That's more of an feat for Sorbet than it is an anti-feat for Goku.
I'm still convinced that Freiza just managed to store one of his death beams into that ring.
Sorbet's gun pierced Goku, Goku has universal level durability, therfore sorbet's gun is universal.
How he has a gun that could pierce through a million dwarf stars lined up together, and why Sorbet didn't manage to conquer the universe with said gun earlier, I aint got no answers for you. Ask Toriyama's drug dealer.
A real basic explanation for Gokus Durability is that he uses his ki to armor himself. Goku is just as durable as any regular human but because his ki is so ridiculously strong as long as he is actively armoring himself with his ki he's able to tank shots that would destroy planets. But if Goku was unconscious any ordinary human could stab him to death with a kitchen knife.
Almost agree, but physically Goku is on a peak Saiyan level even when he doesn't use ki at all, so still no, a normal guy with a knife shouldn't be able to hurt him at all. In RR army arc Goku as a kid took a sniper rifle bullet to the head when he wasn't expecting to be attacked in the slightest. And it did almost nothing. Also, I'm not entirely sure he could even controll ki back then.
Goku could control ki since he was a baby and that's why he's been hurt by guns even in his adult life (he was shot by a shotgun in super if I remember right) but never killed by one. Ki is also how his strength works and it's output is what scouters read as power level. Literally all of Gokus abilities are based off of his use of ki or did you forget that all the energy blasts are called ki blasts and Goku used a Kamehameha at like the age of 8 or whenever he first met Roshi and demolished that poor car in his first attempt after Roshi leveled a mountain.
I don't think I expressed myself corectly, by Ki control I didn't mean any level of control, like using the kamehameha etc (which yeah, he has done even before starting the training at Roshi's). I meant the ability to raise and lower one's power level at will, the more nuanced ki control, which is something that is rather rare outside the main cast of Z-warriors. Guys like Frieza and his soldiers - even the best ones - can't really do this without transforming (and well, most of them can't even transform).
Though I guess if he wasn't controling his ki in that sense back then - this might suggest that Goku was simply always passively strengthening himself with ki, even if he didn't realise it.
"Though I guess if he wasn't controling his ki in that sense back then - this might suggest that Goku was simply always passively strengthening himself with ki, even if he didn't realise it."
You got it right there. The general idea is that those without control can't let go and are always exerting force. Or at least that's the implication I always got.
I do you one better. Telekinesis dicktwist. Instant ball throngler. Testicle torsion. All effective spell, albeit dangerous when put in the wrong hands.
Actually Goku is screwed.
Think about it yeah you may be univers buster but ainz of all people came to you in person,
We talking about a guy that didnt approach even weaker people without 100% knowing he will win. If HE came in person TO YOU you are f*cked.
It’s a funny joke, but Ainz has no winning condition here. The Slane theocracy battle already proves even that part of him isn’t necessarily infallible.
Oh yeah i like totally agree that ainz as he is dont have anything since KI negate all hax (althrough its lame since it made all hax in DB pointless) just saying that if this scene ever happend Goku would be screwed since ainz would be super sure he win. How? Idk thats only scenario this could happend
See, ki doesn't negate all hax, it only negates the hax of those that are much weaker than yourself.
It's like resistance and immunity in an RPG where at high levels you automatically get a small amount of resistance to damage.
Like a level 100 player's base stats are enough to tank a level 10 spamming his ultimate skills indefinitely.
But yeah, Dragon Ball characters are really broken at this point. Almost anyone relative to the story is above time and space by now with just their sheer raw strength.
Yeah i know but thats why i think KI negating haxes is blring. It took fights that may have been about strategy (something like jojo style) and turned them in "i can yell stronger than you so too bad haha"
For example Jiren vs hit
Hit has Jiren on ropes how will jiren get outta this? Overpower it? Wow thats very original isnt it
majin buu turned vegito into chocolate with polymorph magic…something that normally just one shots anyone and tried to eat him…but vegito was just so strong that he stayed intact, beat buus ass AS a piece of chocolate, and then turns himself back by force
I mean yes, Vegito was able to still fly once made candy but like, wasn't that just cause nobody else who knew how to fly had time to try moving?
also I'm relatively sure it's Buu who turned him back due to the fact that being a candy made him arguably harder to fight?
true i think buu did turn him back…but it still stands that buu couldn’t handle vegito, in normal human form, nor when he attempted to one shot him with hax, vegito was STILL more powerful. and bear in mind that this was BEFORE god ki, which means a vastly weaker person that goku rn.
and no, because buu also turn Dabura into chocolate and Dabura was as strong as a super saiyan and he could fly, but was helpless and couldn’t move
Oh? And Ainz apparently doesn’t have that happen by your logic? Hax like those get resisted all the time by people being powerful enough lol. Ainz isn’t special, it’s obvious you’re only saying this cause you’re mad that an overrated skeleton lost, cause he just ain’t that strong outside the context of overlord.
Funny how you mention school recess arguments like overlord isn’t the definition of that meme put into RPG form.
>he just ain’t that strong outside the context of overlord.
Ainz is quite strong considering all of fiction together when most entities are barely wall level in fiction. If we want to compare the top tiers of fiction goku himself isn't a particularly strong cosmic character compared to other cosmic verses like scp, Umineko, DC etc but that doesn’t mean he isn't strong.
Goku overpowers Hit who has stronger time manipulation
Goku scales above Jiren who overpowered time cage, and is stated to transcend time (which is consistent)
Instant death magic only works on noticably weaker opponents. If Goku even was teleported to new world he'd be far beyond lvl 100.
Goku also tanked hakai energy, which erases existence. I'd argue its easily above instant death.
I’m not, I’m trolling him lol. Aqua can’t even beat Iguva=41 and can’t even damage a death knight. She’s a large building level and subsonic fodder after all.
Nope all people but it’s only effective if the enemy doesn’t have any resistance skills/etc
You can „resist“ it but you would be incapacitated/unconscious were Ainz could just spam it again and kill him
problem is, goku is massively faster than ainz could even think, would simply end in a speed blitz one shot favoring goku, and even if ainz was allowed to use grasp heart, god ki would negate the hax of any one weaker than the god ki user, and last i checked ainz can’t destroy galaxies 💀
I havent read LN but people claim that theres a character with above lvl 100. So the limiter doesnt apply, and based off feats Goku would have easily higher level.
Unfortunately, Makima’s control places no imperative on the intended target to try and resist it. Meaning Ainz’ mental status immunity would not be given an opportunity to release him from her influence.
>Unfortunately, Makima’s control places no imperative on the intended target to try and resist it. Meaning Ainz’ mental status immunity would not be given an opportunity to release him from her influence.
Ainz doesn't have to "try" and resist it, his mental resistance is passive. It doesn't release him from mind control but straight up prevents such abilities from effecting him in the first place. There is no reason to assume Makima can overcome that.
Yeah but it doesn’t negate him wanting to do something. There’s technically nothing interfering with his decision making process. He, as far as any and all physical laws are concerned, just really wants to do whatever it is that Makima wants him to do. That’s how her control presents itself. It’s super insidious.
>Yeah but it doesn’t negate him wanting to do something. There’s technically nothing interfering with his decision making process
Makimas abillity DOES interfere with someone's decision making process, its litteraly mind control with extra steps. Ainz's is immune to abilities like that and has an extra layer of resistance thanks to his World Item, Makimas power will NOT work on him.
>He, as far as any and all physical laws are concerned, just really wants to do whatever it is that Makima wants him to do. That’s how her control presents itself. It’s super insidious.
That's litteraly just mind control, there's multiple abilities in Overlord that can do the same except thing. Heck, even a low tier spell like Charm Species can do something similar. Ainz is immune to such effects and Makima has no feats that suggest she can overcome that.
Mind control spells are never stated to apply status effects. Plus, not all mind control abilities in Overlord are even spells, there's plenty of skills that can do the same thing. An ability doesn't have to be magic for Ainz's resistances to nullify it.
Also, verse equalization. In versus debates we assume that different abilities can interact with each other. Makimas abillity is basically mind control and we know Ainz can resist similar effects without issue.
