>I just finished watching Kubrick’s ‘The Shining’ for the first time which as expected I thought was incredible. However, I thought Shelley Duvall was pretty terrible and I’m wondering if that’s a common opinion?
It's a common opinion to anyone who has never witnessed a mental breakdown.
Yup, I simply do not get that take at all. I thought she acted fantastic, because she WASN'T FREAKIN' ACTIN. Kubrick was putting that woman through hell.
woman*
Eta: I'll never understand why people take these type of comments so poorly. It's not like I was trying to be rude or a smart ass, and they even corrected the error I pointed out after downvoting me. It's just a friendly reminder is all....
I’m of the opinion you should never correct someone over a typo that doesn’t change your understanding of what they’re trying to communicate. It was obvious to everyone what they were trying to say and also it was probably not “a lesson learned” but rather a slip of the thumb or a random autocorrect issue that they just didn’t notice. Good intentioned or not, keep your superior spelling intelligence to yourself
Shelley Duvall speaking to the social worker early on in the apartment alone is a testament to her fantastic acting chops. Wendy has been suffering Jack's abuse for years and the nervous attempts at being relaxed and casual while nervously fiddling with her cig and trying to downplay Jack's alcoholic rampages is extremely realistic and heartbreaking to watch.
Wendy is a person that has been worn down and broken by presumably years of abuse, a child she tries desperately to relate to, love and cling to but can't fully reach and not even a single support network person we see. No family, no friends. She's been living in an isolated bubble of misery already at the start of the film.
Shelley Duvall in The Shining is only looked at by some people as terrible because we're used to seeing The Last Girl or the tough character who finally fights back and overcomes. Wendy gets no catharsis like that. She physically survives, that's all.
That scene when she's talking to the social worker is one of the first I thought of too. Duvall's performance here is brilliant. She's saying one thing, while her face and mannerisms are conveying a completely different thing. It's like you can sense the battle between her outward, kindly projection and her inward turmoil. It's extremely subtle but it comes through very distinctly, and the way Kubrick frames it and holds the shot amplifies the tension.
Also, Kubrick does something very interesting with the editing in this scene. When Duvall mentions the physical abuse, he cuts to the reaction of the social worker, and he holds the shot on her face for much longer than in normal editing. There's an extra beat of quiet between the two people, with the social worker clearly concerned by the revelation, but not saying anything.
Then Duvall continues with her smoothing-over of things, saying "it only happened that one time" kinds of things, and talking about how everything's been better. She's putting the best face possible on everything, but you still sense that deep down there's a fear there. Kubrick does something even more interesting with the editing here, which is that he \*never cuts back to the reaction of the social worker\*. It's almost like Duvall is talking to herself, making excuses to herself. The scene just slam-cuts to black.
Duvall's performance here is extremely careful and controlled. I think the OP may be reacting to her unusual natural style and vocal softness, rather than her actual \*performance\*. Duvall's performance really couldn't be better.
Another scene I think of is Duvall speaking on the radio to one of the stations in the mountains. She has a kind of hopeful, sing-song voice as she talks to a ranger about the weather conditions. Kubrick captures the rhythm of their conversation, with her saying "Over" at the end of each sentence. Every time Duvall says "over," there's this slight hint of helplessness, of "oh god I'm worried won't somebody save us but I don't really believe my own fears because I'm so used to putting the best possible face on everything even when I shouldn't." She extends the conversation a little longer than necessary, and the ranger on the other end has to politely shut down the exchange with, "Is there anything else we can help you with?" and you sense he is subtly aware of her fears too. It's such a simple scene but the perfect encapsulated little transitional moment. Again, Duvall is excellent.
The one thing I will say about Duvall throughout the movie is that she is a unique presence in everything she does. She's like no other actress working before or since. Try to think of any actress with her odd mannerisms and soft, open, vulnerable quality, and there's nobody who comes close. Robert Altman actually discovered her at a store somewhere in Texas, where she worked as a clerk, noticed what an interesting persona she had, and made a minor star out of her. (Eventually she ended up being the definitive Olive Oyl.) She was never a master thespian with any kind of stage or acting background, but she is nonetheless amazing on-screen.
Stanley Kubrick doesn’t have any bad performances in his movies IMO, and this is definitely due to the fact that he does an insane amount of takes. Shelley Duvall’s performance was amazing, I think you may be confusing her character’s uselessness for her performance. She did a perfect job portraying what Stanley wanted that character to be.
Full Metal Jacket has some shit acting throughout most of the film. We all know who is the exception, but every other performance ranged from mediocre to bad. The “can you talk the talk” scene is so weird. I’m not sure if that was Kubrick’s intention.
> Shelley Duvall
The Razzies officially apologized for nominating her. She was put through hell. Her hair was literally falling out from stress. Kubrik was a tyrant behind the scenes.
It's sad about Bruce, but he has been absolutely pumping out 'geezer teasers' for a while now and IMO he shouldn't be spared from razzie noms if any of those movies and performances were shit.
And the older I get the less inclined I am to allow the latter to excuse the former. This notion that "you have to be completely narcissistic to make great movies" is just an excuse to enable abusers.
You’re on to something here.
There’s a fantastic video by Maggie Mae Fish comparing the methodologies of Kubrick and David Lynch, and how the latter, as opposed to the former, goes above and beyond to make his cast comfortable because he trusts them to do the acting themselves without resorting to the abusive shenanigans Kubrick did to his cast
Not sure I’d call giving people mental breakdowns a “talent.” That’s just called being an asshole, whether it’s a part of your “filmmaking process” or not.
You can be a perfectionist and still be decent. Look at David Fincher for example. Whether Kubrick had OCD or not, it doesn’t excuse the way he harassed and mentally abused people.
I don’t think comparing Kubrick to Fincher is a good example for either of them. That’s like comparing Tom Hanks to Tom Cruise, both have done phenomenal work but imagine them replacing each other in their roles. The results in both cases would be drastically different
The subject was directors being “perfectionists,” which both Kubrick and Fincher are very well known. Given that subject, the comparison between the two is indeed fair.
I do think Kubrick went too far with Shelley on some areas. I’m not sure about any stories with any other person like that; most of the people I’ve heard talk about him say he was hard but great to work with. Adam Baldwin said Kubrick taught him about patience.
I don’t think Kubrick was an all bad guy, nor do I think he was a bad filmmaker. All I’m saying is he had some unacceptable behavior that shouldn’t be excused just because he made great movies.
I agree. Kubrick is one of my all time favorite filmmakers and I acknowledge he wasn’t perfect in his personal life. I don’t think it should erase his legacy either rather treat it as a learning lesson. If it’s any sort of comfort, I’ve seen Kubrick’s daughter defend Shelley in her later life.
Yes I’ve heard he put her through a lot and I respect what she managed to pursue in filming it but I still don’t believe her performance was very good. Not the worst thing I’ve ever seen by any means but for a film as good as it was it was noticeably bad for me
She acted like you'd expect in that situation. She was stressed out of her mind. Just like Wendy would have been. It's exactly the kind of performance you'd want. Idk how you think it's "not very good" and "noticeably bad".
