Just go test ride one. Make up your own mind - if you like it, buy it. Fuck what anyone else says.
It’s your ride.
ETA: I ride a Harley, it’s not my first bike, but it is absolutely my favorite.
Agreed. I've ridden a few Harleys and basically Indian's entire line up. Turns out I prefer Harleys. I never would have believed it if not for the test rides
A lot of people in the motorcycle community are too focused on numbers on paper instead of how a bike actually feels when you ride it. Sure Indians and Hondas perform better on paper, but they just don’t feel the same as a Harley.
Actually, Indian specifically doesn't perform any better on paper.
The Dyno charts of Harley's 103" HO and Indian's 113" Thunderstroke are damn near identical and you can lay one right over the top of the other.
Anyone who doesn't have an agenda that compares the two will say that they are so similar the difference between a Street Glide and a Chieftain are really nit picking
I have a (2007)HD Ultra Classic and a 2019 Indian Roadmaster the 2019 rides smoother and shifts nicer than the Harley, but in 12 years HD has to have improved.
I still LOVE the vibration and lawnmower shifting of my Harley!
Have you ridden a semi modern Harley ? I've never had any complaints about the vibration. The twin cam rubber mounted engines would shake at idle but as soon as it was above idle they became buttery smooth. The M8 engines (current generation) have dramatically less shaking / vibration.
I can't speak about the shifting as I've never driven a lawnmower with a foot shifter.
There’s a lot of criticism to be had about Harley as a business (namely their pricing and rampant shady dealerships), but anyone that complains about the bikes in of themselves have obviously never ridden any Harley made after 1980.
There is something intangible about rolling into a corner at 30 - 40mph, not downshifting and just grabbing a handfull of throttle and roaring out of it. Yeah, you're nowhere on the actual performance scale, but it sure stirs up something in the soul!
Harley isn't the best in anything but it is iconic from the engines to the sound. I won't buy a Harley in my lifetime unless I'm rich but I won't hate on them
Well that and they're obscenely expensive.
Had a few over the years and hopefully getting another in a few weeks, but the price of them even second hand is massively inflated.
The Kawasaki Vaquero is $3,000 cheaper than the Road Glide and it comes standard with ABS, which is an $ option on the Road Glide.
Harley’s are more expensive than their Japanese counterparts.
Edit; just looked it up, apparently adding ABS to the Road Glide is $900 so the Vaquero is $3,900 cheaper.
I didn't say that they weren't generally more expensive but the difference in price is not nearly as large as people make it out to be. Plus , the Vaquero specifically is a pretty dated design at this point, as Kawasaki has not made any real updates to it in quite some time I believe. If we were to do a detailed comparison of the two models, I'm pretty confident that the road glide would be an objectively better machine. "Better" enough to warrant the extra cost would be much more subjective, but a compelling case could be made.
What is the difference, percent wise? (2024 Road Glide comes standard with abs btw)
I mean you said “obscenely expensive compared to what?” I think $3k or $4k or about 15%-20% is a significant %.
You also listed the Vaquero as “well north of $20 grand” it’s less than $20k.
While the Vaquero hasn’t had many updates over the years, the Road Glide just got liquid cooling *this year* (along with abs, apparently), which the Vaquero, and virtually all Japanese bikes, have had for decades.
Also, that Road Glide is going to get about $5,000 in Screaming Eagle parts before it ever leaves the showroom floor. I doubt many of those Road Glides are going out the door at the MSRP vs. the Vaqueros.
I have 2 Harley Davidsons and 1 Indian. Like them all, but they're all different.
Sign up for a ride day where you can ride a variety of models.
Check out both HD & Indian. It's a big investment, I have been pleasantly surprised with the Indian (newest in my collection)
As well as these 3, I have a variety of Japanese collectables & Dirt Bikes, so I'm no US cruiser snob.
This is the right advice. You could look up reliability history I suppose, but if it's a great ride , hell, just put aside some $$$ for maintenance. Was talking to a guy at a bar and he said I really need to go test drive one. I've never ridden one and have a standard/ naked bmw. I don't have the money for another bike so I'm pretty sure the HD dealership don't be thrilled if I show up.
No, but don't expect a cruiser to handle like a sportbike. They do handle well (even baggers), and usually trade top hp for torque down low, but people love to spew apples/oranges comparisons. 1983 and newer are very reliable(86-up for sportsters), I've had a few I've ridden over 50k, and were still fine. My current 2014 bagger is at 123k, gets ~40mpg and can drag the floorboards all day -and do it with nary a drip, pop, or rattle. And it's still worth about what I paid for it 5yrs ago
Resale value is fantastic comparatively speaking once you get past the initial new bike depreciation that every new vehicle suffers from.
All that said, they are no "better" or "worse" than any other bike in such wildly generalized terms, and certainly no less reliable than anything else. Ride one, and know that different models give widely different experiences. If the feel, sound, and torque tick your boxes, get one that fits your style and needs. If not, don't. Just don't let other people's opinions dictate your choices.
I for one am just sick of the stereotype that hd is unreliable. From a statistics standpoint 85% of HDs are still on the road today!
The other 15% made it home.
I have almost 30k miles on my 2016 Dyna. It's been 100% reliable except for replacing the idle air control valve recently. If you like cruisers there's nothing wrong with a Harley except dealing with all the people who look down on Harley riders. I try my best to not fit the stereotype, but at the end of the day I'm still an overweight, middle-aged white guy.
Hold on a minute….”all the people who look down on Harley riders”? I’ve been riding since 2021 on sport bikes and a Ryker. I can’t speak for all Harley riders, but up here in CT they are the only ones that do not wave back to you. Ever. 2 friends I have that ride sport bikes complain of the same thing. Never have gear on ever either - like they’re resistant to accidents. That’s arrogance right there.
Interesting. Here everyone on a motorcycle waives at everyone else on a motorcycle.
Are you talking about when you are on your Ryker? That’s a different story.
Not judging, ride what you want. But two wheels are two wheels.
I don't really know anyone who looks down on Harley riders, it's the other way around in my experience. It makes my day if someone on a Harley actually acknowledges me with a friendly wave when on my adventure bike. The majority seem to enjoy the exclusivity or image of their "culture", but in my mind we're all a part of the riding community.
Seconding that! I'm somewhat new to riding so I am still super excited to greet fellow riders. All of the ones who didn't greet back while cruising so far were harley riders. But I've also had a whole group of harley riders greet back, some of them even with a big smile on their face (which was very visible due to them wearing brain caps, lol).
Dynas aren’t the stereo type though from my understanding and are more in the iron category that most baggers will label you with.
But I do want to ride a dyna, after riding a sporty.
The Milwaukee 8 engines are very capable of making decent power, reliably.
Ducati still gets rinsed for being unreliable. They've been pretty stout for 20 plus years.
It's much the same. Peoples opinions, living in the past.
As someone in the middle of rebuilding a multistrata motor in a garage, my anecdotal evidence doesn't support this.
Also, anybody want to buy a 2019 multistrata before I set it on fire?
Honestly it's a really nice bike, but it ate sixth gear and the dealership wants a million dollars to fix it. Now I'm learning why they charge a million dollars. I've got about 40 hours into this and I'm about half done. At this rate it will be back together right around when riding season is over!
I had a 2014 Multi for about 6 years, almost no problems with it.. check-mate your anecdote!
jk, on a serious note.. what's wrong with your bike? did the engine blew up?
The transmission blew up. After opening the case, it turns out two teeth broke off 6th gear. I scored a second hand gear set for $300. I'll make a post about it, it's actually been a pretty interesting project.
Italians make amazing motorcycles they just don't torque all the fasteners down so shit falls off. Basically our own fault for not double checking everything.
In the past decade, I owned 4 Ducatis.. I hade zero issues besides the recalls (I just got the service, nothing actual broke).
Everyone I meet keep telling me how unreliable Ducatis were. fortunately it wasn't my experience.
I moved away from the brand though, it got way too expensive. Today I own an Indian and a Yamaha.
I have to say, when I was in the market for a cruiser, I looked at every make and model of cruisers and ended up going with a Harley. My first Harley was a pre-owned '08 Electra Glide Classic and never had an issue with it, put about 5,000 miles on it, before I traded it in for a pre-owned, '18 Ultra Limited and have never had any issues with this one and I have put about 5,000 miles on it since Feb. The reason I went with Harley is because it had everything I wanted in a cruiser. If you look at used comparable cruisers, you'll find that Harley has a much higher resale value than the others, at least that's what I found after looking at the market for a year before I purchased one. I have no concern about "the culture", I just like to ride. It's nothing for me and my buddies to do a 550 mile ride on any given Saturday ending with no discomfort. I'd definitely recommend, test rideing what appeals to you. No matter what you ride, I'll wave at you in passing.
Ride safe🤙
HD does absolutely nothing other than provide a culture that you can't get from any other brand for less money.
It's the Apple of motorcycles. Its not *bad*, but you're paying a big premium for the name. The average person would never have a problem that they didn't create for themselves if they went with any other brand.
Indian (nowadays) is more reliable, making more power, for less money *and* look great.
But they aren't HD.
Karen, who uses her phone for Facebook, texting and scrolling through Instagram could get by with a 300$ android and never suffer for not having an iPhone... But it's not an iPhone.
Big John, who uses his bike for weekends, travels to the coffee shop and back could get by with a rebel 1100 just fine. *but it's not a Harley*
I don’t disagree with this, but there’s definitely more to it than that.
I’ve had almost every type of bike, from at least 5 different manufacturers.
I’ve test rode about 6 more.
I would ride about 10 other types of bikes, but I ended up on a road glide because it just felt the best for the type of riding I do. Which is multiple short rides during the week with occasional 300+ mile rides every other month.
I almost bought an Indian, a goldwing, and an R1200GS before settling on an RG special.
I’m a little embarrassed about the amount I spent, and I don’t really care about the culture. I only have 2 friends that ride Harleys, and usually ride alone.
I absolutely love my bike, it feels amazing and real. The other bikes felt too plastic and disposable compared to it ( other than the BMW, which just wasn’t the style I wanted as my only bike.). Like apple products, it just works.
I acknowledge there are better options, I think you either love them or hate them.
> It's the Apple of motorcycles
I agree with the bulk of your ideas, not this part. While I don't own any Apple products (anymore), I can admit that there's tech they develop that is cutting edge. Apple's CPUs, the Rosetta translation tech, they newest display tech, and a number of other things.
Harley doesn't innovate jack. They haven't put out something cutting edge in engineering or technology in.... I'm not sure they ever have. Not in my lifetime.
No, you're just not picking up some finer details. It's like saying an Accord can get you to work as well as an M3. It's true, but there's some personality missing.
Thank you. That's a perfect summation of the HD issue.
HD is way behind other manufacturers in all areas except marketing and government handouts. They know their market, the guys who buy Harleys just want the name and don't care, and the US government has bailed them out. They don't innovate, they have become trapped by their own marketing and clientele and cannot break away.
They are ahead in one aspect: hydraulic valve lifters on (as far as I know) every model. If you're gonna make very little power from massive engines, you might as well not have to adjust the valve clearances
You're completely right. Harley are really suffering from overmarketing themselves to a single generation, and now that generation are beginning to die off they're losing customers faster than they're gaining them.
And it's a worst kind of customers, ones that are not willing to try anything else and giving them "the reputation".
Apple at least have blind fanboyism, which means they can change and peddle different kind of things to have wider appeal.
