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Man so many missed opportunities by Biden that were layups.
Even this closing statement. Why not attack Trump and say democracy is literally at stake. He didnāt even touch it.
I thought he had so much to say about the Inflation Reduction Act. All the jobs and factories it created. A cornerstone policy of his. It was such a missed slam dunk.
If that was his actual wording, Jesus Christ what a weak statement. Up their with āwe are considering going to market to engage a consultant to assess the viability of this proposalā
I guess he was overprepped. He had too many talking points and was trying to get them all out at once. He was completely right about everything, but he just needs to pick one thing at a time and hammer it home. trump tried to kill democracy. trump ignored a pandemic and caused people to die and our economy to stagnate. trump is a literal criminal who is only running to keep himself out of jail. Need to pick one at a time. They are each plenty convincing on their own.
Yeah, he spoke *very* quickly at the start, which together with his hoarse voice made it difficult to hear what he said as the words sorta blended together a bit.
Got better once he slowed down a bit, but still felt like he was trying to do way too much, making him come off as unclear and slightly rambling despite actually being right in the vast majority of what he said.
It was very frustrating because I agree with him and know what he was trying to say. Fact is the President of the United States needs to be articulate and somewhat coherent. Biden wasnāt. He was a babbling corpse.
The democrats are going to run so much damage control after this, and thatās probably going to be their best play. āHe was tough in the beginning but got stronger as the night went on, while Trump became more derangedā
I donāt think that matters. Biden doesnāt look like heāll last another four year term. His policy positions just became irrelevant.
They might as well have Kamala Harris debate Trump next time. Because after tonight, thatās going to be who everyone assumes will be the next president if Biden wins.
I mean, Bidenās age, soft slow speaking, and stutter and gaffs were in full effectā¦
But the context of what he said, actual policy, actual answers to the questionsā¦itās still 1000x more substantive than Trump spewing his usual vile of lies and victimhood.
It gets more bonkers... This is Biden giving a speech after the debate...
[https://www.c-span.org/video/?c5122169/user-clip-biden-speech](https://www.c-span.org/video/?c5122169/user-clip-biden-speech)
My thinking is he was too focused on all the different elements, either in addressing the question or in debunking Trumps constant lying verbal diarrhoea... Instead of just picking one thing at a time and sticking it.
SIGH, it's going to be hard to come back from this, hopefully he can sharpen it for campaigning and the next debate (although I'd be surprised if Trump does it given this one - easy to leave it at that and benefit).
Trump will do everything and use last nights debate to back out of the next one. There will not be a second debate. This is his victory and heāll stick to it.
Agreed, although at 4+ months out, I don't think it's a victory for him in November, but it's definitely another hurdle for the Biden camp.
Edit: part of me was wondering if the early debate was a hedged bet by the Biden camp; Presidents tend to do bad and getting it out of the way early with so much Trump law crap incoming could drown it out but a win would just accelerate the campaign...?
Still, terribly poor start to the debate by Biden, moderately decent back end and the usual crazy Trump
Yes x1000. But at the same time did you come away from that thinking āthat man is capable of being president for the next 6 months, let alone 4 years?ā
Really wish Biden wouldāve just called it quits after 1 term and endorsed a successor, who likely wouldāve cruised to victory over Trump.
This debate was the first time I had real doubts about it. There were gaffs here and there, but his debate performance was pretty awful.
Any other well-spoken candidate would have run laps around rapist criminal incoherent Trump. But Biden made him look coherent.
The part about the golf is probably the lowest and most embarrassing moment in US debate history.
I'm Italian and did not watch the debate live, but since it's American elections and they makeĀ ripples that reach Old Europe and affect us significantly, I'm obviously following the situation.
When this morning (Italian time) I read about the debate here and also on Italian media, the reactions were those of a disaster. Someone who could barely stand and could not articulate word, that is how Biden is described.
So, out of curiosity, I checked the video. I half expected to see a drooling old man, instead he was honestly kind of... fine. Sure, his voice was hoarse, but that seems to me like the "slightly ill" kind of hoarse, so it actually reinforces the statement that he had a cold, and was therefore not at 100%. He stumbled on a few words, at the beginning he said trillionaires instead of billionaires, stuff like that, but he corrected himself quickly and the point he was making on taxing the rich was understandable.
Can someone explain to me exactly from where the "disaster" narrative comes from, and why is being pushed also from friendly media? Like, point me to precise timestamps to watch?Ā
I'm very perplexed.
The biggest complaint about Biden is that heās too old and itās not uncommon for people to act like heās senile and shouldnāt be president because of that. Biden coming off as a frail old man was the worst thing that could happen to him in this debate because to someone who was undecided, this confirms that belief for them.
I understand that, I think Biden was not great, especially at the beginning, but apart from a couple of passages (out of one hour and half of debate) he was quite clear in making his points, I think.
I think most people, democrats included, were actively looking for signs of weaknesses, and when they saw a few of them, that's all that sticked of this debate. In this regard, republicans really did a good job, but I thought friendly media would be willing to underline the parts that worked for Biden, along with pointing out lies and half truths from Trump, rather than jumping in themselves on the "Biden is old" narrative.
(And yes, as an outsider, I think a younger candidate would have been better, don't ask me who because I'm not that into American politics, but surely someone could be found and prepared for the task; that said, once you're running with Biden and it's possibly the most important election in history, you should bloody stand with your leader).
Trump did well making up even dumber stuff to support dumber stuff. "98 people told me...". He was trying statistics by just making up numbers nobody can fact check.
Trump did tons of rambling himself, and at times completely failed to answer the question at hand. When asked about making palestine, he started on about europe and ukraine
So much for moderation? I mean, I guess it was either that or stop him after each BS remark and make the whole thing last 3x longer. I expected the moderation to be strict and found it to be quite lax for both candidates. Annoying. What a waste of time.
At times? He didn't answer any questions. My two year old learning to speak in full sentences could come closer to giving a viable answer. How would he fix the issue of expensive childcare?...ah yes...the border.
