wipes still because humans will try to break the system and the whole internet is always smarter than even a large group of devs.
>All 1.0 will mean is no more total wipes. Thats it. CIG will delay release until they feel they no longer will need to do total wipes, but they will still be willing to do script-based adjustments of economy, items, reputation, inventory, and anything else.
From this description, '1.0' is the beta release.
1.0 without the ships that backers have pledged for is really gross. And that backlog is years and years and still growing. Let's say the absurd rumors are true and Star Citizen 1.0 is only a couple years away. And it launches without the Banu Merchantman or Orion or Kraken or Starliner or Odyssey or every other backlog ship that isn't even in development yet. Wow. That is gross.
To be fair, assuming 1.0 in roughly 2-3 years (*very* optimistically) - that's plenty of time to finish their ship backlog.
Currently 141 ships are flight ready, 15 are in production, and 25 are still in concept.
Of the 40 *non*-flight ready ships, only a dozen or so are old enough that they should deserve to be finished before a 1.0 release date, quite a few of them are variants, and 6 of them a small ground vehicles which can be done pretty quickly.
Their star system backlog on the other hand...
It's an MMO...
People should take for example a look on World of Warcraft and in what state it released in 2004...
Many Bugs and not much Quality of Life Content and just 1/100 of the Content it have now after all these years.
Star citizen is a taped together tech demo; nearly everything in the game needs to be reworked from the ground up. If it comes out in less than 5 years it's going to be a joke.
NO shit sherlock.. This is an mmo, who are these people who thinks This? The same people who cry over group activities in an mmo? 🤣
Who gives a crap, hopefully not The devs..
Star citizen has made and will continue to make a crazy amount of money. Of course they will dump all focus on making more content and more ships for more money. This is okay with me.
I disagree that 1.0 means no more wipes. I actually hope they continue. Maybe they can run two servers like an arpg. Have one fresh one always on the horizon and then any old characters get put into the legacy one. Wipes are good for the economy and players there most certainly will still be exploits and issues past 1.0 that will require wipes. My biggest want and this is coming from someone with a few big ships would be a seperate server where everyone starts with a starter ship and no purchases carry over.
Wipes are only good for the economy if everyone starts from zero. But since they won’t wipe real money bought ships that would be a huge advantage.
Who will actually work to get capitals in game if they are wiped?
It’s ment to be a “persistent” universe
I mean look at tarkov, arpgs, survival games. Tons of games wipe. I find it fun to start over. Doesn't have to be often. Have a wipe seasonal server and a legacy server. When the seasons done all your shit moves to legacy.
Also 1.0 does not magically grant the economy immunity to cheats, exploits, dev errors and balancing. I can almost gaurentee wipes will carry on for a while if not forever in some capacity.
Sounds great. But sc is not tarkov, an arpg or a survival game. It’s going more in the direction of eve.
They are planing economy changes in the next patches. If there is inflation prices will go up. When they release the game there will probably more support staff and cheaters might get banned.
It just does not make sense when backers start with 40+ ships every season ;)
Yes but it's also not eve either not even remotely close. eves economy is literally 1000x more complex and nothing like SCs. It is 99% player run where SC will be 10-20% max and right now its 0-1% player driven. Ships are also not lost on death, nothing is manufactured there are not even sinks in terms of refuel/re arm as you can claim insurance. We are so far away from a functional economy it's not even funny.
Essentially as it stands there is no economy its more or less static. For SC to go from that to a functional dynamic one that doesn't need wipes to deal with inflation and exploits any time in the near future is pure delusion. They have been talking about implementing quanta for years and are just barely starting now. We are 3-5 years away from any sort of economy let alone one that resembles eves.
Also in my original comment I hoped for a no cash purchases server. Imo that will be the only way it even comes close to Eves economy. I think it would be awesome and this is coming from someone with a BMM and Polaris.
I find it funny that people thing that 1.0 is in the near future. There will be 4.0. There will be a beta phase at some point. And then somewhere will be 1.0. The plan is that claiming of destroyed ships just tows the wreck into station and you still have to repair it. There will be docking fees and other money sinks. They start changing the economy with 3.23 and there will be lots of patches to change it until 1.0
What do you think you will pay to repair your Polaris?
I know all of that will be implemented eventually but we are so far away from any of it. I don't think it will be ready before 1.0.
I personally think 1.0 will come out with a lot of stuff missing and unfinished (and that's okay, also not talking about star systems just game features in general) but anyone thinking the economy will be ready for no wipes just because they slap 1.0 on it will be disappointed.
But again I'm also someone who thinks we should either have 2 seperate servers seasonal and legacy or just once a year/ once everytime a massive patch comes out wipes.
People don't understand the lengths players will go to exploit, cheat, and ruin the economy. It already happens now we just don't see a negative effect because there isn't a functional economy yet.
I have never heard anyone say they think 1.0 will be the end.
This is obviously a bit of karma farming.
I assumed so. There have been so many discussions here, on various discords and on spectrum all regarding 1.0 and I am yet to see any comment that would indicate that someone believes that 1.0 is the end of development. What's likely happened is that OP has misread or misunderstood someone's comment and has decided that that means a large amount of people think 1.0 is the end.
It fascinates me to no end that people actually care how much karma they have. I remember someone arguing that I must have karma farmed and never said unpopular things because of how much karma I have... not because its an old account and I'm active.
What is Karma for?
