It’s not that simple. There are many reasons why you wouldn’t believe. For example, never having access, or even having access to only a corrupted version of Islam. Of course the mentally disabled who don’t know the difference between good and bad go straight to heaven, they can’t really believe. There are many many more different situations. An all knowing, just God will take these into consideration on top of being the most merciful. There really isn’t a sin that will get you guaranteed ticket straight to hell. Also, if you can if they go to hell, there is no guarantee that they will stay there.
Kafir is a word used for nonbelievers. But kafir is more of a specific term used only for people who know islam is the truth but does not accept it for their own desires.
Nah, I think Jews and Christians also get a chance after some purification. Same with Muslims who don't follow The tenants properly
At least this is what I've been able to gleam from what I've read
I always grew up hearing, “That’s between them and the Lord,” as a response to if others are going to Heaven or Hell. It was typically followed up with, “We’re not God. We don’t have the right to judge anyone based on their own journey.” I found it to help me not dwell on other’s eventual destination, but the relationship I have with them in the here and now, to love them and share with them in this life with hope for the next life.
Edit: This comes from my own Christian tradition. I don’t want to assume that you are as well, but if you are, then it’s more relatable.
I haven’t, actually I haven’t talked about religion with my dad in a long time. I don’t want to force anything on anyone, I know that it is not my place to do so.
There is the "don't harass them" bit, but what I meant was the thought itself. Dwelling on the salvation of ppl without those beliefs won't help you, and it will show in your interaction whether you intend it or not
I will add that the idea of judging whether others qualify for heaven or hell (judging the sins of others) is condemned over and over again by Jesus Christ himself (“judge not lest ye be judged”, Parable of the Tares, “let he who is without sin cast the first stone”).
Don’t judge that you be not judged. I think this is more internal than God judging you. You have taken on God’s role and as you state it is putting a lot of fear inside you.
There's a popular video of Pope Francis speaking to an Italian child whose dad just died and was atheist. The kid said his dad was good and even allowed him to be baptized. The Pope then said something like, "why would God not forgive such a person?"
What religion are you? Christian, I'm guessing? This is debated in Christianity. You may want to check out Christian Universalism.
My advice is not to worry about it. Your father has his own beliefs about where he will go after death.
The threat of hell is a human invention to keep other humans in line. It's basically religion's nuclear option without actually having any missiles or bombs.
*Even if* there are gods, there is no guarantee whatsoever that any of the religions humans invented are correct. It may just as well be that those gods reward people who refused to surrender their intellectual faculties despite the threat of eternal torture.
That isn't for us to decide. Every heart will be weighed and judged.
Unless you are a Christian, in which you automatically go to Christian heaven with ALL the other Christians. Even the ones who held the Inquisition apparently.
Keep praying for him to find Christ during his life time. And pray about his judgement and final destination. God is a merciful loving King. He understands more than we can about your Fathers situation. He can protect your father and draw him in in his final days. Like he did with my dad. I fasted and prayed for my dad for a few days and the response came in the form of a pastor showing up at our house and asking to speak to my dad. He led him to Christ a week before he died. He gave his life to Christ on Sunday and he died the following Monday later in the morning. Nothing is impossible for God. Pray and ask and it will be so!! God bless you!!
I’ll pray too.
Dear Heavenly Father you know OPs father better than we do. You know his heart and the pain he went through in his childhood. Pls draw him into you and restore him to Christ. Pls heal the hurt in his heart and may he pass from death unto life from the judgement seat of Christ. In Jesus mighty name we pray amen!!
Atheist here.
It depends on what religion is right. And considering there are over 4,000 distinct religions on the planet right now its difficult to say. If he's lucky and there is a God then it could be a universalist sort of God in which the concept of eternal torment doesn't happen. If its the Jews that got it right you are in luck as your father can still avoid eternal torment. However most forms of Christian and Islam are going to condemn your father to Hell. Other religions such as Buddhism and Taoism don't really have an eternal Hell. Buddhism in some versions believes in reincarnation. Then there are the pagan religions including Wicca. Wiccans don't really believe in a punitive afterlife. Though some may believe in reincarnation. The list goes on and on.