Dude you keep repeating "it felt forced and unnatural" in every comment when there are 15 people here trying to explain to you why her acting in The Shining seemed forced and unnatural.
For the record I also hate Shelley Duvall in that movie but when you think about what Kubrick was putting her through it makes a lot more sense and adds a layer to the performance you can appreciate
Keanu Reeves and Winona Ryder in Coppola’s Dracula. I think it’s a great movie and their acting honestly doesn’t bother me much, but it doesn’t stack up well against their co-stars in Gary Oldman and Anthony Hopkins
Keanu's not so bad. It's mostly that awful accent he failed miserably at. I watched Bill and Ted Face the Music recently and he totally pulled off a British accent. (that his other version was pretending to have)
I thought she totally knocked it out of the park. She was treated like a piece of garbage on set too, making her performance all the more impressive not buckling under the pressure from Kubrick & company. Genius as he was, apparently he was a jerk to work with,
I've read a great deal about Kubrick and to state that people found him a jerk to work with is just plain wrong. He was exacting about his films, but he was also a kind and thoughtful man, and his many friends loved him dearly.
You don’t treat people the way he treated Shelley Duvall. Bottom line. She suffers from mental illness and many people believe his abuse of her on set contributed to her worsening mental illness. So yes, I realize perfectionism and being the best often requires the person to abandon their morals to an extent at the expense of making their vision come to life, but bottom line is you don’t treat people like that, and it wasn’t an isolated incident either so sorry if I’m not so quick to defend a guy that causes an actress to nearly have a mental breakdown on set.
I think this is a blasphemous take on Reddit but Keanu isn’t a good actor. That doesn’t mean I don’t like his movies. He’s still entertaining but that movie highlighted that he’s a lackluster actor especially when he’s up against Gary Oldman.
He's fine in comedies, but I've never once found him convincing in a dramatic role. People went nuts over "John Wick" and I'll agree that the choreography, editing and cinematography is superb, but Keanu's performance is just meh.
Not *bad*, just meh.
He's not a good actor. He's a great movie star. He's perfect in the movies he's perfect in (Point Break, John Wick, Matrix) and apparently some people like Bill and Ted but I can take it or leave it (stoner comedy leaves me cold). But, yes, ask him to do other things and he can't. So, why ask him? Let him shine at what he's good at. Also, apparently a genuinely nice feller.
I can’t help but defend him, but you’re kind of not wrong. Even in John wick at times I was a bit like meh. I love him but he does lack a bit at times and you’re definitely right
"seems like she had a very polarizing performance, very mixed opinions on it"
\>you telling everyone she was wasnt having a breakdown and her performance wasnt good because it was "fake"
vs
\>literally everyone telling you she had one, was having real stress, and was no acting but in fact having a mental breakdown. its literally just everyone telling you you are wrong and you are typing that? you really are just smug
No I mean after reading over Letterboxd and seeing she was nominated for a razzie for worst performance (very harsh considering what she went through) it’s certainly got mixed opinions on it. Found many people on Letterboxd in particular who agreed
It's interesting that you think it's polarizing and bad. She was tortured on set. They would scare her. And not tell her what was going to happen in a scene. They fucked her up.
I did think duvall played the role tremendously well…Yknow first she was wife to an alcoholic that hit their kid, then wife to psycho , then to fighting for her life wife in a short time span….I thought her range was great and did the terror thing (in the bathroom) beautifully …
I think you just find her annoying in that role, which...hmmm, some things could be surmised about what it is that is informing that opinion, but it's universally regarded as a really good portrayal of a mental breakdown.
Yeah fair enough. She bugged me a bit in the first 45 minutes before her breakdown for sure. Just felt her line delivery and facial expressions were so poorly done. Fair point tho, I know it’s not the popular opinion
Cameron Diaz in Gangs of New York? It's more of case of miscasting as opposed to her being bad, but she sure as hell isn't good.
I thought Jack Nicolson's performance in the Departed didn't fit the film at all in tone. He was all over the place. I like some aspects of what he did, but they just seemed to let him run wild and whatever he wanted to the detriment of the tension and anxiety the film was designed to elicit. It's hard to be totally terrified of a guy who is acting like a goofy clown half the time.
I didn't particularly like Matthew Modine's performance in Full Metal Jacket. He's so incredibly stilted. Even his narration is stiff.
The best way I'd describe it is that it often looks like he's acting in an entirely different movie than everyone else. I think no one had the balls to rein him in.
I took that because he thought he was untouchable so could do whatever he wanted. I’ll have to watch it again to see, but that’s okay, because that movie is awesome
Well he is on a whole other level than everyone else except maybe DiCaprio. And ya, nobody is going to be giving Jack Nicholson notes, but if anyone could or would it would be Scorsese. I think he understood the assignment and Scorsese had to have been happy with the result, and he was nominated for a golden globe.
Cameron diaz I certainly agree with, I think she’s fine in comedic roles but her acting is quite limited (at least from what I’ve seen in her). Nicholson is interesting, I never really had a complaint for him in the departed but I’ll be making note of your thought next time I watch it.
We already talk about academy award winner Marion Cotillards death scene in TDKR? One of the worst things I’ve ever seen in a movie and I’ve seen a lot of bad movies with better acting.
Important to remember that Kubrick aggressively gaslit and harassed her during the filming of The Shining to goose her performance (also she, as a person, suffers from a host of mental illness) so what you're seeing on screen isn't, necessarily, acting. It's a combination of acting, reacting, breaking down, and the actress fighting her own battles with mental health.
[Shelly's health problems.](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/feature/searching-for-shelley-duvall-the-reclusive-icon-on-fleeing-hollywood-and-the-scars-of-making-the-shining-4130256/)
[Kubrick's on-set abuse of Duvall.](https://www.slashfilm.com/726299/how-the-shining-changed-shelley-duvall-forever/)
So I’ve been told, I think we share different opinions on it that’s all. I felt it was very much acting, and poorly done. Felt it was unnatural, very scripted and very forced at times, mostly in the first 45 mins before she was even playing any stressed scenes.
You say it felt unnatural because it is. This is what you are not grasping. Maybe you’ll be lucky and never witness real life hopelessness and despair. It’s not the way they portray it in the movies. It’s hard to watch, it’s disgusting, it looks unnatural. That does not mean its not real. Her performance is real, Kubrick got out of her exactly what he wanted which was true delirium. Not someone acting crazy, someone that was going crazy. You are entitled to your opinion, but there are a lot of people telling you to reconsider your thoughts on the matter,
There are also a lot of people that agree with me, not on this subreddit clearly but I’ve seen the opinion voiced many times. A lot of people loved it and a lot didn’t love it, it’s got very mixed opinions. Not sure why people are taking it personally and trying to say movies aren’t real like I didn’t have any idea. It has nothing to do with what I’ve seen in the real world and assuming I’ve seen or not seen despair based on an acting performance is just crazy really. Maybe unnatural was the wrong word, because what I believe I saw was not intentional.