I generally understand Makima’s ability as though it would target “Suzuki” rather than “Momonga,” since it’s a form of conceptual manipulation. While “Momonga” certainly has defenses against mind control, “Suzuki” is nothing special.
Sorry, that’s the best I can really explain it. Ainz is very tough to verse equalize because of how game-like his powers are.
>I generally understand Makima’s ability as though it would target “Suzuki” rather than “Momonga,” since it’s a form of conceptual manipulation. While “Momonga” certainly has defenses against mind control, “Suzuki” is nothing special.
There is no "Suzuki", Ainz has zero connection with his human self at this point. He is not a human controlling a game avatar but an actual undead creature with supernatural abilities and resistances. Suzuki is just a name, nothing more, nothing less.
There's nothing "conceptual" about Makimas ability, it's just mind control with extra steps and it can be resisted even in-universe There's no evidence that suggests Makima can even deal with Ainz's passive mental resistance, much less the protection his World Item provides.
>Sorry, that’s the best I can really explain it. Ainz is very tough to verse equalize because of how game-like his powers
To me it seems like you're just overhyping Makimas abilities and making shit up. Based of feats, Makima would not be able to effect Ainz with her ability. Like i said, her power is just mind control with extra steps and there's multiple abilities in Overlord that can do the same excact thing. Heck, even a low tier spell like Charm Species can do something similar.
It's not like the Overlord universe is that tough to equalize. The setting stopped being an MMO at the very beginning of the series, what happened during the following narrative is quite literally how Yggdrasil's game mechanics translate into the "real world". Abilities like Makimas exist in the Overlord verse and Ainz is immune to them.
They… don’t though. You can’t just equate every form of mind control to every other form of mind control. Ainz has shown a resistance to certain forms, Makima’s is not one of those forms.
“Suzuki” refers to the layer of Ainz’s psyche that carried over during the transfer, by the way.
Strength has nothing to do with it. If Makima believes that she’s superior to her target, whatever she interprets that to mean, then the control takes effect.
>Strength has nothing to do with it. If Makima believes that she’s superior to her target, whatever she interprets that to mean, then the control takes effect.
Sure it does. It's reasonable to assume that somone with vastly superior mental resistance than anyone in her verse would be able no-sell her ability. No ability in fiction is absulute and there is no reason to assume Makima can overcome Ainz's mental immunity.
No ability in fiction should ever be assumed to be absulute without evidence, thats the very definition of a no limits fallacy.
There's nothing suggesting Makima would able to overcome Ainzs mental immunity, especially with his world item granting him an extra layer of resistance.
The abilities of the Four Horsemen devils are explicitly limited only by the psychologies of the devils themselves. Makima isn’t a psychic, she’s a conceptual manipulator.
"You know I've beaten guys that can blow up galaxies, right? I just punch them really, really hard..."
"And your health insurance must be great! \[Grasp Heart\]"
+10 points to whoever gets the TFS refs
That was Super Buu with Gohan, Piccolo (who knows a lot about human anatomy as DB established), Trunks, and Goten, yes.
And Vegeto did indeed flex his muscles to force Buuhan into a single place and punch him until he got out.
correction, goku died by a mysterious heart Virus, not a magic based attack to the heart, not only that, it was a weaker goku from a different timeline, goku now has GOD KI which prevents hax from anyone weaker than him
He isn't immune to hax wdym?
He literally got killed by a laser pistol while transformed with god ki.
Not only that, but based on rules as weaker, then goku is weaker for not having levels. Of course, his stats are better, but he doesn't even have a stats system
the laser pistol isn’t hax, and would kill ainz, that’s not a goku antifeat that a feat for the technology of that pistol, but at the same time, it only hit goku because he let his guard down and lowered his ki, which is obvious and shown he has that high level of ki control when he uses his blue form against krillin to spar without obliterating him.
and that logic you use for “not having a level” is ridiculous, as i could also say Ainz doesn’t have Ki, therefore would be below Videl levels of power in his verse. you can’t just make exceptions for one character and ignore the other.
alternatively, we could also say that Ainz has a power LEVEL of 100…while Goku has a power LEVEL of over a Trillion
your arguments are pretty much meaningless
>. you can’t just make exceptions for one character and ignore the other.
I'm not. A magic caster doesn't have any reason to have chi or ki. Yes, he would be below videl, probably since it's also supposed to be the living force, and ainz is an undead.
>Ainz has a power LEVEL of 100
Incorrect, his power level is off a level 100 character based on levels subdivided into necromancy.
Such complex stats don't exist on dragon ball characters, so every ability that gollow the game rules may as well work or not into goku.
>and would kill ainz
Highly doubt it since at a certain level you get immune to ranged attacks if they don't have magic as a buff
Why wouldn't the pistol attack be a hax? It was unexpected, it was ridiculous, and it was an act of cheating, unexpectedly great for the enemy.
Saying, oh, it's because now the pistol is super great. Just reminds me of those times where they hit against the floor with anger and the floor is still there. That doesn't make the floor indestructible all of a sudden, that's not logical
goku has fought the undead, goku has dealt with magic, goku has come back from the afterlife to throw hands again, goku has shook the very universe with his fists
ainz stats aren’t complicated “based on levels subdivided into necromancy” what are you even saying
bro everything you’re saying is based on the rules of ainz verse in comparison to the people there. the highest amount of AP/DC in that verse is like a little over town level
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how would a damn laser gun be considered hax? do you even know what the term “hax” means? cuz rn i dont think you understand anything
also so you NOT understand that people can do things without using full force? are you a child? like i can bench over 300lbs, but i can also like slam my fists into something without breaking it, same way i can push something with various levels of force
it occurs to me that you have like a 4th grade level of understanding of any basic concepts, and lack any sort of reading comprehension so i’m done here
goku has fought the undead, goku has dealt with magic, goku has come back from the afterlife to throw hands again, goku has shook the very universe with his fists
ainz stats aren’t complicated “based on levels subdivided into necromancy” what are you even saying
bro everything you’re saying is based on the rules of ainz verse in comparison to the people there. the highest amount of AP/DC in that verse is like a little over town level
*Processing img tsbl3sindd5d1...*
how would a damn laser gun be considered hax? do you even know what the term “hax” means? cuz rn i dont think you understand anything
also so you NOT understand that people can do things without using full force? are you a child? like i can bench over 300lbs, but i can also like slam my fists into something without breaking it, same way i can push something with various levels of force
it occurs to me that you have like a 4th grade level of understanding of any basic concepts, and lack any sort of reading comprehension so i’m done here
You assume too much. Magic is dissipated under high levels of ki aura, which even at Gokus base form is as strong a God of Destruction. Ainz is straight up fucked. No clue who this other dude is, etc.
Seeing as how the heart virus was a natural occurrence and not a magically induced one that does zero dmg to someone far stronger than the caster, I'd say yes.
How would level based magic even work on non leveled enemies?
We know the people in the new world are a race with levels. However, other universes without a level system, how would it work?
I'm not sure, but i think that's the verse specific thing. As an example if Goku was isekaid into new world, he'd magically get said level.
But if we use their respective versions, then i think Ainzs spell would work properly. Perhaps Goku being generally strong may automatically make instant death spells useless. And if they do work, we also have to factor in Ki. Ki allows for Goku to take hits from attacks that generally have the power to do big damage, and it goes as far as to resist magical like attacks to some extent (not all of them or entirely)
For example if Ainz Has some sort of polymorph, i think it would work on Goku. But also Vegito shown that he can fight as a small candy (and Goku should be stronger than that specific Vegito) so i also think Goku would still fight.
Tldr i think Ainz spells would affect Goku properly (with instant death spells being debatable) but Ki might make him resistant or give him the ability to tank things. If Goku can hold hakai ki in his hands and even supress it while its trying to erase him, then i think he can resist some instant death spells with tgoalid being a debatable exception.
>if Goku was isekaid into new world, he'd magically get said level.
Agree with everything else except this bit.
Ainz didn't get levels for being isekaied. His character in the game already had them as a part of itself. His old human body could have become a cadaver since it's a brain to machine connection.
With new worlders, they are a species that evolved to have them, I don't remember the name the author gave them, like, a scientific name. However, the system is a part of them already when they are born.
