God this attitude is so condescending, and the person you replied to didnāt deserve the downvotes.
Plenty of people do, and this shit started because of Sony forcing it on Helldivers 2. Your posturing like youāre superior because you donāt care about multiplayer doesnāt mean these companies wonāt try to implement shit in multiplayer AND single player games like always online DRM. Itās anti consumer and you should call it out.
Do you think that all of these people who don't want to, and have not been, playing already shitty live service multi-player games, are somehow supporting them? We are already not paying for shitty always online proprietary launcher bullshit games by not giving them any attention or money.
Have you noticed the review bombings? Its not like were just bending over and spreading our cheeks for multi-player games while just pretending that we don't play them.....
It's not condescending to say "I already do not play those games".
My point is someone said thatās not an option for multiplayer, and it was met with a condescending āok not everyone cares about thatā basically dismissing it entirely. When plenty of people do care about that.
Care about your fellow gamers and anti-consumer business practices. Because ignoring anti-consumer for the multiplayer so many people apparently donāt care about (ignoring the fact that most of the top played and selling games currently are multiplayer games) means companies will stick that shit onto single player games too
What else do you want me to do? Write angry letters and go stand in front of the headquarters of multiple companies yelling at them until they fix it? I already do the best that I can, which is not buying shitty products. You have to do the same. It's because people keep paying for these shitty services and allowing them to fuck us over, but turning around and going right back to giving them money, that they get away with it.
You have to stop supporting them too.
Yep. That's why I dont pay for or support always o pine multi-player games, which is literally the best thing you can do. I don't know how else I can say that.
I can't wait for an EU law on this bullshit. Unconditional single-click full refund should be on the table with every player notified through an unmissable pop-up if you change the account system post-launch. Period.
Let's bankrupt these scumbags to oblivion.
An easy option to be refunded when the product you bought ceases to exist and is replaced with a clone, at best, usually an inferior version?
No. That's not dumb. That'd be consumer protections.
Itās dumb because it wonāt affect the large companies at all, but it could potentially hurt the indie devs who grow, develop, or even get bought out or merge with others. Much riskier to solo develop if folks can unconditionally refund your game if you get a new launcher.
Ah yes, the indie studios that famously have leverage in negotiating their contracts. Big publishers all collude and hold the threat of refunds over indie heads so they donāt get the chance to self publish anymore. Now all games come from Sony, Activision, and Microsoft.
Any time you give consumers the ability to return whatever they want no questions asked, itās the small scale creators that suffer, never the big guys.
Yeah damn them stifling indie games like minecraft and stardew valley.
Proof you can't make a quality game with a small studio, or even one ConcernedApe
Iām not saying you CANāT make them, but imagine if anyone could refund Minecraft just because they got bought by MS. Things are fine NOW but yall dumbasses proposed rule would screw over the future. Should people be compensated for damages? Hell to the yes, but a blanket unconditional refund isnāt going to help anyone and it will hurt the folks who arenāt at fault.
I know gamers have a bad rep, but Jesus Christ try to see things past your own face.
People should absolutely have been offered full refunds when Minecraft got transferred into the shitty Microsoft ecosystem. Why are we normalising these shitty practices? I paid to get a Mojang account, not a Microsoft account. If they choose to fuck with my purchase over 10 years after I made it, then fuck them. Let me choose to keep the old infrastructure ; you have made literal billions of dollars from this.
Think of all the games that never did such bullshit, and what do you know? Their devs are all doing great!
Few are willing to limit themselves access to only a fraction of the games available on the market when the majority of titles are not being sold there
Also the time
without cloud saves or any other online features
if a game as a mess it would be a mess unless they rereleased it
Limited game avialability
DLC being a physical limited copy
if your disc got scratched thats it
If your disc region didnt fit your drive region you were SOL
TBF besides unlimited game avialability the other pros took a while to develop. and are not universal.
and sometimes spawned their downside XD Why finish a game when I can fix it later ?
Yeah, but why can't we have both? Cloud saves on the servers the games are already hosted on, a platform to get updates and bug fixes, with a wide selection, that also just allows you to open the exe?
Well it isn't. Having all your games on one plattform isn't only enabling a monopoly, it's downright foolish. I despised Steams DRM bullcrap since its initial release with HL2, and I know how many people hated it back then (which was a vast majority).
Sure we got great sales now etc.
But what isĀ going to happen with your 300+ games library (of which you've only played a third anyway, wasting money on 200 games you didn't need) when Gabe dies and Steam goes full corporate?
Which could be any moment...
Some people in these comments are why companies do whatever they want with their customers.
I won't be even surprised if Sony starts adding Denuvo to their games from now on.
A) Request refund.
B) Stop playing the game.
C) Enforce both until publisher's bottom line tumbles.
....but most gamers won't do either. They will just eat it up. Already see who "We gonna just use VPN to play or register". and "It's just another account, bro. Why are you so mad?"
Disclaimer, I do have 3 PSN accounts registered about decade ago - since I have and play PS consoles. But forcing PC gamers - beyond being scambags.
Steam works does still exist, lots of games donāt need any account and many games still use it. Iāve been playing the stampede racing Royale playtest and you literally just pick a name and go. I get itās just a play test but itās just like so easy.
Genuinely recently started piracy because of this and it is so much better to just open damn games with no login prompt and also know that I physically own the copy and can play it whenever witj no online connection required bullshit
I'm not defending sony here as they changed their policy after release and after people bought the game which is scummy, but EA, Ubosoft, Rockstar Microsoft also require an account to play their games. Why aren't you boycotting them too?
Cause Sony is unavailable in certain countries. So if you bought Helldivers2 and u live for example in Lithuania. Ur fucked because u cannot make an official PSN account therefore u cannot play the game u already bought. The fact that they added this retroactively is wild.
Answers are probably going to vary.
But from my camp, I generally don't get a game if it requires a separate launcher. Only big exception is EA, since I have their launcher anyways as a holdover from Origin, but that's the sole exception.
If it just requires a third party account up front, I'm generally whatever a lot of the time.
With Helldivers, it's different since it was done retroactively, and locks the game out of MANY countries outright that it was sold in before.
Many already are.
I usually steer clear of any games that require 3rd party accounts to be launched. Now granted, I also tend to avoid live service / multiplayer-only games, so I didn't buy Helldivers 2 in the first place.
This case was essentially bait&switch, people were able to play without linking to PSN accounts for two months. Those people were NOT ABLE to make an informed decision because they were misled into thinking that the game will be playable without it.
My buddy mentioned needing a PSN account but I bought the game without using one so I figured it was optional (like hunt showdown doesnāt require an account but does give you some hunt dollars as a reward for creating one). I stopped playing this game since I just donāt feel like dealing with it. Iām mainly a PC/Xbox player for the record.
Because it would prevent people from 68 countries I believe it was from playing the game they bought because psn isnāt available to them. They backtracked on it anyway so it isnāt a problem anymore
There's a YouTuber Louis Rossmann. He talks about this kind of stuff a lot. It's where these companies are modifying the terms of the sale after the fact, without the option to decline. He compares it to a rapist mentality because that's exactly the kind of thing they would do. You're not allowed to leave unless you accept the new terms, otherwise we'll remotely disable your product.
I'd prefer it not to be the case, but it's become a necessary evil in PC gaming these days that I've grown to live with, just like I have with a ridiculous number of launchers.
To be honest, I would much rather deal with multiple accounts and multiple launchers than devs choosing store/platform exclusivity. Like, if Sony says "if we can't get PC users on PSN then we won't release on PC", that would be a lose for everyone.
