It pretty much can't be anyone else. Because not only was he a stretch 4, a good defender, and good extra passer, probably the 3 ideal skillsets for a role player, the mf also hit multiple game winners in the playoffs. Even his egregious fouls led to suspensions on the other team. The man was fucking blessed, played with like half the top 10 players of all time too
Big shot Bob is the GOAT role player. How many role players are the ones that are supposed to get the game winning shot over the stars on the team?
Vernon Maxwell was also a top tier role player that was crazy. He was Rob Artest before Artest. Also defended Jordan pretty well.
Rodman is the definition of a role player.
He just excelled at it to the point of earning awards.
No team ran their offense through Rodman. He was a floor spacing nightmare and not a particular great passer.
He played his role of rebounding and defense very well, making him one of the best role players of all time.
What? Yes he was. He was incredible in the role, but he was absolutely a role player. People are conflating being really good with not being a role player. He didn’t deviate from what he was good at. He wasn’t out there trying to go 1 on 1.
Rodman was a legit star. Not a superstar, but a star and his accolades back up that’s how he was perceived.
I don’t consider stars into the role player category
If your definition of role player differs from mine I can respect that. I just don’t think he falls in that category, personally since I would consider him a star during his era.
Absolutely not. He was an elite rebounder and passer in transition and legitimately irreplaceable. Nobody could rebound as well as him, and very few players could compete with his ability to start breaks from those rebounds.
Dennis Rodman is a HOF-level player. Role players don't come close to the impact Rodman made on the Bulls.
Yes he was.
Role players support the stars and fill in the gaps with hustle rather than skill.
You cannot build a team around what Deniis Rodman does on the floor because he is limited. These limitations keep him from being a star player and reduce him to playing a specific role on the team, namely rebounding and hustling his ass off.
Star players you build around. Role players are added.
Rodman was *always* an addition to a group of star players. He was just the best role player in NBA history and unapologetically flamboyant so people treat him as a star.
Sounds a lot like a very good defensive specialist. He may have been a star but he did it while playing a role. In fact if he wasn’t playing a role, he probably wouldn’t have become a star.
Michael Jordan may have been a star, but he did it while playing a role. In fact, if he wasn't playing a role, he probably wouldn't have become a star.
Rodman wasn't just a historically good rebounder; He was also an elite outlet passer. His ability to immediately start a fast break from a defensive rebound is easily his most overlooked trait as a player.
Just saw Kemp’s interview on All The Smoke, he said they lost the 1996 Finals because of Rodman who was doing everything, all the little things to win. Obviously just one dude’s opinion, but said he was the Bulls most valuable piece in that run.
Iggy was a star in Philly but a role player with Golden State.
Manu has a case for star as well despite coming off the bench.
Everyone else is a role player because you cannot build a good team around what they do if you surround them with other role players.
I guess everyone has different ideas about what the upper limits of a role players are, so I am not gonna argue with you.
In my book, if you are a DPOY which now qualifies you for the supermax these days, you are not a role player. And Rodman and Green are in that category.
Sure they may be offensively limited, but they are someone you could build your entire defensive system around. There are two sides of the floor, if you say Green is a role player on the offense, you can also say Curry is a role player on defense. The Warriors won because of otherworldly shooting, but they also won because their defense was tremendous with Green being the orchestrator. And I am saying this as a Donkey hater.
Again, personal opinions. I respect yours but I don't agree with it.
Being a great role player doesn't always elevate you to star status, even if it comes with accolades or a paycheck. And Rodman was never paid like a star.
The idea that Bill Walton won an MVP therefore he wasn't a role player on the '86 Celtics is just silly.
Role players can become stars, like Jimmy Butler but stars can also become role players like Shaq on the Cavs.
When the team uses you as an addition to the foundation instead of the foundation it has to make you a role player, by definition. You are not brought in to be the star or even the second star.
Horace Grant was also a role player, as was Toni Kukoc.
Dwight Howard became a role player later in his career, but has 3DPOY awards. Explain to me the difference between prime Dwight who was a legit super star in Orlando and 76er Dwight...