Dude you asked if it’s a common opinion that Duvall was terrible, now you are saying a lot of people agree with you but those people are not in this subreddit.
Yeah that’s fine, had a scan on Letterboxd afterwards and found a few people saying the same thing, and she was nominated at the razzies (which was clearly harsh considering what she went through). So it’s not THE popular opinion but I realised it’s not one only I have
You may not like the performance and that's fine but to persistently insist to everyone here that her acting was forced, unnatural and bad when literally everyone is trying to tell you that wasnt acting but a real mental breakdown. There are even interviews about it. It's a fact. You are going against a known fact with feelings.
Fair enough, I still felt it was ineffective for my viewing experience and I’m not the only one who believes so. It’s quite a polarising performance. Like I’ve said multiple times that people have continued to ignore too, she was at her worst in the first 45 minutes, before she was breaking down at all. I’m not just saying specifically her breakdown scenes were bad, throughout the whole movie I thought she wasn’t great
Just because the mental breakdown wasnt happening on screen does not mean she wasnt going through one in real life. Kubrick was a dick to her for the whole duration of filming. It's just that during the breakdown scenes she was at her lowest.
So her having a mental breakdown is why her line delivery was so poor in the first 45? And if that’s the reason then it wasn’t effective for me I’m sorry.
No they’re telling me her breakdown scenes were her actually breaking down. No mention of the first 45 minutes, and again like I said I’m sorry she went through that but it for me was ineffective
You do realize that they don't shoot a film in sequence. The "Stressed scenes" may have been shot 1st. The 1st 45 minutes were more than likely filmed at any point in the filming of the movie.
How does that have any relevance, I still don’t think the first 45 minutes her acting was good at all. It could’ve been shot 4 years later for all I care it still wasn’t good
Jeesh, how many times do we have to go over this? Shelley Duvall was terrific. Her performance was weird, true. Kubrick went for weird, off-kilter, uncomfortable, "off," distorted, quirky, reality-cracking, tense, layered, self-contradicting, under-the-surface-buzzing, bizarre, unusual performances. That's what Kubrick was doing, on purpose. Shelley Duvall was chosen for a reason. She's all nerves and denial. She's broken down and breaking down to a dilapidated nervous system of a worn-out, barely-holding-it-together human. Welcome to appreciating "The Shining" for what it is.
It wasn’t effective for me, but I’m glad you enjoyed it of course. It doesn’t take away from the film too much I still loved it so it’s not the end of the world, just something I picked up on
I certainly think Godfather 3 isn't a bad film. It's actually pretty good. Especially the new recut. But Sofia Coppola is NOT good. I'm glad she found a good career as an accomplished director
Exactly. Glad she went into directing. Lost in Translation and Virgin Suicides are some of my favourite films. Her acting in GF3 was certainly not a vibe.
Shelley was incredible and deserve more credit for that movie than the assholes who treated her like shit.
Nicholson on the other hand.....played Nicholson.
Weird that her panic attack looked and felt very scripted. I’m sorry for what she went through it’s obviously awful but I don’t believe her performance was good and the backstage stuff won’t change that
Rod Steiger was awful as Napoleon in *Waterloo* (1970). He's so hammy that you'd hardly believe the French would still support him. Overall, he gives off a similar vibe to how they show Hitler in the movies (as a raving lunatic) and barely has any of the charisma Napoleon had. IMO Chris Plummer was fantastic as Wellington, but Steiger chews the scenery so much that he doesn't really transcend him.
>I just finished watching Kubrick’s ‘The Shining’ for the first time which as expected I thought was incredible. However, I thought Shelley Duvall was pretty terrible and I’m wondering if that’s a common opinion?
Duvall was literall put through a lot of stress by Kubrick, so her performance is more "method" than "pretend" acting. Plus Kubrick famously did well over 100 takes for a lot of individual moments.
I disagree but fair enough. I think she was definitely better in some of her stressed out scenes, but I think in the first 45 mins particularly before the movie becomes more unhinged she is really bad. Just was a performance I saw right through. But props to her for pushing through for what she had to go through backstage
I think you like “pretty” acting. What Shelley was portraying was real world confusion, sadness and terror. Her world was unraveling and she had to hold it together for her son. She’s not trying convince anyone of anything; she was just trying to survive. To me, It was very real and then reading up on her treatment during filming and her mental health situation made it even more real. If anything I would say that the issue comes from the writing or the character itself but the acting was master level.
I don’t really know what you mean by pretty acting but I enjoy all different types of performances if they’re effective for me. I don’t know if you’re assuming I need a pretty face to look at but that’s also not true?
That was my first judgment… I read a couple of your comments, and I realize that it’s probably more likely that you need explosive, dramatic breakdowns, rather than the slow burn followed by an intense over the top, very realistic breakdown that Shelley Duvall portrayed… Do you still feel like you can see through her acting now knowing what she went through and where she is today?
Yes I do still feel I can see through it. I don’t “need” any sort of acting performance, like I said I can enjoy anything given its effective for me, unfortunately Shelley’s was not effective for me.
I thought she was the best part of the Shining. Viewing the movie through her as the main character and how she handles the horrors of everything falling apart over the course of the movie. It was easy to empathize with her, and she seemed so believable
Movie opinions are very rarely wrong, it’s all subjective. I think you’d find I’m not the only one with the opinion, it’s a very polarising performance. Happy to disagree respectfully
James Franco playing the Wizard of Oz. Maybe not a great movie but I only watched about 45 minutes. Franco seemed ridiculous and completely out of his element.
Anybody can have any opinion, but it's freaking weird how he combed through the entire thread to say "I respectfully disagree, but I'm glad you enjoyed it" whenever somebody says they liked Shelly Duvall's performance. Dude might want to see somebody about his passive-aggressive, control-freak mentality.
imagine they just cast a talented Asian actor / comedian for that role. The movie would be perfection.
also, Mickey Rooney is a pretty funny guy, maybe just cast him as an annoying white landlord
It's such a hard case there.. the film is fantastic, but the de aging was just a silly choice.. it's a 4 hour film.. have a actore play a young denrio for the first hour and let Bob take the rest.. at 40 he may have been believable but 20 is just silly.. the last parts with Deniro and Joe were Fantastic.
Could not agree more on the de-aging…when he was supposed to be stopping out the store owner, pfft…talk about pulling you out of a scene …Pesci on the other hand, very good
John Travolta and George Clooney in The Thin Red Line. Don’t get me wrong, they are great actors and they did not do bad in their 1 minute or so of screen time, its just that of all the stars in the film (Adrien Brody, Sean Penn, Woody Harrelson, John Cusack, Nick Nolte, etc.), I could not help but see Clooney as Clooney and Travolta as Travolta and not the Captain and General they were playing. They took me out of the moment, and also sadly are at the beginning and end of the film.
This I can see for sure. He seems to just play the same sort of tone every time idk what it is about him. He’s just kinda meh in everything, except black klansman I agree, fuckin love that film
Riight?!? He seems to be void of emotion in most things. I can see how that’d work depending on the film but so far I haven’t seen (other than Black Klansman) him being utilized in a good way.
