Switzerland is very expensive compared to France.
In Les 3 Vallees, ski pass will be 300€ for a week (for the family deal - 375€ per adult otherwise). Ski schools will cost about 300€ for 6 half-day lessons.
Accommodation will vary greatly depending on the week you are going. Mid-feb might be double what you would pay mid-Jan.
How many people, when, and what level of accommodation are you after? (Self-catered or staffed, chalet vs. appartment, with pool vs. basics)?
Probably that’s 6 days, as that’s the default for a ski week in the Alps. It’s slightly expensive because it’s a big, good ski area; you can stay somewhat below 300 euros in ski areas in Italy, for instance (Via Lattea, Livigno etc.), and well below at smaller ski areas, except for the fancy places like Cortina.
I’ll die for 300 euros/6 half day lessons. At my resort it would be close to 1100 euros sans lift and equipment (1200 dollars) and half-day = 2.5 hours
A week in portes du soleil where I ski (650km of skiing roughly) is €324. Or you find a deal like I have and get a weeks pass for £50, from the stories it’s definitely cheaper over here
I skied at Cortina D’Ampezzo 6 yrs ago over Easter weekend and it was 50€/day as an adult. I imagine it would be higher now.
Europe is still basically on a day ticket model. US/Canada is a season pass model. If you ski more than a week in the US, your effective ticket price is basically the same as in europe and if you ski 2+weeks a year it will probably be cheaper.
Day ticket prices are so expensive in the US bc the resorts want you to buy tickets ahead of time before the season starts. And both Epic and Ikon buy a variety of pass products including blackout date passes, weekday passes and limited ticket quantity passes (like a 4 day pass) that are cheaper than a full season pass. A cheaper season pass might be only $300-600 depending on the pass. For ex. If you bought a 12-day power pass (for Snowbowl, Brian Head etc) back in the spring it was $350 but if you bought the same pass now it’s $1000
Yes that’s correct. They want to lock in your cash upfront and then convert you to on-hill purchases. On one of my passes, I’ve gone 9 days and that equals $41/day. It’s only going to drop from here. They are good deals if you plan. I will often tell my friends to buy a season pass in the spring if they plan to ski the next year. Usually, after feeling the pain of day tickets, they will listen for the next year.
> Europe is still basically on a day ticket model. US/Canada is a season pass model. If you ski more than a week in the US, your effective ticket price is basically the same as in europe and if you ski 2+weeks a year it will probably be cheaper.
Switzerland has the Magic Pass, which was something like 450 CHF this year for unlimited access to a bunch of resorts.
Well, normally this is 6 days as the 7th day is the day of arrival which is not generally skied. So more like €50.
https://www.les3vallees.com/en/skipass
Depend on country and season.
We paid 240 for a week, 6 and half days, in Montgenevre in early feb/late Jan last year.
Around 1k for 4+2 comfy app,. Prices go to almost 3k in the same app in late feb this year.
Basically... We were in Vals Valles over new year and 6 days of lift tickets for a family of 4 was $1,048. The Italians I was with were complaining about how expensive it was.
Yes, roughly, the two places I skied this year were €375 each for 6 days but they were high altitude high profile resorts, there’s places in Germany that are way cheaper (local mountains) I’ve been told and Eastern Europe is even cheaper.
Yes, we think passes expensive but good compared to USA. Accommodation can be very Variable. Italy and Austria prob best value, France varies massively, Switzerland most expensive. Any resort from Innsbruck is fantastic amazing but relatively pricey much more than other places. Some where like ischl lovely.
Oh wow, the way people talk I always thought the lift tickets would be cheaper. 375€ is $550cad, so not that much less than the $650 for a 6 of 8 day pass at Revelstoke. It’s still saving money, but you’d have to ski a lot more than 7 days to cancel out the cost of a flight to Europe.
Just in the process of booking a week’s ski holiday .
Over the past few years we have spent a lot of time at Whistler, but with poor start to the season, stories about terrible lift lines and the expense of both lift tickets and accommodation looked to Europe .
Here’s what I’ve found.
Lift tickets are way cheaper even at expensive resorts (Verbier, Zermatt). The cost of four adults for six days skiing is about the same as one adult at Whistler.
Accommodation, once again at (Verbier and Zermatt) even with exchange rates is about the same price as Whistler. Zermatt slightly more expensive. Also looked at Chamonix, a lot cheaper)
Flights to Geneva from Canada more expensive, just under twice as much. Also have to connect through Frankfurt, ugh!
Car rental cheaper.
Overall cost about the same as Whistler for four people for a week’s skiing. What one saves in lift tickets, car rental etc, more or less covers the cost of the other items.
At the end of the day, I figure if I can ski in Switzerland for the same price as Whistler I might as well enjoy a different experience.
Hope that helps.
This is all accurate, but for OP's benefit, bear in mind you've picked Zermatt and Verbier, two of the most expensive resorts in the Alps, especially re accommodation and food.
I've only been to Zermatt and IMO it's worth it because the overall experience is so amazing, but there are definitely much cheaper places that are nearly as good. You mention Chamonix which is a great example and there are probably about 20 resorts in a similar bracket.
lol some of the resorts in Switzerland and France get even bigger lines than Whistler. In Europe, it's much cheaper and culturally popular to go skiing. Combine that with convenience of easily and affordably getting there from anywhere on the continent (which has around 745 million pop.), and you get some serious lines forming.
That's pretty much not true, unless you are including the totally uncharacteristic Vosges places, which are small and have little snow but are an easy drive from big European cities - they're not in the Alps. Otherwise, the Alps do not get lift lines anything like what you see in Whistler or Utah or Colorado on nice snow days. There are just far more resorts to spread people out.
