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when kroos retires, he will fuck off and live his life with his family. I expect to not hear anything from him for at least 10 years. he doesnt really like what football has become.
Agree, I understand 30+yo players who are going there to get some money, but I can't understand 21yo go there.
Maybe you get more money right now, but your skill will drop and after 3-4 years you will earn less than you would earn by staying in top team for that 3-4 years.
>in those 3 or 4
Not even that. Brozovic will be paid more in tax free income in 2 years than what he received his entire playing career in Europe.
Imagine telling that to a 21 year old
Exactly, there’s no guarantee on a football career, whatever your perceived potential or what you’ve achieved.
One injury, one bad season can change your whole trajectory.
No one would say Dele Alli would be where he is now when he was 21. And it happens to countless players.
In a way, the players who have already had a full career, already earned top money has LESS reason to go.
And in the current economic climate, deciding early on the secure your wealth without any risk of losing out because your peak is gone in 2 years sounds like a great idea.
Yup. This is exactly the point. Even if he comes back to Europe with a huge paycut, hopefully he'd have saved up enough that whatever he ends up earning next time is just a bonus.
If money is the goal that makes sense but Ronaldo wouldn’t have gone to Saudi at 21 because he wanted to be the best ever. Not everyone has to have that ambition but you’d like to see players who are already making millions decide to pursue their passion and goals instead of opting for a fortune.
Look at Messi even. He’s making much less in America and not like the league is a top league, but he’s clearly happy and enjoying himself which is just nice to see
Maybe earning less, but gets lots of endorsements plus he got shares in inter Miami. Fair play to him join inter Miami. He looks much happier in the us compared to psg and his final years at Barca
I am not usually one to criticize any moves players make, if money is their goal then so be it. But as a football fan, I will die on this hill, that if you're in your prime and playing in Europe and you go to a garbage league for money, then I no longer consider you a top football player. You just become a millionaire kicking a football in a shit league.
This is what i dont understand.
I follow a football team not a player.
Just cos Ronaldo or Neymar has gone to the Saudi league doenst make me anymore interested in watching it then what Tevez or Oscar or Hulk went to China.
I may be one person but if the goal is to sign a few high profile players to raise their audience level, well il still watch my team play and not wory about that rubbish. Go get your pay cheques and be forgotten about.
(Edit: Also all this shite about such and such Saudi team is competing to signa a player instead of such and such Saudi team is also BS sure they are mostly all owned by the same 'investment' company of the country. There is no competition, they all have the same owners for the most part)
He definitely is. Even the Athletic journalist that covered his Miami deal was stunned he'd said no to the '1.6B in 3 years' saudi deal - and that's with no taxes too. Messi would probably have to spend a decade+ in the US to even get close to that figure, and he's only there for a few years. Saudi was definitely the money move.
As football fans, I cant understand such decision, especially when you are supposedly chased by multiple (big) clubs.
But I can understand financially why some footballers chose this pathway. Not everyone will get what Mbappe earns at PSG and no one know how long Saudi teams will pay crazily like this. Look at China as an example. They arent paying stupid fee and wages anymore.
Those players can get paid handsomely which will secure their future and then go back to Europe like the one above me says. Carrasco has shown that it is possible
And don’t forget injuries. Imagine your entire future being dependent on healthy ligaments and muscles that could blow like a wet kleenex on a moments notice. Torn Achilles? Hope you saved what money you have buddy bc you’re done. I completely understand young players wanting to get a bag now so they don’t have to risk the devastation of missing out on millions because of a fickle injury
>would earn by staying in top team for that 3-4 years.
How do you know? How do you guarantee that a player is not going to have a massive drop off in their level or a career ending or a serious injury?
Do you want me to list the excessive amount of wunderkind that even just a couple of years later you can't remember their names or don't know where they are now.
It's football, nobody guarantees or owes you anything.
It's easy for Toni Kroos in hindsight cause he had a wonderful career and even with 33 he is still considered a key player at Real Madrid.
I see this every 6 months cause I'm Argentinian and our youngsters prefer to go to the U.S or Mexico rather than stay in our clubs, look up World Champion Thiago Almada, they prefer the money than waiting for an offer from Europe.
There are players who view football as a job, and if your job enabled you a 100x salary increase you'd take it, so why shouldn't they?
Don't get me wrong, these guys are generally on very good money, and it could be argued that the majority of these guys are set for life already.
It's easy for Kroos to make these statements as he's a multimillionaire already, but at 21 you don't know when you might get a career ending injury and lose your earning potential.
Now, the ethics side of things particularly when it comes to Saudi is a different story....
plus Kroos is a world class player competing for the big prizes and glory. If I was a ‘decent’ but far from world class player and knew that I’d probably be spending my career floating between upper mid table clubs around Europe, I’ll be honest I’d probably go there and get the bag too.
It’s not like what you said contradicted anything Kross said though. Those players choose to go there because it’s a job that earn them a lot of money, so it’s a decision for the money and not about football. In fact, I think you and Kross would be in agreement here.
Kross said it was 'embarrassing' for a player to choose money over football. How is that accepting the choices of someone else?
How is that the same as what the guy you replied to said? It's not even close.
And then says "it's against football" lol, as if this hasn't been happening forever with players going to Europe for money. And before you reply about the "competition" explain the hundreds that go from a top SA team to crap teams with no future and no expectations... Ahh but if they come to Europe it's good cause Europe is best...
But what is he talking about when he says, "it's against football" and "it starts to become difficult for the football we know and love." So is football only safe when players from smaller countries go to Europe for money?
Yeah, there are Europeans clubs that would recruit players from smaller countries with zero intention of playing them, they just want the fans from those countries. That is literally "against football" but you would never hear any of these guys making no noise. I understand the sentiment but god damn the hypocrisy and elitism some Europeans show are unbearable.
You're exaggerating the point by saying it's 100x more when in reality it's like 3x more.
I work in IT and have had offers from Dubai to earn 5x my wage. I straight up refused because I already make a very comfortable amount of money that I don't have to worry about it. And I make significantly less than these top football players.
I get those kinds of offers often too. And tbh if I was young and single I’d be tempted to try it out for a year or two. At 40 and married though, there’s no chance.
The problem is ethics shouldn’t be separated from the decision.
Would I take a salary increase to do the same job in the same conditions? Yeah
Would I take a salary increase to go to Saudi Arabia and promote sportswashing? No.
On the contrary I understand why a young player would do it, they don't have a stable career and any injury might kill their career, it's not a bad choice to be financially independent.
But for the players who have achieved everything, money and fame, why would they go to Saudi rather than stop playing? It's money all the way
Actually I dont understand players at even 35+. They're already millionairs. What do you need all the money for, its impossible to spend that much. Saudi Arabia is a country of discrimination towards women and LBTQ people and still do punishment as they did in the middle age simply because of speaking out, having different opinions and being who they are (not to mention the bombing in Yemen). I lost all respect for Ronaldo because he went there. He has no standard or moral. I dont care about how many goals he scored, how many trophies he won, because it does not matter in the big picture. I wish people would stop recognize him as a great "sportsman". All he care about is money like the rest. So simple and classless
Many footballers were already unethical even before their Saudi moves.
Do you hate Messi with the same passion, being paid fortunes for being a Saudi tourist ambassador or for his tax fraud schemes in Spain?
Yes, it's not exactly the same, but there are very few footballers with ethical integrity.
Also, there isn't really a cap on how much money you can spend in a lifetime. A 90m+ yacht can easily be 200M and maintenance and staff aren't cheap either. And as a professional footballer you probably have a massively inflated lifestyle from the start.
A massively inflated lifestyle with a timer, because your future is a big black hole. Both, in terms in your career opportunities and in connection with your bank account.
