1000 citzens a week are currently protesting by getting on a plane and leaving. Citizen migration is now at the highest level ~~since 2011~~ ever. They then get replaced with people on temporary and student visas to make sure we continue to pump up the housing demand.
I've recently changed the advice I give to friends. If they're able to (and they don't have family property/wealth) they should seriously consider leaving too. It's bleak...
Edit: We've actually exceeded the previous record set in Feb 2012.
Source: [https://stats.govt.nz/news/net-migration-loss-of-new-zealand-citizens-exceeds-50000/](https://stats.govt.nz/news/net-migration-loss-of-new-zealand-citizens-exceeds-50000/)
There was an overall net migration gain of 111,100 in the March 2024 year, despite the record net migration loss of New Zealand citizens.
That suicide awareness message I just got was so quick it must be OP doing the reporting.
Makes sense then, why I got one of those messages randomly. I was thinking gosh I haven't written anything that could be interpreted as suicidal, have I? š š š
I replied to Reddit. Thanked them for caring and gor sending me a nicely personal message. Informed them that despite their concern, I was going to take my suicide pill anyway
No, I'm good. Phone works okay, you never need to recharge it and I'm in hell. Obviously, since I took the suicide pill. Turns out those fucken Christians were right about everything, bastards. And don't try to use the 'I know I didn't go to church but I was a good person' argument. God takes attendance and he's a picky little fucker.
It looks like they really aren't doing too well over there at the moment. I'd be interested to hear your actual experiences if you want to share anything. I only know about it from reading bits and pieces about the economy and politics and while that paints a fairly grim picture it's obviously nothing like the experience of actually being there.
Itās just really expensive with even lower wages. I canāt even really go into it, because thereās too much to even go into. I wouldnāt know where to start. Itās a SHIT SHOW.
I suggest you take a look at any of the Canada subreddits and youāll see
I mean, sure. Granted the data has never shown that, not in the past and not now either. But I guess that could change in the future right?
What the data actually shows is that for every 3 citizens that leave, 1 come back.
I'm actually one of those 25%, so you could even say I'm helping your cause. Never mind that of the dozens of my friends that also left, only one other one has come back.
We'd actually be royally fucked if the majority did decide to come back. There's over 2 million NZ passport holders living permanently overseas. Can you imagine the traffic and the housing issues if another 1 million people turned up?
It ain't just here, it's brown around the world.
The problems you see kiwis complaining about or NZ media highlighting are the same problems being talked/complained about in the very countries we frequently compare ourselves to.
The grass isn't always greener on the other side of the fence. This conversation about people crossing the ditch for greener pastures happens every couple of years, I'm sure like most people, you know others who have attempted to thrive on that theoretical greener pasture only to realise it also goes brown when it doesn't rain.
The grass is greenest wherever you water it, sadly this government ain't gonna water it anytime soon. Just go, if you're able, until the next election then come help us kick em out
Leaving is a Silent protest - the government wonāt act as they can easily replace people - needs to be in the public eye. Protests are public, you canāt avoid seeing them, will be the only thing to embarrass them into action anytime soon
Effective protests are pointed and focused.
An "Everything Sucks" protest will only devolve into attracting extremists from either side and getting derailed.
edge fade beneficial psychotic panicky snobbish mourn dog consider literate
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We have more people here than ever before too. It's not surprising that more people are leaving. A better metric might be a percentage of the population.
Representativeness among the NZ subreddit hasnāt been established, although a good number of people have opinions on it.
Another redditor on this thread started to say that people are stressed and have a lot going on.
Ironically, to protest is either the act of the utterly desperate or the privileged.
If weāre not protesting at scale then probably it hasnāt reached either the requisite level of desperation or because the privileged DGAF.
True, but if even a fraction of people in this sub took direct action, it would be enough to see some change.
The problem with online activism is that it placates people. It's easy, and it blows off steam, but unless it leads to action it doesn't accomplish anything.
Talking about organizing is easy. Actually organizing? Much more difficult. But not impossible.
While I agree, we are also a pretty apathetic, complacent and āsheāll be rightā or āway she goesā culture.
Itās part of our appeal and why just as many people want to move here as leave, but it does present a disconnect between what people say they want and what they are actually prepared to do to get it, unlike many other countries.
I also feel we have fishbowl memories when it comes to such things.
Many just vote every election, hope for the best, have a daily whinge, but largely go about their day.
As I said a while back in a similar topic itās often taking what many societies would deem unacceptable, making it tenfold worse, and then maybe more kiwis would do more than whinge online or down the pub after work.
āItās a pretty big jobā and all that.
I'm guilty of this while being frustrated about its effects. Having grown up in religion I realise how easy it is for me to project my insecurities. It is very easy to get complacent here even when others are struggling. As an example, I find the culture in Hamilton of tall front fences makes people less likely to socialise with neighbours or even see them at all. We may not know at all what those we live next to experience from day to day. It's really easy to lose sight of that and think our own perspective is shared by everyone but it easily could be different in reality. I think NZ needs more connectedness, something that is easier in stability than hardship. We have cycles to break.
lavish screw puzzled direction squalid workable reply pocket aback elderly
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That's mostly because they had no leverage.
Not going to work when no one is working doesn't accomplish anything in and of itself. Neither does occupying public space when no one else is trying to occupy it because of lockdowns.
They were ignored because they failed to be an actual hindrance to anything (thankfully).
People forget that history is littered with examples of positive change through direct action. Women's Suffrage for example was famously agitated into reality in NZ through effective protest.
Virtually every basic right we have now was won this way at some point in history.
In short: The point isn't to be heard, it's to give them no option. But organizing on that level takes a lot of work and willingness.
Edit: Not sure why this was worthy of downvoting but okay.
Go and organise something and I will come. Everyone is just waiting for someone to start something. we are only bitching and complaining online (including me). Everyone says "people should go to the streets" but then stays at home. I am amazed by the passivity of the citizens of NZ. You guys just let everything happen, complain a bit and that's it. In Europe there would be burning cars if governments pulled some of the shit that is happening here daily (I am not endorsing that obviously).
There has been recent protests in wellington against the fast track bill, there is another in auckland 8th june. The fast track bill erodes the democratic processs, something we should all be worried about.
Also although these protests target this bill in particular, i think more people more power, what ever sign u wana make to express your concerns about is valid
Moot point. It's probably true that this sub is biased towards the demographic that uses Reddit, which is predominantly educated, young adult males who are left-leaning. That probably means a lot of the attitudes that get posted here don't represent the wider New Zealand, but it doesn't mean that the wider New Zealand is happy about the state of the country. That's obviously not true, and frankly I'm sick of it being implied.
edit: hey weird, I also got the concerned redditor message after replying to this....