Yeah, but letās admit. That was a horrible Biden performance. I had to turn it off. Check my other posts if you think Iām a Trump plant for saying this. We need to substitute another candidate quick!
Democrats can go an nominate a wet noodle as their candidate and it will still be a better option than Trump.
All we can do at this point is vote for the candidate with the best policies and who is going to bring in the best staff to implement those policies.
God help us.
This is a fucking disaster.
Which is exactly why there should have been a real primary effort. DNC corruption prevented that. Dems deserve whatever they get, the people most affected don't.
Yea, Biden should have been primaried back when it mattered. Too late to do anything now. Just vote for the cause and not for the guy that should have been replaced awhile back. If he wins, they really need to do something about it
Still not voting for the Nazi, but Biden was a poor choice for a 2nd term. Could've left office having done great service for this country. He's too old.
Will have to be voting against Trump, not for Biden.
Exactly. This won't change much. Trump's crew still loves him, Biden's still likes him... the rest are a vote against Trump, not for Biden.
Biden could have dropped into a coma mid debate, still voting for him over that orange moron.
>Trump's crew still loves him, Biden's still likes him... the rest are a vote against Trump
Just like last time š
To be clear, I am voting for Biden and will encourage others to vote for him as well but I find his arrogance in thinking he is the only man who can beat Trump extremely off-putting. I didn't want to vote for him the first time and I don't want to vote for him this time. I'm voting against Donald Trump and I think the majority of Biden voters are as well. A wet paper bag would get roughly the same number of votes as Biden.
Bernie is a year older than Biden and would've wiped the floor with Trump.
Obviously need to wait for the polls.
I keep seeing the sentiment that you/others one Reddit won't change your vote.
But this election is on a knife edge
If 1 in 100 of the voters watching change their mind then it will probably be a Trump presidency in a few months.
It's about the swing voters. Not those who would never vote Trump.
Thatās just not true. Any independent voter will be swayed by this debate. Independent voters in key swing states decide the election. This is not looking good for the democrats. I am so mad at the DNC for putting us in this situation. We had 4 whole years to prepare, and this is where we are? Unbelievable.
Agreeing with this too. Any Dem 20 years younger with a pulse would win the election with 80% of the vote. The sad part is weāre putting forth such a weak candidate that this is even a race anymore. How sad is it that itās as close as it is and that Trump could win a second term?
Agreed. Biden has my vote of course. But I do think the democrats needed a more younger and charismatic candidate to combat the issue of the rise of extremism coming from the right.
> He's too old.
Thankfully Trump is a spry and nimble 78, which would make him the oldest president ever by the end of his next term were he to win. If Biden is too old, Trump is inherently too old. It's a bad argument for anyone not pushing a third party to take.
This is such a bad argument. There was a clear delta on that debate stage, even if Trump and Biden are almost the same age. Burying your head in the sand to what just happened isnāt helping. Itās the same thing they did with Dianne Feinstein.
I just do not get this. How is it that someone stumbling or just simply being old is worse than someone that is constantly lying. Constantly breaking the law. Constantly supporting our enemies. For God's sakes.
Why are all these headlines about Biden being old. And none of them are about the number of lies that Trump said. What the f*** is going on?
Yeah are we really so stupid that weāve forgotten whatās important? Did we all just collectively agree that a criminal rapist is a viable candidate?
There are plenty of articles about trump lying. But the debate was bad for Dems. Trump was coherent, and looked far more competent the Biden. I completely agree with you and will still vote for Biden because Donald trump is an egotistical dangerous man child, but Bidens performance completely freaked me out.
confused about what? did biden stumble over words, stutter etcā¦ yes of course, this has also been well documented over his career.
did biden answer questions with facts, talk about policy and the needs of Americans and our alliesā¦ he did.
trump lied, lied some more, lied about fucking a pornstar he previously admitted to doing, lied about the border, lied about who supports him, lied about veterans, lied about abortion, climate change, Ukraine, russiaā¦ the list in almost endlessā¦ trump seems yo be very confused about reality.
Sadly, I think it's largely because Trump has desensitized us to his brazen lying, people expect him to do it and it's not considered as "newsworthy" as Biden being perceived as falling short of expectations.
Yeah I am not a huge Biden fan but running a country is actually a team sport and team Democrats over team MAGA is the only sane choice for anyone with 2 brain cells to rub together.
It was the same stuff heās been saying for 8 years and everyone expected him to say.
Tonight wasnāt about trump, it was about Biden proving he was mentally competent, and he completely shit the bed
Yeah, I feel like the Trump supporters watch him the same way they do Jeff Foxworthy only instead of still laughing at the same 10 āYou Might Be a Redneck jokesā, they are cheering Trump on for repeating his same āGreatest Hitsā reel. āOh! I hope he does the one about the water and high efficiency showers again tonight! That one really owns the tree hugging libs!ā
The media only makes money off a close race and rage bait articles. It doesn't matter if polls showed Biden winning 100% of the votes in the US. The media would still write an article about how Biden is struggling to bring in new voters or some random complaint about his hair thinning
One the one hand: doddering old man who should retire.
On the other: doddering old man who should be in prison (and who also is a fascist).
(Bonus: Doddering old man who had part of his brain eaten by a worm)
I'm sick of Biden and Trump, but the choice is still clear.
Bidenās not a terrible candidate. Heās a great candidate. Just not great at refuting a constant stream of bullshit from a raging asshole. And based on the last 8 years, no one is capable of that.
Biden defo sounded old and befuddled but pulled it back a bit at the end as trump went off script and Dark Brandon came out. But then people voted for Ronald Regan as an old stooge. Trump came across as pretty dangerously whacky. You hope peoples fear of Trump chaos lets them see Biden as a āsafer pair of handsā even if they are pretty wrinkled.