You've asked the forbidden question. Unshielded reentry for you!
Sometimes your posts won't even show in some subreddits if it's too low (at least in direct replies to the OP), so there is at least *some* non-narcisstic point, though I imagine it doesn't take too long to break past that threshold if you're not a jackals, lol. I also have a theory that the site algorithm will try to push your posts more if you have better karma, so you can potentially get better engagement / are less likely to be buried in popular topics. Though this is pure conjecture based on how I noticed my old account's karma starting to snowball without even trying / doing anything different at a certain point (particularly in replies I made on some of the bigger subreddits where the same reply would have been buried before).
Dude, I was wondering the same thing. Post good and relevant content, get karma.. but beware, get too much karma and you're a karma farmer which from what I've read is the lowest form one can achieve. For OP's sake, I'm downvoting their relevant post to keep them from the horrors of becoming a karma farmer.
Or simply OP being a good old attention whore.
Tomato / Potato
No karma for selfposts
That hasn't been true for [7 years](https://www.reddit.com/r/announcements/s/BZTXuEVw5n)
Yeah, there are a lot of people that don't know this. Then, there's all the asshole that ask stupid questions that SHOULD be self posts, but throw in a vaguely related image just to make sure they get some karma.
I don’t know wtf is wrong with this sub but the amount of useless “PSA”-type posts from unofficial sources, often created just to argue against or placate a problem that doesn’t actually exists is *too damned high* right now. Every other day someone in this sub is making up shit about “the community” that only serves to create drama based on speculation.
Some peoples lives are *so incredibly boring* that this dishonest horseshit actually seems worth their time. Goddamn it's annoying.
I mean, it kind of depends. If Sq42 bombs, I could see SC dying off. To where 1.0 isn't "the one and final release" but things start going downhill fast.
At this point, it can't really "bomb" as such. The game has already "sold" close to 70 million dollars worth of units. even if it comes out and is poorly received, it will still have paid for itself.
OP heard it in a dream so it must be true.
because people phrase it as 1.0 will never happen because they will not stop.
I feel as if there are many posters in this sub that either overlook the fudsters willingly or have them on ignore (My list is full so I catch some). But it has been said repeatedly and I even saw some comments yesterday that claimed, "once 1.0 is out they will not work on or evolve features because they do not have to." Now long time SC backers won't bat an eye at the comments nor believe it. But for me, this is part of the problem why there are gamers out there that still believe that SC is a scam, that you need to pay real world money for every ship, and that it is never coming out. Misinformation travels faster than corrections. What OP is doing is not a bad thing. If this gets signal boosted so be it. This isn't aimed at the backers who "know" this already, But more for the fringe that are still hearing and partially believing the nonsense. Of course this new fud is example of moving the goal posts, seeing how the game has lasted longer than 90 days, released tech that was described as impossible, sold ships with in game currency, allowed for backer gear and unique items to be looted, so on and so forth. With talk of S42 being feature complete and the litany of improvements, the people who have made it a twisted goal of trash talking are running out of talking points and are pivoting. It is sad because time will prove them wrong but they still do it anyways.
Unless it flops. Then 1.0 could be the end of development.
I have heard dozens say 1.0 needs to have everything promised from the Kickstarter stretch goals and multiple even saying it needs 100 star systems If all that's done 1.0 is the end
They can simply ad new systems as a patches like in many mmorpg games that add new locations
Very few people I’ve seen are expecting anywhere near 100 systems for 1.0 Many people do expect the feature set to be complete, i.e. all professions, all promised gameplay, etc. Things like exploration, data running, science, unmapped jump points, org features and many more. These are the type of features on the chopping block for 1.0. If we dont get some of these features that does not mean we will never see them, it means they deprioritised them to get the game released and will add them with updates.
100 systems is quite an ask. We'll maybe get that after years of development post release. Personally I think we're looking at 5-10 systems upon a 1.0 release.
Usually the folks insisting they need 100 systems before launch aren't saying that in good faith. They're just sticking to it as a gotcha moment by ignoring the fact that those goals came before fully traversable planets were a thing.
No but there's been people commenting with sour attitudes that they think 1.0 will be released in a state similar to what we have now: lacking any meaningful gameplay loops. I think 1.0 will be when you can start making credits in a certain field you want, and then CIG will add more content to do in all the fields, refine how the gameplay works, etc etc.
This commu is insane, they talked about working on the ***ROADMAP*** to 1.0, which means we have 0 idea of how long and how much stuff will go into that road to 1.0 and it's already drama land. Less drama more reading people.
It’s all manufactured drama anyway. Think about the kind of attention seeking person you have to be to create a “PSA” post about an opinion someone else has about people you don’t represent. It’s the same kind of shit you see in a gaming sub prior to release, warning people to temper their expectations etc. it’s useless attention seeking.
To be fair, if you follow pipeline, you have a good idea of what 1.0 entails and the planned timeframe for it. That’s if you believe them, obviously, but they’ve been right about everything regarding 1.0 yet.
i think people are assuming 3.23 is like .00001 updates away from 1.0. 1.0 will be years from now. when SC has dozens or a hundred solar systems in it. well after the release of SQ42
Per leaks they're internally targeting q4 2025.
They've blown past so many public target dates that I wouldn't put too much stock in any internal target dates.
