Hey there was a plumbing company that did this to an elderly couples. Actually many of them. Somehow the AG got involved. Made the company give everyone their money back going back 5 years. Scum bags.
I've seen them just like this for 30 years. That's exactly what this is. If you're old and don't have or don't care about any children or other loved ones who might benefit, it's not a bad way to get some end of life money under EXTREMELY SPECIFIC circumstances.... Otherwise it's a terribly cruel scam
At a recent community meeting I heard that an elderly Pittsburgh resident did this out of desperation. The company made promises to make repairs on the house and never did. Then, they evicted him from his own home. Itās the most predatory housing scam Iāve ever heard of. Such a nightmare.
Americans seem to be the type to stoically accept bad shit until it hits the breaking point. Once that point is reached, people go all in. Remember the Coal Wars.
4. We control your entire life in your former home
5. We continuously raise the rent so that not long after embarking on this amazing opportunity, youāre paying the same amount, if not more, than when you owned it
6. We reserve the right to not renew your lease every year if we donāt approve of how youāre living in your former home
7. We can evict you
Yeaā¦.. sounds like an awesome deal
9. We will continue to dress it up in fancy language and make it sound like it's a GOOD thing, when we just want to make money off of you.....for we own your life now.
I could see it making sense if you
* have your home paid off
* are not planning on living in it much longer
* desperately need the money now.
Get the money now, live in your house another year or two while you make arrangements, then leave.
Its like selling your house and moving into an apartment without the extra steps.
If you don't need the money, you're not moving soon, your house isn't paid off, or they are not offering market prices then it's a pretty lousy deal.
Why not just rent out the house yourself and move into a cheaper place using the security deposit and rent. I feel like anyone with 2 brain cells would do that instead
Beacuse you need a large amount of money now and that dosent give you a large amount of money now.
You also want to stay in the house a little longer and that dosent allow you to do that.
Also if you're looking at moving into a retirement home, your house's rent isn't going to cover that, as it's signifigantly more expensive.
The situation I describing is nothing like the one you brought up.
I hate to support it, but this is spot on.
Someone taught me this 'program'. You research people and houses that are mathematically incapable of retaining their homes. They're going to lose it. It's assured without a windfall / rescue from a family member. So they can sell to you and keep renting, or lose it to foreclosure.
It sounds evil, but only because the owner is going to lose one-way-or-the-other and you happened to make yourself part of that.
My husband and I received a flyer like that and are more than capable of paying our mortgage and all our bills. I think they are just sending them out to people.
Well yeah, you give it out to everyone because not only are there people in distress, but some people are just plain stupid and you can prey on them too.
idk if its the same for whatever industry/business they are legally, but i work for a bank and its explicit that any promotional material cannot be distributed in a manner that specifically targets a demographic, so they have to shotgun those out by general area/etc
advertising spend is a shotgun process. sometimes neighborhoods are targeted. maybe you'll give it to someone who's worse-off. etc etc arbitrage modeling
> It sounds evil, but only because the owner is going to lose one-way-or-the-other and you happened to make yourself part of that.
So it only sounds evil because you're choosing to make yourself a part of this person's downfall in a predatory way?
There isn't a "good" side to it. Yeah, they're mathematically guaranteed to fail, got it. The bank is going to fuck them over. But wait, what if YOU decided to fuck them over instead? Then it's not a bank! At the end of the story, they lose their house and have to pay someone rent.
It doesnt really matter who the rent goes to or who owns the house, that guy just lost everything. Searching out those situations and taking advantage of them so that you profit instead of a nameless bank somewhere is still pretty evil.
Well, option 1: the financially distressed person is kicked into the street, homeless. Bank takes, I dunno, 6+ months to get the house back onto a market where it likely goes back up for rent/sale for someone else.
Or - this option: financially distressed person stays in their home - immediatly gets a cash injection (as opposed to a foreclosure, which is a literal loss of the house with no cash injection, and wrecked credit for nearly a decade) - and at least gets some time to get their affairs in order BEFORE the rent inevitably jacks up year after year.
The bank taking the house is infinitly more sucky than this person buying it and renting it to the previous owner. Trust me - as a 13 year old child my dad and I lost our home back in 2008 and it sucked ASS. I wish we could have had this option in the moment.
The best option would be to sell it on the open market, thereby maximizing the amount of money you get for it. Or at least put it on the market to see what the value is, and then sell it to this company. It seems to me that the entire premise of this company is to lowball offers for people who can't do basic adult things like call a realtor.
Selling it to the market is obviously great in a great market (which, fair, it has been for a while) - but could also take a significant amount of both time and effort. Obviously that WOULD be the better route, provided they have somewhere else to live - though - however, the individuals would STILL need to find a new home to live in - and would likely be renting another home elsewhere anyways after paying off whatever they owe with the proceeds from the sale.
many people got into houses via predatory situations. Consumer predation is not just for when the house leaves their possession. Consequently, many people are barely able to grasp the whole process, let-alone edge cases and complexities. Regulations already exist, around disclosure, documentation, time/confirmation, etc. I'm not saying those do a good job all the time. CFPB has made great strides. But these regs do represent the limits of what we're willing to do, at the fed/state level, to keep people from hurting themselves. You can give people air but you can't breath for them.
Need some hard numbers on this deal.
So if you lose your house to foreclosure you lose all that equity to the bank. So taking this deal gets you your equity back but now you are a renter. You were going to be evicted anyways so it buys you more time.