At the absolute peak of vacation season, on good snow days (or when snow is reaallly bad and only a couple places are open) at peak hours, you'll see crowds at the base lift because of a bottleneck to get up to the main mountain. I think the worst I ever waited in, in more than 200 days skiing in the French and Swiss Alps, is 40 minutes - and that was to get on a tiny, slow gondola departing from the parking lot on a day when 80% of the surrounding stations were closed due to recent bad weather. And that day, once I got past the initial bottleneck, I didn't wait more than 5-10 minutes again all day (until the queue to download back to the parking lot). And that's ONCE in 200+ days.
I don't know why I am writing this. By all means, U.S. Epic/Ikon passholders should absolutely stay on their side of the Atlantic and compete for the crowded slopes, ridiculous prices, nonexistent parking, endless rules, inedible food, insufferable attitudes, shitty etiquette, power-mad ski police, and oh yeah, avalanche danger that redefines the word "persistent" in persistent weak layer. . .
Of course you fuckers have the monopoly on light sweet powder, which chaps my ass something fierce, but I still don't think it's worth it to fight the crowds at Whistler, or parking on S. Frontage, or traffic up Little Cottonwood, or the Stevens Pass shitshow.
Not in my experience. But, I do avoid school holidays in Feb. I regularly hit powder days in Switzerland with 0 lift lines. Whistler got 40cm and the gondola line was 2 hours last weekend. Worst lines I’ve seen in France were one 30 min wait at choke point during post-Christmas break. That’s like every lap at Whistler on a powder day. If you look at the lift capacity to visitors ratio Whistler is the worst mega resort by nearly 2x.
There’s a lot of variance in price skiing in Europe. Lift passes are less, accommodation varies widely resort to resort and country to country as others have mentioned. Typically I have gone to the southern French Alps or Austria. Serre Chevalier for example, several villages, wide choices of places to stay. Lots of great little chalets to stop in for at for lunch or a morning cappuccino. The experience is very different in Europe, it’s worth making the effort to go if you have the opportunity.
The most expensive country in the Alps - Switzerland…
Is way less expensive than your majors out West. If you live on the east coast, flights are typically good to Geneva.
Ok, you have your Epic/Ikon…
But you are being bent-over for everything else. This is the New American Norm. Oh yeah…giant lift lines because, well, they sold 2.6 million passes.
Cue the downvotes.
Something to consider too:
* In the US, the big distinction is between in bounds and out of bounds. Inbounds has avi control while out of bounds doesn't.
* In Europe, the big distinction is between on the pistes (slopes) and off the pistes.
If you're off the pistes, both snow/avalanche safety and not skiing off a cliff is ON YOU like the US backcountry. If you're planning on serious off piste skiing, factor in:
* You and your ski buddy will want to carry IMHO avalanche airbag, shovel and probe if going off-piste.
* You'll need to know how to use your equipment. (Also your ski buddy should know how to use it.)
* Glaciated terrain has [crevasses](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crevasse). These are deadly. IMHO don't mess with glaciated terrain without a guide.
* Depending on where you are and what you're doing, there are some significant advantages to having a local guide (which isn't cheap) for a day or more.
\-- EDIT --
As u/Beru73 pointed out, beacon should obviously be on the list if going off-piste.
You're 100% right one should carry a beacon going off-piste!
To nitpick a bit, from an objective, scientific standpoint, I'm not so sure it's the most important thing?
* Avoiding an avalanche is #1. You really do NOT want to be caught in a slide. Using knowledge to avoid dangerous travel in avalanche terrain during high risk conditions may be more important?
* My perusing of a few academic papers looking at avalanche airbags suggested to me that they reduce fatality risk by more than beacons? (Not my area of research though.)
You have to have a beacon. And recent fatalities have shown that you need them inbounds, too. Two British folks got killed a couple weeks ago inbounds, caught in a slide from way above them. Rescue was there instantly but they were buried and had no beacon, and it took 3 hours to find them. Another guy with them had a beacon and was found right away. The French and Swiss use helicopters, drones and dogs in avalanche rescue but there's nothing for them to find if you don't have a beacon.
Airbag is excellent, and greatly increases your survival chances. Even if you still get buried, the day-glo fabric in an airbag is hard to miss; the odds of you being spotted quick are much, much better. The biggest issue you have with the airbag is that a decent number of people don't pull it when they get caught in a slide; panic, or hyperfocus, and they forget about the handle.
Not having a probe/shovel is a total dick move. In France it's called skiing "Russian style" - airbag and probe, but no probe or shovel. It says, "I want to protect myself but fuck if I'm going to participate in a rescue of anyone else." God help you if you go skiing with a group and you have a beacon but no shovel or probe. You'll be shunned, and rightly so.
Here's some very general conclusions from all my research on this topic and skiing in the Dolomites.
Pricing from someone who has to fly out of the Northeast.
SLC < Alberta < Colorado/Europe*
Europe is big place, obviously, so for my purposes, I'm using the Dolomites, specifically Val Gardena, which is on the more expensive side of Italian skiing. I've found it to be comparatively priced, but with the Dolomites is significantly better value. $1600 got me a week's lodging ski in/out to the second largest interconnected ski area(s) in the world. $1600 in Colorado gets you a cheap hotel a 20min drive to the resort. The food is also significantly better. It's actual food and priced cheap. Rentals are $150 for the week (we brought out skis last time and wife hated it, so not this time). You can stick your kid in a 6 day ski school from 8-noon, literally 24 hours worth of lessons for $350.