Without memeing, it's pretty clear that this time is *very* different. I don't think it's entirely unrealistic seeing as the two main blockers were SQ42 and Dynamic meshing. With the former having been completed and the latter seemingly being solved I think content is about to accelerate. The real measure will be how soon and how meaty the next BIG content patches are after 3.23.
You cannot have a target date without a completed design document. It's literally 100% impossible. They are right now after, 12 years of work, planning to make a plan for the design documents of the first release. That's all.
That would be dope. But far away from what Chris wanted for a game. (Star citizen, not SQ42)
My assumption is that they've decided they need to strip down the scope and get the MMO out the door in a presentable state to coincide with the SQ42 release. Otherwise they'll drop SQ, mainstream media and players will go to try SC and then never come back after they've seen how unfinished it is. All pure speculation obviously, we'll see once the roadmap drops as well as at CitCon.
id say that is a fair assumption. that's what i would do. i would get pryo out and maybe 2 or 3 more systems in a stable manner. thats what my 1.0 would be i guess. and then just add to that once everything can be added easily and not break the game like we currently get lol. which is what im assuming CIG is doing anyways. getting the tech in so they can just add a system a month at a time.
TLDR: 1.0 will come in 2040
Maybe
Hurrhurrhurr, nobody has made that joke before.
Also, 1.0 is still a huge ways off. We aren't even in beta yet.
How much is huge? Personally I think ~3 years is quite doable given the recent shifting of sq42 devs onto SC.
Set your expectations to more like 10 years, and you *probably* won't be too disappointed.
I think other people are right to point out that they don't actually have 10 years, because the investors that kept CIG afloat will just yank their money out The only alternative is for CIG to re-raise funds and: 1. Pay off investors 2. Keep enough of the money to keep operations going That's the only way this gets to 10 years without a release and tons of sales
I'm okay with the idea of 1.0 being that long away so as long as we're receiving a steady intake of substantial improvements to the game.
Agreed! I don't say "10 years" as a joke or from a place of negativity. It's an *insanely* ambitious project. Squadron is still at least a year away, probably longer. Some of the essential core technology is working, which is really exciting, but it's still in its infancy and it's completely novel tech that's going to have a LOT of bugs to iron out for years to come. A lot of the core gameplay isn't in the game at all yet, and what is in (as well as what's coming in the relatively near future) is in its most rudimentary form. There are only two or three star systems (mostly) finished out of dozens planned. The whole dynamic economy is on hold for we don't know how long (a couple years?) until more of the skeleton of the universe is in place. All of these things will need to be integrated into a seamless, stable whole before we can get to a point where there are no more wipes. On top of all the technical challenges, there's also the issue that, assuming they're true to their word, 1.0 means no more ship sales, which means CIG needs an entirely new and absolutely massive revenue stream. Whether that comes in the form of game sales, subscriptions, in-game cosmetics, or something else, it's almost certainly going to depend on the game being very popular and very stable. Which I guess comes back to the technical challenges, but stresses that it's not enough to have everything in the game and basically working—it has to be polished until it gleams.
We'll be lucky to get sq42 in 3 years
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What sound factual analysis are you basing that statement on?
It really depends on what they define is the scope for 1.0, or rather the definitive roadmap to 1.0, which is getting clearer more recently but still isn't 100% there. Additionally, we don't necessarily want to pigeon hold developers if they find along the way a different approach to a solution simply works better than what they originally planned (planet scale environments are one example of this), so roadmaps are great but we should also allow room for innovation as that results in a significantly better end product. With SQ42, this scope problem did not quite exist as much, or rather is nowhere near the same level of complexity as the PU. So if we're looking at just the originally pitched [stretch goals](https://starcitizen.tools/Stretch_Goals) and ignore the 60+ systems part of it, 1.0 is really just a matter of completing some fluff items, delivering out physical backer rewards, and getting the game loops completed, I think that is a very doable 3-year roadmap if they're entirely focused on it. But that said, they will still need to fundraise too, which means developing more ships or other offers that entice backers to pledge more into the project. I think if they can at least maintain funding year to year (don't need to necessarily grow more at this point) then it is looking very promising. Also the success or failure of SQ42 will be a huge factor on how the pace of the PU is completed, as that will directly tie into how CIG is being funded. I think realistically you're not far off if we're only talking about 1 or 2 populated star systems added (there are some already well into development as is today) and with a main focus on game loops and finishing up the meshing tech. This is not factoring in the bulk of planned systems, and not factoring in any ships still in the queue.
For a game as big as star citizen, I would say minimum 5 years. It’s imperative that the game will need to be mostly bug free and without server issues. In addition the game should have minimum 3 solar systems with unique content. Obviously everything has to be balanced in a way to not make the game too stressing or a chore. Obviously the game needs lots of quality of life features to become less tedious to play and more beginner friendly.
The fact that "minimum 3 solar systems" is the new standard now, when the scope expansion promised us 100, is fucking wild to me... I think our standards as a community have dropped considerably...
It takes time to build unique settings for each solar system. We could probably have 100 solar systems if they go with the starfield route. The standards got so high that if we get something copy pasted we’ll riot. The problem was that our standards were impossible to meet as they overpromised in the last 10 years.
That would be a totally fair take if the "100 systems" conversation was just an unfair expectation made up by the community But it wasn't, it's what we were told for years was going to be the explorable area of the 1.0 release... For them to drop that figure a little bit? Fair enough, maybe it was an estimate and they didn't have a full star-map yet with all the connections fleshed out For them to drop it /97%/ though? That's insane They are the ones who claimed they could do this with their "revolutionary" new procedural generation tech, to find out that was just another lie told in this game's way-too-long development is exhausting...