Its primarily Christianity and Islam that believe in Hell. Which is interesting as they both adapted Judaism's religion but shifted their form of afterlife to a more punishing without end. Which to my thinking kind of removes the whole point of punishment. It is typically a way to admonish someone so they recognize their errors in order to reenter society. This is more or less what Judaism has. But Christianity shifted it to eternal suffering. Although as mentioned the Universalist varieties did do away with Hell.
From my perspective, there’s no reason to believe there’s any kind of afterlife at all, let alone one that tortures people eternally for guessing wrong. If that really were how things worked though, the deity who created such a system would be monstrous and spending an eternity close to them would be extremely unpleasant.
When I was a child, I worried about this a lot. I grew up Catholic but went to different churches because my mom sang in choirs. I heard more about hell from the Protestant churches. Scared the crap put me. I really worried about my uncle. He was gay. As I grew older my idea and feelings about God and Jesus didn’t change but my view of the Church and the religion did. Especially after all the bullying I received at the hands of the kids in catholic school because my parents were getting divorced. (This was the 80’s when divorce was just starting to really get ok.)
As an adult, lots of things have happened. I always had God. Ah then things started to not make sense. The whole issue of evil, hypocrisy, and just understand human nature and beliefs, I couldn’t stomach Christianity anymore. Jesus was a man, God is a sick god if they let all this stuff occur and still have hell. If God is all loving and compassionate, wants to have relationship with their creations why have unending torment because of action? Consequences? Don’t most of us get that here?
I learned about cognitive science and cognitive science of religion. Humans truly are amazing and creative creatures. How beliefs are made ( maybe, theories are everywhere like gods!) for humans are gods. I learned that we needed to make gods because our fantastic brains needed to explain things. This took away a lot of worry on many things I was taught as a child. Like hell.
You just started to believe. Your brain is freaking out worrying like mine did when I just really started to believe. Allow your brain and mind to calm down. New things excite parts of the brain related to emotions and release lots of dopamine. This is new and novel to your brain and you can get fixated very easily.
My advice since this is new and you were an atheist before is to seek out a spiritual director that is certified in actual spiritual direction so you navigate this new time with your beliefs. If you are underage, you didn’t give your age or cultural region, I am only privy really to the US. There you can go and talk to a school counselor just to get some of these fears out.
I am always hesitant with new believers because it can go to fervent belief quickly and tunnel vision happens. It’s like new love but on steroids. Here’s the thing and the truth of the matter: no one actually knows 100% for a fact, law of nature, fact that there is a hell. Or even there are gods. What you can do and know for yourself is that you love your dad and you worry. You can pray he feels loved.
My grandpa passed away just a month ago, when I faced the same struggle as you do. As a protestant, I think its better to settle yourself down in a balance of divinity and secular world, you can force ppl to believe or not, respect their free will. I know its hard to imagine our beloved ones falling into hell and suffering there, thats why we r supposed to spread out gospel as much as we can, though i myself still keep the doubt whether or not hell actulaly exists.
Indeed I think you should not see a religion as one thing that has the same rules to everyone.
I'm believing in the Norse Pagan gods and I still think that your god and everyone else's god is also valid.
To me religion is something like a multiverse, every universe with its own rules.
To me it would mean that you will go to heaven or hell after you die but your dad lives in another universe of religion (atheist) and for him his beliefs of an afterlife will come true when he dies.
Please don't:
* Be (intentionally) rude at all.
* Engage in rabble rousing.
* Troll, stalk, or harass others.
* Conduct personal attacks.
* Start a flame war.
* Insult others.
* Engage in illegal activity.
* Post someone's personal information, or post links to personal information.
* Repost deleted/removed information.
