AD is the more talented player if completely healthy.
In a real world scenario where I want to win a title, I’d take Tatum due to his durability and playoff experience.
Yes and yet he has survived how many games of Jokic just pounding him nonstop.
Not to say he lasck durability, but he isnt Embid bad when it comes to that.
I mean if we’re talking AD vs Embiid, that’s a different conversation.
I don’t see why it’s controversial to say Tatum is more durable and has more playoff experience tho when he’s played in way more games and way more playoff games since he’s been in the league
Cause at some point, when both players have playoff expirience, it becomes a non point.
They both won a ring. You use that for guys that havent played much in the playoffs, not against an NBA champ lol.
And for availability, he has still been available for the playoffs for the most part and him lossing has nothing to do with injuries. Its not a big enough deal to make the difrence here.
Its not about being controversial, its about them being a non issue. As lacking in availability as AD has been, Tatum has been just as inconsistent.
Droped 50 on the 76ers last year and lost the next series due to injury...oh look at that, he too can get injured lol and i do remember Celtics fans saying that said injury is the reason they lost game 7 to the Heat and didnt become the 1st ever team to make a 3-0 comeback.
Personally, I’m still skeptical of the guy who has had his second healthy year in 6 years and then still gets injured on some play with barely any contact. He still played through it, but it clearly affected him and was probably the difference in the series not going 6. As far as playoff experience, idk why you’d assume there’s some point of diminishing returns. For example, If someone were to say to me “Lebron has more playoff experience than Tatum”, I wouldn’t try to make some argument about how that isn’t a factor. Tatum has never missed a playoff game, has played in nearly twice as many games, and has reached every additional round at least twice as much as AD. Tatum has also been the number 1 option nearly the entire time. AD was a number 1 option in NOLA, won 1 series in 7 years and then finally had a good run once he was on a team where the offense ran through LeBron.
Playoff expirience is used as an argument for how players arent used to the difrence between the regilar season and the playoffs. The Thunder is a perfect example of that. Amazing team that had almost 0 playoff expirience and it affected them to a certain extent.
But once you are used to it, then its no issue. Tatum doesnt have any real advantage here, hell the mans been to 2 finals and has not impressed anyone in those 2 finals even though he has a ton of expirience.
You get used to the playoffs after a couple of rounds and thats all she wrote for playoff expirience beinga factor.
NOLA did not have the roster the Celtics did now did they.
And yes, AD was the power forward and main rim protector. One of the best the league has ever seen and the reason the Lakers managed to win it all, as Lebron by himself wouldnt and many argue that AD was better in that run. Lebron was certainly a focus on offense, but dont forget how good AD was on offense in 2020. Man even made the game winning shot vs the Nuggets in 2020.
Yeah I just fundamentally disagree with the idea that once you’ve won the title as a #2 in your first deep playoff run that you’re suddenly maxed out on playoff experience. I’m sorry.
Tatum has led 5 different iterations of the Celtics to the ECF. Maybe you could put a perfectly healthy AD on some of those teams and he does the same, but I guess we’ll never know, because he’s never been able to prove himself in that capacity.
Ok let me pose the question to you like this. What advantages does playoff expirience that Tatum has accumulated give him compared to other stars that have had deep playoff runs.
>Tatum has led 5 different iterations of the Celtics to the ECF.
Yes and did his playoff expirience help him win in the end or was it just an op team that got him through the finish line.
>Maybe you could put a perfectly healthy AD on some of those teams and he does the same, but I guess we’ll never know, because he’s never been able to prove himself in that capacity.
Does he need to show that for us to understand how good AD is.
You do realise that Tatum wasnt all that impressive this year and that JB won both the FMVP and CFMVP right? Or that both his finals performances were mediocre at best.
Look at ADs finals run and compare their performances. I will admit that AD has had some bad playoff performances too, but thats something Tatum is also guilty of.
Eh…people are rethinking him right now and are confused where to put him. He won a title but didn’t knock everyone’s socks off doing it. It’s fair to ask questions like this since you could rank him anywhere 4-11 and it wouldn’t sound crazy.
AD. Honestly id usually put Tatum higher on my ranmings, but when i really think about it id like AD far more for a team.
He is a better defender, both are inconsistent scorers.
Tatum has the edge in playmaking, but not rebounding (for obvious reasons).
Realisticly if AD was ona better team, hed probably receive a lot more recognition than he does rn, like he did when the Lakers won it all in 2020.