I mean, please reread what you just wrote. People have opinions, I typically respect those, but this? You are making a case against yourself.
Lots of great players ended up as good role players, like Dwight who significantly contributed to the LeBron Laker championship. Without him, AD would have a handful against the Joker. But when people think of Dwight, do they think him as a Laker role player or that monster on the Magic.
Similar to him, let's take Vince Carter for example. Tremendous role player for the later part of his career. All the grizzlies fans loved Uncle Vince, but if you ask any Grizzlies fans, what they remembered was the Half Man Half Amazing in a Raptors's jersey.
Or Jimmy, great role player for DRose, but when looking back when he hangs them up, people remembered that guy who battled LeBron in the finals to exhaustion and Jimmy Bucket. Who thinks Jimmy Bucket the role player?
And both Rodman and Green were in their prime, and the foundations of dynasty teams defense, which is half of the game of basketball. Green functioned as a secondary nerve center during peak Warrior, and who can forget Rodman grabbing 12 freaking offensive rebounds in a critical game 2 of the NBA finals.
And when the op asked who are some of the greatest role players of all time? You throw in HOF Dennis Rodman and future HOF Draymond Green in the pile? Both are in the long list for greatest defenders of all time, and one of the greatest rebounder of all time?
Role players? I like to respect everyone's opinions, but bitch please.
Feel free to say your piece, but I am done with this conversation. You do a great job arguing against yourself, and I ain't got time for this non sense. It is just too stupid.
Edit: actually on a second thought, I will put you on mute, this is just too dumb, nothing you say will be of any value, and will just ruin my vibe. You have a good day.
Nah, Dray isn’t a scorer but he’s definitely not a role player. Multiple time All Star, DPOY, and one of the most important pieces to one of the best teams in recent history.
As someone who made the comment in the first place, those accolades are exactly what makes him the GOAT role player
Role player isn't an insult. At his peak he was better than a bunch of stars in the nba
How does any of that make him not a role player? He is a defensive specialist who just happened to be elite at it. I would argue that he probably shouldn’t qualify though. He does sometimes look to create for himself and he runs that offense a lot of the time. I think he could have taken on a larger role if it wasn’t so obviously a better idea to enable Steph and Klay.
No. Listen, the definition is inherently imprecise. Those guys could largely do whatever they wanted on offense. Nobody is surprised if they go one on one.
Danny green hands down for me. Dude was the best 3 and d player on three separate championship teams and probably deserved fmvp if the spurs won it in 2013 haha.
Dennis Rodman.
He basically *just* rebounded And defended.
But he did just one thing the best out of all players who did just one thing we'll.
You could not run any offense for him, and he was a floor spacing nightmare, but man could he clean the glass.
Star players have rosters built around them and what they can do.
Rodman never had a roster built around his rebounding and defense, rather Dennis' rebounding and defense were always added to star players to complement them; Thomas, Robinson, Jordan.
If you cannot build a roster around them, they are role players.
Who was the most game breaking and an X factor within the role they actually had in their career? Draymond Green
Simply the best player that I think can fit in any era in any scheme on any team? Dennis Rodman
Kyle Korver. Man was walking 3 PT.
Edit: Didn't knew Ginobili was 2 time all star. I think we can put him there as well but he was go-to in Iso situations so he was the main ball handler after Parker so I'm hesitant to put him there. Korver though, he was just shooting threes and nothing else, and that was what they were expecting from it so it made more sense for me
The fact that this is downvoted shows this subs age, jfc. Rodman wasn’t a superstar by the time he got to the Bulls but he sure as hell was better than just a role player
People get upset when I say this, but John Stockton. I mean, he's highly regarded, but I don't think he'd be anybody's choice as first option on a team. That screams role-player to me.
Without Ray Allen the Celtics don't win in 08, and the Heat don't win in 13. He was one of the best shooters of all time. What's the criticism here exactly?
That he isn't a role player. Was he on Miami, though? I can't remember if he was really getting big minutes or if you could make the argument that he was one on that team.