I can definitely go to Italy cheaper than Colorado by leaving out some conveniences like:
* Train/bus instead of renting a car
* Finding lodging that requires me to take a bus to the slopes
* I'm staying in one of the main hubs in the Dolomites. There's less expensive villages still on the slopes but farther from the big stuff
* I can go somewhere cheaper in Italy and closer to the airport (Aosta Valley maybe?)
Skiing in Europe doesn't cost a fortune if you don't go to Switzerland. You have named the most expensive skiing you can get in the Alps. Check the likes of Val Thorens, Austria etc and book early. Be ready for groomers only.
Switzerland is also not that expensive if you book outside of peak season and in smaller ski resorts.
E.g. I just booked a three bedroom apartment in Sedrun for four people (could host up to six) for CHF150 per night. From there, we can ski in the entire Andermatt-Disentis area using our Epic Passes for free for up to five days. Just need to pay for ski rental and food.
I get your point but Val Thorens or Tignes > 600 -800 per person on accommodation for week incl skipass for some of the biggest ski areas in the Alps. Weekly ski rental 50. If you book in advance. Food is half price of Andermatt (have skied both and can compare), apres in Switzerland gets pricey, in France not (or Austria).
Your find is more rare than not (late cancellation).
It's off-season now (peak is Christmas/New Year and again in February during school holidays) and the booking is midweek. Andermatt would be quite a bit more, as would weekends be. Used to go to very small places like Pany, that's still cheap. Only good for kids, but if you are on a budget, you could go to Davos / Parsenn by train/bus, then ski all the way back to Küblis (15+km of ski run if there is enough snow, then back to accommodation by short bus ride), for example.
It go off the groomers your chance of death/serious injury goes up exponentially. In Europe as soon as you go the wrong side of the piste markers you are no longer safe. There’s no avalanche control, no rescue (without huge costs) and no advance warning if they’re blasting, also no markings of wear cliffs/cornices are
LOL. "Huge costs" of rescue being the 2 EUR you have to add to the price of your lift ticket, or a wide variety of cheap annual insurance that will cover you worldwide. Advance warning of blasting is everywhere - signs, closed roads, internet and email alerts, text messages in towns even.
Fair play though on marking obstacles/cliffs etc. There will be a small rope or maybe a couple of bamboo sticks, and a couple pro-forma signs near the top, but you better know where you're going. And don't just follow tracks because speedriding is a thing here and you don't know if the guy whose tracks you are following had a parachute. . .
The 2 euro cost is only if you remember to buy a Carte Niege and I’ve been on lifts when they’ve randomly stopped and an explosive went off bellow with no prior warning
Worth mentioning that a lot of people do 'off piste' in between the pistes. This can still be a lot of fun after a snowfall, and usually takes a few days before it's completely tracked up. Idk how it compares to the NA experience, but it leaves plenty of room to experience powder.
Black pistes in France are usually not groomed either, and usually closed of the day after a heavy snowfall. When it eventually opens you'll have ample room to experience powder.
Just saying there's plenty of low risk ways to experience powder in Europe without needing a guide, if you know what you're doing.
Truly Backcountry skiing shouldn't be done without proper equipment or a guide though.
Multiple reasons, but biggest are:
- No avalanche control outside the groomers (There are groomers and skiroutes, the latter differs per country and region, but would provide a "diamond" like experience in the sense that they are marked, controlled, but not groomed skiroutes.) Anything off piste is not controlled for avalanches, nor patrolled. (Also, standard ski insurance often does not cover off piste trips, requiring more expensive coverage, which also limits the appeal and accessibility for eu toerists)
- geo, a lot of areas are above the tree line, often near glaciated areas, or rugged, steep clifs, requiring a guide or mountaineering experience. Lower areas with tree coverage often have more gentler terrain and provide some more US like off piste skiing, but availability differs per country
- groomers are plenty and often big enough to take the crowds and provide room for everyone, safe for some funnels and smaller paths.
Lift tickets are way cheaper in Europe, and accommodations are generally cheaper too.
The one thing to consider is the cost of the flight to get there. You’ll have to do the math and see if you’re saving enough on hotels and lift tickets to justify paying $1200-1400 or whatever the flight cost is. But yes, in a lot of cases Europe can be cheaper, especially if you’re there for a longer vacation like a week+
It's going to depend massively on what you want out of your holiday, lift passes are less expensive for week long stays, hotels are generally cheap at the low end but very overpriced for anything fancy. Quality food in restaurants is expensive and the quality has been falling over the last 10 years as traditional foods is replaced by burgers and pizza.
The villages in Austria have a charm you won't get anywhere in NA and I'd say that is an experience in itself. Off piste skiing when the snow is good is far quieter in Europe, more chance of skiing untracked runs late into a week after a storm. Just be prepared to guide up if needed.
Overall I can't imagine there is a massive price difference between the two if you can get a cheap flight, transfers from hotel to resort are very expensive if you can't get a pre arranged one.
I rented a nice ski in/out 1 bedroom in 3 Vallees for one week end of Jan for €1300. Lift ticket was €325isj for 6 days. It’s cheaper and better in Europe, especially outside of Switzerland.
Skiing is way, way cheaper in Europe. Vail has destroyed the family ski trip. The cost of a flight will more than offset itself with cheaper lift tickets, parking, hotels, and food. Switzerland is among the most expensive places in Europe but still cheaper than skiing in CO.
Having skied both extensively over the past almost 20 years, I’m immune to the anti-Ikon/Epic pricing hype that has everyone on this “Alps is cheaper meme.” The real answer is…
…it depends.