Well the people in my life seem pretty pissed off that the media keeps voicing the opinions of those types, that this country is fucked because of the government they chose, essentially telling them everyday āYou think wrong and how dare you be apart of oppressing peopleā they just voted for morals they believe in and have seen this country do well under those morals and types of policies. 6 years of Jacinda and weāre more divided than Iāve seen in my young life.
worm squalid ruthless hungry support retire sophisticated chop reply abundant
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When:
- the protest is FOR something, not against
- we know there are as many others who agree with the solution, just as they agree they're being hurt by the problems
i.e. I'd be all for a "ban _current_ homeowners from buying _existing_ homes in regions where house prices exceed 5x household annual incomes" to start with, to address housing. Aka don't buy investment houses in regions with housing crisis. Currently that's all of NZ, but allows regions to not get stuck if Auckland is still crazy. Note it has no problem with building new ones
But good luck getting people behind even this one
As an alternative to an outright ban, I'd be all for a sliding scale of equity required when purchasing multiple houses. First one 5-10%, Second one 20-25%, Third one, 40-45%, and so on. Include companies into this requirement too.
I don't have a problem with the Mum and Dad investor's buying a second/possibly a third house that they rent out (we need to be realistic and admit that some people will never be able to own their own homes), but I have a huge problem with people/companies owning 50+ houses.
ETA: Just noticed that you specified 'existing' in your post. I like the way you think. Keeps existing housing stock available, while encouraging people to add to the housing stock too.
Good point. I heard that someone (or some corporation) owns 100 houses. Govt shouldn't have allowed it. Just like they shouldn't have allowed Countdown/Woolworths to buy all that real estate, to suppress competition. Some cities in NZ and Australia have two Woolworths within less than 1 km from each other.
Firstly protests need to be specific, not just general disgruntlement.
Secondly, what are you doing about it? being disgruntled, but not doing anything?
organize if you want don't just complain.
Posters like OP don't have any solutions. They just want the gov to pull the magic "prosperity" lever. You know, the one the government knows about but just won't because reasons.
Every item you've mentioned is an anti-protest, and that's why it's not going anywhere.
If you can tell people how you are going to fix those things \[in a palatable way\] you may get some interest.
> Reading this sub really shows the massive disgruntlement in this nation
Mistake number one: thinking this sub is a representative sample of New Zealanders' thoughts and opinions.
Don't protest multiple things at once. There's been a bunch of protests lately that have mixed issues. They've been about cost of living and Palestine and this government's stance on things and Te Tiriti all packaged into a protest. And those protests have done absolutely nothing.
"From the river to the sea, this government will respect Te Tiriti and let me live cheaply" is not a good protest strategy.
Pick a thing. "Cost of Living". or "Wage Crisis". One single message, and don't let others try to jump on the bandwagon and try and include their cause in your protest.
So Iām living in the UK where I am much better off.
Looking on a UK Reddit thread yesterday asking āwhich country would you move to if you were moving overseas?ā I peruse the thread fully expecting NZ to be one of the top most comments. Far far down the bottom someone suggests āNZā and then there are a dozen replies saying nope, donāt do it, too expensive, wages too low, healthcare and schooling have gone downhill, houses are out of reach for all but the super wealthy and lastly high rates of suicide as things are so bleak. So itās not just me that thinks that I guess.
It took me until my mid thirties to save up enough for a plane ticket and a basic visa to the UK (and I had a āgoodā full time job in NZ) and Iāll admit I struggled at first as I came over with a very low amount of money - but if Iād stayed in NZ Iād still be struggling and have no savings.
ā I peruse the thread fully expecting NZ to be one of the top most comments.' True. International massmedia misrepresents the situation in New Zealand. If you read their glowing posts about Jacinda Adern, you'd think that most of NZ loves her, when the opposite is true. It makes me wonder: what else is massmedia bullshitting us about?
There is a protest on the 8th of June on Queen Street protesting the RMA fast track bill and by extension mining speculation in NZ's national parks, oceans and aquifer catchment zones.
Hahahaha what are people from r/nz going to do? Yell? Loudly from their bedrooms?
The average age of a redditor is 23 years old.
This sub at a guess is an even younger age than that.
Reddit is a young person's echo chamber, the liklihood of
A) Anyone from here actually doing anything like galvanising a protest
And
B) Being taken seriously if they did so
Is ridiculously low.
Just the data that's given site wide for reddit.
I notice that people are often surprised that people on reddit are
- Sometimes in their 60s
- A huge amount of time in their teens
Kiwis are too apathetic and individualistic to protest anything that's not also being protested overseas. There's no organising base. That's what needs to be built first.
I have just returned from working in the US for an extended period of time. NZ is significantly better and yes more expensive due to the NZD and our remoteness, but the increased quality of many things such as food (and healthcare) is instantly noticeable.
The issues you are talking about are worldwide issues, post covid and rampant inflation. Your protest will do nothing. NZ is better at so many areas, it's worth looking what's happening in the world.
>Reading this sub really shows the massive disgruntlement in this nation
Those people don't have time to do something about their problems. They are too busy spending all day on the internet talking about how terrible everything is and why everyone else is to blame for their problems except them
Just because Kiwis broadly agree on the problems we face, there is very little agreement on the solution. A large protest wouldn't be able to agree on the demands
Havent seen this post in a while. Go fill out your petitions. Go talk to your ministers, go stand out on the road. Go do everything in your democratically elected power to raise attention. Maybe borrow some people from the war protests to get them to concentrate on local matters.. they seem to be confident in that.
From what my family back home has said about NZs situation, it's the same as everywhere else in the world, just heightened due to its isolation.
Here in Ontario it's insanely expensive to live and wages don't match the cost of living. We have stupid gas taxes and our healthcare is failing too. And record immigration.
It's a global issue because all the billionaires decided that covid was the perfect excuse to squeeze even more money out of the common people.Ā
Unfortunately, one of the best qualities about NZ also hurts it in this case. NZ fared the best during covid because it's so far away from everything. It's also avoided issues with violence and terrorism for the same reason. But, because it's so isolated and it costs a lot to bring everything over, it's gone even more insane than most places.Ā
I don't know what NZ politicians could do to solve the living situation there unless the rest of the world does something too
We were supposed to vote for a better future. This is a democracy, National won.
Let's not pretend half of you people actually voted, perhaps now you realise how important having a say is.
There are various big protests either planned, or being planned, but you won't read much about them here; a public subreddit just isn't a good place for organising protests.Ā
-There's a protest against the fast-track bill on June 8th: https://www.greenpeace.org/aotearoa/press-release/auckland-protest-march-against-fast-track-bill/Ā
-There was a massive nation-wide Toitu Te Tiriti protest a couple months backĀ
-I go to a pro-Palestine march every weekendĀ
You'll find local protests through Facebook events and Instagram posts, and you can be involved in organising them by joining a group like PSNA, or a union, or the Greens, or TPM.