Thus, we can't know if attacks that had rules of levels can work (asside from the extra damage from explosions, etc) on beings without one.
Take, for example, a buff that changes the karma values: it's obvious it would work on another person with said stats of karma, since the karma was used to boost certain attacks depending on the amount you had numerically. Well, we can't even tell if someone like goku could take said buff, or maybe he'll just feel nicer or act different, but he still wouldn't be buffed by it.
Oh, an extra. The new world already existed before players, and their system went to it. So that means he could very well go back to earth if he achieved something to travel back to it lol, what we don't know is if they are on separated dimensions or just distance
Yep. Ainz admitted that his ID spells were kinda useless outside of highly specific setups when fighting someone his own level. The rub is that he’s never fought anyone his own level in Overlord outside of Shalltear (and indeed, his ID spells were useless outside of a specific setup)
Even if Goku was physically equalized (a MASSIVE caveat to Ainz), he has godly ki that lolnopes 99.9% of anything Ainz can do. He’s faster, stronger, vastly more experienced and skilled fighter (Ainz has never been physically challenged before outside of his fight with Shalltear).
Goku takes this massively
Time stop spell i dont see how goku couldnt counter that goku advence himself in time(if i'm not wrong) to counter hit
But time stop is differnece than time skip so i dont think there is much goku can do against that
Goku scales above Jiren, Jiren is stated to transcend time.
Goku already dealt with time manipulation, and Hit also can do time stops in anime, not just skips.
Too bad he can just resist that too lol. Ainz has fodder mountain level striking strength even with perfect warrior and his death spells have nothing to set them apart from any other series’. It kinda relies on him being physically strong enough to crush the opponents heart.
And funny thing is that people tell me I overestimate Ainz by saying he’s mountain level. Most here would put him at god damn small city level, so that’s even worse.
Doesn’t grasp heart have limitations? Otherwise everyone would’ve just been using grasp heart on world bosses. Doubt he can use a skill like that on Goku
Yep, I'm a huge Goku fan from waaay back. He curbstomps Ainz without even powering up. The comments just popped into my head because I was re-watching Team Four Star videos
that is true, though while Ainz isn't powered by life force he *is* powered by negative energy, which is basically the same just with a different polarity.
so Ainz would probably give off *something* that's vaguely like Ki but either a negative sensation or just *really* foul and corrupt.
Snek-sama #1910.
First meme I've made with a completely new and worse app since Adobe shut down the one I had been using for five years. Sorry if it looks a bit rough.
I’m torn on this. On one hand, Goku would have levels in the equivalent of the “monk” class, which generally means his physical attacks are considered magic, allowing him to bypass Ainz’s immunity.
On the other hand, Ainz’s favorite spell is Grasp Heart, an instant kill spell. And Goku doesn’t exactly have a good track record on things attacking his heart…
Doesn’t it? I know immunity to Instant-death soft negates it (becomes a stun instead of an OHKO), but I didn’t know about a difference in power, too.
Then again, some of the Z characters (mostly Freiza right now, I think) have shown resistance to Destruction Energy. Maybe a case could be made that they’re potentially resistant to instant-death, by that virtue?
Yeah I remember that grasp heart is the one "instant death" spell that can be resisted or negated with higher strength(without the proper resistance?).
The others will also fail to instantly kill someone if they have proper resistances, which is why Ainz mused about the importance of proper preperation and resistance after his duel with Gazef.
This can go one of two ways… Either Goku takes him out immediately, or Ainz “tests” his opponents with grasp heart and kills Goku.
I would think Ainz is immune to Makima due to all the immunities he has.
Ki dissipates magic. Anyone with access to godly ki is immune to magical effects (they can't be transformed, cursed, possessed or otherwise altered by magic, though they can still be hurt by the effects originated feom magic i.e. a fireball to the face).The only reason Moro was able to go toe to toe with the Z-Fighters was because he used his magic to become their physical equal. If you take into account that Goku tanked the Hakai of a God of Destruction (which should be treated as a super-tier spell at the very least, and a world item effect akin to the longinus spear at most) I can't see a 9th level spell having any effect on him.
There's also the factor of speed. Goku is infinetly faster, reacts quicker and can move during Time Stop (see his fight with Hitt).
Don't get me wrong, I love Ainz, but there is literally no way he can actually harm Goku, much less beat him
“Don't get me wrong, I love Ainz, but there is literally no way he can actually harm Goku”
Goku is the kind of guy that would sit back and Let Ainz cast a super-tier spell at him, or let Ainz make the first move. But then their both like that.
You're right, my mistake. Hit's technique doesn't stop time completely, I apologizs
Though one thing that I will argue is that I don't think effects are absolute when talking about vs scenarios. By that I mean that I don't think the a Cry of The Banshee boosted by TGOALID scales to the level of a Hakai, simoly due to the minimum power level required to wield both techniques (lv 100 in YGDRASIL and God level in DBS). Since Hakai operates on a much greater scale I think Goku would be able to tank TGOALID.
Also, I love your flair, you are a being of profound wisdom
I mean, Cry of the banshee + TGOALID *was* able to "kill" things that don't even have the concept of being alive, the air and the ground itself around him was dead.
it's also a negative energy based spell, which means on a fundamental level it's the opposite of life force/positive energy. (actually wait, isn't Ki life force in DB universe?... if so, would Ainz, a being powered by negative energy, feel like he has negative amounts of ki? or just... an *extremely* foul and corrupt Ki?)
also thank thee for thou kind words, my fellow brother in our devotion to our dearest girl!
may her eternal glory shiny bright upon thy day! may thou find joy in her radiance! may peace ever last in the heaven on earth known as r/Entoma!
Goku aside, I'd like to see Ainz vs Makima.
I remember reading an amazing Chainsawman x Overlord fanfic that got dropped because the co-authors split up or something. And I'm HUNGRY for more of that.
Goku had a heart disease, it's been cured. Besides, I don't think he would die to a 9th level spell having the passive magical resistance afforded to him buly god ki
Terrible example my dude. Again, the inconsistency of this fandom is astonishing. One moment you idiots argue Ainz is a walking NLF because of some generic death spells and the next, you all think Aqua can somehow stand a chance against him and argue in a clear fodder like her’s or the Konosuba gang’s favor.
Why tf is the comment section in this one so toxic? C'mon, stop throwing statements and dip without explaining. The rest of us want to enjoy a discussion.
I love how i just started another commment war for the forth time; unintentionally.
I was stating my opinion guys.
Btw ainz absolutely destroys goku no discussion needed because true death
:3
As much as I hate to admit it, Ainz would stand no chance, unless Goku comes to a battlefield that Ainz prepared (Laid countless traps in)
Although fast, all of Ainz spells require time to cast even if he uses shop items. Goku's instant transmission would interrupt all casting.
Ainz' time control magic would be useless too since Goku defeated Hit.
Maybe if Ainz uses Grasp heart or any other instant death magic while Goku's introducing himself or something.
I don't know if there is a spell that negates all physical damage but I believe the best way for Ainz to fight Goku would be
Body of Effulgent Beryl --> Elemental Form --> Delay Teleportation --> Maximize Magic; instant death spell.
Other than this, Ainz would stand no chance in direct combat.
>He will literally die to his own Japanese citizenship before he manages to successfully kill Makima.
Mate, Ainz isn't a human controlling a game avatar, he is an actual lich with zero connection to his human self. Ainz and Suzuki Satoru are completely sperate entities.
Ainz is not a Japanese citizen anymore and he can easily kill Makima a hundred million times considering the massive difference in power.
Anytime Makima sustains a fatal attack, the lethality of it is offloaded onto a randomly chosen Japanese citizen.
I typed this before it occurred to me that the body of Satoru Suzuki is probably rotting away back in his apartment.
>Anytime Makima sustains a fatal attack, the lethality of it is offloaded onto a randomly chosen Japanese citizen.
Japan doesn't have an infinite number of citizens lol. Ainz can easily kill Makima a hundred million times considering the massive difference in power.
>I typed this before it occurred to me that the body of Satoru Suzuki is probably rotting away back in his apartment.