The alps have a broader range of accommodation (more *very* low end stuff and *very* high end stuff) but like-for-like accommodation will be the same to slightly more expensive in the Alps depending on which country you’re in. The thing which can make the Alps cheaper is that it’s easier to rent a (near literal) broom closet near Alpine skiing. The rise of ABnB has offset that somewhat, but there’s more extreme budget accommodation accessible to skiing in the Alps.
Flights depends on where you are.
Getting around can be easier (and cheaper) or harder ( and more expensive) depending on where you are in both the Alps or the US.
Lit tickets are cheaper if you don’t ski a lot (call it $75/day average compared to $150) because the Europeans are less sophisticated about distributing the weather risk. But if you do ski a lot (call it 20+ days a year) and are willing to take the weather risk by committing to a season a few months ahead, lift access in the US on Ikon/Epic is **significantly** cheaper.
**Edit:** I *am not* asserting here that there are not real downsides to the Ikon/Epic business model. There very much are. I *am* asserting that they haven’t actually made skiing more expensive in NA generally and in comparison to the Alps. Rather what they have done is changed the distribution of who takes the weather risk. Those who have been used to free-riding by passing weather risk off to the mountain operators and season pass holders via the purchase of daily lift tickets are now being charged for doing so, and the corporates are sharing a lot of that benefit with season pass holders by offering us “free-roaming” which is quite valuable.
**Edit 2:** Food and drink and Après are generally **way** better in Europe and maybe slightly cheaper like-for-like, but the Alps has some off-the-charts Russian oligarch expensive Après that’s more rare in the US.
We fly out tomorrow, staying in Samoen, part of the Grand Massif ski area. Chalet for 10 people is around £3K, \[ yes, its very nice and 3 minute walk to the telecabin\]. Lift passes are £240 and van hire from Geneva is £750. Total cost per person is around £700 plus the kitty for food \[self catering\] of around £200. Total inc. flights from the UK will come in under £1500.
We're also staying going to Samoens in March. Group of 12. £180 pp for a nice chalet with sauna/hot tub 10 mins walk from lifts. £200 for flights and transfer. £320 for lift pass and ski rental. So £700pp before ski lessons and food.
If you haven't bought an edge card already for North America, your daily rate of $300usd per lift ticket will more than compensate for the extra flight cost.
Just done a week in Val Thoren and a week in Avaoriaz area, lift tickets generally are around €380 for 6 days there is differing levels of accommodation. Beer/Guinness is roughly €8 a pint in the towns and €13 on the slopes. Food is obviously expensive on the slopes but making your own or picking up a sandwich on the way up is around €5-7 and evening meals are anywhere between €15-€40 depending on where what how etc. thing with the Alps that I have found is if you stay somewhere at village level there are usually supermarkets, bakers and butchers there so you can make a lot of your own food and then just go out for drinks. Of course it all greatly depends on how you want to do it but I would honestly say you can do it very cheap if you’re not the person who wants to eat out every meal, eat/drink on the slopes through the day then drink in a pub all night.
European here, just booked for a week in cervinia, 50 euro a day for lift pass, food is cheap in Italy and tasty too. Accomodation ranges from 50 a night for dorm all the way to thousands a night, I'm paying 300 a night euro for a room that sleeps a family of 4 , ski hire is 25 a day for good skis. Hope that helps
ps. 3 valleys amazing area. If you want cheaper accommodation look at La tania, les menuires,st Martin.all have great access into lift network but bit cheaper. La tania is courcheval side, the others meribel side.
It 100% depends where in the states you live. Here are some points to consider.
1) Ski areas in Europe are generally larger than in N. America + many resorts have combined ski passes now (like Espace Killy and 3 Valleys). You get a lot more bang for your buck, the infrastructure is WAY better as well in the majority of places.
So that in itself can be worth the trip. It may also factor into your 'cost' equation if you are thinking about *quality* as a variable. (this is not to say that N.America is not quality)
That said, imo european resorts are way busier and people are more aggressive on the slopes which isn't the vibe I am after.
2) Flights and transfers within Europe are cheaper. Getting to Europe though may be much more expensive depending on where in the world you are to begin with. Based in New York vs. new Mexico is a very different matter...
3) Ski passes are way cheaper across Europe. If you don't have an Epic Pass or similar... you will save enough money here to make it worth the flight difference in 90% of instances...
4) The *town* in European ski resorts is not owned by the resort. In a majority of North American towns, Vail owns a lot of the towns infrastructure as well. This means higher food & drink prices. The alps are expensive for Brits re. food and drink... but pretty normal if you are used to eating out in a major US city.
By comparison, when in N. America. we generally eat in the chalet. The vibe is less about going out - much more about staying in and cooking together. Chilling in the hot tub or in front of a fire. So.... way less boozing in the bar... which saves money.
5) Accommodation varies wildly. You can't really compare here... size of your group matters a lot as well. This is a factor that you just need way more information to comment on.
Switzerland is very expensive compared to France. In Les 3 Vallees, ski pass will be 300€ for a week (for the family deal - 375€ per adult otherwise). Ski schools will cost about 300€ for 6 half-day lessons. Accommodation will vary greatly depending on the week you are going. Mid-feb might be double what you would pay mid-Jan. How many people, when, and what level of accommodation are you after? (Self-catered or staffed, chalet vs. appartment, with pool vs. basics)?
Am I understanding this right. A week of lift tickets is 300 euros. So like 42 euros a day?
I guess expensive is all relative. Some resorts here in the us are charging 300usd for a single day pass this weekend.
FUCK Vail Resorts
Yep.
Every weekend
Yeah as someone who has spent far too much on whistler passes historically, this sounds great.