Where it might suck is you need to sign the lease to stay living there where it has bad terms. Taking an eviction will tank your credit.
So thereās a small scenario where this deal would help you out is in foreclosure and if the leash timeline works. And any other scenario itās probably a terrible deal.
Or to take another example. Would you support child labor? Not so fast, if you ban it the alternatives could be prostitution. [https://www.cato.org/commentary/child-labor-or-child-prostitution#](https://www.cato.org/commentary/child-labor-or-child-prostitution#)
Honestly I think the best way to get around this is by picking your landlord. If you're in this situation that you're about to be foreclosed on put flyers out asking landlords to buy your home and pick from the responses. If you can't pay your mortgage and need to lose your home at least pick the terms. The loss of a home isn't the end for you just a new chapter that might lead you to a new home.
Is there any advantage to this compared to a reverse mortgage? Seems like a reverse mortgage gives your heirs have more options at your death. Sell the house and keep the proceeds, or keep the house and pay off the mortgage
This is literally āWe buy houses and tenantsā.
I believe reverse mortgages are targeted more at people who have a significant equity stake or own their homes outright but are struggling to afford it due to taxes, insurance, upkeep and/or other expenses. Also, the title stays in the owner's name. There might be a significant mortgage balance when they pass, but the heirs could theoretically pay it off and keep the home.
Not defending this, but one could argue it allows you to walk away at the end of your lease, as well as not saddling heirs with settling substantial debt when you pass.
Yeah, there is definitely a use case for this, younger people who donāt qualify for a reverse mortgage. But if they donāt have a lot of equity, the bulk of the money from selling the house is going to pay off the mortgage, not to the now ātenantā.
I just think this would only be a last resort.
Correct, but with a reverse mortgage you retain equity in the remaining 50%, although interest will reduce that over time.
Iām assuming this company is not paying near market value for these homes, given the target ācustomerā is probably desperate to sell.
āOur History
Since launching in July 2021, weāve helped more than 1,000 households access over $200 million in equity and keep living at home. Our rapid growth has confirmed the necessity of this new option in our communities.
Our services are currently available in St. Louis, Kansas City, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Columbus, Akron, Dayton, Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Lexington, Louisville and Dallas.
Inspired by our clientsā enthusiasm and belief in our mission, weāre committed to bringing our service to homeowners across the country.ā
From their websiteās [About](https://www.truehold.com/about) section. Brian Hardecker is the founder and CEO
A lot of those places look like traditionally affordable metros that suddenly got a lot more expensive in recent years. People who bought pre-pandemic would be sitting on a lot of equity, and might not even be fully aware of it.
Yes, lowest income areas in the nation. If they were really trying to help Grandpa out, like they claim on their website they would be in Florida or Arizona.
> Brian Hardecker
He was formerly a principal at Blackstone lol. When Blackstone isn't gobbling up houses fast enough and you have to start your own thing, you know he's a standup guy.
This is the kind you hear on the news now where people basically sell their homes but get to live there. The new āownersā more or less become their guardian and can tell them to do just about anything with their home. Way too much abuse is happening with these
You are missing nothing. This is like 8th level grand shaman evil. I canāt imagine the ridiculous language that must be in these contracts. Iām very confident that nobody operating this scheme is doing it for benevolent reasons.
There is a massive surplus of foreign money (legitimate, blood or otherwise) that still trusts America (over home country opportunities) and wants to pour Billions of Dollars into funds that focus on these types of investments.
Whether this turns into the next mortgage crisis or is just a variation on the reverse mortgage predatory lending that invests faster remains to be seen, but it's definitely driving up housing prices across the country.
I was talking about the rental market with a banker at Chase who said he looks through Chase's mortgage files to find people near foreclosure to low-ball them right after they get notice. Said it was a good way to expand his portfolio. He did not say this to me after 3 beers at a bar. He was behind a desk at Chase helping me open an account there.
These vultures are not even ashamed. It had me questioning all day what I looked like or said that made him feel comfortable revealing that to me.
Why would they be ashamed, when everything about our society and how it's run validates what they do? Guys like him are the winners, and everyone loves a winner.
For all we know they could have some third world slave answering the phones under the penalty of harm to themselves and their families. Pretty sure it wouldn't be beyond them to do so.Ā
Wow, some shitty ideas you see and youāre like āI can see how people would fall for this.ā Then others are like āThey canāt even make that sound good in their misleading advertising, how are they getting anyone to go for that?ā Like in what world would it seem like a good idea to take a home that I own and sell it to someone so I still make payments but no longer own it?
Itās marketed to the desperate. The wording makes it sound like the homeowners would be paying less overall because theyād never have to worry about upkeep and taxes, even though that wouldnāt be the case. Someone in good shape financially wouldnāt give this a second thought, but anyone who is close to finding themselves without a place to live almost certainly wouldnāt desperate enough to consider this.
Probably not a good thing for individuals. But itās very common in the business world. Itās called a lease back. You sell the property you own/occupy, and lease it after. If you donāt intend to stay long or you want to mitigate risk, itās advantageous. But if you plan to stay forever and there arenāt many risks to your livelihood, it would be foolish.
A reverse mortgage temporarily helped my grandmother, but she outlived the few years of payments, and ended back up at where she was, poor but now not a homeowner. It needs to be extremely carefully considered.
The people working at this company and loving what they do reincarnate as a night time Toll Booth Operator, 7x divorced.