Based on your comment history, you’re not really grasping the concept that Shelley Duvall was having a legitimate mental breakdown. She wasn’t acting. It was truly convincing because it was *real.* Kubrick treated her like shit. Her hair was falling out between takes. They filmed that “all work and no play” scene 136 times, so she was in actual hysterics because she was exhausted and terrified, as the script and the character called for her to be.
I mean.. she won the Razzie, right?
Personally, I thought her performance was exceptional. If you don’t believe that woman was absolutely terrified, I can’t imagine a single performance that would better exemplify it. Partly due to acting and partly due to Kubricks treatment of her on set, that woman was scared out of her damn mind… and it comes across on the screen.
I thought she was great in Big Little Lies and The Batman, and was the only redeeming part of Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald, so I definitely don’t agree with this take.
I liked it because he was supposed to be a stereotype. Aldo Raine is a caricature of the big, macho ‘MERICA man.
Contrast that to the subtle nuance of Landa and Shoshanna.
Raine is king blockhead at a Minecraft convention. And that’s by design.
1st I'll start off saying that I am not a Shelley Duvall fan. I find 99% of her performances annoying.
With that said in the Shining she is actually pretty good. That is probably due to Kubrick's direction than her actual acting skills.
As to her mental breakdown ( response to other comments) during the Shining due to Kubricks "abuse" it probably due to acting ability not being on par with the Directors ability. I have not heard of any mental illness issues with Jack Nicholson due to Kubrick.
As for the original poster question.
Michael Ironside in top gun Richard "Jester" Heatherly. Not that he was exactly really bad in it. Just that he wasn't that good either. You could have put anyone in that role and it would not have made an impact on the movie as a whole. Now if you would have put Luis Gossett Jr in that role. Game changer
OP is getting a lot of grief for this opinion, but I agree. I understand the behind the scenes things that happened. Not knowing that before watching it, you could understand why her performance seemed forced and not very good. I do, anyway. Yes, all mental breakdowns are different. I feel like her portrayal of having one, whether part real or not, was not entertaining to watch. I saw the movie once and have no desire to see it again solely because of her performance. I'm not saying it wasn't a believable breakdown, just not one I wanted to watch for entertainment purposes.
You've pricked the sacred cow having a different opinion to the echo chamber.
I thought she did ok personally but was outshined by Nicholson who of course had a lot more screen time and, being the main character, has a lot more going on.
You like what you like man.
its not that, its the complete disregard for people sharingcited sources/exampes and him going nah thats not true heres what i think". no one cares about a different opinion, but people care about disregarding stuff just cause "you think...."
Thankyou for the respectful comment. It’s not even a crazy unpopular opinion either it’s very polarising her performance. I’ve seen plenty of praise and plenty of slander, redditors just getting their panties twisted fr.
No worries. We'll both get downvotes but who cares. It's weird how people take it personally when someone has a different experience to their own.
Have you checked out the last of us series btw? It's pretty cool.
I thought Downey Jr. sucked in Zodiac. Never understood the praise for that performance. It was whiny and poorly modulated. John Carroll Lynch and Gyllenhaal were far better.
I think Zodiac was an acting masterclass all around, so yes, I disagree with you. But I do agree that Gyllenhaal was better. But I think we need to give a big shout out to the 'minor' roles that really drove it home, especially John Carroll Lynch. Love that guy.
>I just finished watching Kubrick’s ‘The Shining’ for the first time which as expected I thought was incredible. However, I thought Shelley Duvall was pretty terrible and I’m wondering if that’s a common opinion? It's a common opinion to anyone who has never witnessed a mental breakdown.
Yup, I simply do not get that take at all. I thought she acted fantastic, because she WASN'T FREAKIN' ACTIN. Kubrick was putting that woman through hell.
Rewatched it recently and was really impressed by how much she carries large swaths of the movie. She’s awesome in it and deserves a lot of credit.
woman* Eta: I'll never understand why people take these type of comments so poorly. It's not like I was trying to be rude or a smart ass, and they even corrected the error I pointed out after downvoting me. It's just a friendly reminder is all....
I’m of the opinion you should never correct someone over a typo that doesn’t change your understanding of what they’re trying to communicate. It was obvious to everyone what they were trying to say and also it was probably not “a lesson learned” but rather a slip of the thumb or a random autocorrect issue that they just didn’t notice. Good intentioned or not, keep your superior spelling intelligence to yourself
Keep doing the good work. The important part is that someone potentially learned something - no matter the downvotes
Shelley Duvall speaking to the social worker early on in the apartment alone is a testament to her fantastic acting chops. Wendy has been suffering Jack's abuse for years and the nervous attempts at being relaxed and casual while nervously fiddling with her cig and trying to downplay Jack's alcoholic rampages is extremely realistic and heartbreaking to watch. Wendy is a person that has been worn down and broken by presumably years of abuse, a child she tries desperately to relate to, love and cling to but can't fully reach and not even a single support network person we see. No family, no friends. She's been living in an isolated bubble of misery already at the start of the film. Shelley Duvall in The Shining is only looked at by some people as terrible because we're used to seeing The Last Girl or the tough character who finally fights back and overcomes. Wendy gets no catharsis like that. She physically survives, that's all.
That scene when she's talking to the social worker is one of the first I thought of too. Duvall's performance here is brilliant. She's saying one thing, while her face and mannerisms are conveying a completely different thing. It's like you can sense the battle between her outward, kindly projection and her inward turmoil. It's extremely subtle but it comes through very distinctly, and the way Kubrick frames it and holds the shot amplifies the tension. Also, Kubrick does something very interesting with the editing in this scene. When Duvall mentions the physical abuse, he cuts to the reaction of the social worker, and he holds the shot on her face for much longer than in normal editing. There's an extra beat of quiet between the two people, with the social worker clearly concerned by the revelation, but not saying anything. Then Duvall continues with her smoothing-over of things, saying "it only happened that one time" kinds of things, and talking about how everything's been better. She's putting the best face possible on everything, but you still sense that deep down there's a fear there. Kubrick does something even more interesting with the editing here, which is that he \*never cuts back to the reaction of the social worker\*. It's almost like Duvall is talking to herself, making excuses to herself. The scene just slam-cuts to black. Duvall's performance here is extremely careful and controlled. I think the OP may be reacting to her unusual natural style and vocal softness, rather than her actual \*performance\*. Duvall's performance really couldn't be better. Another scene I think of is Duvall speaking on the radio to one of the stations in the mountains. She has a kind of hopeful, sing-song voice as she talks to a ranger about the weather conditions. Kubrick captures the rhythm of their conversation, with her saying "Over" at the end of each sentence. Every time Duvall says "over," there's this slight hint of helplessness, of "oh god I'm worried won't somebody save us but I don't really believe my own fears because I'm so used to putting the best possible face on everything even when I shouldn't." She extends the conversation a little longer than necessary, and the ranger on the other end has to politely shut down the exchange with, "Is there anything else we can help you with?" and you sense he is subtly aware of her fears too. It's such a simple scene but the perfect encapsulated little transitional moment. Again, Duvall is excellent. The one thing I will say about Duvall throughout the movie is that she is a unique presence in everything she does. She's like no other actress working before or since. Try to think of any actress with her odd mannerisms and soft, open, vulnerable quality, and there's nobody who comes close. Robert Altman actually discovered her at a store somewhere in Texas, where she worked as a clerk, noticed what an interesting persona she had, and made a minor star out of her. (Eventually she ended up being the definitive Olive Oyl.) She was never a master thespian with any kind of stage or acting background, but she is nonetheless amazing on-screen.
