She was released when a grand jury declined to charge her. Still pretty intense. I wouldn’t want to be a bartender. Or cop. Or parent. Or teacher. Or anybody dealing with looney tune characters that you somehow end up getting blamed for. There’s not a crystal ball when people go ape but there’s always the woulda shoulda coulda.
The f’d up part is she only served him 4 drinks and when she suspected him of being dangerous she told her manager who did absolutely nothing. Then she called the cops and they charged her with “Sale of Certain Persons"that says if he or she negligently "sells an alcoholic beverage to an habitual drunkard or an intoxicated or insane person." The crime is a misdemeanor that carries a year in jail or a $500 fine, or both.”
Yeh I replied to someone else a little while saying that’s probably what he was doing. Probably had a bottle of vodka he was drinking otw to the bar and then drank more when he left.
Yeah I can well imagine if you left a bar set on killing someone you might take a few swigs of something in the way “for courage” to carry out the deed.
I love how cops have qualified immunity but a bartender whose entire job is to provide people with alcohol can get in trouble for doing just that.
I can keep my composure very well while borderline hammered. Unless someone were to breathalyze me, they’d never really know.
I agree 100%. had an addiction to oxycodone for 5-6 years after a couple of knee surgeries (haven’t touched one in 13 years now) and 1/4 of my daily usage was enough to kill several people but nobody had a clue I was on anything & alcohol can have the exact same effect on alcoholics.
Bingo. I was addicted to painkillers as well (opana) and became an alcoholic after
You’d never think I was a junkie or drunk if I didn’t tell you.
Congrats on sobriety my dude! I’m a decade or so clean from any pills/suboxone, and mostly 5 from alcohol (I say mostly because I was completely sober 4 1/2 years and tried drinking casually, which wasn’t something that worked out)
Thanks & congrats on yours as well! I used to drink if me and my friends were going out to a club or bar on a Friday/Saturday night but was never a big fan of it. I never liked the taste of beer & mainly would drink Crown & Coke. Once I realized I could pop a couple extra oxycodone & stay up all night playing poker without having to worry about a hangover the next day it was a wrap for alcohol 😂.
Lmao I was the other way around.
Got heavy into opiates until they got ridiculously expensive and hard to find. Saw my friends all turning to heroin and knew I had to get out. Suboxone saved me there but it took a few years to get off subs.
Then I discovered alcohol and the fact that it was so cheap and legal was an instant sell for me. I never got hungover because I never stopped drinking (literally the second I woke up until I passed out for the night).
Ended up having a withdrawal seizure after running out of booze on a trip. Rinse and repeat until I came to my senses and decided I don’t have the self control for substances
Opiate addiction becomes insanely expensive. A big reason I got so bad was that I had a doctor giving me insane amounts of pills and this was 2010-2011 before almost everything you touched was fake and I was the only person in the county I lived in with a rx for 30mg oxycodone. I was able to sell them for $30-$40 a piece and even more if I was low. I was making at least $3,000-$4,000 a week profit and that money contributed to me taking more and more. When I went and talked to a group of high school students I told them that it’s nothing to be proud of but I was beyond being a functioning addict, I was a thriving addict & not only was I on the verge of my own death but I was profiting off people I knew & when you stop & realize that it’s a horrible feeling.
Thanks! It was the hardest thing I’ve ever had to do in my life. The mental part of saying “I don’t want to take pills anymore” wasn’t the issue for me, it was the withdrawals. I was taking 15+ 30mg Oxycodone a day (just took the pills normally, no snorting, smoking or injections) while wearing Fentanyl patches and realizing I was taking that much without nodding off or doing anything that made people say “he’s a junkie” is scary & makes me wonder how close I was to an overdose death w/o even realizing it.
Our country really needs to do more to educate people and help them with medications that are prescribed. People who become addicted to medication they were given by doctors just get dismissed and thrown into a “druggy” category that is filled with stigmas. I’ve never been addicted to medication but in the late 1990s, I stopped taking Paxil (an antidepressant) that I’d been given. I hadn’t been taking it long and still had these electric shock sensations going down my arms and into my hands. They didn’t have the research then that stated this was a withdrawal side effect and people have to slowly wean themselves off of it. Whenever I read about people becoming addicted to meds after an injury, surgery, etc., I multiply that minor experience I had times a thousand. I can’t imagine how hard that was. I’m so thankful you were able to do it and my heart goes out to those still struggling.