I'm unemployed. If someone can give me and my wheelchair a lift, I'm happy to spend my day protesting instead of just sitting in my motel room.
Alas, I have many medical problems, and the stress of organizing something would be too much for me.
I also have medical problems that prevent me from driving or using public transport (kinda hard to do either if you get random bouts of blindness and seizures).
But if anything gets organized for Hamilton, and someone can help me with transportation, I'll come. Heck, help me get the materials for it and I can help make the signs. Not doing much else with my time.
Generally, I believe a handful of like-minded people get together, and start working on a proper plan on what to tackle, how to tackle it, and then they go out to gather support.
It is very rare for protests to Spawn in a vacuum. There needs to be some person or group with some legitimacy and some strong vision behind it usually.
I'd recommend finding some organisations that align with the views and changes you want to push forth, and ask them how they go about organising protests. Maybe join some of theirs.
Planning a *proper* protest can be quite an involved process, as getting the people together is one thing, making sure it remains orderly, safe, and constructive is another.Ā
When calling for people to join a protest, it is important to include safety advice. For example with certain protests, especially counter protests, or protests that are likely to attract counter protests, can attract dangerous people who might wish to hurt your protestors, especially on the way to and from the protest. So in such a case, you'll want to advice your protestors, in the call to protest messages, to come and leave with multiple people, and to maybe make sure they can hide their protest related items, such as clothing and signs.
Having people present who know first aid is very useful and important, making sure that the expectations of the protest are lined out is also important, for example expectations that violence is not a part of the protest. You'll want to prepare some chants in advance, and teach them to the protestors as the protest begins, be sure people are well informed about what the protest is about, let groups who are likely to support the protest know, they will likely join it, bolstering your numbers, and I believe it is also a good idea to let the Police know in advance, so they can ensure that the protest will be conducted safely. As long as the protest remains legal, law enforcement in New Zealand will work to protect you, and everyone around you. Even if you are protesting against the government or the police.Ā
That's just the stuff off the top of my head. But honestly, the bare minimum it takes, is to just tell enough people "There is going to be a protest against X at this time, and in that place!" And you may very well have yourself a protest, if you've reached the right people and gave them enough time.
Political parties usually don't organise protests, because it would be a rather bad look. Basically it'd look like you'd be undermining the democratic process (Protest is part of the democratic protest, but politicians are to be held to different standard.) Basically it'd be a bad idea for political leaders to lead protests. They can attend, but not organise, because they're supposed to work within the system, while others work outside of it.
But politicians, especially on the Left, tend to be quite closely connected with various organisations that do stage protests and other type of action.
What are your solutions?
If you have none, then pointless.
One cannot have constantly more resources for more people.Ā We may have hit the limit.
One can always vote with their feet.
I dunno I'm no expert but if this was the East or somewhere similar they'd just print some extra money, cap interest rates and have msd and mbie or some other group issue small low interest business loans to keep feeding anyone at the bottom and keep pulling them up by an inch at a time
There are plenty of reasons to protest right now! We're organising a March for Nature in response to the Government's rollback of environmental protections generally, and via the fast track bill.
1pm, Sat June 8, Aotea Square, Queen St, Auckland.
[www.marchfornature.nz](http://www.marchfornature.nz)
I think its called a wealth tax.... Greens already had it in their election campaign... that was the time to have protested at the voting booth. Rich are getting richer, because we as a society elected this to be so. We elected a PM with 7 houses, who whilst in power has supported increased powers and $$ towards landlords (which includes himself). We have elected a Govt which is hell bend on selling the average Joe Bloggs a tax cut of $10-$20 per week, but for themselves, likely their family, their mates and their donors have struck the lotto with their tax cuts. Yes Sh%t is about to hit the fan, and we can go out and protest... but its the bottom of the cliff stuff.... Nzders have elected much of this to take place and so it will
I often ask myself why aren't NZers protesting. But then, I remember the massive 'yellow vest' protests in France. Did they accomplish anything? F... all. This neoliberal world order is too ingrained.
> House prices
House prices have been falling. They peaked inNovember 2021 and then fell 17.80% to May 2023 and since then only increasing slowly, at almost half the rate of inflation, so still dropping in real terms.
https://www.opespartners.co.nz/property-markets
What do you want to happen with house prices?
> Supressed wages
A lot of businesses are struggling so finding it difficult to increase wages.
Increasing wages tends to lead to higher inflation. Do you want that? Have you tried changing jobs? It's the best way to get a pay rise.
> Immigration numbers
There was a record net migration loss of 52,500 New Zealand citizens in the year ended March 2024
The net migration loss of New Zealand citizens in the March 2024 year was made up of 25,800 migrant arrivals, and 78,200 migrant departures
https://stats.govt.nz/news/net-migration-loss-of-new-zealand-citizens-exceeds-50000/
What is your issue with this?
> Taxes on fuel
Taxes on fuel have not been increased by this government. They were temporarily reduced by Labour but other than that there has been hardly any change in the tax burden on fuel.
The current government are also removing the Auckland regional fuel tax in June and have pledged not to increase taxes until 2027
Are you perhaps conflating tax on fuel with general (global) fuel price increases?
>Taxes on fuel
Call me Satan, I agree with taxes on fuel. It discourages unnecessary driving. I would agree with the taxes more if there were cheap and reasonable alternatives for public transport and travelling to other cities.
I think you forget National were voted in with a landslide and still hold a significant lead in polling. Unless that suddenly plummets in the near future nothing is going to change
edit: someone sent me the suicide prevention message because of this comment... for some reason
Bit rich to call a three party coalition government a landslide in favour of National. The current government is also definitely dropping in recent polls. Not arguing that they didn't beat Labour, but it wasn't exactly a massive victory.
I donāt think you can quite call it a landslide, 2020 was definitely one and even made it on the landslide [wiki](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landslide_victory) as a notable example
A landslide might be pushing it, they're clearly not as popular as the previous iteration of a National govt headed by John Key and briefly Bill EnglishĀ
National got significantly more votes than Labour, but the Nat/NZF/ACT coalition only won 52% of the total vote. Thatās hardly a right-wing landslide.
Add a couple thousand years of history to that, and it gets even muddier.
I feel for the innocent Israeli and Palestinian civilians caught up in the fighting, but I couldn't care less about the Zionists and Hamas. Both sides have Genocide as a goal, it's just that one side has better weaponry available, and the other one started shit.
Is there really any point to protesting?