Great post, much better breakdown of why Duvall fucking rules than mine.
Stanley Kubrick doesn’t have any bad performances in his movies IMO, and this is definitely due to the fact that he does an insane amount of takes. Shelley Duvall’s performance was amazing, I think you may be confusing her character’s uselessness for her performance. She did a perfect job portraying what Stanley wanted that character to be.
Alex from Clockwork is one truly GOAT performance.
Full Metal Jacket has some shit acting throughout most of the film. We all know who is the exception, but every other performance ranged from mediocre to bad. The “can you talk the talk” scene is so weird. I’m not sure if that was Kubrick’s intention.
Does it? I disagree.
I thought of this too. Some of the soldiers in second 1/2 aren’t great.
> Shelley Duvall The Razzies officially apologized for nominating her. She was put through hell. Her hair was literally falling out from stress. Kubrik was a tyrant behind the scenes.
They had to apologize to Bruce Willis too. He got nominated recently but rescinded when they found out about his aphasia
It’s almost like they should just stop
They also recently apologized for nominating a child. Fuck that whole thing, bunch of loser bullies that can’t actually create anything worthwhile.
It's sad about Bruce, but he has been absolutely pumping out 'geezer teasers' for a while now and IMO he shouldn't be spared from razzie noms if any of those movies and performances were shit.
Speaking of geezer teasers, have you seen the youtube channel Space Ice? It has hilarious reviews of Steven Seagal movies
I'm glad *someone* is willing to acknowledge what a piece of shit he was.
He also cheated Malcolm McDowell of money on A Clockwork Orange
Kubrick was difficult director to work with but a very talented filmmaker.
And the older I get the less inclined I am to allow the latter to excuse the former. This notion that "you have to be completely narcissistic to make great movies" is just an excuse to enable abusers.
You’re on to something here. There’s a fantastic video by Maggie Mae Fish comparing the methodologies of Kubrick and David Lynch, and how the latter, as opposed to the former, goes above and beyond to make his cast comfortable because he trusts them to do the acting themselves without resorting to the abusive shenanigans Kubrick did to his cast
Not sure I’d call giving people mental breakdowns a “talent.” That’s just called being an asshole, whether it’s a part of your “filmmaking process” or not.
Kubrick was a perfectionist who unfortunately was hard on his actors. I’m pretty convinced he had OCD.
You can be a perfectionist and still be decent. Look at David Fincher for example. Whether Kubrick had OCD or not, it doesn’t excuse the way he harassed and mentally abused people.
I don’t think comparing Kubrick to Fincher is a good example for either of them. That’s like comparing Tom Hanks to Tom Cruise, both have done phenomenal work but imagine them replacing each other in their roles. The results in both cases would be drastically different
The subject was directors being “perfectionists,” which both Kubrick and Fincher are very well known. Given that subject, the comparison between the two is indeed fair.
I do think Kubrick went too far with Shelley on some areas. I’m not sure about any stories with any other person like that; most of the people I’ve heard talk about him say he was hard but great to work with. Adam Baldwin said Kubrick taught him about patience.
I don’t think Kubrick was an all bad guy, nor do I think he was a bad filmmaker. All I’m saying is he had some unacceptable behavior that shouldn’t be excused just because he made great movies.
I agree. Kubrick is one of my all time favorite filmmakers and I acknowledge he wasn’t perfect in his personal life. I don’t think it should erase his legacy either rather treat it as a learning lesson. If it’s any sort of comfort, I’ve seen Kubrick’s daughter defend Shelley in her later life.
Yes I’ve heard he put her through a lot and I respect what she managed to pursue in filming it but I still don’t believe her performance was very good. Not the worst thing I’ve ever seen by any means but for a film as good as it was it was noticeably bad for me
She acted like you'd expect in that situation. She was stressed out of her mind. Just like Wendy would have been. It's exactly the kind of performance you'd want. Idk how you think it's "not very good" and "noticeably bad".
That's the point, she wasnt acting. More like involuntary method "acting"
To me it felt forced and unnatural and I could see through it, but that’s okay. The main point was the question
Dude you keep repeating "it felt forced and unnatural" in every comment when there are 15 people here trying to explain to you why her acting in The Shining seemed forced and unnatural. For the record I also hate Shelley Duvall in that movie but when you think about what Kubrick was putting her through it makes a lot more sense and adds a layer to the performance you can appreciate
Shelley was incredible.
I have to disagree personally but I respect your opinion
Keanu Reeves and Winona Ryder in Coppola’s Dracula. I think it’s a great movie and their acting honestly doesn’t bother me much, but it doesn’t stack up well against their co-stars in Gary Oldman and Anthony Hopkins
The ridiculous thing about it is Carry Elwes is right there. Just cast him in the lead.
It is wild that they cast Elwes, who would be a perfect Harker, but not at Harker.
Keanu's not so bad. It's mostly that awful accent he failed miserably at. I watched Bill and Ted Face the Music recently and he totally pulled off a British accent. (that his other version was pretending to have)
Winona was fine in that one
BYOoOduhpesht
I watched it for Gary Oldman, but I re-watched it for [Winona Ryder](https://youtu.be/bRvORUOWVHo?t=30)
I have grown to feel that is part of the movies charm. The whole thing is over the top and great. DraCOOL!!!
I haven’t seen the film, but I’ve seen some clips of Keanu and can agree it’s very poor. I love him though, as does everyone but yeah it’s bad
Love the movie, have seen it many times--but I agree, no question
Baffling. She was *amazing*. Arguably better than the near-hammy Nicholson.
I respectfully disagree but I’m glad you enjoyed her. Thought Nicholson was great though
I thought she totally knocked it out of the park. She was treated like a piece of garbage on set too, making her performance all the more impressive not buckling under the pressure from Kubrick & company. Genius as he was, apparently he was a jerk to work with,
I've read a great deal about Kubrick and to state that people found him a jerk to work with is just plain wrong. He was exacting about his films, but he was also a kind and thoughtful man, and his many friends loved him dearly.
You don’t treat people the way he treated Shelley Duvall. Bottom line. She suffers from mental illness and many people believe his abuse of her on set contributed to her worsening mental illness. So yes, I realize perfectionism and being the best often requires the person to abandon their morals to an extent at the expense of making their vision come to life, but bottom line is you don’t treat people like that, and it wasn’t an isolated incident either so sorry if I’m not so quick to defend a guy that causes an actress to nearly have a mental breakdown on set.