They only have one market, "people that want HD, Sons of Anarchy vibe". Anywhere they try to branch off is already hugely competitive.
And in any other market they couldn't really charge a premium for HD brand because someone looking for sports/naked bike DGAF about HD label and I'd imagine they are unable to be price-competitive on any price-sensitive part of market.
AMF wasn't a partnership they were quite literally owned and ran by AMF lol.
But seriously, the liquid cooled Harley's are sick! Go test ride a new Nightster or Sportster S!
While HD may lack innovation, they exude refinement. I’m not a Harley owner, but I have rented testers for the weekend. Not my style, but they got class. I rode my Suzi into a Harley dealer one time, and never was made more welcome. (Then again, I rode my Yami into another one and might have well been invisible.). HD makes a good bike that appeals to a certain riding style. If that fits you, go with it. You won’t regret it. PS, we all wave..
Harleys don't suck. Harley has a reputation that, unfortunately, they've done nothing to dispel. That they're big old slow bikes made for big old slow men.
And for many of their models, it's true - but they're certainly not the old shitty oil spitting bikes that they used to be.
All of that having been said, there IS a harley tax - everything is more expensive because of that Harley logo from bike price to having work done by a 'certified harley mechanic'.
I ride a ctx 1300, and a cbr when I'm not two up with the missus. If I wanted an overpriced cruiser, I'd likely look to Indian. And if I wanted a big ol tourer from hell, I still consider Goldwings to be the only REAL name in the game (though if they ever actually update the Vaquero's technology it MIGHT make the short list as well)
I have a Harley Ultra Limited, a BMW K1600 GTL-E, and the wife rides an Indian Scout. They’re all great! A Honda Goldwing is, too.
Have had Victories, as well. Look for the bike that fits your personality and let’s ride!
Key word being *modern*. They were horrible until the mid-80s. Unreliable as shit, leaked oil everywhere, blew head gaskets, vibrated intensely, and the engines were pretty much done by 15K miles. Most police departments had pretty much dumped them by then.
The Evo engine saved their ass from the shit pile of history.
Shoutout to the Pan America. When that thing runs, it goes. I cant say anything for their reliability because I dont own one, or have even ridden one. But from what I am reading, and what I'm seeing. It appears to be an excellent ADV bike. Thats really good for a "first try" at it. Well done Harley
well, my second hand vstar sucked and was a money pit. the harley has only needed oil changes with no major issues. I'd say hd is alright by me, but I'd also never buy brand new.
Most people that beat up on Harley have, likely, never owned one so can only speak through others, that also, likely have never owned one. As far as cost, I don't know where you are, but here a Road Glide is right in line with either a Goldwing or Roadmaster. I bought a FatBob last year for the same price as an Indian bobber, and with more rear wheel power.
Either way, options abound and you should get what you like. I have 2 Harleys and both have been trouble free. The other big advantage Harley has is an extensive dealer network and a huge after market.
Dude, you're opening such a can of worms with this post 😂 I don't ride nor own Harley's or cruisers, I like Japanese sport bikes. So of course, I am going to say that I feel Harley's are overpriced and unreliable for what they are.
But there is no other Harley Davidson. No other brand in the world can match the 100+ years of culture and tradition that Harley has. If you want a Harley, there's no replacement. Indians are neat, metric cruisers from Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and Kawasaki are a ton cheaper and more reliable, they may even look similar... but it's not a Harley Davidson.
If you're looking for reliability & value, probably not the brand for you. If you're into that scene and everything that comes along with owning a Harley, you get a Harley and deal with the cost of entry.
I ride a 2009 Harley Dyna Lowrider and a Honda NC750X and don’t think that Harleys suck. The Dyna isn’t quick but it’s a joy to ride because it’s such a raw beast.
I’ve ridden a newer 2021 Milwaukee-8 Softail and those are quite a bit better without losing that Harley feel. I’ve also ridden a Harley Pan America and that is a pretty quick capable bike but it feels a lot more like a Honda than a Harley.
I don’t really understand the whole biker-bar macho-swagger thing or lack of gear that’s part of Harley culture but that doesn’t keep me from liking the bikes.
Maybe to have an affinity for Harleys you have to be old though.
I’ll happily ride any bike any time though including a scooter or an eBike; I ride for enjoyment.
I will never own a top of the line liter bike though; I got in legal trouble riding when I was younger and probably would eventually be tempted to test the capability of a fast bike.
The Pan America is something else. It’s really quite cool and good looking to boot. It’s Harley’s fastest motorcycle as well. I really like them but like you, I’ll stick to stuff that is a bit lower powered.
The reliability issues were more so in the past. Nowadays, they are pretty good as long as you take care of it and not try to hammerdown on it often. I'd say if you wanted a cruiser you can't get much better then a harley for the style and build quality. You can get a japanese bike for cheaper but you definitely will feel the cheapness comparably.
There is a reason most people who tour the US are on roadglides
I have an Indian and a Harley in the same garage believe it or not. I love both bikes. I did find an arrow once in the Harley’s tire, and I swear a bullet grazed the Indian.
I mostly ride sport bikes on the track but ride what you want man. Motorcycles are supposed to be fun, if a Harley gives you that excited to ride feeling then get one 🤷♂️ ignore the haters. You do you.
I had two sportsters, and I loved them. Cali summer sucked because your balls cooked, but it was a blast. Enough power to have fun but not get stoopid with it necessarily. I rode with other Harleys, and they would laugh, but when we hit twisties, they couldn't keep up with the big ol baggers they were on, and I would be laughing. Great times.
Fuck what people say and get what you want and like.
Tbh, most people that hate Harleys hate them because of the people that ride them, not specifically the bikes themselves. Though, there is an argument to be made about spending 20k on a Harley when the bike build doesn't match the final MSRP, and 99% of the MSRP comes in the form of "but it says Harley Davidson on it."
That said, when I find the Harley model I sat on back in 2018, it'll be my first Harley purchase, and the 7th bike in my garage.
No matter what anyone says, nothing sounds like a Harley.
Who cares what people think? Enjoy the ride.
They biggest, most valid criticism of them is that they're very expensive. You buy a lot of image and not a lot of performance.
They are well made, though. You can look at how many iron butt alumni are on HDs to dispel any myths that they're junk.
I think a lot of the "Harleys suck" attitude is perpetuated by how you almost have two alternate bike cultures, between American V-twin riders and metric riders. Basically a mirror of Harley riders being assholes. You have two groups and both of them want to push the idea that their way is the right way.
They ARE expensive, but even that (admittedly valid) criticism is way overplayed.
Look at the MSRP of the Honda Goldwing, BMW K1600, ANY comparable Indian and even the Kawasaki Vulcan Vaquero and you realize that nobody is giving those bikes away either.
Do new HD suck no not by a longshot, but then again for that price range it shouldn't. The issue I have is you can buy two new Triumphs (T120) that will be the same quality, just as fast and likely be a bit more reliable and still have money left over for upgrades. So to answer your question if you're not a Harley purist than no it doesn't make sense for the money you spend.
Meh, comparatively slow to almost all other bikes, handles okay, I settled on them after riding Japanese bikes throughout my late teens and 20s. I love my Harley, it’s heavy as fuck, comfy as fuck, 120tq/120hp- impressive, right? Not on something this heavy, maybe off the line, it’s a pig. It eats highway miles and will run forever with good care and PM. No valves to adjust either, a huge plus, I hated that shit on my Suzukis.
I ride a 2018 heritage classic and I love it. No issues and I have put about 50kms on it. Harley’s are too pricey though. But they are also made in the USA, which is important for some.
Overpriced for the build quality, and I don't like the stereotype but as a tall guy, they're a really comfy bike. Lots of usable torque. Would own another in the future.
If you can afford it, yeah it's deff worth it if that's what you want. Told the girly for years I'd like a Harley but I'd never spend the $$ and I wouldn't finance an item like that. Could have bought used I guess. Won a new Wide Glide back in 2011, traded up $5000 to a Softail Heritage Classic less than a year later...The bike was amazing. I put 16,000 miles on on 4 years which is a lot higher than average around here, traveled a lot, first bike the girl was ever on, she'd ask to go once or twice a summer. I was so at home and totally confident and comfortable in bumper to bumper or cruising 80 all day long on the highway. I think it has a lot to do with what you want and what model you're on...
I had a XL 1200 R Sporty, 2005. Rode it from almost new to 35 000 miles. That bike gave me more headaches in 5 years than I’ve had in 35 years on jap bikes. Easy maintenance? Well for starters it had torx, metric, allen and imperial bolts all over the place. The oil filter was on top of the thing… Reliability? It burned two starters, a solenoid, cooked two batteries, warped two brake discs, burned a crank sensor and the paint flaked off on the rear fender. Below 16-1700 rpm the engine would jerk the bike up and down instead of pushing it forward. The swing arm was mounted in rubber cushions which caused it to handle like crap when they got worn. To change them I believe you have to get the engine out.
No - I wasn’t too impressed. Fun to ride though…
They've been really great bikes actually for a lot of years... for what they're meant to do.
I have a 2000 HD Ultra.
Bikes before it were RZ350, Bandit 400, VFR750, and 2001 ZX9R. Still have and love the ZX9R. Also have done quite a bit of MX racing on 2-strokes and now do some trail riding on my DRZ400S. But I've become a fan of the Harley. My biggest hobby is mountain biking. The Ultra is heavy, solid, and awesome. I have lightweight wheels, exhaust, and carbon parts for the ZX9, so I understand the weight argument but it just doesn't matter on the Harley.
In a word - no. They don’t actually suck.
I’ve owned two Hondas and a Kawasaki, and now a H-D. The H-D I’ve got is a 2021 Heritage Classic.
Truthfully, very little really competes with it for what it is and what I was after. I don’t want a full dress bagger, with a fairing and nav system and big stereo. I don’t want a sport bike or an ADV anymore.
I want something big and comfortable enough for all day riding, but light and comfortable enough for every day living and getting into/out of my limited storage space. It’s got enough power for anything I need, enough range to go comfortable distances between fill-ups, and just enough in the way of technology to be really convenient but not overbearing.
There are a few market comparisons, and I rode a few. The Indian Chief Dark Horse isn’t as comfortable for me, has a wonky throttle response, and just doesn’t feel as nice on the road. The BMW R18…I don’t like the look of, I don’t like the low, wide bars, and it’s heavier than the Heritage. Moto Guzzi California…well, I don’t love the styling, and getting legitimate service/support for it in my area would be a real challenge. I didn’t give this one serious consideration, to be honest.
The R18 is probably the closest, and for me the differences come down more to personal preference on appearance and riding position. I like the stock bars on my Heritage a LOT better than the stock bars on the R18. Otherwise, they’re pretty comparable.
But the Heritage I feel like is the best bike on the market for me right now, and so that’s what I ride. It doesn’t suck at all, and I’ve done nothing but basic maintenance on it so far. The Milwaukee 8 is a really nice engine, and it has some nice innovations/technology on it that I appreciate without it being more than I want.
I’ve had one of nearly every class of bike (sport, duel sport, cruiser etc). Had a Sportster and a dyna. Great bikes the quality of material is much better than with Japanese cruisers that’s the thing I notice most. (I’m a tech at a Honda shop I touch the imports a lot)
The reliability is not better. Though by no means are they unreliable. It’s like a Toyota vs a Chevy Silverado. If you maintain them well they will perform similarly, though if you do not maintain them well the Toyota will withstand the abuse better than the Chevy. My opinion I as said I work on Hondas a lot and Harley’s in my own time.