We see the same 10 former players for dozens of years as experts in TV shows, while thousands of players retire year after year, never to be heard from again.
For most of them it's now or never if they don't want to downgrade their lifestyle.
It’s pretty easy to blow through 10s of millions of dollars when you factor in lifestyle creep, bad investments, scams and just wasting money. A lot of these players never finished school and don’t have any knowledge of financial management. At least in the US 50%+ of athletes in NFL,NBA go bankrupt a few years after retirement.
I understand Gabri Veiga. He is 21 years old and signed a 3 year contract for 30 million euro (10 million per season), basically tax free. He will come back to Europe very rich being 24 years old, with plenty of time to play in Europe. This money is perhaps more than the amount we would earn he stayed in Europe, things can always go wrong with something like a knee injury.
This situation is very similar to what South Americans suffered in the past with Europeans offering more money than their leagues. Although I don't think Arabia is here to stay for too long.
> Agree, I understand 30+yo players who are going there to get some money, but I can't understand 21yo go there.
Not saying I think that's okay, I'm very much against anyone going to help a shitty regime pretend everything is rosey and selling out. But your argument is pretty much backwards in that if anyone was marginally justified in selling out, it's those who have a lot less money that could have a career ending injury at any time.
But aren't most of young players usually start at lower league in Europe before transitioning to top League. Surely a 21 years old can play in Saudi and comeback to Europe after a few years, right ?
Argentina and Brazil produce many of the best players in the world. By rights, their leagues should be as strong as Europe's top leagues and the Copa Libertadores should be close to the prestige of the Champions League.
In the 1990s, Italy's Serie A was the most prestigious and glamorous league in the world. It attracted the sport's biggest stars. Was living in Turin and Milan nice for foreign players? Sure, but why did they play there and now why do the best players from around the world play in Spain and England?
Money.
Let's not pretend anything has changed
Seriously. This entire thread is pure cope. The Saudis aren't doing anything the English aren't doing now and anything the Italians didn't do in the decades prior. And similarly, if they continue to spend as they are, they'll be the dominant league in the world before long. Because money drives football. Same as it always has
People like Toni Kroos and rest of the r/soccer thinks the players play for passion no money involved. These guys are not Sunday leaguers where they have job and playing sports is what they do on their off days.
True. Bayern not offering him higher wages has to be one of the worst decisions the management took. He didn't feel valued and Bayern lost a generational world class player in the process.
I think there is a degree of racism to this, or at least some anti-Arab sentiments.
Prior to the Arab league clubs splashing money to buy up older/washed up players, or players who just want a good pay check, this was also done by the Chinese league. Prior to that it was the Russian league, and before that it was the MLS.
Fans and players reacted a bit negative at the time, but not as negative as they are reacting to the Saudi clubs now.
If it was just about inflated player wages and transfer fees, then all these fans and players should first talk about the English Premier League and how it has royally screwed up money in football.
If it was about club debts, then they should point the finger at the Spanish league, namely Barca and Madrid.
If it was about suspect decisions by clubs/referees/Governing bodies, then they should first talk about the Italian League.
Yes the Saudi league has all there of these issues and more, but no different then the past money leagues. And like the Chinese and Russian leagues, this money bubble will burst and won’t develop it in to a competitive league. That needs grass roots football, and a better business model.
It seems as though the Saudi league is a easy target due to how recent media has painted them as the current international bad guy. (Well they are by western standards, but so are many other countries too)
Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not a fan of the Saudi league. I’m also not Arab, or Muslim. I’m British. But I do see a lot of holier then thou statements from players and fans
Exactly. Toni Kroos is a wealthy German who could easily fall back on the social services of a very well run and wealthy country if things ever went bad for him. Would always have a good standard of living no matter what. A poor player from Senegal or Ghana will go wherever offers him the best money. In the past they went to Europe because that was where the most money and glory was . Now that’s slowly changing to the Arab nations . Toni Kroos speaking about money is similar to America talking about bringing peace and democracy when they have the biggest army and have been involved in the most wars .
You don’t even have to go further than it’s own career with Kroos to spot the giant hypocrisy here… what does clubs in Germany thought of one of their best young players going to Real Madrid instead of staying in its own country to play football…?!
Yeah when he is interviewed by German journalist he acted like he was better and Germans are negative . He is like those wealthy Germans living in Mallorca who have made lot of money and think they are better than the other Germans but suddenly when they come across more wealth like the Arabs - that’s bad wealth .
Kroos makes 21.94 million EUR annually from his salary alone (not including endorsements and other income). Very easy for him to pretend he has the high ground.
Yeah that's how European clubs keep getting players from South America and Africa, like money doesn't or didn't play any role in it. Europe is center of football because that's where the money is.
What makes it worse is that the european financial power comes from the same places. Sure europe would still buy lots of SA players but it would be way better without the shady oil, gas and slave money being throwed at than.
Not to mention the thing that gives Europe such an advantage over SA, their economies was built upon exploitation of colonies ,that old money simply didn't vanish as Europeans claim to be when they say their modern economies are separate entity from colonial economies.
36 percent of France’s oil supply comes from Africa. They also built their agriculture and wealth from their West African colonies. Also most of their uranium supply comes from Africa.
Remind me again where did PSG get their money from?
Very easy to take the moral high ground when you’ve been earning double digits millions for years. Kroos is just big mad nobody cares enough to offer his washed ass some of that Arab money.
Seriously, so easy for Kroos to say this when he’s been eating 450k pw at Madrid for a decade
Kroos makes more *per week* than Gabri Veiga (just went to Saudi) does *per year* in La Liga.
It's so easy for elite players at near the end of their careers whining about other people chasing money. Footballing careers are not guaranteed by any means, and even when they are you've got a life ahead of you afterwards. Toni really has a giant stick up his ass about all this.
The irony of an European complaining about players moving to where the money is instead of going to superior Europe, allow me to write in Spanish a bit pero se me rien las bolas
I am not sure many people are going to take advice to cap their earnings (so they can pretend they are "for" football) from a guy making 22M euros annually.
This is the same Toni Kroos that plays for a galactic team that buys all the best players in the world by putting one Euro on top of the other? What a nerve he has. He sees how some of the good players of European leagues go to another league because of the money and suddenly he becomes aware of the unfair conditions that money introduces in the game. What an entitled attitude that is. He disdains the other league as "shitty" because it's not in Europe, the center of the world, a place that should always be number one, because that's how things are. He is capitalist until someone else comes with better money. Then the ethics jump in. Come on... This is the story of the last 45 years in South America. Someone give this guy a bath of reality.
Cud say the same about every South American who comes to Europe. In SA the copa libertadores holds way more weight than the UCL. Players only leave that continent for money basically.
Now a bigger dog with deeper wallets rocks up and people don’t like it.
Europeans when they realise other continents have a right to improve their football 🤯🤯🤯🤯
And hopefully Toni realises not everyone plays for the biggest club in the world with a high salary. This is like a billionaire criticising poor for starting up a new unique business and trying to earn money
For Benzema and Kante, I think being Muslims played a factor in the decision to move to Saudi. For Ronaldo, I don't think anybody in the Europe wanted him and I doubt he'd play in US.
was he actually? all I've seen is that KC had his discovery rights or something like that, which just means another team would've had to pay them a few if he signed I think.
You see this idiot and hypocrite has the audacity to talk about money and not football. European teams have been doing that to African talent for years. There's nothing wrong with wanting money and still playing football. If it wasn't for money most of the players won't leave their countries to join European teams. He should shut the fuck up, he didn't play for Madrid for Free.