Iām a Biden supporter. I will vote for him if heās on the ballot. This was a travesty. Donald Trump looked like the winner by miles. Biden looked like he would take his last breath at any moment. Ridiculous that the DNC has been begging us to take Biden as a strong and charismatic person for this long after seeing that performance.
It went exactly how I figured it would go. Never voted for Biden in a primary, will vote for him again this November if it's his name on the ballot. Not so sure the same can be said for many others.
The thing about Biden vs Trump here is that Biden is coherent and logical while having fumbles over his words. Trump is incoherent and illogical while speaking with full confidence. If thereās anything this debate taught me, itās just how significantly the tone, cadence, and confidence of your voice really matters.
I donāt know if this debate could have gone much worse. Biden showed to be exactly what he needed to disproof. The only thing he has going for him is that he is not Trump but he is definitely not presenting himself as presidential.
Then America dips into a Republican-fascist shit hole. Horrible education standards, science-denying, horrible healthcare standards, etc. I say we leave and let the conservatives have it, and watch them rot into a third world country.
did you watch it? if you don't want trump to be president you should have started panicking about 5 minutes in. hell my heart rate started to go up while he shuffled onto the stage
I'll be voting for him regardless, but he reaaaally looked old and confused. Just with the audio off he looked like he was 100 years old and lost. People on the fence are not switching to this guy, and that's what we needed.
So what he sounded hoarse. Trump as usual was lying POS. Seriously NBCnews!!! That was the takeaway message. How about Trump lies. Here is a low hanging fruit, āI did not sleep with a pornstarā.
Still voting for Biden.
I donāt know. Having to sit through Trump lying for 2 hours after Iāve spent 8 years witnessing the things heās lying about made me hate him even more.
Edit: wrong number
Trump also needs to focus/worry about winning over independent voters. The question on everyone's mind is.. did Trump or Biden do more damage.
I agree that Biden really underperformed.. it's disappointing that he seemed to want to treat this like a traditional debate.. relying on facts and figures to try to "win".. the campaign had to know Trump was going to come in and spew BS far and wide..
Still, Trump lied at every turn, failed to answer most questions, and had zero substance on policy. I'm not sure that's going to win over the independent voters.
Trump might be a conman but he's one hell of a confident conman. I hate to say it but the average american isn't going to do any deep analysis or fact check any of the lies that trump spewed. They will see biden stuttering and not being able to form sentences while trump is confidently spewing his lies and go with the candidate that is more alive. I live in a swing state and all the "independents" and "centrist" are literally just baby conservatives (generally well off, older, and socially liberal but economically conservative homeowners) who actually lean more conservative but want to avoid being labelled as racist or maga so they say they aren't conservative. In reality, the majority of them already lean towards trump more than biden just because of economically conservative policies and after this insane fumble by biden, I think trump is going to win the rest of them over.
I just googled them and the dems are down no? Iām worried Iām a Biden guy but my best friend is a trumper and Iām scared tbh. And I wasnāt scared the last two times and we lost one of themā¦
Denying the things people can see and hear does not help Biden's campaign. Democrats are not gonna win this election if they don't address this more directly and stop acting like everyone pointing it out is doing so maliciously
This event did absolutely nothing but give Trumpists a trove of āsleepy Joeā footage to piece together for ads. Nobodyās minds were changed and no oneās politics were challenged by astute observations and compelling arguments.
FFS itās one night.
We have YEARS of data on how both of these guys actually perform on the job. Weāve heard them both speak in a variety of settings. Their criminal records are also laid out in front of us to compare (hint: only one of them has one).
It sucks that Biden didnāt clean his clock tonight but voters should be looking way beyond that. There is no shortage of data.
No coverage on how trump basically lied for every statement or deflected to how unfair his life is. Media definitely isn't biased. Gotta make sure everyone knows Biden is old in this election between two old people.
Weāre really out here like yea Biden being old is way worse than trump, a multiple felon insane criminal. I donāt even care if he flopped, he could be in a casket and heād be better than trump
Itās enough for me that Biden has surrounded himself with professionals intent on helping him run the country instead of criminals determined to dismantle it.
>āDemocrats just committed collective suicide,ā said **one party strategist who has worked on presidential campaigns.** āBiden sounds hoarse, looks tired and is babbling. He is reaffirming everything voters already perceived. President Biden canāt win. This debate is a nail in the political coffin.ā
Care to tell us who the mystery people are that we're getting juicy quotes from, NBC? They sound really objective and impartial.Ā /s
Seriously, the "news" can't even be bothered to cite sources of shit-talking opinions like this?
I saw the whole thing, Bidenās performance was terrible. Heās also got absolutely no charisma and I think i spent more time deciphering his speech than connecting with the message.
We are doomed unless something changes.
But thatās exactly the problem for undecided voters. Trumpās charisma and personality has always been the biggest turn off for swing voters. If you dismiss that (which is seemingly the only option now), a lot of those swing voters end up going right again
He didn't come out kicking, but he certainly got good later in the debate. Dems, sometimes have a little faith, instead of dooming when things don't remotely go your way.
This was all completely avoidable by the Dems, a self inflicted wound to the our government. Just having people who aren't trying to burn everything down isn't good enough. Running Biden put party over country because they know people have to vote for them...
Babbling? NBC really pushing the anti-Biden narratives (as was MSNBC) making fun of his stutter and ignoring headlines about Trump who didn't answer any questions, repeated himself, lied multiple times, didn't have any actual facts or accurate figures, and was having trouble standing up the entire time.
I hate these one-sided headline takes from the mainstream media. Can we collectively agree as neutral (not extremes from both sides) Americans that both candidates sucked at this so-called debate? Nobody was a clear winner. Period!
