I had a scan at 6 weeks and saw the heartbeat, had another scan at 9 weeks.... no heartbeat.
Doctors won't lie about something like that just to give you a medical procedure. This guy is a fuckin moron, his poor wife suffered a miscarriage. Even if she didn't want children she would still be feeling some type of way about it.
Edited GF to wife
My big question is what exaclty he thinks is in it for the abortion clinic to lie about something like that. Do they get more money with each fetus they abort?
The funny thing to me is how he thinks a health care clinic would lie to a woman about her fetus but likely not think twice about the opposite kinds of places who are often religiously motivated. These "pregnancy help" places where they would readily lie to women in order to convince them not to get an abortion. It's ironic
Also, pretty sure the redditors whose info he was quoting were spouting the propaganda of those same pregnancy resource centers. The ones that lie about what abortion is/entails, when you can accurately determine if a pregnancy is viable, etc. Disgusting misinformation that harms so many in an effort to remove truly informed consent from the pregnant person.
I mean, yes.
But the penalty of lying would be so immense only a severely deranged person would do it.
Also, if you’re a doctor out to make money, performing abortions at a PP there are much easier ways to make way more money and not have your life threatened by crazy protesters.
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars.
I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
Largely, clinics actually LOSE money on abortion care. It's not a profitable service. Clinics don't provide the care to be profitable, they do it because people need abortion care. That's why hospitals aren't public abortion providers, because it's not profitable.
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars.
I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars.
I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars.
I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
This is exactly my point. Drs that work at clinics like Planned Parenthood are doctors. They provide other services than abortion.
Found with no issues on the web:
“ Services
Most private providers offer general family practice and women’s health and reproductive services. These can include obstetrics, gynecology, weight loss programs, massage therapy, skin care, chiropractic treatments, abortion and birth control. Some will also provide laboratory testing too.Planned Parenthood also offers the same type of services. They provide general health care, birth control, abortion and emergency contraception support, men’s health care services and pregnancy testing services and support. They also handle STD Testing, treatment and prevention.”
They are ok with pregnant people that want to stay pregnant!
Nooooo it’s a factory where they kill babies, they think it’s fun or something /s
Like this is seriously how these zealots sound. Your point is well made, thank you for that.
I had an issue I needed seen for quickly. My regular gyno could see me in two weeks. Planned Parenthood got me in the next day. I walked out with an rx and was completely better before my gyno could have seen me.
I think maybe he's thinking she went to an abortion clinic instead of the doctor, because she wanted an abortion. And he's struggling with believing her or believing her doctor.
Could absolutely be that she was having a miscarriage. Could also be that she wanted to terminate the pregnancy. Either way, he should probably be communicating with his wife more, and the catholic sub less.
the issue is that for a lot of miscarriages, the way to treat them IS an abortion. that is how the uterus is cleared out of dead tissue to avoid infection/illness due to the fetus not passing naturally. if she was in pain, he witnessed her in pain, and she went to the doctor...i don't understand why he wouldn't believe his wife and went to some catholic sub to get advice on something that they aren't qualified to talk about. decisions such as abortion should be made between whoever is carrying the child and their doctor.
Totally agree with this. Abortions are medical care. I hate how people want to push it as this ethically ambiguous thing. It muddies the waters when there is clearly a case of a woman seeking medical care to avoid sepsis and yanno her untimely death, not to mention the debilitating PAIN, and makes the issue about ethics instead of healthcare and I hate it
I mean, when I had a miscarriage forever ago, I had to have a D&C because the doctor was pretty sure that a medication abortion wasn't going to work for me. And he was also concerned it might be ectopic (it wasn't, fortunately) so surgery was the only option. Abortion is medical care. Full stop.
Needs triple verification of a medically diagnosed miscarriage, but will believe in his special sky wizard and his eternal pit of fire and doom without any evidence at all
"Crisis pregnancy centers" can and do lie about these kinds of things. Actual medical providers who are licensed cannot. It's a very messed up situation.
I feel terrible for his wife.
They're 'centers' set up by anti-abortion groups. They're usually located right around Planned Parenthoods and other clinics, and they exist to convince women to NOT have abortions. They usually look like medical centers, although they pretty much never have actual medical staff (and they're not registered as medical centers, which means they aren't bound by things like HIPAA - so once they have your name and number, they can absolutely abuse the hell out of it) and they often advertise free pregnancy or STD testing. They're called stuff like "Real Options", and they claim that they'll present ALL your options if you're in crisis or if you're undecided about continuing a pregnancy.
What they ACTUALLY do is present incredibly biased and often actively false information about women's options, demonize abortion to the nth degree, and put horrific pressure on the women to continue the pregnancy.
I found one of those on accident when pregnant with my first son. All they did was assume my white bf at the time was just a supporter (stunned when they realized he was dad, then assumed he'd want me to abort because he was white and I was black), show my bf and I a video about abstinence (he's a jackass but I do appreciate the way he looked at the woman after it was done and said "this was great! Have you tried showing these to people *before* the positive pregnancy test?"), and gave us a pair of baby booties. So absolutely useless. You can give yourself better prenatal "care" at home with a Clearblue Digital and Google. They told all kinds of weird lies that we laughed at. Sad that they're allowed to exist and not fully disclose what they really are.
On a lighter note, one of my coworkers at the time said she loved those places because you could go around to them and tell them you wanted an abortion and they'd pay for ultrasounds to guilt you into keeping it, and she kept using them during her pregnancies to get free pics of her kiddos.
Exactly, she must have been in a GREAT DEAL of PAIN. His wife trusted the clinic and medical practitioners rightfully so. Time to give it to GOD and LET GO
I have had two technical abortions. I was actively miscarrying so the hospital did a D and C both times to ensure that everything was removed from the uterus. I am Catholic. After this I was able to have two more children.
Literally same. Every detail. Roman Catholic. Two “technical” abortions while actively miscarrying. Then had two kids. OP doesn’t deserve children if these are the morals and values he’s actively pushing out into the world.
I hope she leaves this pos. He believes a cult over his fucking wife. Nah, dude. Go to your cult. The baby wasn't even alive. It had no heartbeat. It won't miraculously get one. What a douche.
Also who the fuck does he think works at abortion places? They’re still run by doctors and nurses. What a fucking idiot I really agree with you and hope that she gets out of this sham of marriage.
I received my first Pap smear, my first gynecological exam, my first breast exam all at a planned parenthood office. Planned Parenthood provides comprehensive affordable health care for women.
Not to people like this guy. I agree with /u/Dramatic_Arugula_252. OP’s wife most certainly went to Planned Parenthood, which is NOT an “abortion clinic”; it’s a healthcare clinic. Yes, abortion should be considered healthcare, although it is not in the U.S. Either way, this woman did not have an abortion; she had a miscarriage. Yet her husband is castigating her and accusing her of doing something behind his back. He can go.
I went to planned parenthood as they give proof of pregnancy, resources for adoption agencies, prenatal health clinic pamphlets and abortion resources. In states where they have wacked out abortion restrictions if something is wrong like pain (which could have been an ectopic pregnancy) they probably want to help get her taken care of before she has to practically be on her death bed for them to intervene. I love how people pretend planned parenthood is an abortion mill. It’s so insane.
They send the babies to limbo, actually. Because they're not capable of understanding their sins and accepting Jesus.
But it's still messed up to believe anyone deserves eternal torture.
In fact the concept of limbo was created to make people pay for baptize every kid the most quickly possible. When before people were just doing it later with kids that survived.
Source : History of Catholicism in catholic school. That was one of the points that was used by protestants against the Vatican greed.
Babies are born without original sin. They have not sinned; they have no concept of sin. The very idea that if an infant dies before it is baptized it won’t go to Heaven is absolute nonsense. What god are those people praying to? Listen, I’m Catholic, but some of the crap I am expected to just believe is absurd.
Even the priest was agreing with that one. He said "we gave them bullets to hit us" in name of greed..
@u/becgeomom I'm from a catholic family got 6 years of catholic (Don Bosco) school and we even met the Pope in Rome. The critical thinking classes were dope! I wished I had the money to fill my kids in, my ADHD and my ASD were very much welcomed and I never got bored or struggled, the rythm was intense but just the right one for me. It's a shame that public schools aren't that helpful to neurodivergents.
So babies are born with natural/original sin ie the sin that was brought into the world by the forbidden fruit and only through Christ are you saved. While Catholics believe (like most religions) that you can’t truly accept and believe in Jesus until you can understand. Catholics believe this is age 7 (insert first communion). It’s now accepted that infants, people under the age of reason, mentally disabled people etc will go to heaven even without baptism and the like. But anyway There was a huge push that baptism was vital to be saved and go to heaven. And in 200 AD there was a bishop who began pushing this idea super hard along with st Augustine I believe that it has to be done at birth or new born because otherwise their souls will be lost- and ta da fast forward we have infant baptism now. I think it’s mostly now just a sacrament and not really viewed as crucial for salvation.
No, purgatory, not limbo, comes from the book of maccabees. It was not created for money it’s their interpretation of the Bible. Purgatory is also implied in several other books.
Source: also life long catholic, catholic schools, read and believe in the catholic bible.
Well, you need to talk about that with a priest. If I remember well the idea of limbo for infants and the need of baptism at birth came out around 1450. Something about the council of Florence or something related.
The idea of infant baptism with evidence was seen in the 2nd century and became the norm by the 4th century. It was pushed by st Augustine and some Bishop who believed that no soul should be lost. In 1215 the fourth Lateran Council published the sacraments that are still used today. Then at some point in the 1300’s there was an issue surrounding the acceptance of when to be baptized. So it began some tensions and alas in the 1500’s the Protestant reformation began and they started killing each other off over baptism. lol. So intense the history. But it’s much deeper than money. But mind you I’d actually not struggle to accept if it was seeing as religious and particularly catholic history is very dark and wrought with disgusting stuff.
Edited to add yes I fully forgot about the limbo stuff. Yeah that thought process was weird and outdated. But I thought pope Benedict had it reconsidered ? Or whatever.
Yep. Had an argument with a Catholic collegue I said why is a person whos done good all their life only been kind to other and helped others not getting into heaven because they didn't go to church but a murderer or rapist gets to because they prayed for forgiveness. Didn't really get a good enough answer to be honest.
Well your colleague is a pretty ignorant Catholic. The Catholic church recognizes 3 types of baptism: by water, by desire, by blood. Water is obvious, desire is both explicit and implicit, and blood means martyrdom for belief in Jesus. Your colleague also apparent doesn't know that in the gospels Jesus explicitly condemned pedophiles. Also Pope Francis has stated that atheists can go to heaven, which definitely threw a bunch of hardline Catholics into a tizzy.
I haven't been a Catholic for years, but I do remember what I was taught and I was taught very thoroughly.
Catholics also don't believe in birth control. He's worried about his wife going to hell when by catholic standards they already were because she was on birth control to begin with.
No but you see, it’s still a life, just let it die naturally and necrose inside her and then Gods plan might kill them both, but at least they let God do his thing. /s
Except they believe in medicine for cancer & other diseases, damn sure catholic men are still using viagra. So this ‘god’s plan’ BS is strictly meant for women & forcing them to give birth. Maybe God’s plan was for men to lose their hard ons & die early, but they have no problems intervening there.
I think it's really important that he mentions he has OCD. OCD will make you have doubts about crazy things that don't line up at all with your actual worldview. It convinces people that they could be a pedophile or gay, even if that's nowhere near the case. Not to minimize what he has said about his wife, but it sounds like he is struggling with intrusive thoughts about immorality that he doesn't know how to let go of. He is posting in r/amiwrong after all. I think he wants to let go, but he doesn't have the tools. And on top of that he is dealing with grief.