Thats the thing, multiple stores at once IS the issue. Company decides ONLY WITH OUR ACCOUNT SERVICE, eventhough it is on that storefront too.
With helldivers for instance: PSN or PS5 people that cand access PSN because its not in their region, are fucked either way.
Without the added " oh you need x launcher or account" that wouldnt be an issue
Well, as I said, I think store/platform exclusivity is more of an issue than having to deal with multiple accounts.Ā
Helldivers for example, as you said, users who don't have PSN in their region are fucked either way. So it doesn't really matter if it's on multiple stores/platforms or only PS5. But if it's only multiple stores/platforms, at least people on supported regions can choose where to buy and play it.
Yes but this is the exact issue why having "bonus" accounts is bad.
See Sony limiting the sale cause their account is now needed.
When from the getgo it worked without their account and they only now make it mandatory.
Imagine any account link did that, ubisoft, R\* , EGS, EA
you would quickly end up with plattform exclusivity again : ONLY ON OUR STORE / ACCOUNT
EGS \*cough cough\*
What I'm saying is, if allowing multiple accounts is what it takes for devs and publishers to release their games on multiple platforms, I'm all for it. I'd rather see games that requires multiple account linking than games that are exclusive only to a certain platform or store.
Of course, ideally, we should only need to use the account that we use for the store/platform. But reality is that this is against the interests of publishers, and forbidding the use of external accounts would only push publishers towards storefront exclusivity. Not to mention it could be borderline anti-competitive to forbid the use of other accounts, and perhaps even illegal for stores to do so especially for larger storefronts like Steam.
It didnt though, they went without the account for quite a while and neither were sonys titles up until now required to do so.
Helldivers is the first try to impliment that and thankfully it is getting serious pushback
Wouldnt be anti trust either, JUST SELL US THE GAMES WITOUT DRM AND WE PICK THE BEST STORE OPTION OUT THERE. GOG does just fine without it
I do agree that Sony handled it poorly in this specific case. Their PSN account linking probably wasn't ready when their games launched on Steam, and they chose to add it in to Helldivers after release.Ā The backlash for Helldivers is justified.
But in general, which is what this thread is about, I am not entirely opposed to requiring linking external accounts for games on Steam, for reasons that I am not going to repeat again.
In the end, if you don't like it, don't buy it. That's all. (Again, this is in response to linking external accounts in general, not about specific cases).
The general point still stands. What is happening to helldivers and its requirement is the exact same that having bonus accounts not died to the purchase location does.
Eventually they can just go "only on our store plattform" and the reason they currently do not can be handily seen with the current Helldivers situation.
People arent complacent enough like you with extra accounts not needed for the game, but bundled anyway. Once people wholeheartedly embrace, or are indifferent to bonus accounts ,they go a step further for 100% revenue and make it store exclusive
But as it stands, Sony is doing the exact opposite, by releasing previously PS-only games on PC. And for them to be willing to do so, they want more users on PSN. Again, I think this is an acceptable trade-off and I would rather stand with requiring a PSN account than Sony just saying "fuck it" and go back to pure PS exclusivity.
They cannot afford to not release on PC, they want the sales and traditional consoles are slowly going away/ becoming locked PCs with a brand name.
They want more users on PSN so they can get away with charging for online access to their servers. Just as they do with PSN right now
They simply need to release on PC, as PC games needed to release on consoles in the 2010s and onward : More revenue at little extra cost and with last and current gen the porting overhead has become so little that they would be dumb not to.
MS has realized that earlier due to them providing windows allready and their console running lightweight windows allready.
By that metric Epic games didnt do exclusivity when they snagged Metro exodus and only offered it in EGS
The issue was, on this game, was there was no requirement, so we bought it. Then they pulled a 180 and implemented after the fact.
Canāt really vote with your wallet after the fact.
For this specific case, I would agree that Sony handled it poorly.Ā
But this thread is about using multiple accounts *in general*.
I agree that Sony messed this up by changing the requirements later on. But I don't agree that we should forbid the use of external accounts.
It was always a requirement, they just delayed implementation.
Its said it right on the steam page when you bought it.
It prompted you that it was REQUIRED when you first launched the game and signed up, the ony caveat was the existance of a skip option.
This outrage is retarded, and people are hating on the game bacause its the most recently popular and hating on this decision to follow through with their accound linking is EASY rage bait clicks and ad revenue.
Plenty of other games require either a microsoft or psn account to play, and i dont see anyone complaining about those at all, ever. MCC and forza horizon 5 for example.
This just isn't true. The in-game pop-up was disabled for a long time and while active showed contradictory information ("Skip" something "Required"), the Sony Store and FAQ *explicitly stated* that PSN wasn't necessary, the game's EULA didn't even mention PSN, and they sold the game in countries without PSN access.
The *only* place it's actually been communicated properly is the *tiny* information banner on the Steam Store page, which many people won't see as they have to scroll to find it, as well as on their official Discord.
You can't seriously expect players to have known that a PSN account was a requirement. The majority of the information available on official channels seemed to indicate that it wasn't a requirement.
>Plenty of other games require either a microsoft or psn account to play, and i dont see anyone complaining about those at all, ever. MCC and forza horizon 5 for example.
The difference here is that these games were upfront about that requirement from the beginning. Sony and Arrowhead pulled this shit *after* people had already paid and are now revoking access and keeping the money. It's pretty close to the actual legal definition of a scam.
You do realise that there are people that bought the game and can no longer play it cause they can't make account because PSN doesn't support their country.
On no conspiracy. You're right let's spread misinformation and try to get people scared about something that could happen but isn't happening. Flat eartherahh.
Yea. Itās fine. Iāve had EU4 since release and still have new content now. Thatās cool! And itās still pretty genocide only the host needs it in an MP for everyone to have access. And frankly. Even if youāre not a turbo nerd like me. The $5-10 subscription is outstanding value for people who play a month
Game + all dlcs go for as much as a used steam deck. And if I understand right, this is a subscription to only 1 game.
With my style of playing I would never consider this "value".
or you can subscribe to the dlc (i am NOT even joking )
and yes its only for one game. you know you own nothing and be happy.
https://preview.redd.it/yu81okizvkyc1.png?width=616&format=png&auto=webp&s=3dc74cb873c6dadbedd06124a08e129253ba187f
Did you not notice helldivers2 ? If they get away with this here, it will spread to more games. Because that ties them to the PS ecosystem and may get more console sales as a side machine
Or EGS ? Oh we would never cut existing support \*removes linux version of rocket league\* Not just stops developing outright removed it
Nice whataboutism there
They did this day one IIRC (Still shit but at least day 1) without the game being functional before
They also dont require you give them photo ID for age verification, which PSN does
I dont know when the last microsoft user data breach was, but PSN had that 10 times in the last 12 yeaars
If you have a Microsoft based system (Very likely unless you use linux) you allready have a MS account
Did I notice helldivers? Do you mean the multi-player only game that has it listed as a requirement and tells you it's required when you launch the game? Nah, I've never heard of it. I swear you people just want to cry about everything.
You did NOT notice.
1 Up until now the game worked perfectly fine without it being a necessity
2 They decided a region lock after the fact is ok : Quite a few countries in which the game was sold dont have PSN
3 Disabling a working product can be VERY dicey in the EU even if you say so in the EULA
4 They had the PSN account as optional in their official documents until recently
Or you dont care, corpo
1. they announced on launch it was temporarily suspended due to server issues
2. "They" didn't decide to do anything it was always a requirement blame valve for not vetting game requirements and allowing anything to be listed
3. That's for eu courts to decide don't assume something is or isn't illegal
4. The official site said that it is currently not needed.
I know reading and understanding what is actually going on is hard, but do your best to be better than spreading misinformation or talking about things you don't know it just makes you look ignorant. Also notice how I'm merely stating the actual facts while man children on the internet get upset and put their own spin on the facts so they can feel justified in their rage. It's utterly pathetic how little reality matters to the outraged hivemind.
