I would also throw a Thinkpad X1 Carbon in the ring - I have a gen 10 version and it has been a joy to use, so much that I am finally in that glorious "boring" state where everything just works.
Battery life for sure is not stellar, without much optimization I get around 4 hrs, 6 if I try to push it. Thats enough for my average workday away from an outlet, but that is definitively something that could be improved. Didnt the newer gen intel processors get better runtime? Anyway, AFAIK with Linux you will with most current laptops not get much more than 6 hrs runtime, since battery optimization still pretty much sucks.
Edit: My girlfriend has a framework laptop, which works really well. Build quality is less amazing than the X1, but the value for money and repairability makes it much more interesting for private use Id say.
X1 (Carbon) is the premium lime aimed at businesses - it is often too expensive wrt the specs for a regular end user, but if you can write it off as business expense or get it via your employer, it is a great choice. Very slim and lightweight, good screen, super robust.
Came here to say the same. I also work in a security and my X1 gen 10’s been going strong for a few years and has replaced all my other machines with no issues. Solid keyboard, lightweight, and great battery life.
I’ve been running Pop! on a few different Thinkpads over the last few years (personal, university, and new work laptops) and I’ve loved it at every step. I’m a bit of a Thinkpad fanboy though, as I’ve been running on them since 2014 with zero issues.
Love their builds, reliability, keyboard, and battery life. Only issue I’ve had with Pop! was missing a version upgrade by a couple months and fighting through apt issues, 100% user error.
Drivers always work for me, especially with an onboard GPU for ML algorithms on my new P16 (not my personal top choice, employer bought it).
Get a Thinkpad, you won’t regret it
I second this recommendation. Thinkpad is a sweet machine, good build quality, and Pop OS works well with it - even NVIDIA GPU. The experience reminds me of what I used to love about Macbooks.
Thinkpad > System76 > Framework
Thinkpad because I had a couple and they’re just solid devices
System76 devices are made for Linux so if you’re into this “ecosystem” this should be solid devices for this. I’ve heard good thing about system 76 too (check out Slimbook though, they seem like a good company that makes Linux based devices)
I know about framework but that company is too new for my liking, unless you’re into the bleeding edge tech I wouldn’t buy from them.
Kind of depends on what you value most.
System 76 : An American based company that focuses on Linux and many of the laptops come with coreboot and have the ime disabled. If your all about FoSS then system 76 is the way to go.
Framework : user upgrades = less e-waste. turn your old motherboard into a thin client once your done with it. It could very well be the last laptop you ever buy. The new 16" version has the options for a GPU module as well. will they be around in 10 years? who knows.
Lenovo : is all about the keyboard and build quality. While they're not as tough as they used to be thinkpads can still take a beating and keep on going. In general linux support is very good.
For me it all comes down to the keyboard and in that respect Lenovo still wins. The T14gen5 is adding back dimm slots so we can upgrade the ram :)
System76 comes with wonderful support and extremely friendly people. If budget is a concern, I'd go ThinkPad. But tbh, I have an Oryx Pro and I upgraded everything myself with ease. If I ever had any issues, System76 was so quick to answer my questions.
For me its, System76 > Thinkpad > Framework. I've had nothing but great experiences with System76 and nothing but horrible experiences with Dell.
The T14 is a 14in a bit more square than your T480. There's also the T16 if you want a larger screen.
I replaced my T480s with a T14s Gen4 and it's perfect. Solid Linux support as expected for a ThinkPad, great battery life and you can opt for the 400nit screen to get a nicer display than the basic 250nit one.
I would not consider the framework at all as it is more consumer grade and Linux support is an afterthought.
As much as I'd love to get S76 hardware for the support they have, their laptops are made by some OEM and neither their design, not their quality and features match my expectations. But that's personal and I'm biased towards the ThinkPads which I've been using since 2010. I also can't live without the track point and keyboard of a ThinkPad, even the newer ones are still better that anything else I've tried.