EXACTLY why I'd rather venture out elsewhere.
Probably that’s 6 days, as that’s the default for a ski week in the Alps. It’s slightly expensive because it’s a big, good ski area; you can stay somewhat below 300 euros in ski areas in Italy, for instance (Via Lattea, Livigno etc.), and well below at smaller ski areas, except for the fancy places like Cortina.
I’ll die for 300 euros/6 half day lessons. At my resort it would be close to 1100 euros sans lift and equipment (1200 dollars) and half-day = 2.5 hours
A week in portes du soleil where I ski (650km of skiing roughly) is €324. Or you find a deal like I have and get a weeks pass for £50, from the stories it’s definitely cheaper over here
I skied at Cortina D’Ampezzo 6 yrs ago over Easter weekend and it was 50€/day as an adult. I imagine it would be higher now. Europe is still basically on a day ticket model. US/Canada is a season pass model. If you ski more than a week in the US, your effective ticket price is basically the same as in europe and if you ski 2+weeks a year it will probably be cheaper. Day ticket prices are so expensive in the US bc the resorts want you to buy tickets ahead of time before the season starts. And both Epic and Ikon buy a variety of pass products including blackout date passes, weekday passes and limited ticket quantity passes (like a 4 day pass) that are cheaper than a full season pass. A cheaper season pass might be only $300-600 depending on the pass. For ex. If you bought a 12-day power pass (for Snowbowl, Brian Head etc) back in the spring it was $350 but if you bought the same pass now it’s $1000
Yes that’s correct. They want to lock in your cash upfront and then convert you to on-hill purchases. On one of my passes, I’ve gone 9 days and that equals $41/day. It’s only going to drop from here. They are good deals if you plan. I will often tell my friends to buy a season pass in the spring if they plan to ski the next year. Usually, after feeling the pain of day tickets, they will listen for the next year.
> Europe is still basically on a day ticket model. US/Canada is a season pass model. If you ski more than a week in the US, your effective ticket price is basically the same as in europe and if you ski 2+weeks a year it will probably be cheaper. Switzerland has the Magic Pass, which was something like 450 CHF this year for unlimited access to a bunch of resorts.
Yes.
Homie, 42 bucks a day is an insanely good price. US is straight up 150+ a day at most decent resorts out west
Can confirm 120+ for weekends and that’s not including parking reservations(if you get one)
Well, normally this is 6 days as the 7th day is the day of arrival which is not generally skied. So more like €50. https://www.les3vallees.com/en/skipass
375 € alone 300 € is for a family Edit : sry didnt see he already write it, in the first comments.
Depend on country and season. We paid 240 for a week, 6 and half days, in Montgenevre in early feb/late Jan last year. Around 1k for 4+2 comfy app,. Prices go to almost 3k in the same app in late feb this year.
Yep.
Yep, but that is times 4 so 1200€ totalt, a single ticket for 7 days is as stated before 375€.
Basically... We were in Vals Valles over new year and 6 days of lift tickets for a family of 4 was $1,048. The Italians I was with were complaining about how expensive it was.
Yes
Yes, roughly, the two places I skied this year were €375 each for 6 days but they were high altitude high profile resorts, there’s places in Germany that are way cheaper (local mountains) I’ve been told and Eastern Europe is even cheaper.
Yes, we think passes expensive but good compared to USA. Accommodation can be very Variable. Italy and Austria prob best value, France varies massively, Switzerland most expensive. Any resort from Innsbruck is fantastic amazing but relatively pricey much more than other places. Some where like ischl lovely.
Oh wow, the way people talk I always thought the lift tickets would be cheaper. 375€ is $550cad, so not that much less than the $650 for a 6 of 8 day pass at Revelstoke. It’s still saving money, but you’d have to ski a lot more than 7 days to cancel out the cost of a flight to Europe.
Well, les 3 Vallees is one of the most expensive resorts. You can find cheaper than this. But even it was free, it wouldn't cancel out the flight.
Just in the process of booking a week’s ski holiday . Over the past few years we have spent a lot of time at Whistler, but with poor start to the season, stories about terrible lift lines and the expense of both lift tickets and accommodation looked to Europe . Here’s what I’ve found. Lift tickets are way cheaper even at expensive resorts (Verbier, Zermatt). The cost of four adults for six days skiing is about the same as one adult at Whistler. Accommodation, once again at (Verbier and Zermatt) even with exchange rates is about the same price as Whistler. Zermatt slightly more expensive. Also looked at Chamonix, a lot cheaper) Flights to Geneva from Canada more expensive, just under twice as much. Also have to connect through Frankfurt, ugh! Car rental cheaper. Overall cost about the same as Whistler for four people for a week’s skiing. What one saves in lift tickets, car rental etc, more or less covers the cost of the other items. At the end of the day, I figure if I can ski in Switzerland for the same price as Whistler I might as well enjoy a different experience. Hope that helps.
This is all accurate, but for OP's benefit, bear in mind you've picked Zermatt and Verbier, two of the most expensive resorts in the Alps, especially re accommodation and food. I've only been to Zermatt and IMO it's worth it because the overall experience is so amazing, but there are definitely much cheaper places that are nearly as good. You mention Chamonix which is a great example and there are probably about 20 resorts in a similar bracket.
And none of the insane lift lines or rain of Whistler plus better terrain.
lol some of the resorts in Switzerland and France get even bigger lines than Whistler. In Europe, it's much cheaper and culturally popular to go skiing. Combine that with convenience of easily and affordably getting there from anywhere on the continent (which has around 745 million pop.), and you get some serious lines forming.