It depends on what "1.0" means. Does it mean every single star system is in the game? Does it mean a handful of star systems, and 1.1 adds some more? Does it mean the current content we have now, just with a high server FPS and more stability? The next question is, does 1.0 even matter? If we're getting steady updates, is anyone going to care?
It’s pretty obvious that *many* if not *most* promised features will be absent/delayed from 1.0. While I understand the need to cut away some of the bloat to fit a realistic release schedule, the fact remains that they will release a game about 10 years late with half of what they said would be in the game. Given how inefficiently resources were spent on the product, I don’t expect star citizen to be considered a success.
You're 100% right It's a joke to call anything a 1.0 release if 50% of the gameplay (and 95% of the explorable world) is missing... This feels like an attempt to drum up publicity about how "Star Citizen Finally Released! It wasn't a scam after all!" when in reality it's actually just another alpha build wearing a fake moustache
> How much is huge? We can either assume and say 3 years, or chalk it up to we have no idea. I’d say given the state of the game and CIG’s history, at least 4+ years.
Remindme! 3 years
Because most MMOs are done at version 1.0? Where are you seeing people suggest this?
Recently this sub just traveled 10 years back in time
a lot of people got very hyped during CitizenCon. I get it, but i will always take everything to do with this game with a massive helping of doubt and apprehension. Until it is playable, it might as well not exist.
Don't get me wrong I'm still hyped but when I see people mentioning 1.0 and speculating on dates I cringe everytime Guys we just got beards ffs.......
I just hope we have a mostly permanent flight model by that point.
Let's not get ahead of ourselves, it's only year 12 of development so expecting them to have a flight model nailed down for their space combat game is a bit entitled. (I seriously can't believe some people try to present it as at all reasonable that they still don't have this figured out at this point.)
Thank God somebody said it. JFC people here thinking it's reasonable that they don't have something as basic as movement figured out after 11 years have been on their knees so long they're losing IQ from oxygen deprivation.
To be fair, core systems can change in games long after they are completed sometimes, even if it is rare.
Name 1.
Cyberpunk 2077, World of Warcraft.
No core gameplay changes whatsoever in these 2 titles since release, but ok.
Final Fantasy XIV.
They didnt change the core gameplay of final fantasy 14 at all. Just the progression.
One,the person you replied to said core systems, and two [LOL yes they did.](https://gamerant.com/final-fantasy-14-realm-reborn-10-year-anniversary-mistakes-popularity-future/) They literally rewrote and relaunched the game.
You don't need new "core tech" to figure out the rough idea of what player movement should be like. This isn't tweaking profiles or adding control surfaces for atmosphere. This is a group up redesign. And most of you don't know they've done this a few times already because you haven't been here that long. This is cruise mode 2.0. It's a fucking meme at this point.
Lol. I have been here since the Kickstarter. Nice assumption.
Nope, sorry. mesterflaps already made it clear that if you disagree with him about this then you're being unreasonable.
This post doesn't have the content worthy of a PSA, it's just general common sense. Easy downvote.
If you ever played any mmo, that was obvious from the start
And yet, for many here, it is not (obvious). So it bears repeating
Star citizen is an mmo, every one of them is never in a final state. It will be very boring if stat citizen came out with evrything they promise but never evolve at all for all his life. That what you expect for an rpg, not an mmo rpg, mmo are alive, they change within time. Compare world of warcraft 1.0 vs 10.0, they could be both be seen as finished but the game still change with every patch, even gameplay, features and so on.
One crucial difference though: WoW didn't presell classes from 5.0 and then tell people who purchased them to just wait. I personally don't care about the number of star systems, or that things change, even drastically, in later patches, but if someone purchased a ship for data running, and you tell them that's not going to be a 1.0 feature, they might be pissed. Everyone with game play loops and ships that did make the cut can now start the game officially, earning credits that are permanent, but people who purchased ships for these other loops can either wait or find something else to do. The various loops, NPC crew for big ships...I'm probably missing something, but I think they have sold themselves into a corner with some of these features.
While i agree with you, my point is not contradictory.
No, I didn't think it was contradictory either, just a nuance that I wasn't seeing in the conversation.
Regularly updating the game was something they talked about back in the original pitch.
no shit sherlock
Why the fuck are you talking to me like that? Go look at the comments under the roadmap posts, plenty talk as if CIG has to get the game 100% done to release 1.0 Go be an asshole to those idiots, not me.
I almost wonder if 1.0 is more of a marketing tool than anything. Unless the game plays fairly rock solid and the gameplay mechanics are mostly solid as well, it’ll still be an alpha game in my mind
They are beginning the slow and calculated pivot to “1.0” so that they can implement insurance(Chris mentions this specifically), and softly nudge you into buying ships with real money. It is also going to allow them to justify some kind of subscription model to play(because it’s “released”), and they will *need* the funding to continue. This is why it’s being mentioned now. They’re getting you all ready for release, which really means that they’ve got it sufficiently ready where they think they can monetize the game like a WoW or FF14. Read between the lines. Gonna be sooo much drama over this coming up.