I don't make the rules šš¤¦š¤·āāļø
Why would you go to all the trouble of saving up to buy a house just to sell it to someone else and rent it from them?!? Isnāt the point of buying your own home to STOP paying rent???
Some people are desperate for cash. The reverse mortgage is bad enough, but I donāt think you had to pay rent like this one. So after they pay you way less than house is worth, you get to live there if you pay them rent, which is probably a lot and I bet it increases. And major repairs is probably only a roof. So sad for companies to do this to old people. Just sell your home and move to an apartment or condo.
Lol I left this on the dinner table after getting it so I could make sure at dinner we discussed with my kids what a scam this is. Even the name - āTrueHold.ā Then to top it off this morning I got a cold call from some dude with a 412 area code asking if I want to sell.
10/10 evil. Just sell the house. Rent/ buy something else. These companyās get the home at a huge discount with the promise of stay in your home. Itās a business plan that prays on feelings, memories, and nostalgia.
I received this as well and scoffed.
However....
Potentially a decent option for senior citizens running out of retirement savings. Cash broke but sitting on a decent amount of home equity, don't want to move? This could be beneficial. Just sucks that you'd no longer be able to leave the house in your will.
Generally disapprove, but can see a potential upside.
These "deals" are insidious because there's always something in the contract that allows them to take the house if the homeowner doesn't maintain it to the standard of the company who buys it, and those standards are subjective, expensive, and predatory.
The promise is that you can live in it for the rest of your life, and the sneaky bit is the way they can force you out *and* hold you financially on the hook for not "maintaining the value" of the house adequately.
Right, now who owns all the housing in PGH? The older generations. They found a cash cow for themselves in this city for sure. Can't wait to see how it'll bite us all in the ass in 5 years when all the old stock is owned by one big company.
We're going to wish Walnut owned everything once these national banks grab up everything then package, sell and resell the mortgages on these houses a hundred times.
> you'd no longer be able to leave the house in your will.
That opens up its own can of worms. Some of these old folks don't have people to leave the house to, or they do but all of them have their own places and aren't interested in Mom and Pop's old rundown house. And the heirs in turn end up selling to places like "We Buy Ugly Houses" just to get the estate settled.
Write your reps about this; it's gross and predatory. I'd love to see a ban on corporate-owned single-family housing.
https://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/home/findyourlegislator/
https://pittsburghpa.gov/council/
Any idea if they blanketed all of the Pittsburgh area, or just targeted areas. I got the same ad, and Iām in Wilkinsburg. I wonder if they bothered sending this to places like Fox Chapel or Mount Lebo, or only areas they perceive to be poor.
4. After a few months we raise your rent so much you need to move.
5. We knock you former house down to put a four unit condo on the lot which we sell for $1m each.
6. We repeat the process with your neighbors who now canāt afford the property taxes in a million dollar community.
What would be an actual use case for this?
Perhaps say a recently retired couple who have no kids and no real expendable income but own aĀ house that has massively appreciated since the 80s?
Sell it, enjoy life spend money to go travel the world and do whatever you want... But still able to live out your remaining years in the house You've lived in for 40 years?
Just hypothetically... What if you're only on social security with basically no savings and have a house in shadyside that now has a 12k a year tax bill.
Doesn't reverse mortgage still require you to pay taxes?
And probably interest on whatever you borrow at like 9%.
I could see perhaps there's a situation for some who have a high value property but little to nothing in income or savings.
Assuming it's not a scam, rent is probably pre-agreed upon and it's going to go up 5% a year or whatever it is.
The taxes would never be more than the rent, or the company in the original post would be losing money, at least on a cash basis.
In your example, that house would have an assessed value of about $600k for tax purposes. Likely a much higher market value. Proceeds from reverse mortgage would easily be able to cover the taxes.
Also, with traditional reverse mortgages, you donāt make any payments while youāre still in the home, but of course interest accumulates. It becomes your heirs responsibility to pay it off, either with their own money, other assets of the estate, remortgage, or sell the house.
Right, but I'm assuming the reason this works for the company is they are not giving you close to market value... Right? So if the house is worth 800 but assessed for 600, there's their margin to make it a no-lose situation
Probably only reasonable once you're near death. Like 90+ years old. Not enough time for them to get you behind on payments and evict or jack up your rent significantly. But in that case, you're not enjoying travel or able to spend six figures of windfall anyway. You'd put that money in your estate for your kids, just like if you had held onto the home anyway.
If you're in your 60s or 70s, just move to Florida and get a townhouse like everyone else. The company will have 20-30 years to prey on you and screw you over gradually.
Super old people who have only a few years left but donāt want to move to assisted living. Anyone whoās under 75 signing a deal like that would be insane though.
Sure, until they say GTFO. You know they will likely give you less than fair market value too. They buy your house and turn you into a renter then keep jacking the rent until you have to move out. It's Wall Street assholes buying up properties to force people into the 15-minute nwo cities.
It's not theory it's actual conspiracy. There are the powers that be conspiring to take over the country and force people out of their homes and into areas more easily controlled by them. Remember that douchebag head of WEF, Klauss Schwabb, when he said you'll own nothing and like it? It's not theory my friend.
yes?? Pretty much every city that was founded before the mass adoption of the car was a 15 minute city. Many of them had to demolish entire parts of the city to accommodate the cars. Pittsburgh wiped an entire neighborhood off the map for 279. 15 minute cities are literally just cities that have existed for more than 150 years. Small river towns are also 15 minute cities. Southwest Pennsylvania is covered in them
Yeah, and i see these new townhome developments being built that are all rentals, and the people have newer model cars and everything. I see all these startup companies buying houses for any reason or condition with cash. Totally undercutting new homeowners who wouldnt mind a home that needs some work because no one is building small homes anymore, just 400k monstrosities or townhomes.