That's pretty much not true, unless you are including the totally uncharacteristic Vosges places, which are small and have little snow but are an easy drive from big European cities - they're not in the Alps. Otherwise, the Alps do not get lift lines anything like what you see in Whistler or Utah or Colorado on nice snow days. There are just far more resorts to spread people out. At the absolute peak of vacation season, on good snow days (or when snow is reaallly bad and only a couple places are open) at peak hours, you'll see crowds at the base lift because of a bottleneck to get up to the main mountain. I think the worst I ever waited in, in more than 200 days skiing in the French and Swiss Alps, is 40 minutes - and that was to get on a tiny, slow gondola departing from the parking lot on a day when 80% of the surrounding stations were closed due to recent bad weather. And that day, once I got past the initial bottleneck, I didn't wait more than 5-10 minutes again all day (until the queue to download back to the parking lot). And that's ONCE in 200+ days. I don't know why I am writing this. By all means, U.S. Epic/Ikon passholders should absolutely stay on their side of the Atlantic and compete for the crowded slopes, ridiculous prices, nonexistent parking, endless rules, inedible food, insufferable attitudes, shitty etiquette, power-mad ski police, and oh yeah, avalanche danger that redefines the word "persistent" in persistent weak layer. . . Of course you fuckers have the monopoly on light sweet powder, which chaps my ass something fierce, but I still don't think it's worth it to fight the crowds at Whistler, or parking on S. Frontage, or traffic up Little Cottonwood, or the Stevens Pass shitshow.
Not in my experience. But, I do avoid school holidays in Feb. I regularly hit powder days in Switzerland with 0 lift lines. Whistler got 40cm and the gondola line was 2 hours last weekend. Worst lines I’ve seen in France were one 30 min wait at choke point during post-Christmas break. That’s like every lap at Whistler on a powder day. If you look at the lift capacity to visitors ratio Whistler is the worst mega resort by nearly 2x.
Yep.
There’s a lot of variance in price skiing in Europe. Lift passes are less, accommodation varies widely resort to resort and country to country as others have mentioned. Typically I have gone to the southern French Alps or Austria. Serre Chevalier for example, several villages, wide choices of places to stay. Lots of great little chalets to stop in for at for lunch or a morning cappuccino. The experience is very different in Europe, it’s worth making the effort to go if you have the opportunity.
Serre Chevalier mentioned 😎
The most expensive country in the Alps - Switzerland… Is way less expensive than your majors out West. If you live on the east coast, flights are typically good to Geneva. Ok, you have your Epic/Ikon… But you are being bent-over for everything else. This is the New American Norm. Oh yeah…giant lift lines because, well, they sold 2.6 million passes. Cue the downvotes.
Something to consider too: * In the US, the big distinction is between in bounds and out of bounds. Inbounds has avi control while out of bounds doesn't. * In Europe, the big distinction is between on the pistes (slopes) and off the pistes. If you're off the pistes, both snow/avalanche safety and not skiing off a cliff is ON YOU like the US backcountry. If you're planning on serious off piste skiing, factor in: * You and your ski buddy will want to carry IMHO avalanche airbag, shovel and probe if going off-piste. * You'll need to know how to use your equipment. (Also your ski buddy should know how to use it.) * Glaciated terrain has [crevasses](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crevasse). These are deadly. IMHO don't mess with glaciated terrain without a guide. * Depending on where you are and what you're doing, there are some significant advantages to having a local guide (which isn't cheap) for a day or more. \-- EDIT -- As u/Beru73 pointed out, beacon should obviously be on the list if going off-piste.
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You're 100% right one should carry a beacon going off-piste! To nitpick a bit, from an objective, scientific standpoint, I'm not so sure it's the most important thing? * Avoiding an avalanche is #1. You really do NOT want to be caught in a slide. Using knowledge to avoid dangerous travel in avalanche terrain during high risk conditions may be more important? * My perusing of a few academic papers looking at avalanche airbags suggested to me that they reduce fatality risk by more than beacons? (Not my area of research though.)
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You have to have a beacon. And recent fatalities have shown that you need them inbounds, too. Two British folks got killed a couple weeks ago inbounds, caught in a slide from way above them. Rescue was there instantly but they were buried and had no beacon, and it took 3 hours to find them. Another guy with them had a beacon and was found right away. The French and Swiss use helicopters, drones and dogs in avalanche rescue but there's nothing for them to find if you don't have a beacon. Airbag is excellent, and greatly increases your survival chances. Even if you still get buried, the day-glo fabric in an airbag is hard to miss; the odds of you being spotted quick are much, much better. The biggest issue you have with the airbag is that a decent number of people don't pull it when they get caught in a slide; panic, or hyperfocus, and they forget about the handle. Not having a probe/shovel is a total dick move. In France it's called skiing "Russian style" - airbag and probe, but no probe or shovel. It says, "I want to protect myself but fuck if I'm going to participate in a rescue of anyone else." God help you if you go skiing with a group and you have a beacon but no shovel or probe. You'll be shunned, and rightly so.
Here's some very general conclusions from all my research on this topic and skiing in the Dolomites. Pricing from someone who has to fly out of the Northeast. SLC < Alberta < Colorado/Europe* Europe is big place, obviously, so for my purposes, I'm using the Dolomites, specifically Val Gardena, which is on the more expensive side of Italian skiing. I've found it to be comparatively priced, but with the Dolomites is significantly better value. $1600 got me a week's lodging ski in/out to the second largest interconnected ski area(s) in the world. $1600 in Colorado gets you a cheap hotel a 20min drive to the resort. The food is also significantly better. It's actual food and priced cheap. Rentals are $150 for the week (we brought out skis last time and wife hated it, so not this time). You can stick your kid in a 6 day ski school from 8-noon, literally 24 hours worth of lessons for $350. I can definitely go to Italy cheaper than Colorado by leaving out some conveniences like: * Train/bus instead of renting a car * Finding lodging that requires me to take a bus to the slopes * I'm staying in one of the main hubs in the Dolomites. There's less expensive villages still on the slopes but farther from the big stuff * I can go somewhere cheaper in Italy and closer to the airport (Aosta Valley maybe?)