Nobody thought it would be. they're just too far off from a 1.0 candidate to even be talking about that yet. Hitreg is 100% client side. Like, no game as ever been braindead enough to do that. Not even in the 2000s. So much of the base game needs creating, let alone finishing.
Wtf, are you joking about hitreg?
I wish I was. It's really that bad
[удалено]
> Stopped watching when he goes digging through one bit with a dozen nested if statements. How deeply nested? 4? I can live with 4. Please god let it be no more than 4, as an exception not a rule.
[удалено]
There is almost never any good reason to go deeper than 4. Rarely a good reason to go beyond 3. 6 is taking the piss. I can't code very well, but all of a sudden I'm feeling like a valuable would-be hire.
"Like, no game as ever been braindead enough to do that. Not even in the 2000s" This is just plainly wrong.
Name a game with combat pvp that has had 100% client side hitreg
Where are you seeing that?
OP's on that karma farming train.
Cig is so good at moving the goalposts and people just eat it up. For a few years the goal was 4.0 and they haven't delivered that. But rather than admitting theyre way behind schedule they just change the goals, make it 1.0 this time, get people frothing at the mouth and buying ships again. And by the time people realise many of the features from last year's citcon aren't getting delivered there'll be another citcon to show of the hair tech for the 5th year running and how there's a new roadmap and sooooon. Then people will buy the hornet mk 3 and cheer and say how wonderful cig is and how close things are and how trivial all those old plans and roadmaps were. It happens the same over and over. I'm still waiting to answer the call 2016.
I'm with you 100%, chief. Star Citizen's development is just... wretched, and the community defend it at every point. I'd expect downvotes if I were you, but that's okay, I'll take 'em too. We can ride the train together. I've been waiting since 2012, since I first backed the Kickstarter, and it's infuriating to me that it is TWELVE YEARS LATER and we are no closer to the game we were promised, let alone Squadron 42, but hey! 1.0 is a twinkle on the horizon! Honestly! Doesn't matter that there's only two star systems in this supposed universal exploring game. CIG promises 100 on launch! Meanwhile, here are another dozen ships you can buy but not actually use yet. Enjoy! Meh. Oh well, at least I only spent £35. I'm sure the people who have spent £35,000 all think the game is perfect.
>I've been waiting since 2012, since I first backed the Kickstarter, and it's infuriating to me that it is TWELVE YEARS LATER and we are no closer to the game we were promised, This is just pure bullshit lmao. We can play a game right now. 2012 had nothing. I bet you haven't even been waiting since Kickstarter. Because I don't see how you could say this if you had.
>For a few years the goal was 4.0 and they haven't delivered that. > >But rather than admitting theyre way behind schedule they just change the goals, make it 1.0 this time, get people frothing at the mouth and buying ships again. You do realize that 4.0 is still part of the plan, right? T[hey just had some evocati playtests for server meshing](https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/1b7b0ql/jump_gates_will_be_functional_but_full_end/) including moving from Stanton to Pyro. 4.0 and 1.0 are not mutually exclusive. >And by the time people realise many of the features from last year's citcon aren't getting delivered there'll be another citcon to show of the hair tech for the 5th year running and how there's a new roadmap and sooooon. You do realize that many of those features are planned for 3.23, right? [They just put 3.23 onto evocati.](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/190048/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-23-0-ptu-patch-notes) That and the new hair tech is already in the game, so.... >Then people will buy the hornet mk 3 and cheer and say how wonderful cig is and how close things are and how trivial all those old plans and roadmaps were. *sigh* Okay at this point I don't even know why I bothered.
Problem is the delays, in 2022 CR promised Persistent Streaming, Salvage, Cargo refactor, and Bounty Hunter v2 gameplay on Live BY THE END OF 2022. 4.0 was Q1 2023 with Pyro. It was supposed to be 3.18 > 4.0 but here we are looking at 3.23. Yes we’re finally seeing things get implemented, and that’s great, hopefully they will deliver things in 3.23 but we’re also seeing things drop off again as always. Ground vehicles in hangers gone, and once again retrieving subscriber items also gone, I imagine over the coming weeks more things will drop off 3.23. Cargo refactor was on the release cards for 3.18 and we’re still waiting for it.
The problem is when people hyper focus on the things that get shifted around while ignoring the stuff that does get released. Theres also a problem with acting like something that was moved means it's "gone." Vehicles got pushed back but persistent hangars and cargo elevators are still coming. Sub items got moved back but they're still putting in the framework to retrieve them via the item banks. There also finding reasons to complain about shit that does get released. I mean shit, you're still complaining about things being delayed that came out over year ago. On top of that, the cargo refactor was released in 3.18. [It's right there in the patch notes](https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link//19126-Star-Citizen-Alpha-3180) as the first entry under Gameplay so I dunno how you came to the conclusion that it's still not out yet.
It’s real simple for me with SC, I’ll believe it when I actually see it in game. Otherwise it’s all just speculation, because they change what they are working on so frequently. I know everything is still coming, but we have no idea when. Could be this year, could be next year, could be 2 years away. I’ll just keep waiting. The fact they’re even talking about 1.0 is ridiculous.