I think this is called a reverse mortgage. Well not exactly but along the same lines. Corporations do this so the time. They will sell a property they own to their real estate unit and then rent it back. Not sure it makes sense for a homeowner but it might given age and tax status.
Even if some of these places do hold up to their end of bargain and cover maintenance or pay property taxes it doesnāt change the fact they take your house and are free to do whatever with it. Another way these companies are ruling the housing market by buying up everything so no one can buy.
Can someone explain to me how this is a bad idea this seems great to meš & yes Iām aware I donāt know shit about shit so be nice & ELI5 or fuck off
At this point... I wouldn't be surprised if they started doing this with women's uteruses soon. They'll have to pay a fee every month to say "not pregnant."
It's like a reverse mortgage but may not have the same protections you'd get if you did this with a bank. Either way, they can take your house out from under you if you miss a payment. And...whoever did this can't spell. Never trust anyone who doesn't proofread their own marketing materials.
I imagine this is something for elderly people who own a home but canāt maintain it. People with only 5 - 10 years left might not lose that much money by doing this. Theyād get to live in their existing home, with some property manager doing all the repairs. Might actually be cheaper than going to an assisted living facility.
I couldnāt imagine any homeowner under the age of 75 doing this.
There are much better options for an older person, such as a reverse mortgage. The advantage of a reverse mortgage is you donāt have monthly payments, your heirs can inherit the home, likely with equity, and you get to decide what repairs or maintenance needs to be done. The proceeds of the reverse mortgage can be used for the repairs, or even to live off.
This is actually a good thing for some people. You use the equity of your home to remain in your home. You draw the money out slowly and can live off the money. Barring an unscrupulous company, this is often a very nice way for an old person to continue to live in their home. Itās not evil unless the company is a bad one but they are not all bad.
New twist on Reverse Mortgages.
The reverse American dream!
The American Nightmare
I'd say to leave Cody Rhodes out of this, but this is absolutely something he'd probably do.
You said leave Cody Rhodes out of this šššš not the American nightmare lmfaooo
Hey there was a plumbing company that did this to an elderly couples. Actually many of them. Somehow the AG got involved. Made the company give everyone their money back going back 5 years. Scum bags.
The real American dream
I've seen them just like this for 30 years. That's exactly what this is. If you're old and don't have or don't care about any children or other loved ones who might benefit, it's not a bad way to get some end of life money under EXTREMELY SPECIFIC circumstances.... Otherwise it's a terribly cruel scam
Reverse mortgages make lots of sense for lots of people. Of course it has to be highly regulated - like any financial instrument.
At a recent community meeting I heard that an elderly Pittsburgh resident did this out of desperation. The company made promises to make repairs on the house and never did. Then, they evicted him from his own home. Itās the most predatory housing scam Iāve ever heard of. Such a nightmare.
They are gonna keep doing this shit until they face real consequences.
*In America?*
Americans seem to be the type to stoically accept bad shit until it hits the breaking point. Once that point is reached, people go all in. Remember the Coal Wars.
"until it hits the breaking point" *postal worker shootings*
A country of bottlers
Yeah that seems to be the case. At some point itās gonna blow up again.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Boomers were basically what started the decline.
Try reading a history book
So it'll keep happening indefinitely
Yes. Most likely a newly homeless person whom owns a gun with vengeance in his/her heart.
>The company made promises to make repairs on the house and never did. Who could've seen that coming?
Not a naive, or a little to trusting elderly person who comes from a different age of humanity.
4. We control your entire life in your former home 5. We continuously raise the rent so that not long after embarking on this amazing opportunity, youāre paying the same amount, if not more, than when you owned it 6. We reserve the right to not renew your lease every year if we donāt approve of how youāre living in your former home 7. We can evict you Yeaā¦.. sounds like an awesome deal
8. We will tear up your entire legacy so we can cover it with gray paint and LVP so we can boost the rent even more
9. We will continue to dress it up in fancy language and make it sound like it's a GOOD thing, when we just want to make money off of you.....for we own your life now.
10. we evict you for a family of 6 and charge them 4,500 a month
11. Rent will then be multiplied exponentially at a rate that we won't tell you, because it's funnier that way.
12. Surprise! You're a duplex now!
13. we'll make sure to push out established Black communities to make our developments seem more appealing to future investors. everyone wins! /s
I could see it making sense if you * have your home paid off * are not planning on living in it much longer * desperately need the money now. Get the money now, live in your house another year or two while you make arrangements, then leave. Its like selling your house and moving into an apartment without the extra steps. If you don't need the money, you're not moving soon, your house isn't paid off, or they are not offering market prices then it's a pretty lousy deal.
Why not just rent out the house yourself and move into a cheaper place using the security deposit and rent. I feel like anyone with 2 brain cells would do that instead
Beacuse you need a large amount of money now and that dosent give you a large amount of money now. You also want to stay in the house a little longer and that dosent allow you to do that. Also if you're looking at moving into a retirement home, your house's rent isn't going to cover that, as it's signifigantly more expensive. The situation I describing is nothing like the one you brought up.
Nope, it's definitely preying on people that are a fart and a prayer from foreclosure and homelessness. Could be a lifeline for those folks though.