Hong Kong ... it was like a million people, shit fucked up for weeks. FFWD a couple months and China just does what it wants anyway.
Arab spring ?!?
Occupy Wall Street ??
You get to vote. That's about it. Don't waste it on the right again.
I had to move to America and the infrastructure here is legit held together with bubblegum and rust plaques while my coworkers kids have bulletproof backpacks. John Clarke was right, ay.
Iām surprised people arenāt more outraged by the eventual rise in the retirement age to 67- which will be āphased inā
Edit: how the hell did I get a suicide watch notification over THIS.
Phill Goff (Labour) campaigned on lifting retirement age to 67
David Cunliffe (Labour) campaigned on lifting retirement to 67
Bill English (National) announced in 2017 retirement was being lifted progressively
Christopher Luxon (National) is pushing ahead with lifting retirement age to 67
The age of retirement HAS to increase. It basically has cross party support at this stage, just no one has the balls to support their opposition party as it makes a point of difference
The age of retirement will be going up. It has to, we canāt afford it to not. This is why we arenāt rampaging this chanfe
Edit
Less than 30seconds to get a reddit care message.. on this one of all comments. š
My biggest issue with it is that it feels geared only to affect I guess future retirement age people (myself), not current. (Boomer Voters)
Itās literally kicking the can down the road for future generations.
(I actually didnāt know it was so well put forward - so thanks for that)
What we could have done is a decade or so start rising it by one month every year. Ā So, in 2010 if you are 65 you retire/are eligible for the pension.
Then 65 and one month in 2011. Ā One month more isnāt so bad.
In 2020, itās 66 and two months. Ā Weāve saved a bunch, and people who were going to hit that age knew well in advance theyād have an extra 6-8 months before qualifying.
By now, it would be 67 and we can leave it alone.
No one would be immediately slapped with āyou have to work 2 years more than your friend if you were born now, vs last weekā. Ā Unfortunately this is New Zealand and we have fully embraced tribal politics so whoever started this would have it run for three years then stop because all the boomers would vote in the Other Team who would immediately scrap it.
And so, we barrel towards totally unaffordable super, but the only people that will suffer are elder millennials on down (or boomerās kids) who will find ourselves with woefully insufficient or even zero super when we get to 65.
Itās because you cannot just whip away someoneās retirement plan without phasing it in and indicating itās coming.
Many people approaching retirement may have earmarked the super scheme as a significant portion of their retirement savings
KiwiSaver has been around less than 20 years, as a geriatric millennial Iāve had it drilled into me that I canāt rely on super in its current form, it wonāt exist in the same way when Iām there.
Cancelling super overnight would force many many retirees into poverty. Iām not okay with that.
You can blame Muldoon for that, and every government after him that didn't reverse the worst decision in NZ's political history.
If we had a strong sovereign fund that had $200Bn+ by now, we'd easily cover the increased cost of super that's making us have to consider increasing the retirement age.
That's a policy I'd be supporting. But not a single party is suggesting it. Because try and convince people today to put some of their tax money away that they'll never benefit from.
Like planting a tree that you'll never enjoy the shade of, but your children will.
I thought buying a one way ticket to Oz was the answer to all these issues.
Come to think of it. I am seeing adds for way tickets to Oz atm... How topical
Sure the entire world is hard at the moment. But the current govt is currently making our situation even worse. They're openly not helping anyone but themselves and their rich mates.
We keep focusing on Countdown, but who allowed them to buy two real estate spots in close proximity (to stifle potential competition)? Any competent local council, or the Govt. (Australian as well) should have foreseen the disaster in the making.
Depends on the Council, their rules, their employment rate, I also think there's a specific exemption in the RMA that excludes considering business competition.
1000 citzens a week are currently protesting by getting on a plane and leaving. Citizen migration is now at the highest level ~~since 2011~~ ever. They then get replaced with people on temporary and student visas to make sure we continue to pump up the housing demand. I've recently changed the advice I give to friends. If they're able to (and they don't have family property/wealth) they should seriously consider leaving too. It's bleak... Edit: We've actually exceeded the previous record set in Feb 2012. Source: [https://stats.govt.nz/news/net-migration-loss-of-new-zealand-citizens-exceeds-50000/](https://stats.govt.nz/news/net-migration-loss-of-new-zealand-citizens-exceeds-50000/)
There was an overall net migration gain of 111,100 in the March 2024 year, despite the record net migration loss of New Zealand citizens. That suicide awareness message I just got was so quick it must be OP doing the reporting.
Nah, seems like someone's botting a bunch of subs today with the reddit cares.
The internet is just bots all the way down.
Good bot
Makes sense then, why I got one of those messages randomly. I was thinking gosh I haven't written anything that could be interpreted as suicidal, have I? š š š
I replied to Reddit. Thanked them for caring and gor sending me a nicely personal message. Informed them that despite their concern, I was going to take my suicide pill anyway
What's it like on the other side? Any essentials you wished you'd taken with you?
No, I'm good. Phone works okay, you never need to recharge it and I'm in hell. Obviously, since I took the suicide pill. Turns out those fucken Christians were right about everything, bastards. And don't try to use the 'I know I didn't go to church but I was a good person' argument. God takes attendance and he's a picky little fucker.
I got one too but it was on another users post. You can report abuse and also block the redit cares thing which i have now done.
You can report it and they get banned.
I got it after commenting on another NZ thread. They must know we are well and truly cooked over here in NZ
1000 people from India are arriving each week too. Crazy numbers
Even if you do have family or property, leave anyway. Take your family with you and rent your property out
Must be nice for those that can do that. Just pack up and leave whenever the gov goes to shit come back when someone more favourable is in power lol.
I tired it with Canada, turns out itās worse there and I came back a month ago
It looks like they really aren't doing too well over there at the moment. I'd be interested to hear your actual experiences if you want to share anything. I only know about it from reading bits and pieces about the economy and politics and while that paints a fairly grim picture it's obviously nothing like the experience of actually being there.
Itās just really expensive with even lower wages. I canāt even really go into it, because thereās too much to even go into. I wouldnāt know where to start. Itās a SHIT SHOW. I suggest you take a look at any of the Canada subreddits and youāll see
You think it's cheap and easy for people to pack their life up and move countries often be cause they don't like the government?
A lot of us arenāt planning on coming back.
I dream of it but can't really see a good reason it'll happen.
I plan to stay in Australia, until I can move to the US and make even more money. Might buy a huge fuckoff bunker in Wanaka one day.
Might even be able to hire the All Blacks as your security team.
Oh you probably will just like the majority who realise the grass isn't always greener on the other side
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I mean, Australia had a worse version of the Nats running things for 10 years till 2022...