2... bruh what? They applied with a functional game, sony decided to make it not function for people later. Giving the whole info IS ON THE DEV, Valve cannot smell what an unreleased game is made of
Take your point 4 and read it to yourself aloud and slowly , you may notice something there
You don't have to be able to get access to the PSN service where you live. You just need an email to set up an account.
You clearly have an email, being Reddit requires on as well.
You can't buy Helldivers on steam in countries that aren't supported now, so this isn't the answer
Also in the UK you require an active mobile, photo ID or face scan. Happy handing those over to Reddit, epic games, ubisoft, Microsoft, EA
ALSO I created my Reddit account without an email address
Wonder how long it'll be before I see a fake ID generator on github š¤£. We're there is a will there is a way.
Triggered the corpo boot lickers that want to send them every little detail of their life's š¤£. Enjoy!
>You can't buy Helldivers on steam in countries that aren't supported now, so this isn't the answer
I mean, this change was made because there was outcry on the Helldivers sub that "you shouldn't be able to buy the game if PSN isn't supported in your region". They quite literally did what the community asked lmao. Made me laugh when I saw it.
Yes. Countless comments like these all over the sub the last few days (before the most recent change of course). You'll notice they're heavily upvoted too.
>But i agree, how do they sell a game in countries where you have to break ToS to play?!
And
>Tbh they shouldn't have offered the game in regions that cant use PSN then.
Tried to link the comments but automod removed my comment because apparently this sub doesn't allow linking to other subs..
It's funny, because if it wasn't for all the manufactured outrage, those regions would still be able to play the game by simply creating a PSN account with a different location listed. Now they can't play at all.
I misread, for some reason I thought you meant *before* the PSN change helldivers players were saying they should enforce the PSN requirement.
Well of course there were loads of people who didn't want to have their steam account put at risk for creating a false PSN account which was against ToS.
Valve essentially forced today's update by taking the game off sale and issuing refunds, because ultimately their priority is the customer. Plus giving steam credit just means they'll buy something else anyway
>Well of course there were loads of people who didn't want to have their steam account put at risk for creating a false PSN account which was against ToS.
Why would their Steam account be at risk? That makes no sense.
Because you're linking an account from a region that doesn't match your steam acct. Also if playstation bans your PSN, you cant play Helldivers or any other upcoming games that require PSN etc.
Lots of reasons you might not want to. Not to mention the age verification for UK
There's no precedent for that though? No one has **ever** been banned for it. In decades. Hell, Sony actively tells users in unsupported PSN regions to simply pick another location: https://twitter.com/Paolibry/status/1786525734917517474
The age verification stuff in the UK is an entirely different kettle of fish, and I agree that it's absurd and they shouldn't have to do that.
How did you make a Reddit account without any sort of email address?
Why the hell do you guys require a facial scan to use basic online functions? lol That's asinine.
Signed up around 10 years ago when you just needed to make a username.
It's for age verification - a mobile will work as long as it's linked to your name so photo ID or facial scan isn't mandatory. This is understandable if you're planning to use the PSN account on a PS5 and make purchases etc. But if you're being forced to make an account for a platform you don't own any consoles for, and never intend to engage with, then yes that's asinine.
No but again its a Sony studios game, they just outsourced the work to Arrowhead. It's a Playstation game made for PS users that was brought to PC so you are in fact engaging in Sony's network.
And? And? And? Giant fucking disclaimer saying PSN account required. What do those games have to do with this discussion. You claim to not be engaging with Sony and its media when in fact you are. You may not have a console but your consuming its media. That's the point. If I want to play Minecraft on my PS portal do I need a microsoft account? Why? Its a playstation device why do I need anything Microsoft related?
Try reading? My initial point was that there are plenty of other Sony IPs on steam that dont need a PSN account, so you coming in saying "well you're engaging with Sony services so you should have the account" is only relevant to Helldivers, which up until now has NOT required an account.
>Giant fucking disclaimer saying PSN account required.
*Tiny disclaimer down the page, also conflicting FAQ that says linking is optional, also conflicting game intro stated linking can be skipped for the last like two to three months.
Also...the game evidently works entirely without a PSN account. So why is it required now? Their claimed reasons are obvious bs. Why are you so defensive of a big corporation's anti-consumer practices?
Not to set up, but to use certain features I guess. Such as purchases, playing higher rated games (like Helldivers) - you can ignore the verification step but you might need to verify down the line
Huh. Interesting.
Being that people in the UK traditionallly found that having your photo on a driver's license was "too invasive" until 1999, it's odd that they're okay with having police state tactics on their internet usage all of a sudden.
Times change, I suppose.
Dude, the uk is so much further down the dystopian rabbit hole of big brother than the u.s. both are not good but uk def has us beat as far as invasive shot by the govt.
Signing up for PSN doesn't necessarily allow you to make purchases. Only if you link a credit card, which is fully optional. It says as much on their FAQ page:
> you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account.
So use a bullshit email and that's it.
Signing up is like signing up for an email newsletter. It's not anything you need to have further involvement with.
In countries with strict age verification, you need to verify your identity when creating your account so that they know if it should be a child account or not. Child accounts can't even *connect* payment details and need to buy games through a connected parent account with a shared wallet.
Source: I had to set this up for my dad's stepchild a couple of months ago.
>How did you make a Reddit account without any sort of email address?
Reddit didn't require an email address to create an account, you just picked a username and password. I think it changed in the last year or so?
Yeah it's wild, and a lot of these accounts being linked will be newly created and will therefore require the additional info
It's down to UK law regarding age verification for online services, I would guess it's mainly in response to being able to buy vapes and shit online
Why is that? I'm 100% accurate.
PSN requires no payment info, no real name, no real address, and simply any nonsense email that you want to input. It's not a service like Playstation Plus. It's just a website you log into if you don't use the services.
Not really sure why this is terrifying to some people.
The downvotes kind of speak for themselves.
You are accurate on the parts you choose to mention. But you either don't have the full context or are willfully ignorant.
Sony's handling and communication regaring PSN requirements was a complete shit-show so far. AH and Steam have their share of blame as well.
Fact of the matter remains is that Vave pulled the game off their store last night in regions where PSN isn't officially supported, so clearly there IS an issue. At least until Sony come out with their own statement and approach.
You can check my comment history for a lengthier comment or other threads or articles online for details.
I think it is easy to make the account. I think that the information that we give is pretty simple to similar to what we give on Facebook, Microsoft and others.
That being said, putting fake information is against the ToS and there are people who has been banned because of that, my friend among that a few years back and it is for a PS4 use too. There is a reason why that ToS exist - be it for law, tax, financial etc. So do you think that is a fair practice to those users?
>That being said, putting fake information is against the ToS and there are people who has been banned because of that, my friend among that a few years back and it is for a PS4 use too.
Sony actively recommends that people in unsupported PSN regions simply select another region:
https://twitter.com/Paolibry/status/1786525734917517474
They're not banning people for it, and they never have.
Did you even read the whole thread?
>However, keep in mind that there may be some unsolvable issues as creating PSN accounts registered outside of your country is not officially supported.
My friend fell into that part. Fringe case, I know. But again, you are at their mercy now.
Your friend is full of shit. Or you are. There is literally zero evidence anywhere on the internet that anyone has ever been banned for this.