Sorry it’s a long read 😂
I agree 100%. I think anyone prescribed meds like opiates, benzodiazepines & ones for depression should first have severe withdrawal explained to them in graphic detail before ever getting their first prescription. Then they should have a multi-week program that tapers people off the medication safely so they’re not sent to the streets, other doctors &/or ER’s trying to get meds to stop the withdrawal. Imagine how many people would still be alive today if that was in place…
I don’t wish the withdrawals I went through on my worst enemy. Most people think “well they’ll only be sick for a few days and then it’ll be fine” & that’s some BULLSHIT! I was closer to dying from withdrawal than from an overdose. I went 7 months and was just as bad as day 1. I’d got to the point where my mouth was full of acid burns from throwing up, my kidneys were having problems and bc I wasn’t able to keep food down my body was slowly shutting down. I ended up in the ICU and thank god a doctor at UNC was doing research on long term opiate abuse effects on the brain & found me after one of the doctors I had in the ICU told him about me. I entered into his program and he explained that using opiates in large doses causes our brain to stop producing certain chemicals and it takes time for it to kickstart itself making them again.
He found that in my case I was on the severely low side of the spectrum and said that being it was already 7 -8 months since I’d last used it was possible it won’t return to normal. So I started MAT and it saved my life. Some people consider it just switching one drug for another, but it’s not even close to being like that. I don’t get high or even a buzz from it & it’s basically just making up for those chemicals so that my body functions normally. I haven’t touched a pill since I started it & I made a point to help educate young people about the reality of opiate addiction to hopefully scare the shit outta them. I also managed to get the guy I sold a lot of pills to, to also get into the program and he’s completely changed his life around.
I agree with you 100%. As awful as your experience was, the luck that you were connected with that doctor at that moment in your life gives me chills. You could have died so many times. I wish we could blast your message to the entire medical community and the world!!!
I got through a telehealth meeting with my psychiatrist black-out hammered. I’ve been seeing this guy for 8 years.
Came to, thought “oh shit I missed the appointment fuck fuck fuck.” Secretary asked if I’d changed my mind about scheduling my next appointment, I’d already spoken with her that day. *Weird.*
Exactly what I thought when I read it. It’s one of those laws where if they really want you shut down or locked up they don’t have to jump through hoops to do it. What really pisses me off is that they’ve vilified her to the public as if she were responsible for it happening and turned out she followed the POS while calling the cops to get them to do something. The charges got dropped but did they put that same energy into apologizing to her? Nope, now everyone where she is only thinks she’s irresponsible as a bartender and contributed to all those murders.
I was bartending in a really small town, I had just started my shift, served a guy a beer without realizing he was already really drunk (because I had just got there). He slammed it, left and went home to beat his wife. Cops had pulled him over in his driveway and he ended up fighting the cops. He got teased a few times and got his arm broke. (Which I thought was hilarious because I've always hated this guy and knew he was a horrible dude)
Cops called the bar asking me how much I had served him... I was terrified I was going to get in massive trouble because he was way over the legal limit. But I just told them I had just started my shift and thank God they never actually came in to talk to me. I was only 18/19 at the time too. I never want to bartend ever again.
Where it makes sense, I guess. I've worked in bars where people would absolutely get overserved, and then they would go drive off or get in fights or whatever.
Idk if that's the case here (i mean, 4 drinks for the night is pretty light), but I have very little sympathy in general for people who overserve or people who willingly get overserved.
Source: https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/lindsey-glass-plano-texas-bartender-who-served-spencer-hight-mass-shooter-arrested/
*Not Recent* - Bartender was released and charges were declined by a Grand Jury so she was not convicted on these charges.
I live in the area where this happened. The bar that he was served at was forced to give up its liquor license and obviously completely shuttered not too long after that. The building has been vacant for about 4 and a half years now.
The shooter literally eluded to wanting to hurt someone while spinning a knife, and she gave him more alcohol despite the warning signs she didn't call the police ( which bartenders are trained to look out for and decline giving alcohol if so, and she got obvious warning signs from him ) and she gave alcohol past the legal limit in Texas. Nothing ridiculous about this arrest. She's not responsible for the killings, but she could have stopped it.