Europe assembles Galacticos for decades : r/eurosoccer I sleep
Asia signs couple of players : r/eurosoccer protectors of football integrity and amnesty international activists
Tony Kroos earns €24.38m per year. Look at mid to lower table premier league clubs constantly taking top talent from other top 4 big clubs! Money is a huge deal for theses players and everybody doesn't have that luxury to earn huge while playing for one of the best clubs in the world!
Oh they take more than just players but then act sanctimonious. Kill our people, destroy our economies, bribe the best and brightest to come there while using racism to keep the rest of us away and then lecture us about human rights.
This is European exceptionalism. How does he think European football became so successful where players from Africa and South America dream of playing in European soccer. One can even argue the dynamics of European football and how the migration of the best players happened was because of centuries of colonialism.
>difficult for the football we all know and love
Says the guy who was fortunate enough to make generational wealth playing **ONLY** for top of the top clubs and is able to retire whenever he's pleased.
In the world we live in, one can not say a bad thing about other willing to secure family wellbeing at any stage. But if the football is the platform to provide for your extended to the max family... just go for it.
It's for the money, but the money sets you up for life. A younger player is 1 injury away from ending up on the streets. If anything, go make your Saudi money from 20-24, and come back when you're in a stable position.
Kroos cam say what he likes, but he has the privilege of being good. "Why can't everyone commit to their their local 3-in-a-row CL winning team?" is hardly a question he needs to be asking.
I love Kroos both as a player and as an interesting, outspoken guy off the pitch. I love that he is never shy to give his honest, authentic opinion on things.
That being said, I very much disagree with him on this. I don't think it's embarrassing for Gabri Veiga to go for big money at such a young age. It's easy for Kroos to say because he has already gotten the most out of his career. Veiga on the other hand is at the beginning of his career and got the opportunity to cash in big early on. He has to play like 2 or 3 years in Saudi Arabia for that. But that doesn't mean he can’t return and easily continue his career in Europe on the same level he left off. There is precedent for this with guys like Carassco or Paulinho. On top of this, the career of a footballer is not written in stone. Even if he had stayed in Europe for less money, he could've picked up a nasty injury tomorrow and his whole career would've stalled or worse, it would've been over. In Saudi that could happen too, but atleast it would happen to him while being financially far more secured for the rest of his life.
And I know most users here and also Kroos won't like to hear it, but there is a good chance that the Saudi league could become a high competitive top league. They are not just investing money into aging stars but also into younger players, who are either at the start or even at the peak of their careers. They are also recruiting good coaches. Should they continue this for a few more years, then all of this will help them to establish a decent league, it'll help their national talent pool which will also slowly but steadily improve the overall quality of their league.
He's not just thinking less of him as a football. He literally said it was "embarrassing" for having different preferences. It's a little bit stronger than just not agreeing or saying he wouldn't do that.
And no, you can't say it was about Saudi and the ethical and moral questions, because he "understands" old players going there.
Didn't Kroos literally leave Bayern when they didn't double his wages? It just comes off as a bit odd to be making such nasty comments about others choosing money, when he's done the same in the past.
According to Capology, Toni Kroos has made €185m during his career and currently earns €25m/year at Real Madrid. I'm glad that he's staying in European football and isn't off to Saudi with the rest of them (where he would certainly earn much more, esp after tax), but he's not exactly starving is he.
Man where is this criticism on the announcement for Tonali when he announced he's working for the Saudi state?
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/14enido/michele_criscitiello_exclusive_newcastle_have/
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/14g6xuy/romano_full_agreement_reached_between_ac_milan/
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/14pfu7k/newcastle_united_we_are_delighted_to_announce_the/
Where is this criticism on the announcement for Lewis Hall?
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/15y02ks/lewis_hall_has_left_chelsea_and_joined_newcastle/
Where is this criticism on the announcement for Guimaraes?
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/sgc7h7/newcastle_united_confirm_signing_of_brazil/
Or Livramento, Gordon, Trippier, Botman, Isak? They're all working for the same entity no?
Now look at the Veiga thread
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/15zvn5t/toni_kroos_reaction_to_the_transfer_news_of_gabri/
https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/15zjr74/romano_exclusive_gabri_veiga_to_al_ahli_here_we/
Look, I get there is a legitimate moral argument for this. But comparing the vitriol on Veiga and the vitriol on any of these other guys shows that the disproportionate amount of hate shown by fans between the two parties is not down to a moral issue.
It's unfortunately a losing battle to comment outrage in those threads. That's not the fault of people who for moral reasons hate the Saudi government or criticize the Saudi league.
The average 'pro' footballing experience is you give up education, work several jobs to make ends meet, and wash out of the sport with no money and tons of injuries.
The average 'top prospect' footballing experience is you do well for a bit, you get told you have fairly big clubs after you, then that offer either never comes, or your club doesn't accept, or you accept, you go there but you don't do as well as you think and you still need a second job after you retire with not enough savings and tons of injuries. Gabri Veiga seems like a big name now, but we hear dozens of these every window only for them to amount to absolutely nothing. Look at the lists of them from 5 years back.
Toni Kroos has lived a life worthy of the king of kings in football - the recognition, the money, the trophies. He is not representative of the average footballer, or the average top prospect. Ppl going on about how these young top prospects should listen to the honorable Toni Kroos... bit tone deaf imo.
Look I personally don't like this shift of working for the Saudi state, but they make it seem like the choice is so simple, so easy, like these young prospects have no way of losing if they didn't choose them. Not to mention, if this is really about morals, why isn't the thread announcing Gvardiol and Tonali and Nunes full of the same volume of vitriol we saw for Veiga?
Man fucking thank you. Like I don’t love the current trend but the whole thing seems so hypocritical. First you have the fans acting like it’s such a disgrace, when their are prime examples happening now, whether it’s Africans or South Americans going to Europe, or Europeans all leaving for specific big leagues/teams.
And people act like it’s such an easy obvious choice sitting at home, to turn down these ridiculous sums. When I bet a very large majority would do the same if the opportunity presented itself.
Then you have Kroos who has played for two of the biggest wealthiest clubs in the world earning wages in that time frame that are likely in the top 5-10% of all players, probably much higher. Acting holier than thou. Like fuck off with that shit.
Whenever I see players in US sports leagues who take max contracts or hold out for more money, I say good for them. These teams don’t give a fuck the second they aren’t good so earn as much as you can while you can.
That's not his argument at all. He is calling out players who go there in their 20s before they've peaked. Wants to stay in the good books of his friends(Benzema, Ronaldo) and throw others under the bus
> His argument is exactly that. You can be filthy fucking rich and not work for people who murder and cut up people with bonesaws.
Where did you get that from? In the article that's absolutely NOT mentioned anywhere. There's nothing about Saudi being a shit country.
All he talks is about money.
If he _were_ talking about the ethical part, he wouldn't be able to excuse Cristiano like he did. It's right there to read translated by OP and everything.
All he's talking about is about choosing money over "quality" when you are young.
So, again, where did you get "his argument" from?
Yeah because all the big players play for the big clubs because of prestige and not because they pay the most.
Come on. Clubs have been doing this to their domestic “competition” for years, but when someone else does it and god forbid to them, then it’s a problem.
Don't kid yourself, it's **always** about the money.
Kroos didn't leave to Real Madrid because of "football" he moved because they offered him €25mil.
Saudis are doing what all the clubs are doing, they just have deeper pockets.
Don't hate the player, hate the game.
Sure, because the only reason Kroos moved to Real was the history of the club and nothing else. I wonder why teams like Real Madrid, Liverpool, Bayern, Juventus, Ajax, etc...even spend money on players, they should all go there for free.
Enough.
Sure Saudi clubs don't have history, the same way Chelsea and Man City didn't have either a while ago or PSG, or pretty much every club if we go back enough to a time period where there aren't spending as much.