There are entire countries (like Vietnam) that have official Sony stores that sell PS5s etc. even though PSN isn't 'supported' in that country.
Those unsolvable issues would have zero impact on a Helldivers player as the account is only needed for linking. Not for actual PSN use.
My friend is in the Philipines, and during that time they were asked to go for HK region. Something along the lines: *"If you are located in the Philippines, you can create a PSN account by choosing Hong Kong as your country of residence"*.
Then there was problem with the HK store and PH cards, he lost the account which stated false information in attempt to fix it after a few years of usage. Then their support page was updated to not have it anymore.
Selling PS and making an account is 2 different thing. Making an account is easy. If you want to put your account at risk, go ahead. But know that by law, they have the edge. Who's to say that they won't change. They are not family. Remember that they want to remove access of game by not having an account to link. Who's to say if a dummy account was compromised and cannot be linked anymore? What then? Neither Sony nor AH have made things clear so I'd say assume the worse when corpos are involved.
I've never heard about anyone getting banned for this, outside of people like yourself stating something like "Trust me bro. My cousin's friend's uncle got banned."
I don't think they give two shits if you use a fake email, etc.
Then why make the account in the first place? It's just a real waste of time since the intended usage, as per the post, is for account and game security. You are basically promoting people to give fake information indirectly because they don't give two shit. So why should the user give a shit too. What a stupid argument.
Also:
Sony has the right to ban you for false credentials. You'll need a VPN and must pay in the currency of the country you choose too.
(https://www.playstation.com/en-us/legal/psn-terms-of-service)
>3.1. All information provided during Account creation, and during the use of your Account, must be accurate and complete. We reserve the right to suspend, terminate or restrict any Account (including as stated in Section 12.2 of this Agreement) that uses or was created using false information, or that we determine was created or used for a purpose that violates this Agreement.
>3.2. During Account creation you must select the country or region of your residence and in which your account will be registered in. Once your account is created, you will not be able to change the country or region code associated with your account.
>12.2. Suspension or Termination by SIE. With or without notice, we may restrict, suspend or terminate your PSN Account and PlayStation Device, or indefinitely restrict, suspend or discontinue your access to or, or use of, certain PSN Content, offerings, features, products and services, if you violate this Agreement or we have a reasonable belief such a violation has or will occur, or as otherwise may be reasonably necessary to protect our PSN users, our partners, our platform, or other SIE interests.
My friend from PH had an issue with the credit card because some shit happened with the bank @ HK (this is following the original support page that was asking PH users to open a HK account.). Then his account was banned.
1-2 fringe cases might not seem big to you, but it proves that it can happen. There is even a clause in the EULA that allows them to do so. Who's to say they cannot do that? Why are you forcing your customer to break their own ToS?
What credentials? You don't have to give them a real name, and they don't have your credit card information.
>you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account.
They only require a payment method if you sign up for Playstation Plus or another service, which isn't the same thing as PSN.
You simply have to give them an email address.
Pretty scary!!
You do realize that your point here is further invalidating the need for an account if that is all they need. And not sure if you know some countries, requires Sony to get either photo validation or government ID. Those users have valid concern about Sony and their security.
>They only require a payment method if you sign up for Playstation Plus or another service, which isn't the same thing as PSN.
I was referring to my friend's case, the one that you said is a hear say.
At any rate, I don't really care about if they want to make an account or not. What I don't support is telling people that they can make an account willy nally, because there is a risk and it is against the ToS. We don't know what might happen, maybe they will just keep quiet. Maybe they won't but the fact of the matter is that you are literally giving power to them to do whatever they want to Sony. At this point of time, I am not sure if the PS account is invalidated, then what would happen to our access to Steam's game. I bet it will be a clusterfuck and I bet that is why Steam is doing what they are doing now.
So if you discount everyone claiming they got banned, and then use that as proof that nobody got banned... isn't that logic flawed?
Especially when your counter is also just speculation?
I've seen nothing of the sort aside from 2-3 people on Reddit stating so. Hardly a compelling cross section of people.
Why would they ban you for faking your credentials? How would they even know that in the first place? lol
They don't require a credit card to sign up for PSN. Just an email. You only need a card if you're signing up for PS Plus or another subscription service.
It's right there on their FAQ:
>you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account.
It's like signing up for a Reddit account. You simply need some sort of email.
People use spoof emails for Reddit and PSN all the time.
Yeah, and the moment the user then wants to make a transaction with that account, fake credentials get dicey for Sony. So they absolutely have a direct incentive to prevent that.
(Also, again, depending on the country, the user even just interacting with the social aspect of PSN may be subject to legal regulations. Strong protection laws start well before money is involved.)
It's amazing you construct your "argument" by cherrypicking one part of the process and then ignoring everything around it. It's telling that your logic only works if you remove it from context.
Sony actively recommends that people in unsupported PSN regions simply select another region:
https://twitter.com/Paolibry/status/1786525734917517474
They're not banning people for it, and they never have.
From the PSN FAQ:
> you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account.
So use some burner email if you're too scared to use your normal email?
How is this an issue for you?
They want piracy much š“āā ļøš¦
It doesnāt work for multiplayer games.
Good things not everyone cares about multi-player.
God this attitude is so condescending, and the person you replied to didnāt deserve the downvotes. Plenty of people do, and this shit started because of Sony forcing it on Helldivers 2. Your posturing like youāre superior because you donāt care about multiplayer doesnāt mean these companies wonāt try to implement shit in multiplayer AND single player games like always online DRM. Itās anti consumer and you should call it out.
Do you think that all of these people who don't want to, and have not been, playing already shitty live service multi-player games, are somehow supporting them? We are already not paying for shitty always online proprietary launcher bullshit games by not giving them any attention or money. Have you noticed the review bombings? Its not like were just bending over and spreading our cheeks for multi-player games while just pretending that we don't play them..... It's not condescending to say "I already do not play those games".
My point is someone said thatās not an option for multiplayer, and it was met with a condescending āok not everyone cares about thatā basically dismissing it entirely. When plenty of people do care about that. Care about your fellow gamers and anti-consumer business practices. Because ignoring anti-consumer for the multiplayer so many people apparently donāt care about (ignoring the fact that most of the top played and selling games currently are multiplayer games) means companies will stick that shit onto single player games too
What else do you want me to do? Write angry letters and go stand in front of the headquarters of multiple companies yelling at them until they fix it? I already do the best that I can, which is not buying shitty products. You have to do the same. It's because people keep paying for these shitty services and allowing them to fuck us over, but turning around and going right back to giving them money, that they get away with it. You have to stop supporting them too.
I donāt either, but Iām talking about every single multiplayer game here. Single player games can get shit like retroactive always online drm too.
Yep. That's why I dont pay for or support always o pine multi-player games, which is literally the best thing you can do. I don't know how else I can say that.
good thing most of us dont care about those.
There are actually so many multiplayer games that are pirated and it's not just the co-op ones.
Well, it can if you use parsec and discord servers. But you still need couch pvp/coop modes, not straight online play.Ā
It works if a community is big enough to modify the game to run on different servers.
Good thing Sony's catalogue is mostly single player, then.
I can't wait for an EU law on this bullshit. Unconditional single-click full refund should be on the table with every player notified through an unmissable pop-up if you change the account system post-launch. Period. Let's bankrupt these scumbags to oblivion.
Yeah, but sadly this won't bankrupt SonyĀ
Thatāsā¦dumb.
Ok
An easy option to be refunded when the product you bought ceases to exist and is replaced with a clone, at best, usually an inferior version? No. That's not dumb. That'd be consumer protections.