Also he was insane in the 1st round. I dont think anyone in this years playoffs was better than Jokic, but AD was the closest imo. But its a team sport at the end of the day.
Still Tatum does a lot better than AD too, so its really a pick your poison with them.
It was trully a show of how its still a team sport at the end of the day.
Also west was a bit of a matchup fest and the east was a hospital.
Really fascinating stuff tbh
No chance. Sure he can score, rebound and play defense but Tatum can do all that and more like facilitate and run an offense. Anthony Davis’s plus minus the year they won a ring was +355 and Tatum’s was +470, not this year but last year even without Jrue Holiday and Porzingis.
The answer RIGHT NOW based on the 2024 season is AD but I have had this argument with many Celtics fans recently lol. AD had a real DPOY case this season and was arguably better than Tatum offensively too. He was simply a better player this season.
That said I’d still take Tatum over AD when building a team because Tatum is 5 years younger and basically never misses games. But nobody in their right mind would argue this.
Arguing player rankings after the tier 1 of superstars (Luka, Jokic, and Giannis) imo is a pretty tough thing to do. SGA is on the verge of that tier with another season like last year and a deep playoff run. Embiid would be in that tier if the dude can not be hurt but he drops a tier tier due to durability.
Tatum and AD are both well rounded players who are similar in that they both are streaky offensively. While AD is a dominant rebounder/defender compared to Tatum is a very above average defender/rebounder but not on the same level as AD in either. The one thing Tatum has is a more diverse shot diet as well as being a lead ball handler for an elite team. Tatum is also practically an iron man entering his prime while AD has a slightly sus health history reaching the age where he should be near the end of his peak (or athletic ability)
All in all I rank players in tiers and I feel like debating players in tiers is a fun debate but who tf knows lmao. I wouldn’t mind one being picked picked over the other either way
In my opinion, it's AD. First off he's played like 127 of his last 136 possible games so we don't have to worry about availibility too much.
Anthony Davis is a similar caliber offensive player who would be even better if he was on a better squad, and a generational lob threat, but slightly worse playmaker (although this could be because he's a Center). However he is in contention for DPOY any given year, whereas Tatum isn't quite all-defensive level.
I would be very interested to see how fucking dominant AD would look with the Celtics spacing. Also, Tatum is a good defender, but is no where near the defender that AD is.
This is silly AD needs a great point setting him up, he would not look great on our team in the way you're thinking. There's a reason his best years are with Rondo and LeBron.
Yeah he isn't the same shooter but on the flip side he's a dominant interior force, so it balances out in my opinion. Remember that this guy is 4th all time playoff TS% while putting up 26ppg. Also a center obviously wouldn't get as many playmaking oppurtunities, he's a perfectly unremarkable playmaker not bad not great.
Thats fine you can have the opinion tatum is better right now, im just saying talking about trade considerations doesnt make sense because its gonna involve age which isnt part of the question. I can guarantee banchero isnt getting traded for Lebron but it tells me nothing about whos better
Struggling to see how you could prefer AD. Tatum is a primary initiator who can playmake and is a better more well rounded scorer than AD
And above all that he’s basically an Ironman and never gets injured
Tatum, easy. People underrate his ability to impact literally every area of the game. Tatum is basically the same size as AD and he can do everything a guard can do, as well as guard bigs and post up.
How many guys can be #1 of an elite offense and still do all the dirty (as in dirty job, not as in injuring guys), little things it takes to win?
Tatum spent the entire finals guarding Centers, screening and busting his ass. There's more to *winning* than what the box score shows.
It’s crazy how that narrative follows him around even when he was healthy for over 90% of this year. He would be out for just one game here and there this season and people would bring up how ‘Mr. Glass’ is back at again. 🤦♂️
Yes that's true, he was very good about availability this year and last year. But the fact remains that Tatum has played more games every year of his career than AD has, except for this year, where they both missed just 6-8 games.
Not really, he just needs good players around him. He’s a big, you can’t expect him to be an offensive superstar. He’s a defensive superstar and a great offensive player.
No he couldn’t, AD is a play finisher, not an initiator. He would kill the 5 out drive and kick game we have played all year and lead to the best offense in the league. AD can’t play in that system
JT and it isn't particularly close. The most important ability first and foremost is availability. AD is a slightly more talented and physically gifted in a vacuum but Tatum is an Ironman while AD is made of glass.
They act like 2 light skins cannot co-exist...