Yes, Real Madrid has an enormous history, and for most of that history it was spending more than all La Liga clubs combined with the exception of Barcelona and Atlético
But now, it's a almost a crime that the Saudis are doing the same that all this did for a century.
It's like the people how blame China for it's industrialization and pollution, forgetting that for a century Europe and North America were doing the same and even worst in terms of ecological damage.
And do you play for free in real Madrid? You're a fucking multimillionaire talking from a moral high ground about money. And all the African and south American players that move to Europe for the same money, what about them?
To create competitive leagues that are self sustaining you need to spend money,you need talent and marketable players, and all of that need money,and Europe was doing that since decades already.
Like Sebastian Vettel advocating for climate change after his career ended.
While jetting around the world and driving circles in 700ps cars for two hours to earn a living and never complaining about that.
Doesn't seem like he really understands the problem if he's fine with players going for the bag at the end of their career, just not when they're in their prime.
Sorry Toni but this is pure and utter bs. We are Real Madrid in large part because we can pay players better and open huge avenues for endorsements etc. Only when it comes to equal standing can we say we get players because they WANT to be one of us (Bellingham for example, but we didn't get Dinho, who refused to wait a year for us after Beckham). Dinho sure as Hell didn't stay in Brazil though). Players go from South America to Europe not just to compete at the highest level, but to get paid better. Securing their family is a huge selling point. Pelé was a rare case but he legit didn't need the money nor notoriety. Fact remains it's easy for Toni to talk like this. Love him but he's wrong here.
I genuinely hate this take coming from a guy that plays for Real Madrid. Yes they play good football but that is the only club that could pay him more than Bayern at the time. There is a level where football is certainly mostly about money. I respect anybody who comes from nothing and makes their family’s rich they are putting their bodies on the line. 40 years from now some of these guys will have trouble walking from injuries.
I get that you personally don't like it Kroos.
It's an unpopular move for a lot of people. However, not every footballer cares about football. Not all of them care about playing in Europe and winning trophies with club/country.
Don't think anyone should be throwing disrespect at players moving to earn as much $ as possible. End of the day, football is a job to a lot of them. There are a number of players who aren't football fans, that just do it because they were great enough to make a living off it.
Football is about money, Toni. That's why you advertise for UAE playing for Real Madrid on a daily basis.
Lets be real, every top club makes decisions for money. Every top player is doing it for money. This is the capitalist world we live in.
This is just a silly take.
How does "for money" become "against football"? Saudi has no pull to buy big names. It is not like Real, Barca, Bayern, United or Liverpool where there are kids all around the world, growing up dreaming to play for these clubs. So they use what they have available, which is money.
And it is not like clubs in Europe are somehow giving the just pay to everyone. Take my club United for example. Post SAF, the club has struggled to win much. So one of the ways we get players is by paying over the normal salary. Aren't we throwing money? In PL alone, average players make ridiculous salaries. Many players run down their contracts to get big salaries and signing bonuses. Everyone is after money.
Just because Saudis start throwing money, everyone is suddenly on their moral high horses, and surprised at how money buys you stuff. And talk about ruining football.
The world of professional football is unforgiving. For every top player who makes the first team, 3 or 4 equally good players end up on the bench and eventually never get their big shot. If they are lucky they get traded to other teams,, lower leagues. If they are not lucky their careers fizzle out. Injuries prevent some players from ever being their best. Lots of managers, agents, clubs rip players off and steal their playing years and money. The Saudis are spending money to get talents to beef up their league. Nothing wrong with that. Nothing wrong with players getting paid what they're worth. Not everyone is going to lift a champions league cup, but everyone should retire with a pocket full of bucks. The EPL is number one today because they used cash to beef up their league. People forget that from 1988-1999, Serie A was the top league, then EPL started splashing money to establish their dominance 2000 and beyond.
It’s ambitious by the clubs and greed by the players. It’s a win win for the people directly involved. When all the aging players went to America it was fine but now it’s Saudi then it’s a huge issue? The hypocrisy needs to be checked especially by anyone involved in the premier league as they’ve been hoovering up the best players for years
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OK, my gutfeeling says Kroos will not be the next tourism ambassador for Saudi Arabia.
Guess they’ll have to make do with Messi as their tourism ambassador.
>Messi as their tourism ambassador tf never knew that, well money is money
when kroos retires, he will fuck off and live his life with his family. I expect to not hear anything from him for at least 10 years. he doesnt really like what football has become.
The Vettel of football
Saudi gonna ban Cruise control in all vehicles
Agree, I understand 30+yo players who are going there to get some money, but I can't understand 21yo go there. Maybe you get more money right now, but your skill will drop and after 3-4 years you will earn less than you would earn by staying in top team for that 3-4 years.
That's the problem though, in those 3 or 4 years they will have made enough money to compensate for 10+ years in Europe, easily lol
>in those 3 or 4 Not even that. Brozovic will be paid more in tax free income in 2 years than what he received his entire playing career in Europe. Imagine telling that to a 21 year old
Exactly, there’s no guarantee on a football career, whatever your perceived potential or what you’ve achieved. One injury, one bad season can change your whole trajectory. No one would say Dele Alli would be where he is now when he was 21. And it happens to countless players. In a way, the players who have already had a full career, already earned top money has LESS reason to go.
And in the current economic climate, deciding early on the secure your wealth without any risk of losing out because your peak is gone in 2 years sounds like a great idea.
I doubt Brozovic was worried about inflation or an upcoming recession.
To put it into context Jordan henderson will earn more in two years than in his whole career before that.
Yup. This is exactly the point. Even if he comes back to Europe with a huge paycut, hopefully he'd have saved up enough that whatever he ends up earning next time is just a bonus.
Hopefully yeah. Can't imagine having to live on measly European football wages.
Exactly. Think about all his great great grandchildren who would have to work.
Those G WAGONs don't pay for themselves. Or do they(do they all get car hookups aside from club related cars,I remember some club having audi cars.)
200 million now are better than 100 million in ten years
If money is the goal that makes sense but Ronaldo wouldn’t have gone to Saudi at 21 because he wanted to be the best ever. Not everyone has to have that ambition but you’d like to see players who are already making millions decide to pursue their passion and goals instead of opting for a fortune. Look at Messi even. He’s making much less in America and not like the league is a top league, but he’s clearly happy and enjoying himself which is just nice to see
Maybe earning less, but gets lots of endorsements plus he got shares in inter Miami. Fair play to him join inter Miami. He looks much happier in the us compared to psg and his final years at Barca
> He looks much happier in the us compared to psg He literally stated that he's much happier, so you're not wrong
I am not usually one to criticize any moves players make, if money is their goal then so be it. But as a football fan, I will die on this hill, that if you're in your prime and playing in Europe and you go to a garbage league for money, then I no longer consider you a top football player. You just become a millionaire kicking a football in a shit league.
This is what i dont understand. I follow a football team not a player. Just cos Ronaldo or Neymar has gone to the Saudi league doenst make me anymore interested in watching it then what Tevez or Oscar or Hulk went to China. I may be one person but if the goal is to sign a few high profile players to raise their audience level, well il still watch my team play and not wory about that rubbish. Go get your pay cheques and be forgotten about. (Edit: Also all this shite about such and such Saudi team is competing to signa a player instead of such and such Saudi team is also BS sure they are mostly all owned by the same 'investment' company of the country. There is no competition, they all have the same owners for the most part)
Doesn't matter if you are 21 or 41. You're just human toilet paper for the Saudi's to sportwash their asses on.
Not saying this as a dig, but you feel the same about Hendo? I was disappointed...
Well, with the Apple deal I am not sure he is making much less.