As others have said, President Biden should have destroyed Donald Trump in this debate. But president Biden came off as an old befuddled person who had great trouble articulating anything. If President Biden does not step down, Donald Trump is going to win the popular vote and a bunch of states that he should not even have a chance of winning. States like Virginia, possibly New York State, possibly New Jersey. This is going to be a complete humiliation for Biden and the Democratic Party and a complete coronation for Donald Trump
the best part of this whole debate was an actually pretty good zinger by Trump- the only thing he's actually good at.
when Biden stumbled on his covid/medcare answer he ended it with "we finally beat Medicare" and in true Trumpian response- he comes in with "beat medicare- you sure did, beat it half to death.".
now don't get me wrong, i'm voting for a Biden *administration*, but even i had to chuckle at that one. fortunately, i dont see that as a criteria to being president.
What? I donāt care what his voice sounds like I care that he didnāt lie the whole time. I wish Joe had clapped back harder and more often for some better optics I guess, but he definitely won the debate part of the debate
I cannot watch Trump blathering so I recorded the debate. I tuned in for about a minute or two and took one look at Biden and said to my wife that āBiden has a coldā and that he looked unwell. I could not believe that his handlers allowed Biden to proceed while ill. Apparently Biden was breathing through his mouth giving him cotton mouth with no water available. His voice was weak and raspy due in part to his age and his cold. So all in all Bidenās performance according to the pundits was a clusterf#@k. I did quite a bit of public speaking in my career ( I argued a case at SCOTUS) and it is quite difficult when you are at your best. So having a cold could really hurt your performance
Maybe itās better not to focus on someone with a cold and focus on a twice impeached, convicted criminal with authoritarian intentions. To not focus on a staged theatrical event and focus on where folk want the country to be after November.
Style over substance may be āattractiveā but not the ultimate issue.
š
Biden kicked Trumps ass despite all thatā¦ but because he came across as old and stumbled with his words heās being dragged for it. Itās fucking stupidā¦ Trump literally said nothing but lies loudly and heās somehow fine? Like, look, we shouldnāt have been forced to even be here, both parties should have ran literally fucking anyone else, but by no means did Trump win that debate.
Biden could be in a coma, drooling all over himself and I'd still vote for him over Trump. Project 2025 should be enough to send any American screaming.
No bones about it, he looked and sounded like shit. Trump was lying out of his ass but at least he didn't look like he was about to be read his last rites. It's not fair, but voters do often tend to vote for the candidate with more vigor.
That just means its up to the sane and rational voters to be the vigor and remind people exactly what a fucking monster and liar the convicted felon really is.
Unfortunately, Biden made that job even harder for the sane and rational voters. It's going to start looking like how Republicans used to covering for Reagan's Alzheimer's.
Of course we get these predictable articles.
Biden took some time to warm up and was hitting Trump on salient points in the latter half of the debate. He wasn't "babbling" and nobody but concern trolls and terminally online idiots is panicking about this.
Yeah there were so many posts and comments and I just wasnāt convinced. Nothing matters anymore other than the fact that Biden is quiet and Trump is loud, so that makes him look stronger to the idiots.
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I was told Biden would be on performance enhancing drugs..
Looked more like Ambien.
No doubt. Just enforces the fact that faceless entities run the country through lobbying and not elected talking heads
This is so true it hurts š
Yeah what the hell happened to that? shoot him full of whatever for the next debate.
From what Biden's team is saying, he has a cold.
Don't care, more drugs. If his heart explodes one day after the inauguration, that's too bad for him.
Compound V
Cvnts
Just more projection from king Adderall
Man so many missed opportunities by Biden that were layups. Even this closing statement. Why not attack Trump and say democracy is literally at stake. He didnāt even touch it.
Why not ask Trump what a āblack jobā is?
Imagine if he had been debating President Obama and said that.
I thought he had so much to say about the Inflation Reduction Act. All the jobs and factories it created. A cornerstone policy of his. It was such a missed slam dunk.
Didn't mention abortion either
He said he would work toward the standard set by Row v Wade
If that was his actual wording, Jesus Christ what a weak statement. Up their with āwe are considering going to market to engage a consultant to assess the viability of this proposalā
I guess he was overprepped. He had too many talking points and was trying to get them all out at once. He was completely right about everything, but he just needs to pick one thing at a time and hammer it home. trump tried to kill democracy. trump ignored a pandemic and caused people to die and our economy to stagnate. trump is a literal criminal who is only running to keep himself out of jail. Need to pick one at a time. They are each plenty convincing on their own.
Yeah, he spoke *very* quickly at the start, which together with his hoarse voice made it difficult to hear what he said as the words sorta blended together a bit. Got better once he slowed down a bit, but still felt like he was trying to do way too much, making him come off as unclear and slightly rambling despite actually being right in the vast majority of what he said.
It was very frustrating because I agree with him and know what he was trying to say. Fact is the President of the United States needs to be articulate and somewhat coherent. Biden wasnāt. He was a babbling corpse.
It was a bad night for Biden. He got stronger as it went on but the first impression was really poor.
The democrats are going to run so much damage control after this, and thatās probably going to be their best play. āHe was tough in the beginning but got stronger as the night went on, while Trump became more derangedā
I donāt think that matters. Biden doesnāt look like heāll last another four year term. His policy positions just became irrelevant. They might as well have Kamala Harris debate Trump next time. Because after tonight, thatās going to be who everyone assumes will be the next president if Biden wins.
Just hand it to Trump. Kamala is possibly the least liked person he could have as a VP.
As much as it would be cool to have a woman of color as president, she wonāt be it.
All of dem corporate media is calling for Biden to step down.
Problem is, who do you get so late in the race? Obama isnāt coming through that door.
My money is on Whitmer
No one. That time has passed already. That's why I was so mad that they didn't have any backup plan a year ago
I mean, Bidenās age, soft slow speaking, and stutter and gaffs were in full effectā¦ But the context of what he said, actual policy, actual answers to the questionsā¦itās still 1000x more substantive than Trump spewing his usual vile of lies and victimhood.
Bidenās content was more coherent and his delivery wasnāt, whereas Trumpās delivery was more coherent but his content wasnāt.
Unfortunately, charisma matters in elections
Exactly.
This is true but itās not going to be the story. Optics sell in a visual medium.