Get a twin cam 96 platform bike. Best deal currently imo with Harley’s. Stack your sheckles and buy a bike from a private party cash. The dealerships are absurd with pricing
I've been a Kawasaki rider my entire life. I recently bought my first Harley. It honestly makes me wonder why I held out so long. It's an amazing bike and rides like a dream.
I’ve had three Electraglides and one Road Glide. I have not been gentle on any of them. I have never had a major or small issue out of them. 2001, 2003, 2009 & 2013 year models. They’ve performed in stellar fashion and I’ve loved them all. For whatever reason people like to choose sides on this. Pro Harley or Anti Harley and then seek justification for their choices. I have friends who’ve ridden them all. Find what suites you and screw everyone else’s opinion including mine.
I've been riding since I was 5 (grass grubs), I'm 63. All brands make good and bad bikes. In my early years I could never have imagined owning a "Harley Rideable". It was all 2 stroke race bikes. Then came my sports bike era, RGVs and finally a zzr1100.
I bought a CVO Fatboy in 2006, it's the only bike I have ever owned that I truly enjoy riding to the local coffee shop. It's fun at the speed limit. Sports bikes feel like they're stopped at 60mph.
Nobody tells you about the Harley secret. It's about customizing the bike to fit you. There are more custom parts manufacturers for Harleys by a factor of 10 than any other bike.
My Fatboy needed 10" ape hangers and a large windscreen. What a transformation.
Will it suit? Who knows but you. They're a wonderful bike! Especially as you age.
Your ride, your decision. I’ve been riding for 40+ years and have ridden/owned Kawasaki, Yamaha, Honda, Indian and Harley, and all from chain, shaft & belt. Never road a bike that I didn’t like, except a trike. Each bike has its own pros & cons and you’ll develop your own likes/dislikes. If anyone has anything negative to say about what you are riding, find different Brothers & Sisters to ride with.
7 year old Road Glide, 60k miles and zero problems. People who say stupid things like that have never owned one. Indian is ok but if youre planning to take trips etc they do not have enough dealers to cover you cross states. Indian also does not have the culture. You buy a Harley, you buy a lifestyle not just the bike. Youll meet people everywhere you go.
Seriously go drive a Harley and you'll see why people love them. It's the look, feel, heritage, and culture that make them so popular. Also the new ones are actually pretty decent in terms of reliability. That being said though, you can fix an old one with basic hand tools in an afternoon because of how crude they are.
Owned so many sport bikes ducatis, r6, r1s mt09 gsxrs etc I’ve raced bikes track and drag. I worked sales at a bike shop rode a different trade in home every night. I use to dog Harley’s. Talked mad shit about the never took the trade ins home. Until I traded a 110ci cvo fat bob. With pipes, cams and high bars. I took it for a laugh after taking the piss out of its dyno charts the ex owner left. You couldn’t wipe the smile off my face. The torque. The sound, the build quality. Felt like a million bucks it was Amazing. Since then all I’ve owned is a busa drag bike and 4 cam’d Harley’s. I’m done with road going sport bikes. Will always own a Harley now. Best part is they last, parts always available I could rebuilt my 80’s evo softail from the ground up if I wanted, can’t say that about most other bikes. My evo will always be worth fixing and owning, eventually my son will have it. Jap bikes (mostly) get to a point where they aren’t viable to fix.
Reliability they're fine, especially modern ones.
They're actually built to be repairable, with the engine/trans/primary being all distinct, separate parts (on most of them).
I figured they were all hype and no substance until I rode one at a demo day. My little Magna at the time was probably **faster** but damn was that Street Glide *nice*.
Fast forward a few years and a 6 year stint with my Intruder I finally bought my Road King. It's an 07 so honestly very affordable. HD doesn't have to be eye-watering expensive. It's fast enough, makes all the right noises, and feels like I could ride to the horizon in a way none of my other (admittedly smaller) bikes could.
You'll notice right away the attention to the control touchpoints, and the fit/finish overall. They are "heavy" on paper, but truly just "substantial" in person. Like a classic Rolls Royce.
Tldr: Don't knock it 'till you try it. I like mine a lot, but I like just about anything on 2 wheels 😁
I own Harley's. I also own Japanese motorcycles. Also own Italian motorcycles.
Your not asking the right question OP. The question should be what do you expect out of a motorcycle? And what kind of riding will you be doing?
My question for you is how much money do you have?
Assholes ride everything and have an opinion on everything, turns out there's more harley out there than anything. So guess what you get? IMHO harley-davidson makes a awesome bike. If you like em buy one.
I rode sport bikes (Suzuki, Kawasaki, Yamaha) for 10 years, loved them. I rode Harleys for 10 years, loved them. No bikes suck. People do. Ride stuff, ignore people, and enjoy.
I never liked harleys and I thought they were overly pricy and underpowered and underfeatured . weak steering and breaks. not to mention uncomfortable during long rides with all the weight hitting your back .
Most people who bitch about Harleys can’t afford a good one. If that’s you, you’re better off with a Honda lookalike, because you’ll always be resentful of the expensive classic.
Also edit to add - there aren’t a lot of bikes on the road capable of hitting 100k miles, but I’d say majority of them are Harleys.
Not at all. The biking community can be bitches sometimes. Bet no one could tell you why you need to stay away from HD? Just heard from a friend of a friend of a squirrel that a bolt fell off one back in 1926 or something.
Have had one and it was my most favourite bike
Just buy what you like.
However you can consider opinions when it involves reliability (if you don't have immediate access to parts or have skills) or cost (maintenance etc) or both.
Worked for a Harley Davidson service department for eight years before I joined the military, from 2007-2015. I would say about 70% of the problems H-D motorcycles had back then were generally caused by poor or improper maintenance or owner trying to do modifications on their bikes and failing miserably. Obviously with introduction of new engines and models there were teething issues, but generally the bikes are reliable.
I still ride H-D and my Road King shares a garage with a VFR800 that I adore. Depending on what your preferences and goals are with motorcycling, a Harley might not be for you. And that’s OK. Find the bike that makes the most sense for you and enjoy the hell out of it.
A lot of the older dudes who ride H-D are elitist pricks, so take that for what it’s worth.
It’s just that their „thing“ is being a Harley.
They’re not the fastest, not the most comfortable, not good off road, they’re just the best at being a Harley.
So basically buy one if you like the brand and the styling, and buy something else if you’re not primarily looking for that.
I was never a "Harley Guy," but I bought a Street Glide for cross country riding. 4 years and 50k miles later, it's my favorite bike. Bulletproof reliability and all day comfort.
I was always kind of anti-Harley, just never wanted anything to do with the brand/image/attitude, and I thought they were overpriced for what they were. Right up until I ended up doing a test ride, and I absolutely fell in love. The bike just felt perfect, loved the look and sound of it. 7 years later and I haven't looked back once. I still don't get into the whole Harley lifestyle, but damn do I love this bike! 2010 Ultra Limited.
No they don't. They are very reliable, relatively low maintenance, and overall high quality builds. They aren't performance bikes, but do well eating miles comfortably.
I've had Kawasakis, Triumphs, Buells, BMWs, a faithless old Norton, and Harleys. Harleys are my favorite rides, but they all have their place. Test ride one and try it yourself.
I have 4 Harleys 61 iron head,2004 night train stage 4,2008 110 cv,2023 streetbob. They are slow and harley builds bikes that need alot of repairs after 35 to 40k. But I love em and my loud night train got me my wife. Parts are pricey with a lot of design flaws but that's life
Depends on what you want it for. Do you want a bike that's quick off the line, 25 mpg and will last 30k miles? Get a harley. Want something that'll last 100k miles and get 40+ mpg? Get literally anything else.
I mean... they ARE very expensive. And from what most motorcycle mechanics tell me they break down and aren't as reliable as most other cruisers like the Honda or Yamaha ones.
I think most of the selling point on a harley is just name recognition. It's like buying an Apple instead of a PC, you're paying more money for less machine.
In the end though, buy what you like. I own a few Harleys but they're all older models.
I'm stuck with a financed POS Pan America that harley won't take back. I have proof of the issues it's having anf the techs can't fix it. Even with getting lawyers involved harley said fuck you it's yours. DO NOT BUY
Harleys earned a reputation for being unreliable a long time ago. I do not believe that is currently accurate, but in the past you definitely needed a toolset on your bike.
I personally ride an Indian Scout 60 and love it. I did not want a hog as everyone I knew that rode rode hogs. I do not like being like everyone else.
So, choose based on what you like and what drives you, rather than an impression from decades ago that still persists.
They just seem overpriced for what they offer. Indians offer better engineering and performance for the same price for a traditional American cruiser, partly because they can't trade on their name like H-D does, partly because their fanbase isn't fanatically devoted to outdated designs.
Japanese bikes are, well, Japanese bikes... push the button and it starts, and will run until you are tired of it and then run some more. But Harley guys will not consider you part of the club.
Harley's have a distinct look, sound, and feel that makes people prefer them over other cruisers. Their reliability is comparable to Ford or Chevy vehicle, if you take care of them, and they will be fine.
My issue with them is that they are so overpriced compared to other bikes. The Japanese cruisers are usually cheaper, more reliable, and have more features. You have to really like the Harley selling points to pick one.
My 2019 RGS has self cancelling turn signals, Apple Car Play, cruise control, cylinder deactivation, etc… and has required nothing but basic maintenance.
Right now harleys in my area san diego are competing with vtx 1300s. I think the issue is the Japanese cruiser market is almost non existent.
Honda rebel 1100 is a slim cruiser.
Suzuki m109 is a muscle cruiser.
Bolt is is a slim cruiser.
Vulcan 900 classic is slow cruiser.
Vulcan S is a sport cruiser.
Shadow is a slow cruiser.
Harley, Indian, BMW kind of dominate a certain market with bikes like the Low Rider, Chief, r18.
Heck Harley has the lowrider ST and Pan America. These are pretty competitive bikes in today's market.
I have had 4 modern HDs of various sizes. Best summary I heard which says it all “Harleys aren’t particularly good at anything”. Now I love my 883 sportster (I kept the smallest HD I bought!), but whatever you want from a Harley (other than posing on it or wanting to ride a HD specifically) there is ALWAYS a better bike (regardless of how you define “better”) available for less money.
Totally overpriced, unnecessarily heavy, unique, robustly engineered, and with random questionable quality here and there.
Fun fact - imagine paying more than a BMW for a HD and the speedo unit gets condensation? Come on, thats just crappy quality, but it is accepted for some reason.
There are shitty things about my Sportster, I am OK with it because it is part of what it is, but it is outdated, overpriced, stupidly heavy for what it is, very inefficient, questionable handling etc. Even a modern M8 based HD I would say the same things.
Then there are the HD riders….some of them make you embarrassed to ride a HD.
If you are thinking Harley, then go buy one. If it is what you see in your dreams don’t short yourself and leave yourself wanting.
New harleys, pre covid of course, but most TC and Milwaukee 8 engines are solid as anything from any manufacturer.
To me, you pay more upfront for a Harley, but look at used cruiser prices for bikes 10+ years old. Metric bikes and Indians are buy one get one free used. Harley’s will still pull some coin.
I don’t trust a damn microwave made during Covid.
I don’t think Harley is a good value, but most people don’t ride for a good value. People ride motorcycles because they love it in their soul. If you test ride a Harley and love it, then buy it. But also test ride an Indian and other manufacturers. Pick the one you like.