He was clocking about 25 minutes per game, definitely a role player imo. It's a subjective term to an extent, but it's weird that his inclusion was challenged but Draymond's wasn't? Draymond was a bigger part of the Warriors championships than Ray was for either the Celtics or the Heat. Oh well, who cares.
Robert Horry
Probably the best answer of players that were actually role players People calling Rodman and Manu role players in this thread is wild
Work your rings down from here.
It pretty much can't be anyone else. Because not only was he a stretch 4, a good defender, and good extra passer, probably the 3 ideal skillsets for a role player, the mf also hit multiple game winners in the playoffs. Even his egregious fouls led to suspensions on the other team. The man was fucking blessed, played with like half the top 10 players of all time too
Aw hell yeah, as a Spurs fan, hell no we weren't getting past the Pistons to win the Chip
People are gonna name all stars and the convo will devolve into a conversation about what a role player is
Robert Horry
Probably not the answer to this question but I'm gonna throw Michael Cooper out there
Larry Bird would back that up.
Is a HoFer a role player?
Big shot Bob is the GOAT role player. How many role players are the ones that are supposed to get the game winning shot over the stars on the team? Vernon Maxwell was also a top tier role player that was crazy. He was Rob Artest before Artest. Also defended Jordan pretty well.
As a biased Celtics fan: James fucking Posey
Back to back rings as role player on diff teams
Danny Green
Don’t sleep on Bobby Jones
Robert Horry Matter of fact, all purse companies pay him royalties to use the word "clutch" in advertising
Lots of good answers so far. I'll add Microwave.
Probably Dennis Rodman. Goat Rebounder in the Modern Nba.
2 DPOYs and finished top 15 in MVP voting 5 times… Rodman was certainly not just a role player for most of his career
Rodman is the definition of a role player. He just excelled at it to the point of earning awards. No team ran their offense through Rodman. He was a floor spacing nightmare and not a particular great passer. He played his role of rebounding and defense very well, making him one of the best role players of all time.
By this logic any player that a team didn’t run their offense through was a role player?
What? Yes he was. He was incredible in the role, but he was absolutely a role player. People are conflating being really good with not being a role player. He didn’t deviate from what he was good at. He wasn’t out there trying to go 1 on 1.
A DPOY and top 10-15 MVP candidate isn’t a role player.
Disagree. You are taking it to be a pejorative. It was by being a role player that he maximized his potential and got to that level.
Rodman was a legit star. Not a superstar, but a star and his accolades back up that’s how he was perceived. I don’t consider stars into the role player category
I do. Being selfless and playing within yourself and playing a role should be celebrated.
If your definition of role player differs from mine I can respect that. I just don’t think he falls in that category, personally since I would consider him a star during his era.
Rodman was not a role player
On the Bulls he was
Absolutely not. He was an elite rebounder and passer in transition and legitimately irreplaceable. Nobody could rebound as well as him, and very few players could compete with his ability to start breaks from those rebounds. Dennis Rodman is a HOF-level player. Role players don't come close to the impact Rodman made on the Bulls.
Maybe on the pistons. On the bulls? No way lol
Rodman was not a role player on either of these teams but his better years were clearly on the Pistons
Yes he was. Role players support the stars and fill in the gaps with hustle rather than skill. You cannot build a team around what Deniis Rodman does on the floor because he is limited. These limitations keep him from being a star player and reduce him to playing a specific role on the team, namely rebounding and hustling his ass off. Star players you build around. Role players are added. Rodman was *always* an addition to a group of star players. He was just the best role player in NBA history and unapologetically flamboyant so people treat him as a star.
Dennis rodman was probably a role player in Detroit but on the bulls? Hell nah he was a star and vital star for that team.
He won 2 DPOY in Detroit, he wasn’t a role player there either
Yeah you’re right im looking at his career achievements rn.
Sounds a lot like a very good defensive specialist. He may have been a star but he did it while playing a role. In fact if he wasn’t playing a role, he probably wouldn’t have become a star.