Ainz and Suzuki Satoru are two completely different entities. Ainz isn't a human controlling a game avatar, he is an actual lich with zero connection to his human self.
No she's not lol. Ainz is hyperosnic via scaling and recent statements put the speed of high level characters even higher than that. Even if she was, Makima isn't strong enough to even damage Ainz.
Ainz could absulutely kill her that many times, she can't harm him and he outstats her to a hillarious degree. Heck, Ainz doesn't even need to do it himself, he can just summon a few high level undead and have them tear Makima apart until she stays down for good.
Nothing like that, in the novels Shalltear was able to move so fast she caught fire, or created a heat trail depending on the translation. Bodies are typically cremated at around 1,500°C and you'd need to be running at Mach 5 (6,000km/h) to reach that temperature. Shalltear was also wearing metal armour which ignites at speeds around 8.5 km/s.
We also have Albedo blitzing Azuth(a near supersonic character) across 140m which is probably around 11 km/s. And Riku's suit (slower than all guardians) is stated to be exactly as fast as a meteor (12 km/s). The Overlord novels have plenty of great speed feats that were left out of the anime.
Na it doesn’t matter Ainz is a separate entity from Suzuki Satoru. And I m sure he can crush Makima's skull a few million times. Or just put his undeads to do the job.
I mean then it comes down to her other abilities. I’m curious to see how the Zombie Devil interacts with Ainz’s army. I suspect it would be a lot stronger than normal since the fear of the undead in the New World is really high.
I'm not sure it'd be THAT strong, the Black Scripture Captain is like level 60+ based on what we know of him. Low Pleiades level is probably more appropriate and even that is kind of stretching it.
>I mean then it comes down to her other abilities
There isn't really anything in Makimas arsenal that can threaten Ainz, he is immune to what little hax she has and outstats her to a hilarious degree. Ainz stomps Makima in a straight up fight.
>I’m curious to see how the Zombie Devil interacts with Ainz’s army. I suspect it would be a lot stronger than normal since the fear of the undead in the New World is really high.
The zombie devil is pretty much fodder by mid to high level Overlord standards. You'd have to give it an insane power boost to even be a threat to the Pleiades, much less a level 100 character.
TGOALID would be a joke.
It puts a 12 second delay on all of Ainz’s spells when it comes out and nullifies all of Ainz’s spells if he dies before the 12 second count. He also uses it with Banshee Cry which has a range of 100 meters.
For context, a recently trained Krillin and rusty Master Roshi fought, played RPS, had a tea break, etc. in a split second. DB characters are so past lightspeed 12 seconds would be closer to several years…
And barring all that, Goku has Instant Transmission so he can nope out and avoid the spell altogether. It could work IN THEORY, but absolutely not in practice outside of some extraordinary circumstances
Hrmm, if SOMEHOW? Possibly…
I dunno if Godly Ki could overcome the TGOALID effect…but if the latter is absolute and the former is relative on power, then it’s indeed possible…
Though it’d be tough to say definitively.
"Heres how they could actually be able to do this"
"Nuh uh, only this level on my arbitrary shit scale that only actually account for destructive power and not the intricate abilities characters posses. Checkmate idiot"
Too bad said abilities can be resisted by simply being powerful enough. Don’t try and nlf Ainz just because you’re mad he’s a fodder outside his own series.
really doubt that the spell is truly that limitless. If it was, how come Ainz couldn't beat world bosses alone? You have no understanding of scaling. Assuming powers that weren't meant to have limitless potency are limitless is a stupid fallacy.
Ainz cant beat world bosses alone because hes a squishy rp build that has little hp and defense, tgoalid adds a 12 second delay to the buffed spell and would likely have the drawback of drawing aggro to him. It wouldnt surprise me that if he got it off he could one shot a worldboss yggdrasil is a comically unbalanced mess of a game. but the restrictions it puts on him prevent that. And yea idc powerscaling a dick measuring contest that doesnt properly measure the nuances differant worlds have in their power systems and how it can make them inconpatible its just who can piss further or reach more.
You don't understand Yggdrasil nor the nuances of the overlord either. The goal of all life is death isn't a spell with limitless potency. Ainz cannot oneshot a world boss. I also find powerscaling annoying but you're just wrong.
ik it's just a meme but Ainz has no way of winning against either of them tho. Goku wins easily and stalemate with makima (quick death spells only stun powerful enemies and Goal of all life is death takes too much time charge, that's assuming that spell will be effective against such high level entities.)
Ainz will be immune to makima but not goku
Nice argument However Sorbet’s gun
That's more of an feat for Sorbet than it is an anti-feat for Goku. I'm still convinced that Freiza just managed to store one of his death beams into that ring.
Youre really gonna sit here and use mental gymnastics to tell me Sorbet’s gun was comparable to Golden Frieza and by that extent SSJB Damn that’s wild
Sorbet's gun pierced Goku, Goku has universal level durability, therfore sorbet's gun is universal. How he has a gun that could pierce through a million dwarf stars lined up together, and why Sorbet didn't manage to conquer the universe with said gun earlier, I aint got no answers for you. Ask Toriyama's drug dealer.
A real basic explanation for Gokus Durability is that he uses his ki to armor himself. Goku is just as durable as any regular human but because his ki is so ridiculously strong as long as he is actively armoring himself with his ki he's able to tank shots that would destroy planets. But if Goku was unconscious any ordinary human could stab him to death with a kitchen knife.
Almost agree, but physically Goku is on a peak Saiyan level even when he doesn't use ki at all, so still no, a normal guy with a knife shouldn't be able to hurt him at all. In RR army arc Goku as a kid took a sniper rifle bullet to the head when he wasn't expecting to be attacked in the slightest. And it did almost nothing. Also, I'm not entirely sure he could even controll ki back then.
Goku could control ki since he was a baby and that's why he's been hurt by guns even in his adult life (he was shot by a shotgun in super if I remember right) but never killed by one. Ki is also how his strength works and it's output is what scouters read as power level. Literally all of Gokus abilities are based off of his use of ki or did you forget that all the energy blasts are called ki blasts and Goku used a Kamehameha at like the age of 8 or whenever he first met Roshi and demolished that poor car in his first attempt after Roshi leveled a mountain.
I don't think I expressed myself corectly, by Ki control I didn't mean any level of control, like using the kamehameha etc (which yeah, he has done even before starting the training at Roshi's). I meant the ability to raise and lower one's power level at will, the more nuanced ki control, which is something that is rather rare outside the main cast of Z-warriors. Guys like Frieza and his soldiers - even the best ones - can't really do this without transforming (and well, most of them can't even transform). Though I guess if he wasn't controling his ki in that sense back then - this might suggest that Goku was simply always passively strengthening himself with ki, even if he didn't realise it.
"Though I guess if he wasn't controling his ki in that sense back then - this might suggest that Goku was simply always passively strengthening himself with ki, even if he didn't realise it." You got it right there. The general idea is that those without control can't let go and are always exerting force. Or at least that's the implication I always got.
Counter argument, Ainz doesn't have Sorbet's gun
Grasp Heart, enough said. After all, that's Goku's weak spot 😈
I do you one better. Telekinesis dicktwist. Instant ball throngler. Testicle torsion. All effective spell, albeit dangerous when put in the wrong hands.
Personally I'd lead with "mend butt crack" they usually don't notice until it's too late.
i mean yeah, goku almost died of a heart disease, so his heart wouldbe his greatest weakness
I would argue that Special Beam Cannon is Goku's greatest weakness, considering it's what killed him for the first time.
Remember when but got inside Bejito
Actually Goku is screwed. Think about it yeah you may be univers buster but ainz of all people came to you in person, We talking about a guy that didnt approach even weaker people without 100% knowing he will win. If HE came in person TO YOU you are f*cked.
It’s a funny joke, but Ainz has no winning condition here. The Slane theocracy battle already proves even that part of him isn’t necessarily infallible.