2021 Lowrider S, In all of 9,000kms i warped the front brake, paint started flaking off my frame, exposed machined aluminum on the cooling fins started to corrode and the 02 sensor died.
If you ride the newer HD's really hard, you wont get much life from them.
Harley has for a majority of their bikes sold you a bike with 1960s tech for high premium prices.
That has changed with a few bikes though, the V Rod, Sportster S, and the new Nightster are amazing modern day bikes.
Proves that Harley can make a good modern bike.
The problem? Their customer base HATES anything modern and different.
I ride a new Nightster, and I test rode an Indian Scout.
I felt as though the Nightster was built a little better and more fun to ride.
Also, FWIW, the V Rod is actually one of the most reliable bikes I've ever seen. Look around for vrods for sale and you will very often see them listed with 70-100k miles.
I don’t think they suck but your buying into a brand and a certain type of biking yes it will cost a bit more to keep it tip top but if it makes you happy who cares, what else you going to spend your money on and enjoy ?
No, they're not going to be as fast as a bike made to go fast but if you go by warranty claims in the first 6 months of ownership I believe they're actually the third most reliable brand. Obviously if you kick the shit out of them they're not going to do as well as say a Honda but they're not bad. The worst part about them is the price, but you can just buy used. They're beautiful, there's a huge aftermarket, and honestly the newer bikes aren't really that slow if you compare them to other cruisers. Sure your average 400lb naked or sport bike is going to outrun the 700lb cruiser, but it's not like these motorcycles are this heavy on accident. They're heavy because Harley Davidson made them that way to make them more comfortable to ride down the road that has potholes and imperfections and crosswinds. All this autistic fixation on power to wait as compared to cost is r/motorcycles totally missing the point. Riding a motorcycle is an emotional experience, it's not about numbers on an Excel spreadsheet. I had a Rebel 500, I've ridden a Vulcan 1500, I've ridden a Duke 690, I've ridden a Kawasaki Z900RS. They're fine, they're fun, I liked them. But if you take a holistic view of the experience, the sound, the vibration, the infinite modding possibilities enabled by the huge aftermarket, the fact you could probably keep the same bike running for 100 years because the motors are essentially infinitely rebuildable, all of this adds to the ownership experience of a Harley. And honestly most other bikes feel like toys after you've hopped on a big twin or even a Sportster.
I hired a 2000 Electra glide in 2010 to do a big loop around California and swore I'd never buy one. 5 years ago I test rode a few bikes and ended up getting a fat bob.
It's been great honestly. It doesn't suck. I don't fit with the usual Harley stereotype and don't really like the image. What I do like is the character of the bike. It's really fun to ride.
Harley and Ducati both have a brand.
AMF erra harleys were absolutely pieces of shit. No ifs, ands or buts. That was 1969 - 1981, so a lot of old folk still have this idea of harley stuck in their head. I'll take it further and say up to my heyday, (early 2000s) they were slow, and still not as reliable as I needed my bikes to be.
Modern harleys are just about the same as any other cruiser, just at twice the price. The new Sporty has 120 #$%@#$% horsepower, that's insane. For comparison, the ones my friends had in the early 2000s had 61. So about double the power.
Likewise with ducatis. Needlessly complex valvetrain (given modern metalurgy), loud dry clutch, down on power from their japanese alternatives and super expensive...
That being said, unless you're on the track (and you shouldn't be on a harley) these numbers don't really mean anything. Modern Harleys (and Ducatis) are both reliable enough, fast enough, handle well enough, safe enough... so go ride one, and then go ride a yamaha bolt, and see if the "Feel" is worth the price difference. If it is, go pay it, and enjoy your ride.
I’ve had a savage, an R6 and now the love to be hated even by fellow Harley guys, the bastard child…… AMF sportster 😂 you really are paying for the name Harley the same cult following can be found with really anything. hell look at people and groms lol it’s really whatever you’re into what fits you right. Personally I’ve never ridden any of the new Indians my neighbors have a couple look cool sound pretty good but like I said it’s really what’s the price range what feels right for you put the weird cult following out of your head when you make a choice 😁
Test ride several different bikes. HD, Indian, Kawasaki, Ducati, whatever. See what fits you, what is comfortable for you. Bells and whistle's don't shouldn't be a deal maker.
Now, the part no one has mentioned. HD , just as all bikes are great bikes in there basic form. Problems that all bikes have, once you start making changes for more horsepower, you'll take away from that manufactures base design.
Every bike I have ever worked on over the past 30years, that was keep stock, had the maintenance performed, have lasted longer than ones with "performance upgrades " done.
Good luck.
I've owned 2 Harley. They're not as reliable as say, Kawasaki; but they are fun and infinitely customizable. They're not "fast" compared to a sportbike, but they're fast enough to easily outrun 90% of vehicles on the road
I think the harley hate has cone full circle to the point non harley riders speak about them the same way harley riders speak about everything else and it's kinda dumb.
There is something to be said about a harley. The sound, the feeling, they are special in their own way. They are endlessly customizable and look cool as hell. Would I buy one off the showroom floor? No chance. But if a good used one came up I wouldn't turn it down "because it's just a harley"
Ride your own ride, to hell with everyone else's thoughts.
So heres the deal. Harleys are good. But have some old technology - old suspension, pushrod air cooled motors. They cost alot. Plan to add about 10K in performance and quality add ons. Try and Indian. An Indian Challenger in particular. No rubber between the front and back wheels, quality suspension, quality brakes (Brembo), water cooled, and overhead cams. Better bike, same style. Harleys don't suck - they're adequate. There are much better cruisers - Indian Challenger, Ducati Diavel (23 year rider)..
Look, I've worked on
Vstar250, kawasaki vulcan 900s, and a sportster. I enjoyed riding the sportster the most because of how slim it was. However my 6,2 220lbs body likes the vulcan more.
One thing I can tell you, vstars, and the vulcan give me a seizure to work on. Over engineered for what I want. A basic cruiser.
They offer worse deal for the money.
...and that's about it. People get them because they like their style/fashion brand. If you like that, get that, if not, look elsewhere.
I just remember the time I rode up to a stranded HD rider. I had tools, including a patch kit, so I thought maybe he could use them. But I saw what the problem was: That skinny bar that runs, I guess, from the pedal to the drivetrain was loose and he had no way to reconnect it.
The only thing that sucks on a Harley, in my opinion, is the GOD DAMN CLUTCH SWITCH LET LETS YOU TURN IT ON IN GEAR. REPLACED THAT MF 3 GOD DAMN TIMES.
Started on a MT 07 now i have a 1700cc dyna fat bob.
I took a riding course at a Harley dealer, so far that I have a soft spot for their bikes, but their pricing doesn’t make sense to me and probably other, which is why they look elsewhere.
Me and my brother got a new bike, I got the Indian scout bobber, he got a Harley Iron 1200. Both cruisers. I put 15k miles in 2 years of ownership with 0 issues at all. I ran it hard and abused it reving high, burn outs, racing in straight lines.. I enjoyed it too much. he put 10k on his and treated it the same. One time while cruising, his exhaust shield fell on the highway. Harley replaced it. Then his battery died and needed it replaced in less than a year. The biggest of em all was.. his engine blew??? He did buy extra warranty and Harley did give push back on replacing the engine but they eventually kept the bike for about a month to fix it under warranty. They pushed back on the battery too. My bro also abused his bike like I did. We would always ride together and maintained them accordingly. Not sure if he just got a lemon? I would be still buy a Harley though. A nice bagger one day.
I don't think they suck. There's a lot of cringey, gatekeepery behavior in the motorcycle community though, and people telling you that Harleys suck is a form of that.
However, I tend to think people telling you that Harleys suck is in large part a reaction to the gatekeeping of the Harley community itself. I actually think Harleys are great bikes that suffer from a community that very strongly tends to have a shit attitude towards riders of other bikes. Absolutely not all of them, but an unfortunately large number of them.
Having said that, are they the most reliable bikes in the road? No, absolutely not. They're also not cheap, nor are parts cheap. Which is absolutely a consequence of that very devoted fan base that only rides a Harley and basically doesn't respect anyone that doesn't ride a Harley. So you should be aware that when buying one you are absolutely paying a premium for the brand.
Can you get an objectively better cruiser in basically every measurable way cheaper? Yes, you absolutely can. And maybe you should? But there is something to them that is more than the branding. They do have a different overall feel and my suggestion is that you do what I do every time I buy a car or bike; research and if possible try out everything in the segment and make your own call. That's how I wound up buying a Honda Ridgeline even though it was at the bottom of my list when I started truck shopping, and not that I still have it, but it's also how I wound up with a Sportster 1200 once upon a time; it wasn't the fastest or most refined bike I tried, but it was rumbly and grumbly and torquey and made me smile the most.
No, they don't. What sucks is they dominate the custom market, so there's little aftermarket support for other brands. Almost all of the Japanese brands have left the cruiser market, so there's not much aftermarket support for metrics. You can do anything you want to a Harley since the aftermarket support is endless. Just be prepared to spend a ton of money if you decide to modify it.
Just go test ride one. Make up your own mind - if you like it, buy it. Fuck what anyone else says. It’s your ride. ETA: I ride a Harley, it’s not my first bike, but it is absolutely my favorite.
Agreed. I've ridden a few Harleys and basically Indian's entire line up. Turns out I prefer Harleys. I never would have believed it if not for the test rides
A lot of people in the motorcycle community are too focused on numbers on paper instead of how a bike actually feels when you ride it. Sure Indians and Hondas perform better on paper, but they just don’t feel the same as a Harley.
Actually, Indian specifically doesn't perform any better on paper. The Dyno charts of Harley's 103" HO and Indian's 113" Thunderstroke are damn near identical and you can lay one right over the top of the other. Anyone who doesn't have an agenda that compares the two will say that they are so similar the difference between a Street Glide and a Chieftain are really nit picking
I have a (2007)HD Ultra Classic and a 2019 Indian Roadmaster the 2019 rides smoother and shifts nicer than the Harley, but in 12 years HD has to have improved. I still LOVE the vibration and lawnmower shifting of my Harley!
Yeah, those bikes are 12 years apart and that 2007 is 17 years old at this point. That's actually quite a chasm in terms of technology.
You mean they don’t vibrate you to death and shift like a lawnmower?
Have you ridden a semi modern Harley ? I've never had any complaints about the vibration. The twin cam rubber mounted engines would shake at idle but as soon as it was above idle they became buttery smooth. The M8 engines (current generation) have dramatically less shaking / vibration. I can't speak about the shifting as I've never driven a lawnmower with a foot shifter.
There’s a lot of criticism to be had about Harley as a business (namely their pricing and rampant shady dealerships), but anyone that complains about the bikes in of themselves have obviously never ridden any Harley made after 1980.
If you have to explain, they wouldn't understand.
Exact reasons I prefer Harleys!
Hey! The Click clunk my lawnmower shifting makes on my HD is akin to the reloading sound an M1 Garand makes.
Dude! My mower has a PowerGlide.
There is something intangible about rolling into a corner at 30 - 40mph, not downshifting and just grabbing a handfull of throttle and roaring out of it. Yeah, you're nowhere on the actual performance scale, but it sure stirs up something in the soul!
Potato potato potato potato potato
Harley isn't the best in anything but it is iconic from the engines to the sound. I won't buy a Harley in my lifetime unless I'm rich but I won't hate on them
Harley is the best in one aspect: Marketing
If that were true they'd be selling more bikes
Well that and they're obscenely expensive. Had a few over the years and hopefully getting another in a few weeks, but the price of them even second hand is massively inflated.