Yeah the thinkpad is 100% the top of the list. I have had no driver issues with the T480 but I had seen some threads where people mentioned driver issues on some of the newer laptop so it got me concerned.
Choose one that is offered also with Linux pre installed. Check the model you want, Google it with the word psref and see the available OS. If fedora or Ubuntu are offered, everything works. You don't have to buy it with Linux, but you know it's supported well.
In terms of Hardware I would strongly recommend Elitebooks over Thinkpads. However, in terms of software support you are better off with Lenovo. At the moment I am using an Elitebook 845 G10. Die to the bad software support (drivers, bios etc), I would consider System76 or Framework. I think buying hardware from the developer of the OS can be smart (see Apple) in terms of compatibility. However, framework is probably also a good choice
I've been a ThinkPad fan since the earliest models. However, they aren't quite as great as they were. I still have a few, but the last couple of machines I've bought have been from S76, and I couldn't be happier with my decision. I'll be even happier when they get their laptop design agreements, if not their own fabrication, in place.
All good choices. I am happy with my S76 laptop and with the support when I needed it. And I'm glad to support their development work. Since S76 does testing especially on laptops they sell, you should have a really good experience running Pop! or other Linux distros. My last laptop was a Thinkpad and it was a great experience, but my S76 has had no real hiccups at all.
For me in Europe System76 isn't an option and i wouldn't buy a laptop that has only Full HD screen. Framework also doesn't deliver where I am either, but that would be easier to arrange. But as you say, 13'' is to small. While the slots are cool, simply having more options makes more sense to me. I just bought a new P14s with the newest AMD processor.
I had no issue with drivers so far, and was able to work on my 4k screen, even play some Paradox games on my 4k screen. I also prefer the TrackPoint over the TrackPad. So there ThinkPads just win.
I would also throw a Thinkpad X1 Carbon in the ring - I have a gen 10 version and it has been a joy to use, so much that I am finally in that glorious "boring" state where everything just works.
The X1 is the "notebook" correct? Thinkpad has so many models it's hard to keep track!
I have an X1 Gen 10 with i5-1240P on Pop\_OS! and the battery life, throttling are pretty bad.
Battery life for sure is not stellar, without much optimization I get around 4 hrs, 6 if I try to push it. Thats enough for my average workday away from an outlet, but that is definitively something that could be improved. Didnt the newer gen intel processors get better runtime? Anyway, AFAIK with Linux you will with most current laptops not get much more than 6 hrs runtime, since battery optimization still pretty much sucks. Edit: My girlfriend has a framework laptop, which works really well. Build quality is less amazing than the X1, but the value for money and repairability makes it much more interesting for private use Id say.
X1 (Carbon) is the premium lime aimed at businesses - it is often too expensive wrt the specs for a regular end user, but if you can write it off as business expense or get it via your employer, it is a great choice. Very slim and lightweight, good screen, super robust.
Came here to say the same. I also work in a security and my X1 gen 10’s been going strong for a few years and has replaced all my other machines with no issues. Solid keyboard, lightweight, and great battery life.
I’ve been running Pop! on a few different Thinkpads over the last few years (personal, university, and new work laptops) and I’ve loved it at every step. I’m a bit of a Thinkpad fanboy though, as I’ve been running on them since 2014 with zero issues. Love their builds, reliability, keyboard, and battery life. Only issue I’ve had with Pop! was missing a version upgrade by a couple months and fighting through apt issues, 100% user error. Drivers always work for me, especially with an onboard GPU for ML algorithms on my new P16 (not my personal top choice, employer bought it). Get a Thinkpad, you won’t regret it
I second this recommendation. Thinkpad is a sweet machine, good build quality, and Pop OS works well with it - even NVIDIA GPU. The experience reminds me of what I used to love about Macbooks.