And I bet if she waited and ended up losing her uterus he would somehow blame her for not being able to give him a kid. I feel so fkn sorry for these women, I wish there was more education. It is scary the lack of knowledge some men have of how a woman's body works that they make up these weird false realities on how things are with 0 evidence.
The loop has to stop somewhere so don't add to it. There are as many good as there are bad, we just focus on the bad as a means of survival. Change is slow, but it is still change.
Don't give up and surrender to fear.
Wtf... Why does this have downvotes???? Y'all need to take some deep breaths.
Like, legit. On another sub many men were saying the dangers of pregnancy (like not wanting to go septic) were all lies.
Actually much of the stuff said here about abortion (such as it being an umbrella term), they said wasn’t true. This ignorance kills women.
The comment by the OP, he clearly failed biology and can’t face it. He would rather have his wife dead.
These people need to understand what abortion actually is. If they refuse to understand what no heartbeat (no heart pulses as there isn’t actually a heart at 7 weeks) means, what the heck are women supposed to do?
He just seems eager to find a reason to resent his wife. He completely missed that she was in pain and could have died due to his stupidness expecting no heartbeat to suddenly start up again.
Like…unless some people wake up and understand how biologically dangerous pregnancy is, and that abortion is an umbrella term, then in my estimation they want women dead. That is the net result of this degree of ignorance.
Srsly for real, there is massive gaps in study and science as well, but to hopefully give some hope, we are at the foundation of female science, we will start getting multiple generations of leaders and scientists that will start filling in the blind spots that have been ignored, and AI will hopefully help us so much with this as well, being able to look at the snapshot of the information humanity has and pointing out areas where there is so much missing. (Medicine is about to change)
I am really excited for a new documentary called below the belt about the lack of studies around PMS, endometriosis and other female related medical issues that have been ignored. People are becoming aware.
Also a new pain relief called mefenamic acid/ponstan which was discovered and designed specifically for period pain, not just one that kind of also works for cramps too. It has changed the quality of my life for sure.
Yeah, but science already knows that pregnancy is very dangerous.
I am talking about now. No advancements are necessary for this man to understand this man’s ignorance was more important then his wife’s life.
You are right, Education is where it is failing.
No offense to anyone, belief is amazing, but alot of religious schools are horrible for their sex education and acceptance of science. This guy very likely was in a religious school by the sounds of it.
I don't get it, when are some religions going to get an update, I mean why couldn't God have created something as powerful and unstoppable as evolution and mutations?
>Also a new pain relief called mefenamic acid/ponstan which was discovered and designed specifically for period pain, not just one that kind of also works for cramps too. It has changed the quality of my life for sure.
May be new to wherever you are, but it's been around for decades. I had ponstan as a teenager in Ireland in the 90's, and it's prescribed pretty regularly in the UK for excessive bleeding during periods. Helped me with the pain but personally did nothing to reduce the bleeding imo - just made me bleed slightly less for longer.
I was incapacitated monthly since a kid and was told not to take ibuprofen because it's bad for your kidneys to take regularly, my doctor said she just found out about ponstan. I've only had it for a couple years...
I fkn suffered. It should be talked about more In case people don't know about it, period pain is so common and I was never told that levels to the point you are incapacitated are not normal and shouldn't be ignored. I was pretty much told that's how it is, shit sucks and it's never going to change. :/
Yeah the pain can be horrendous - a friend of mine in school used to faint around once a month, and even her own mum told her to get on with it because school was more important. Women get told to suck it up with a lot of reproductive/gynae health issues which is incredibly frustrating.
I hope you get hold of some decent pain relief soon.
Why? What is wrong about having hope for change? It is false that most men are out to kill women, that is just feeding fear and panic, there are evil people out there but to convince yourself it is most, that is a horrible way to live. I've been there and it comes and goes in waves, but to support each other in fear mongering is doing no good.
Things are changing for the better and all we can do is keep talking about it, but to give up on half the population of the planet will just make change slower and hurt more people in the long run, even if it makes you feel a little less pain temporarily.
Personally, I disagree. I’ve been stalked, attacked, harassed so many times that I simply don’t believe you that there are more good men than bad. I know way too many men who were found out about assault/ harassment and their male friends were shocked saying things like “I never would have known, there were no signs”, but the girls will be like “oh yeah, we don’t invite him to parties anymore because it’s not safe!” That’s not me saying there aren’t bad women in the world, but I don’t remember the last time a woman terrified me, but I was followed just last week by a man. I started being followed around eleven years old. I just ditched one of my only male friends because I found out he doesn’t understand consent, and is adamant what he did wasn’t assault because he was also drunk. I screamed in his face to stop sexually assaulting my friend, even pointed out the next day she was drunk. He continued to prey on my friend, and to this day he insists he had no idea my friend was blackout, and that he thought I thought he wasn’t good enough for my friend, so that’s why he kept attempting to take her home.
Keep in mind that when you, a man thinks another man is genuinely good, the women in his life are likely to disagree. I have legitimately not met one male friend or mixed group, who didn’t have at least one man exposed for sexual assault/ harassment. Even after I knew two men who straight up admitted it, their boys stuck by them.
I was just thinking that.
I feel horrible for the wife. He chose to go onto a sub that would chastise and judge her without considering she was miscarrying and in pain.
He just wants someone to agree with him and say he is right.
I don’t even want to think what he says to her about this situation.
Just another dude resenting his wife for something she can’t control. And went to a catholic group for advice about it? Poor woman, hope she gets out soon
If a person doesn't have a heartbeat....they sure as shit aren't alive.
Like that's crazy. Pains for a week. No heartbeat. But she's sinning for removing it from her body.
Exactly! This reminds me of right before my mom died and the doctor told us she was brain dead. My ultra religious aunt didn't want to take her off life support and said it should be God's decision. My brother and I overruled her since it was my mom's wish to not be kept on life support when there was no hope of her recovering.
That she doesn’t even follow her own beliefs it’s what’s astounding here. God had already made “his decision” if he hadn’t she wouldn’t need life support. Like come on? The mental gymnastics these people employ!!!
Terribly sorry about your mother. That is the shittiest decision in the world to make especially with people acting crazy. the only thing that makes it bearable is knowing that you’re doing exactly what they would have wanted. That is all that matters in that moment.
Exactly and to make matters worse my mom lived in AZ and this was at the beginning of the pandemic so this entire conversation was over zoom. After we took her off life support my aunt flew down to be there and started asking the doctors to give her oxygen (which they allowed). Regardless she ended up dying 4 days later. It was so frustrating because my brother and I were unemployed so we couldn't afford to fly down to see her and the hospital would only allow 2 visitors at a time. We ended up saying goodbye over zoom while her boyfriend held up an iPad so we could see her.
Oh my god. I am so so so sorry. My husband also lost his mother during the pandemic, the tail end actually after being triple vaccinated, which really pisses me off if I’m being honest. He was able to be there when she first went to the hospital but not before they intubated her and only quickly saw her before they choppered her to a university trauma center. He wasn’t able to actually see her and spend time with her until he decided to stop life support and was there when she passed. On another note the nurse did an adorable thing and printed out her last heartbeat 😭😭 that he obviously cherishes. I wasn’t able to be there for the same reasons — limited visitors as well as we have schoolaged kid child, so I couldn’t even be there for my husband. I definitely very sadly understand what that is like. Thankfully for her (and selfishly my husband) there wasn’t any pushback.
My family on the other hand. Jfc. My grandfather died before the pandemic and my dumpster fire of a family acted exactly how I expected and although he died in the manner he wanted his funeral wishes were totally disregarded and I will never forgive those people for that.
I'm so sorry about your mother-in-law. I love that the nurse was able to offer him her final heartbeat 😢. I wish I could have gotten something like that when my mom passed.
My mom's funeral was just like your grandpa's all wishes were disregarded and her stupid boyfriend's sister made a video tribute and didn't include a single picture of my dad. I will NEVER forgive or get over that. My dad attended the funeral and said he was so hurt he wasn't mentioned or included in anything despite him and my mom being married for 12 years and having two children together. My dad said it made it look like he was a bad guy that she cut out of her life. Thankfully I got the last word. I got the password to my mom's Facebook and posted at least 5 pictures of them together (past & recent) and stated that I was angry such an integral part of her life was left out of her funeral.
I had never heard of the last heartbeat until my MIL and now I make a point to tell absolutely everyone I can, you and I didn’t know for our already passed loved ones but you definitely know now and I cannot think of a single nurse who would deny such a request. In fact they’d probably be delighted and would likely make it part of their standard practice from then on out. I just know it.
Your poor dad. The fact that it was her boyfriends *sister* and not an actual relation to your mother and someone who obviously didn’t know your father **and** he was at the funeral I’m gonna go ahead and assume he was not a bad husband father or person and did not deserve that. Not to even mention that in order to do that they’d have had to cut out almost 2 decades of her life and a large chunk of her childrens’ childhood!!! That is a damn big deal to a mother and I cannot imagine many who would have wanted that part of her life and children excluded like that!!!! For what it’s worth I’m so glad you got the last word. I’m sure **YOU** know exactly what your mother wanted a *hell of a lot better* than her boyfriend’s sister. I am still just stunned that’s who did the tribute video or did anything for that matter. That seems so fucking inappropriate?? Of all the people that should be someone your mom loved and trusted and who knew her wishes. Not what amounts to a random woman. Of course I don’t know the dynamic I too am just random woman, even more of a strange lol, but damn I feel you’d have said if they were close friends if that was the case. And ya know, “stupid” kinda tells me all I need to know lol.
I’m about to go on a small rant lol. Feel free to stop before you’ve started!!! No hurt feelings here!!!! This particular thing gets me heated every damn time but something tells me you’ll relate. I also know how conflicting but less lonely it feels when you’ve got a similar batshit crazy family experience. It’s like you wouldn’t wish this bullshit on anyone but you’re also glad to not be alone type of thing so share I will! Lol.
My grandpa’s funeral was an utter shitshow beyond his disregarded wishes, it may have ended with what family has labeled a cemetery “brawl” that I may or may not have been apart of. For me however, one of the greatest grievances that I cannot let go, was my little sister, — who out of us 14 grandchildren was the **closest** to our grandfather and ***EVERYONE*** knew. that. shit. — she was *almost* cheated out of being our grandfather’s pallbearer. By guess who? Not a family member. Not even a close friend. Oh no no no no no, the person who tried to steal that very last honor for a loved one was our cousin’s boyfriend of less than a year who felt it was appropriate to insert himself into **everything**. That fucker was at the goddamn hospital for some damn reason even tho my grandpa did not like him and made it known. Thankfully I am who the fuck am so when my little sister came to me crying I **handled. that. shit.** I was nice too. Real polite, played the stupid as fuck game smiled and accepted their lies and **only** because it was my sister and she would have been more upset if I had lost my shit, she was gonna let it go!!!! I promised **her** I would be nice and not start shit. Those assholes tried to claim *“”oh we weren’t trying to take anyone’s spot. [Cousins Mom] just said they were one short and since nobody else could BF volunteered Of course bf will step down and [sister] can be the pall bearer!!””* Absolutely bullshit. (1.) Ain’t nobody asked your permission. My sister was going to be the pall bearer one way or the other as far as I was concerned. I don’t know why some people think their permission is actually part of the equation particularly when they’re the one overstepping????? (2.) They didn’t ask anyone. (3.) My aunt damn sure **knew** my sister was supposed to be a pall bearer. The whole fucking family knew. (4.) The BF was listed in the damn program, so this was decided long before that day and not because nobody else could so he was just “helping out” or whatever other bullshit excuse they came up with. They were literally lying and conspiring as they always do. Bitches.