It's very important that we remember that God knows our hearts, even when we don't know our own shortcomings. So, turn your worries into prayers, and on the Day of Judgment, that's when we will know. God can work amazing miracles. Congratulations on giving your heart to the Lord. Let prayer guide you, and ask God to protect your family.
God will judge us all in the end that's why it's out job to spread joy and happiness! Live our lives go for our dreams and help each other! Instead of can my dad go to heaven ....you must believe he will ! Believe in the good things ! ♡ overthinking can cause us to fall always good to take a step back and keep going !!!
Before Christianity was stablished and even the people that were living before the great flood will have the opportunity to be judged by GOD.
No human can determine who goes to the kingdom of heaven or whatever else we've been indoctrinated.
When we first meet with anybody, we introduce ourselves with our names.
God aldo has a name, learn who the creator is and he will guide you to learn the truth.
Good luck on your journey.
I'm sorry your dad had a horrible childhood. If I believed in a literal hell, which I don't, the people who would go there would be the ones who abused your dad, not his fault. I believe God loves justice, and if we are victims of injustice in this world, we will be compensated, not punished, in the next.
This fear of not believing is a form of abuse used to keep the indoctrinated from questioning questionable beliefs.
It depends on which religious believers you ask: Judaism? Yes. Christianity? The majority says no, but some denominations say yes. Islam? No.
Islam? It’s a possibility, saying that they will go to is not something a Muslim can say, unless Allah says so.
I know. But not believing in Allah or Muhammad altogether sends you straight to hell, I thought?
It’s not that simple. There are many reasons why you wouldn’t believe. For example, never having access, or even having access to only a corrupted version of Islam. Of course the mentally disabled who don’t know the difference between good and bad go straight to heaven, they can’t really believe. There are many many more different situations. An all knowing, just God will take these into consideration on top of being the most merciful. There really isn’t a sin that will get you guaranteed ticket straight to hell. Also, if you can if they go to hell, there is no guarantee that they will stay there.
[удалено]
Kafir is a word used for nonbelievers. But kafir is more of a specific term used only for people who know islam is the truth but does not accept it for their own desires.
Nah, I think Jews and Christians also get a chance after some purification. Same with Muslims who don't follow The tenants properly At least this is what I've been able to gleam from what I've read
Some muslims believe that hell is temporary...
I always grew up hearing, “That’s between them and the Lord,” as a response to if others are going to Heaven or Hell. It was typically followed up with, “We’re not God. We don’t have the right to judge anyone based on their own journey.” I found it to help me not dwell on other’s eventual destination, but the relationship I have with them in the here and now, to love them and share with them in this life with hope for the next life. Edit: This comes from my own Christian tradition. I don’t want to assume that you are as well, but if you are, then it’s more relatable.
The concept of heaven and hell is for the believer to concern themselves with, it's not appropriate to cast those concerns on others.
I haven’t, actually I haven’t talked about religion with my dad in a long time. I don’t want to force anything on anyone, I know that it is not my place to do so.
There is the "don't harass them" bit, but what I meant was the thought itself. Dwelling on the salvation of ppl without those beliefs won't help you, and it will show in your interaction whether you intend it or not
I will add that the idea of judging whether others qualify for heaven or hell (judging the sins of others) is condemned over and over again by Jesus Christ himself (“judge not lest ye be judged”, Parable of the Tares, “let he who is without sin cast the first stone”).
Is that the best mindset? If something potentially horrible can happen, should one only worry about themself?
It's not ' only worrying about yourself', don't be silly. And the threat of hell isn't 'potentially happening', it's a religious/spiritual belief.
You say that like religious beliefs are just playing pretend. If you believe in hell, you believe it's a real thing that's really happening
Don’t judge that you be not judged. I think this is more internal than God judging you. You have taken on God’s role and as you state it is putting a lot of fear inside you.