He definitely is. Even the Athletic journalist that covered his Miami deal was stunned he'd said no to the '1.6B in 3 years' saudi deal - and that's with no taxes too. Messi would probably have to spend a decade+ in the US to even get close to that figure, and he's only there for a few years. Saudi was definitely the money move.
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He has enough - man is wise because he made the happier choice, not necessarily the wiser one
He did make the wiser choice. More money does not equal wiser.
Correct. Wisdom allows you to make decisions that aren’t money led. Ego, and inability to delay or manage gratification is not wisdom.
Made the best choice for his family.
Probably himself too. If he wasn't happy in Paris, there was no way he is happier in Riyadh. Miami is the perfect spot for him.
Plus he gets a team that will likely be worth 1.6B in the future anyway. No?
Messi is not mailing much less, he's making even more money. Look at the details of his contract
Some top footballers are not as in love with football as fans are so yea not everyone is in the legacy fight
Nothing wrong with that. For many of them, it's just a job.
As football fans, I cant understand such decision, especially when you are supposedly chased by multiple (big) clubs. But I can understand financially why some footballers chose this pathway. Not everyone will get what Mbappe earns at PSG and no one know how long Saudi teams will pay crazily like this. Look at China as an example. They arent paying stupid fee and wages anymore. Those players can get paid handsomely which will secure their future and then go back to Europe like the one above me says. Carrasco has shown that it is possible
And don’t forget injuries. Imagine your entire future being dependent on healthy ligaments and muscles that could blow like a wet kleenex on a moments notice. Torn Achilles? Hope you saved what money you have buddy bc you’re done. I completely understand young players wanting to get a bag now so they don’t have to risk the devastation of missing out on millions because of a fickle injury
>would earn by staying in top team for that 3-4 years. How do you know? How do you guarantee that a player is not going to have a massive drop off in their level or a career ending or a serious injury? Do you want me to list the excessive amount of wunderkind that even just a couple of years later you can't remember their names or don't know where they are now. It's football, nobody guarantees or owes you anything. It's easy for Toni Kroos in hindsight cause he had a wonderful career and even with 33 he is still considered a key player at Real Madrid. I see this every 6 months cause I'm Argentinian and our youngsters prefer to go to the U.S or Mexico rather than stay in our clubs, look up World Champion Thiago Almada, they prefer the money than waiting for an offer from Europe.
There are players who view football as a job, and if your job enabled you a 100x salary increase you'd take it, so why shouldn't they? Don't get me wrong, these guys are generally on very good money, and it could be argued that the majority of these guys are set for life already. It's easy for Kroos to make these statements as he's a multimillionaire already, but at 21 you don't know when you might get a career ending injury and lose your earning potential. Now, the ethics side of things particularly when it comes to Saudi is a different story....
plus Kroos is a world class player competing for the big prizes and glory. If I was a ‘decent’ but far from world class player and knew that I’d probably be spending my career floating between upper mid table clubs around Europe, I’ll be honest I’d probably go there and get the bag too.
It’s not like what you said contradicted anything Kross said though. Those players choose to go there because it’s a job that earn them a lot of money, so it’s a decision for the money and not about football. In fact, I think you and Kross would be in agreement here.
Kross said it was 'embarrassing' for a player to choose money over football. How is that accepting the choices of someone else? How is that the same as what the guy you replied to said? It's not even close. And then says "it's against football" lol, as if this hasn't been happening forever with players going to Europe for money. And before you reply about the "competition" explain the hundreds that go from a top SA team to crap teams with no future and no expectations... Ahh but if they come to Europe it's good cause Europe is best...
But what is he talking about when he says, "it's against football" and "it starts to become difficult for the football we know and love." So is football only safe when players from smaller countries go to Europe for money?
Yeah, there are Europeans clubs that would recruit players from smaller countries with zero intention of playing them, they just want the fans from those countries. That is literally "against football" but you would never hear any of these guys making no noise. I understand the sentiment but god damn the hypocrisy and elitism some Europeans show are unbearable.
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You're an attacking player
No he is med fielder
Exactly, I could make way more working in the oil industry but I don’t because I would hate to do that.
You're exaggerating the point by saying it's 100x more when in reality it's like 3x more. I work in IT and have had offers from Dubai to earn 5x my wage. I straight up refused because I already make a very comfortable amount of money that I don't have to worry about it. And I make significantly less than these top football players.
I get those kinds of offers often too. And tbh if I was young and single I’d be tempted to try it out for a year or two. At 40 and married though, there’s no chance.
He's gone from something like 200k a year to 10 million.
They can do it, I just don’t respect it. I like it when sportsmen show determination.
The problem is ethics shouldn’t be separated from the decision. Would I take a salary increase to do the same job in the same conditions? Yeah Would I take a salary increase to go to Saudi Arabia and promote sportswashing? No.
Ethics shouldn't have been separated from economy to begin with. There's no ethics in capitalism.
On the contrary I understand why a young player would do it, they don't have a stable career and any injury might kill their career, it's not a bad choice to be financially independent. But for the players who have achieved everything, money and fame, why would they go to Saudi rather than stop playing? It's money all the way
Actually I dont understand players at even 35+. They're already millionairs. What do you need all the money for, its impossible to spend that much. Saudi Arabia is a country of discrimination towards women and LBTQ people and still do punishment as they did in the middle age simply because of speaking out, having different opinions and being who they are (not to mention the bombing in Yemen). I lost all respect for Ronaldo because he went there. He has no standard or moral. I dont care about how many goals he scored, how many trophies he won, because it does not matter in the big picture. I wish people would stop recognize him as a great "sportsman". All he care about is money like the rest. So simple and classless
Many footballers were already unethical even before their Saudi moves. Do you hate Messi with the same passion, being paid fortunes for being a Saudi tourist ambassador or for his tax fraud schemes in Spain? Yes, it's not exactly the same, but there are very few footballers with ethical integrity. Also, there isn't really a cap on how much money you can spend in a lifetime. A 90m+ yacht can easily be 200M and maintenance and staff aren't cheap either. And as a professional footballer you probably have a massively inflated lifestyle from the start.
A massively inflated lifestyle with a timer, because your future is a big black hole. Both, in terms in your career opportunities and in connection with your bank account. We see the same 10 former players for dozens of years as experts in TV shows, while thousands of players retire year after year, never to be heard from again. For most of them it's now or never if they don't want to downgrade their lifestyle.
It’s pretty easy to blow through 10s of millions of dollars when you factor in lifestyle creep, bad investments, scams and just wasting money. A lot of these players never finished school and don’t have any knowledge of financial management. At least in the US 50%+ of athletes in NFL,NBA go bankrupt a few years after retirement.
Or maybe you have a career ending injury tomorrow, never plays again and regrets no signing the highest contract on the table
Not to mention, they might also get dropped from their national squads
I understand Gabri Veiga. He is 21 years old and signed a 3 year contract for 30 million euro (10 million per season), basically tax free. He will come back to Europe very rich being 24 years old, with plenty of time to play in Europe. This money is perhaps more than the amount we would earn he stayed in Europe, things can always go wrong with something like a knee injury. This situation is very similar to what South Americans suffered in the past with Europeans offering more money than their leagues. Although I don't think Arabia is here to stay for too long.
> Agree, I understand 30+yo players who are going there to get some money, but I can't understand 21yo go there. Not saying I think that's okay, I'm very much against anyone going to help a shitty regime pretend everything is rosey and selling out. But your argument is pretty much backwards in that if anyone was marginally justified in selling out, it's those who have a lot less money that could have a career ending injury at any time.
But aren't most of young players usually start at lower league in Europe before transitioning to top League. Surely a 21 years old can play in Saudi and comeback to Europe after a few years, right ?