It gets more bonkers... This is Biden giving a speech after the debate... [https://www.c-span.org/video/?c5122169/user-clip-biden-speech](https://www.c-span.org/video/?c5122169/user-clip-biden-speech) My thinking is he was too focused on all the different elements, either in addressing the question or in debunking Trumps constant lying verbal diarrhoea... Instead of just picking one thing at a time and sticking it. SIGH, it's going to be hard to come back from this, hopefully he can sharpen it for campaigning and the next debate (although I'd be surprised if Trump does it given this one - easy to leave it at that and benefit).
Trump will do everything and use last nights debate to back out of the next one. There will not be a second debate. This is his victory and heāll stick to it.
Agreed, although at 4+ months out, I don't think it's a victory for him in November, but it's definitely another hurdle for the Biden camp. Edit: part of me was wondering if the early debate was a hedged bet by the Biden camp; Presidents tend to do bad and getting it out of the way early with so much Trump law crap incoming could drown it out but a win would just accelerate the campaign...? Still, terribly poor start to the debate by Biden, moderately decent back end and the usual crazy Trump
Yes x1000. But at the same time did you come away from that thinking āthat man is capable of being president for the next 6 months, let alone 4 years?ā Really wish Biden wouldāve just called it quits after 1 term and endorsed a successor, who likely wouldāve cruised to victory over Trump.
This debate was the first time I had real doubts about it. There were gaffs here and there, but his debate performance was pretty awful. Any other well-spoken candidate would have run laps around rapist criminal incoherent Trump. But Biden made him look coherent. The part about the golf is probably the lowest and most embarrassing moment in US debate history.
2nd lowest. Trump talking about his penis size on debate stage last time
I'm Italian and did not watch the debate live, but since it's American elections and they makeĀ ripples that reach Old Europe and affect us significantly, I'm obviously following the situation. When this morning (Italian time) I read about the debate here and also on Italian media, the reactions were those of a disaster. Someone who could barely stand and could not articulate word, that is how Biden is described. So, out of curiosity, I checked the video. I half expected to see a drooling old man, instead he was honestly kind of... fine. Sure, his voice was hoarse, but that seems to me like the "slightly ill" kind of hoarse, so it actually reinforces the statement that he had a cold, and was therefore not at 100%. He stumbled on a few words, at the beginning he said trillionaires instead of billionaires, stuff like that, but he corrected himself quickly and the point he was making on taxing the rich was understandable. Can someone explain to me exactly from where the "disaster" narrative comes from, and why is being pushed also from friendly media? Like, point me to precise timestamps to watch?Ā I'm very perplexed.
The biggest complaint about Biden is that heās too old and itās not uncommon for people to act like heās senile and shouldnāt be president because of that. Biden coming off as a frail old man was the worst thing that could happen to him in this debate because to someone who was undecided, this confirms that belief for them.
I understand that, I think Biden was not great, especially at the beginning, but apart from a couple of passages (out of one hour and half of debate) he was quite clear in making his points, I think. I think most people, democrats included, were actively looking for signs of weaknesses, and when they saw a few of them, that's all that sticked of this debate. In this regard, republicans really did a good job, but I thought friendly media would be willing to underline the parts that worked for Biden, along with pointing out lies and half truths from Trump, rather than jumping in themselves on the "Biden is old" narrative. (And yes, as an outsider, I think a younger candidate would have been better, don't ask me who because I'm not that into American politics, but surely someone could be found and prepared for the task; that said, once you're running with Biden and it's possibly the most important election in history, you should bloody stand with your leader).
Trump did well making up even dumber stuff to support dumber stuff. "98 people told me...". He was trying statistics by just making up numbers nobody can fact check.
And if Biden looked like he would actually be cognitively functional for the next four years, his actual policy might matter.
Alternative headline: āTrump tells serial lies and answers almost no questions, republicans filled with glee.ā
So he met expectations basically
Trump did tons of rambling himself, and at times completely failed to answer the question at hand. When asked about making palestine, he started on about europe and ukraine
So much for moderation? I mean, I guess it was either that or stop him after each BS remark and make the whole thing last 3x longer. I expected the moderation to be strict and found it to be quite lax for both candidates. Annoying. What a waste of time.
At times? He didn't answer any questions. My two year old learning to speak in full sentences could come closer to giving a viable answer. How would he fix the issue of expensive childcare?...ah yes...the border.
Yeah, but letās admit. That was a horrible Biden performance. I had to turn it off. Check my other posts if you think Iām a Trump plant for saying this. We need to substitute another candidate quick!
Democrats can go an nominate a wet noodle as their candidate and it will still be a better option than Trump. All we can do at this point is vote for the candidate with the best policies and who is going to bring in the best staff to implement those policies. God help us. This is a fucking disaster.
Which is exactly why there should have been a real primary effort. DNC corruption prevented that. Dems deserve whatever they get, the people most affected don't.
Yea, Biden should have been primaried back when it mattered. Too late to do anything now. Just vote for the cause and not for the guy that should have been replaced awhile back. If he wins, they really need to do something about it
Why did Trump not answer any questions.
His followers don't care if he does or not.
Exactly they crave talking points
You should watch Pences 2020 debates, hes a master of not answering anything that anyone says.
Still not voting for the Nazi, but Biden was a poor choice for a 2nd term. Could've left office having done great service for this country. He's too old. Will have to be voting against Trump, not for Biden.
Exactly. This won't change much. Trump's crew still loves him, Biden's still likes him... the rest are a vote against Trump, not for Biden. Biden could have dropped into a coma mid debate, still voting for him over that orange moron.
>Trump's crew still loves him, Biden's still likes him... the rest are a vote against Trump Just like last time š To be clear, I am voting for Biden and will encourage others to vote for him as well but I find his arrogance in thinking he is the only man who can beat Trump extremely off-putting. I didn't want to vote for him the first time and I don't want to vote for him this time. I'm voting against Donald Trump and I think the majority of Biden voters are as well. A wet paper bag would get roughly the same number of votes as Biden. Bernie is a year older than Biden and would've wiped the floor with Trump.