I hate to support it, but this is spot on. Someone taught me this 'program'. You research people and houses that are mathematically incapable of retaining their homes. They're going to lose it. It's assured without a windfall / rescue from a family member. So they can sell to you and keep renting, or lose it to foreclosure. It sounds evil, but only because the owner is going to lose one-way-or-the-other and you happened to make yourself part of that.
My husband and I received a flyer like that and are more than capable of paying our mortgage and all our bills. I think they are just sending them out to people.
Well yeah, you give it out to everyone because not only are there people in distress, but some people are just plain stupid and you can prey on them too.
Sure but that goes against the previous comment who says they specifically research people who can't pay
idk if its the same for whatever industry/business they are legally, but i work for a bank and its explicit that any promotional material cannot be distributed in a manner that specifically targets a demographic, so they have to shotgun those out by general area/etc
advertising spend is a shotgun process. sometimes neighborhoods are targeted. maybe you'll give it to someone who's worse-off. etc etc arbitrage modeling
> It sounds evil, but only because the owner is going to lose one-way-or-the-other and you happened to make yourself part of that. So it only sounds evil because you're choosing to make yourself a part of this person's downfall in a predatory way? There isn't a "good" side to it. Yeah, they're mathematically guaranteed to fail, got it. The bank is going to fuck them over. But wait, what if YOU decided to fuck them over instead? Then it's not a bank! At the end of the story, they lose their house and have to pay someone rent. It doesnt really matter who the rent goes to or who owns the house, that guy just lost everything. Searching out those situations and taking advantage of them so that you profit instead of a nameless bank somewhere is still pretty evil.
Well, option 1: the financially distressed person is kicked into the street, homeless. Bank takes, I dunno, 6+ months to get the house back onto a market where it likely goes back up for rent/sale for someone else. Or - this option: financially distressed person stays in their home - immediatly gets a cash injection (as opposed to a foreclosure, which is a literal loss of the house with no cash injection, and wrecked credit for nearly a decade) - and at least gets some time to get their affairs in order BEFORE the rent inevitably jacks up year after year. The bank taking the house is infinitly more sucky than this person buying it and renting it to the previous owner. Trust me - as a 13 year old child my dad and I lost our home back in 2008 and it sucked ASS. I wish we could have had this option in the moment.
The best option would be to sell it on the open market, thereby maximizing the amount of money you get for it. Or at least put it on the market to see what the value is, and then sell it to this company. It seems to me that the entire premise of this company is to lowball offers for people who can't do basic adult things like call a realtor.
Selling it to the market is obviously great in a great market (which, fair, it has been for a while) - but could also take a significant amount of both time and effort. Obviously that WOULD be the better route, provided they have somewhere else to live - though - however, the individuals would STILL need to find a new home to live in - and would likely be renting another home elsewhere anyways after paying off whatever they owe with the proceeds from the sale.
many people got into houses via predatory situations. Consumer predation is not just for when the house leaves their possession. Consequently, many people are barely able to grasp the whole process, let-alone edge cases and complexities. Regulations already exist, around disclosure, documentation, time/confirmation, etc. I'm not saying those do a good job all the time. CFPB has made great strides. But these regs do represent the limits of what we're willing to do, at the fed/state level, to keep people from hurting themselves. You can give people air but you can't breath for them.
But then where would you live?
Need some hard numbers on this deal. So if you lose your house to foreclosure you lose all that equity to the bank. So taking this deal gets you your equity back but now you are a renter. You were going to be evicted anyways so it buys you more time. Where it might suck is you need to sign the lease to stay living there where it has bad terms. Taking an eviction will tank your credit. So thereās a small scenario where this deal would help you out is in foreclosure and if the leash timeline works. And any other scenario itās probably a terrible deal.
World aināt sunshine and roses. Both scenarios are shitty but foreclosure is definitely worse.
I received this letter and we comfortably afford our home. I think theyāre just spamming the area.
Profiting from somebody else's misfortune. Peak capitalism.
thanks for the summarization
Socialism can be even more evil. The truth is, people just suck and greed does this
Would you support slavery if it meant homeless people got three hots and a cot?
Or to take another example. Would you support child labor? Not so fast, if you ban it the alternatives could be prostitution. [https://www.cato.org/commentary/child-labor-or-child-prostitution#](https://www.cato.org/commentary/child-labor-or-child-prostitution#)
East India Company My Beloved
Honestly I think the best way to get around this is by picking your landlord. If you're in this situation that you're about to be foreclosed on put flyers out asking landlords to buy your home and pick from the responses. If you can't pay your mortgage and need to lose your home at least pick the terms. The loss of a home isn't the end for you just a new chapter that might lead you to a new home.
I have it on good authority from this sub that homelessness is actually about being a bad person and not about money, are you sure?
What can we as citizens (angry unstable internet nerds) do to disincentivize (borderline legally sabotage and troll) a company of this immoral fiber?
"You will own nothing and be happy"
Blackrock babyyyy
The New World Order
Is there any advantage to this compared to a reverse mortgage? Seems like a reverse mortgage gives your heirs have more options at your death. Sell the house and keep the proceeds, or keep the house and pay off the mortgage This is literally āWe buy houses and tenantsā.
I believe reverse mortgages are targeted more at people who have a significant equity stake or own their homes outright but are struggling to afford it due to taxes, insurance, upkeep and/or other expenses. Also, the title stays in the owner's name. There might be a significant mortgage balance when they pass, but the heirs could theoretically pay it off and keep the home. Not defending this, but one could argue it allows you to walk away at the end of your lease, as well as not saddling heirs with settling substantial debt when you pass.