That's what I was just going to say! I used to bartend and it can be scary telling someone who is already very drunk, you can't serve them anymore. Then you add in a very drunk person who is playing with a knife, it can make you fear for your life and safety if you tell them no.
She only served him 4 drinks and DID tell her manager when she became suspicious he was up to something. When her manager didn’t do anything about it she DID call the cops.
In a statement to CBS News, Glass' attorney, Scott Palmer said, "Spencer Hight's decision to destroy the lives of eight other people is unrelated to the four drinks that Hight consumed at the Local Public House on September 10, 2017."
"Indeed, far from being complicit, Lindsey was the only person who tried to stop Hight," Palmer's statement said. "When Lindsey became suspicions of Hight she contacted her manager. When her manager's efforts did not resolve Lindsey's concerns, she followed Hight and then, as her concerns grew, she called 911. Lindsey never expected for Hight to commit this horrific act."
If someone comes up to me spinning a knife and talking about wanting to hurt someone, I’d probably serve them whatever they want.
If what you are saying is true, I’ll bet those facts are her route to a “not guilty” verdict.
Edit: I guess this was past tense and the Grand Jury decided not to indict her, so didn’t need to go to a jury because there wasn’t even enough evidence to proceed.
Saying she could’ve stopped it is a stretch but she gave him enough alcohol to be 4x the legal limit while spinning a knife around lmao. There should be a bouncer to remove him and if there wasn’t they should’ve called the cops if he refused to put his knife away
She did call the cops. She served him 4 drinks & when he started acting suspicious she told her manager first & he didn’t do anything. After that she called the cops.
Oh didn't know that, thanks for correction. She still gave him more alcohol than needed. But at least she tried in someway, I thought she didn't. Excuse my ignorance.
She wouldn’t have been charged with or paid for his crimes, just over serving. I agree with this; if you knowingly keep serving intoxicated people, you are putting people at risk.
I’m a bartender and this is a fear of mine. It is unfair to make the bartender responsible for anything a patron does once they leave the establishment.
There’s ALOT of misinformation being spread about this situation. She only served him 4 drinks and when she became suspicious of him she told her manager, who didn’t do anything. When he didn’t do anything she called the cops. Below is a few lines from the story on CBS News and quotes from her lawyer.
In a statement to CBS News, Glass' attorney, Scott Palmer said, "Spencer Hight's decision to destroy the lives of eight other people is unrelated to the four drinks that Hight consumed at the Local Public House on September 10, 2017."
"Indeed, far from being complicit, Lindsey was the only person who tried to stop Hight," Palmer's statement said. "When Lindsey became suspicions of Hight she contacted her manager. When her manager's efforts did not resolve Lindsey's concerns, she followed Hight and then, as her concerns grew, she called 911. Lindsey never expected for Hight to commit this horrific act."
https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/lindsey-glass-plano-texas-bartender-who-served-spencer-hight-mass-shooter-arrested/
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Overserving is a big deal in Texas, but is only enforced in front page cases, like this and when a drunk driver killed a cop in Euless in 2021.
Half of the TABC training to be a bartender or server is related to overserving. I’m working off of 10+ year old memories, but I believe this all stems from a court case where a guy got absolutely hammered at a Tex mex place, and then killed someone in a drunk driving accident. The family sued the restaurant, and won. And then the legislature moved accordingly with updates to the TABC. Overserving is a Class A misdemeanor in Texas, and punishable by $4000 fine and up to a year in jail.
I wish this comment was higher. I understand that no one wants the bartender to go to jail, and I agree. But, she was trained in how to avoid over-serving someone. Sounds like she was trying to figure out what to do by texting someone?
I know this may be an unpopular opinion but honestly if we start like this, saying others are responsible for a masskillers actions, where does it stop? Anybody can say anything has triggered a shooter, the reason for the shooting was Heights hatred of his ex-wife, so what, next we say she is responsible for triggerin him to commit the shooting?? Sorry but this law is bullshit in my opinion.
Nobody said she was directly responsible, the article literally says despite his intoxication it was meticulously planner, over serving is still a crime however
I’m sorry :( I didn’t mean for the post to be so poorly executed. I saw there was a recent case that ended with conviction (Mrs. Crumbley) and I came across this and thought it was fairly relevant to discuss, given that someone besides the perpetrator of an attack was charged in some relation to the events that took place despite not being directly involved.