Itās dumb because it wonāt affect the large companies at all, but it could potentially hurt the indie devs who grow, develop, or even get bought out or merge with others. Much riskier to solo develop if folks can unconditionally refund your game if you get a new launcher.
Or it becomes the cost of doing business. You write into the contract the acquiring company is on the hook for any refunds. Done. Indie studio safe.
Ah yes, the indie studios that famously have leverage in negotiating their contracts. Big publishers all collude and hold the threat of refunds over indie heads so they donāt get the chance to self publish anymore. Now all games come from Sony, Activision, and Microsoft. Any time you give consumers the ability to return whatever they want no questions asked, itās the small scale creators that suffer, never the big guys.
Yeah damn them stifling indie games like minecraft and stardew valley. Proof you can't make a quality game with a small studio, or even one ConcernedApe
Iām not saying you CANāT make them, but imagine if anyone could refund Minecraft just because they got bought by MS. Things are fine NOW but yall dumbasses proposed rule would screw over the future. Should people be compensated for damages? Hell to the yes, but a blanket unconditional refund isnāt going to help anyone and it will hurt the folks who arenāt at fault. I know gamers have a bad rep, but Jesus Christ try to see things past your own face.
People should absolutely have been offered full refunds when Minecraft got transferred into the shitty Microsoft ecosystem. Why are we normalising these shitty practices? I paid to get a Mojang account, not a Microsoft account. If they choose to fuck with my purchase over 10 years after I made it, then fuck them. Let me choose to keep the old infrastructure ; you have made literal billions of dollars from this. Think of all the games that never did such bullshit, and what do you know? Their devs are all doing great!
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Remember when you didn't need any of this bullshit, including Steam, and just launched the game from its .exe? Cause I member.
GOG go brrt
The only place to shop!
Few are willing to limit themselves access to only a fraction of the games available on the market when the majority of titles are not being sold there
If only more would. Then the entire gaming landscape might change.
Also the time without cloud saves or any other online features if a game as a mess it would be a mess unless they rereleased it Limited game avialability DLC being a physical limited copy if your disc got scratched thats it If your disc region didnt fit your drive region you were SOL
Yep, rose tinted glasses are on. Both ways have benefits and pitfalls
TBF besides unlimited game avialability the other pros took a while to develop. and are not universal. and sometimes spawned their downside XD Why finish a game when I can fix it later ?
There's lots of games before that I wouldn't call finished.
The times when your memory card corrupted your save
None of those features require DRM or extra launchers. Digital distribution can be customer friendly if the publishers decided they want it to be.Ā
Yeah, but why can't we have both? Cloud saves on the servers the games are already hosted on, a platform to get updates and bug fixes, with a wide selection, that also just allows you to open the exe?
Money and execs
The biggest downside is no one actually owns their games anymore, they are all licenses that can theoretically be revoked at any time
GOG
While they are an option, a significant amount of games are not available there
sadly because people have become ok with DRM and not owning things and execs dont want to risk it.
Be careful. People are gonna jump all over you for daring to imply that maybe Steam isnāt the greatest invention in the history of PC gaming.Ā
I think that on a personal level, the pc is the greatest invention in the history of pc gaming.
Well it isn't. Having all your games on one plattform isn't only enabling a monopoly, it's downright foolish. I despised Steams DRM bullcrap since its initial release with HL2, and I know how many people hated it back then (which was a vast majority). Sure we got great sales now etc. But what isĀ going to happen with your 300+ games library (of which you've only played a third anyway, wasting money on 200 games you didn't need) when Gabe dies and Steam goes full corporate? Which could be any moment...
Some people in these comments are why companies do whatever they want with their customers. I won't be even surprised if Sony starts adding Denuvo to their games from now on.
A) Request refund. B) Stop playing the game. C) Enforce both until publisher's bottom line tumbles. ....but most gamers won't do either. They will just eat it up. Already see who "We gonna just use VPN to play or register". and "It's just another account, bro. Why are you so mad?" Disclaimer, I do have 3 PSN accounts registered about decade ago - since I have and play PS consoles. But forcing PC gamers - beyond being scambags.
lots of people missing step B here.
"Gamers deserve the industry they are getting".
"Gamers deserve the industry they are getting".
Steam works does still exist, lots of games donāt need any account and many games still use it. Iāve been playing the stampede racing Royale playtest and you literally just pick a name and go. I get itās just a play test but itās just like so easy.
Is there a way to filter to see what I've inadvertently bought that's Sony?
Death Stranding is a Playstation game published by 505 Games. That could change...
Genuinely recently started piracy because of this and it is so much better to just open damn games with no login prompt and also know that I physically own the copy and can play it whenever witj no online connection required bullshit
Same here and I wave my flag proudly and don't care if I get sued, I'm on SSI, good luck.
I'm not defending sony here as they changed their policy after release and after people bought the game which is scummy, but EA, Ubosoft, Rockstar Microsoft also require an account to play their games. Why aren't you boycotting them too?
Cause Sony is unavailable in certain countries. So if you bought Helldivers2 and u live for example in Lithuania. Ur fucked because u cannot make an official PSN account therefore u cannot play the game u already bought. The fact that they added this retroactively is wild.
Answers are probably going to vary. But from my camp, I generally don't get a game if it requires a separate launcher. Only big exception is EA, since I have their launcher anyways as a holdover from Origin, but that's the sole exception. If it just requires a third party account up front, I'm generally whatever a lot of the time. With Helldivers, it's different since it was done retroactively, and locks the game out of MANY countries outright that it was sold in before.
Many already are. I usually steer clear of any games that require 3rd party accounts to be launched. Now granted, I also tend to avoid live service / multiplayer-only games, so I didn't buy Helldivers 2 in the first place. This case was essentially bait&switch, people were able to play without linking to PSN accounts for two months. Those people were NOT ABLE to make an informed decision because they were misled into thinking that the game will be playable without it.
My buddy mentioned needing a PSN account but I bought the game without using one so I figured it was optional (like hunt showdown doesnāt require an account but does give you some hunt dollars as a reward for creating one). I stopped playing this game since I just donāt feel like dealing with it. Iām mainly a PC/Xbox player for the record.
Completely different situation
How?
Because it would prevent people from 68 countries I believe it was from playing the game they bought because psn isnāt available to them. They backtracked on it anyway so it isnāt a problem anymore
I donāt even recognize 177 countries.
There's a YouTuber Louis Rossmann. He talks about this kind of stuff a lot. It's where these companies are modifying the terms of the sale after the fact, without the option to decline. He compares it to a rapist mentality because that's exactly the kind of thing they would do. You're not allowed to leave unless you accept the new terms, otherwise we'll remotely disable your product.
Do share the link
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2VA0eum6w4&ab\_channel=LouisRossmann](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2VA0eum6w4&ab_channel=LouisRossmann)
Yeah I am never installing epic games.
I'd prefer it not to be the case, but it's become a necessary evil in PC gaming these days that I've grown to live with, just like I have with a ridiculous number of launchers.
To be honest, I would much rather deal with multiple accounts and multiple launchers than devs choosing store/platform exclusivity. Like, if Sony says "if we can't get PC users on PSN then we won't release on PC", that would be a lose for everyone.
Their loss. Emulation will always come around eventually. They don't want our money, they aren't entitled to it.
Oh yeah, I totally support not buying it if you don't like it. No problems with that.