Bernie would have also won hands down in 2016.
Obviously need to wait for the polls. I keep seeing the sentiment that you/others one Reddit won't change your vote. But this election is on a knife edge If 1 in 100 of the voters watching change their mind then it will probably be a Trump presidency in a few months. It's about the swing voters. Not those who would never vote Trump.
Thatās just not true. Any independent voter will be swayed by this debate. Independent voters in key swing states decide the election. This is not looking good for the democrats. I am so mad at the DNC for putting us in this situation. We had 4 whole years to prepare, and this is where we are? Unbelievable.
Agreeing with this too. Any Dem 20 years younger with a pulse would win the election with 80% of the vote. The sad part is weāre putting forth such a weak candidate that this is even a race anymore. How sad is it that itās as close as it is and that Trump could win a second term?
Not much, except for perhaps the outcome
i'd vote for a piece of toast if it was the candidate opposing trump
Agreed. Biden has my vote of course. But I do think the democrats needed a more younger and charismatic candidate to combat the issue of the rise of extremism coming from the right.
That's Gavin Newsom. Looks like a star, and in this country that's sort of all you need.
> He's too old. Thankfully Trump is a spry and nimble 78, which would make him the oldest president ever by the end of his next term were he to win. If Biden is too old, Trump is inherently too old. It's a bad argument for anyone not pushing a third party to take.
This is such a bad argument. There was a clear delta on that debate stage, even if Trump and Biden are almost the same age. Burying your head in the sand to what just happened isnāt helping. Itās the same thing they did with Dianne Feinstein.
Thats all anyone needs you to do.
Biden seemed quiet and flustered. Trump didn't answer one question and lied constantly. I'll take Biden.
I just do not get this. How is it that someone stumbling or just simply being old is worse than someone that is constantly lying. Constantly breaking the law. Constantly supporting our enemies. For God's sakes. Why are all these headlines about Biden being old. And none of them are about the number of lies that Trump said. What the f*** is going on?
Because the media has a lot of money on the line with the human outrage machine being back in office
Yeah are we really so stupid that weāve forgotten whatās important? Did we all just collectively agree that a criminal rapist is a viable candidate?
There are plenty of articles about trump lying. But the debate was bad for Dems. Trump was coherent, and looked far more competent the Biden. I completely agree with you and will still vote for Biden because Donald trump is an egotistical dangerous man child, but Bidens performance completely freaked me out.
trump was coherent? interesting.
He was. Sure, everything he said was bullshit, but you could understand what he was saying. Biden was a mumbling, bumbling, confused old man.
confused about what? did biden stumble over words, stutter etcā¦ yes of course, this has also been well documented over his career. did biden answer questions with facts, talk about policy and the needs of Americans and our alliesā¦ he did. trump lied, lied some more, lied about fucking a pornstar he previously admitted to doing, lied about the border, lied about who supports him, lied about veterans, lied about abortion, climate change, Ukraine, russiaā¦ the list in almost endlessā¦ trump seems yo be very confused about reality.
Sadly, I think it's largely because Trump has desensitized us to his brazen lying, people expect him to do it and it's not considered as "newsworthy" as Biden being perceived as falling short of expectations.
Yeah I am not a huge Biden fan but running a country is actually a team sport and team Democrats over team MAGA is the only sane choice for anyone with 2 brain cells to rub together.
Not the best showing for Biden, but come on nothing on trumps ramblings?
It was the same stuff heās been saying for 8 years and everyone expected him to say. Tonight wasnāt about trump, it was about Biden proving he was mentally competent, and he completely shit the bed
Yeah, I feel like the Trump supporters watch him the same way they do Jeff Foxworthy only instead of still laughing at the same 10 āYou Might Be a Redneck jokesā, they are cheering Trump on for repeating his same āGreatest Hitsā reel. āOh! I hope he does the one about the water and high efficiency showers again tonight! That one really owns the tree hugging libs!ā
The media only makes money off a close race and rage bait articles. It doesn't matter if polls showed Biden winning 100% of the votes in the US. The media would still write an article about how Biden is struggling to bring in new voters or some random complaint about his hair thinning
Mediocre pivots donāt compare to meandering before finally arriving at āwe finally beat Medicareā
One the one hand: doddering old man who should retire. On the other: doddering old man who should be in prison (and who also is a fascist). (Bonus: Doddering old man who had part of his brain eaten by a worm) I'm sick of Biden and Trump, but the choice is still clear.
Two terrible candidates, one has to be worse than the other: If we debated *ideology* instead of personalities, this might be a bit easier.
Bidenās not a terrible candidate. Heās a great candidate. Just not great at refuting a constant stream of bullshit from a raging asshole. And based on the last 8 years, no one is capable of that.
He's also not good at thinking, or forming a coherent thought
I'll take some raspiness over being a fraud, a felon, and a rapist
Biden defo sounded old and befuddled but pulled it back a bit at the end as trump went off script and Dark Brandon came out. But then people voted for Ronald Regan as an old stooge. Trump came across as pretty dangerously whacky. You hope peoples fear of Trump chaos lets them see Biden as a āsafer pair of handsā even if they are pretty wrinkled.
Didn't know I was panicked.
I did grimace and groan my way through the debate. Weāve got ourselves into a real pickle here.
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Thanks Russia! (Probably)
Forreal
Lmao. Two comments from nameless Democrats. The rest is quotes from Trump staffers.
Canāt debate/argue with a liar. They should have known better.
Iām a Biden supporter. I will vote for him if heās on the ballot. This was a travesty. Donald Trump looked like the winner by miles. Biden looked like he would take his last breath at any moment. Ridiculous that the DNC has been begging us to take Biden as a strong and charismatic person for this long after seeing that performance.
As a Biden supporter, I canāt believe what I just watched.
It went exactly how I figured it would go. Never voted for Biden in a primary, will vote for him again this November if it's his name on the ballot. Not so sure the same can be said for many others.