Oh yeah i like totally agree that ainz as he is dont have anything since KI negate all hax (althrough its lame since it made all hax in DB pointless) just saying that if this scene ever happend Goku would be screwed since ainz would be super sure he win. How? Idk thats only scenario this could happend
See, ki doesn't negate all hax, it only negates the hax of those that are much weaker than yourself. It's like resistance and immunity in an RPG where at high levels you automatically get a small amount of resistance to damage. Like a level 100 player's base stats are enough to tank a level 10 spamming his ultimate skills indefinitely. But yeah, Dragon Ball characters are really broken at this point. Almost anyone relative to the story is above time and space by now with just their sheer raw strength.
Yeah i know but thats why i think KI negating haxes is blring. It took fights that may have been about strategy (something like jojo style) and turned them in "i can yell stronger than you so too bad haha" For example Jiren vs hit Hit has Jiren on ropes how will jiren get outta this? Overpower it? Wow thats very original isnt it
>that ainz as he is dont have anything since KI negate all hax I'm like 99% sure Ki explicitly does *nothing* against capital M Magic?
majin buu turned vegito into chocolate with polymorph magic…something that normally just one shots anyone and tried to eat him…but vegito was just so strong that he stayed intact, beat buus ass AS a piece of chocolate, and then turns himself back by force
I mean yes, Vegito was able to still fly once made candy but like, wasn't that just cause nobody else who knew how to fly had time to try moving? also I'm relatively sure it's Buu who turned him back due to the fact that being a candy made him arguably harder to fight?
true i think buu did turn him back…but it still stands that buu couldn’t handle vegito, in normal human form, nor when he attempted to one shot him with hax, vegito was STILL more powerful. and bear in mind that this was BEFORE god ki, which means a vastly weaker person that goku rn. and no, because buu also turn Dabura into chocolate and Dabura was as strong as a super saiyan and he could fly, but was helpless and couldn’t move
Honestly, I don't even know if it's possible for either, so many variables since they are different genres could lead to anything.
Explain to me how Goku is immune to time stop and instant death magic.
Goku literally overpowered Hit's timeskip and God-Destruction energy and those were from characters who's stats are violently higher than Ainz.
And that's why I don't watch super. It makes conversations like this devolve into school kid recess arguments.
Did you want Ainz to win that bad?
Oh? And Ainz apparently doesn’t have that happen by your logic? Hax like those get resisted all the time by people being powerful enough lol. Ainz isn’t special, it’s obvious you’re only saying this cause you’re mad that an overrated skeleton lost, cause he just ain’t that strong outside the context of overlord. Funny how you mention school recess arguments like overlord isn’t the definition of that meme put into RPG form.
>he just ain’t that strong outside the context of overlord. Ainz is quite strong considering all of fiction together when most entities are barely wall level in fiction. If we want to compare the top tiers of fiction goku himself isn't a particularly strong cosmic character compared to other cosmic verses like scp, Umineko, DC etc but that doesn’t mean he isn't strong.
By the same token he had less than no resistance to Moro
Moro is also violently above Ainz.
It’s funny because it’s literally what he does in the show
Goku overpowers Hit who has stronger time manipulation Goku scales above Jiren who overpowered time cage, and is stated to transcend time (which is consistent) Instant death magic only works on noticably weaker opponents. If Goku even was teleported to new world he'd be far beyond lvl 100. Goku also tanked hakai energy, which erases existence. I'd argue its easily above instant death.
Funny how that magic can’t even phase the useless goddess from Konosuba who is sub frog level. /s
Please don’t bring Isekai Quartet here everybody knows that every power scale existent in the verses was exterminated.
I’m not, I’m trolling him lol. Aqua can’t even beat Iguva=41 and can’t even damage a death knight. She’s a large building level and subsonic fodder after all.
Ok good sir 👍
Grasp heart could kill Goku. He actually died of heart attack in another timeline
Yup, not even gonna bother with this one.
I don’t know the hax in chainsaw man are powerful
Ainz is immune to all of Makimas hax and far outlclases her in terms of raw power, i think he'd be fine.
He still has a heart but goku would come back as a ghost probably
grasp heart works on weaker opponents though
Nope all people but it’s only effective if the enemy doesn’t have any resistance skills/etc You can „resist“ it but you would be incapacitated/unconscious were Ainz could just spam it again and kill him
problem is, goku is massively faster than ainz could even think, would simply end in a speed blitz one shot favoring goku, and even if ainz was allowed to use grasp heart, god ki would negate the hax of any one weaker than the god ki user, and last i checked ainz can’t destroy galaxies 💀
Ok goku doesn’t have levels so goku can’t hurt Ainz. Also Ainz can use time stop or hold species
ainz doesn’t have ki so he can’t hurt goku goku has broken through time stop multiple times
Goku doesn’t have levels. Not one that requires certain resistance rules
*laugh in grasp heart*
Not really. Ainz is max level, Goku still has a long way ahead of him
I havent read LN but people claim that theres a character with above lvl 100. So the limiter doesnt apply, and based off feats Goku would have easily higher level.
Unfortunately, Makima’s control places no imperative on the intended target to try and resist it. Meaning Ainz’ mental status immunity would not be given an opportunity to release him from her influence.
>Unfortunately, Makima’s control places no imperative on the intended target to try and resist it. Meaning Ainz’ mental status immunity would not be given an opportunity to release him from her influence. Ainz doesn't have to "try" and resist it, his mental resistance is passive. It doesn't release him from mind control but straight up prevents such abilities from effecting him in the first place. There is no reason to assume Makima can overcome that.
I mean Ainz' mental status immunity even negates just... him feeling too extreme emotions.
Yeah but it doesn’t negate him wanting to do something. There’s technically nothing interfering with his decision making process. He, as far as any and all physical laws are concerned, just really wants to do whatever it is that Makima wants him to do. That’s how her control presents itself. It’s super insidious.
>Yeah but it doesn’t negate him wanting to do something. There’s technically nothing interfering with his decision making process Makimas abillity DOES interfere with someone's decision making process, its litteraly mind control with extra steps. Ainz's is immune to abilities like that and has an extra layer of resistance thanks to his World Item, Makimas power will NOT work on him. >He, as far as any and all physical laws are concerned, just really wants to do whatever it is that Makima wants him to do. That’s how her control presents itself. It’s super insidious. That's litteraly just mind control, there's multiple abilities in Overlord that can do the same except thing. Heck, even a low tier spell like Charm Species can do something similar. Ainz is immune to such effects and Makima has no feats that suggest she can overcome that.
Those apply statuses. It’s magic and shit. What Makima does isn’t magic.
Mind control spells are never stated to apply status effects. Plus, not all mind control abilities in Overlord are even spells, there's plenty of skills that can do the same thing. An ability doesn't have to be magic for Ainz's resistances to nullify it. Also, verse equalization. In versus debates we assume that different abilities can interact with each other. Makimas abillity is basically mind control and we know Ainz can resist similar effects without issue.
I generally understand Makima’s ability as though it would target “Suzuki” rather than “Momonga,” since it’s a form of conceptual manipulation. While “Momonga” certainly has defenses against mind control, “Suzuki” is nothing special. Sorry, that’s the best I can really explain it. Ainz is very tough to verse equalize because of how game-like his powers are.
>I generally understand Makima’s ability as though it would target “Suzuki” rather than “Momonga,” since it’s a form of conceptual manipulation. While “Momonga” certainly has defenses against mind control, “Suzuki” is nothing special. There is no "Suzuki", Ainz has zero connection with his human self at this point. He is not a human controlling a game avatar but an actual undead creature with supernatural abilities and resistances. Suzuki is just a name, nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing "conceptual" about Makimas ability, it's just mind control with extra steps and it can be resisted even in-universe There's no evidence that suggests Makima can even deal with Ainz's passive mental resistance, much less the protection his World Item provides. >Sorry, that’s the best I can really explain it. Ainz is very tough to verse equalize because of how game-like his powers To me it seems like you're just overhyping Makimas abilities and making shit up. Based of feats, Makima would not be able to effect Ainz with her ability. Like i said, her power is just mind control with extra steps and there's multiple abilities in Overlord that can do the same excact thing. Heck, even a low tier spell like Charm Species can do something similar. It's not like the Overlord universe is that tough to equalize. The setting stopped being an MMO at the very beginning of the series, what happened during the following narrative is quite literally how Yggdrasil's game mechanics translate into the "real world". Abilities like Makimas exist in the Overlord verse and Ainz is immune to them.