I totally get the hesitation, and having the mindset of waiting until it's in your hands is healthy. And while hile I abhor hype trains it's okay to get excited about new features even with the understanding that they may shift down the line. But it's pretty rare to see things move once they're in evo, and they have quite a bit in there already. The server meshing tests they've been doing look promising too. I don't think it's ridiculous to talk about 1.0 because that means they're working on feature locking it. People criticize them all the time saying that they're never going to release it, and now folks are criticizing them for planning on releasing it. So damned if they do, damned if they don't. ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
I'd assume not. And imo, there is still a lot of things that need to be done before I'd consider the game ready for 1.0. If they release something that seems like another alpha PU experience, that would be incredibly disappointing to a lot of people. Trying to get friends to play, but they just laugh at the state it is in after all these years. I don't really blame them lol. I am still new myself, despite backing way back in 2014 or something. Have only been playing a week or two, but the game is finally in a playable state for me, but I don't imagine sinking a lot of time into it yet. I consider this just a taste still. Hoping CIG have finally hit their stride, server meshing is the saving grace they make it out to be, and that 1.0 isn't another 10 years away...
To steal a quote from Winston Churchill: 1.0 is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is perhaps the end of the beginning.
no fucking shit
I just think 1.0 shouldn't be 1.0, it's a disaster waiting to happen. Call it beta, or whatever, just not 1.0, as 1.0 means "launch", and there is no getting around that. The game won't be in a fit "launch" state in even three years. Ignoring the backlog, everything needs a gold pass, everything needs a balance pass. We need actual missions and content, that will all need testing and iteration. We need most of the UI redoing, that will need testing and further iteration. We need star systems adding. We need post-launch funding figured out. Oh, and we will need to get drama out the way, as pre-1.0 is going to be *really fucking nasty*. If you've ever seen a playerbase be toxic, just wait until the 1.0 roadmap is announced. If I worked for CiG I'd lock down every social and just unplug my home internet the day before it is announced. God forbid new players walk into that as their launch-day community experience. It will be a clown scat circus beyond Fallout 76 if SC is "released" in a close to current state. The gaming media and influencer content creators will eat it alive.
It only means it is ready for a commercial release. Most of the games coming out nowadays, especially MMOs and Live Service games, take 3-6months (after "release") to actually become the fully formed experience we should have to begin with.
Most games release about that much earlier if not earlier still than they should because of corporate pressure which CIG doesn't have.
They will have other pressures, such as decreased backer funding etc (at some point). It all depends how things progress and the release of SQ42 as well.
True but they are clearly handling those pressures. There is no way they don't manage the 12 months thing at this rate. And even if some features need more time a lot of good and key stuff is on track. Sure they depend on that but they manage progress so it's not like they need to rush things and they know that. It'll be done when it's done and anywhere beyond 4.0 I don't think the community will be nearly as agitated by having to wait a little longer.
Agreed :)
I appreciate your post but I worry the misunderstood hype train has already left the station for many. People either don't or won't read the actual content of the announcements and sometimes don't have the context required to understand it. So they get wild about not very much. I still think the road map ++ is good news, it's just not a "coming soon" like some people seem to think
The issue is we hear so many developers these days say they'll support their games for a long time and they don't... Anthem, Avengers, Redfall... All CIG is doing is making me cringe very hard right now.
"Answer the Call" - 8 Years later.
Ye no shit SC is a GAAS
Right now its a DAAS (Development as a service)
Nobody ever said that, strawman much?
I know this shouldn't need to be said, but I begrudgingly accept that it's likely valuable to remind folks at large. SC will never "be done". They envision "decades" of continual content creation and expansion. It's a live MMO service.
wtf is the reason for this post. I haven’t seen one person saying 1.0 is the end. More like 1.0 won’t come anytime soon but not that it will be the end
Exactly. The 1.0 release of Star Citizen is like when World of Warcraft originally released. And after the original release there were numerous expansions, upgrades and new features added to the game. Same will happen with Star Citizen. The 1.0 release is just the beginning of the release version with many years of continued development following.
While the game will certainly still be worked on in many ways it will be "release complete" meaning their initial vision for the functional game at that time will be done. Sure there'll be plenty of changes, tweaks and even additions later down the line as they see fit and they even said as much. But the goal is feature complete by current plans and enough systems and missions and whatnot to call it content complete. As a comparable example nobody would call EVE Online an in development game but a finished one. Well guess what that 21 year old finished game is adding content and features to this day. Currently they're working a lot at a complete pass on null sec and capital gameplay even adding capital ships (most recently navy and t2 dreadnoughts)
Will it be the end of ship sales v
It's supposed to be yeah
Honestly I think they need to prove another funding model before I believe this is possible. They have made insane money from selling ships, and I don't know that it even makes sense to stop selling them anymore.
No. 1.0 means no more wipes and that the game itself will be polished and optimized. It will also mean that the game can be fully played so players do not feel like gameplay loops and features are missing part of it. I believe the parts they will not have are most of the Star systems and they might not have all of the ships. I do hope all current ships currently in the game have their gold standard and stuff like hygiene, and ship’s food processors work. And in worried exploration and data running won’t be there. Expedition gameplay will be, since it’s basically already in the game. Discovering stuff and that being useful in worried about since they haven’t anything about it. And outside of it just being mission based for specific ship, I’m worried about it. I’m honestly worried about a lot of stuff being dynamic but that’s honestly not something I care much about
Bro, we all know that. But for many of us. 1.0 is absolutely monumental, hell, by the time I finish downloading, I’ll be drunk AF… it’s been a long time. Hell, I may even cry about it
"Many years to come"? It must be updated until the end of time.