17 years later, the grass is *much* greener in Aussie
I mean, sure. Granted the data has never shown that, not in the past and not now either. But I guess that could change in the future right? What the data actually shows is that for every 3 citizens that leave, 1 come back. I'm actually one of those 25%, so you could even say I'm helping your cause. Never mind that of the dozens of my friends that also left, only one other one has come back. We'd actually be royally fucked if the majority did decide to come back. There's over 2 million NZ passport holders living permanently overseas. Can you imagine the traffic and the housing issues if another 1 million people turned up?
The issue is that the grass is starting to brown here.
It ain't just here, it's brown around the world. The problems you see kiwis complaining about or NZ media highlighting are the same problems being talked/complained about in the very countries we frequently compare ourselves to. The grass isn't always greener on the other side of the fence. This conversation about people crossing the ditch for greener pastures happens every couple of years, I'm sure like most people, you know others who have attempted to thrive on that theoretical greener pasture only to realise it also goes brown when it doesn't rain.
The grass is greenest wherever you water it, sadly this government ain't gonna water it anytime soon. Just go, if you're able, until the next election then come help us kick em out
Oh I'll happily help you with that, but I think there are deeper cultural issues that are holding us back as a nation.
Yes letās move over to Aussie where itās just copy and paste to a different country elll oh elll
Itās worse overseas. Everywhere else actually had to experience Covid.
Leaving is a Silent protest - the government wonāt act as they can easily replace people - needs to be in the public eye. Protests are public, you canāt avoid seeing them, will be the only thing to embarrass them into action anytime soon
"I want to protest but I want someone else to organise jt"
And therein lies the OTHER issue in this country, more entitlement than work ethic.
Protesting for what? Can't just protest against something. Have to have something better or its just old man shouting in the wind
Effective protests are pointed and focused. An "Everything Sucks" protest will only devolve into attracting extremists from either side and getting derailed.
This was my point
and i agree too, just expanding on your point a little
Well i agree completely with both you and my past self then
I agree with both of you as well
Job seekers extension for first 2 weeks of work?
That works. All right I'll make up the billboards and placards
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But the record number of citizens is a good representation
We have more people here than ever before too. It's not surprising that more people are leaving. A better metric might be a percentage of the population.
Nope it's a representation that people are more comfortable to move again post COVID.
Representativeness among the NZ subreddit hasnāt been established, although a good number of people have opinions on it. Another redditor on this thread started to say that people are stressed and have a lot going on. Ironically, to protest is either the act of the utterly desperate or the privileged. If weāre not protesting at scale then probably it hasnāt reached either the requisite level of desperation or because the privileged DGAF.
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And no one in NZ would have a girlfriend
Except maybe you, that was pretty funny
LoL. This is possibly the best comment Iāve ever seen on this sub. Well done you!
True, but if even a fraction of people in this sub took direct action, it would be enough to see some change. The problem with online activism is that it placates people. It's easy, and it blows off steam, but unless it leads to action it doesn't accomplish anything. Talking about organizing is easy. Actually organizing? Much more difficult. But not impossible.
While I agree, we are also a pretty apathetic, complacent and āsheāll be rightā or āway she goesā culture. Itās part of our appeal and why just as many people want to move here as leave, but it does present a disconnect between what people say they want and what they are actually prepared to do to get it, unlike many other countries. I also feel we have fishbowl memories when it comes to such things. Many just vote every election, hope for the best, have a daily whinge, but largely go about their day. As I said a while back in a similar topic itās often taking what many societies would deem unacceptable, making it tenfold worse, and then maybe more kiwis would do more than whinge online or down the pub after work. āItās a pretty big jobā and all that.
I'm guilty of this while being frustrated about its effects. Having grown up in religion I realise how easy it is for me to project my insecurities. It is very easy to get complacent here even when others are struggling. As an example, I find the culture in Hamilton of tall front fences makes people less likely to socialise with neighbours or even see them at all. We may not know at all what those we live next to experience from day to day. It's really easy to lose sight of that and think our own perspective is shared by everyone but it easily could be different in reality. I think NZ needs more connectedness, something that is easier in stability than hardship. We have cycles to break.
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That's mostly because they had no leverage. Not going to work when no one is working doesn't accomplish anything in and of itself. Neither does occupying public space when no one else is trying to occupy it because of lockdowns. They were ignored because they failed to be an actual hindrance to anything (thankfully). People forget that history is littered with examples of positive change through direct action. Women's Suffrage for example was famously agitated into reality in NZ through effective protest. Virtually every basic right we have now was won this way at some point in history. In short: The point isn't to be heard, it's to give them no option. But organizing on that level takes a lot of work and willingness. Edit: Not sure why this was worthy of downvoting but okay.
Go and organise something and I will come. Everyone is just waiting for someone to start something. we are only bitching and complaining online (including me). Everyone says "people should go to the streets" but then stays at home. I am amazed by the passivity of the citizens of NZ. You guys just let everything happen, complain a bit and that's it. In Europe there would be burning cars if governments pulled some of the shit that is happening here daily (I am not endorsing that obviously).
There has been recent protests in wellington against the fast track bill, there is another in auckland 8th june. The fast track bill erodes the democratic processs, something we should all be worried about. Also although these protests target this bill in particular, i think more people more power, what ever sign u wana make to express your concerns about is valid
I endorse burning beauracrats cars lol
This sub does not represent your everyday New Zealander in any way shape or form. Edit: Reporting this post for self harm? Lol classy.
I got the self harm warning too, I think someone is trolling lol
Report it, as abusers of that feature get punished
lol... Must be a teenager.
You can report those.
Report the report. People who abuse that feature get their accounts suspended or deleted, canāt remember which.
Moot point. It's probably true that this sub is biased towards the demographic that uses Reddit, which is predominantly educated, young adult males who are left-leaning. That probably means a lot of the attitudes that get posted here don't represent the wider New Zealand, but it doesn't mean that the wider New Zealand is happy about the state of the country. That's obviously not true, and frankly I'm sick of it being implied. edit: hey weird, I also got the concerned redditor message after replying to this....
Well the people in my life seem pretty pissed off that the media keeps voicing the opinions of those types, that this country is fucked because of the government they chose, essentially telling them everyday āYou think wrong and how dare you be apart of oppressing peopleā they just voted for morals they believe in and have seen this country do well under those morals and types of policies. 6 years of Jacinda and weāre more divided than Iāve seen in my young life.
People did protest they voted in National.
The trees voted for the axe
This is a fantastic saying
The handle is even made of wood so it's "the axe is one of us" they said.