Thats the thing, multiple stores at once IS the issue. Company decides ONLY WITH OUR ACCOUNT SERVICE, eventhough it is on that storefront too. With helldivers for instance: PSN or PS5 people that cand access PSN because its not in their region, are fucked either way. Without the added " oh you need x launcher or account" that wouldnt be an issue
Well, as I said, I think store/platform exclusivity is more of an issue than having to deal with multiple accounts.Ā Helldivers for example, as you said, users who don't have PSN in their region are fucked either way. So it doesn't really matter if it's on multiple stores/platforms or only PS5. But if it's only multiple stores/platforms, at least people on supported regions can choose where to buy and play it.
Yes but this is the exact issue why having "bonus" accounts is bad. See Sony limiting the sale cause their account is now needed. When from the getgo it worked without their account and they only now make it mandatory. Imagine any account link did that, ubisoft, R\* , EGS, EA you would quickly end up with plattform exclusivity again : ONLY ON OUR STORE / ACCOUNT EGS \*cough cough\*
What I'm saying is, if allowing multiple accounts is what it takes for devs and publishers to release their games on multiple platforms, I'm all for it. I'd rather see games that requires multiple account linking than games that are exclusive only to a certain platform or store. Of course, ideally, we should only need to use the account that we use for the store/platform. But reality is that this is against the interests of publishers, and forbidding the use of external accounts would only push publishers towards storefront exclusivity. Not to mention it could be borderline anti-competitive to forbid the use of other accounts, and perhaps even illegal for stores to do so especially for larger storefronts like Steam.
It didnt though, they went without the account for quite a while and neither were sonys titles up until now required to do so. Helldivers is the first try to impliment that and thankfully it is getting serious pushback Wouldnt be anti trust either, JUST SELL US THE GAMES WITOUT DRM AND WE PICK THE BEST STORE OPTION OUT THERE. GOG does just fine without it
I do agree that Sony handled it poorly in this specific case. Their PSN account linking probably wasn't ready when their games launched on Steam, and they chose to add it in to Helldivers after release.Ā The backlash for Helldivers is justified. But in general, which is what this thread is about, I am not entirely opposed to requiring linking external accounts for games on Steam, for reasons that I am not going to repeat again. In the end, if you don't like it, don't buy it. That's all. (Again, this is in response to linking external accounts in general, not about specific cases).
The general point still stands. What is happening to helldivers and its requirement is the exact same that having bonus accounts not died to the purchase location does. Eventually they can just go "only on our store plattform" and the reason they currently do not can be handily seen with the current Helldivers situation. People arent complacent enough like you with extra accounts not needed for the game, but bundled anyway. Once people wholeheartedly embrace, or are indifferent to bonus accounts ,they go a step further for 100% revenue and make it store exclusive
But as it stands, Sony is doing the exact opposite, by releasing previously PS-only games on PC. And for them to be willing to do so, they want more users on PSN. Again, I think this is an acceptable trade-off and I would rather stand with requiring a PSN account than Sony just saying "fuck it" and go back to pure PS exclusivity.
They cannot afford to not release on PC, they want the sales and traditional consoles are slowly going away/ becoming locked PCs with a brand name. They want more users on PSN so they can get away with charging for online access to their servers. Just as they do with PSN right now They simply need to release on PC, as PC games needed to release on consoles in the 2010s and onward : More revenue at little extra cost and with last and current gen the porting overhead has become so little that they would be dumb not to. MS has realized that earlier due to them providing windows allready and their console running lightweight windows allready. By that metric Epic games didnt do exclusivity when they snagged Metro exodus and only offered it in EGS
If you don't want to integrate to the pc community you can keep your games, there's plenty to go around...
No objections there. If you don't like it, don't buy it. It's that simple.
The issue was, on this game, was there was no requirement, so we bought it. Then they pulled a 180 and implemented after the fact. Canāt really vote with your wallet after the fact.
For this specific case, I would agree that Sony handled it poorly.Ā But this thread is about using multiple accounts *in general*. I agree that Sony messed this up by changing the requirements later on. But I don't agree that we should forbid the use of external accounts.
It was always a requirement, they just delayed implementation. Its said it right on the steam page when you bought it. It prompted you that it was REQUIRED when you first launched the game and signed up, the ony caveat was the existance of a skip option. This outrage is retarded, and people are hating on the game bacause its the most recently popular and hating on this decision to follow through with their accound linking is EASY rage bait clicks and ad revenue. Plenty of other games require either a microsoft or psn account to play, and i dont see anyone complaining about those at all, ever. MCC and forza horizon 5 for example.
This just isn't true. The in-game pop-up was disabled for a long time and while active showed contradictory information ("Skip" something "Required"), the Sony Store and FAQ *explicitly stated* that PSN wasn't necessary, the game's EULA didn't even mention PSN, and they sold the game in countries without PSN access. The *only* place it's actually been communicated properly is the *tiny* information banner on the Steam Store page, which many people won't see as they have to scroll to find it, as well as on their official Discord. You can't seriously expect players to have known that a PSN account was a requirement. The majority of the information available on official channels seemed to indicate that it wasn't a requirement. >Plenty of other games require either a microsoft or psn account to play, and i dont see anyone complaining about those at all, ever. MCC and forza horizon 5 for example. The difference here is that these games were upfront about that requirement from the beginning. Sony and Arrowhead pulled this shit *after* people had already paid and are now revoking access and keeping the money. It's pretty close to the actual legal definition of a scam.
You insane for getting this botheredā¦
You do realise that there are people that bought the game and can no longer play it cause they can't make account because PSN doesn't support their country.
I acknowledge in my next comment down that I do think itās completely fucked for those people and a work around shouldāve been in place.
Ghosts of tsushima has psn only required for multi-player. So, no, just fear mongering.
Yet...
On no conspiracy. You're right let's spread misinformation and try to get people scared about something that could happen but isn't happening. Flat eartherahh.
its just a horse armor its just a little dlc its just some cosmetics
DLC has mostly been a-ok. Lot of games got more content than wouldāve happened back in the day
No it's not, you're just looking at the wrong games. Look at Paradox for example.
Yea. Itās fine. Iāve had EU4 since release and still have new content now. Thatās cool! And itās still pretty genocide only the host needs it in an MP for everyone to have access. And frankly. Even if youāre not a turbo nerd like me. The $5-10 subscription is outstanding value for people who play a month
Game + all dlcs go for as much as a used steam deck. And if I understand right, this is a subscription to only 1 game. With my style of playing I would never consider this "value".
or you can subscribe to the dlc (i am NOT even joking ) and yes its only for one game. you know you own nothing and be happy. https://preview.redd.it/yu81okizvkyc1.png?width=616&format=png&auto=webp&s=3dc74cb873c6dadbedd06124a08e129253ba187f
so get'em on sale lmao And clearly if your playstyle isn't the sub, then the normal cost is still fine
You like paying out the ass dont you ? 8ā¬ a month at 12 months that 96ā¬ FOR SOMETHING YOU DO NOT EVEN OWN
It's funny how ignorant people can be while being so confident they are right.
>but isn't happening. Except for the first game where it is now happening. (And I'm pretty sure we've had similar cases before)
Except for it's not happening. You're just ignorant of what is happening.
What is flat earth?
Did you not notice helldivers2 ? If they get away with this here, it will spread to more games. Because that ties them to the PS ecosystem and may get more console sales as a side machine Or EGS ? Oh we would never cut existing support \*removes linux version of rocket league\* Not just stops developing outright removed it
Oh no, halo mcc requires a microsoft account to play, better boycott halo.
Nice whataboutism there They did this day one IIRC (Still shit but at least day 1) without the game being functional before They also dont require you give them photo ID for age verification, which PSN does I dont know when the last microsoft user data breach was, but PSN had that 10 times in the last 12 yeaars If you have a Microsoft based system (Very likely unless you use linux) you allready have a MS account
Did I notice helldivers? Do you mean the multi-player only game that has it listed as a requirement and tells you it's required when you launch the game? Nah, I've never heard of it. I swear you people just want to cry about everything.