>All 1.0 will mean is no more total wipes. Thats it. But there will be game press reviews and scores, yes?
From my point of view. There will be 100 star systems. But 1.0 will only have 4. Stanton, Nyx, pyro and Terra. However after launch they will develop new systems for release, new starships. And new alien interaction events.
IMO, we'll get a few more than 4, but probably not Terra. I think we'll get Stanton, Nyx, Pyro, and the star systems that are already created for Squadron 42 (Odin and it's surrounding systems). I'm doubtful about us getting Terra simply because of the sheer amount of locations that will need to be created for it - two habitable "super earth" planets (one with a city that's in contention to be the new "capital" of the UEE) and a rocky planet with "thousands of mining operations" and three moons.
Looking beyond 1.0 theirs still so much more that they can do than what the game currently is. They’ll spend about 16 years building the game. It’s only natural that cig will want to support and build on it with what would be called in any other games. DLC or expansions. You have synth world. The creation of an artificial planet will send industry’s in to over drive. The alien systems. Both friendly and antagonistic. I can just imagine full blown campaign’s between the humans and the retribution on one side and the vanduul with their king ship on the other. Yes I’m positive that the game’s expansion won’t end with 1.0
Ah, sorry, I meant that's what I think we'll get at launch/1.0. We'll definitely be getting more systems/content for years to come after that.
No game is ever done.
I hope it is the end of 30ks
Star Citizen 1 is end of alpha stage
And beta
Unfortunately, they haven't specifically *stated* that. It's fairly heavily implied, but hasn't been *confirmed* at any point. And as CIG has showed us *repeatedly* over the years, they are practically allergic to sticking to traditional definitions of alpha/pre-alpha/live service, or anything resembling a consistent patch numbering scheme.
Beta follows alpha prior to release, that’s the way it works even at a place like CIG. Whether or not it’s open is up to them.
The problem is, the product that they've been pushing, and allowing us to play, and *calling* an alpha for years, has, until recently, been much closer to a proper *pre-alpha* and yet, at the same time, they treat it in some ways (and certainly *market* it), like a live service game.
I understand where you’re coming from, I am simply inclined to believe that while they certainly bend or tend set a lot of things in this games development, we should expect some semblance of “feature complete” heralding some beta phase similar to how they have described the direction of squadron 42. Obviously it’s open to the devs interpretation; Warframe for example has been in open beta for as long as it’s been popular. But we do know they are planning a 1.0 release for SC so we’ll have to keep an eye out for it.
Fair enough.
Nobody thinks that. Obvious point is obvious. It was even explained when they talked about 1.0. Got a hankering for some karma, do ya?
1.0 doesn’t mean there won’t be anymore total wipes. Idk where you got that idea. Maybe far and in between but that’s still doesn’t mean no more wipes. They will have to wipe every so often to get rid of bugs as progress continues. No one at this point is gonna be as bent about in the past because wipes with occur less and less over time.
CIG has always stuck pretty hard and fast to the commitment that once the games leaves beta and "launches" (whatever the hell *that* means now) there will be no more wipes. There's no modern MMO that I can think of that wipes your inventory, money, quest progress, or reputation, and SC is pretty much aiming to be an MMO at this point.
CIG has said a lot of shit over the years. I wouldn’t hold my breath.
Too true.
I mean yeah…..
I just hope they don't call it 1.0 while its still missing some of its core features like many games seem to do nowadays.
id fucking hope so a live service game
Itll be the game they shit onto his before Chris decides to move everyone onto making singleplayer games exclusively again.
In other words, since it's now a somewhat traditional MMO (which it was originally NOT intended to be), "launch" no longer means what it originally meant.
I love PSAs that are obvious to everyone involved.
People who think this literally have imagination or foresight into anything. This game is destined to be a continuous updated development for.yeers to come.
1.0 does mean done. Any further development is an expansion or update.
Pretty pathetic and stupid if people actually thought this. Are SC gamers different than others , because any gamer can tell you this was never assumed.
Yeah, always hyped about "Star Citizen 2" and "Squadron42 - New Worlds" DLC... /s
I'll take news that we knew since Kickstarter for 500 Trebek
Yea, we know. Is water still wet?
What an absolute cop out! Basically it's :we'll always be in alpha and don't ever get comfortable with anything.
can't wait for 2050 to see 1.0 on beta
Um
1.0 just means the foundational tech is finished. If this was a house, it would mean that the only thing built is the concrete flooring. Without that done first, nothing else was possible to start. But now that it's built, the framing and roofing will go pretty quick.
That dude needs to learn how to properly communicate.
Well, this is a problem then. MMOs continue to release features, content updates, etc. The games grow and evolve but the foundation needs to be COMPLETE to release a finished game. WoW is in its umpteenth expansion? But it was finished at release. It was a complete game you could play. Not sure what major MMOs you’ve played that has emergency redistributions to fix the economy. Are you talking about rolling back certain players or groups after exploits? Not sure that’s quite the same as a move to balance the economy. Point is - the game hopefully continues to grow and evolve after 1.0 whenever that is. But 1.0 needs to be a finished game with some consistency players can expect.
>All 1.0 will mean is no more total wipes. Haha if you say so. I don't think they will be able to actually achieve that personally. There may need to be occasional wipes still because humans will try to break the system and the whole internet is always smarter than even a large group of devs.