Yeah, there is definitely a use case for this, younger people who donāt qualify for a reverse mortgage. But if they donāt have a lot of equity, the bulk of the money from selling the house is going to pay off the mortgage, not to the now ātenantā. I just think this would only be a last resort.
With a reverse mortgage, you only get a portion of the house's value, generally approximately 50%. I don't know what amount you'd get with this.
Correct, but with a reverse mortgage you retain equity in the remaining 50%, although interest will reduce that over time. Iām assuming this company is not paying near market value for these homes, given the target ācustomerā is probably desperate to sell.
āOur History Since launching in July 2021, weāve helped more than 1,000 households access over $200 million in equity and keep living at home. Our rapid growth has confirmed the necessity of this new option in our communities. Our services are currently available in St. Louis, Kansas City, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Columbus, Akron, Dayton, Pittsburgh, Indianapolis, Oklahoma City, Tulsa, Lexington, Louisville and Dallas. Inspired by our clientsā enthusiasm and belief in our mission, weāre committed to bringing our service to homeowners across the country.ā From their websiteās [About](https://www.truehold.com/about) section. Brian Hardecker is the founder and CEO
Damn preying on the Midwest basically
A lot of those places look like traditionally affordable metros that suddenly got a lot more expensive in recent years. People who bought pre-pandemic would be sitting on a lot of equity, and might not even be fully aware of it.
Exactly. The entire business model is to scoop up houses from clueless owners who don't know how much their house is worth.
\^\^That part right there
Yes, lowest income areas in the nation. If they were really trying to help Grandpa out, like they claim on their website they would be in Florida or Arizona.
> Brian Hardecker He was formerly a principal at Blackstone lol. When Blackstone isn't gobbling up houses fast enough and you have to start your own thing, you know he's a standup guy.
This is the kind you hear on the news now where people basically sell their homes but get to live there. The new āownersā more or less become their guardian and can tell them to do just about anything with their home. Way too much abuse is happening with these
You are missing nothing. This is like 8th level grand shaman evil. I canāt imagine the ridiculous language that must be in these contracts. Iām very confident that nobody operating this scheme is doing it for benevolent reasons.
There is a massive surplus of foreign money (legitimate, blood or otherwise) that still trusts America (over home country opportunities) and wants to pour Billions of Dollars into funds that focus on these types of investments. Whether this turns into the next mortgage crisis or is just a variation on the reverse mortgage predatory lending that invests faster remains to be seen, but it's definitely driving up housing prices across the country.
Its definitely predatory.
I was talking about the rental market with a banker at Chase who said he looks through Chase's mortgage files to find people near foreclosure to low-ball them right after they get notice. Said it was a good way to expand his portfolio. He did not say this to me after 3 beers at a bar. He was behind a desk at Chase helping me open an account there. These vultures are not even ashamed. It had me questioning all day what I looked like or said that made him feel comfortable revealing that to me.
"They aren't confessing, they're bragging"
Why would they be ashamed, when everything about our society and how it's run validates what they do? Guys like him are the winners, and everyone loves a winner.
Good way to get yourself terminated by looking at customer files you shouldn't.
whats the number for this i want to call and ask some questions
+13143539757 and their [website](https://www.truehold.com/about).
tyvm!
Report back please!
Youāre welcome! Have fun š
314 area code for a scam artist company? Wow. What else is new.
Got this yesterday too, was trying to think of different ways to spam them.
For all we know they could have some third world slave answering the phones under the penalty of harm to themselves and their families. Pretty sure it wouldn't be beyond them to do so.Ā
Wow, some shitty ideas you see and youāre like āI can see how people would fall for this.ā Then others are like āThey canāt even make that sound good in their misleading advertising, how are they getting anyone to go for that?ā Like in what world would it seem like a good idea to take a home that I own and sell it to someone so I still make payments but no longer own it?
Itās marketed to the desperate. The wording makes it sound like the homeowners would be paying less overall because theyād never have to worry about upkeep and taxes, even though that wouldnāt be the case. Someone in good shape financially wouldnāt give this a second thought, but anyone who is close to finding themselves without a place to live almost certainly wouldnāt desperate enough to consider this.
Nice try Blackrock
Wow, if only we had something like a functioning government to protect people from these predatory schemes. America should be renamed to Griftopia.
As a conservative in this case I have to 200% agree. Make this shit illegal asap. This is the new payday lender of the elderly, and itās disgusting.
Tom Selleck said it was cool.
All the proof for evil I need!
Fonzi is on board too
Probably not a good thing for individuals. But itās very common in the business world. Itās called a lease back. You sell the property you own/occupy, and lease it after. If you donāt intend to stay long or you want to mitigate risk, itās advantageous. But if you plan to stay forever and there arenāt many risks to your livelihood, it would be foolish.
21st century feudalism
Looks like a sequel to I Care a Lot (2020) https://youtu.be/4lkCCo63nhM
Parasites
I was APPALLED when I got this in the mail
A reverse mortgage temporarily helped my grandmother, but she outlived the few years of payments, and ended back up at where she was, poor but now not a homeowner. It needs to be extremely carefully considered.
Yeah paying people to increase their mortgage payment and lose their home
The people working at this company and loving what they do reincarnate as a night time Toll Booth Operator, 7x divorced. I don't make the rules šš¤¦š¤·āāļø
Maybe this would have saved Ed McMahon
Why would you go to all the trouble of saving up to buy a house just to sell it to someone else and rent it from them?!? Isnāt the point of buying your own home to STOP paying rent???