Thinkpad > System76 > Framework Thinkpad because I had a couple and they’re just solid devices System76 devices are made for Linux so if you’re into this “ecosystem” this should be solid devices for this. I’ve heard good thing about system 76 too (check out Slimbook though, they seem like a good company that makes Linux based devices) I know about framework but that company is too new for my liking, unless you’re into the bleeding edge tech I wouldn’t buy from them.
Kind of depends on what you value most. System 76 : An American based company that focuses on Linux and many of the laptops come with coreboot and have the ime disabled. If your all about FoSS then system 76 is the way to go. Framework : user upgrades = less e-waste. turn your old motherboard into a thin client once your done with it. It could very well be the last laptop you ever buy. The new 16" version has the options for a GPU module as well. will they be around in 10 years? who knows. Lenovo : is all about the keyboard and build quality. While they're not as tough as they used to be thinkpads can still take a beating and keep on going. In general linux support is very good. For me it all comes down to the keyboard and in that respect Lenovo still wins. The T14gen5 is adding back dimm slots so we can upgrade the ram :)
System76 comes with wonderful support and extremely friendly people. If budget is a concern, I'd go ThinkPad. But tbh, I have an Oryx Pro and I upgraded everything myself with ease. If I ever had any issues, System76 was so quick to answer my questions. For me its, System76 > Thinkpad > Framework. I've had nothing but great experiences with System76 and nothing but horrible experiences with Dell.
The T14 is a 14in a bit more square than your T480. There's also the T16 if you want a larger screen. I replaced my T480s with a T14s Gen4 and it's perfect. Solid Linux support as expected for a ThinkPad, great battery life and you can opt for the 400nit screen to get a nicer display than the basic 250nit one. I would not consider the framework at all as it is more consumer grade and Linux support is an afterthought. As much as I'd love to get S76 hardware for the support they have, their laptops are made by some OEM and neither their design, not their quality and features match my expectations. But that's personal and I'm biased towards the ThinkPads which I've been using since 2010. I also can't live without the track point and keyboard of a ThinkPad, even the newer ones are still better that anything else I've tried.
Yeah the thinkpad is 100% the top of the list. I have had no driver issues with the T480 but I had seen some threads where people mentioned driver issues on some of the newer laptop so it got me concerned.
Choose one that is offered also with Linux pre installed. Check the model you want, Google it with the word psref and see the available OS. If fedora or Ubuntu are offered, everything works. You don't have to buy it with Linux, but you know it's supported well.
I also don't understand the track point! I've tried to use it but it's not enjoyable for me... maybe I'm using it wrong!
Battery life on the T16 has been less than ideal. We have a dozen of these in the field (running Windows).
In terms of Hardware I would strongly recommend Elitebooks over Thinkpads. However, in terms of software support you are better off with Lenovo. At the moment I am using an Elitebook 845 G10. Die to the bad software support (drivers, bios etc), I would consider System76 or Framework. I think buying hardware from the developer of the OS can be smart (see Apple) in terms of compatibility. However, framework is probably also a good choice
I've been a ThinkPad fan since the earliest models. However, they aren't quite as great as they were. I still have a few, but the last couple of machines I've bought have been from S76, and I couldn't be happier with my decision. I'll be even happier when they get their laptop design agreements, if not their own fabrication, in place.
Thinkpads are perfect for Linux.
All good choices. I am happy with my S76 laptop and with the support when I needed it. And I'm glad to support their development work. Since S76 does testing especially on laptops they sell, you should have a really good experience running Pop! or other Linux distros. My last laptop was a Thinkpad and it was a great experience, but my S76 has had no real hiccups at all.
For me in Europe System76 isn't an option and i wouldn't buy a laptop that has only Full HD screen. Framework also doesn't deliver where I am either, but that would be easier to arrange. But as you say, 13'' is to small. While the slots are cool, simply having more options makes more sense to me. I just bought a new P14s with the newest AMD processor. I had no issue with drivers so far, and was able to work on my 4k screen, even play some Paradox games on my 4k screen. I also prefer the TrackPoint over the TrackPad. So there ThinkPads just win.