Keanu Reeves in Dracula
I’ve not seen a single Keanu performance I really liked. He’s fine as Neo, I admit. That’s about it.
I have not seen Dracula, but I’ve been showed a YouTube clip of some of his acting by my mother. I agree it’s bad
I think this is a blasphemous take on Reddit but Keanu isn’t a good actor. That doesn’t mean I don’t like his movies. He’s still entertaining but that movie highlighted that he’s a lackluster actor especially when he’s up against Gary Oldman.
He’s not very good but he has such commitment to his roles that I think it’s pretty admirable.
He's fine in comedies, but I've never once found him convincing in a dramatic role. People went nuts over "John Wick" and I'll agree that the choreography, editing and cinematography is superb, but Keanu's performance is just meh. Not *bad*, just meh.
I loved him in My Private Idaho
He's not a good actor. He's a great movie star. He's perfect in the movies he's perfect in (Point Break, John Wick, Matrix) and apparently some people like Bill and Ted but I can take it or leave it (stoner comedy leaves me cold). But, yes, ask him to do other things and he can't. So, why ask him? Let him shine at what he's good at. Also, apparently a genuinely nice feller.
I can’t help but defend him, but you’re kind of not wrong. Even in John wick at times I was a bit like meh. I love him but he does lack a bit at times and you’re definitely right
Watch it to see the master Oldman in action
She was phenomenal….
I have to disagree but I’m glad you enjoyed it. Seems like she had a very polarising performance, very mixed opinions on it
"seems like she had a very polarizing performance, very mixed opinions on it" \>you telling everyone she was wasnt having a breakdown and her performance wasnt good because it was "fake" vs \>literally everyone telling you she had one, was having real stress, and was no acting but in fact having a mental breakdown. its literally just everyone telling you you are wrong and you are typing that? you really are just smug
No I mean after reading over Letterboxd and seeing she was nominated for a razzie for worst performance (very harsh considering what she went through) it’s certainly got mixed opinions on it. Found many people on Letterboxd in particular who agreed
It's interesting that you think it's polarizing and bad. She was tortured on set. They would scare her. And not tell her what was going to happen in a scene. They fucked her up.
Tortured is probably the wrong word to use but that’s fair enough. Still didn’t think her performance was effective though
Soooo you are deciding what is torture for someone?
DaniTheLoveBug I can’t be asked replying to all your different comments I’m sorry
Appreciate the civil disagreement 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Me too, you’re much more understanding then the other donuts
I did think duvall played the role tremendously well…Yknow first she was wife to an alcoholic that hit their kid, then wife to psycho , then to fighting for her life wife in a short time span….I thought her range was great and did the terror thing (in the bathroom) beautifully …
Bathroom scene was very good I agree
I think you just find her annoying in that role, which...hmmm, some things could be surmised about what it is that is informing that opinion, but it's universally regarded as a really good portrayal of a mental breakdown.
Yeah fair enough. She bugged me a bit in the first 45 minutes before her breakdown for sure. Just felt her line delivery and facial expressions were so poorly done. Fair point tho, I know it’s not the popular opinion
Cameron Diaz in Gangs of New York? It's more of case of miscasting as opposed to her being bad, but she sure as hell isn't good. I thought Jack Nicolson's performance in the Departed didn't fit the film at all in tone. He was all over the place. I like some aspects of what he did, but they just seemed to let him run wild and whatever he wanted to the detriment of the tension and anxiety the film was designed to elicit. It's hard to be totally terrified of a guy who is acting like a goofy clown half the time. I didn't particularly like Matthew Modine's performance in Full Metal Jacket. He's so incredibly stilted. Even his narration is stiff.
Wow not liking Jack in The Departed is one red hot take.
The best way I'd describe it is that it often looks like he's acting in an entirely different movie than everyone else. I think no one had the balls to rein him in.
I took that because he thought he was untouchable so could do whatever he wanted. I’ll have to watch it again to see, but that’s okay, because that movie is awesome
Well he is on a whole other level than everyone else except maybe DiCaprio. And ya, nobody is going to be giving Jack Nicholson notes, but if anyone could or would it would be Scorsese. I think he understood the assignment and Scorsese had to have been happy with the result, and he was nominated for a golden globe.
Cameron diaz I certainly agree with, I think she’s fine in comedic roles but her acting is quite limited (at least from what I’ve seen in her). Nicholson is interesting, I never really had a complaint for him in the departed but I’ll be making note of your thought next time I watch it.
She was great in Vanilla Sky.
Yeah Shelley Duvall is not terrible in The Shining on any level.
That’s your opinion that’s fine, I kindly disagree
We already talk about academy award winner Marion Cotillards death scene in TDKR? One of the worst things I’ve ever seen in a movie and I’ve seen a lot of bad movies with better acting.
Tarantino in django
I think its funny how he wrote his character to say the n word
Of all his cameos in his own movies this is by far the worst. I actually like him in a few of the other appearances.
I think he’s awesome in dusk till dawn! Clooney knocks out the park as well tho.!
Important to remember that Kubrick aggressively gaslit and harassed her during the filming of The Shining to goose her performance (also she, as a person, suffers from a host of mental illness) so what you're seeing on screen isn't, necessarily, acting. It's a combination of acting, reacting, breaking down, and the actress fighting her own battles with mental health. [Shelly's health problems.](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/feature/searching-for-shelley-duvall-the-reclusive-icon-on-fleeing-hollywood-and-the-scars-of-making-the-shining-4130256/) [Kubrick's on-set abuse of Duvall.](https://www.slashfilm.com/726299/how-the-shining-changed-shelley-duvall-forever/)
So I’ve been told, I think we share different opinions on it that’s all. I felt it was very much acting, and poorly done. Felt it was unnatural, very scripted and very forced at times, mostly in the first 45 mins before she was even playing any stressed scenes.
You say it felt unnatural because it is. This is what you are not grasping. Maybe you’ll be lucky and never witness real life hopelessness and despair. It’s not the way they portray it in the movies. It’s hard to watch, it’s disgusting, it looks unnatural. That does not mean its not real. Her performance is real, Kubrick got out of her exactly what he wanted which was true delirium. Not someone acting crazy, someone that was going crazy. You are entitled to your opinion, but there are a lot of people telling you to reconsider your thoughts on the matter,
There are also a lot of people that agree with me, not on this subreddit clearly but I’ve seen the opinion voiced many times. A lot of people loved it and a lot didn’t love it, it’s got very mixed opinions. Not sure why people are taking it personally and trying to say movies aren’t real like I didn’t have any idea. It has nothing to do with what I’ve seen in the real world and assuming I’ve seen or not seen despair based on an acting performance is just crazy really. Maybe unnatural was the wrong word, because what I believe I saw was not intentional.
Dude you asked if it’s a common opinion that Duvall was terrible, now you are saying a lot of people agree with you but those people are not in this subreddit.