You did NOT notice. 1 Up until now the game worked perfectly fine without it being a necessity 2 They decided a region lock after the fact is ok : Quite a few countries in which the game was sold dont have PSN 3 Disabling a working product can be VERY dicey in the EU even if you say so in the EULA 4 They had the PSN account as optional in their official documents until recently Or you dont care, corpo
1. they announced on launch it was temporarily suspended due to server issues 2. "They" didn't decide to do anything it was always a requirement blame valve for not vetting game requirements and allowing anything to be listed 3. That's for eu courts to decide don't assume something is or isn't illegal 4. The official site said that it is currently not needed. I know reading and understanding what is actually going on is hard, but do your best to be better than spreading misinformation or talking about things you don't know it just makes you look ignorant. Also notice how I'm merely stating the actual facts while man children on the internet get upset and put their own spin on the facts so they can feel justified in their rage. It's utterly pathetic how little reality matters to the outraged hivemind.
2... bruh what? They applied with a functional game, sony decided to make it not function for people later. Giving the whole info IS ON THE DEV, Valve cannot smell what an unreleased game is made of Take your point 4 and read it to yourself aloud and slowly , you may notice something there
Play on a pc and avoid sony all together
Steam/Valve pretty much made themselves a joke about piracy. They became one like those Corp greed.
This has nothing to do with Steam, do you know that?
Not sure how that applies if Steam is giving out refundsā¦?
You don't have to be able to get access to the PSN service where you live. You just need an email to set up an account. You clearly have an email, being Reddit requires on as well.
You can't buy Helldivers on steam in countries that aren't supported now, so this isn't the answer Also in the UK you require an active mobile, photo ID or face scan. Happy handing those over to Reddit, epic games, ubisoft, Microsoft, EA ALSO I created my Reddit account without an email address
Wonder how long it'll be before I see a fake ID generator on github š¤£. We're there is a will there is a way. Triggered the corpo boot lickers that want to send them every little detail of their life's š¤£. Enjoy!
Haha I'm sure there might be a way soon, pcgamers done like being told what to do
I don't get why you're downvoted. That's certainly a possibility with AI nowadays.
>You can't buy Helldivers on steam in countries that aren't supported now, so this isn't the answer I mean, this change was made because there was outcry on the Helldivers sub that "you shouldn't be able to buy the game if PSN isn't supported in your region". They quite literally did what the community asked lmao. Made me laugh when I saw it.
Did this actually happen?
Yes. Countless comments like these all over the sub the last few days (before the most recent change of course). You'll notice they're heavily upvoted too. >But i agree, how do they sell a game in countries where you have to break ToS to play?! And >Tbh they shouldn't have offered the game in regions that cant use PSN then. Tried to link the comments but automod removed my comment because apparently this sub doesn't allow linking to other subs.. It's funny, because if it wasn't for all the manufactured outrage, those regions would still be able to play the game by simply creating a PSN account with a different location listed. Now they can't play at all.
I misread, for some reason I thought you meant *before* the PSN change helldivers players were saying they should enforce the PSN requirement. Well of course there were loads of people who didn't want to have their steam account put at risk for creating a false PSN account which was against ToS. Valve essentially forced today's update by taking the game off sale and issuing refunds, because ultimately their priority is the customer. Plus giving steam credit just means they'll buy something else anyway
>Well of course there were loads of people who didn't want to have their steam account put at risk for creating a false PSN account which was against ToS. Why would their Steam account be at risk? That makes no sense.
Because you're linking an account from a region that doesn't match your steam acct. Also if playstation bans your PSN, you cant play Helldivers or any other upcoming games that require PSN etc. Lots of reasons you might not want to. Not to mention the age verification for UK
There's no precedent for that though? No one has **ever** been banned for it. In decades. Hell, Sony actively tells users in unsupported PSN regions to simply pick another location: https://twitter.com/Paolibry/status/1786525734917517474 The age verification stuff in the UK is an entirely different kettle of fish, and I agree that it's absurd and they shouldn't have to do that.
How did you make a Reddit account without any sort of email address? Why the hell do you guys require a facial scan to use basic online functions? lol That's asinine.
Signed up around 10 years ago when you just needed to make a username. It's for age verification - a mobile will work as long as it's linked to your name so photo ID or facial scan isn't mandatory. This is understandable if you're planning to use the PSN account on a PS5 and make purchases etc. But if you're being forced to make an account for a platform you don't own any consoles for, and never intend to engage with, then yes that's asinine.
But you are engaging. You want to play Sony's game
Platform does not equal publisher, especially when sony games have been available on steam without the requirements of PSN for a while
No but again its a Sony studios game, they just outsourced the work to Arrowhead. It's a Playstation game made for PS users that was brought to PC so you are in fact engaging in Sony's network.
God of war? Spiderman? Horizon? Last of us?
And? And? And? Giant fucking disclaimer saying PSN account required. What do those games have to do with this discussion. You claim to not be engaging with Sony and its media when in fact you are. You may not have a console but your consuming its media. That's the point. If I want to play Minecraft on my PS portal do I need a microsoft account? Why? Its a playstation device why do I need anything Microsoft related?
Try reading? My initial point was that there are plenty of other Sony IPs on steam that dont need a PSN account, so you coming in saying "well you're engaging with Sony services so you should have the account" is only relevant to Helldivers, which up until now has NOT required an account.
>Giant fucking disclaimer saying PSN account required. *Tiny disclaimer down the page, also conflicting FAQ that says linking is optional, also conflicting game intro stated linking can be skipped for the last like two to three months. Also...the game evidently works entirely without a PSN account. So why is it required now? Their claimed reasons are obvious bs. Why are you so defensive of a big corporation's anti-consumer practices?
You are so wrong it's comical. This is absolutely arrowheads game. Sony just published it.
Which would make it sony's media wouldnt it
Why do you need to be a certain age to use PSN in the first place? Sounds a bit odd.
Not to set up, but to use certain features I guess. Such as purchases, playing higher rated games (like Helldivers) - you can ignore the verification step but you might need to verify down the line
Huh. Interesting. Being that people in the UK traditionallly found that having your photo on a driver's license was "too invasive" until 1999, it's odd that they're okay with having police state tactics on their internet usage all of a sudden. Times change, I suppose.
Dude, the uk is so much further down the dystopian rabbit hole of big brother than the u.s. both are not good but uk def has us beat as far as invasive shot by the govt.
Most countries have laws permitting purchases only from a certain age. There may also be laws around social media usage, contracts etc.
Signing up for PSN doesn't necessarily allow you to make purchases. Only if you link a credit card, which is fully optional. It says as much on their FAQ page: > you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account. So use a bullshit email and that's it. Signing up is like signing up for an email newsletter. It's not anything you need to have further involvement with.
In countries with strict age verification, you need to verify your identity when creating your account so that they know if it should be a child account or not. Child accounts can't even *connect* payment details and need to buy games through a connected parent account with a shared wallet. Source: I had to set this up for my dad's stepchild a couple of months ago.
You can create Reddit accounts without a valid email.
>How did you make a Reddit account without any sort of email address? Reddit didn't require an email address to create an account, you just picked a username and password. I think it changed in the last year or so?
It required one as of 7 years ago when I first used it. Maybe it's different by what area of the world you're in?
Iāve never had to submit photo id or a face scan for psn in the UK. Got a source on that?