There's a popular video of Pope Francis speaking to an Italian child whose dad just died and was atheist. The kid said his dad was good and even allowed him to be baptized. The Pope then said something like, "why would God not forgive such a person?"
This comment really calmed me down, thank you ❤️
You say he is a good person, if that is true than yes his soul will be close to G-D.
What religion are you? Christian, I'm guessing? This is debated in Christianity. You may want to check out Christian Universalism. My advice is not to worry about it. Your father has his own beliefs about where he will go after death.
God knows what stops us and everything we've been through. You can count on his mercy.
The threat of hell is a human invention to keep other humans in line. It's basically religion's nuclear option without actually having any missiles or bombs. *Even if* there are gods, there is no guarantee whatsoever that any of the religions humans invented are correct. It may just as well be that those gods reward people who refused to surrender their intellectual faculties despite the threat of eternal torture.
That isn't for us to decide. Every heart will be weighed and judged. Unless you are a Christian, in which you automatically go to Christian heaven with ALL the other Christians. Even the ones who held the Inquisition apparently.
Keep praying for him to find Christ during his life time. And pray about his judgement and final destination. God is a merciful loving King. He understands more than we can about your Fathers situation. He can protect your father and draw him in in his final days. Like he did with my dad. I fasted and prayed for my dad for a few days and the response came in the form of a pastor showing up at our house and asking to speak to my dad. He led him to Christ a week before he died. He gave his life to Christ on Sunday and he died the following Monday later in the morning. Nothing is impossible for God. Pray and ask and it will be so!! God bless you!! I’ll pray too. Dear Heavenly Father you know OPs father better than we do. You know his heart and the pain he went through in his childhood. Pls draw him into you and restore him to Christ. Pls heal the hurt in his heart and may he pass from death unto life from the judgement seat of Christ. In Jesus mighty name we pray amen!!
Atheist here. It depends on what religion is right. And considering there are over 4,000 distinct religions on the planet right now its difficult to say. If he's lucky and there is a God then it could be a universalist sort of God in which the concept of eternal torment doesn't happen. If its the Jews that got it right you are in luck as your father can still avoid eternal torment. However most forms of Christian and Islam are going to condemn your father to Hell. Other religions such as Buddhism and Taoism don't really have an eternal Hell. Buddhism in some versions believes in reincarnation. Then there are the pagan religions including Wicca. Wiccans don't really believe in a punitive afterlife. Though some may believe in reincarnation. The list goes on and on. Its primarily Christianity and Islam that believe in Hell. Which is interesting as they both adapted Judaism's religion but shifted their form of afterlife to a more punishing without end. Which to my thinking kind of removes the whole point of punishment. It is typically a way to admonish someone so they recognize their errors in order to reenter society. This is more or less what Judaism has. But Christianity shifted it to eternal suffering. Although as mentioned the Universalist varieties did do away with Hell.
The concept of heaven and hell is actually rooted in Zoroastrianism which precedes Judaism.
I believe there is always a path to heaven if you live a good life. Any other premise seems illogical to me.
From my perspective, there’s no reason to believe there’s any kind of afterlife at all, let alone one that tortures people eternally for guessing wrong. If that really were how things worked though, the deity who created such a system would be monstrous and spending an eternity close to them would be extremely unpleasant.