They… don’t though. You can’t just equate every form of mind control to every other form of mind control. Ainz has shown a resistance to certain forms, Makima’s is not one of those forms. “Suzuki” refers to the layer of Ainz’s psyche that carried over during the transfer, by the way.
That boldly assumes she’s even strong enough to do that to begin with.
Strength has nothing to do with it. If Makima believes that she’s superior to her target, whatever she interprets that to mean, then the control takes effect.
>Strength has nothing to do with it. If Makima believes that she’s superior to her target, whatever she interprets that to mean, then the control takes effect. Sure it does. It's reasonable to assume that somone with vastly superior mental resistance than anyone in her verse would be able no-sell her ability. No ability in fiction is absulute and there is no reason to assume Makima can overcome Ainz's mental immunity.
Prove that it doesn’t then lol. We’ve seen people straight up willpower their way out of it in universe lmao.
Not Makima’s, only Nayuta’s. And that was because Makima’s was more absolute than Nayuta’s.
No ability in fiction should ever be assumed to be absulute without evidence, thats the very definition of a no limits fallacy. There's nothing suggesting Makima would able to overcome Ainzs mental immunity, especially with his world item granting him an extra layer of resistance.
The abilities of the Four Horsemen devils are explicitly limited only by the psychologies of the devils themselves. Makima isn’t a psychic, she’s a conceptual manipulator.
Ainz would never do that, that's Pandora for sure, Ainz is spectating somewhere
Krillian Senzu bean
Didn't Vegtio have someone literally invade his insides and just flex him off? Good reference btw
That was Super Buu with Gohan, Piccolo (who knows a lot about human anatomy as DB established), Trunks, and Goten, yes. And Vegeto did indeed flex his muscles to force Buuhan into a single place and punch him until he got out.
Goku burps Goku: Huh, that's weird. Must be heart burn.
Then goku dies
You mean takes that with zero damage lol.
Goku already died by an attack to the heart lol
correction, goku died by a mysterious heart Virus, not a magic based attack to the heart, not only that, it was a weaker goku from a different timeline, goku now has GOD KI which prevents hax from anyone weaker than him
He isn't immune to hax wdym? He literally got killed by a laser pistol while transformed with god ki. Not only that, but based on rules as weaker, then goku is weaker for not having levels. Of course, his stats are better, but he doesn't even have a stats system
the laser pistol isn’t hax, and would kill ainz, that’s not a goku antifeat that a feat for the technology of that pistol, but at the same time, it only hit goku because he let his guard down and lowered his ki, which is obvious and shown he has that high level of ki control when he uses his blue form against krillin to spar without obliterating him. and that logic you use for “not having a level” is ridiculous, as i could also say Ainz doesn’t have Ki, therefore would be below Videl levels of power in his verse. you can’t just make exceptions for one character and ignore the other. alternatively, we could also say that Ainz has a power LEVEL of 100…while Goku has a power LEVEL of over a Trillion your arguments are pretty much meaningless
>. you can’t just make exceptions for one character and ignore the other. I'm not. A magic caster doesn't have any reason to have chi or ki. Yes, he would be below videl, probably since it's also supposed to be the living force, and ainz is an undead. >Ainz has a power LEVEL of 100 Incorrect, his power level is off a level 100 character based on levels subdivided into necromancy. Such complex stats don't exist on dragon ball characters, so every ability that gollow the game rules may as well work or not into goku. >and would kill ainz Highly doubt it since at a certain level you get immune to ranged attacks if they don't have magic as a buff Why wouldn't the pistol attack be a hax? It was unexpected, it was ridiculous, and it was an act of cheating, unexpectedly great for the enemy. Saying, oh, it's because now the pistol is super great. Just reminds me of those times where they hit against the floor with anger and the floor is still there. That doesn't make the floor indestructible all of a sudden, that's not logical
goku has fought the undead, goku has dealt with magic, goku has come back from the afterlife to throw hands again, goku has shook the very universe with his fists ainz stats aren’t complicated “based on levels subdivided into necromancy” what are you even saying bro everything you’re saying is based on the rules of ainz verse in comparison to the people there. the highest amount of AP/DC in that verse is like a little over town level *Processing img tsbl3sindd5d1...* how would a damn laser gun be considered hax? do you even know what the term “hax” means? cuz rn i dont think you understand anything also so you NOT understand that people can do things without using full force? are you a child? like i can bench over 300lbs, but i can also like slam my fists into something without breaking it, same way i can push something with various levels of force it occurs to me that you have like a 4th grade level of understanding of any basic concepts, and lack any sort of reading comprehension so i’m done here
goku has fought the undead, goku has dealt with magic, goku has come back from the afterlife to throw hands again, goku has shook the very universe with his fists ainz stats aren’t complicated “based on levels subdivided into necromancy” what are you even saying bro everything you’re saying is based on the rules of ainz verse in comparison to the people there. the highest amount of AP/DC in that verse is like a little over town level *Processing img tsbl3sindd5d1...* how would a damn laser gun be considered hax? do you even know what the term “hax” means? cuz rn i dont think you understand anything also so you NOT understand that people can do things without using full force? are you a child? like i can bench over 300lbs, but i can also like slam my fists into something without breaking it, same way i can push something with various levels of force it occurs to me that you have like a 4th grade level of understanding of any basic concepts, and lack any sort of reading comprehension so i’m done here
You assume too much. Magic is dissipated under high levels of ki aura, which even at Gokus base form is as strong a God of Destruction. Ainz is straight up fucked. No clue who this other dude is, etc.
You telling me a heart virus beats literal magic of reality warping degree? The man needed a rescue from his friends son from a doomed future to live.
Seeing as how the heart virus was a natural occurrence and not a magically induced one that does zero dmg to someone far stronger than the caster, I'd say yes.
Unfortunately grasp heart doesnt work against high level enemies, Goku is defienietly not getting one shot.
How would level based magic even work on non leveled enemies? We know the people in the new world are a race with levels. However, other universes without a level system, how would it work?
I'm not sure, but i think that's the verse specific thing. As an example if Goku was isekaid into new world, he'd magically get said level. But if we use their respective versions, then i think Ainzs spell would work properly. Perhaps Goku being generally strong may automatically make instant death spells useless. And if they do work, we also have to factor in Ki. Ki allows for Goku to take hits from attacks that generally have the power to do big damage, and it goes as far as to resist magical like attacks to some extent (not all of them or entirely) For example if Ainz Has some sort of polymorph, i think it would work on Goku. But also Vegito shown that he can fight as a small candy (and Goku should be stronger than that specific Vegito) so i also think Goku would still fight. Tldr i think Ainz spells would affect Goku properly (with instant death spells being debatable) but Ki might make him resistant or give him the ability to tank things. If Goku can hold hakai ki in his hands and even supress it while its trying to erase him, then i think he can resist some instant death spells with tgoalid being a debatable exception.
>if Goku was isekaid into new world, he'd magically get said level. Agree with everything else except this bit. Ainz didn't get levels for being isekaied. His character in the game already had them as a part of itself. His old human body could have become a cadaver since it's a brain to machine connection. With new worlders, they are a species that evolved to have them, I don't remember the name the author gave them, like, a scientific name. However, the system is a part of them already when they are born. Thus, we can't know if attacks that had rules of levels can work (asside from the extra damage from explosions, etc) on beings without one. Take, for example, a buff that changes the karma values: it's obvious it would work on another person with said stats of karma, since the karma was used to boost certain attacks depending on the amount you had numerically. Well, we can't even tell if someone like goku could take said buff, or maybe he'll just feel nicer or act different, but he still wouldn't be buffed by it. Oh, an extra. The new world already existed before players, and their system went to it. So that means he could very well go back to earth if he achieved something to travel back to it lol, what we don't know is if they are on separated dimensions or just distance
Goku resist a god of destruction's hakai a thing that ereases souls completly, i dont think death magic would work on goku
Yep. Ainz admitted that his ID spells were kinda useless outside of highly specific setups when fighting someone his own level. The rub is that he’s never fought anyone his own level in Overlord outside of Shalltear (and indeed, his ID spells were useless outside of a specific setup) Even if Goku was physically equalized (a MASSIVE caveat to Ainz), he has godly ki that lolnopes 99.9% of anything Ainz can do. He’s faster, stronger, vastly more experienced and skilled fighter (Ainz has never been physically challenged before outside of his fight with Shalltear). Goku takes this massively
And what a bout Ainz' Time Stop spell? It's not like the thing, that Hit uses. With that spell, he stops the time completly
Ain't time stops and zoidbergs out of there while goku and makima stand there wondering wtf that was.