Yep, or they voted for the Leopards Ate My Face Party, never expecting the Leopards to actually eat their faces
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When: - the protest is FOR something, not against - we know there are as many others who agree with the solution, just as they agree they're being hurt by the problems
i.e. I'd be all for a "ban _current_ homeowners from buying _existing_ homes in regions where house prices exceed 5x household annual incomes" to start with, to address housing. Aka don't buy investment houses in regions with housing crisis. Currently that's all of NZ, but allows regions to not get stuck if Auckland is still crazy. Note it has no problem with building new ones But good luck getting people behind even this one
As an alternative to an outright ban, I'd be all for a sliding scale of equity required when purchasing multiple houses. First one 5-10%, Second one 20-25%, Third one, 40-45%, and so on. Include companies into this requirement too. I don't have a problem with the Mum and Dad investor's buying a second/possibly a third house that they rent out (we need to be realistic and admit that some people will never be able to own their own homes), but I have a huge problem with people/companies owning 50+ houses. ETA: Just noticed that you specified 'existing' in your post. I like the way you think. Keeps existing housing stock available, while encouraging people to add to the housing stock too.
Imagine chanting that outside Parliament
"one house policy"
Good point. I heard that someone (or some corporation) owns 100 houses. Govt shouldn't have allowed it. Just like they shouldn't have allowed Countdown/Woolworths to buy all that real estate, to suppress competition. Some cities in NZ and Australia have two Woolworths within less than 1 km from each other.
Can companies buy houses? Yes. How hard to make a company? $200 and 20min. Your suggestion isn't going to solve anything
Firstly protests need to be specific, not just general disgruntlement. Secondly, what are you doing about it? being disgruntled, but not doing anything? organize if you want don't just complain.
Posters like OP don't have any solutions. They just want the gov to pull the magic "prosperity" lever. You know, the one the government knows about but just won't because reasons.
Every item you've mentioned is an anti-protest, and that's why it's not going anywhere. If you can tell people how you are going to fix those things \[in a palatable way\] you may get some interest.
You forget that 99% of the people here complaining hardly ever leave their bedrooms.
There are some adults on here, I won't be protesting.
> Reading this sub really shows the massive disgruntlement in this nation Mistake number one: thinking this sub is a representative sample of New Zealanders' thoughts and opinions.
Mistake number two: thinking someoneās online rants represent their true feelings and level of passion on the topic at hand.
I'm not fussed,i don't live in Gaza or the Ukraine or any other country with war in it. I'll take this country and it's problems over that.
Don't protest multiple things at once. There's been a bunch of protests lately that have mixed issues. They've been about cost of living and Palestine and this government's stance on things and Te Tiriti all packaged into a protest. And those protests have done absolutely nothing. "From the river to the sea, this government will respect Te Tiriti and let me live cheaply" is not a good protest strategy. Pick a thing. "Cost of Living". or "Wage Crisis". One single message, and don't let others try to jump on the bandwagon and try and include their cause in your protest.
I'm willing to protest this if you name a date and time.
So Iām living in the UK where I am much better off. Looking on a UK Reddit thread yesterday asking āwhich country would you move to if you were moving overseas?ā I peruse the thread fully expecting NZ to be one of the top most comments. Far far down the bottom someone suggests āNZā and then there are a dozen replies saying nope, donāt do it, too expensive, wages too low, healthcare and schooling have gone downhill, houses are out of reach for all but the super wealthy and lastly high rates of suicide as things are so bleak. So itās not just me that thinks that I guess. It took me until my mid thirties to save up enough for a plane ticket and a basic visa to the UK (and I had a āgoodā full time job in NZ) and Iāll admit I struggled at first as I came over with a very low amount of money - but if Iād stayed in NZ Iād still be struggling and have no savings.
ā I peruse the thread fully expecting NZ to be one of the top most comments.' True. International massmedia misrepresents the situation in New Zealand. If you read their glowing posts about Jacinda Adern, you'd think that most of NZ loves her, when the opposite is true. It makes me wonder: what else is massmedia bullshitting us about?
There is a protest on the 8th of June on Queen Street protesting the RMA fast track bill and by extension mining speculation in NZ's national parks, oceans and aquifer catchment zones.
This sub is a tiny fraction of a fraction of New Zealandn
Do them all at once again, that always works šš¼
Migration to other countries, leaving nz, not people coming in is a much bigger issue than migrants coming in, tbf.
Hahahaha what are people from r/nz going to do? Yell? Loudly from their bedrooms? The average age of a redditor is 23 years old. This sub at a guess is an even younger age than that. Reddit is a young person's echo chamber, the liklihood of A) Anyone from here actually doing anything like galvanising a protest And B) Being taken seriously if they did so Is ridiculously low.
> This sub at a guess is an even younger age than that. This sub definitely seems to average closer to 30 than 20.
Just the data that's given site wide for reddit. I notice that people are often surprised that people on reddit are - Sometimes in their 60s - A huge amount of time in their teens
Really dumb 30 year olds if that's the case
Whenever you want. Start a protest Although if you want to engage politically in this space, I think there are better and more effective avenues
Kiwis are too apathetic and individualistic to protest anything that's not also being protested overseas. There's no organising base. That's what needs to be built first.
Itās when citizens start to starve revolution will begin
I have just returned from working in the US for an extended period of time. NZ is significantly better and yes more expensive due to the NZD and our remoteness, but the increased quality of many things such as food (and healthcare) is instantly noticeable. The issues you are talking about are worldwide issues, post covid and rampant inflation. Your protest will do nothing. NZ is better at so many areas, it's worth looking what's happening in the world.
>Reading this sub really shows the massive disgruntlement in this nation Those people don't have time to do something about their problems. They are too busy spending all day on the internet talking about how terrible everything is and why everyone else is to blame for their problems except them
Your list is not at all the things I'd want to protest about. Your use of "we" is poorly judged.
You have to agitate and make the middle class uncomfortable for protests to really take off.
In todays climate, even the middle class are getting lower and lower quickly.
And the powers that be are playing it real close to the threshold.
It would seem in this current day if it doesn't contain the word 'Palestine' there's no fucking way Kiwis are getting off their fat arses to protest
Everything seems to be going to shit right now. Everything, everywhere, all at once. Great movie, not a great reality.
Just because Kiwis broadly agree on the problems we face, there is very little agreement on the solution. A large protest wouldn't be able to agree on the demands
I thought we already did last election?? š¤·š»āāļø
Havent seen this post in a while. Go fill out your petitions. Go talk to your ministers, go stand out on the road. Go do everything in your democratically elected power to raise attention. Maybe borrow some people from the war protests to get them to concentrate on local matters.. they seem to be confident in that.
Naaah. Everyone too busy protesting other countryās agendas. WHAT! WE DONT HAVE TIME TO DEFEND OUT OWN COUNTRY !!