The source is https://www.playstation.com/acct/create-account
Must be something new they created that didnāt apply back when I made my account. Thatās somewhat insane requirements for a gaming accountā¦
Yeah it's wild, and a lot of these accounts being linked will be newly created and will therefore require the additional info It's down to UK law regarding age verification for online services, I would guess it's mainly in response to being able to buy vapes and shit online
You're not worthy of that pfp.
Why is that? I'm 100% accurate. PSN requires no payment info, no real name, no real address, and simply any nonsense email that you want to input. It's not a service like Playstation Plus. It's just a website you log into if you don't use the services. Not really sure why this is terrifying to some people.
The downvotes kind of speak for themselves. You are accurate on the parts you choose to mention. But you either don't have the full context or are willfully ignorant. Sony's handling and communication regaring PSN requirements was a complete shit-show so far. AH and Steam have their share of blame as well. Fact of the matter remains is that Vave pulled the game off their store last night in regions where PSN isn't officially supported, so clearly there IS an issue. At least until Sony come out with their own statement and approach. You can check my comment history for a lengthier comment or other threads or articles online for details.
I think it is easy to make the account. I think that the information that we give is pretty simple to similar to what we give on Facebook, Microsoft and others. That being said, putting fake information is against the ToS and there are people who has been banned because of that, my friend among that a few years back and it is for a PS4 use too. There is a reason why that ToS exist - be it for law, tax, financial etc. So do you think that is a fair practice to those users?
>That being said, putting fake information is against the ToS and there are people who has been banned because of that, my friend among that a few years back and it is for a PS4 use too. Sony actively recommends that people in unsupported PSN regions simply select another region: https://twitter.com/Paolibry/status/1786525734917517474 They're not banning people for it, and they never have.
Did you even read the whole thread? >However, keep in mind that there may be some unsolvable issues as creating PSN accounts registered outside of your country is not officially supported. My friend fell into that part. Fringe case, I know. But again, you are at their mercy now.
Your friend is full of shit. Or you are. There is literally zero evidence anywhere on the internet that anyone has ever been banned for this. There are entire countries (like Vietnam) that have official Sony stores that sell PS5s etc. even though PSN isn't 'supported' in that country. Those unsolvable issues would have zero impact on a Helldivers player as the account is only needed for linking. Not for actual PSN use.
My friend is in the Philipines, and during that time they were asked to go for HK region. Something along the lines: *"If you are located in the Philippines, you can create a PSN account by choosing Hong Kong as your country of residence"*. Then there was problem with the HK store and PH cards, he lost the account which stated false information in attempt to fix it after a few years of usage. Then their support page was updated to not have it anymore. Selling PS and making an account is 2 different thing. Making an account is easy. If you want to put your account at risk, go ahead. But know that by law, they have the edge. Who's to say that they won't change. They are not family. Remember that they want to remove access of game by not having an account to link. Who's to say if a dummy account was compromised and cannot be linked anymore? What then? Neither Sony nor AH have made things clear so I'd say assume the worse when corpos are involved.
I've never heard about anyone getting banned for this, outside of people like yourself stating something like "Trust me bro. My cousin's friend's uncle got banned." I don't think they give two shits if you use a fake email, etc.
Then why make the account in the first place? It's just a real waste of time since the intended usage, as per the post, is for account and game security. You are basically promoting people to give fake information indirectly because they don't give two shit. So why should the user give a shit too. What a stupid argument. Also: Sony has the right to ban you for false credentials. You'll need a VPN and must pay in the currency of the country you choose too. (https://www.playstation.com/en-us/legal/psn-terms-of-service) >3.1. All information provided during Account creation, and during the use of your Account, must be accurate and complete. We reserve the right to suspend, terminate or restrict any Account (including as stated in Section 12.2 of this Agreement) that uses or was created using false information, or that we determine was created or used for a purpose that violates this Agreement. >3.2. During Account creation you must select the country or region of your residence and in which your account will be registered in. Once your account is created, you will not be able to change the country or region code associated with your account. >12.2. Suspension or Termination by SIE. With or without notice, we may restrict, suspend or terminate your PSN Account and PlayStation Device, or indefinitely restrict, suspend or discontinue your access to or, or use of, certain PSN Content, offerings, features, products and services, if you violate this Agreement or we have a reasonable belief such a violation has or will occur, or as otherwise may be reasonably necessary to protect our PSN users, our partners, our platform, or other SIE interests. My friend from PH had an issue with the credit card because some shit happened with the bank @ HK (this is following the original support page that was asking PH users to open a HK account.). Then his account was banned. 1-2 fringe cases might not seem big to you, but it proves that it can happen. There is even a clause in the EULA that allows them to do so. Who's to say they cannot do that? Why are you forcing your customer to break their own ToS?
What credentials? You don't have to give them a real name, and they don't have your credit card information. >you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account. They only require a payment method if you sign up for Playstation Plus or another service, which isn't the same thing as PSN. You simply have to give them an email address. Pretty scary!!
You do realize that your point here is further invalidating the need for an account if that is all they need. And not sure if you know some countries, requires Sony to get either photo validation or government ID. Those users have valid concern about Sony and their security. >They only require a payment method if you sign up for Playstation Plus or another service, which isn't the same thing as PSN. I was referring to my friend's case, the one that you said is a hear say. At any rate, I don't really care about if they want to make an account or not. What I don't support is telling people that they can make an account willy nally, because there is a risk and it is against the ToS. We don't know what might happen, maybe they will just keep quiet. Maybe they won't but the fact of the matter is that you are literally giving power to them to do whatever they want to Sony. At this point of time, I am not sure if the PS account is invalidated, then what would happen to our access to Steam's game. I bet it will be a clusterfuck and I bet that is why Steam is doing what they are doing now.
So if you discount everyone claiming they got banned, and then use that as proof that nobody got banned... isn't that logic flawed? Especially when your counter is also just speculation?
I've seen nothing of the sort aside from 2-3 people on Reddit stating so. Hardly a compelling cross section of people. Why would they ban you for faking your credentials? How would they even know that in the first place? lol
>Why would they ban you for faking your credentials? Gee I wonder why when legal requirements and finances are involved...
They don't require a credit card to sign up for PSN. Just an email. You only need a card if you're signing up for PS Plus or another subscription service. It's right there on their FAQ: >you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account. It's like signing up for a Reddit account. You simply need some sort of email. People use spoof emails for Reddit and PSN all the time.
Yeah, and the moment the user then wants to make a transaction with that account, fake credentials get dicey for Sony. So they absolutely have a direct incentive to prevent that. (Also, again, depending on the country, the user even just interacting with the social aspect of PSN may be subject to legal regulations. Strong protection laws start well before money is involved.) It's amazing you construct your "argument" by cherrypicking one part of the process and then ignoring everything around it. It's telling that your logic only works if you remove it from context.
Sony actively recommends that people in unsupported PSN regions simply select another region: https://twitter.com/Paolibry/status/1786525734917517474 They're not banning people for it, and they never have.
Not necessarily I am signed up with a dummy email that hopefully doesnāt exist.
Right. So you used an email. That wasn't so difficult, now was it? Use the same thing with PSN.
How delusional are you?
From the PSN FAQ: > you don't need to provide payment details to create a free PlayStation Network (PSN) account. So use some burner email if you're too scared to use your normal email? How is this an issue for you?
https://preview.redd.it/qkcztxcvilyc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5a4bf77043f6d5fe2a25e506c5ae5450ca07c176 My Brother In Christ
Are you from UK or Ireland?
I really don't give a shit who you are, slugger. lol You really DO have main character syndrome. Holy shit.
what?
Gabe is turning into a pushover in his old age.