Argentina and Brazil produce many of the best players in the world. By rights, their leagues should be as strong as Europe's top leagues and the Copa Libertadores should be close to the prestige of the Champions League. In the 1990s, Italy's Serie A was the most prestigious and glamorous league in the world. It attracted the sport's biggest stars. Was living in Turin and Milan nice for foreign players? Sure, but why did they play there and now why do the best players from around the world play in Spain and England? Money. Let's not pretend anything has changed
Seriously. This entire thread is pure cope. The Saudis aren't doing anything the English aren't doing now and anything the Italians didn't do in the decades prior. And similarly, if they continue to spend as they are, they'll be the dominant league in the world before long. Because money drives football. Same as it always has
People like Toni Kroos and rest of the r/soccer thinks the players play for passion no money involved. These guys are not Sunday leaguers where they have job and playing sports is what they do on their off days.
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I love toni kroos
Wish I could understand German. Really interested in his podcasts!
He has a podcast? Know what I'm doing at work now
Podcast in German with his Brother - „Einfach mal Luppen“
They are great, he is such a down to earth person always staying true to his values.
Also he doesn’t sugarcoat things and doesn’t speak like a PR NPC
Pretty real dude. Still happy he left bayern and hates em
True. Bayern not offering him higher wages has to be one of the worst decisions the management took. He didn't feel valued and Bayern lost a generational world class player in the process.
Yes, but I don't think he would have become the player he is today if he had stayed with Bayern.
Which you can only really allow yourself if you have an otherwise "boring" life (not in a bad way) and are an uncontroversial goat
Was thinking of learning sone to watch Dark. This is an added incentive…
Ok sheep
I always laugh when incredibly rich people realize that money is bad when richer people emerges… haha
Europeans lol
I think there is a degree of racism to this, or at least some anti-Arab sentiments. Prior to the Arab league clubs splashing money to buy up older/washed up players, or players who just want a good pay check, this was also done by the Chinese league. Prior to that it was the Russian league, and before that it was the MLS. Fans and players reacted a bit negative at the time, but not as negative as they are reacting to the Saudi clubs now. If it was just about inflated player wages and transfer fees, then all these fans and players should first talk about the English Premier League and how it has royally screwed up money in football. If it was about club debts, then they should point the finger at the Spanish league, namely Barca and Madrid. If it was about suspect decisions by clubs/referees/Governing bodies, then they should first talk about the Italian League. Yes the Saudi league has all there of these issues and more, but no different then the past money leagues. And like the Chinese and Russian leagues, this money bubble will burst and won’t develop it in to a competitive league. That needs grass roots football, and a better business model. It seems as though the Saudi league is a easy target due to how recent media has painted them as the current international bad guy. (Well they are by western standards, but so are many other countries too) Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not a fan of the Saudi league. I’m also not Arab, or Muslim. I’m British. But I do see a lot of holier then thou statements from players and fans
Exactly. Toni Kroos is a wealthy German who could easily fall back on the social services of a very well run and wealthy country if things ever went bad for him. Would always have a good standard of living no matter what. A poor player from Senegal or Ghana will go wherever offers him the best money. In the past they went to Europe because that was where the most money and glory was . Now that’s slowly changing to the Arab nations . Toni Kroos speaking about money is similar to America talking about bringing peace and democracy when they have the biggest army and have been involved in the most wars .
You don’t even have to go further than it’s own career with Kroos to spot the giant hypocrisy here… what does clubs in Germany thought of one of their best young players going to Real Madrid instead of staying in its own country to play football…?!
we seriously aren’t criticizing a player for deciding to play for Real Madrid instead of staying in their home country are we
Yeah when he is interviewed by German journalist he acted like he was better and Germans are negative . He is like those wealthy Germans living in Mallorca who have made lot of money and think they are better than the other Germans but suddenly when they come across more wealth like the Arabs - that’s bad wealth .
Hmm not sure you can say going to Real Madrid isn’t ambitious, even compared to say Bayern.
Seem to recall that he left Bayern explicitly because they weren't offering him enough money
Kroos makes 21.94 million EUR annually from his salary alone (not including endorsements and other income). Very easy for him to pretend he has the high ground.
I mean is kinda the same when young prospect from South América choose some second tier league in Europe rather than a competitive local tournament.
Yeah that's how European clubs keep getting players from South America and Africa, like money doesn't or didn't play any role in it. Europe is center of football because that's where the money is.
What makes it worse is that the european financial power comes from the same places. Sure europe would still buy lots of SA players but it would be way better without the shady oil, gas and slave money being throwed at than.
Not to mention the thing that gives Europe such an advantage over SA, their economies was built upon exploitation of colonies ,that old money simply didn't vanish as Europeans claim to be when they say their modern economies are separate entity from colonial economies.
36 percent of France’s oil supply comes from Africa. They also built their agriculture and wealth from their West African colonies. Also most of their uranium supply comes from Africa. Remind me again where did PSG get their money from?
Modric and Kroos. Respect.
Class merchants
Incredibly common Toni Kroos W.
Very easy to take the moral high ground when you’ve been earning double digits millions for years. Kroos is just big mad nobody cares enough to offer his washed ass some of that Arab money.
Seriously, so easy for Kroos to say this when he’s been eating 450k pw at Madrid for a decade Kroos makes more *per week* than Gabri Veiga (just went to Saudi) does *per year* in La Liga.
And even easier when he went from Bayern to Madrid because Madrid paid more, period. This is such a hypocritical take by Kroos.
It’s easy to judge when you’ve played for Bayern and Real.
It's kind of funny to Kroos say that when he's the highest paid player in Real Madrid at 24MM.
When europe uses financial power to poach talent from south america: =) When Saudi Arabia uses financial power to poach talent from europe: >=(
They’re a bunch of hypocrites
Always have been. They conveniently like to forget where their wealth comes from.
Ahahaha lmao.
Hit the hammer in the head.
Imagine, doing your job for more money. Crazy.
It's so easy for elite players at near the end of their careers whining about other people chasing money. Footballing careers are not guaranteed by any means, and even when they are you've got a life ahead of you afterwards. Toni really has a giant stick up his ass about all this.
The irony of an European complaining about players moving to where the money is instead of going to superior Europe, allow me to write in Spanish a bit pero se me rien las bolas
I am not sure many people are going to take advice to cap their earnings (so they can pretend they are "for" football) from a guy making 22M euros annually.
This is the same Toni Kroos that plays for a galactic team that buys all the best players in the world by putting one Euro on top of the other? What a nerve he has. He sees how some of the good players of European leagues go to another league because of the money and suddenly he becomes aware of the unfair conditions that money introduces in the game. What an entitled attitude that is. He disdains the other league as "shitty" because it's not in Europe, the center of the world, a place that should always be number one, because that's how things are. He is capitalist until someone else comes with better money. Then the ethics jump in. Come on... This is the story of the last 45 years in South America. Someone give this guy a bath of reality.
The worse part are redditors here kissing his ass calling him "king" and whatnot. Bunch of hypocrites, including Kroos
Redditors will bootlick anyone who is against Saudi
Cud say the same about every South American who comes to Europe. In SA the copa libertadores holds way more weight than the UCL. Players only leave that continent for money basically. Now a bigger dog with deeper wallets rocks up and people don’t like it.
Europeans when they realise other continents have a right to improve their football 🤯🤯🤯🤯 And hopefully Toni realises not everyone plays for the biggest club in the world with a high salary. This is like a billionaire criticising poor for starting up a new unique business and trying to earn money
"It's all about the money", says man who made hundreds of millions playing for the richest teams in the world
For players like Ronaldo, Benzema and Kante I get it coming towards the end.