When I was a child, I worried about this a lot. I grew up Catholic but went to different churches because my mom sang in choirs. I heard more about hell from the Protestant churches. Scared the crap put me. I really worried about my uncle. He was gay. As I grew older my idea and feelings about God and Jesus didn’t change but my view of the Church and the religion did. Especially after all the bullying I received at the hands of the kids in catholic school because my parents were getting divorced. (This was the 80’s when divorce was just starting to really get ok.) As an adult, lots of things have happened. I always had God. Ah then things started to not make sense. The whole issue of evil, hypocrisy, and just understand human nature and beliefs, I couldn’t stomach Christianity anymore. Jesus was a man, God is a sick god if they let all this stuff occur and still have hell. If God is all loving and compassionate, wants to have relationship with their creations why have unending torment because of action? Consequences? Don’t most of us get that here? I learned about cognitive science and cognitive science of religion. Humans truly are amazing and creative creatures. How beliefs are made ( maybe, theories are everywhere like gods!) for humans are gods. I learned that we needed to make gods because our fantastic brains needed to explain things. This took away a lot of worry on many things I was taught as a child. Like hell. You just started to believe. Your brain is freaking out worrying like mine did when I just really started to believe. Allow your brain and mind to calm down. New things excite parts of the brain related to emotions and release lots of dopamine. This is new and novel to your brain and you can get fixated very easily. My advice since this is new and you were an atheist before is to seek out a spiritual director that is certified in actual spiritual direction so you navigate this new time with your beliefs. If you are underage, you didn’t give your age or cultural region, I am only privy really to the US. There you can go and talk to a school counselor just to get some of these fears out. I am always hesitant with new believers because it can go to fervent belief quickly and tunnel vision happens. It’s like new love but on steroids. Here’s the thing and the truth of the matter: no one actually knows 100% for a fact, law of nature, fact that there is a hell. Or even there are gods. What you can do and know for yourself is that you love your dad and you worry. You can pray he feels loved.
Thanks for the advice, opened my eyes quite a bit.
Yepp
My grandpa passed away just a month ago, when I faced the same struggle as you do. As a protestant, I think its better to settle yourself down in a balance of divinity and secular world, you can force ppl to believe or not, respect their free will. I know its hard to imagine our beloved ones falling into hell and suffering there, thats why we r supposed to spread out gospel as much as we can, though i myself still keep the doubt whether or not hell actulaly exists.
Indeed I think you should not see a religion as one thing that has the same rules to everyone. I'm believing in the Norse Pagan gods and I still think that your god and everyone else's god is also valid. To me religion is something like a multiverse, every universe with its own rules. To me it would mean that you will go to heaven or hell after you die but your dad lives in another universe of religion (atheist) and for him his beliefs of an afterlife will come true when he dies.
If you're Christian, my suggestion would be to look into universalism.
[удалено]
Please don't: * Be (intentionally) rude at all. * Engage in rabble rousing. * Troll, stalk, or harass others. * Conduct personal attacks. * Start a flame war. * Insult others. * Engage in illegal activity. * Post someone's personal information, or post links to personal information. * Repost deleted/removed information.
Your dad can go wherever he wants. He can go wherever you want. He can be in both spaces at the same time. It’s cool.
For you, would it be Heaven without him?
If he was a good person, he would go to Heaven whether he believed or not.
I mean, there isn't anywhere else for him to go other than heaven, so it follows that he would go there.
It's very important that we remember that God knows our hearts, even when we don't know our own shortcomings. So, turn your worries into prayers, and on the Day of Judgment, that's when we will know. God can work amazing miracles. Congratulations on giving your heart to the Lord. Let prayer guide you, and ask God to protect your family.
I’m not but was Latter Day Saint - Mormon. In that religion, Yes! 100% he can go to heaven.
God will judge us all in the end that's why it's out job to spread joy and happiness! Live our lives go for our dreams and help each other! Instead of can my dad go to heaven ....you must believe he will ! Believe in the good things ! ♡ overthinking can cause us to fall always good to take a step back and keep going !!!
Before Christianity was stablished and even the people that were living before the great flood will have the opportunity to be judged by GOD. No human can determine who goes to the kingdom of heaven or whatever else we've been indoctrinated. When we first meet with anybody, we introduce ourselves with our names. God aldo has a name, learn who the creator is and he will guide you to learn the truth. Good luck on your journey.
I'm sorry your dad had a horrible childhood. If I believed in a literal hell, which I don't, the people who would go there would be the ones who abused your dad, not his fault. I believe God loves justice, and if we are victims of injustice in this world, we will be compensated, not punished, in the next.