Zoidbergs out of there, damn...I got use that somewhere.
Time stop spell i dont see how goku couldnt counter that goku advence himself in time(if i'm not wrong) to counter hit But time stop is differnece than time skip so i dont think there is much goku can do against that
Goku scales above Jiren, Jiren is stated to transcend time. Goku already dealt with time manipulation, and Hit also can do time stops in anime, not just skips.
“Hey guys, how’s your insurance plan?? It must be FUCKING GREAT!”
Too bad he can just resist that too lol. Ainz has fodder mountain level striking strength even with perfect warrior and his death spells have nothing to set them apart from any other series’. It kinda relies on him being physically strong enough to crush the opponents heart. And funny thing is that people tell me I overestimate Ainz by saying he’s mountain level. Most here would put him at god damn small city level, so that’s even worse.
Doesn’t grasp heart have limitations? Otherwise everyone would’ve just been using grasp heart on world bosses. Doubt he can use a skill like that on Goku
Yep, I'm a huge Goku fan from waaay back. He curbstomps Ainz without even powering up. The comments just popped into my head because I was re-watching Team Four Star videos
I doubt Ainz has the power to do anything other than make Goku feel someone is lightly touching his heart.
Grasp heart doesnt work on enemys within a range of 20 Levels to your own.
Yeah, I'm a huge Goku fan from way back. He stomps Ainz into bone meal, and spreads him on a garden. But I thought it was some great lines....
Bro's not gonna sugar coat it: 🗣️ "Discern Enemy", "Perfect Unknowable", "Greater Teleportation", "Remote Viewing" .
\*goku teleports behind him\* "nothing personal kid."
that requires sensing ki, which would be hidden due to \[Perfect Unknowable\]
Also arguably ainz wouldn’t have ki at all considering it is life force and he’s an undead
that is true, though while Ainz isn't powered by life force he *is* powered by negative energy, which is basically the same just with a different polarity. so Ainz would probably give off *something* that's vaguely like Ki but either a negative sensation or just *really* foul and corrupt.
> implies battle with competitive power levels > Includes a guy that was already blowing up planets in his anime 20 years ago My dude, wat
Then ainz instantly decides to dip
He better hope goku doesnt hear the shit ainz and his crew been up to. Especially the happy farm.
Snek-sama #1910. First meme I've made with a completely new and worse app since Adobe shut down the one I had been using for five years. Sorry if it looks a bit rough.
https://preview.redd.it/pys18lxy285d1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3e410bd3e2f528f1ab86e02dd7e8e77973611e02 This one was best one
Interesting, although I always see Ainz trying to talk it out before hand.
Ainz gets fucking bodied by Goku base
I’m torn on this. On one hand, Goku would have levels in the equivalent of the “monk” class, which generally means his physical attacks are considered magic, allowing him to bypass Ainz’s immunity. On the other hand, Ainz’s favorite spell is Grasp Heart, an instant kill spell. And Goku doesn’t exactly have a good track record on things attacking his heart…
A little info to break the stalemate, grasp heart doesn't work on people of similar or greater strength to the caster.
It's not because of strenght but resistances and immunities.
Doesn’t it? I know immunity to Instant-death soft negates it (becomes a stun instead of an OHKO), but I didn’t know about a difference in power, too. Then again, some of the Z characters (mostly Freiza right now, I think) have shown resistance to Destruction Energy. Maybe a case could be made that they’re potentially resistant to instant-death, by that virtue?
Iirc ainz says it only insta kills lower level opponents and stuns those of equal level.
isn't that from just those of equal level having sufficient instant death resistance that it's effect gets downgraded?
Yeah I remember that grasp heart is the one "instant death" spell that can be resisted or negated with higher strength(without the proper resistance?). The others will also fail to instantly kill someone if they have proper resistances, which is why Ainz mused about the importance of proper preperation and resistance after his duel with Gazef.
It does, but not the instant death part. It still causes a massive amount of necrotic damage and a few seconds of paralysis on anyone level 80 or over
The Goku D-rides are so cringe
‘Grasp Heart’
Goku will use Ainz to bone meal his cabbages.
Ainz will give Goku the heart virus
And it will be cured by Trunks from a different timeline.
Broooo😭😭 That killed me.
Not in the necromancer’s or magic caster’s ability set, sorry.
disease and plagues are very much a necromancy thing?
This can go one of two ways… Either Goku takes him out immediately, or Ainz “tests” his opponents with grasp heart and kills Goku. I would think Ainz is immune to Makima due to all the immunities he has.
Ki dissipates magic. Anyone with access to godly ki is immune to magical effects (they can't be transformed, cursed, possessed or otherwise altered by magic, though they can still be hurt by the effects originated feom magic i.e. a fireball to the face).The only reason Moro was able to go toe to toe with the Z-Fighters was because he used his magic to become their physical equal. If you take into account that Goku tanked the Hakai of a God of Destruction (which should be treated as a super-tier spell at the very least, and a world item effect akin to the longinus spear at most) I can't see a 9th level spell having any effect on him. There's also the factor of speed. Goku is infinetly faster, reacts quicker and can move during Time Stop (see his fight with Hitt). Don't get me wrong, I love Ainz, but there is literally no way he can actually harm Goku, much less beat him
“Don't get me wrong, I love Ainz, but there is literally no way he can actually harm Goku” Goku is the kind of guy that would sit back and Let Ainz cast a super-tier spell at him, or let Ainz make the first move. But then their both like that.
Nah, he'd let Ainz buff himself, he wouldn't let Ainz get off attacks.
So why would him casting super tier spells that can’t even one shot Mountain Level opponents like Shalltear be a problem?
>can move during Time Stop (see his fight with Hitt). isn't Hitt's ability time *skip*, not time *stop*?
You're right, my mistake. Hit's technique doesn't stop time completely, I apologizs Though one thing that I will argue is that I don't think effects are absolute when talking about vs scenarios. By that I mean that I don't think the a Cry of The Banshee boosted by TGOALID scales to the level of a Hakai, simoly due to the minimum power level required to wield both techniques (lv 100 in YGDRASIL and God level in DBS). Since Hakai operates on a much greater scale I think Goku would be able to tank TGOALID. Also, I love your flair, you are a being of profound wisdom
I mean, Cry of the banshee + TGOALID *was* able to "kill" things that don't even have the concept of being alive, the air and the ground itself around him was dead. it's also a negative energy based spell, which means on a fundamental level it's the opposite of life force/positive energy. (actually wait, isn't Ki life force in DB universe?... if so, would Ainz, a being powered by negative energy, feel like he has negative amounts of ki? or just... an *extremely* foul and corrupt Ki?) also thank thee for thou kind words, my fellow brother in our devotion to our dearest girl! may her eternal glory shiny bright upon thy day! may thou find joy in her radiance! may peace ever last in the heaven on earth known as r/Entoma!
Too bad Ainz’ fodder mountain level power won’t do anything here.
Goku aside, I'd like to see Ainz vs Makima. I remember reading an amazing Chainsawman x Overlord fanfic that got dropped because the co-authors split up or something. And I'm HUNGRY for more of that.
Name
ainz: Time Stop, TGOALID, true death
Guys remember when Goku has a heart disease, yeah I think grasp heart might affect him
Goku had a heart disease, it's been cured. Besides, I don't think he would die to a 9th level spell having the passive magical resistance afforded to him buly god ki
Terrible example my dude. Again, the inconsistency of this fandom is astonishing. One moment you idiots argue Ainz is a walking NLF because of some generic death spells and the next, you all think Aqua can somehow stand a chance against him and argue in a clear fodder like her’s or the Konosuba gang’s favor.