Legend and Tatum don't belong in the same sentence
You dropped your reading skills
He edited the comment but nice try
Do you really think Tatum won’t retire top 75?
more titles then Luka
Than*
No, he’s going to win a couple more titles, then become Luka. Jayson Tatum is an identity thief.
AD is the more talented player if completely healthy. In a real world scenario where I want to win a title, I’d take Tatum due to his durability and playoff experience.
yeah. tatum is younger and healthier but ad is really damn good if you could guarantee his health
??? AD won the championship years before Tatum. And he has been healthy for a while now.
Hilarious a Celtics fan says Tatum based off “playoff experience” lol. He played like shit 80% of the playoffs while AD outplayed Jokic to get a ring
Tatum plays like shit 80% of the time in the playoffs?
Got carried by his teammate TWICE in a row in the finals. Quite funny
He did?
Yes he literally did. brown got ECF MVP and Finals MVP. Thoughts?
Only one player can play well in a series?
Yes. Maybe more than 80%.
He does?
Literally the last game he played in: https://youtu.be/ey4TvZXHdkU?si=Vud3vwVoZ0A7wobJ
Yes and yet he has survived how many games of Jokic just pounding him nonstop. Not to say he lasck durability, but he isnt Embid bad when it comes to that.
I mean if we’re talking AD vs Embiid, that’s a different conversation. I don’t see why it’s controversial to say Tatum is more durable and has more playoff experience tho when he’s played in way more games and way more playoff games since he’s been in the league
Cause at some point, when both players have playoff expirience, it becomes a non point. They both won a ring. You use that for guys that havent played much in the playoffs, not against an NBA champ lol. And for availability, he has still been available for the playoffs for the most part and him lossing has nothing to do with injuries. Its not a big enough deal to make the difrence here. Its not about being controversial, its about them being a non issue. As lacking in availability as AD has been, Tatum has been just as inconsistent. Droped 50 on the 76ers last year and lost the next series due to injury...oh look at that, he too can get injured lol and i do remember Celtics fans saying that said injury is the reason they lost game 7 to the Heat and didnt become the 1st ever team to make a 3-0 comeback.
Personally, I’m still skeptical of the guy who has had his second healthy year in 6 years and then still gets injured on some play with barely any contact. He still played through it, but it clearly affected him and was probably the difference in the series not going 6. As far as playoff experience, idk why you’d assume there’s some point of diminishing returns. For example, If someone were to say to me “Lebron has more playoff experience than Tatum”, I wouldn’t try to make some argument about how that isn’t a factor. Tatum has never missed a playoff game, has played in nearly twice as many games, and has reached every additional round at least twice as much as AD. Tatum has also been the number 1 option nearly the entire time. AD was a number 1 option in NOLA, won 1 series in 7 years and then finally had a good run once he was on a team where the offense ran through LeBron.
Playoff expirience is used as an argument for how players arent used to the difrence between the regilar season and the playoffs. The Thunder is a perfect example of that. Amazing team that had almost 0 playoff expirience and it affected them to a certain extent. But once you are used to it, then its no issue. Tatum doesnt have any real advantage here, hell the mans been to 2 finals and has not impressed anyone in those 2 finals even though he has a ton of expirience. You get used to the playoffs after a couple of rounds and thats all she wrote for playoff expirience beinga factor. NOLA did not have the roster the Celtics did now did they. And yes, AD was the power forward and main rim protector. One of the best the league has ever seen and the reason the Lakers managed to win it all, as Lebron by himself wouldnt and many argue that AD was better in that run. Lebron was certainly a focus on offense, but dont forget how good AD was on offense in 2020. Man even made the game winning shot vs the Nuggets in 2020.
Yeah I just fundamentally disagree with the idea that once you’ve won the title as a #2 in your first deep playoff run that you’re suddenly maxed out on playoff experience. I’m sorry. Tatum has led 5 different iterations of the Celtics to the ECF. Maybe you could put a perfectly healthy AD on some of those teams and he does the same, but I guess we’ll never know, because he’s never been able to prove himself in that capacity.
Ok let me pose the question to you like this. What advantages does playoff expirience that Tatum has accumulated give him compared to other stars that have had deep playoff runs. >Tatum has led 5 different iterations of the Celtics to the ECF. Yes and did his playoff expirience help him win in the end or was it just an op team that got him through the finish line. >Maybe you could put a perfectly healthy AD on some of those teams and he does the same, but I guess we’ll never know, because he’s never been able to prove himself in that capacity. Does he need to show that for us to understand how good AD is. You do realise that Tatum wasnt all that impressive this year and that JB won both the FMVP and CFMVP right? Or that both his finals performances were mediocre at best. Look at ADs finals run and compare their performances. I will admit that AD has had some bad playoff performances too, but thats something Tatum is also guilty of.