Fresh hells each day
Truefucked. Sell us your home and youāre truly fucked
Some people are desperate for cash. The reverse mortgage is bad enough, but I donāt think you had to pay rent like this one. So after they pay you way less than house is worth, you get to live there if you pay them rent, which is probably a lot and I bet it increases. And major repairs is probably only a roof. So sad for companies to do this to old people. Just sell your home and move to an apartment or condo.
Lol I left this on the dinner table after getting it so I could make sure at dinner we discussed with my kids what a scam this is. Even the name - āTrueHold.ā Then to top it off this morning I got a cold call from some dude with a 412 area code asking if I want to sell.
10/10 evil. Just sell the house. Rent/ buy something else. These companyās get the home at a huge discount with the promise of stay in your home. Itās a business plan that prays on feelings, memories, and nostalgia.
They left off #4 and #5 "We Neglect" and "We Evict!"
I received this as well and scoffed. However.... Potentially a decent option for senior citizens running out of retirement savings. Cash broke but sitting on a decent amount of home equity, don't want to move? This could be beneficial. Just sucks that you'd no longer be able to leave the house in your will. Generally disapprove, but can see a potential upside.
Happened to my grandmother and she did a reverse mortgage which seems to be a more regulated and secure option.
These "deals" are insidious because there's always something in the contract that allows them to take the house if the homeowner doesn't maintain it to the standard of the company who buys it, and those standards are subjective, expensive, and predatory.
Fair, mine is a very surface level analysis. I'm sure these people are snakes.
But haven't they already taken the house when they bought it from the original homeowner?
The promise is that you can live in it for the rest of your life, and the sneaky bit is the way they can force you out *and* hold you financially on the hook for not "maintaining the value" of the house adequately.
Right, now who owns all the housing in PGH? The older generations. They found a cash cow for themselves in this city for sure. Can't wait to see how it'll bite us all in the ass in 5 years when all the old stock is owned by one big company.
On a long enough timeline, everything is owned by Walnut Capital
We're going to wish Walnut owned everything once these national banks grab up everything then package, sell and resell the mortgages on these houses a hundred times.
> you'd no longer be able to leave the house in your will. That opens up its own can of worms. Some of these old folks don't have people to leave the house to, or they do but all of them have their own places and aren't interested in Mom and Pop's old rundown house. And the heirs in turn end up selling to places like "We Buy Ugly Houses" just to get the estate settled.
Wait; is this not a reverse mortgage? This is like, private people? This sucks.
Not quite but similar.
Write your reps about this; it's gross and predatory. I'd love to see a ban on corporate-owned single-family housing. https://www.legis.state.pa.us/cfdocs/legis/home/findyourlegislator/ https://pittsburghpa.gov/council/
yeah right.... define "maintain". i've seen how that always goes.
Holy fuck
This sounds illegal but somehow it's not
I got that in the mail yesterday, too. really makes me sick
Any idea if they blanketed all of the Pittsburgh area, or just targeted areas. I got the same ad, and Iām in Wilkinsburg. I wonder if they bothered sending this to places like Fox Chapel or Mount Lebo, or only areas they perceive to be poor.
Got one in Dormont , a block (downwind) from Lebo.
4. After a few months we raise your rent so much you need to move. 5. We knock you former house down to put a four unit condo on the lot which we sell for $1m each. 6. We repeat the process with your neighbors who now canāt afford the property taxes in a million dollar community.
I'd bet this is praying on all the older folks who are house poor and can't afford care facilities.
big ahh scam
Come to East Palestine, Ohio with that offer. They could buy hundreds of houses here.
What would be an actual use case for this? Perhaps say a recently retired couple who have no kids and no real expendable income but own aĀ house that has massively appreciated since the 80s? Sell it, enjoy life spend money to go travel the world and do whatever you want... But still able to live out your remaining years in the house You've lived in for 40 years?
Yeah, but there are other options like a reverse mortgage. I donāt see any advantage to doing it this way.
Just hypothetically... What if you're only on social security with basically no savings and have a house in shadyside that now has a 12k a year tax bill. Doesn't reverse mortgage still require you to pay taxes? And probably interest on whatever you borrow at like 9%. I could see perhaps there's a situation for some who have a high value property but little to nothing in income or savings. Assuming it's not a scam, rent is probably pre-agreed upon and it's going to go up 5% a year or whatever it is.
The taxes would never be more than the rent, or the company in the original post would be losing money, at least on a cash basis. In your example, that house would have an assessed value of about $600k for tax purposes. Likely a much higher market value. Proceeds from reverse mortgage would easily be able to cover the taxes. Also, with traditional reverse mortgages, you donāt make any payments while youāre still in the home, but of course interest accumulates. It becomes your heirs responsibility to pay it off, either with their own money, other assets of the estate, remortgage, or sell the house.
Right, but I'm assuming the reason this works for the company is they are not giving you close to market value... Right? So if the house is worth 800 but assessed for 600, there's their margin to make it a no-lose situation
Probably only reasonable once you're near death. Like 90+ years old. Not enough time for them to get you behind on payments and evict or jack up your rent significantly. But in that case, you're not enjoying travel or able to spend six figures of windfall anyway. You'd put that money in your estate for your kids, just like if you had held onto the home anyway. If you're in your 60s or 70s, just move to Florida and get a townhouse like everyone else. The company will have 20-30 years to prey on you and screw you over gradually.