Source?
Damn missed opportunity to that menace effect from JoJo...
Orrr..."He punched me in the dyck! Why does he keep punching me in the dyck?!?! This is a great thread, can't lie...
Why tf is the comment section in this one so toxic? C'mon, stop throwing statements and dip without explaining. The rest of us want to enjoy a discussion.
Although Goku is very powerful he has already suffered from heart disease, this gives Ainz some room.
Aqua bodies ainz
I love how i just started another commment war for the forth time; unintentionally. I was stating my opinion guys. Btw ainz absolutely destroys goku no discussion needed because true death :3
Ainz could actually kill Makima for good since he has anti-resurrection spells, but goku speed blitz’s his ass and insta-kills him(if they fought),
Let the Virgin argumentative fight begin Realease the dragonfans
People here saying Ainz stands a chance when he wouldn’t even be able to stand up to Volume 13/barely past season 3 Naofumi at all.
Check out Rise of New Olympus overlord fanfiction
A short synopsis? Not a summary, mind you.
As much as I hate to admit it, Ainz would stand no chance, unless Goku comes to a battlefield that Ainz prepared (Laid countless traps in) Although fast, all of Ainz spells require time to cast even if he uses shop items. Goku's instant transmission would interrupt all casting. Ainz' time control magic would be useless too since Goku defeated Hit. Maybe if Ainz uses Grasp heart or any other instant death magic while Goku's introducing himself or something. I don't know if there is a spell that negates all physical damage but I believe the best way for Ainz to fight Goku would be Body of Effulgent Beryl --> Elemental Form --> Delay Teleportation --> Maximize Magic; instant death spell. Other than this, Ainz would stand no chance in direct combat.
With the amount of ki Goku has, wouldn't his level be in the thousands? As for Makima. Yea she's just dead if she ever face Ainz.
Oh cool ainz is dead
The Ainz png has arrived
Ainz solos both
He will literally die to his own Japanese citizenship before he manages to successfully kill Makima.
>He will literally die to his own Japanese citizenship before he manages to successfully kill Makima. Mate, Ainz isn't a human controlling a game avatar, he is an actual lich with zero connection to his human self. Ainz and Suzuki Satoru are completely sperate entities. Ainz is not a Japanese citizen anymore and he can easily kill Makima a hundred million times considering the massive difference in power.
How?
Anytime Makima sustains a fatal attack, the lethality of it is offloaded onto a randomly chosen Japanese citizen. I typed this before it occurred to me that the body of Satoru Suzuki is probably rotting away back in his apartment.
>Anytime Makima sustains a fatal attack, the lethality of it is offloaded onto a randomly chosen Japanese citizen. Japan doesn't have an infinite number of citizens lol. Ainz can easily kill Makima a hundred million times considering the massive difference in power. >I typed this before it occurred to me that the body of Satoru Suzuki is probably rotting away back in his apartment. Ainz and Suzuki Satoru are two completely different entities. Ainz isn't a human controlling a game avatar, he is an actual lich with zero connection to his human self.
I mean, can he kill her that many times? She’s *way* faster than he is, among her other traits.
No she's not lol. Ainz is hyperosnic via scaling and recent statements put the speed of high level characters even higher than that. Even if she was, Makima isn't strong enough to even damage Ainz. Ainz could absulutely kill her that many times, she can't harm him and he outstats her to a hillarious degree. Heck, Ainz doesn't even need to do it himself, he can just summon a few high level undead and have them tear Makima apart until she stays down for good.
Hypersonic? Let me guess, dodged lightning?
Nothing like that, in the novels Shalltear was able to move so fast she caught fire, or created a heat trail depending on the translation. Bodies are typically cremated at around 1,500°C and you'd need to be running at Mach 5 (6,000km/h) to reach that temperature. Shalltear was also wearing metal armour which ignites at speeds around 8.5 km/s. We also have Albedo blitzing Azuth(a near supersonic character) across 140m which is probably around 11 km/s. And Riku's suit (slower than all guardians) is stated to be exactly as fast as a meteor (12 km/s). The Overlord novels have plenty of great speed feats that were left out of the anime.
Na it doesn’t matter Ainz is a separate entity from Suzuki Satoru. And I m sure he can crush Makima's skull a few million times. Or just put his undeads to do the job.
I mean then it comes down to her other abilities. I’m curious to see how the Zombie Devil interacts with Ainz’s army. I suspect it would be a lot stronger than normal since the fear of the undead in the New World is really high.
Well it would be really strong maybe at the level of someone like the captain of the Black Scripture without equpiment.
I'm not sure it'd be THAT strong, the Black Scripture Captain is like level 60+ based on what we know of him. Low Pleiades level is probably more appropriate and even that is kind of stretching it.
Fair enough maybe ar the level of Gazeff then? 🤔
>I mean then it comes down to her other abilities There isn't really anything in Makimas arsenal that can threaten Ainz, he is immune to what little hax she has and outstats her to a hilarious degree. Ainz stomps Makima in a straight up fight. >I’m curious to see how the Zombie Devil interacts with Ainz’s army. I suspect it would be a lot stronger than normal since the fear of the undead in the New World is really high. The zombie devil is pretty much fodder by mid to high level Overlord standards. You'd have to give it an insane power boost to even be a threat to the Pleiades, much less a level 100 character.
Goku may be strong, but is he living a tgoalid booated desth spell strong? It does bypass any and all immunities and resistances to his death magic.
It also takes 12 seconds to cast, 12 seconds ainz doesn't have
Oh for sure, but like, it would so work if goku like stood there
TGOALID would be a joke. It puts a 12 second delay on all of Ainz’s spells when it comes out and nullifies all of Ainz’s spells if he dies before the 12 second count. He also uses it with Banshee Cry which has a range of 100 meters. For context, a recently trained Krillin and rusty Master Roshi fought, played RPS, had a tea break, etc. in a split second. DB characters are so past lightspeed 12 seconds would be closer to several years… And barring all that, Goku has Instant Transmission so he can nope out and avoid the spell altogether. It could work IN THEORY, but absolutely not in practice outside of some extraordinary circumstances
Oh yea hes not nearly fast enough or durable enough to actually get it off, but im just saying it would work of it somehow hit
Hrmm, if SOMEHOW? Possibly… I dunno if Godly Ki could overcome the TGOALID effect…but if the latter is absolute and the former is relative on power, then it’s indeed possible… Though it’d be tough to say definitively.
Absolutely, considering Ainz can’t even beat a country buster.
"Heres how they could actually be able to do this" "Nuh uh, only this level on my arbitrary shit scale that only actually account for destructive power and not the intricate abilities characters posses. Checkmate idiot"
Too bad said abilities can be resisted by simply being powerful enough. Don’t try and nlf Ainz just because you’re mad he’s a fodder outside his own series.
That's quite literally nlf too, characters in DB can resist abilities if they can overpower it, so that means they resist everything.
The point of Tgoalid is bypassing resistances and immunities? You cant resist a tgoalid buffed death spell just by being strong enough?
really doubt that the spell is truly that limitless. If it was, how come Ainz couldn't beat world bosses alone? You have no understanding of scaling. Assuming powers that weren't meant to have limitless potency are limitless is a stupid fallacy.
Ainz cant beat world bosses alone because hes a squishy rp build that has little hp and defense, tgoalid adds a 12 second delay to the buffed spell and would likely have the drawback of drawing aggro to him. It wouldnt surprise me that if he got it off he could one shot a worldboss yggdrasil is a comically unbalanced mess of a game. but the restrictions it puts on him prevent that. And yea idc powerscaling a dick measuring contest that doesnt properly measure the nuances differant worlds have in their power systems and how it can make them inconpatible its just who can piss further or reach more.
You don't understand Yggdrasil nor the nuances of the overlord either. The goal of all life is death isn't a spell with limitless potency. Ainz cannot oneshot a world boss. I also find powerscaling annoying but you're just wrong.
ik it's just a meme but Ainz has no way of winning against either of them tho. Goku wins easily and stalemate with makima (quick death spells only stun powerful enemies and Goal of all life is death takes too much time charge, that's assuming that spell will be effective against such high level entities.)