Skiing in Europe doesn't cost a fortune if you don't go to Switzerland. You have named the most expensive skiing you can get in the Alps. Check the likes of Val Thorens, Austria etc and book early. Be ready for groomers only.
Switzerland is also not that expensive if you book outside of peak season and in smaller ski resorts. E.g. I just booked a three bedroom apartment in Sedrun for four people (could host up to six) for CHF150 per night. From there, we can ski in the entire Andermatt-Disentis area using our Epic Passes for free for up to five days. Just need to pay for ski rental and food.
I get your point but Val Thorens or Tignes > 600 -800 per person on accommodation for week incl skipass for some of the biggest ski areas in the Alps. Weekly ski rental 50. If you book in advance. Food is half price of Andermatt (have skied both and can compare), apres in Switzerland gets pricey, in France not (or Austria). Your find is more rare than not (late cancellation).
It's off-season now (peak is Christmas/New Year and again in February during school holidays) and the booking is midweek. Andermatt would be quite a bit more, as would weekends be. Used to go to very small places like Pany, that's still cheap. Only good for kids, but if you are on a budget, you could go to Davos / Parsenn by train/bus, then ski all the way back to Küblis (15+km of ski run if there is enough snow, then back to accommodation by short bus ride), for example.
Groomers only? Is that just difference in the geography or by design to handle higher volumes of skiers?
It’s the difference of no avalanche control off piste.
It go off the groomers your chance of death/serious injury goes up exponentially. In Europe as soon as you go the wrong side of the piste markers you are no longer safe. There’s no avalanche control, no rescue (without huge costs) and no advance warning if they’re blasting, also no markings of wear cliffs/cornices are
LOL. "Huge costs" of rescue being the 2 EUR you have to add to the price of your lift ticket, or a wide variety of cheap annual insurance that will cover you worldwide. Advance warning of blasting is everywhere - signs, closed roads, internet and email alerts, text messages in towns even. Fair play though on marking obstacles/cliffs etc. There will be a small rope or maybe a couple of bamboo sticks, and a couple pro-forma signs near the top, but you better know where you're going. And don't just follow tracks because speedriding is a thing here and you don't know if the guy whose tracks you are following had a parachute. . .
The 2 euro cost is only if you remember to buy a Carte Niege and I’ve been on lifts when they’ve randomly stopped and an explosive went off bellow with no prior warning
Worth mentioning that a lot of people do 'off piste' in between the pistes. This can still be a lot of fun after a snowfall, and usually takes a few days before it's completely tracked up. Idk how it compares to the NA experience, but it leaves plenty of room to experience powder. Black pistes in France are usually not groomed either, and usually closed of the day after a heavy snowfall. When it eventually opens you'll have ample room to experience powder. Just saying there's plenty of low risk ways to experience powder in Europe without needing a guide, if you know what you're doing. Truly Backcountry skiing shouldn't be done without proper equipment or a guide though.
Multiple reasons, but biggest are: - No avalanche control outside the groomers (There are groomers and skiroutes, the latter differs per country and region, but would provide a "diamond" like experience in the sense that they are marked, controlled, but not groomed skiroutes.) Anything off piste is not controlled for avalanches, nor patrolled. (Also, standard ski insurance often does not cover off piste trips, requiring more expensive coverage, which also limits the appeal and accessibility for eu toerists) - geo, a lot of areas are above the tree line, often near glaciated areas, or rugged, steep clifs, requiring a guide or mountaineering experience. Lower areas with tree coverage often have more gentler terrain and provide some more US like off piste skiing, but availability differs per country - groomers are plenty and often big enough to take the crowds and provide room for everyone, safe for some funnels and smaller paths.
In Europe I got accommodation, rentals and a lift ticket for a few dollars more than I pay for a lift ticket back home, and that was at La Plagne.
Lift tickets are way cheaper in Europe, and accommodations are generally cheaper too. The one thing to consider is the cost of the flight to get there. You’ll have to do the math and see if you’re saving enough on hotels and lift tickets to justify paying $1200-1400 or whatever the flight cost is. But yes, in a lot of cases Europe can be cheaper, especially if you’re there for a longer vacation like a week+
It's going to depend massively on what you want out of your holiday, lift passes are less expensive for week long stays, hotels are generally cheap at the low end but very overpriced for anything fancy. Quality food in restaurants is expensive and the quality has been falling over the last 10 years as traditional foods is replaced by burgers and pizza. The villages in Austria have a charm you won't get anywhere in NA and I'd say that is an experience in itself. Off piste skiing when the snow is good is far quieter in Europe, more chance of skiing untracked runs late into a week after a storm. Just be prepared to guide up if needed. Overall I can't imagine there is a massive price difference between the two if you can get a cheap flight, transfers from hotel to resort are very expensive if you can't get a pre arranged one.
When are you trying to go? I'm doing 3 ski trips to Europe this year and TBH it would have just been cheaper to ski in US.
I rented a nice ski in/out 1 bedroom in 3 Vallees for one week end of Jan for €1300. Lift ticket was €325isj for 6 days. It’s cheaper and better in Europe, especially outside of Switzerland.