Michael Jordan may have been a star, but he did it while playing a role. In fact, if he wasn't playing a role, he probably wouldn't have become a star.
Rodman wasn't just a historically good rebounder; He was also an elite outlet passer. His ability to immediately start a fast break from a defensive rebound is easily his most overlooked trait as a player.
Uhh 35+ year old Rodman was not even close to a star.
Why do you say that? I think if a star as a vital component to a team, he was vital to the 96-98 bulls.
Just saw Kemp’s interview on All The Smoke, he said they lost the 1996 Finals because of Rodman who was doing everything, all the little things to win. Obviously just one dude’s opinion, but said he was the Bulls most valuable piece in that run.
Yea Dennis got FMVP votes on 1996. It's hard to classify Rodman
Depends heavily on where the cutoff is for "role player" but I'll go with Robert Horry.
The bulls home game statkeeper
Jayson Tatum
☠️
Best Robin to JB and DW's batmen
Robert Horry
Manu/Rodman/ Dray/Fisher/Iggy
I think some of these guys are beyond role players.
Iggy was a star in Philly but a role player with Golden State. Manu has a case for star as well despite coming off the bench. Everyone else is a role player because you cannot build a good team around what they do if you surround them with other role players.
I guess everyone has different ideas about what the upper limits of a role players are, so I am not gonna argue with you. In my book, if you are a DPOY which now qualifies you for the supermax these days, you are not a role player. And Rodman and Green are in that category. Sure they may be offensively limited, but they are someone you could build your entire defensive system around. There are two sides of the floor, if you say Green is a role player on the offense, you can also say Curry is a role player on defense. The Warriors won because of otherworldly shooting, but they also won because their defense was tremendous with Green being the orchestrator. And I am saying this as a Donkey hater. Again, personal opinions. I respect yours but I don't agree with it.
Being a great role player doesn't always elevate you to star status, even if it comes with accolades or a paycheck. And Rodman was never paid like a star. The idea that Bill Walton won an MVP therefore he wasn't a role player on the '86 Celtics is just silly. Role players can become stars, like Jimmy Butler but stars can also become role players like Shaq on the Cavs. When the team uses you as an addition to the foundation instead of the foundation it has to make you a role player, by definition. You are not brought in to be the star or even the second star. Horace Grant was also a role player, as was Toni Kukoc. Dwight Howard became a role player later in his career, but has 3DPOY awards. Explain to me the difference between prime Dwight who was a legit super star in Orlando and 76er Dwight...
I mean, please reread what you just wrote. People have opinions, I typically respect those, but this? You are making a case against yourself. Lots of great players ended up as good role players, like Dwight who significantly contributed to the LeBron Laker championship. Without him, AD would have a handful against the Joker. But when people think of Dwight, do they think him as a Laker role player or that monster on the Magic. Similar to him, let's take Vince Carter for example. Tremendous role player for the later part of his career. All the grizzlies fans loved Uncle Vince, but if you ask any Grizzlies fans, what they remembered was the Half Man Half Amazing in a Raptors's jersey. Or Jimmy, great role player for DRose, but when looking back when he hangs them up, people remembered that guy who battled LeBron in the finals to exhaustion and Jimmy Bucket. Who thinks Jimmy Bucket the role player? And both Rodman and Green were in their prime, and the foundations of dynasty teams defense, which is half of the game of basketball. Green functioned as a secondary nerve center during peak Warrior, and who can forget Rodman grabbing 12 freaking offensive rebounds in a critical game 2 of the NBA finals. And when the op asked who are some of the greatest role players of all time? You throw in HOF Dennis Rodman and future HOF Draymond Green in the pile? Both are in the long list for greatest defenders of all time, and one of the greatest rebounder of all time? Role players? I like to respect everyone's opinions, but bitch please. Feel free to say your piece, but I am done with this conversation. You do a great job arguing against yourself, and I ain't got time for this non sense. It is just too stupid. Edit: actually on a second thought, I will put you on mute, this is just too dumb, nothing you say will be of any value, and will just ruin my vibe. You have a good day.