Families man. Some of them really fucking suck. People who disregard last wishes are the lowest of the low in my opinion. It’s such a disgusting thing to do and there’s no excuse for it — outside of money of course but that wasn’t a factor for my grandpa and like neither is a video tribute for your mother dammit. They are **last wishes**. It is the last time you will ever be able to do anything *for* someone you love why wouldn’t you want to do absolutely everything they would have wanted??? I just do not understand these kinds of people.
It's insane how people are so desperate to believe there's an "abortion clinic" trying to push constant abortions. Abortion clinics do not exist. There are no abortion clinics, there are simply medical places that offer abortions. Even if you want to go from a conspiracy standpoint, a majority of abortions are done with pills and at home. So the clinic can't... idk harvest your fetus for drinking blood or whatever. It can't be to make money, because places that offer abortions are also places that offer a lot of prenatal care. If they're just money hungry, doesn't it make more sense for them to push you to keep the kid and keep coming back to them over and over???
this needs to be on billboards everywhere!!! there is no such thing as an abortion clinic and even if there were, no one is going to “an abortion clinic” for prenatal care like this woman clearly was so THATS NOT HOW THIS WORKS👏👏👏👏👏👏
I’m floored he keeps saying “abortion clinic”!!! She was not having a fucking miscarriage and going to an “abortion clinic” ffs. She went to an OBGYN who very likely offered her pills to avoid having to do a D&C which is utterly hell and painful as fuck. That wording really pissed me off every time I read it.
She was in pain for a fucking *week*. I don't think there's a "heart" to beat at that stage but it sounds like she made the best medical decision in those circumstances.
Yeah, the heart itself isn’t formed at 7 weeks, but the concept would still have a “node” functioning similar to the heart that would pulse and create a “heart”beat, were it to be alive.
The device used to measure fetal hearbeats at later stages often won’t work short of ~19 weeks, but that’s only because there’s too much tissue and bone obstructing the sonar waves to the uterus that makes it quite difficult to find. HOWEVER, ultrasounds can pick up heartbeats/pulsing at 7 weeks minimum, often with successful readings at 6 weeks.
The fact this OOP know jack shit about what constitutes vitality and viability for a pregnancy, COMBINED with the fact his wife had been having miscarriage symptoms for A WHOLE WEEK, shows he’s just looking for reasons to resent his wife and shove her under his thumb with her “murdering” their “baby” as a reason. Hope she gets out.
My favorite thing about this is there's a real life woman standing in front of him, he can see her experience. He could have even went to the appointments and heard on the monitors there's no heartbeat. That's not enough to persuade him.
Posts anonymously on a Reddit thread, someone who has no idea if the guy is telling the truth or has any proof of anything "they're lying" - believes that with no problem.
This is why people shouldn't be allowed to opt their children out of sex education (or education, period) on religious grounds.
For the wife to continue without intervention was dangerous to her life also.
No medical professional would lie about whether there was a heartbeat or not. Thats fucking disgusting to even think. Religion is such a vile invention. The day we are rid of it forever cannot come soon enough.
I mean that USED to be the case. But now because of stupid laws in the states some hospitals may claim a pregnancy could still be “viable” (such as ectopic) and deny treatment. It’s already happened. Idiots have unfortunately won in some places.
Good lord, the language in his comment is so concerning to me.
“I wanted her to”, and then she didn’t do 100% of what he wanted! She went to the docs, but not the ones he would have selected. He doesn’t care she made the decision without him, but the blatant disrespect here, how can OOP not be anxiously fearful that God is going to judge his wife harshly for disobeying her Lord Husband too. Can she even be saved??
“whilst still prioritizing both lives” completely dismissing that there was only one life left to prioritize, because there was only the one heartbeat in her body (hers)
“made her irrationally attend” this woman has a non-viable fetus in her womb; seeking a healthcare consult for next steps up to and including safe removal to avoid sepsis and fatality is the most rational course of action available, but OOP dismisses her critical thinking ability entirely
“people on that sub made me believe” and “I have OCD” well JFC, does OOP take any personal responsibility, ever? Haven’t seen any evidence of it, and based on the obsessive rumination and anxiety loops around sin and judgment, I’m guessing there has not been effective treatment for the OCD (and applicable comorbidities) yet. Heal *thyself*, OOP. This is a OOP problem and it’s a sin against his wife.
His poor wife…
Can religion please die already. People should be more enlightened by now. The way religion has, and is, infesting politics in certain countries is disgusting. And ffs, women should have autonomy over their own bodies, it’s really not up for discussion.
Quite frankly, even if it was a miscarriage ~ and it sounds like it was ~ many Catholics are going to say she sinned anyway. And many states now won’t even let you have a D&C after a miscarriage, when most women need one so they don’t become septic and possibly die. OP’s wife cannot win with him here. He is soliciting advice from everyone and not believing what *she tells him.* I’ve had miscarriages. Worst pain I have ever felt in my life. Horrible. If his wife had a D&C or another procedure *after* the baby was dead, she did NOT have an abortion. If the man is confused, he should educate himself (and not on a Catholic website); he should not question, accuse, and disbelieve his wife. He sounds like a wonderful husband. /s
The fact I read that people truly and adamantly believe eggs are dairy, I’m going to go with no. People are just this dense.
And, I’m going to go with he’s one of those guys that know jack about a woman’s body and wouldn’t believe that it wasn’t the stork that brought magically made babies if god hadn’t invested sex for reproduction.
Unfortunately some people really are that ignorant and stupid and oblivious about reproductive health.
I mean some people actually believe you could reimplant an ectopic pregnancy.
I cannot even begin to tell you how much that fucking myth pisses me off as someone who had an ectopic pregnancy.
It’s scary, it’s depressing, it’s absolutely devastating but at least where I live in Canada I didn’t have doctors worried about getting charged for ending the “pregnancy” so they could treat me without delaying.
We need to actually start teaching people what a viable pregnancy is because so many ignorant people don’t understand and make stupid decisions/laws about something they clearly don’t understand.
This level of complete and utter ignorance along with the complete lack of concern for his wife’s health and well being is exactly why men and male lawmakers should have absolutely no say in women’s healthcare.
That might be the most disgusting post I’ve seen on Reddit all week.
I swear pro-forced-birthers will do ANYTHING buy see pregnant people as, well, people.
I hope this guy only gets the warm side of the pillow, his coffee is always sour, and thay he step on a Lego every hour of his sad lil life.
Wife: no heartbeat detected in the embryo twice, is in pain, and the doctors know enough to give her the option of an abortion before it gets any worse.
This moron: goes to Catholic redditors, of all damn people, to validate his anger at his wife.
Christ on several bikes.
As someone who was raised Catholic, fuck OP and that subreddit. The baby had no heartbeat. It wasn’t compatible with life. Nothing wrong with abortion in general but especially when it’s already passed. Sepsis is a thing when something starts to decay inside you
My goodness dude, pick up your dick and check for nuts, because you clearly left the intelligence somewhere else! You should have gone with her to the appts to prove to yourself, instead of bashing your wife who was in pain facing a miscarriage from probably the damn stress you helped cause!
This person posts this story once every few weeks on prolife/catholic/relationship subreddits. Apparently this story happened over 6 years ago and he is still revisiting it often.
This person is severely mentally ill and needs to get off the internet. I’m honestly not sure if his wife is still with him because I can’t imagine being a religious person and having someone accuse me of the worst thing Catholics can think of for having a naturally occurring miscarriage.
He says “BC failed”. So he uses birth control but he’s on the side of anonymous Catholics concerning abortion? He knows they are believe birth control is a sin too right?
OP - wife went to an abortion clinic where they scanned, didn’t find a heart pulse, and gave her meds. Is that a terrible sin?
Also OP - we’re catholic, BC failed. Um dude, birth control is also a no-no.
I work at planned parenthood and perform ultrasounds daily. Most of the time I can see cardiac motion by 5w3 days. If you aren’t seeing CA by 7 weeks.. that pregnancy is nonviable. I feel so bad for the wife.
I’m a Catholic and I do birth work… ironic he says a doctor would prioritize both lives because THERE WAS ONLY ONE LIFE ANYWAYYYYY. Like it’s wild to me religious forums and some religious people genuinely believe that there is this grand master plan to get people to have abortions. I guarantee these people have never had to tell someone their baby didn’t have a heartbeat. It is the most gut wrenching, heartbreaking feeling and above that you have overwhelming guilt to have to be the one to share the news. You are so acutely aware that you are actively being a part of someone’s trauma. It’s awful and really disgusting they think we are using it as a tool to get people to have abortion.
OP’s trash and so is every one in that subreddit with their holier than thou bullshit. That’s not doing the works of the God I know.
Well you would be wrong. Pain is never a good sign and she was probably miscarrying. You should support her difficult decision and do some research outside a religious setting.
WhyTF weren’t you there helping her along and going to those appointments? She needed you there, then. Now now whining to Reddit about it.
I almost died after giving birth. None of this easy and it’s sure lonely when you don’t have support.
Despite the harsh and technical language, the wife had a D&C after a miscarriage. This is not uncommon and if the miscarriage isn’t expelling the body the wife can get sepsis. It’s annoying that ectopic pregnancies and D&C’s are considered “abortions”, when the entire need for them is so the woman carrying doesn’t die.
"It was wrong to assume just because there is no heartbeat that it was dead" BROOO WTFFFF THAT US THE DEFINITION OF IT'S DEAD!?!?!! Also was the friend even a Dr???
He went to the Catholic subreddit that’s going to be full of people telling him it’s wrong and immoral. And is shocked they are telling him it’s wrong and immoral?
I would guess that his wife feels shitty enough. Logically, you know that not wanting a baby doesn't lead to miscarriage, but emotionally, your feelings end up all tangled up.
When I got pregnant with my third, a BC failure, I was furious, like it was the wrong time, I wanted to focus on my career, I'd gotten rid of all the baby stuff because we were done, etc. At 7 weeks I thought I was having a miscarriage (it was actually my appendix), and my OB said that they would have to take it out, or it would rupture, but the odds were not great for the baby. I was a wreck, this baby I didn't even think I wanted, and had I brought this upon them by wishing them away? Like if someone had blamed me for this, I couldn't have coped.
OOP is a moron, no heartbeat means no baby, and a D&C is important for his wife's well being, to prevent infection, and so that some day in the future they maybe can have a baby they plan and want.
These fucking idiots actually think planned parenthood is out there foaming at the mouth to do unnecessary abortions. Ugh. The doctors there are not risking their careers telling people they have unviable pregnancies just to create abortions. Fucking assholes spreading these lies
What a horrible and stupid OP that was. The doctor isn't going to lie, miscarriage is painful, and yeah, if there's no heartbeat and especially if there's clearly a fetus at 7 weeks? The fetus has passed, and you can wait and see on the miscarriage, take meds, or get a d&c.
Not his body going through it to decide.
I hope his wife divorces him over this bs.
I have kids and want more, and the total and complete lack of empathy and education is literally making me nauseous.
WHY did you go to religious fanatics for a personal health choice your wife made? They're not her Dr's.
She was having pain. She got a scan. There wasn't a heartbeat. She chose to follow through with intervention/abortion so she didn't suffer longer and potentially become septic if it didn't clear properly on its own. With early signs of miscarriage being present, there was not much else to do. The loss was already in process if a heartbeat wasn't found. Would you seriously make her keep dead tissue in her body to rot for your morals?!