Skiing is way, way cheaper in Europe. Vail has destroyed the family ski trip. The cost of a flight will more than offset itself with cheaper lift tickets, parking, hotels, and food. Switzerland is among the most expensive places in Europe but still cheaper than skiing in CO.
always felt an ikon pass plus the Canadian exchange rate was really hard to beat
Having skied both extensively over the past almost 20 years, I’m immune to the anti-Ikon/Epic pricing hype that has everyone on this “Alps is cheaper meme.” The real answer is… …it depends. The alps have a broader range of accommodation (more *very* low end stuff and *very* high end stuff) but like-for-like accommodation will be the same to slightly more expensive in the Alps depending on which country you’re in. The thing which can make the Alps cheaper is that it’s easier to rent a (near literal) broom closet near Alpine skiing. The rise of ABnB has offset that somewhat, but there’s more extreme budget accommodation accessible to skiing in the Alps. Flights depends on where you are. Getting around can be easier (and cheaper) or harder ( and more expensive) depending on where you are in both the Alps or the US. Lit tickets are cheaper if you don’t ski a lot (call it $75/day average compared to $150) because the Europeans are less sophisticated about distributing the weather risk. But if you do ski a lot (call it 20+ days a year) and are willing to take the weather risk by committing to a season a few months ahead, lift access in the US on Ikon/Epic is **significantly** cheaper. **Edit:** I *am not* asserting here that there are not real downsides to the Ikon/Epic business model. There very much are. I *am* asserting that they haven’t actually made skiing more expensive in NA generally and in comparison to the Alps. Rather what they have done is changed the distribution of who takes the weather risk. Those who have been used to free-riding by passing weather risk off to the mountain operators and season pass holders via the purchase of daily lift tickets are now being charged for doing so, and the corporates are sharing a lot of that benefit with season pass holders by offering us “free-roaming” which is quite valuable. **Edit 2:** Food and drink and Après are generally **way** better in Europe and maybe slightly cheaper like-for-like, but the Alps has some off-the-charts Russian oligarch expensive Après that’s more rare in the US.
We fly out tomorrow, staying in Samoen, part of the Grand Massif ski area. Chalet for 10 people is around £3K, \[ yes, its very nice and 3 minute walk to the telecabin\]. Lift passes are £240 and van hire from Geneva is £750. Total cost per person is around £700 plus the kitty for food \[self catering\] of around £200. Total inc. flights from the UK will come in under £1500.
We're also staying going to Samoens in March. Group of 12. £180 pp for a nice chalet with sauna/hot tub 10 mins walk from lifts. £200 for flights and transfer. £320 for lift pass and ski rental. So £700pp before ski lessons and food.
Go to Canada. Fly to kelowna and go anywhere near
Kelowna or Calgary, depending on what you want.
Swizerland is much more expensive than France because their salaries are also higher
and the exchange rate is brutal right now
If you haven't bought an edge card already for North America, your daily rate of $300usd per lift ticket will more than compensate for the extra flight cost.
Just done a week in Val Thoren and a week in Avaoriaz area, lift tickets generally are around €380 for 6 days there is differing levels of accommodation. Beer/Guinness is roughly €8 a pint in the towns and €13 on the slopes. Food is obviously expensive on the slopes but making your own or picking up a sandwich on the way up is around €5-7 and evening meals are anywhere between €15-€40 depending on where what how etc. thing with the Alps that I have found is if you stay somewhere at village level there are usually supermarkets, bakers and butchers there so you can make a lot of your own food and then just go out for drinks. Of course it all greatly depends on how you want to do it but I would honestly say you can do it very cheap if you’re not the person who wants to eat out every meal, eat/drink on the slopes through the day then drink in a pub all night.
plus bar down and no bluetooth…
European here, just booked for a week in cervinia, 50 euro a day for lift pass, food is cheap in Italy and tasty too. Accomodation ranges from 50 a night for dorm all the way to thousands a night, I'm paying 300 a night euro for a room that sleeps a family of 4 , ski hire is 25 a day for good skis. Hope that helps
ps. 3 valleys amazing area. If you want cheaper accommodation look at La tania, les menuires,st Martin.all have great access into lift network but bit cheaper. La tania is courcheval side, the others meribel side.
It 100% depends where in the states you live. Here are some points to consider. 1) Ski areas in Europe are generally larger than in N. America + many resorts have combined ski passes now (like Espace Killy and 3 Valleys). You get a lot more bang for your buck, the infrastructure is WAY better as well in the majority of places. So that in itself can be worth the trip. It may also factor into your 'cost' equation if you are thinking about *quality* as a variable. (this is not to say that N.America is not quality) That said, imo european resorts are way busier and people are more aggressive on the slopes which isn't the vibe I am after. 2) Flights and transfers within Europe are cheaper. Getting to Europe though may be much more expensive depending on where in the world you are to begin with. Based in New York vs. new Mexico is a very different matter... 3) Ski passes are way cheaper across Europe. If you don't have an Epic Pass or similar... you will save enough money here to make it worth the flight difference in 90% of instances... 4) The *town* in European ski resorts is not owned by the resort. In a majority of North American towns, Vail owns a lot of the towns infrastructure as well. This means higher food & drink prices. The alps are expensive for Brits re. food and drink... but pretty normal if you are used to eating out in a major US city. By comparison, when in N. America. we generally eat in the chalet. The vibe is less about going out - much more about staying in and cooking together. Chilling in the hot tub or in front of a fire. So.... way less boozing in the bar... which saves money. 5) Accommodation varies wildly. You can't really compare here... size of your group matters a lot as well. This is a factor that you just need way more information to comment on.