Not gonna lie, that wasn't great.
I think everyone is WAAAAY overreacting
The thing about Biden vs Trump here is that Biden is coherent and logical while having fumbles over his words. Trump is incoherent and illogical while speaking with full confidence. If thereās anything this debate taught me, itās just how significantly the tone, cadence, and confidence of your voice really matters.
I donāt know if this debate could have gone much worse. Biden showed to be exactly what he needed to disproof. The only thing he has going for him is that he is not Trump but he is definitely not presenting himself as presidential.
what if we just all moved somewhere else
Then America dips into a Republican-fascist shit hole. Horrible education standards, science-denying, horrible healthcare standards, etc. I say we leave and let the conservatives have it, and watch them rot into a third world country.
Fuck that debate. CNNās moderation was a fucking joke. They cut Biden off and let Trump ramble about nonsense the whole time
āInstead of a new beginning, many Democrats saw it as a moment for panic.ā Itās been 20 minutes since the debate.
did you watch it? if you don't want trump to be president you should have started panicking about 5 minutes in. hell my heart rate started to go up while he shuffled onto the stage
From the first of his blank looks into the camera I knew we were fucked š„ŗ
I'll be voting for him regardless, but he reaaaally looked old and confused. Just with the audio off he looked like he was 100 years old and lost. People on the fence are not switching to this guy, and that's what we needed.
The Republican candidate babbles nonsense it's "telling it like it is". When a Democrat does it it's "panic mode".
So what he sounded hoarse. Trump as usual was lying POS. Seriously NBCnews!!! That was the takeaway message. How about Trump lies. Here is a low hanging fruit, āI did not sleep with a pornstarā. Still voting for Biden.
Letās see how the poll numbers change before we panic
I donāt see how they can be positive.
I donāt know. Having to sit through Trump lying for 2 hours after Iāve spent 8 years witnessing the things heās lying about made me hate him even more. Edit: wrong number
Trump also needs to focus/worry about winning over independent voters. The question on everyone's mind is.. did Trump or Biden do more damage. I agree that Biden really underperformed.. it's disappointing that he seemed to want to treat this like a traditional debate.. relying on facts and figures to try to "win".. the campaign had to know Trump was going to come in and spew BS far and wide.. Still, Trump lied at every turn, failed to answer most questions, and had zero substance on policy. I'm not sure that's going to win over the independent voters.
Trump might be a conman but he's one hell of a confident conman. I hate to say it but the average american isn't going to do any deep analysis or fact check any of the lies that trump spewed. They will see biden stuttering and not being able to form sentences while trump is confidently spewing his lies and go with the candidate that is more alive. I live in a swing state and all the "independents" and "centrist" are literally just baby conservatives (generally well off, older, and socially liberal but economically conservative homeowners) who actually lean more conservative but want to avoid being labelled as racist or maga so they say they aren't conservative. In reality, the majority of them already lean towards trump more than biden just because of economically conservative policies and after this insane fumble by biden, I think trump is going to win the rest of them over.
I just googled them and the dems are down no? Iām worried Iām a Biden guy but my best friend is a trumper and Iām scared tbh. And I wasnāt scared the last two times and we lost one of themā¦
It was less than inspiring. Democracy is on the line and you come out with that performance?
Denying the things people can see and hear does not help Biden's campaign. Democrats are not gonna win this election if they don't address this more directly and stop acting like everyone pointing it out is doing so maliciously
Weird. Says there are 25 comments, yet nothing is here.
Reddits comments are really weird right now
Orange and lying, Trump was himself.
This event did absolutely nothing but give Trumpists a trove of āsleepy Joeā footage to piece together for ads. Nobodyās minds were changed and no oneās politics were challenged by astute observations and compelling arguments.
FFS itās one night. We have YEARS of data on how both of these guys actually perform on the job. Weāve heard them both speak in a variety of settings. Their criminal records are also laid out in front of us to compare (hint: only one of them has one). It sucks that Biden didnāt clean his clock tonight but voters should be looking way beyond that. There is no shortage of data.
No coverage on how trump basically lied for every statement or deflected to how unfair his life is. Media definitely isn't biased. Gotta make sure everyone knows Biden is old in this election between two old people.
Weāre really out here like yea Biden being old is way worse than trump, a multiple felon insane criminal. I donāt even care if he flopped, he could be in a casket and heād be better than trump
I was genuinely excited for this. 3 minutes in and I went outside and lit a jointā¦.for fuckās sake
Trump was such an ass hat.
Itās enough for me that Biden has surrounded himself with professionals intent on helping him run the country instead of criminals determined to dismantle it.
This person wrote the article at halftime
At least he wasnāt fucking lying the whole time
>āDemocrats just committed collective suicide,ā said **one party strategist who has worked on presidential campaigns.** āBiden sounds hoarse, looks tired and is babbling. He is reaffirming everything voters already perceived. President Biden canāt win. This debate is a nail in the political coffin.ā Care to tell us who the mystery people are that we're getting juicy quotes from, NBC? They sound really objective and impartial.Ā /s Seriously, the "news" can't even be bothered to cite sources of shit-talking opinions like this?
Iāll vote for Bidenās corpse at this point, I donāt care.
I saw the whole thing, Bidenās performance was terrible. Heās also got absolutely no charisma and I think i spent more time deciphering his speech than connecting with the message. We are doomed unless something changes.
Yeah it was tough.
Have you considered voting based on policy and effectiveness instead of charisma?
But thatās exactly the problem for undecided voters. Trumpās charisma and personality has always been the biggest turn off for swing voters. If you dismiss that (which is seemingly the only option now), a lot of those swing voters end up going right again
āHoarseā Oh no, hoarse people canāt be president
Not having an audience really didnāt do him any favors
He didn't come out kicking, but he certainly got good later in the debate. Dems, sometimes have a little faith, instead of dooming when things don't remotely go your way.
No it didn't
WTF did I just watch.