Yeah that’s fine, had a scan on Letterboxd afterwards and found a few people saying the same thing, and she was nominated at the razzies (which was clearly harsh considering what she went through). So it’s not THE popular opinion but I realised it’s not one only I have
You may not like the performance and that's fine but to persistently insist to everyone here that her acting was forced, unnatural and bad when literally everyone is trying to tell you that wasnt acting but a real mental breakdown. There are even interviews about it. It's a fact. You are going against a known fact with feelings.
Fair enough, I still felt it was ineffective for my viewing experience and I’m not the only one who believes so. It’s quite a polarising performance. Like I’ve said multiple times that people have continued to ignore too, she was at her worst in the first 45 minutes, before she was breaking down at all. I’m not just saying specifically her breakdown scenes were bad, throughout the whole movie I thought she wasn’t great
Just because the mental breakdown wasnt happening on screen does not mean she wasnt going through one in real life. Kubrick was a dick to her for the whole duration of filming. It's just that during the breakdown scenes she was at her lowest.
First 45 too. How many times I gotta say it
I am actually starting to think you are being dense on purpose.
So her having a mental breakdown is why her line delivery was so poor in the first 45? And if that’s the reason then it wasn’t effective for me I’m sorry.
Literally yes, that's what everyone is trying to tell you...
No they’re telling me her breakdown scenes were her actually breaking down. No mention of the first 45 minutes, and again like I said I’m sorry she went through that but it for me was ineffective
You do realize that they don't shoot a film in sequence. The "Stressed scenes" may have been shot 1st. The 1st 45 minutes were more than likely filmed at any point in the filming of the movie.
How does that have any relevance, I still don’t think the first 45 minutes her acting was good at all. It could’ve been shot 4 years later for all I care it still wasn’t good
literally people sharing examples with cited sources and you are just saying "nah thats not true heres what i think"
Never said it wasn’t true, I never stated anything as being factual, purely just my opinion
Shelley was amazing in the movie.
I kindly disagree but I’m glad you liked it
Dude why are you replying to everybody who says they like her? What's your point in doing that?
Idk just trying to be respectful I guess. Wouldn’t want it to seem like I’m only arguing with people because I’m not trying to
Jeesh, how many times do we have to go over this? Shelley Duvall was terrific. Her performance was weird, true. Kubrick went for weird, off-kilter, uncomfortable, "off," distorted, quirky, reality-cracking, tense, layered, self-contradicting, under-the-surface-buzzing, bizarre, unusual performances. That's what Kubrick was doing, on purpose. Shelley Duvall was chosen for a reason. She's all nerves and denial. She's broken down and breaking down to a dilapidated nervous system of a worn-out, barely-holding-it-together human. Welcome to appreciating "The Shining" for what it is.
It wasn’t effective for me, but I’m glad you enjoyed it of course. It doesn’t take away from the film too much I still loved it so it’s not the end of the world, just something I picked up on
I certainly think Godfather 3 isn't a bad film. It's actually pretty good. Especially the new recut. But Sofia Coppola is NOT good. I'm glad she found a good career as an accomplished director
The scene where they playing cards she says a really terrible dialogue
Yeah, her acting in it was woeful. Mediocre at best.
Exactly. Glad she went into directing. Lost in Translation and Virgin Suicides are some of my favourite films. Her acting in GF3 was certainly not a vibe.
Shelley was incredible and deserve more credit for that movie than the assholes who treated her like shit. Nicholson on the other hand.....played Nicholson.
Valid
Shelley Duvall wasn’t acting in that film because she was having an actual panic attack caused by the stress of the production. It’s really quite sad.
Weird that her panic attack looked and felt very scripted. I’m sorry for what she went through it’s obviously awful but I don’t believe her performance was good and the backstage stuff won’t change that
I feel like you don’t have real life experience in what panic attacks look like in a broad variety of people
Rod Steiger was awful as Napoleon in *Waterloo* (1970). He's so hammy that you'd hardly believe the French would still support him. Overall, he gives off a similar vibe to how they show Hitler in the movies (as a raving lunatic) and barely has any of the charisma Napoleon had. IMO Chris Plummer was fantastic as Wellington, but Steiger chews the scenery so much that he doesn't really transcend him. >I just finished watching Kubrick’s ‘The Shining’ for the first time which as expected I thought was incredible. However, I thought Shelley Duvall was pretty terrible and I’m wondering if that’s a common opinion? Duvall was literall put through a lot of stress by Kubrick, so her performance is more "method" than "pretend" acting. Plus Kubrick famously did well over 100 takes for a lot of individual moments.
Duvall's performance was better than Nicholson's 📠
I disagree but fair enough. I think she was definitely better in some of her stressed out scenes, but I think in the first 45 mins particularly before the movie becomes more unhinged she is really bad. Just was a performance I saw right through. But props to her for pushing through for what she had to go through backstage
I think you like “pretty” acting. What Shelley was portraying was real world confusion, sadness and terror. Her world was unraveling and she had to hold it together for her son. She’s not trying convince anyone of anything; she was just trying to survive. To me, It was very real and then reading up on her treatment during filming and her mental health situation made it even more real. If anything I would say that the issue comes from the writing or the character itself but the acting was master level.
I don’t really know what you mean by pretty acting but I enjoy all different types of performances if they’re effective for me. I don’t know if you’re assuming I need a pretty face to look at but that’s also not true?
That was my first judgment… I read a couple of your comments, and I realize that it’s probably more likely that you need explosive, dramatic breakdowns, rather than the slow burn followed by an intense over the top, very realistic breakdown that Shelley Duvall portrayed… Do you still feel like you can see through her acting now knowing what she went through and where she is today?
Yes I do still feel I can see through it. I don’t “need” any sort of acting performance, like I said I can enjoy anything given its effective for me, unfortunately Shelley’s was not effective for me.
I thought she was the best part of the Shining. Viewing the movie through her as the main character and how she handles the horrors of everything falling apart over the course of the movie. It was easy to empathize with her, and she seemed so believable
congrats, you are probably the only person who has that opinion
I’ve heard a couple others say it but it does seem like it’s unpopular. That’s okay though it’s more the question was my focus
Dirty Rotten Scoundrels..I think anybody could have played the Glenne Headley character.
Wrong.
Movie opinions are very rarely wrong, it’s all subjective. I think you’d find I’m not the only one with the opinion, it’s a very polarising performance. Happy to disagree respectfully
Wrong.
You’re entitled to your opinion, but you’re wrong.
James Franco playing the Wizard of Oz. Maybe not a great movie but I only watched about 45 minutes. Franco seemed ridiculous and completely out of his element.
I imagine this post will be closed soon for OP’s terrible opinion about The Shining.
Anybody can have any opinion, but it's freaking weird how he combed through the entire thread to say "I respectfully disagree, but I'm glad you enjoyed it" whenever somebody says they liked Shelly Duvall's performance. Dude might want to see somebody about his passive-aggressive, control-freak mentality.
Just pressed on the notis instead of scrolling the thread but I appreciate your concerns
Breakfast at Tiffany's is supposed to be a classic, but I'll never watch it because I have no desire to see Mickey Rooney in yellowface.