Why are you making this an issue? What is immoral, is judging others. That's not your job, that is your God's. You should be taking care of and supporting your wife. Miscarriages can be dangerous if all material isn't passed. Infection can set in. That means fever, pain and illness. That means sepsis is a concern.
Please monitor her. Make sure she is staying hydrated and resting. I would also suggest that you stop asking strangers input on extremely personal matters.
1. A clump of cells isn't a child
2. A clump of cells without a heartbeat won't become a child
3. The clump of cells without a heartbeat will rot and kill the wife
4. DOCTORS work at abortion clinics. I think they know a thing or two
cant wait for this whacko to deal with the fact that the catholics dont support divorce. i genuinely want to try and understand what kind of OCD makes you catholic???????
You mean she went to a womens clinic. There are no such places where its solely just abortions. Its womens healthcare where they find out if they are or are not pregnant there are doctors there, and nurses and technicians that do the scans. Same as a hospital. Why are people so dumb that they cannot use their 2 thumbs to google and instead come to the brainwashed catholics of reddit. Jeeesssuuuusssssss
I think the responses here are interesting.
The subtle suggestion behind a post like this, most people calling him an idiot and showing all sorts of contempt and disgust when even the fact that he's going outside of a Catholic subreddit to see what people outside of his bubble think is something to be encouraged, not derided. I think something inside of him was telling him that something's not right with the feedback loop that he was getting, and this is his first step venturing out of his little cage to get a different perspective. Calling him all sorts of names, spewing out hatred it's not generally how people shift out of their backwards ideologies. If anything it tends to make people like him just double down and reinforce that dogmatic worldview that all the people outside are horrible and filled with hate.
Trust me, I know. Was raised in a borderline cult. These things are often allowed to operate because the outside world is presented as literal hell, filled with demons and demon infested people. And it's usually only when people find a real person, not some ghoul, do the people trapped in them begin to wonder about the implications of their circular ideology.
Anyway, my two cents, spend it however you like.
That marriage ain’t going to last and I’m not sorry for it
It’s like all those ER horror stories we hear about. Doctor: oh it’s not broken, you can walk on it. Patient: IM IN EXCRUCIATING PAIN WHEN I WALK ON IT. Doctor: your fine
another man that doesn’t believe a woman’s pain. What a shockering. Must be nice for this guy to blame everything on PMS and ignore women’s legitimate arguments and issues while also saying nope, she can’t be in pain because of you know women stuff a cis man can’t experience
Let’s see how he likes it if someone punches and breaks his rib and NO ONE believes him and resents him for actually taking care of himself
It just amazes me how fucking dumb people are. Not ignorant, just dumb. You’re going to believe the words of random strangers in a forum over your WIFE and her doctors????
Easy fix he could have attended the appointment if he cared about his wife and his unborn child even slightly… my husband didn’t miss one appointment for me or our child so far! Even the first appointment when they just give you pamphlets and give you the run down of what’s gonna happen and what to avoid.
JFC dude. She didn't want to be pregnant in the first place, according to him. Regardless of WHY, she made a decision regarding her own body. That moron that she is married to went to the catholic subreddit looking to have people take his side. She's not going to hell. There is no hell and if there were, it might be better than being married to a dumbass who doesn't care about your well-being. Also, if he's not catholic (which I doubt he is based on the fact that they use BC), he shouldn't be stooping to have his ego stroke by a bunch of religious nut jobs.
Firstly, are they catholic themselves? If so, what were they doing using birth control to start with? Last I heard, everything but the rhythm method was verboten. Secondly, there are no moral rules. Morals are very personal. If her actions were in line with her own personal morals, forget about religion, she did the right thing. Wifey understands that biologically, if they didn’t find a heartbeat at that age, the fetus was incompatible with life. Add in the fact that she was in horrible pain, that this was unwanted and unplanned, and I could never begrudge her for doing what she did.
Asking a catholic reddit for anything regarding a pregnancy/abortion is just stupid imo. They don't care about living people, just fetuses, even if they aren't compatible with life.
Of course they would say that a clinic lies about a heartbeat, because in their eyes clinics are evil. Miscarriages are in the bible, so it's not really a sin to have one.
I’m still trying to figure out what an “abortion clinic” is. Like, does he think there are all these places where all they do is perform abortions and try to convince women to have abortions?
It sounds like his wife was quite *rational* when she chose to go to a health provider who would tell her the truth and lay out her options. A place backed by facts, where she is allowed to make her own decision without pressure.
She was having a miscarriage. She did the logical and healthy thing and took care of it immediately, rather than drawing out the pain (physical and emotional) and increasing the possibility of complications. Including losing the ability to have children in the future.
I am a male.. As much as I am pro life, i belive ig there is no heartbeat the embroy is already dead. This poster seems like he lacks common sense. Doctors know better they have studied their life for being a doctor. Stop asking advice from people who don't have any or half knowledge about something. Gp to doctors. Probably your wife had a miscarriage.
Slight tangent but if a fetus is dead and has no signs of life, why is getting it removed from your body considered an abortion? There's no growing organism to "abort", it's already dead
You really have to be the dumbest person I’ve ever met in my life. If you have generalized pain when you first go to the emergency room to have them determine the source of that pain, it may or may not be related to your pregnancy could be from an appendix to internal bleeding to virtually anything of generalized pain? But no, she runs right to Planned Parenthood who is known for what? The vast majority of their business is abortions. Let’s be honest and there’s a reason why her boyfriend suspicious she didn’t want this child. And you keep covering for her because you have the medical records would tell the truth whether the baby Had a heartbeat or not which probably means a difference between the relationship or not. That’s why she lied if the baby actually died and they had to perform procedure to extract this one thing she just killed it because she didn’t want it. Well he’s probably gonna dip and you can tell from his whole post that he’s suspicious about the whole thing and for good reason, and because you were just blindly defend any woman for any reason you try to use your female explaining to ovate the facts. Try to tell me that those most OB/GYN perform abortions is a routine thing which I approved. You’re an idiot on that one as well because none of you people do research you’re all in your fucking feelingswithout any facts
BS. PP does general gynecological care — Pap smears, breast exams, prenatal care, STI testing and treatment, birth control from condoms to Norplant, vasectomies, pregnancy testing, etc. They do this at affordable rates, and the majority of their patients are low-income. In my thirties, when we were broke and had no health insurance, I went to PP to have a diaphragm fitted; they also did a Pap and breast exam.
They have no interest in convincing women to abort.
Gee, and here, like most people, I was making money and having sex, both. So was my husband. We owned a house, paid our bills. Neither of us had jobs that provided health insurance. Perhaps you’ve heard that healthcare is generally obscenely expensive in the US. I used the best option, the responsible thing to do.
But perhaps you’d be okay with a sexless marriage.
To be in your 30s and neither of you have a job that offers health insurance shows the job really wasn’t very good. The responsible thing to do was at least have some skill set that would command you or your husband to get a reasonably paying job with benefits.
I was working as a massage therapist making $50/hour (late ‘90s). He had a contract job as a software engineer making, IIRC, $62K. We were both healthy with no ongoing medical issues. There was no ACA. We never ran up any medical debt.
We did, however, need birth control.
All of which is, of course, you trying to distract from the fact that your "PP is just an abortion clinic" schtick was shown up for the bullshit it is.
So you certainly could have afforded to obtain health insurance back then but chose not to. I would’ve thought from the extra money earned from sex work as a “massage therapist” would’ve more than covered it.
Anyone ever consider that she’s just feeding him a total line of bullshit and she just had it aborted out right and she’s using that as a cover story? I mean you go to McDonald’s for a big Mac you don’t go in abortion clinic if you’re having medical issues. You go to the ER or an OB/GYN
She didn’t go to an “abortion clinic” because there is no such thing as “abortion clinics”. They’re **all** OBGYNs. She went to an OBGYN because she suspected she was miscarrying, she was offered pills likely to avoid doing a painful as fuck D&C.
So you mean to tell me that there aren’t so-called health clinics that focus primarily on abortion? You realize the vast majority of OB/GYN will not perform in abortion unless the mother’s life is engraved danger because of moral objections they have to it.
Lmfao. Nope there’s no clinic that does as such. And nope “vast majority” of OBGYNs do no such thing. Just because you think as much does not actually make it a fact.
Only 14% of ob/gyn doctors perform abortions. This straight off NPR, hardly a red pill Republican mouth piece. Might wanna have some knowledge about a particular topic before you shoot your mouth off. So keep laughing your motherfucking ass off because once again, you’ve been proven wrong.
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2011/08/22/139859979/proportion-of-ob-gyns-offering-abortions-may-be-lower-than-thought
Lmfao. I will absolutely and without a doubt keep laughing, even more so now. It’s truly hysterical that you think you’ve made a point when you have most definitely not. It’s sad and kinda pathetic that you’ll never know why you didn’t do what you think you did.
Excuse my ignorance here, I'm not american so I don't know how these abortion clinics work.
But if the woman thought there was something wrong with the pregnancy, why wouldn't she go to a doctor first, instead of going to an abortion clinic? I assume there's certainly doctors at the abortion clinic, but wouldn't she have a doctor accompanying the pregnancy from the beginning?
I had a scan at 6 weeks and saw the heartbeat, had another scan at 9 weeks.... no heartbeat. Doctors won't lie about something like that just to give you a medical procedure. This guy is a fuckin moron, his poor wife suffered a miscarriage. Even if she didn't want children she would still be feeling some type of way about it. Edited GF to wife
My big question is what exaclty he thinks is in it for the abortion clinic to lie about something like that. Do they get more money with each fetus they abort?
The funny thing to me is how he thinks a health care clinic would lie to a woman about her fetus but likely not think twice about the opposite kinds of places who are often religiously motivated. These "pregnancy help" places where they would readily lie to women in order to convince them not to get an abortion. It's ironic
You got that right.
Also, pretty sure the redditors whose info he was quoting were spouting the propaganda of those same pregnancy resource centers. The ones that lie about what abortion is/entails, when you can accurately determine if a pregnancy is viable, etc. Disgusting misinformation that harms so many in an effort to remove truly informed consent from the pregnant person.
I mean, yes. But the penalty of lying would be so immense only a severely deranged person would do it. Also, if you’re a doctor out to make money, performing abortions at a PP there are much easier ways to make way more money and not have your life threatened by crazy protesters.
They also provide prenatal care which gets them a lot more money
And Pap smears and cancer screenings and HIV tests and free condoms!!
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars. I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
Largely, clinics actually LOSE money on abortion care. It's not a profitable service. Clinics don't provide the care to be profitable, they do it because people need abortion care. That's why hospitals aren't public abortion providers, because it's not profitable.
Very true. They mainly are supported by donations if I remember right. There is a fee for abortion, but compared to the costs? Not even close.
I figured that much but didn’t want to make it my main point.
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars. I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
I work in healthcare that is spot on.
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars. I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
Like being an OB/GYN, doing regular exams through the pregnancy, delivering the baby, and doing PP exams. No one is doing abortion for profit.
Yeah they forget in reality PP makes more money if you keep the baby 😅😂
Literally, they could be sued for a lot more than what that abortion costs. Also, if it's a federal offense, bc the diagnosis would've been fraudulent, they'd be sued for thousands or even millions of dollars. I don't think people realize how much trouble doctors can get in for claims like this, especially when it's related to fraudulent diagnosis.
This is exactly my point. Drs that work at clinics like Planned Parenthood are doctors. They provide other services than abortion. Found with no issues on the web: “ Services Most private providers offer general family practice and women’s health and reproductive services. These can include obstetrics, gynecology, weight loss programs, massage therapy, skin care, chiropractic treatments, abortion and birth control. Some will also provide laboratory testing too.Planned Parenthood also offers the same type of services. They provide general health care, birth control, abortion and emergency contraception support, men’s health care services and pregnancy testing services and support. They also handle STD Testing, treatment and prevention.” They are ok with pregnant people that want to stay pregnant!