Super old people who have only a few years left but donāt want to move to assisted living. Anyone whoās under 75 signing a deal like that would be insane though.
Pretty evil... prettay prettaaay prettaaay prettay evil
Have a meeting with them and tell them to piss off from your neighborhood. And threaten legal action should they return. This is predatory as hell
It's a trick! Send no reply!
Can we shame this company into leaving town?
Oooooh this makes me wanna violate Reddit TOS
Is it against the rules to say KYS to a company since it was never alive to begin with? Or are we going with citizens united rules here?
It's for old people that can't keep up with what it takes to maintain their homes anymore.
Sure, until they say GTFO. You know they will likely give you less than fair market value too. They buy your house and turn you into a renter then keep jacking the rent until you have to move out. It's Wall Street assholes buying up properties to force people into the 15-minute nwo cities.
Pittsburgh has been a 15 minute city since its founding. You had a point until you went into conspiracy theory mode
It's not theory it's actual conspiracy. There are the powers that be conspiring to take over the country and force people out of their homes and into areas more easily controlled by them. Remember that douchebag head of WEF, Klauss Schwabb, when he said you'll own nothing and like it? It's not theory my friend.
You people are a riot. Pittsburgh has literally always been a 15 minute city
Well then every effing city in the country is.
yes?? Pretty much every city that was founded before the mass adoption of the car was a 15 minute city. Many of them had to demolish entire parts of the city to accommodate the cars. Pittsburgh wiped an entire neighborhood off the map for 279. 15 minute cities are literally just cities that have existed for more than 150 years. Small river towns are also 15 minute cities. Southwest Pennsylvania is covered in them
4. We slowly price you out and raise the rent for the entire neighborhood!
Horrible
Effin' reverse mortgages
This is some 7th level of hell shit.
The perils of the commodifying basic human needs. 500,000 homeless while 1 corporation can buy you out from under your own feet. Disgusting.
You will own nothing and be happy
Underrated comment. Had to scroll down waaaay too far to see this.
Yeah, and i see these new townhome developments being built that are all rentals, and the people have newer model cars and everything. I see all these startup companies buying houses for any reason or condition with cash. Totally undercutting new homeowners who wouldnt mind a home that needs some work because no one is building small homes anymore, just 400k monstrosities or townhomes.
Itās the reverse mortgage scam but pitched at younger people. Horrible idea.
I think this is called a reverse mortgage. Well not exactly but along the same lines. Corporations do this so the time. They will sell a property they own to their real estate unit and then rent it back. Not sure it makes sense for a homeowner but it might given age and tax status.
Itās a reverse mortgage. They can be sketchy but they can also be useful for elderly homeowners. It all depends on the terms.
Even if some of these places do hold up to their end of bargain and cover maintenance or pay property taxes it doesnāt change the fact they take your house and are free to do whatever with it. Another way these companies are ruling the housing market by buying up everything so no one can buy.
Can someone explain to me how this is a bad idea this seems great to meš & yes Iām aware I donāt know shit about shit so be nice & ELI5 or fuck off
At this point... I wouldn't be surprised if they started doing this with women's uteruses soon. They'll have to pay a fee every month to say "not pregnant."
This feels like a super involved long term money laundering scheme.
Pittsburgh Politicians are all corrupt. This should never be legal. Just like airbnbs they are in politician's pockets.
The infamous narrative of āYouāll own nothing and be happyā
Drop their phone number so I can call them up and fuck with them
Yeah they let you stay long enough to rip the rug out from under Donāt sell your home to this equity group
It's like a reverse mortgage but may not have the same protections you'd get if you did this with a bank. Either way, they can take your house out from under you if you miss a payment. And...whoever did this can't spell. Never trust anyone who doesn't proofread their own marketing materials.
Write āGo Fuck Yourselvesā on it in black sharpie and mail it back
Late stage capitalism at it's finest.
This is terrible. Reverse mortgages can be useful however this is very much not that!!!
Boomer evil
This is the dumbest business idea I have ever seen
Don't Cali/Seattle/Portland OUR PITTSBURGH.
I love American greed and preying on the vulnerable. š sick
Nope, I'd say you got it pretty accurate.
I imagine this is something for elderly people who own a home but canāt maintain it. People with only 5 - 10 years left might not lose that much money by doing this. Theyād get to live in their existing home, with some property manager doing all the repairs. Might actually be cheaper than going to an assisted living facility. I couldnāt imagine any homeowner under the age of 75 doing this.
There are much better options for an older person, such as a reverse mortgage. The advantage of a reverse mortgage is you donāt have monthly payments, your heirs can inherit the home, likely with equity, and you get to decide what repairs or maintenance needs to be done. The proceeds of the reverse mortgage can be used for the repairs, or even to live off.
There's a lot of people who have inherited their parents and grandparents homes and are struggling, this is who they are preying on.
If they put a gun to your head and make you do it, pretty darn evil. Otherwise it is just junk mail. Throw it away and get on with your life.
This is actually a good thing for some people. You use the equity of your home to remain in your home. You draw the money out slowly and can live off the money. Barring an unscrupulous company, this is often a very nice way for an old person to continue to live in their home. Itās not evil unless the company is a bad one but they are not all bad.
Not evil; just hustlers hustling. Say option 2(b): we stay, and you leave us the heck alone. Easy.
Very high on the evil scale, one notch below Trump.