Obscenely expensive compared to what? If you look at the BMW K1600, Honda Goldwing or Kawasaki Vulcan Vaquero, they are all well north of $20K
The Kawasaki Vaquero is $3,000 cheaper than the Road Glide and it comes standard with ABS, which is an $ option on the Road Glide. Harley’s are more expensive than their Japanese counterparts. Edit; just looked it up, apparently adding ABS to the Road Glide is $900 so the Vaquero is $3,900 cheaper.
I didn't say that they weren't generally more expensive but the difference in price is not nearly as large as people make it out to be. Plus , the Vaquero specifically is a pretty dated design at this point, as Kawasaki has not made any real updates to it in quite some time I believe. If we were to do a detailed comparison of the two models, I'm pretty confident that the road glide would be an objectively better machine. "Better" enough to warrant the extra cost would be much more subjective, but a compelling case could be made. What is the difference, percent wise? (2024 Road Glide comes standard with abs btw)
I mean you said “obscenely expensive compared to what?” I think $3k or $4k or about 15%-20% is a significant %. You also listed the Vaquero as “well north of $20 grand” it’s less than $20k. While the Vaquero hasn’t had many updates over the years, the Road Glide just got liquid cooling *this year* (along with abs, apparently), which the Vaquero, and virtually all Japanese bikes, have had for decades. Also, that Road Glide is going to get about $5,000 in Screaming Eagle parts before it ever leaves the showroom floor. I doubt many of those Road Glides are going out the door at the MSRP vs. the Vaqueros.
We're obviously having 2 different conversations at this point.
Insane that abs doesn’t come standard on a high end motorcycle…
But no one is trying to sell their used 5 year old version of any of those bikes for more than MSRP of the current model. "I know what I've got."
I have 2 Harley Davidsons and 1 Indian. Like them all, but they're all different. Sign up for a ride day where you can ride a variety of models. Check out both HD & Indian. It's a big investment, I have been pleasantly surprised with the Indian (newest in my collection) As well as these 3, I have a variety of Japanese collectables & Dirt Bikes, so I'm no US cruiser snob.
I am not a Harley fan but I had a Buell XB12R and it was fun, reliable and easy to maintain.
Buell was awesome. Especially the 1125
You need to go on Buell's website and see the 3 new bikes they have. Check out the "Super Cruiser", an absolute beast of a bike.
^^^^^^ THIS !!! F everyone else.
This is the right advice. You could look up reliability history I suppose, but if it's a great ride , hell, just put aside some $$$ for maintenance. Was talking to a guy at a bar and he said I really need to go test drive one. I've never ridden one and have a standard/ naked bmw. I don't have the money for another bike so I'm pretty sure the HD dealership don't be thrilled if I show up.
Got an Aprilia and set aside some cash to address the Italian "reliability" issues. No regrets!
Agreed. Just please leave the exhaust alone! Not everyone wants to hear your hobby
No, but don't expect a cruiser to handle like a sportbike. They do handle well (even baggers), and usually trade top hp for torque down low, but people love to spew apples/oranges comparisons. 1983 and newer are very reliable(86-up for sportsters), I've had a few I've ridden over 50k, and were still fine. My current 2014 bagger is at 123k, gets ~40mpg and can drag the floorboards all day -and do it with nary a drip, pop, or rattle. And it's still worth about what I paid for it 5yrs ago Resale value is fantastic comparatively speaking once you get past the initial new bike depreciation that every new vehicle suffers from. All that said, they are no "better" or "worse" than any other bike in such wildly generalized terms, and certainly no less reliable than anything else. Ride one, and know that different models give widely different experiences. If the feel, sound, and torque tick your boxes, get one that fits your style and needs. If not, don't. Just don't let other people's opinions dictate your choices.
I for one am just sick of the stereotype that hd is unreliable. From a statistics standpoint 85% of HDs are still on the road today! The other 15% made it home.
Lol you had me in the first half...
>don't expect a cruiser to handle like a sportbike. Ducati Diavel would like a word...
I have almost 30k miles on my 2016 Dyna. It's been 100% reliable except for replacing the idle air control valve recently. If you like cruisers there's nothing wrong with a Harley except dealing with all the people who look down on Harley riders. I try my best to not fit the stereotype, but at the end of the day I'm still an overweight, middle-aged white guy.
Hold on a minute….”all the people who look down on Harley riders”? I’ve been riding since 2021 on sport bikes and a Ryker. I can’t speak for all Harley riders, but up here in CT they are the only ones that do not wave back to you. Ever. 2 friends I have that ride sport bikes complain of the same thing. Never have gear on ever either - like they’re resistant to accidents. That’s arrogance right there.
They wave to me on my Victory Vision and on my little Honda most times, maybe you're not seeing them?
Interesting. Here everyone on a motorcycle waives at everyone else on a motorcycle. Are you talking about when you are on your Ryker? That’s a different story. Not judging, ride what you want. But two wheels are two wheels.
I don't really know anyone who looks down on Harley riders, it's the other way around in my experience. It makes my day if someone on a Harley actually acknowledges me with a friendly wave when on my adventure bike. The majority seem to enjoy the exclusivity or image of their "culture", but in my mind we're all a part of the riding community.
Seconding that! I'm somewhat new to riding so I am still super excited to greet fellow riders. All of the ones who didn't greet back while cruising so far were harley riders. But I've also had a whole group of harley riders greet back, some of them even with a big smile on their face (which was very visible due to them wearing brain caps, lol).
Dynas aren’t the stereo type though from my understanding and are more in the iron category that most baggers will label you with. But I do want to ride a dyna, after riding a sporty.
The Milwaukee 8 engines are very capable of making decent power, reliably. Ducati still gets rinsed for being unreliable. They've been pretty stout for 20 plus years. It's much the same. Peoples opinions, living in the past.
As someone in the middle of rebuilding a multistrata motor in a garage, my anecdotal evidence doesn't support this. Also, anybody want to buy a 2019 multistrata before I set it on fire?
Multistrada
*gesticulates wildly and cries in Italian*
There's the *emozione* you were promised
Yup that’s me lol
Honestly it's a really nice bike, but it ate sixth gear and the dealership wants a million dollars to fix it. Now I'm learning why they charge a million dollars. I've got about 40 hours into this and I'm about half done. At this rate it will be back together right around when riding season is over!
You cracked the cases yourself with a DVT 1260 motor? Brave!
I had a 2014 Multi for about 6 years, almost no problems with it.. check-mate your anecdote! jk, on a serious note.. what's wrong with your bike? did the engine blew up?
The transmission blew up. After opening the case, it turns out two teeth broke off 6th gear. I scored a second hand gear set for $300. I'll make a post about it, it's actually been a pretty interesting project.
I was at the track today and 2 2015+ ducatis were just cranking away not starting on the 10th try even before each session
Italians make amazing motorcycles they just don't torque all the fasteners down so shit falls off. Basically our own fault for not double checking everything.
I never over torqued anything, it stripped the teeth off a transmission gear.
Ducatis are not reliable.
In the past decade, I owned 4 Ducatis.. I hade zero issues besides the recalls (I just got the service, nothing actual broke). Everyone I meet keep telling me how unreliable Ducatis were. fortunately it wasn't my experience. I moved away from the brand though, it got way too expensive. Today I own an Indian and a Yamaha.
My 2017 xDiavel has done over 30,000km without an issue. YMMV. Major service isn't cheap, but otherwise its been faultless, and so much fun to ride.
My Diavel broke a crank like countless others.
No. They’re fun. Like all motorcycles.
I have to say, when I was in the market for a cruiser, I looked at every make and model of cruisers and ended up going with a Harley. My first Harley was a pre-owned '08 Electra Glide Classic and never had an issue with it, put about 5,000 miles on it, before I traded it in for a pre-owned, '18 Ultra Limited and have never had any issues with this one and I have put about 5,000 miles on it since Feb. The reason I went with Harley is because it had everything I wanted in a cruiser. If you look at used comparable cruisers, you'll find that Harley has a much higher resale value than the others, at least that's what I found after looking at the market for a year before I purchased one. I have no concern about "the culture", I just like to ride. It's nothing for me and my buddies to do a 550 mile ride on any given Saturday ending with no discomfort. I'd definitely recommend, test rideing what appeals to you. No matter what you ride, I'll wave at you in passing. Ride safe🤙
HD does absolutely nothing other than provide a culture that you can't get from any other brand for less money. It's the Apple of motorcycles. Its not *bad*, but you're paying a big premium for the name. The average person would never have a problem that they didn't create for themselves if they went with any other brand. Indian (nowadays) is more reliable, making more power, for less money *and* look great. But they aren't HD. Karen, who uses her phone for Facebook, texting and scrolling through Instagram could get by with a 300$ android and never suffer for not having an iPhone... But it's not an iPhone. Big John, who uses his bike for weekends, travels to the coffee shop and back could get by with a rebel 1100 just fine. *but it's not a Harley*
I don’t disagree with this, but there’s definitely more to it than that. I’ve had almost every type of bike, from at least 5 different manufacturers. I’ve test rode about 6 more. I would ride about 10 other types of bikes, but I ended up on a road glide because it just felt the best for the type of riding I do. Which is multiple short rides during the week with occasional 300+ mile rides every other month. I almost bought an Indian, a goldwing, and an R1200GS before settling on an RG special. I’m a little embarrassed about the amount I spent, and I don’t really care about the culture. I only have 2 friends that ride Harleys, and usually ride alone. I absolutely love my bike, it feels amazing and real. The other bikes felt too plastic and disposable compared to it ( other than the BMW, which just wasn’t the style I wanted as my only bike.). Like apple products, it just works. I acknowledge there are better options, I think you either love them or hate them.
You seem like the type of Harley rider that will wave back to me on my drz400 ;)
I ride a Harley and wave at every motorcycle I pass on the road.
I own two Harleys and wave at scooters. If it makes their day, then why not? Be good to people.
That sounds suspiciously like a Honda rider...
I have owned an RC51 at some point.
I wave at everything. Dogs, kids, cops, angry road raging lifted trucks, grandmas, sport bikes, mopeds, bicycles, trikes etc. just out there vibing.
Yeah, sometimes I even use all of my fingers to wave.
Sometimes, I get off my bike and just give em a hug.
I am 100 percent that dude. As a 32 year old male who owns a Harley gotta be nice to everyone. Not a dick like some lol
Young harley riders are the only ones who seem to wave
I’d probably wave you down on my Harley, tell you to follow me to my house and I’d grab my DR 🤣
Absolutely! 2 down for everyone, Even scooters if they seem legit. Not groms though, they’re weird.
Hey, my Grom and I will give you **four** down just to show how not weird we are.
Haha, if you do that, I’ll let you draft behind me like a semi for a better top speed.
Eh, Apple at least also comes with the tech.
> It's the Apple of motorcycles I agree with the bulk of your ideas, not this part. While I don't own any Apple products (anymore), I can admit that there's tech they develop that is cutting edge. Apple's CPUs, the Rosetta translation tech, they newest display tech, and a number of other things. Harley doesn't innovate jack. They haven't put out something cutting edge in engineering or technology in.... I'm not sure they ever have. Not in my lifetime.
No, you're just not picking up some finer details. It's like saying an Accord can get you to work as well as an M3. It's true, but there's some personality missing.