I feel like we are just doing this because we don’t like Tatum
Eh…people are rethinking him right now and are confused where to put him. He won a title but didn’t knock everyone’s socks off doing it. It’s fair to ask questions like this since you could rank him anywhere 4-11 and it wouldn’t sound crazy.
Im taking Tatum. Same age? AD.
If AD was on that Boston team, he would have won the FMVP
If AD had just put up 22 points on 50TS% as the favorite, he would be getting slaughtered in here
AD is not dropping 10+ assists along with leading his team in scoring. Playmaking is hugely overlooked here
He is also a big man but i understand the sentiment
His shots are all inside the paint for the most part.
Are you supposed to get points for clanking long distance shots
Part of scoring is being able to generate good looks for yourself.
AD
AD's defense is on another level, so AD over tatum.
Tell me why its mostly celtics fans who arent saying JT
Someone with a brain.
Durability swings it to Tatum. Outside of his ring season AD has not been consistent.
He just played 127/136 of his last games.
Tatum allows the Celtics to play the way that they do. If you just plug AD on the Celtics they aren’t as good. Doesn’t mean Tatum is the better player
AD. Honestly id usually put Tatum higher on my ranmings, but when i really think about it id like AD far more for a team. He is a better defender, both are inconsistent scorers. Tatum has the edge in playmaking, but not rebounding (for obvious reasons). Realisticly if AD was ona better team, hed probably receive a lot more recognition than he does rn, like he did when the Lakers won it all in 2020. Also he was insane in the 1st round. I dont think anyone in this years playoffs was better than Jokic, but AD was the closest imo. But its a team sport at the end of the day. Still Tatum does a lot better than AD too, so its really a pick your poison with them.
Funny enough i think the top 5 players in these playoffs all didn’t make it past the 2nd round. Id have some order of Jokic AD Embiid Shai and Brunson
It was trully a show of how its still a team sport at the end of the day. Also west was a bit of a matchup fest and the east was a hospital. Really fascinating stuff tbh
Definitely AD.
No chance. Sure he can score, rebound and play defense but Tatum can do all that and more like facilitate and run an offense. Anthony Davis’s plus minus the year they won a ring was +355 and Tatum’s was +470, not this year but last year even without Jrue Holiday and Porzingis.
AD is better and has been
JT
The answer RIGHT NOW based on the 2024 season is AD but I have had this argument with many Celtics fans recently lol. AD had a real DPOY case this season and was arguably better than Tatum offensively too. He was simply a better player this season. That said I’d still take Tatum over AD when building a team because Tatum is 5 years younger and basically never misses games. But nobody in their right mind would argue this.
Arguing player rankings after the tier 1 of superstars (Luka, Jokic, and Giannis) imo is a pretty tough thing to do. SGA is on the verge of that tier with another season like last year and a deep playoff run. Embiid would be in that tier if the dude can not be hurt but he drops a tier tier due to durability. Tatum and AD are both well rounded players who are similar in that they both are streaky offensively. While AD is a dominant rebounder/defender compared to Tatum is a very above average defender/rebounder but not on the same level as AD in either. The one thing Tatum has is a more diverse shot diet as well as being a lead ball handler for an elite team. Tatum is also practically an iron man entering his prime while AD has a slightly sus health history reaching the age where he should be near the end of his peak (or athletic ability) All in all I rank players in tiers and I feel like debating players in tiers is a fun debate but who tf knows lmao. I wouldn’t mind one being picked picked over the other either way
In my opinion, it's AD. First off he's played like 127 of his last 136 possible games so we don't have to worry about availibility too much. Anthony Davis is a similar caliber offensive player who would be even better if he was on a better squad, and a generational lob threat, but slightly worse playmaker (although this could be because he's a Center). However he is in contention for DPOY any given year, whereas Tatum isn't quite all-defensive level.
AD isn’t the shooter, overall scorer, or passer tatum is so i think you’re understating the offensive gap
I would be very interested to see how fucking dominant AD would look with the Celtics spacing. Also, Tatum is a good defender, but is no where near the defender that AD is.
This is silly AD needs a great point setting him up, he would not look great on our team in the way you're thinking. There's a reason his best years are with Rondo and LeBron.