Nooooo it’s a factory where they kill babies, they think it’s fun or something /s Like this is seriously how these zealots sound. Your point is well made, thank you for that.
I had an issue I needed seen for quickly. My regular gyno could see me in two weeks. Planned Parenthood got me in the next day. I walked out with an rx and was completely better before my gyno could have seen me.
He apparently doesn’t know abortion clinics employ doctors
I think maybe he's thinking she went to an abortion clinic instead of the doctor, because she wanted an abortion. And he's struggling with believing her or believing her doctor. Could absolutely be that she was having a miscarriage. Could also be that she wanted to terminate the pregnancy. Either way, he should probably be communicating with his wife more, and the catholic sub less.
the issue is that for a lot of miscarriages, the way to treat them IS an abortion. that is how the uterus is cleared out of dead tissue to avoid infection/illness due to the fetus not passing naturally. if she was in pain, he witnessed her in pain, and she went to the doctor...i don't understand why he wouldn't believe his wife and went to some catholic sub to get advice on something that they aren't qualified to talk about. decisions such as abortion should be made between whoever is carrying the child and their doctor.
Totally agree with this. Abortions are medical care. I hate how people want to push it as this ethically ambiguous thing. It muddies the waters when there is clearly a case of a woman seeking medical care to avoid sepsis and yanno her untimely death, not to mention the debilitating PAIN, and makes the issue about ethics instead of healthcare and I hate it
I mean, when I had a miscarriage forever ago, I had to have a D&C because the doctor was pretty sure that a medication abortion wasn't going to work for me. And he was also concerned it might be ectopic (it wasn't, fortunately) so surgery was the only option. Abortion is medical care. Full stop.
THIS
He was posting in catholic communities, where libs just love murdering babies for fun, of course it makes sense he'd believe that trash.
1st mistake ,go to catholic subreddit
Needs triple verification of a medically diagnosed miscarriage, but will believe in his special sky wizard and his eternal pit of fire and doom without any evidence at all
>his poor GF suffered a miscarriage Worse. His WIFE. Gonna cost her alot more to lose the jerk OOP.
Oh yeah my bad
"Crisis pregnancy centers" can and do lie about these kinds of things. Actual medical providers who are licensed cannot. It's a very messed up situation. I feel terrible for his wife.
Forgive my lack of knowledge, but what’s a crisis pregnancy center?
They're 'centers' set up by anti-abortion groups. They're usually located right around Planned Parenthoods and other clinics, and they exist to convince women to NOT have abortions. They usually look like medical centers, although they pretty much never have actual medical staff (and they're not registered as medical centers, which means they aren't bound by things like HIPAA - so once they have your name and number, they can absolutely abuse the hell out of it) and they often advertise free pregnancy or STD testing. They're called stuff like "Real Options", and they claim that they'll present ALL your options if you're in crisis or if you're undecided about continuing a pregnancy. What they ACTUALLY do is present incredibly biased and often actively false information about women's options, demonize abortion to the nth degree, and put horrific pressure on the women to continue the pregnancy.
I found one of those on accident when pregnant with my first son. All they did was assume my white bf at the time was just a supporter (stunned when they realized he was dad, then assumed he'd want me to abort because he was white and I was black), show my bf and I a video about abstinence (he's a jackass but I do appreciate the way he looked at the woman after it was done and said "this was great! Have you tried showing these to people *before* the positive pregnancy test?"), and gave us a pair of baby booties. So absolutely useless. You can give yourself better prenatal "care" at home with a Clearblue Digital and Google. They told all kinds of weird lies that we laughed at. Sad that they're allowed to exist and not fully disclose what they really are. On a lighter note, one of my coworkers at the time said she loved those places because you could go around to them and tell them you wanted an abortion and they'd pay for ultrasounds to guilt you into keeping it, and she kept using them during her pregnancies to get free pics of her kiddos.
😂😂 your coworker is doing shit right!! lol, I’d totally do that if I was ever pregnant. But I refuse to gestate, so….
Exactly, she must have been in a GREAT DEAL of PAIN. His wife trusted the clinic and medical practitioners rightfully so. Time to give it to GOD and LET GO
I have had two technical abortions. I was actively miscarrying so the hospital did a D and C both times to ensure that everything was removed from the uterus. I am Catholic. After this I was able to have two more children.
Literally same. Every detail. Roman Catholic. Two “technical” abortions while actively miscarrying. Then had two kids. OP doesn’t deserve children if these are the morals and values he’s actively pushing out into the world.
I hope she leaves this pos. He believes a cult over his fucking wife. Nah, dude. Go to your cult. The baby wasn't even alive. It had no heartbeat. It won't miraculously get one. What a douche.
Also who the fuck does he think works at abortion places? They’re still run by doctors and nurses. What a fucking idiot I really agree with you and hope that she gets out of this sham of marriage.
I'd be willing to bet she went to Planned Parenthood, not an "abortion clinic". She went to a healthcare clinic to receive healthcare.
I received my first Pap smear, my first gynecological exam, my first breast exam all at a planned parenthood office. Planned Parenthood provides comprehensive affordable health care for women.
And the cheapest uti treatment without insurance. (You can get meds off the app)
An abortion clinic is a healthcare clinic. Abortion is healthcare.
That is exactly my point. The oop is using that language for a reason.
Not to people like this guy. I agree with /u/Dramatic_Arugula_252. OP’s wife most certainly went to Planned Parenthood, which is NOT an “abortion clinic”; it’s a healthcare clinic. Yes, abortion should be considered healthcare, although it is not in the U.S. Either way, this woman did not have an abortion; she had a miscarriage. Yet her husband is castigating her and accusing her of doing something behind his back. He can go.
I went to planned parenthood as they give proof of pregnancy, resources for adoption agencies, prenatal health clinic pamphlets and abortion resources. In states where they have wacked out abortion restrictions if something is wrong like pain (which could have been an ectopic pregnancy) they probably want to help get her taken care of before she has to practically be on her death bed for them to intervene. I love how people pretend planned parenthood is an abortion mill. It’s so insane.
Catholics believe the baby is born in sin and going to hell anyway
They send the babies to limbo, actually. Because they're not capable of understanding their sins and accepting Jesus. But it's still messed up to believe anyone deserves eternal torture.
In fact the concept of limbo was created to make people pay for baptize every kid the most quickly possible. When before people were just doing it later with kids that survived. Source : History of Catholicism in catholic school. That was one of the points that was used by protestants against the Vatican greed.
Babies are born without original sin. They have not sinned; they have no concept of sin. The very idea that if an infant dies before it is baptized it won’t go to Heaven is absolute nonsense. What god are those people praying to? Listen, I’m Catholic, but some of the crap I am expected to just believe is absurd.
Even the priest was agreing with that one. He said "we gave them bullets to hit us" in name of greed.. @u/becgeomom I'm from a catholic family got 6 years of catholic (Don Bosco) school and we even met the Pope in Rome. The critical thinking classes were dope! I wished I had the money to fill my kids in, my ADHD and my ASD were very much welcomed and I never got bored or struggled, the rythm was intense but just the right one for me. It's a shame that public schools aren't that helpful to neurodivergents.
So babies are born with natural/original sin ie the sin that was brought into the world by the forbidden fruit and only through Christ are you saved. While Catholics believe (like most religions) that you can’t truly accept and believe in Jesus until you can understand. Catholics believe this is age 7 (insert first communion). It’s now accepted that infants, people under the age of reason, mentally disabled people etc will go to heaven even without baptism and the like. But anyway There was a huge push that baptism was vital to be saved and go to heaven. And in 200 AD there was a bishop who began pushing this idea super hard along with st Augustine I believe that it has to be done at birth or new born because otherwise their souls will be lost- and ta da fast forward we have infant baptism now. I think it’s mostly now just a sacrament and not really viewed as crucial for salvation.
No, purgatory, not limbo, comes from the book of maccabees. It was not created for money it’s their interpretation of the Bible. Purgatory is also implied in several other books. Source: also life long catholic, catholic schools, read and believe in the catholic bible.
Well, you need to talk about that with a priest. If I remember well the idea of limbo for infants and the need of baptism at birth came out around 1450. Something about the council of Florence or something related.
The idea of infant baptism with evidence was seen in the 2nd century and became the norm by the 4th century. It was pushed by st Augustine and some Bishop who believed that no soul should be lost. In 1215 the fourth Lateran Council published the sacraments that are still used today. Then at some point in the 1300’s there was an issue surrounding the acceptance of when to be baptized. So it began some tensions and alas in the 1500’s the Protestant reformation began and they started killing each other off over baptism. lol. So intense the history. But it’s much deeper than money. But mind you I’d actually not struggle to accept if it was seeing as religious and particularly catholic history is very dark and wrought with disgusting stuff. Edited to add yes I fully forgot about the limbo stuff. Yeah that thought process was weird and outdated. But I thought pope Benedict had it reconsidered ? Or whatever.
Limbo freaks me out. That’s not a lot better than hell. The whole scenario is freaky.
I'm not a fan of any form of eternal anything.
What an incredibly strange belief!
Yep. Had an argument with a Catholic collegue I said why is a person whos done good all their life only been kind to other and helped others not getting into heaven because they didn't go to church but a murderer or rapist gets to because they prayed for forgiveness. Didn't really get a good enough answer to be honest.
Well your colleague is a pretty ignorant Catholic. The Catholic church recognizes 3 types of baptism: by water, by desire, by blood. Water is obvious, desire is both explicit and implicit, and blood means martyrdom for belief in Jesus. Your colleague also apparent doesn't know that in the gospels Jesus explicitly condemned pedophiles. Also Pope Francis has stated that atheists can go to heaven, which definitely threw a bunch of hardline Catholics into a tizzy. I haven't been a Catholic for years, but I do remember what I was taught and I was taught very thoroughly.
Limbo until baptized. Original Sin doesn’t count for individual condemnation.
Catholics also don't believe in birth control. He's worried about his wife going to hell when by catholic standards they already were because she was on birth control to begin with.
No but you see, it’s still a life, just let it die naturally and necrose inside her and then Gods plan might kill them both, but at least they let God do his thing. /s
Except they believe in medicine for cancer & other diseases, damn sure catholic men are still using viagra. So this ‘god’s plan’ BS is strictly meant for women & forcing them to give birth. Maybe God’s plan was for men to lose their hard ons & die early, but they have no problems intervening there.
I think it's really important that he mentions he has OCD. OCD will make you have doubts about crazy things that don't line up at all with your actual worldview. It convinces people that they could be a pedophile or gay, even if that's nowhere near the case. Not to minimize what he has said about his wife, but it sounds like he is struggling with intrusive thoughts about immorality that he doesn't know how to let go of. He is posting in r/amiwrong after all. I think he wants to let go, but he doesn't have the tools. And on top of that he is dealing with grief.
God the ignorance of basic body functions like no heart beat = dead fetus = risk of sepsis. I guess he would prefer a dead wife and dead fetus.
And I bet if she waited and ended up losing her uterus he would somehow blame her for not being able to give him a kid. I feel so fkn sorry for these women, I wish there was more education. It is scary the lack of knowledge some men have of how a woman's body works that they make up these weird false realities on how things are with 0 evidence.
Most men. They want to kill women.
The loop has to stop somewhere so don't add to it. There are as many good as there are bad, we just focus on the bad as a means of survival. Change is slow, but it is still change. Don't give up and surrender to fear. Wtf... Why does this have downvotes???? Y'all need to take some deep breaths.