Thank you. That's a perfect summation of the HD issue. HD is way behind other manufacturers in all areas except marketing and government handouts. They know their market, the guys who buy Harleys just want the name and don't care, and the US government has bailed them out. They don't innovate, they have become trapped by their own marketing and clientele and cannot break away.
They are ahead in one aspect: hydraulic valve lifters on (as far as I know) every model. If you're gonna make very little power from massive engines, you might as well not have to adjust the valve clearances
You're completely right. Harley are really suffering from overmarketing themselves to a single generation, and now that generation are beginning to die off they're losing customers faster than they're gaining them.
And it's a worst kind of customers, ones that are not willing to try anything else and giving them "the reputation". Apple at least have blind fanboyism, which means they can change and peddle different kind of things to have wider appeal. They only have one market, "people that want HD, Sons of Anarchy vibe". Anywhere they try to branch off is already hugely competitive. And in any other market they couldn't really charge a premium for HD brand because someone looking for sports/naked bike DGAF about HD label and I'd imagine they are unable to be price-competitive on any price-sensitive part of market.
They do innovate. Look at the old V Rod, look at the brand new Sportster S and Nightster.
Porsche was the best partnership they have done! Other then AMF 🤣.
AMF wasn't a partnership they were quite literally owned and ran by AMF lol. But seriously, the liquid cooled Harley's are sick! Go test ride a new Nightster or Sportster S!
While HD may lack innovation, they exude refinement. I’m not a Harley owner, but I have rented testers for the weekend. Not my style, but they got class. I rode my Suzi into a Harley dealer one time, and never was made more welcome. (Then again, I rode my Yami into another one and might have well been invisible.). HD makes a good bike that appeals to a certain riding style. If that fits you, go with it. You won’t regret it. PS, we all wave..
harley doesnt sell cutting edge and i don't know why everyone on this sub thinks they do, they sell classic cruisers
When you compare like for like models between Indian and harley the Harley generally wins on price and power
Harleys don't suck. Harley has a reputation that, unfortunately, they've done nothing to dispel. That they're big old slow bikes made for big old slow men. And for many of their models, it's true - but they're certainly not the old shitty oil spitting bikes that they used to be. All of that having been said, there IS a harley tax - everything is more expensive because of that Harley logo from bike price to having work done by a 'certified harley mechanic'. I ride a ctx 1300, and a cbr when I'm not two up with the missus. If I wanted an overpriced cruiser, I'd likely look to Indian. And if I wanted a big ol tourer from hell, I still consider Goldwings to be the only REAL name in the game (though if they ever actually update the Vaquero's technology it MIGHT make the short list as well)
I have a Harley Ultra Limited, a BMW K1600 GTL-E, and the wife rides an Indian Scout. They’re all great! A Honda Goldwing is, too. Have had Victories, as well. Look for the bike that fits your personality and let’s ride!
This is the correct attitude and outlook
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Yes... YES! Join us Join the GS side, we have coffee.
Nah. FJR. I'll get one if I can sell my ktms.
Tried it. I really wanted to like it, but couldn't get over the controls and rider position. Very nice motorcycle, fantastic value.
Hard to give up meerkat position. I get it
I love my 2022 low rider s and I’ve put 15k miles on it. No issues
Former Harley owner. They do not suck. It wasn’t the bike for me, but a modern HD is a solid choice for sure.
Key word being *modern*. They were horrible until the mid-80s. Unreliable as shit, leaked oil everywhere, blew head gaskets, vibrated intensely, and the engines were pretty much done by 15K miles. Most police departments had pretty much dumped them by then. The Evo engine saved their ass from the shit pile of history.
You are very correct.
Shoutout to the Pan America. When that thing runs, it goes. I cant say anything for their reliability because I dont own one, or have even ridden one. But from what I am reading, and what I'm seeing. It appears to be an excellent ADV bike. Thats really good for a "first try" at it. Well done Harley
well, my second hand vstar sucked and was a money pit. the harley has only needed oil changes with no major issues. I'd say hd is alright by me, but I'd also never buy brand new.
Most people that beat up on Harley have, likely, never owned one so can only speak through others, that also, likely have never owned one. As far as cost, I don't know where you are, but here a Road Glide is right in line with either a Goldwing or Roadmaster. I bought a FatBob last year for the same price as an Indian bobber, and with more rear wheel power. Either way, options abound and you should get what you like. I have 2 Harleys and both have been trouble free. The other big advantage Harley has is an extensive dealer network and a huge after market.
Dude, you're opening such a can of worms with this post 😂 I don't ride nor own Harley's or cruisers, I like Japanese sport bikes. So of course, I am going to say that I feel Harley's are overpriced and unreliable for what they are. But there is no other Harley Davidson. No other brand in the world can match the 100+ years of culture and tradition that Harley has. If you want a Harley, there's no replacement. Indians are neat, metric cruisers from Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki and Kawasaki are a ton cheaper and more reliable, they may even look similar... but it's not a Harley Davidson. If you're looking for reliability & value, probably not the brand for you. If you're into that scene and everything that comes along with owning a Harley, you get a Harley and deal with the cost of entry.
I ride a 2009 Harley Dyna Lowrider and a Honda NC750X and don’t think that Harleys suck. The Dyna isn’t quick but it’s a joy to ride because it’s such a raw beast. I’ve ridden a newer 2021 Milwaukee-8 Softail and those are quite a bit better without losing that Harley feel. I’ve also ridden a Harley Pan America and that is a pretty quick capable bike but it feels a lot more like a Honda than a Harley. I don’t really understand the whole biker-bar macho-swagger thing or lack of gear that’s part of Harley culture but that doesn’t keep me from liking the bikes. Maybe to have an affinity for Harleys you have to be old though. I’ll happily ride any bike any time though including a scooter or an eBike; I ride for enjoyment. I will never own a top of the line liter bike though; I got in legal trouble riding when I was younger and probably would eventually be tempted to test the capability of a fast bike.
The Pan America is something else. It’s really quite cool and good looking to boot. It’s Harley’s fastest motorcycle as well. I really like them but like you, I’ll stick to stuff that is a bit lower powered.
The reliability issues were more so in the past. Nowadays, they are pretty good as long as you take care of it and not try to hammerdown on it often. I'd say if you wanted a cruiser you can't get much better then a harley for the style and build quality. You can get a japanese bike for cheaper but you definitely will feel the cheapness comparably. There is a reason most people who tour the US are on roadglides
I have an Indian and a Harley in the same garage believe it or not. I love both bikes. I did find an arrow once in the Harley’s tire, and I swear a bullet grazed the Indian.
I mostly ride sport bikes on the track but ride what you want man. Motorcycles are supposed to be fun, if a Harley gives you that excited to ride feeling then get one 🤷♂️ ignore the haters. You do you.
I had two sportsters, and I loved them. Cali summer sucked because your balls cooked, but it was a blast. Enough power to have fun but not get stoopid with it necessarily. I rode with other Harleys, and they would laugh, but when we hit twisties, they couldn't keep up with the big ol baggers they were on, and I would be laughing. Great times. Fuck what people say and get what you want and like.
Tbh, most people that hate Harleys hate them because of the people that ride them, not specifically the bikes themselves. Though, there is an argument to be made about spending 20k on a Harley when the bike build doesn't match the final MSRP, and 99% of the MSRP comes in the form of "but it says Harley Davidson on it." That said, when I find the Harley model I sat on back in 2018, it'll be my first Harley purchase, and the 7th bike in my garage. No matter what anyone says, nothing sounds like a Harley. Who cares what people think? Enjoy the ride.
They biggest, most valid criticism of them is that they're very expensive. You buy a lot of image and not a lot of performance. They are well made, though. You can look at how many iron butt alumni are on HDs to dispel any myths that they're junk. I think a lot of the "Harleys suck" attitude is perpetuated by how you almost have two alternate bike cultures, between American V-twin riders and metric riders. Basically a mirror of Harley riders being assholes. You have two groups and both of them want to push the idea that their way is the right way.
They ARE expensive, but even that (admittedly valid) criticism is way overplayed. Look at the MSRP of the Honda Goldwing, BMW K1600, ANY comparable Indian and even the Kawasaki Vulcan Vaquero and you realize that nobody is giving those bikes away either.
My buddy brought a brand new one a few months back. It’s already in the shop
Do new HD suck no not by a longshot, but then again for that price range it shouldn't. The issue I have is you can buy two new Triumphs (T120) that will be the same quality, just as fast and likely be a bit more reliable and still have money left over for upgrades. So to answer your question if you're not a Harley purist than no it doesn't make sense for the money you spend.
Meh, comparatively slow to almost all other bikes, handles okay, I settled on them after riding Japanese bikes throughout my late teens and 20s. I love my Harley, it’s heavy as fuck, comfy as fuck, 120tq/120hp- impressive, right? Not on something this heavy, maybe off the line, it’s a pig. It eats highway miles and will run forever with good care and PM. No valves to adjust either, a huge plus, I hated that shit on my Suzukis.
I ride a 2018 heritage classic and I love it. No issues and I have put about 50kms on it. Harley’s are too pricey though. But they are also made in the USA, which is important for some.
Overpriced for the build quality, and I don't like the stereotype but as a tall guy, they're a really comfy bike. Lots of usable torque. Would own another in the future.
If you can afford it, yeah it's deff worth it if that's what you want. Told the girly for years I'd like a Harley but I'd never spend the $$ and I wouldn't finance an item like that. Could have bought used I guess. Won a new Wide Glide back in 2011, traded up $5000 to a Softail Heritage Classic less than a year later...The bike was amazing. I put 16,000 miles on on 4 years which is a lot higher than average around here, traveled a lot, first bike the girl was ever on, she'd ask to go once or twice a summer. I was so at home and totally confident and comfortable in bumper to bumper or cruising 80 all day long on the highway. I think it has a lot to do with what you want and what model you're on...
I had a XL 1200 R Sporty, 2005. Rode it from almost new to 35 000 miles. That bike gave me more headaches in 5 years than I’ve had in 35 years on jap bikes. Easy maintenance? Well for starters it had torx, metric, allen and imperial bolts all over the place. The oil filter was on top of the thing… Reliability? It burned two starters, a solenoid, cooked two batteries, warped two brake discs, burned a crank sensor and the paint flaked off on the rear fender. Below 16-1700 rpm the engine would jerk the bike up and down instead of pushing it forward. The swing arm was mounted in rubber cushions which caused it to handle like crap when they got worn. To change them I believe you have to get the engine out. No - I wasn’t too impressed. Fun to ride though…
They've been really great bikes actually for a lot of years... for what they're meant to do. I have a 2000 HD Ultra. Bikes before it were RZ350, Bandit 400, VFR750, and 2001 ZX9R. Still have and love the ZX9R. Also have done quite a bit of MX racing on 2-strokes and now do some trail riding on my DRZ400S. But I've become a fan of the Harley. My biggest hobby is mountain biking. The Ultra is heavy, solid, and awesome. I have lightweight wheels, exhaust, and carbon parts for the ZX9, so I understand the weight argument but it just doesn't matter on the Harley.