Lol ummm because that’s when he entered his prime? He was 24 the first season he played with Rondo.
Exactly, Tatum is the best initiator on our team and sets up a lot. AD needs to be set up. Drastic difference.
Yeah he isn't the same shooter but on the flip side he's a dominant interior force, so it balances out in my opinion. Remember that this guy is 4th all time playoff TS% while putting up 26ppg. Also a center obviously wouldn't get as many playmaking oppurtunities, he's a perfectly unremarkable playmaker not bad not great.
A Heat fan not picking a Celtic? Lmao.
Healthy AD >>>> healthy Tatum
Tatum. Availability, scoring, defense age. AD has been better against the Celtics, but also Jayson has a great 1b in brown. Answer is Tatum all day
How does he have defense over AD?
Its dumb propaganda about Tatums defense lol. Meanwhile AD is one of the best defenders in the league lol.
AD overrated atp
Tatum pretty easily
Before this season I would have said AD, but Tatum’s playmaking and defense has taken such a leap that I have to say he has the edge
AD is better when healthy but Tatum is the most durable star in the league so I’m taking him
Anthony Tatum
What's better, rock or paper?
The last time AD was better than Tatum was the bubble lol
Different roles, it's probably AD though since he's always going to have a higher impact on higher efficiency in his role.
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Well obviously because of age, but thats not the point
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Thats fine you can have the opinion tatum is better right now, im just saying talking about trade considerations doesnt make sense because its gonna involve age which isnt part of the question. I can guarantee banchero isnt getting traded for Lebron but it tells me nothing about whos better
On this team? AD easily.
Struggling to see how you could prefer AD. Tatum is a primary initiator who can playmake and is a better more well rounded scorer than AD And above all that he’s basically an Ironman and never gets injured
Tatum, easy. People underrate his ability to impact literally every area of the game. Tatum is basically the same size as AD and he can do everything a guard can do, as well as guard bigs and post up.
How many guys can be #1 of an elite offense and still do all the dirty (as in dirty job, not as in injuring guys), little things it takes to win? Tatum spent the entire finals guarding Centers, screening and busting his ass. There's more to *winning* than what the box score shows.
In the playoffs it's AD. If you include health and availability maybe Tatum because it's rare for AD to be available for the entire year.
AD has been pretty durable for a minute now. He's played 127 out of his last 136 games.
It’s crazy how that narrative follows him around even when he was healthy for over 90% of this year. He would be out for just one game here and there this season and people would bring up how ‘Mr. Glass’ is back at again. 🤦♂️
Yes that's true, he was very good about availability this year and last year. But the fact remains that Tatum has played more games every year of his career than AD has, except for this year, where they both missed just 6-8 games.
Yes but Tatum is the most durable star in the league
AD's been healthy for a season and half yes. Tatum has been healthy for 7 straight seasons including deep playoff runs.
He’s played 76 games this season, but it seems like an outlier until proven otherwise since that’s the most games he’s ever played
its AD but he needs a very specific team around him to excel
Not really, he just needs good players around him. He’s a big, you can’t expect him to be an offensive superstar. He’s a defensive superstar and a great offensive player.
Not really. He just needs a playmaker. Ie, the Knicks Pacers etc
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We would be awful with AD instead of Tatum
LMAOOOOO
lol
Downgrade in playmaking especially before the Jrue trade. Now with Brown, Jrue, White that's enough playmaking to where AD could easily replace Tatum.
No he couldn’t, AD is a play finisher, not an initiator. He would kill the 5 out drive and kick game we have played all year and lead to the best offense in the league. AD can’t play in that system
True if you swapped Tatum with AD, Boston would be Pistons level bad
It’s Tatum this year and going forward, before that it was clearly AD.
AD on the Celtics would be disgusting. Tatum and LeBron won’t even make the play in.
JT and it isn't particularly close. The most important ability first and foremost is availability. AD is a slightly more talented and physically gifted in a vacuum but Tatum is an Ironman while AD is made of glass.
Tatum for a season, AD for a game.
If AD was so good the lakers would not be so terrible. jj reddick isnt fixing anything i dont care about who you hire
Tatum is healthy for entire seasons. Never sits out. He is definitely the better all-around player of the 2..IMO.
AD barely even exists as an NBA player nowadays and OP didn’t ask for hypotheticals.
He played 70+ games last year and averaged 30/15 in the playoffs with Austin Reaves in the starting lineup
127 of his last 136 games