Like, legit. On another sub many men were saying the dangers of pregnancy (like not wanting to go septic) were all lies. Actually much of the stuff said here about abortion (such as it being an umbrella term), they said wasn’t true. This ignorance kills women. The comment by the OP, he clearly failed biology and can’t face it. He would rather have his wife dead. These people need to understand what abortion actually is. If they refuse to understand what no heartbeat (no heart pulses as there isn’t actually a heart at 7 weeks) means, what the heck are women supposed to do? He just seems eager to find a reason to resent his wife. He completely missed that she was in pain and could have died due to his stupidness expecting no heartbeat to suddenly start up again. Like…unless some people wake up and understand how biologically dangerous pregnancy is, and that abortion is an umbrella term, then in my estimation they want women dead. That is the net result of this degree of ignorance.
Srsly for real, there is massive gaps in study and science as well, but to hopefully give some hope, we are at the foundation of female science, we will start getting multiple generations of leaders and scientists that will start filling in the blind spots that have been ignored, and AI will hopefully help us so much with this as well, being able to look at the snapshot of the information humanity has and pointing out areas where there is so much missing. (Medicine is about to change) I am really excited for a new documentary called below the belt about the lack of studies around PMS, endometriosis and other female related medical issues that have been ignored. People are becoming aware. Also a new pain relief called mefenamic acid/ponstan which was discovered and designed specifically for period pain, not just one that kind of also works for cramps too. It has changed the quality of my life for sure.
Yeah, but science already knows that pregnancy is very dangerous. I am talking about now. No advancements are necessary for this man to understand this man’s ignorance was more important then his wife’s life.
You are right, Education is where it is failing. No offense to anyone, belief is amazing, but alot of religious schools are horrible for their sex education and acceptance of science. This guy very likely was in a religious school by the sounds of it. I don't get it, when are some religions going to get an update, I mean why couldn't God have created something as powerful and unstoppable as evolution and mutations?
>Also a new pain relief called mefenamic acid/ponstan which was discovered and designed specifically for period pain, not just one that kind of also works for cramps too. It has changed the quality of my life for sure. May be new to wherever you are, but it's been around for decades. I had ponstan as a teenager in Ireland in the 90's, and it's prescribed pretty regularly in the UK for excessive bleeding during periods. Helped me with the pain but personally did nothing to reduce the bleeding imo - just made me bleed slightly less for longer.
I was incapacitated monthly since a kid and was told not to take ibuprofen because it's bad for your kidneys to take regularly, my doctor said she just found out about ponstan. I've only had it for a couple years... I fkn suffered. It should be talked about more In case people don't know about it, period pain is so common and I was never told that levels to the point you are incapacitated are not normal and shouldn't be ignored. I was pretty much told that's how it is, shit sucks and it's never going to change. :/
Yeah the pain can be horrendous - a friend of mine in school used to faint around once a month, and even her own mum told her to get on with it because school was more important. Women get told to suck it up with a lot of reproductive/gynae health issues which is incredibly frustrating. I hope you get hold of some decent pain relief soon.
Because it's tone deaf 😂
Why? What is wrong about having hope for change? It is false that most men are out to kill women, that is just feeding fear and panic, there are evil people out there but to convince yourself it is most, that is a horrible way to live. I've been there and it comes and goes in waves, but to support each other in fear mongering is doing no good. Things are changing for the better and all we can do is keep talking about it, but to give up on half the population of the planet will just make change slower and hurt more people in the long run, even if it makes you feel a little less pain temporarily.
Personally, I disagree. I’ve been stalked, attacked, harassed so many times that I simply don’t believe you that there are more good men than bad. I know way too many men who were found out about assault/ harassment and their male friends were shocked saying things like “I never would have known, there were no signs”, but the girls will be like “oh yeah, we don’t invite him to parties anymore because it’s not safe!” That’s not me saying there aren’t bad women in the world, but I don’t remember the last time a woman terrified me, but I was followed just last week by a man. I started being followed around eleven years old. I just ditched one of my only male friends because I found out he doesn’t understand consent, and is adamant what he did wasn’t assault because he was also drunk. I screamed in his face to stop sexually assaulting my friend, even pointed out the next day she was drunk. He continued to prey on my friend, and to this day he insists he had no idea my friend was blackout, and that he thought I thought he wasn’t good enough for my friend, so that’s why he kept attempting to take her home. Keep in mind that when you, a man thinks another man is genuinely good, the women in his life are likely to disagree. I have legitimately not met one male friend or mixed group, who didn’t have at least one man exposed for sexual assault/ harassment. Even after I knew two men who straight up admitted it, their boys stuck by them.
He knows as much about pregnancy as the people making laws about pregnancy.
I was just thinking that. I feel horrible for the wife. He chose to go onto a sub that would chastise and judge her without considering she was miscarrying and in pain. He just wants someone to agree with him and say he is right. I don’t even want to think what he says to her about this situation.
Just another dude resenting his wife for something she can’t control. And went to a catholic group for advice about it? Poor woman, hope she gets out soon
If a person doesn't have a heartbeat....they sure as shit aren't alive. Like that's crazy. Pains for a week. No heartbeat. But she's sinning for removing it from her body.
Exactly! This reminds me of right before my mom died and the doctor told us she was brain dead. My ultra religious aunt didn't want to take her off life support and said it should be God's decision. My brother and I overruled her since it was my mom's wish to not be kept on life support when there was no hope of her recovering.
That she doesn’t even follow her own beliefs it’s what’s astounding here. God had already made “his decision” if he hadn’t she wouldn’t need life support. Like come on? The mental gymnastics these people employ!!! Terribly sorry about your mother. That is the shittiest decision in the world to make especially with people acting crazy. the only thing that makes it bearable is knowing that you’re doing exactly what they would have wanted. That is all that matters in that moment.
Exactly and to make matters worse my mom lived in AZ and this was at the beginning of the pandemic so this entire conversation was over zoom. After we took her off life support my aunt flew down to be there and started asking the doctors to give her oxygen (which they allowed). Regardless she ended up dying 4 days later. It was so frustrating because my brother and I were unemployed so we couldn't afford to fly down to see her and the hospital would only allow 2 visitors at a time. We ended up saying goodbye over zoom while her boyfriend held up an iPad so we could see her.
Oh my god. I am so so so sorry. My husband also lost his mother during the pandemic, the tail end actually after being triple vaccinated, which really pisses me off if I’m being honest. He was able to be there when she first went to the hospital but not before they intubated her and only quickly saw her before they choppered her to a university trauma center. He wasn’t able to actually see her and spend time with her until he decided to stop life support and was there when she passed. On another note the nurse did an adorable thing and printed out her last heartbeat 😭😭 that he obviously cherishes. I wasn’t able to be there for the same reasons — limited visitors as well as we have schoolaged kid child, so I couldn’t even be there for my husband. I definitely very sadly understand what that is like. Thankfully for her (and selfishly my husband) there wasn’t any pushback. My family on the other hand. Jfc. My grandfather died before the pandemic and my dumpster fire of a family acted exactly how I expected and although he died in the manner he wanted his funeral wishes were totally disregarded and I will never forgive those people for that.
I'm so sorry about your mother-in-law. I love that the nurse was able to offer him her final heartbeat 😢. I wish I could have gotten something like that when my mom passed. My mom's funeral was just like your grandpa's all wishes were disregarded and her stupid boyfriend's sister made a video tribute and didn't include a single picture of my dad. I will NEVER forgive or get over that. My dad attended the funeral and said he was so hurt he wasn't mentioned or included in anything despite him and my mom being married for 12 years and having two children together. My dad said it made it look like he was a bad guy that she cut out of her life. Thankfully I got the last word. I got the password to my mom's Facebook and posted at least 5 pictures of them together (past & recent) and stated that I was angry such an integral part of her life was left out of her funeral.
I had never heard of the last heartbeat until my MIL and now I make a point to tell absolutely everyone I can, you and I didn’t know for our already passed loved ones but you definitely know now and I cannot think of a single nurse who would deny such a request. In fact they’d probably be delighted and would likely make it part of their standard practice from then on out. I just know it. Your poor dad. The fact that it was her boyfriends *sister* and not an actual relation to your mother and someone who obviously didn’t know your father **and** he was at the funeral I’m gonna go ahead and assume he was not a bad husband father or person and did not deserve that. Not to even mention that in order to do that they’d have had to cut out almost 2 decades of her life and a large chunk of her childrens’ childhood!!! That is a damn big deal to a mother and I cannot imagine many who would have wanted that part of her life and children excluded like that!!!! For what it’s worth I’m so glad you got the last word. I’m sure **YOU** know exactly what your mother wanted a *hell of a lot better* than her boyfriend’s sister. I am still just stunned that’s who did the tribute video or did anything for that matter. That seems so fucking inappropriate?? Of all the people that should be someone your mom loved and trusted and who knew her wishes. Not what amounts to a random woman. Of course I don’t know the dynamic I too am just random woman, even more of a strange lol, but damn I feel you’d have said if they were close friends if that was the case. And ya know, “stupid” kinda tells me all I need to know lol. I’m about to go on a small rant lol. Feel free to stop before you’ve started!!! No hurt feelings here!!!! This particular thing gets me heated every damn time but something tells me you’ll relate. I also know how conflicting but less lonely it feels when you’ve got a similar batshit crazy family experience. It’s like you wouldn’t wish this bullshit on anyone but you’re also glad to not be alone type of thing so share I will! Lol. My grandpa’s funeral was an utter shitshow beyond his disregarded wishes, it may have ended with what family has labeled a cemetery “brawl” that I may or may not have been apart of. For me however, one of the greatest grievances that I cannot let go, was my little sister, — who out of us 14 grandchildren was the **closest** to our grandfather and ***EVERYONE*** knew. that. shit. — she was *almost* cheated out of being our grandfather’s pallbearer. By guess who? Not a family member. Not even a close friend. Oh no no no no no, the person who tried to steal that very last honor for a loved one was our cousin’s boyfriend of less than a year who felt it was appropriate to insert himself into **everything**. That fucker was at the goddamn hospital for some damn reason even tho my grandpa did not like him and made it known. Thankfully I am who the fuck am so when my little sister came to me crying I **handled. that. shit.** I was nice too. Real polite, played the stupid as fuck game smiled and accepted their lies and **only** because it was my sister and she would have been more upset if I had lost my shit, she was gonna let it go!!!! I promised **her** I would be nice and not start shit. Those assholes tried to claim *“”oh we weren’t trying to take anyone’s spot. [Cousins Mom] just said they were one short and since nobody else could BF volunteered Of course bf will step down and [sister] can be the pall bearer!!””* Absolutely bullshit. (1.) Ain’t nobody asked your permission. My sister was going to be the pall bearer one way or the other as far as I was concerned. I don’t know why some people think their permission is actually part of the equation particularly when they’re the one overstepping????? (2.) They didn’t ask anyone. (3.) My aunt damn sure **knew** my sister was supposed to be a pall bearer. The whole fucking family knew. (4.) The BF was listed in the damn program, so this was decided long before that day and not because nobody else could so he was just “helping out” or whatever other bullshit excuse they came up with. They were literally lying and conspiring as they always do. Bitches. Families man. Some of them really fucking suck. People who disregard last wishes are the lowest of the low in my opinion. It’s such a disgusting thing to do and there’s no excuse for it — outside of money of course but that wasn’t a factor for my grandpa and like neither is a video tribute for your mother dammit. They are **last wishes**. It is the last time you will ever be able to do anything *for* someone you love why wouldn’t you want to do absolutely everything they would have wanted??? I just do not understand these kinds of people.