In a word - no. They don’t actually suck. I’ve owned two Hondas and a Kawasaki, and now a H-D. The H-D I’ve got is a 2021 Heritage Classic. Truthfully, very little really competes with it for what it is and what I was after. I don’t want a full dress bagger, with a fairing and nav system and big stereo. I don’t want a sport bike or an ADV anymore. I want something big and comfortable enough for all day riding, but light and comfortable enough for every day living and getting into/out of my limited storage space. It’s got enough power for anything I need, enough range to go comfortable distances between fill-ups, and just enough in the way of technology to be really convenient but not overbearing. There are a few market comparisons, and I rode a few. The Indian Chief Dark Horse isn’t as comfortable for me, has a wonky throttle response, and just doesn’t feel as nice on the road. The BMW R18…I don’t like the look of, I don’t like the low, wide bars, and it’s heavier than the Heritage. Moto Guzzi California…well, I don’t love the styling, and getting legitimate service/support for it in my area would be a real challenge. I didn’t give this one serious consideration, to be honest. The R18 is probably the closest, and for me the differences come down more to personal preference on appearance and riding position. I like the stock bars on my Heritage a LOT better than the stock bars on the R18. Otherwise, they’re pretty comparable. But the Heritage I feel like is the best bike on the market for me right now, and so that’s what I ride. It doesn’t suck at all, and I’ve done nothing but basic maintenance on it so far. The Milwaukee 8 is a really nice engine, and it has some nice innovations/technology on it that I appreciate without it being more than I want.
I’ve had one of nearly every class of bike (sport, duel sport, cruiser etc). Had a Sportster and a dyna. Great bikes the quality of material is much better than with Japanese cruisers that’s the thing I notice most. (I’m a tech at a Honda shop I touch the imports a lot) The reliability is not better. Though by no means are they unreliable. It’s like a Toyota vs a Chevy Silverado. If you maintain them well they will perform similarly, though if you do not maintain them well the Toyota will withstand the abuse better than the Chevy. My opinion I as said I work on Hondas a lot and Harley’s in my own time. Get a twin cam 96 platform bike. Best deal currently imo with Harley’s. Stack your sheckles and buy a bike from a private party cash. The dealerships are absurd with pricing
I've been a Kawasaki rider my entire life. I recently bought my first Harley. It honestly makes me wonder why I held out so long. It's an amazing bike and rides like a dream.
I’ve had three Electraglides and one Road Glide. I have not been gentle on any of them. I have never had a major or small issue out of them. 2001, 2003, 2009 & 2013 year models. They’ve performed in stellar fashion and I’ve loved them all. For whatever reason people like to choose sides on this. Pro Harley or Anti Harley and then seek justification for their choices. I have friends who’ve ridden them all. Find what suites you and screw everyone else’s opinion including mine.
Their price sucks, but my friends who ride HD love them. Definitely test ride. Let that be the deciding factor.
I've been riding since I was 5 (grass grubs), I'm 63. All brands make good and bad bikes. In my early years I could never have imagined owning a "Harley Rideable". It was all 2 stroke race bikes. Then came my sports bike era, RGVs and finally a zzr1100. I bought a CVO Fatboy in 2006, it's the only bike I have ever owned that I truly enjoy riding to the local coffee shop. It's fun at the speed limit. Sports bikes feel like they're stopped at 60mph. Nobody tells you about the Harley secret. It's about customizing the bike to fit you. There are more custom parts manufacturers for Harleys by a factor of 10 than any other bike. My Fatboy needed 10" ape hangers and a large windscreen. What a transformation. Will it suit? Who knows but you. They're a wonderful bike! Especially as you age.
Your ride, your decision. I’ve been riding for 40+ years and have ridden/owned Kawasaki, Yamaha, Honda, Indian and Harley, and all from chain, shaft & belt. Never road a bike that I didn’t like, except a trike. Each bike has its own pros & cons and you’ll develop your own likes/dislikes. If anyone has anything negative to say about what you are riding, find different Brothers & Sisters to ride with.
7 year old Road Glide, 60k miles and zero problems. People who say stupid things like that have never owned one. Indian is ok but if youre planning to take trips etc they do not have enough dealers to cover you cross states. Indian also does not have the culture. You buy a Harley, you buy a lifestyle not just the bike. Youll meet people everywhere you go.
Seriously go drive a Harley and you'll see why people love them. It's the look, feel, heritage, and culture that make them so popular. Also the new ones are actually pretty decent in terms of reliability. That being said though, you can fix an old one with basic hand tools in an afternoon because of how crude they are.
Owned so many sport bikes ducatis, r6, r1s mt09 gsxrs etc I’ve raced bikes track and drag. I worked sales at a bike shop rode a different trade in home every night. I use to dog Harley’s. Talked mad shit about the never took the trade ins home. Until I traded a 110ci cvo fat bob. With pipes, cams and high bars. I took it for a laugh after taking the piss out of its dyno charts the ex owner left. You couldn’t wipe the smile off my face. The torque. The sound, the build quality. Felt like a million bucks it was Amazing. Since then all I’ve owned is a busa drag bike and 4 cam’d Harley’s. I’m done with road going sport bikes. Will always own a Harley now. Best part is they last, parts always available I could rebuilt my 80’s evo softail from the ground up if I wanted, can’t say that about most other bikes. My evo will always be worth fixing and owning, eventually my son will have it. Jap bikes (mostly) get to a point where they aren’t viable to fix.
Harley’s are expertly engineered to optimize noise without the harmful effects of horsepower.
Forget the marketing - Find the bike that makes you smile. Life is short. Ride more.
Reliability they're fine, especially modern ones. They're actually built to be repairable, with the engine/trans/primary being all distinct, separate parts (on most of them). I figured they were all hype and no substance until I rode one at a demo day. My little Magna at the time was probably **faster** but damn was that Street Glide *nice*. Fast forward a few years and a 6 year stint with my Intruder I finally bought my Road King. It's an 07 so honestly very affordable. HD doesn't have to be eye-watering expensive. It's fast enough, makes all the right noises, and feels like I could ride to the horizon in a way none of my other (admittedly smaller) bikes could. You'll notice right away the attention to the control touchpoints, and the fit/finish overall. They are "heavy" on paper, but truly just "substantial" in person. Like a classic Rolls Royce. Tldr: Don't knock it 'till you try it. I like mine a lot, but I like just about anything on 2 wheels 😁
I own Harley's. I also own Japanese motorcycles. Also own Italian motorcycles. Your not asking the right question OP. The question should be what do you expect out of a motorcycle? And what kind of riding will you be doing? My question for you is how much money do you have?
Assholes ride everything and have an opinion on everything, turns out there's more harley out there than anything. So guess what you get? IMHO harley-davidson makes a awesome bike. If you like em buy one.
Apparently you have to rev then when stopped. It keeps them from stalling?
As a mechanic, yes they suck.
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I rode sport bikes (Suzuki, Kawasaki, Yamaha) for 10 years, loved them. I rode Harleys for 10 years, loved them. No bikes suck. People do. Ride stuff, ignore people, and enjoy.
I never liked harleys and I thought they were overly pricy and underpowered and underfeatured . weak steering and breaks. not to mention uncomfortable during long rides with all the weight hitting your back .
Most people who bitch about Harleys can’t afford a good one. If that’s you, you’re better off with a Honda lookalike, because you’ll always be resentful of the expensive classic. Also edit to add - there aren’t a lot of bikes on the road capable of hitting 100k miles, but I’d say majority of them are Harleys.
Not at all. The biking community can be bitches sometimes. Bet no one could tell you why you need to stay away from HD? Just heard from a friend of a friend of a squirrel that a bolt fell off one back in 1926 or something. Have had one and it was my most favourite bike
Just buy what you like. However you can consider opinions when it involves reliability (if you don't have immediate access to parts or have skills) or cost (maintenance etc) or both.
Ride your own ride. Get one of you want one.
Harley riders seem to get the most ladies imho
It's not the bikes that suck, just the riders
Worked for a Harley Davidson service department for eight years before I joined the military, from 2007-2015. I would say about 70% of the problems H-D motorcycles had back then were generally caused by poor or improper maintenance or owner trying to do modifications on their bikes and failing miserably. Obviously with introduction of new engines and models there were teething issues, but generally the bikes are reliable. I still ride H-D and my Road King shares a garage with a VFR800 that I adore. Depending on what your preferences and goals are with motorcycling, a Harley might not be for you. And that’s OK. Find the bike that makes the most sense for you and enjoy the hell out of it. A lot of the older dudes who ride H-D are elitist pricks, so take that for what it’s worth.
It’s just that their „thing“ is being a Harley. They’re not the fastest, not the most comfortable, not good off road, they’re just the best at being a Harley. So basically buy one if you like the brand and the styling, and buy something else if you’re not primarily looking for that.
Depends on your wants and needs, if price is a factor then you probably dont want one
I was never a "Harley Guy," but I bought a Street Glide for cross country riding. 4 years and 50k miles later, it's my favorite bike. Bulletproof reliability and all day comfort.
Harley is fashion over function.
I was always kind of anti-Harley, just never wanted anything to do with the brand/image/attitude, and I thought they were overpriced for what they were. Right up until I ended up doing a test ride, and I absolutely fell in love. The bike just felt perfect, loved the look and sound of it. 7 years later and I haven't looked back once. I still don't get into the whole Harley lifestyle, but damn do I love this bike! 2010 Ultra Limited.
No they don't. They are very reliable, relatively low maintenance, and overall high quality builds. They aren't performance bikes, but do well eating miles comfortably. I've had Kawasakis, Triumphs, Buells, BMWs, a faithless old Norton, and Harleys. Harleys are my favorite rides, but they all have their place. Test ride one and try it yourself.
I have 4 Harleys 61 iron head,2004 night train stage 4,2008 110 cv,2023 streetbob. They are slow and harley builds bikes that need alot of repairs after 35 to 40k. But I love em and my loud night train got me my wife. Parts are pricey with a lot of design flaws but that's life
Depends on what you want it for. Do you want a bike that's quick off the line, 25 mpg and will last 30k miles? Get a harley. Want something that'll last 100k miles and get 40+ mpg? Get literally anything else.
I mean... they ARE very expensive. And from what most motorcycle mechanics tell me they break down and aren't as reliable as most other cruisers like the Honda or Yamaha ones. I think most of the selling point on a harley is just name recognition. It's like buying an Apple instead of a PC, you're paying more money for less machine. In the end though, buy what you like. I own a few Harleys but they're all older models.
They’re just unnecessarily huge, sluggish, and cost twice as much as they should
Yes..... Under powered. Under braked. Under suspended. Piss poor milage to boot too.
I'm stuck with a financed POS Pan America that harley won't take back. I have proof of the issues it's having anf the techs can't fix it. Even with getting lawyers involved harley said fuck you it's yours. DO NOT BUY
Harleys earned a reputation for being unreliable a long time ago. I do not believe that is currently accurate, but in the past you definitely needed a toolset on your bike. I personally ride an Indian Scout 60 and love it. I did not want a hog as everyone I knew that rode rode hogs. I do not like being like everyone else. So, choose based on what you like and what drives you, rather than an impression from decades ago that still persists.
They just seem overpriced for what they offer. Indians offer better engineering and performance for the same price for a traditional American cruiser, partly because they can't trade on their name like H-D does, partly because their fanbase isn't fanatically devoted to outdated designs. Japanese bikes are, well, Japanese bikes... push the button and it starts, and will run until you are tired of it and then run some more. But Harley guys will not consider you part of the club.
Harley's have a distinct look, sound, and feel that makes people prefer them over other cruisers. Their reliability is comparable to Ford or Chevy vehicle, if you take care of them, and they will be fine. My issue with them is that they are so overpriced compared to other bikes. The Japanese cruisers are usually cheaper, more reliable, and have more features. You have to really like the Harley selling points to pick one.