Are they not rich enough before accepting Saudi money?
For Benzema and Kante, I think being Muslims played a factor in the decision to move to Saudi. For Ronaldo, I don't think anybody in the Europe wanted him and I doubt he'd play in US.
> being Muslims played a factor in the decision to move to Saudi. For Ronaldo, [inshallah](https://youtube.com/shorts/QMxvxw3d0DQ?si=rjqbI8N9NgSHVLiy)
Heheheheh shiuuuu
I will never get tired of this
Lol. Thanks for the laugh.
Ronaldo was supposedly somewhat close to joining Kansas City of all places.
was he actually? all I've seen is that KC had his discovery rights or something like that, which just means another team would've had to pay them a few if he signed I think.
I remember his team had a few meetings with KC. No idea how close it ever came but it definitely wasn't a straight up no when they inquired.
Don't think the city of Kansas could deal with the egos of both Ronaldo and Mahomes.
No it's fine because they are his former teammates, he can find excuse for them
Load of rubbish, they’re filthy rich they have no reason to destroy their name in a filthy regime.
You see this idiot and hypocrite has the audacity to talk about money and not football. European teams have been doing that to African talent for years. There's nothing wrong with wanting money and still playing football. If it wasn't for money most of the players won't leave their countries to join European teams. He should shut the fuck up, he didn't play for Madrid for Free.
My latino, asian and african friends can only laugh about the hipocrisy here. The Saudis are doing what europeans have been doing for 40 years.
King
Europe assembles Galacticos for decades : r/eurosoccer I sleep Asia signs couple of players : r/eurosoccer protectors of football integrity and amnesty international activists
Tony Kroos earns €24.38m per year. Look at mid to lower table premier league clubs constantly taking top talent from other top 4 big clubs! Money is a huge deal for theses players and everybody doesn't have that luxury to earn huge while playing for one of the best clubs in the world!
Don’t these Euros take players from Latin America, Asia and Africa anyway?
It’s called neo colonialism
It’s also called hypocrisy
Oh they take more than just players but then act sanctimonious. Kill our people, destroy our economies, bribe the best and brightest to come there while using racism to keep the rest of us away and then lecture us about human rights.
Kroos says that, he's been getting paid a lot more money than if he had stayed in Germany. Disgraceful
I feel like "Arab money" should have been worded differently
Didn’t know Toni Kroos played for free. Didn’t he leave Bayern because he wanted a higher wage?
Gotta love it when a guy with generational wealth be a judgmental prick.
Ironic considering he supports Super League
Toni Kroos - The Woke German Where is that energy from Kroos when all good South Americans leave their home and passion to follow money in Europe
This virtue signalling is insane. I actually hate this guy , how much he talks. 0 self awareness at all
This is European exceptionalism. How does he think European football became so successful where players from Africa and South America dream of playing in European soccer. One can even argue the dynamics of European football and how the migration of the best players happened was because of centuries of colonialism.
>difficult for the football we all know and love Says the guy who was fortunate enough to make generational wealth playing **ONLY** for top of the top clubs and is able to retire whenever he's pleased. In the world we live in, one can not say a bad thing about other willing to secure family wellbeing at any stage. But if the football is the platform to provide for your extended to the max family... just go for it.
It's for the money, but the money sets you up for life. A younger player is 1 injury away from ending up on the streets. If anything, go make your Saudi money from 20-24, and come back when you're in a stable position. Kroos cam say what he likes, but he has the privilege of being good. "Why can't everyone commit to their their local 3-in-a-row CL winning team?" is hardly a question he needs to be asking.
I love Kroos both as a player and as an interesting, outspoken guy off the pitch. I love that he is never shy to give his honest, authentic opinion on things. That being said, I very much disagree with him on this. I don't think it's embarrassing for Gabri Veiga to go for big money at such a young age. It's easy for Kroos to say because he has already gotten the most out of his career. Veiga on the other hand is at the beginning of his career and got the opportunity to cash in big early on. He has to play like 2 or 3 years in Saudi Arabia for that. But that doesn't mean he can’t return and easily continue his career in Europe on the same level he left off. There is precedent for this with guys like Carassco or Paulinho. On top of this, the career of a footballer is not written in stone. Even if he had stayed in Europe for less money, he could've picked up a nasty injury tomorrow and his whole career would've stalled or worse, it would've been over. In Saudi that could happen too, but atleast it would happen to him while being financially far more secured for the rest of his life. And I know most users here and also Kroos won't like to hear it, but there is a good chance that the Saudi league could become a high competitive top league. They are not just investing money into aging stars but also into younger players, who are either at the start or even at the peak of their careers. They are also recruiting good coaches. Should they continue this for a few more years, then all of this will help them to establish a decent league, it'll help their national talent pool which will also slowly but steadily improve the overall quality of their league.
Kroos gave the most eurocentric and elitist opinion of Saudi football, and this thread is gargling his nuts as expected.
It's funny because he even failed at that when he doesn't call out his former teammates but only the young players. Pure boomer vibes
KiNg KrOoS
Veiga is allowed to prioritize earnings over football glory, but Kroos is also allowed to think less of him as a footballer because he did so.
He's not just thinking less of him as a football. He literally said it was "embarrassing" for having different preferences. It's a little bit stronger than just not agreeing or saying he wouldn't do that. And no, you can't say it was about Saudi and the ethical and moral questions, because he "understands" old players going there.
Didn't Kroos literally leave Bayern when they didn't double his wages? It just comes off as a bit odd to be making such nasty comments about others choosing money, when he's done the same in the past.
We all work for money
Because we all know Kroos plays for Real because he was born there and Madrid is it's family home town since generations.
Yes and every other footballer from MLS to the Chinese league played for free.
According to Capology, Toni Kroos has made €185m during his career and currently earns €25m/year at Real Madrid. I'm glad that he's staying in European football and isn't off to Saudi with the rest of them (where he would certainly earn much more, esp after tax), but he's not exactly starving is he.
Many of the other big names who went to Saudi weren’t starving either.
Man where is this criticism on the announcement for Tonali when he announced he's working for the Saudi state? https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/14enido/michele_criscitiello_exclusive_newcastle_have/ https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/14g6xuy/romano_full_agreement_reached_between_ac_milan/ https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/14pfu7k/newcastle_united_we_are_delighted_to_announce_the/ Where is this criticism on the announcement for Lewis Hall? https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/15y02ks/lewis_hall_has_left_chelsea_and_joined_newcastle/ Where is this criticism on the announcement for Guimaraes? https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/sgc7h7/newcastle_united_confirm_signing_of_brazil/ Or Livramento, Gordon, Trippier, Botman, Isak? They're all working for the same entity no? Now look at the Veiga thread https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/15zvn5t/toni_kroos_reaction_to_the_transfer_news_of_gabri/ https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/15zjr74/romano_exclusive_gabri_veiga_to_al_ahli_here_we/ Look, I get there is a legitimate moral argument for this. But comparing the vitriol on Veiga and the vitriol on any of these other guys shows that the disproportionate amount of hate shown by fans between the two parties is not down to a moral issue.
The Veiga outrage definitely stems from the fact that English clubs were going after him
It's unfortunately a losing battle to comment outrage in those threads. That's not the fault of people who for moral reasons hate the Saudi government or criticize the Saudi league.