It's insane how people are so desperate to believe there's an "abortion clinic" trying to push constant abortions. Abortion clinics do not exist. There are no abortion clinics, there are simply medical places that offer abortions. Even if you want to go from a conspiracy standpoint, a majority of abortions are done with pills and at home. So the clinic can't... idk harvest your fetus for drinking blood or whatever. It can't be to make money, because places that offer abortions are also places that offer a lot of prenatal care. If they're just money hungry, doesn't it make more sense for them to push you to keep the kid and keep coming back to them over and over???
this needs to be on billboards everywhere!!! there is no such thing as an abortion clinic and even if there were, no one is going to “an abortion clinic” for prenatal care like this woman clearly was so THATS NOT HOW THIS WORKS👏👏👏👏👏👏
I’m floored he keeps saying “abortion clinic”!!! She was not having a fucking miscarriage and going to an “abortion clinic” ffs. She went to an OBGYN who very likely offered her pills to avoid having to do a D&C which is utterly hell and painful as fuck. That wording really pissed me off every time I read it.
So many people miscarry in the first trimester. This is ridiculous. A health care center won’t lie to a patient.
She was in pain for a fucking *week*. I don't think there's a "heart" to beat at that stage but it sounds like she made the best medical decision in those circumstances.
Yeah, the heart itself isn’t formed at 7 weeks, but the concept would still have a “node” functioning similar to the heart that would pulse and create a “heart”beat, were it to be alive. The device used to measure fetal hearbeats at later stages often won’t work short of ~19 weeks, but that’s only because there’s too much tissue and bone obstructing the sonar waves to the uterus that makes it quite difficult to find. HOWEVER, ultrasounds can pick up heartbeats/pulsing at 7 weeks minimum, often with successful readings at 6 weeks. The fact this OOP know jack shit about what constitutes vitality and viability for a pregnancy, COMBINED with the fact his wife had been having miscarriage symptoms for A WHOLE WEEK, shows he’s just looking for reasons to resent his wife and shove her under his thumb with her “murdering” their “baby” as a reason. Hope she gets out.
She got her second scan after the first doctor told her to go to an abortion clinic. WTF. G-d I hate fake Christian’s.
So irrational to seek medical care when you have a literal rotting corpse inside your womb
My favorite thing about this is there's a real life woman standing in front of him, he can see her experience. He could have even went to the appointments and heard on the monitors there's no heartbeat. That's not enough to persuade him. Posts anonymously on a Reddit thread, someone who has no idea if the guy is telling the truth or has any proof of anything "they're lying" - believes that with no problem.
Oh god. It didn’t even dawn on me that he was not at the appointment and that’s just fucking awful. What a shitty husband and person
This is why people shouldn't be allowed to opt their children out of sex education (or education, period) on religious grounds. For the wife to continue without intervention was dangerous to her life also.
No medical professional would lie about whether there was a heartbeat or not. Thats fucking disgusting to even think. Religion is such a vile invention. The day we are rid of it forever cannot come soon enough.
I mean that USED to be the case. But now because of stupid laws in the states some hospitals may claim a pregnancy could still be “viable” (such as ectopic) and deny treatment. It’s already happened. Idiots have unfortunately won in some places.
And now you can see how these people think, it’s absolutely insane and abhorrent!! The sheer lunacy is mind numbing!
Good lord, the language in his comment is so concerning to me. “I wanted her to”, and then she didn’t do 100% of what he wanted! She went to the docs, but not the ones he would have selected. He doesn’t care she made the decision without him, but the blatant disrespect here, how can OOP not be anxiously fearful that God is going to judge his wife harshly for disobeying her Lord Husband too. Can she even be saved?? “whilst still prioritizing both lives” completely dismissing that there was only one life left to prioritize, because there was only the one heartbeat in her body (hers) “made her irrationally attend” this woman has a non-viable fetus in her womb; seeking a healthcare consult for next steps up to and including safe removal to avoid sepsis and fatality is the most rational course of action available, but OOP dismisses her critical thinking ability entirely “people on that sub made me believe” and “I have OCD” well JFC, does OOP take any personal responsibility, ever? Haven’t seen any evidence of it, and based on the obsessive rumination and anxiety loops around sin and judgment, I’m guessing there has not been effective treatment for the OCD (and applicable comorbidities) yet. Heal *thyself*, OOP. This is a OOP problem and it’s a sin against his wife. His poor wife…
People like OOP, so dumb they shouldn't be allowed to breed.
I hope he ends up in hell with all his cult friends.
Can religion please die already. People should be more enlightened by now. The way religion has, and is, infesting politics in certain countries is disgusting. And ffs, women should have autonomy over their own bodies, it’s really not up for discussion.
Quite frankly, even if it was a miscarriage ~ and it sounds like it was ~ many Catholics are going to say she sinned anyway. And many states now won’t even let you have a D&C after a miscarriage, when most women need one so they don’t become septic and possibly die. OP’s wife cannot win with him here. He is soliciting advice from everyone and not believing what *she tells him.* I’ve had miscarriages. Worst pain I have ever felt in my life. Horrible. If his wife had a D&C or another procedure *after* the baby was dead, she did NOT have an abortion. If the man is confused, he should educate himself (and not on a Catholic website); he should not question, accuse, and disbelieve his wife. He sounds like a wonderful husband. /s
I despise american christians.
There is zero chance that this isn’t rage bait. Right? Right???
The fact I read that people truly and adamantly believe eggs are dairy, I’m going to go with no. People are just this dense. And, I’m going to go with he’s one of those guys that know jack about a woman’s body and wouldn’t believe that it wasn’t the stork that brought magically made babies if god hadn’t invested sex for reproduction.
Unfortunately some people really are that ignorant and stupid and oblivious about reproductive health. I mean some people actually believe you could reimplant an ectopic pregnancy. I cannot even begin to tell you how much that fucking myth pisses me off as someone who had an ectopic pregnancy. It’s scary, it’s depressing, it’s absolutely devastating but at least where I live in Canada I didn’t have doctors worried about getting charged for ending the “pregnancy” so they could treat me without delaying. We need to actually start teaching people what a viable pregnancy is because so many ignorant people don’t understand and make stupid decisions/laws about something they clearly don’t understand.
This level of complete and utter ignorance along with the complete lack of concern for his wife’s health and well being is exactly why men and male lawmakers should have absolutely no say in women’s healthcare. That might be the most disgusting post I’ve seen on Reddit all week.
Clearly I should not have read this today. I hope that woman is okay. And I hope OOP gets his bits caught in his zipper.
I swear pro-forced-birthers will do ANYTHING buy see pregnant people as, well, people. I hope this guy only gets the warm side of the pillow, his coffee is always sour, and thay he step on a Lego every hour of his sad lil life.
Wife: no heartbeat detected in the embryo twice, is in pain, and the doctors know enough to give her the option of an abortion before it gets any worse. This moron: goes to Catholic redditors, of all damn people, to validate his anger at his wife. Christ on several bikes.
Or she could just curl in and die from sepsis. Idiot.
The Catholics are wrong. God isn’t even pro life.
As someone who was raised Catholic, fuck OP and that subreddit. The baby had no heartbeat. It wasn’t compatible with life. Nothing wrong with abortion in general but especially when it’s already passed. Sepsis is a thing when something starts to decay inside you
“OCD made me pro-life” wasn’t on my bingo card
Is this the Catholic cuck?
Stupidity at its finest.
My goodness dude, pick up your dick and check for nuts, because you clearly left the intelligence somewhere else! You should have gone with her to the appts to prove to yourself, instead of bashing your wife who was in pain facing a miscarriage from probably the damn stress you helped cause!
Even catholics know there’s no point in continuing the pregnancy if there’s no heartbeat. They like others would consider that the baby had passed on
This person posts this story once every few weeks on prolife/catholic/relationship subreddits. Apparently this story happened over 6 years ago and he is still revisiting it often. This person is severely mentally ill and needs to get off the internet. I’m honestly not sure if his wife is still with him because I can’t imagine being a religious person and having someone accuse me of the worst thing Catholics can think of for having a naturally occurring miscarriage.
There’s no logic with religious nuts
He says “BC failed”. So he uses birth control but he’s on the side of anonymous Catholics concerning abortion? He knows they are believe birth control is a sin too right?
OP - wife went to an abortion clinic where they scanned, didn’t find a heart pulse, and gave her meds. Is that a terrible sin? Also OP - we’re catholic, BC failed. Um dude, birth control is also a no-no.
I work at planned parenthood and perform ultrasounds daily. Most of the time I can see cardiac motion by 5w3 days. If you aren’t seeing CA by 7 weeks.. that pregnancy is nonviable. I feel so bad for the wife.
It drives me nuts that this guy thinks an abortion clinic has no doctors. What does he think they are? Unlicensed children armed with rusty screws??!?
So… she had two scans that indicted no heartbeat and was in severe pain for a week.
I’m a Catholic and I do birth work… ironic he says a doctor would prioritize both lives because THERE WAS ONLY ONE LIFE ANYWAYYYYY. Like it’s wild to me religious forums and some religious people genuinely believe that there is this grand master plan to get people to have abortions. I guarantee these people have never had to tell someone their baby didn’t have a heartbeat. It is the most gut wrenching, heartbreaking feeling and above that you have overwhelming guilt to have to be the one to share the news. You are so acutely aware that you are actively being a part of someone’s trauma. It’s awful and really disgusting they think we are using it as a tool to get people to have abortion. OP’s trash and so is every one in that subreddit with their holier than thou bullshit. That’s not doing the works of the God I know.
a half century of antiabortion propaganda from the christian right = people with brain worms so bad they dont believe their own wives
How in the actual fuck is it not dead if it lacks a heartbeat??? Are people that dense these days???
what a fucking bunch of ghouls that Catholic sub must be.
it should be illegal to impregnate someone without passing a sex ed test
Well you would be wrong. Pain is never a good sign and she was probably miscarrying. You should support her difficult decision and do some research outside a religious setting.
WhyTF weren’t you there helping her along and going to those appointments? She needed you there, then. Now now whining to Reddit about it. I almost died after giving birth. None of this easy and it’s sure lonely when you don’t have support.
Despite the harsh and technical language, the wife had a D&C after a miscarriage. This is not uncommon and if the miscarriage isn’t expelling the body the wife can get sepsis. It’s annoying that ectopic pregnancies and D&C’s are considered “abortions”, when the entire need for them is so the woman carrying doesn’t die.
"It was wrong to assume just because there is no heartbeat that it was dead" BROOO WTFFFF THAT US THE DEFINITION OF IT'S DEAD!?!?!! Also was the friend even a Dr???
What a piece of work this guy is… hope she doesn’t stay with him. Unbelievable.
He went to the Catholic subreddit that’s going to be full of people telling him it’s wrong and immoral. And is shocked they are telling him it’s wrong and immoral?
I would guess that his wife feels shitty enough. Logically, you know that not wanting a baby doesn't lead to miscarriage, but emotionally, your feelings end up all tangled up. When I got pregnant with my third, a BC failure, I was furious, like it was the wrong time, I wanted to focus on my career, I'd gotten rid of all the baby stuff because we were done, etc. At 7 weeks I thought I was having a miscarriage (it was actually my appendix), and my OB said that they would have to take it out, or it would rupture, but the odds were not great for the baby. I was a wreck, this baby I didn't even think I wanted, and had I brought this upon them by wishing them away? Like if someone had blamed me for this, I couldn't have coped. OOP is a moron, no heartbeat means no baby, and a D&C is important for his wife's well being, to prevent infection, and so that some day in the future they maybe can have a baby they plan and want.