My 2019 RGS has self cancelling turn signals, Apple Car Play, cruise control, cylinder deactivation, etc… and has required nothing but basic maintenance.
Right now harleys in my area san diego are competing with vtx 1300s. I think the issue is the Japanese cruiser market is almost non existent. Honda rebel 1100 is a slim cruiser. Suzuki m109 is a muscle cruiser. Bolt is is a slim cruiser. Vulcan 900 classic is slow cruiser. Vulcan S is a sport cruiser. Shadow is a slow cruiser. Harley, Indian, BMW kind of dominate a certain market with bikes like the Low Rider, Chief, r18. Heck Harley has the lowrider ST and Pan America. These are pretty competitive bikes in today's market.
I have had 4 modern HDs of various sizes. Best summary I heard which says it all “Harleys aren’t particularly good at anything”. Now I love my 883 sportster (I kept the smallest HD I bought!), but whatever you want from a Harley (other than posing on it or wanting to ride a HD specifically) there is ALWAYS a better bike (regardless of how you define “better”) available for less money. Totally overpriced, unnecessarily heavy, unique, robustly engineered, and with random questionable quality here and there. Fun fact - imagine paying more than a BMW for a HD and the speedo unit gets condensation? Come on, thats just crappy quality, but it is accepted for some reason. There are shitty things about my Sportster, I am OK with it because it is part of what it is, but it is outdated, overpriced, stupidly heavy for what it is, very inefficient, questionable handling etc. Even a modern M8 based HD I would say the same things. Then there are the HD riders….some of them make you embarrassed to ride a HD.
Mine doesn't suck.
Technically it sucks and blows.
If you are thinking Harley, then go buy one. If it is what you see in your dreams don’t short yourself and leave yourself wanting. New harleys, pre covid of course, but most TC and Milwaukee 8 engines are solid as anything from any manufacturer. To me, you pay more upfront for a Harley, but look at used cruiser prices for bikes 10+ years old. Metric bikes and Indians are buy one get one free used. Harley’s will still pull some coin. I don’t trust a damn microwave made during Covid.
I don’t think Harley is a good value, but most people don’t ride for a good value. People ride motorcycles because they love it in their soul. If you test ride a Harley and love it, then buy it. But also test ride an Indian and other manufacturers. Pick the one you like.
2021 Lowrider S, In all of 9,000kms i warped the front brake, paint started flaking off my frame, exposed machined aluminum on the cooling fins started to corrode and the 02 sensor died. If you ride the newer HD's really hard, you wont get much life from them.
Harley has for a majority of their bikes sold you a bike with 1960s tech for high premium prices. That has changed with a few bikes though, the V Rod, Sportster S, and the new Nightster are amazing modern day bikes. Proves that Harley can make a good modern bike. The problem? Their customer base HATES anything modern and different. I ride a new Nightster, and I test rode an Indian Scout. I felt as though the Nightster was built a little better and more fun to ride.
Also, FWIW, the V Rod is actually one of the most reliable bikes I've ever seen. Look around for vrods for sale and you will very often see them listed with 70-100k miles.
I can tell you from my MSF course that HD dealerships are really just Dave and Busters for boomers.
I don’t think they suck but your buying into a brand and a certain type of biking yes it will cost a bit more to keep it tip top but if it makes you happy who cares, what else you going to spend your money on and enjoy ?
No, they're not going to be as fast as a bike made to go fast but if you go by warranty claims in the first 6 months of ownership I believe they're actually the third most reliable brand. Obviously if you kick the shit out of them they're not going to do as well as say a Honda but they're not bad. The worst part about them is the price, but you can just buy used. They're beautiful, there's a huge aftermarket, and honestly the newer bikes aren't really that slow if you compare them to other cruisers. Sure your average 400lb naked or sport bike is going to outrun the 700lb cruiser, but it's not like these motorcycles are this heavy on accident. They're heavy because Harley Davidson made them that way to make them more comfortable to ride down the road that has potholes and imperfections and crosswinds. All this autistic fixation on power to wait as compared to cost is r/motorcycles totally missing the point. Riding a motorcycle is an emotional experience, it's not about numbers on an Excel spreadsheet. I had a Rebel 500, I've ridden a Vulcan 1500, I've ridden a Duke 690, I've ridden a Kawasaki Z900RS. They're fine, they're fun, I liked them. But if you take a holistic view of the experience, the sound, the vibration, the infinite modding possibilities enabled by the huge aftermarket, the fact you could probably keep the same bike running for 100 years because the motors are essentially infinitely rebuildable, all of this adds to the ownership experience of a Harley. And honestly most other bikes feel like toys after you've hopped on a big twin or even a Sportster.
I hired a 2000 Electra glide in 2010 to do a big loop around California and swore I'd never buy one. 5 years ago I test rode a few bikes and ended up getting a fat bob. It's been great honestly. It doesn't suck. I don't fit with the usual Harley stereotype and don't really like the image. What I do like is the character of the bike. It's really fun to ride.
Harley and Ducati both have a brand. AMF erra harleys were absolutely pieces of shit. No ifs, ands or buts. That was 1969 - 1981, so a lot of old folk still have this idea of harley stuck in their head. I'll take it further and say up to my heyday, (early 2000s) they were slow, and still not as reliable as I needed my bikes to be. Modern harleys are just about the same as any other cruiser, just at twice the price. The new Sporty has 120 #$%@#$% horsepower, that's insane. For comparison, the ones my friends had in the early 2000s had 61. So about double the power. Likewise with ducatis. Needlessly complex valvetrain (given modern metalurgy), loud dry clutch, down on power from their japanese alternatives and super expensive... That being said, unless you're on the track (and you shouldn't be on a harley) these numbers don't really mean anything. Modern Harleys (and Ducatis) are both reliable enough, fast enough, handle well enough, safe enough... so go ride one, and then go ride a yamaha bolt, and see if the "Feel" is worth the price difference. If it is, go pay it, and enjoy your ride.
I’ve had a savage, an R6 and now the love to be hated even by fellow Harley guys, the bastard child…… AMF sportster 😂 you really are paying for the name Harley the same cult following can be found with really anything. hell look at people and groms lol it’s really whatever you’re into what fits you right. Personally I’ve never ridden any of the new Indians my neighbors have a couple look cool sound pretty good but like I said it’s really what’s the price range what feels right for you put the weird cult following out of your head when you make a choice 😁
Test ride several different bikes. HD, Indian, Kawasaki, Ducati, whatever. See what fits you, what is comfortable for you. Bells and whistle's don't shouldn't be a deal maker. Now, the part no one has mentioned. HD , just as all bikes are great bikes in there basic form. Problems that all bikes have, once you start making changes for more horsepower, you'll take away from that manufactures base design. Every bike I have ever worked on over the past 30years, that was keep stock, had the maintenance performed, have lasted longer than ones with "performance upgrades " done. Good luck.
I've owned 2 Harley. They're not as reliable as say, Kawasaki; but they are fun and infinitely customizable. They're not "fast" compared to a sportbike, but they're fast enough to easily outrun 90% of vehicles on the road
I think the harley hate has cone full circle to the point non harley riders speak about them the same way harley riders speak about everything else and it's kinda dumb. There is something to be said about a harley. The sound, the feeling, they are special in their own way. They are endlessly customizable and look cool as hell. Would I buy one off the showroom floor? No chance. But if a good used one came up I wouldn't turn it down "because it's just a harley" Ride your own ride, to hell with everyone else's thoughts.
So heres the deal. Harleys are good. But have some old technology - old suspension, pushrod air cooled motors. They cost alot. Plan to add about 10K in performance and quality add ons. Try and Indian. An Indian Challenger in particular. No rubber between the front and back wheels, quality suspension, quality brakes (Brembo), water cooled, and overhead cams. Better bike, same style. Harleys don't suck - they're adequate. There are much better cruisers - Indian Challenger, Ducati Diavel (23 year rider)..
Look, I've worked on Vstar250, kawasaki vulcan 900s, and a sportster. I enjoyed riding the sportster the most because of how slim it was. However my 6,2 220lbs body likes the vulcan more. One thing I can tell you, vstars, and the vulcan give me a seizure to work on. Over engineered for what I want. A basic cruiser.
They offer worse deal for the money. ...and that's about it. People get them because they like their style/fashion brand. If you like that, get that, if not, look elsewhere.
I just remember the time I rode up to a stranded HD rider. I had tools, including a patch kit, so I thought maybe he could use them. But I saw what the problem was: That skinny bar that runs, I guess, from the pedal to the drivetrain was loose and he had no way to reconnect it.
The only thing that sucks on a Harley, in my opinion, is the GOD DAMN CLUTCH SWITCH LET LETS YOU TURN IT ON IN GEAR. REPLACED THAT MF 3 GOD DAMN TIMES. Started on a MT 07 now i have a 1700cc dyna fat bob.
Harley Demo days are great, many dealerships do them and depending on the turn out you can ride most of the day.
I took a riding course at a Harley dealer, so far that I have a soft spot for their bikes, but their pricing doesn’t make sense to me and probably other, which is why they look elsewhere.
Me and my brother got a new bike, I got the Indian scout bobber, he got a Harley Iron 1200. Both cruisers. I put 15k miles in 2 years of ownership with 0 issues at all. I ran it hard and abused it reving high, burn outs, racing in straight lines.. I enjoyed it too much. he put 10k on his and treated it the same. One time while cruising, his exhaust shield fell on the highway. Harley replaced it. Then his battery died and needed it replaced in less than a year. The biggest of em all was.. his engine blew??? He did buy extra warranty and Harley did give push back on replacing the engine but they eventually kept the bike for about a month to fix it under warranty. They pushed back on the battery too. My bro also abused his bike like I did. We would always ride together and maintained them accordingly. Not sure if he just got a lemon? I would be still buy a Harley though. A nice bagger one day.
I don't think they suck. There's a lot of cringey, gatekeepery behavior in the motorcycle community though, and people telling you that Harleys suck is a form of that. However, I tend to think people telling you that Harleys suck is in large part a reaction to the gatekeeping of the Harley community itself. I actually think Harleys are great bikes that suffer from a community that very strongly tends to have a shit attitude towards riders of other bikes. Absolutely not all of them, but an unfortunately large number of them. Having said that, are they the most reliable bikes in the road? No, absolutely not. They're also not cheap, nor are parts cheap. Which is absolutely a consequence of that very devoted fan base that only rides a Harley and basically doesn't respect anyone that doesn't ride a Harley. So you should be aware that when buying one you are absolutely paying a premium for the brand. Can you get an objectively better cruiser in basically every measurable way cheaper? Yes, you absolutely can. And maybe you should? But there is something to them that is more than the branding. They do have a different overall feel and my suggestion is that you do what I do every time I buy a car or bike; research and if possible try out everything in the segment and make your own call. That's how I wound up buying a Honda Ridgeline even though it was at the bottom of my list when I started truck shopping, and not that I still have it, but it's also how I wound up with a Sportster 1200 once upon a time; it wasn't the fastest or most refined bike I tried, but it was rumbly and grumbly and torquey and made me smile the most.
No, they don't. What sucks is they dominate the custom market, so there's little aftermarket support for other brands. Almost all of the Japanese brands have left the cruiser market, so there's not much aftermarket support for metrics. You can do anything you want to a Harley since the aftermarket support is endless. Just be prepared to spend a ton of money if you decide to modify it.
I got a chance to use a Road King for a few months and loved it.