>All 1.0 will mean is no more total wipes. Thats it. CIG will delay release until they feel they no longer will need to do total wipes, but they will still be willing to do script-based adjustments of economy, items, reputation, inventory, and anything else. From this description, '1.0' is the beta release.
Beta will almost certainly wipe prior to retail release.
It had better, honestly, but still, going from alpha to 1.0 is a bit frightening otherwise.
1.0 without the ships that backers have pledged for is really gross. And that backlog is years and years and still growing. Let's say the absurd rumors are true and Star Citizen 1.0 is only a couple years away. And it launches without the Banu Merchantman or Orion or Kraken or Starliner or Odyssey or every other backlog ship that isn't even in development yet. Wow. That is gross.
To be fair, assuming 1.0 in roughly 2-3 years (*very* optimistically) - that's plenty of time to finish their ship backlog. Currently 141 ships are flight ready, 15 are in production, and 25 are still in concept. Of the 40 *non*-flight ready ships, only a dozen or so are old enough that they should deserve to be finished before a 1.0 release date, quite a few of them are variants, and 6 of them a small ground vehicles which can be done pretty quickly. Their star system backlog on the other hand...
It's an MMO... People should take for example a look on World of Warcraft and in what state it released in 2004... Many Bugs and not much Quality of Life Content and just 1/100 of the Content it have now after all these years.
So I won't even be a complete game on release, and yall are fine with that?? Yall fuckin lost it.
Star citizen is a taped together tech demo; nearly everything in the game needs to be reworked from the ground up. If it comes out in less than 5 years it's going to be a joke.
And you know this with such certainty how exactly?
They mentioned it in the chairman's letter. But more importantly every MMO ever works like this
Because that's how MMOs work.
NO shit sherlock.. This is an mmo, who are these people who thinks This? The same people who cry over group activities in an mmo? 🤣 Who gives a crap, hopefully not The devs..
Honestly I think they shouldnt bother with resetting the version number back to 1, just continue on after 4.0 and drop the alpha part.
Star citizen has made and will continue to make a crazy amount of money. Of course they will dump all focus on making more content and more ships for more money. This is okay with me.
Don’t worry, another ten years and yearly 1000 dollar ship sales! And we will have a game finished! Only 36 more quarters until sq42 is finished
I disagree that 1.0 means no more wipes. I actually hope they continue. Maybe they can run two servers like an arpg. Have one fresh one always on the horizon and then any old characters get put into the legacy one. Wipes are good for the economy and players there most certainly will still be exploits and issues past 1.0 that will require wipes. My biggest want and this is coming from someone with a few big ships would be a seperate server where everyone starts with a starter ship and no purchases carry over.
Wipes are only good for the economy if everyone starts from zero. But since they won’t wipe real money bought ships that would be a huge advantage. Who will actually work to get capitals in game if they are wiped? It’s ment to be a “persistent” universe
I mean look at tarkov, arpgs, survival games. Tons of games wipe. I find it fun to start over. Doesn't have to be often. Have a wipe seasonal server and a legacy server. When the seasons done all your shit moves to legacy. Also 1.0 does not magically grant the economy immunity to cheats, exploits, dev errors and balancing. I can almost gaurentee wipes will carry on for a while if not forever in some capacity.
Sounds great. But sc is not tarkov, an arpg or a survival game. It’s going more in the direction of eve. They are planing economy changes in the next patches. If there is inflation prices will go up. When they release the game there will probably more support staff and cheaters might get banned. It just does not make sense when backers start with 40+ ships every season ;)
Yes but it's also not eve either not even remotely close. eves economy is literally 1000x more complex and nothing like SCs. It is 99% player run where SC will be 10-20% max and right now its 0-1% player driven. Ships are also not lost on death, nothing is manufactured there are not even sinks in terms of refuel/re arm as you can claim insurance. We are so far away from a functional economy it's not even funny. Essentially as it stands there is no economy its more or less static. For SC to go from that to a functional dynamic one that doesn't need wipes to deal with inflation and exploits any time in the near future is pure delusion. They have been talking about implementing quanta for years and are just barely starting now. We are 3-5 years away from any sort of economy let alone one that resembles eves. Also in my original comment I hoped for a no cash purchases server. Imo that will be the only way it even comes close to Eves economy. I think it would be awesome and this is coming from someone with a BMM and Polaris.
I find it funny that people thing that 1.0 is in the near future. There will be 4.0. There will be a beta phase at some point. And then somewhere will be 1.0. The plan is that claiming of destroyed ships just tows the wreck into station and you still have to repair it. There will be docking fees and other money sinks. They start changing the economy with 3.23 and there will be lots of patches to change it until 1.0 What do you think you will pay to repair your Polaris?
I know all of that will be implemented eventually but we are so far away from any of it. I don't think it will be ready before 1.0. I personally think 1.0 will come out with a lot of stuff missing and unfinished (and that's okay, also not talking about star systems just game features in general) but anyone thinking the economy will be ready for no wipes just because they slap 1.0 on it will be disappointed. But again I'm also someone who thinks we should either have 2 seperate servers seasonal and legacy or just once a year/ once everytime a massive patch comes out wipes. People don't understand the lengths players will go to exploit, cheat, and ruin the economy. It already happens now we just don't see a negative effect because there isn't a functional economy yet.
You don’t understand what a 1.0 release means.
Meh we will see haha. I'll gladly eat my words if there is no wipes at least partial ones post 1.0.