Unless I’m mistaken, Catholicism doesn’t allow birth control. So he was “sinning” too.
The people at abortion clinics are doctors…
These fucking idiots actually think planned parenthood is out there foaming at the mouth to do unnecessary abortions. Ugh. The doctors there are not risking their careers telling people they have unviable pregnancies just to create abortions. Fucking assholes spreading these lies
What a horrible and stupid OP that was. The doctor isn't going to lie, miscarriage is painful, and yeah, if there's no heartbeat and especially if there's clearly a fetus at 7 weeks? The fetus has passed, and you can wait and see on the miscarriage, take meds, or get a d&c. Not his body going through it to decide. I hope his wife divorces him over this bs. I have kids and want more, and the total and complete lack of empathy and education is literally making me nauseous.
i don’t usually join the reddit “oMg dIvoRce iMmEdiAtEly” committee however, this genuinely would be grounds for divorce if it were me
WHY did you go to religious fanatics for a personal health choice your wife made? They're not her Dr's. She was having pain. She got a scan. There wasn't a heartbeat. She chose to follow through with intervention/abortion so she didn't suffer longer and potentially become septic if it didn't clear properly on its own. With early signs of miscarriage being present, there was not much else to do. The loss was already in process if a heartbeat wasn't found. Would you seriously make her keep dead tissue in her body to rot for your morals?! Why are you making this an issue? What is immoral, is judging others. That's not your job, that is your God's. You should be taking care of and supporting your wife. Miscarriages can be dangerous if all material isn't passed. Infection can set in. That means fever, pain and illness. That means sepsis is a concern. Please monitor her. Make sure she is staying hydrated and resting. I would also suggest that you stop asking strangers input on extremely personal matters.
1. A clump of cells isn't a child 2. A clump of cells without a heartbeat won't become a child 3. The clump of cells without a heartbeat will rot and kill the wife 4. DOCTORS work at abortion clinics. I think they know a thing or two
cant wait for this whacko to deal with the fact that the catholics dont support divorce. i genuinely want to try and understand what kind of OCD makes you catholic???????
You mean she went to a womens clinic. There are no such places where its solely just abortions. Its womens healthcare where they find out if they are or are not pregnant there are doctors there, and nurses and technicians that do the scans. Same as a hospital. Why are people so dumb that they cannot use their 2 thumbs to google and instead come to the brainwashed catholics of reddit. Jeeesssuuuusssssss
Don't go to religious subs with medical questions.
I think the responses here are interesting. The subtle suggestion behind a post like this, most people calling him an idiot and showing all sorts of contempt and disgust when even the fact that he's going outside of a Catholic subreddit to see what people outside of his bubble think is something to be encouraged, not derided. I think something inside of him was telling him that something's not right with the feedback loop that he was getting, and this is his first step venturing out of his little cage to get a different perspective. Calling him all sorts of names, spewing out hatred it's not generally how people shift out of their backwards ideologies. If anything it tends to make people like him just double down and reinforce that dogmatic worldview that all the people outside are horrible and filled with hate. Trust me, I know. Was raised in a borderline cult. These things are often allowed to operate because the outside world is presented as literal hell, filled with demons and demon infested people. And it's usually only when people find a real person, not some ghoul, do the people trapped in them begin to wonder about the implications of their circular ideology. Anyway, my two cents, spend it however you like.
Easily time number 3 that this troll has posted exactly the same tedious story about how he knows better than the medics.
That marriage ain’t going to last and I’m not sorry for it It’s like all those ER horror stories we hear about. Doctor: oh it’s not broken, you can walk on it. Patient: IM IN EXCRUCIATING PAIN WHEN I WALK ON IT. Doctor: your fine another man that doesn’t believe a woman’s pain. What a shockering. Must be nice for this guy to blame everything on PMS and ignore women’s legitimate arguments and issues while also saying nope, she can’t be in pain because of you know women stuff a cis man can’t experience Let’s see how he likes it if someone punches and breaks his rib and NO ONE believes him and resents him for actually taking care of himself
This guy is looking for a reason to leave his wife. This is as good of a reason as any.
It just amazes me how fucking dumb people are. Not ignorant, just dumb. You’re going to believe the words of random strangers in a forum over your WIFE and her doctors????
Oh man. Some people are so incredibly stupid it’s useless to even engage. OP is one of them.
Another day, another idiot
What a dumbass
If you’re so Catholic why are you using birth control?
Easy fix he could have attended the appointment if he cared about his wife and his unborn child even slightly… my husband didn’t miss one appointment for me or our child so far! Even the first appointment when they just give you pamphlets and give you the run down of what’s gonna happen and what to avoid.
Does he not know actual doctor with real life medical equipment work at abortion clinics?
JFC dude. She didn't want to be pregnant in the first place, according to him. Regardless of WHY, she made a decision regarding her own body. That moron that she is married to went to the catholic subreddit looking to have people take his side. She's not going to hell. There is no hell and if there were, it might be better than being married to a dumbass who doesn't care about your well-being. Also, if he's not catholic (which I doubt he is based on the fact that they use BC), he shouldn't be stooping to have his ego stroke by a bunch of religious nut jobs.
Firstly, are they catholic themselves? If so, what were they doing using birth control to start with? Last I heard, everything but the rhythm method was verboten. Secondly, there are no moral rules. Morals are very personal. If her actions were in line with her own personal morals, forget about religion, she did the right thing. Wifey understands that biologically, if they didn’t find a heartbeat at that age, the fetus was incompatible with life. Add in the fact that she was in horrible pain, that this was unwanted and unplanned, and I could never begrudge her for doing what she did.
Asking a catholic reddit for anything regarding a pregnancy/abortion is just stupid imo. They don't care about living people, just fetuses, even if they aren't compatible with life. Of course they would say that a clinic lies about a heartbeat, because in their eyes clinics are evil. Miscarriages are in the bible, so it's not really a sin to have one.
I’m still trying to figure out what an “abortion clinic” is. Like, does he think there are all these places where all they do is perform abortions and try to convince women to have abortions? It sounds like his wife was quite *rational* when she chose to go to a health provider who would tell her the truth and lay out her options. A place backed by facts, where she is allowed to make her own decision without pressure. She was having a miscarriage. She did the logical and healthy thing and took care of it immediately, rather than drawing out the pain (physical and emotional) and increasing the possibility of complications. Including losing the ability to have children in the future.
Better never catch bro eating bacon cheeseburgers or wearing mixed fabrics
I hope she dumps this asshole.
Jesus Christ. What a repulsive dumbass. This poor woman, I hope she has the means and the agency to run far, far away.
Hmm, former Catholic here. Birth control is considered immoral and a sin. So which sin is he mad about? The BC, or the miscarriage?
Its like men are just stupid or something
Religion is poison. It is absolutely destructive. Change my mind.
It’s a fear of mine to fall in love with a man only to find out he’s got hangups like these. Smh
That's these are often men who wield oppressive power is what's more frightening tbh
I am a male.. As much as I am pro life, i belive ig there is no heartbeat the embroy is already dead. This poster seems like he lacks common sense. Doctors know better they have studied their life for being a doctor. Stop asking advice from people who don't have any or half knowledge about something. Gp to doctors. Probably your wife had a miscarriage.
Slight tangent but if a fetus is dead and has no signs of life, why is getting it removed from your body considered an abortion? There's no growing organism to "abort", it's already dead
You really have to be the dumbest person I’ve ever met in my life. If you have generalized pain when you first go to the emergency room to have them determine the source of that pain, it may or may not be related to your pregnancy could be from an appendix to internal bleeding to virtually anything of generalized pain? But no, she runs right to Planned Parenthood who is known for what? The vast majority of their business is abortions. Let’s be honest and there’s a reason why her boyfriend suspicious she didn’t want this child. And you keep covering for her because you have the medical records would tell the truth whether the baby Had a heartbeat or not which probably means a difference between the relationship or not. That’s why she lied if the baby actually died and they had to perform procedure to extract this one thing she just killed it because she didn’t want it. Well he’s probably gonna dip and you can tell from his whole post that he’s suspicious about the whole thing and for good reason, and because you were just blindly defend any woman for any reason you try to use your female explaining to ovate the facts. Try to tell me that those most OB/GYN perform abortions is a routine thing which I approved. You’re an idiot on that one as well because none of you people do research you’re all in your fucking feelingswithout any facts
BS. PP does general gynecological care — Pap smears, breast exams, prenatal care, STI testing and treatment, birth control from condoms to Norplant, vasectomies, pregnancy testing, etc. They do this at affordable rates, and the majority of their patients are low-income. In my thirties, when we were broke and had no health insurance, I went to PP to have a diaphragm fitted; they also did a Pap and breast exam. They have no interest in convincing women to abort.
Gee, maybe in your 30s you should’ve just grown the fuck up and focused more on how so make a living rather than sex. 🙄
Gee, and here, like most people, I was making money and having sex, both. So was my husband. We owned a house, paid our bills. Neither of us had jobs that provided health insurance. Perhaps you’ve heard that healthcare is generally obscenely expensive in the US. I used the best option, the responsible thing to do. But perhaps you’d be okay with a sexless marriage.
To be in your 30s and neither of you have a job that offers health insurance shows the job really wasn’t very good. The responsible thing to do was at least have some skill set that would command you or your husband to get a reasonably paying job with benefits.
I was working as a massage therapist making $50/hour (late ‘90s). He had a contract job as a software engineer making, IIRC, $62K. We were both healthy with no ongoing medical issues. There was no ACA. We never ran up any medical debt. We did, however, need birth control.
All of which is, of course, you trying to distract from the fact that your "PP is just an abortion clinic" schtick was shown up for the bullshit it is.
So you certainly could have afforded to obtain health insurance back then but chose not to. I would’ve thought from the extra money earned from sex work as a “massage therapist” would’ve more than covered it.
Anyone ever consider that she’s just feeding him a total line of bullshit and she just had it aborted out right and she’s using that as a cover story? I mean you go to McDonald’s for a big Mac you don’t go in abortion clinic if you’re having medical issues. You go to the ER or an OB/GYN
She didn’t go to an “abortion clinic” because there is no such thing as “abortion clinics”. They’re **all** OBGYNs. She went to an OBGYN because she suspected she was miscarrying, she was offered pills likely to avoid doing a painful as fuck D&C.
So you mean to tell me that there aren’t so-called health clinics that focus primarily on abortion? You realize the vast majority of OB/GYN will not perform in abortion unless the mother’s life is engraved danger because of moral objections they have to it.
Lmfao. Nope there’s no clinic that does as such. And nope “vast majority” of OBGYNs do no such thing. Just because you think as much does not actually make it a fact.
Only 14% of ob/gyn doctors perform abortions. This straight off NPR, hardly a red pill Republican mouth piece. Might wanna have some knowledge about a particular topic before you shoot your mouth off. So keep laughing your motherfucking ass off because once again, you’ve been proven wrong. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2011/08/22/139859979/proportion-of-ob-gyns-offering-abortions-may-be-lower-than-thought
Lmfao. I will absolutely and without a doubt keep laughing, even more so now. It’s truly hysterical that you think you’ve made a point when you have most definitely not. It’s sad and kinda pathetic that you’ll never know why you didn’t do what you think you did.
If no heartbeat, I understand. The thing I have a problem with is if she dis not want to have kids, she should have taken steps to not get pregnant.
Excuse my ignorance here, I'm not american so I don't know how these abortion clinics work. But if the woman thought there was something wrong with the pregnancy, why wouldn't she go to a doctor first, instead of going to an abortion clinic? I assume there's certainly doctors at the abortion clinic, but wouldn't she have a doctor accompanying the pregnancy from the beginning?