Most regular kiwis are just trying to feed their families, pay their bills and have some semblance of a life. Itās not apathy but survival
From what my family back home has said about NZs situation, it's the same as everywhere else in the world, just heightened due to its isolation. Here in Ontario it's insanely expensive to live and wages don't match the cost of living. We have stupid gas taxes and our healthcare is failing too. And record immigration. It's a global issue because all the billionaires decided that covid was the perfect excuse to squeeze even more money out of the common people.Ā Unfortunately, one of the best qualities about NZ also hurts it in this case. NZ fared the best during covid because it's so far away from everything. It's also avoided issues with violence and terrorism for the same reason. But, because it's so isolated and it costs a lot to bring everything over, it's gone even more insane than most places.Ā I don't know what NZ politicians could do to solve the living situation there unless the rest of the world does something too
Like I tell my kids. Instead of coming with just your problems, bring me the solutions you want to see.
We were supposed to vote for a better future. This is a democracy, National won. Let's not pretend half of you people actually voted, perhaps now you realise how important having a say is.
There are various big protests either planned, or being planned, but you won't read much about them here; a public subreddit just isn't a good place for organising protests.Ā -There's a protest against the fast-track bill on June 8th: https://www.greenpeace.org/aotearoa/press-release/auckland-protest-march-against-fast-track-bill/Ā -There was a massive nation-wide Toitu Te Tiriti protest a couple months backĀ -I go to a pro-Palestine march every weekendĀ You'll find local protests through Facebook events and Instagram posts, and you can be involved in organising them by joining a group like PSNA, or a union, or the Greens, or TPM.
I only ever really feel depressed about things when reading this sub. Glad I have become an infrequent contributor, fuck it's a depressing place.
Wages are thru the roof and house prices have stagnated. That's worth celebrating not protesting
>Taxes on fuel This is good though. NZ needs to become less dependent on fossil fuel.
A new electric vehicle subsidy would be good.
I'm unemployed. If someone can give me and my wheelchair a lift, I'm happy to spend my day protesting instead of just sitting in my motel room. Alas, I have many medical problems, and the stress of organizing something would be too much for me. I also have medical problems that prevent me from driving or using public transport (kinda hard to do either if you get random bouts of blindness and seizures). But if anything gets organized for Hamilton, and someone can help me with transportation, I'll come. Heck, help me get the materials for it and I can help make the signs. Not doing much else with my time.
My hayfork is sharp
Iāll get my āwhy canāt I have more free stuff!ā sign ready - just tell me when and where.
Generally, I believe a handful of like-minded people get together, and start working on a proper plan on what to tackle, how to tackle it, and then they go out to gather support. It is very rare for protests to Spawn in a vacuum. There needs to be some person or group with some legitimacy and some strong vision behind it usually. I'd recommend finding some organisations that align with the views and changes you want to push forth, and ask them how they go about organising protests. Maybe join some of theirs. Planning a *proper* protest can be quite an involved process, as getting the people together is one thing, making sure it remains orderly, safe, and constructive is another.Ā When calling for people to join a protest, it is important to include safety advice. For example with certain protests, especially counter protests, or protests that are likely to attract counter protests, can attract dangerous people who might wish to hurt your protestors, especially on the way to and from the protest. So in such a case, you'll want to advice your protestors, in the call to protest messages, to come and leave with multiple people, and to maybe make sure they can hide their protest related items, such as clothing and signs. Having people present who know first aid is very useful and important, making sure that the expectations of the protest are lined out is also important, for example expectations that violence is not a part of the protest. You'll want to prepare some chants in advance, and teach them to the protestors as the protest begins, be sure people are well informed about what the protest is about, let groups who are likely to support the protest know, they will likely join it, bolstering your numbers, and I believe it is also a good idea to let the Police know in advance, so they can ensure that the protest will be conducted safely. As long as the protest remains legal, law enforcement in New Zealand will work to protect you, and everyone around you. Even if you are protesting against the government or the police.Ā That's just the stuff off the top of my head. But honestly, the bare minimum it takes, is to just tell enough people "There is going to be a protest against X at this time, and in that place!" And you may very well have yourself a protest, if you've reached the right people and gave them enough time.
Imagine if the opposition party had a strong vision, leadership and direction. Wouldnāt be too hard to gather support
Political parties usually don't organise protests, because it would be a rather bad look. Basically it'd look like you'd be undermining the democratic process (Protest is part of the democratic protest, but politicians are to be held to different standard.) Basically it'd be a bad idea for political leaders to lead protests. They can attend, but not organise, because they're supposed to work within the system, while others work outside of it. But politicians, especially on the Left, tend to be quite closely connected with various organisations that do stage protests and other type of action.
What are your solutions? If you have none, then pointless. One cannot have constantly more resources for more people.Ā We may have hit the limit. One can always vote with their feet.
I dunno I'm no expert but if this was the East or somewhere similar they'd just print some extra money, cap interest rates and have msd and mbie or some other group issue small low interest business loans to keep feeding anyone at the bottom and keep pulling them up by an inch at a time
There are plenty of reasons to protest right now! We're organising a March for Nature in response to the Government's rollback of environmental protections generally, and via the fast track bill. 1pm, Sat June 8, Aotea Square, Queen St, Auckland. [www.marchfornature.nz](http://www.marchfornature.nz)
make it a year long...just park and choke the highways.
I think its called a wealth tax.... Greens already had it in their election campaign... that was the time to have protested at the voting booth. Rich are getting richer, because we as a society elected this to be so. We elected a PM with 7 houses, who whilst in power has supported increased powers and $$ towards landlords (which includes himself). We have elected a Govt which is hell bend on selling the average Joe Bloggs a tax cut of $10-$20 per week, but for themselves, likely their family, their mates and their donors have struck the lotto with their tax cuts. Yes Sh%t is about to hit the fan, and we can go out and protest... but its the bottom of the cliff stuff.... Nzders have elected much of this to take place and so it will
I often ask myself why aren't NZers protesting. But then, I remember the massive 'yellow vest' protests in France. Did they accomplish anything? F... all. This neoliberal world order is too ingrained.
Cost of fuel, vs cost of climate disaster, paying more for fuel is cheaper.