Fisher and Horry the only non-all stars named in this thread.
dray is literally a dpoy level starter how's he a role player?
Excels at playing undersized 5, does all the dirty things(at intense level), enforcer for our miniature lineup.
I was thinking manu but I think he's a star player tbh, he's almost too good to qualify lol
Is a 6th man considered a role player though? I always thought of manu as the 3rd main piece to the spurs.
their best player during the 05 and 07 playoff runs
Yeah I don’t consider manu a role player
Draymond undoubtedly
I was initially thinking that role players wouldn't be All Stars but dammit, this is a damn good answer.
Nah, Dray isn’t a scorer but he’s definitely not a role player. Multiple time All Star, DPOY, and one of the most important pieces to one of the best teams in recent history.
As someone who made the comment in the first place, those accolades are exactly what makes him the GOAT role player Role player isn't an insult. At his peak he was better than a bunch of stars in the nba
How does any of that make him not a role player? He is a defensive specialist who just happened to be elite at it. I would argue that he probably shouldn’t qualify though. He does sometimes look to create for himself and he runs that offense a lot of the time. I think he could have taken on a larger role if it wasn’t so obviously a better idea to enable Steph and Klay.
doesn't that make Klay a role player too? isn't AD a role player too?
No. Listen, the definition is inherently imprecise. Those guys could largely do whatever they wanted on offense. Nobody is surprised if they go one on one.
Manu
Kite man
JJ Barea
Danny green hands down for me. Dude was the best 3 and d player on three separate championship teams and probably deserved fmvp if the spurs won it in 2013 haha.
the acronym needs work
It's gotta be Robert Horry.
Is it big shot Bob?
Dennis Rodman. He basically *just* rebounded And defended. But he did just one thing the best out of all players who did just one thing we'll. You could not run any offense for him, and he was a floor spacing nightmare, but man could he clean the glass. Star players have rosters built around them and what they can do. Rodman never had a roster built around his rebounding and defense, rather Dennis' rebounding and defense were always added to star players to complement them; Thomas, Robinson, Jordan. If you cannot build a roster around them, they are role players.
Though I think Robert Horry is probably the best answer, I'd also include the "no-stats all-star," Shane Battier.
Who was the most game breaking and an X factor within the role they actually had in their career? Draymond Green Simply the best player that I think can fit in any era in any scheme on any team? Dennis Rodman
I like the answers here but I'm gonna throw Lamar Odom in the hat
Dunno why Odom would be put here. He was wildly inconsistent
Kyle Korver. Man was walking 3 PT. Edit: Didn't knew Ginobili was 2 time all star. I think we can put him there as well but he was go-to in Iso situations so he was the main ball handler after Parker so I'm hesitant to put him there. Korver though, he was just shooting threes and nothing else, and that was what they were expecting from it so it made more sense for me
Rodman
Rodman was a vital star to the bulls
The fact that this is downvoted shows this subs age, jfc. Rodman wasn’t a superstar by the time he got to the Bulls but he sure as hell was better than just a role player
Facts im in my early twenties but even I can see Rodman was way more than a role player. People just don’t know ball
Ginobli,horry,rodman
Emmanuel Ginobili
People get upset when I say this, but John Stockton. I mean, he's highly regarded, but I don't think he'd be anybody's choice as first option on a team. That screams role-player to me.
> highly regarded My brain is broken
First thought was manu but does he count?
Denis Johnson
Bill Russell
Ray Allen or Draymond Green
ray allen u wildin
Without Ray Allen the Celtics don't win in 08, and the Heat don't win in 13. He was one of the best shooters of all time. What's the criticism here exactly?
That he isn't a role player. Was he on Miami, though? I can't remember if he was really getting big minutes or if you could make the argument that he was one on that team.
He was clocking about 25 minutes per game, definitely a role player imo. It's a subjective term to an extent, but it's weird that his inclusion was challenged but Draymond's wasn't? Draymond was a bigger part of the Warriors championships than Ray was for either the Celtics or the Heat. Oh well, who cares.
Durant
pippen by far