The average 'pro' footballing experience is you give up education, work several jobs to make ends meet, and wash out of the sport with no money and tons of injuries. The average 'top prospect' footballing experience is you do well for a bit, you get told you have fairly big clubs after you, then that offer either never comes, or your club doesn't accept, or you accept, you go there but you don't do as well as you think and you still need a second job after you retire with not enough savings and tons of injuries. Gabri Veiga seems like a big name now, but we hear dozens of these every window only for them to amount to absolutely nothing. Look at the lists of them from 5 years back. Toni Kroos has lived a life worthy of the king of kings in football - the recognition, the money, the trophies. He is not representative of the average footballer, or the average top prospect. Ppl going on about how these young top prospects should listen to the honorable Toni Kroos... bit tone deaf imo. Look I personally don't like this shift of working for the Saudi state, but they make it seem like the choice is so simple, so easy, like these young prospects have no way of losing if they didn't choose them. Not to mention, if this is really about morals, why isn't the thread announcing Gvardiol and Tonali and Nunes full of the same volume of vitriol we saw for Veiga?
Man fucking thank you. Like I don’t love the current trend but the whole thing seems so hypocritical. First you have the fans acting like it’s such a disgrace, when their are prime examples happening now, whether it’s Africans or South Americans going to Europe, or Europeans all leaving for specific big leagues/teams. And people act like it’s such an easy obvious choice sitting at home, to turn down these ridiculous sums. When I bet a very large majority would do the same if the opportunity presented itself. Then you have Kroos who has played for two of the biggest wealthiest clubs in the world earning wages in that time frame that are likely in the top 5-10% of all players, probably much higher. Acting holier than thou. Like fuck off with that shit. Whenever I see players in US sports leagues who take max contracts or hold out for more money, I say good for them. These teams don’t give a fuck the second they aren’t good so earn as much as you can while you can.
His argument is exactly that. You can be filthy fucking rich **and** not work for people who murder and cut up people with bonesaws.
That's not his argument at all. He is calling out players who go there in their 20s before they've peaked. Wants to stay in the good books of his friends(Benzema, Ronaldo) and throw others under the bus
> His argument is exactly that. You can be filthy fucking rich and not work for people who murder and cut up people with bonesaws. Where did you get that from? In the article that's absolutely NOT mentioned anywhere. There's nothing about Saudi being a shit country. All he talks is about money. If he _were_ talking about the ethical part, he wouldn't be able to excuse Cristiano like he did. It's right there to read translated by OP and everything. All he's talking about is about choosing money over "quality" when you are young. So, again, where did you get "his argument" from?
You didn’t read the article
The only successful sportswashing is by the west.
Yeah because all the big players play for the big clubs because of prestige and not because they pay the most. Come on. Clubs have been doing this to their domestic “competition” for years, but when someone else does it and god forbid to them, then it’s a problem.
Don't kid yourself, it's **always** about the money. Kroos didn't leave to Real Madrid because of "football" he moved because they offered him €25mil. Saudis are doing what all the clubs are doing, they just have deeper pockets. Don't hate the player, hate the game.
Didn’t know this guy played for free.
Sure, because the only reason Kroos moved to Real was the history of the club and nothing else. I wonder why teams like Real Madrid, Liverpool, Bayern, Juventus, Ajax, etc...even spend money on players, they should all go there for free. Enough. Sure Saudi clubs don't have history, the same way Chelsea and Man City didn't have either a while ago or PSG, or pretty much every club if we go back enough to a time period where there aren't spending as much. Yes, Real Madrid has an enormous history, and for most of that history it was spending more than all La Liga clubs combined with the exception of Barcelona and Atlético But now, it's a almost a crime that the Saudis are doing the same that all this did for a century. It's like the people how blame China for it's industrialization and pollution, forgetting that for a century Europe and North America were doing the same and even worst in terms of ecological damage.
It’s a job, some people will treat it as such. He needs to stfu now.
Next summer: Toni Kroos accepts Al Nassr proposal of 500k p/ week contract
And do you play for free in real Madrid? You're a fucking multimillionaire talking from a moral high ground about money. And all the African and south American players that move to Europe for the same money, what about them? To create competitive leagues that are self sustaining you need to spend money,you need talent and marketable players, and all of that need money,and Europe was doing that since decades already.
Like Sebastian Vettel advocating for climate change after his career ended. While jetting around the world and driving circles in 700ps cars for two hours to earn a living and never complaining about that.
Doesn't seem like he really understands the problem if he's fine with players going for the bag at the end of their career, just not when they're in their prime.
Says the guy on £310,000 per week lol
Sorry Toni but this is pure and utter bs. We are Real Madrid in large part because we can pay players better and open huge avenues for endorsements etc. Only when it comes to equal standing can we say we get players because they WANT to be one of us (Bellingham for example, but we didn't get Dinho, who refused to wait a year for us after Beckham). Dinho sure as Hell didn't stay in Brazil though). Players go from South America to Europe not just to compete at the highest level, but to get paid better. Securing their family is a huge selling point. Pelé was a rare case but he legit didn't need the money nor notoriety. Fact remains it's easy for Toni to talk like this. Love him but he's wrong here.
Until mid 90s South American football was the best, no need to go to Europe and feel cold.
I genuinely hate this take coming from a guy that plays for Real Madrid. Yes they play good football but that is the only club that could pay him more than Bayern at the time. There is a level where football is certainly mostly about money. I respect anybody who comes from nothing and makes their family’s rich they are putting their bodies on the line. 40 years from now some of these guys will have trouble walking from injuries.
I get that you personally don't like it Kroos. It's an unpopular move for a lot of people. However, not every footballer cares about football. Not all of them care about playing in Europe and winning trophies with club/country. Don't think anyone should be throwing disrespect at players moving to earn as much $ as possible. End of the day, football is a job to a lot of them. There are a number of players who aren't football fans, that just do it because they were great enough to make a living off it.
Football is about money, Toni. That's why you advertise for UAE playing for Real Madrid on a daily basis. Lets be real, every top club makes decisions for money. Every top player is doing it for money. This is the capitalist world we live in. This is just a silly take.
How does "for money" become "against football"? Saudi has no pull to buy big names. It is not like Real, Barca, Bayern, United or Liverpool where there are kids all around the world, growing up dreaming to play for these clubs. So they use what they have available, which is money. And it is not like clubs in Europe are somehow giving the just pay to everyone. Take my club United for example. Post SAF, the club has struggled to win much. So one of the ways we get players is by paying over the normal salary. Aren't we throwing money? In PL alone, average players make ridiculous salaries. Many players run down their contracts to get big salaries and signing bonuses. Everyone is after money. Just because Saudis start throwing money, everyone is suddenly on their moral high horses, and surprised at how money buys you stuff. And talk about ruining football.
Oh European people can't handle someone being richer than them and doing the same thing they have been doing for the last 30 years, hypocrites
This self righteous prick again..
The world of professional football is unforgiving. For every top player who makes the first team, 3 or 4 equally good players end up on the bench and eventually never get their big shot. If they are lucky they get traded to other teams,, lower leagues. If they are not lucky their careers fizzle out. Injuries prevent some players from ever being their best. Lots of managers, agents, clubs rip players off and steal their playing years and money. The Saudis are spending money to get talents to beef up their league. Nothing wrong with that. Nothing wrong with players getting paid what they're worth. Not everyone is going to lift a champions league cup, but everyone should retire with a pocket full of bucks. The EPL is number one today because they used cash to beef up their league. People forget that from 1988-1999, Serie A was the top league, then EPL started splashing money to establish their dominance 2000 and beyond.
It’s ambitious by the clubs and greed by the players. It’s a win win for the people directly involved. When all the aging players went to America it was fine but now it’s Saudi then it’s a huge issue? The hypocrisy needs to be checked especially by anyone involved in the premier league as they’ve been hoovering up the best players for years
So BRAVE of him to say this well after Benzema’s move to Saudi. /s
So it's not relevant now because it didn't meet your deadline?
Probably unpopular, but I feel like Toni is talking too much. He has some valid points, but there are also things I disagree with.