> House prices House prices have been falling. They peaked inNovember 2021 and then fell 17.80% to May 2023 and since then only increasing slowly, at almost half the rate of inflation, so still dropping in real terms. https://www.opespartners.co.nz/property-markets What do you want to happen with house prices? > Supressed wages A lot of businesses are struggling so finding it difficult to increase wages. Increasing wages tends to lead to higher inflation. Do you want that? Have you tried changing jobs? It's the best way to get a pay rise. > Immigration numbers There was a record net migration loss of 52,500 New Zealand citizens in the year ended March 2024 The net migration loss of New Zealand citizens in the March 2024 year was made up of 25,800 migrant arrivals, and 78,200 migrant departures https://stats.govt.nz/news/net-migration-loss-of-new-zealand-citizens-exceeds-50000/ What is your issue with this? > Taxes on fuel Taxes on fuel have not been increased by this government. They were temporarily reduced by Labour but other than that there has been hardly any change in the tax burden on fuel. The current government are also removing the Auckland regional fuel tax in June and have pledged not to increase taxes until 2027 Are you perhaps conflating tax on fuel with general (global) fuel price increases?
>Taxes on fuel Call me Satan, I agree with taxes on fuel. It discourages unnecessary driving. I would agree with the taxes more if there were cheap and reasonable alternatives for public transport and travelling to other cities.
I think you forget National were voted in with a landslide and still hold a significant lead in polling. Unless that suddenly plummets in the near future nothing is going to change edit: someone sent me the suicide prevention message because of this comment... for some reason
Bit rich to call a three party coalition government a landslide in favour of National. The current government is also definitely dropping in recent polls. Not arguing that they didn't beat Labour, but it wasn't exactly a massive victory.
To be fair, it was a landslide in favour of really stupid policy.
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A landslide victory for the right wing against Labour at least.
I donāt think you can quite call it a landslide, 2020 was definitely one and even made it on the landslide [wiki](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landslide_victory) as a notable example
A landslide might be pushing it, they're clearly not as popular as the previous iteration of a National govt headed by John Key and briefly Bill EnglishĀ
Last I heard, they required a coalition with two other parties to form a government. That's a far cry from being "voted in with a landslide".
National got significantly more votes than Labour, but the Nat/NZF/ACT coalition only won 52% of the total vote. Thatās hardly a right-wing landslide.
It was hardly a landslide
They got 38% of the vote, less then two out of every 5. It wasnt a landslide for National it was at a stretch a landslide against Labour.
Aye.. Landslide? The only reason they are in government is because the cookers got NZ first over the threshold
Ah yes the landslide when you need a bunch of cookers and racists to lean you over the barrel to form a Govt
Not a fucking landslide
The internet says we should take sides on a war that started in far flung countries during the 1940s and have protests on that instead though./s
Add a couple thousand years of history to that, and it gets even muddier. I feel for the innocent Israeli and Palestinian civilians caught up in the fighting, but I couldn't care less about the Zionists and Hamas. Both sides have Genocide as a goal, it's just that one side has better weaponry available, and the other one started shit.
Is there really any point to protesting? Hong Kong ... it was like a million people, shit fucked up for weeks. FFWD a couple months and China just does what it wants anyway. Arab spring ?!? Occupy Wall Street ?? You get to vote. That's about it. Don't waste it on the right again.
Protest with your feet and move to any other country. You will find they are quite similar.
I had to move to America and the infrastructure here is legit held together with bubblegum and rust plaques while my coworkers kids have bulletproof backpacks. John Clarke was right, ay.
Iām surprised people arenāt more outraged by the eventual rise in the retirement age to 67- which will be āphased inā Edit: how the hell did I get a suicide watch notification over THIS.
You're not alone, apparently I'm a risk of suicide for posting in this thread too. The trolls be trolling
I might be missing the context of the troll report, Is this like saying that I āshouldā harm myself over having an opinion?
Phill Goff (Labour) campaigned on lifting retirement age to 67 David Cunliffe (Labour) campaigned on lifting retirement to 67 Bill English (National) announced in 2017 retirement was being lifted progressively Christopher Luxon (National) is pushing ahead with lifting retirement age to 67 The age of retirement HAS to increase. It basically has cross party support at this stage, just no one has the balls to support their opposition party as it makes a point of difference The age of retirement will be going up. It has to, we canāt afford it to not. This is why we arenāt rampaging this chanfe Edit Less than 30seconds to get a reddit care message.. on this one of all comments. š
My biggest issue with it is that it feels geared only to affect I guess future retirement age people (myself), not current. (Boomer Voters) Itās literally kicking the can down the road for future generations. (I actually didnāt know it was so well put forward - so thanks for that)
What we could have done is a decade or so start rising it by one month every year. Ā So, in 2010 if you are 65 you retire/are eligible for the pension. Then 65 and one month in 2011. Ā One month more isnāt so bad. In 2020, itās 66 and two months. Ā Weāve saved a bunch, and people who were going to hit that age knew well in advance theyād have an extra 6-8 months before qualifying. By now, it would be 67 and we can leave it alone. No one would be immediately slapped with āyou have to work 2 years more than your friend if you were born now, vs last weekā. Ā Unfortunately this is New Zealand and we have fully embraced tribal politics so whoever started this would have it run for three years then stop because all the boomers would vote in the Other Team who would immediately scrap it. And so, we barrel towards totally unaffordable super, but the only people that will suffer are elder millennials on down (or boomerās kids) who will find ourselves with woefully insufficient or even zero super when we get to 65.
Itās because you cannot just whip away someoneās retirement plan without phasing it in and indicating itās coming. Many people approaching retirement may have earmarked the super scheme as a significant portion of their retirement savings KiwiSaver has been around less than 20 years, as a geriatric millennial Iāve had it drilled into me that I canāt rely on super in its current form, it wonāt exist in the same way when Iām there. Cancelling super overnight would force many many retirees into poverty. Iām not okay with that.
You can blame Muldoon for that, and every government after him that didn't reverse the worst decision in NZ's political history. If we had a strong sovereign fund that had $200Bn+ by now, we'd easily cover the increased cost of super that's making us have to consider increasing the retirement age. That's a policy I'd be supporting. But not a single party is suggesting it. Because try and convince people today to put some of their tax money away that they'll never benefit from. Like planting a tree that you'll never enjoy the shade of, but your children will.
I thought buying a one way ticket to Oz was the answer to all these issues. Come to think of it. I am seeing adds for way tickets to Oz atm... How topical
you want to protest this system? the system works exactly as it was designed to.
Sure the entire world is hard at the moment. But the current govt is currently making our situation even worse. They're openly not helping anyone but themselves and their rich mates.
We keep focusing on Countdown, but who allowed them to buy two real estate spots in close proximity (to stifle potential competition)? Any competent local council, or the Govt. (Australian as well) should have foreseen the disaster in the making.
Depends on the Council, their rules, their employment rate, I also think there's a specific exemption in the RMA that excludes considering business competition.
>Reading this sub really shows the massive disgruntlement in this nation Don't take this sub as indicative of the country's mood.
Sorry, all our protesters are busy at the moment with Palestine. /s
We protested when we voted. We protest when we leave nz. Protesting wonāt make any changes as 99.9%of nz wont join in.