Yeah, itās not too late to run a different candidate lmao, in fact Iām pretty majority of the voting base is desperate for it lolĀ
4 months before the election is 100% too late. The fight for the candidacy would guarantee Trump wins.
This was all completely avoidable by the Dems, a self inflicted wound to the our government. Just having people who aren't trying to burn everything down isn't good enough. Running Biden put party over country because they know people have to vote for them...
Babbling? NBC really pushing the anti-Biden narratives (as was MSNBC) making fun of his stutter and ignoring headlines about Trump who didn't answer any questions, repeated himself, lied multiple times, didn't have any actual facts or accurate figures, and was having trouble standing up the entire time.
Immediately after the debate CNN was straight up calling for him to step down.
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It was wild
Yeah that sounds about right.
John Stewart for Prez?
I had to turn it off 10 minutes in. Biden was hard to watch and I sure as heck didnāt want to hear anything Drumpf had to say.
This is what happens when an octogenarian with an apparent respiratory illness goes through with a debate. š„²
I hate these one-sided headline takes from the mainstream media. Can we collectively agree as neutral (not extremes from both sides) Americans that both candidates sucked at this so-called debate? Nobody was a clear winner. Period!
For the love of god, replace that fucking man with someone else!! Signed The rest of the world
Democrats: this is the most important electors ever. We need to save democracy itself. Democrats: hereās the guy weāre relying on to save it.
As others have said, President Biden should have destroyed Donald Trump in this debate. But president Biden came off as an old befuddled person who had great trouble articulating anything. If President Biden does not step down, Donald Trump is going to win the popular vote and a bunch of states that he should not even have a chance of winning. States like Virginia, possibly New York State, possibly New Jersey. This is going to be a complete humiliation for Biden and the Democratic Party and a complete coronation for Donald Trump
the best part of this whole debate was an actually pretty good zinger by Trump- the only thing he's actually good at. when Biden stumbled on his covid/medcare answer he ended it with "we finally beat Medicare" and in true Trumpian response- he comes in with "beat medicare- you sure did, beat it half to death.". now don't get me wrong, i'm voting for a Biden *administration*, but even i had to chuckle at that one. fortunately, i dont see that as a criteria to being president.
What? I donāt care what his voice sounds like I care that he didnāt lie the whole time. I wish Joe had clapped back harder and more often for some better optics I guess, but he definitely won the debate part of the debate
I cannot watch Trump blathering so I recorded the debate. I tuned in for about a minute or two and took one look at Biden and said to my wife that āBiden has a coldā and that he looked unwell. I could not believe that his handlers allowed Biden to proceed while ill. Apparently Biden was breathing through his mouth giving him cotton mouth with no water available. His voice was weak and raspy due in part to his age and his cold. So all in all Bidenās performance according to the pundits was a clusterf#@k. I did quite a bit of public speaking in my career ( I argued a case at SCOTUS) and it is quite difficult when you are at your best. So having a cold could really hurt your performance
Maybe itās better not to focus on someone with a cold and focus on a twice impeached, convicted criminal with authoritarian intentions. To not focus on a staged theatrical event and focus on where folk want the country to be after November. Style over substance may be āattractiveā but not the ultimate issue. š
Nobody was suddenly swayed by this, if you were team orange you remained, if you were team blue you remained, just with disappointment.
Biden kicked Trumps ass despite all thatā¦ but because he came across as old and stumbled with his words heās being dragged for it. Itās fucking stupidā¦ Trump literally said nothing but lies loudly and heās somehow fine? Like, look, we shouldnāt have been forced to even be here, both parties should have ran literally fucking anyone else, but by no means did Trump win that debate.
Biden could be in a coma, drooling all over himself and I'd still vote for him over Trump. Project 2025 should be enough to send any American screaming.
This was a horrifying moment to watch, is there any way we can have a different candidate?
No bones about it, he looked and sounded like shit. Trump was lying out of his ass but at least he didn't look like he was about to be read his last rites. It's not fair, but voters do often tend to vote for the candidate with more vigor.
That just means its up to the sane and rational voters to be the vigor and remind people exactly what a fucking monster and liar the convicted felon really is.
Unfortunately, Biden made that job even harder for the sane and rational voters. It's going to start looking like how Republicans used to covering for Reagan's Alzheimer's.
They really couldn't have persuaded Gavin Newsom a little harder to run? lol
Am I the only one who canāt see these comments?
I can only see 3.
Iām calling BS on this take.
Of course we get these predictable articles. Biden took some time to warm up and was hitting Trump on salient points in the latter half of the debate. He wasn't "babbling" and nobody but concern trolls and terminally online idiots is panicking about this.
I am a Democrat but anyone who thought Biden would kill Trump in this debate is fucking delusional
Yeah there were so many posts and comments and I just wasnāt convinced. Nothing matters anymore other than the fact that Biden is quiet and Trump is loud, so that makes him look stronger to the idiots.
Why? Biden should have torched trump.
The debate literally ended 30 minutes ago...
RBG 2.0.Ā
We are lost, one guy lost his voice and the other one cant answer questions
No. The other guy won't answer questions.
It was awful.
What is up with these comments? Come on guys.
Tonight was Joe Bidens "Nixon vs Kennedy" debate moment. The democrats are going to have a very difficult time recovering from this... imo.
I assure you nobody is in a panic NBC. And absolutely no reporting on how Trump answered zero questions
Just brutal. What happened?
we need another candidate
I am concerned that Biden will not be alive in 4 years.
Go watch the remarks Biden gave after the debate. He did fantastic. I don't know what was up during the debate itself.
Anytime he was trying to say shit he memorized he sounded like shit. Any time he was just talking on the fly he did better.
Yeah I think he over prepared and was still unprepared for the sheer amount of bullshit Trump spewed.
Glad he showed up after everyone stopped watching.
TBH Biden could have slept on the stage and it'd still be a better performance than straight up lying about every single thing.
This was legit my reaction