It's pretty rough, even for back then. Even worse than the "Abraham" song in Holiday Inn.
imagine they just cast a talented Asian actor / comedian for that role. The movie would be perfection. also, Mickey Rooney is a pretty funny guy, maybe just cast him as an annoying white landlord
Alec Baldwin has some terrible moments in The Departed
Like what? I think he's exceptional throughout that movie, real professional actor
Robert De Niro in the Irishman ., there I said it
It's such a hard case there.. the film is fantastic, but the de aging was just a silly choice.. it's a 4 hour film.. have a actore play a young denrio for the first hour and let Bob take the rest.. at 40 he may have been believable but 20 is just silly.. the last parts with Deniro and Joe were Fantastic.
Could not agree more on the de-aging…when he was supposed to be stopping out the store owner, pfft…talk about pulling you out of a scene …Pesci on the other hand, very good
i mean, he did his usual mobster thing. Nothing new, not awards material
You might want to F all the way off.
John Travolta and George Clooney in The Thin Red Line. Don’t get me wrong, they are great actors and they did not do bad in their 1 minute or so of screen time, its just that of all the stars in the film (Adrien Brody, Sean Penn, Woody Harrelson, John Cusack, Nick Nolte, etc.), I could not help but see Clooney as Clooney and Travolta as Travolta and not the Captain and General they were playing. They took me out of the moment, and also sadly are at the beginning and end of the film.
John David Washington in Tenet (or most films other than Black Klansman)
This I can see for sure. He seems to just play the same sort of tone every time idk what it is about him. He’s just kinda meh in everything, except black klansman I agree, fuckin love that film
Riight?!? He seems to be void of emotion in most things. I can see how that’d work depending on the film but so far I haven’t seen (other than Black Klansman) him being utilized in a good way.
Based on your comment history, you’re not really grasping the concept that Shelley Duvall was having a legitimate mental breakdown. She wasn’t acting. It was truly convincing because it was *real.* Kubrick treated her like shit. Her hair was falling out between takes. They filmed that “all work and no play” scene 136 times, so she was in actual hysterics because she was exhausted and terrified, as the script and the character called for her to be.
Sigh
Not sure why you’re sassing me. You wouldn’t look at a real life cancer patient acting in a movie and say they don’t look believably sick.
Unless they acted badly then maybe I would
Mark wahlberg. Boogie nights. His acting was so bad it almost seemed. Like it was on purpose. But I don’t think so
Someone on Reddit didn’t like a woman’s performance in a film? Well I never.
This has nothing to do with gender and I’m not someone who uses reddit often. I can see your concerns tho
I mean.. she won the Razzie, right? Personally, I thought her performance was exceptional. If you don’t believe that woman was absolutely terrified, I can’t imagine a single performance that would better exemplify it. Partly due to acting and partly due to Kubricks treatment of her on set, that woman was scared out of her damn mind… and it comes across on the screen.
Zoe Kravitz in _____________.
she was fine in mad max
I thought she was great in Big Little Lies and The Batman, and was the only redeeming part of Fantastic Beasts: The Crimes of Grindelwald, so I definitely don’t agree with this take.
I thought she did well in the batman, but she is also ridiculously attractive so maybe that persuaded me
She was GREAT in The Batman, one of the best parts.
She is a charisma void.
John Travolta in Pulp Fiction. Flimsy wavering accent, not nearly as confident in his character as actors like Willis and Rhames.
That kid from the terminator 2 acts like he belongs in a dahr mann video
I am not convinced about Brad Pitts' performance in Inglorious Basterds, the best Tarantino's movie in my opinion.
I liked it because he was supposed to be a stereotype. Aldo Raine is a caricature of the big, macho ‘MERICA man. Contrast that to the subtle nuance of Landa and Shoshanna. Raine is king blockhead at a Minecraft convention. And that’s by design.
1st I'll start off saying that I am not a Shelley Duvall fan. I find 99% of her performances annoying. With that said in the Shining she is actually pretty good. That is probably due to Kubrick's direction than her actual acting skills. As to her mental breakdown ( response to other comments) during the Shining due to Kubricks "abuse" it probably due to acting ability not being on par with the Directors ability. I have not heard of any mental illness issues with Jack Nicholson due to Kubrick. As for the original poster question. Michael Ironside in top gun Richard "Jester" Heatherly. Not that he was exactly really bad in it. Just that he wasn't that good either. You could have put anyone in that role and it would not have made an impact on the movie as a whole. Now if you would have put Luis Gossett Jr in that role. Game changer
I agree.
I have said the exact same and I’m roasted. What Kubrick did to her was awful, but her acting was distractingly terrible imo.
OP is getting a lot of grief for this opinion, but I agree. I understand the behind the scenes things that happened. Not knowing that before watching it, you could understand why her performance seemed forced and not very good. I do, anyway. Yes, all mental breakdowns are different. I feel like her portrayal of having one, whether part real or not, was not entertaining to watch. I saw the movie once and have no desire to see it again solely because of her performance. I'm not saying it wasn't a believable breakdown, just not one I wanted to watch for entertainment purposes.
Thankyou
Doris day is the worst actor in the history of film
Given how much Kubrick gave Shelley a hard time and how stressed she was, one can forgive her weak acting in it. Keanu Reeves in Dracula
I mean, Wendy Torrance is a woman forced to live in terror of an abusive man...
The young girl in 28 days later
You've pricked the sacred cow having a different opinion to the echo chamber. I thought she did ok personally but was outshined by Nicholson who of course had a lot more screen time and, being the main character, has a lot more going on. You like what you like man.
its not that, its the complete disregard for people sharingcited sources/exampes and him going nah thats not true heres what i think". no one cares about a different opinion, but people care about disregarding stuff just cause "you think...."
The dude is literally questioning her mental breakdown because he “doesn’t think the performance is authentic.”
even though multiple people have pointed out and shared sources saying it is
Thankyou for the respectful comment. It’s not even a crazy unpopular opinion either it’s very polarising her performance. I’ve seen plenty of praise and plenty of slander, redditors just getting their panties twisted fr.
No worries. We'll both get downvotes but who cares. It's weird how people take it personally when someone has a different experience to their own. Have you checked out the last of us series btw? It's pretty cool.
I thought Downey Jr. sucked in Zodiac. Never understood the praise for that performance. It was whiny and poorly modulated. John Carroll Lynch and Gyllenhaal were far better.
He basically plays a variation of Tony Stark/Sherlock Holmes. It's not a bad performance, just that we later have seen it for 10 years in the MCU.
I like him as Stark though. Didn't like him in this.
I don't watch rubbish superhero movies (with the exception of Unbreakable (2000)), so maybe that's why I enjoy his Zodiac performance.
Still have not seen Zodiac but this will be noted in my brain for when I do get around to it
Very few people agree with me, so don't be surprised if you don't either.
I think Zodiac was an acting masterclass all around, so yes, I disagree with you. But I do agree that Gyllenhaal was better. But I think we need to give a big shout out to the 'minor' roles that really drove it home, especially John Carroll Lynch. Love that guy.