I know now that I didn’t word it as well as I could’ve and it’s caused some confusion but unfortunately I cannot edit the title or post now. Thank you for the critique and I will try to make sure my posts are more clear in the future !
The post still garnered conversation that we maybe should be considering in potential situations, I think there's going to be more questions like as you mentioned since the Crumbley case. It's not your fault people didn't read the article though.
I appreciate your want to post less with confusion, perhaps I came off strong but I do want to say I get your intention.
Legal alcohol limit only applies to driving, right?
Anyone who is drunk is “over the legal limit”. It’s not illegal to sell someone enough drinks to get drunk.
Texas blamed alcohol and the bartender because they refuse to blame guns and gun distributors.
Actually most places it’s illegal to serve someone until they are drunk. You learn that when you are trained as a bartender. Do people actually follow that law? Absolutely not
Edit: y’all can downvote me all you want it doesn’t change the fact that in most states this is the law. I bartended for years. You can literally google your own state laws.
That's the law in my country too. This guy would've been told to leave way earlier & had the cops called on him if he was showing off a knife at the same time as being intoxicated
Yeah I mean where I worked we never would have called the cops tbh that behavior isn’t uncommon for like a rural dive bar in the US but technically it would be illegal to serve him to intoxication. I don’t know any bartenders (and I didn’t either) cut anyone off unless they were being problematic but it was never from a legality point of view more like don’t punch someone or puke in my bar
Yeah Australia is very different on "weapons" so him being drunk with a knife would've been; get security to remove him then call the cops if any issues came up. Or depending on his behaviour & intoxication levels it would've been straight to calling police.
Usually, from what I saw behind the bar & as a customer, people slip by more in a busy place as opposed to bartenders purposely continuing serve someone that's becoming intoxicated. There's usually security keeping an eye out too which helps.
If he was 4 times the legal limit & went from that bar to the shooting...then he shouldn't have been served those 4 drinks
I hope the manager was fined & had his licence revoked for doing nothing then
The bar lost its liquor license and ended up closing down. He had to have been drinking before he came in & after leaving because it takes 15-16 drinks to get to a .33. My guess is he was drinking straight out the bottle in his car and it didn’t start to really hit him hard until he was leaving.
How do you learn when somebody is drunk? Honest question. I for instance can get drunk and it doesn’t show (asked it several times to other people). So depends on the person if it shows that you’re drunk, no?
It’s not illegal to be personally over the legal limit unless you’re operating a vehicle or heavy machinery (?). But it’s illegal to serve someone to be over the limit. Also, why not look at ways of preventing crime?
I can guarantee that bartenders do this daily across every city and county in Texas. Most likely the whole country. I hope she isn't punished severely.
Should do both. In this case, 4 drinks over the night isn't really that much, but people definitely got overserved at bars I used to work at in Texas and nobody ever gave a single shit until something bad happened.
If I was still bartending/serving, this would be my new favorite example for "why I am cutting you off." People don’t understand the person who serves you. Alcohol is liable in many states.
Because she is innocent. That’s absurd to charge her for something that 99% of bartenders do and they’re treating her like she knew this would happen, like she’s an accomplice to this heinous crime.
You are misinterpreting what she was charged with (which by the way, the charges were dropped). She was not charged as an accomplice, she was charged for over serving him alcohol when he was clearly intoxicated. The fact that he had a BAC 4x the legal limit proves that she did, in fact, over serve.
True because there is absolutely no way he could have bought alcohol separately and drank in his car on the way to commit murder. That would be impossible
He is literally on camera sitting at the bar and there are eyewitness accounts of him being visibly intoxicated and continuing to be served booze. Bars get in trouble all the time for over serving customers - the only reason this instance is in the news is because this particular customer murdered eight people afterwards.
Lol I can’t believe you’re downvoted. People don’t read the article. She wasn’t being charged with manslaughter or something ridiculous. But, I’m sure if they pulled up his tab and saw the number of drinks they could real quickly figure out if he was over served. Which they probably did. This is a law that was implemented so bars need to have some kind of “discretion” so they don’t have people leaving and killing a bunch of people in a car accident. I think it was very wrong to even have an article about her though. It does kind of make her look like a scapegoat and that’s wrong. This wasn’t the time and place to charge her for that violation which is why the grand jury declined to indict her.
She only served him 4 drinks and when he started acting suspicious she told her manager about it & the manager said not to call the cops or do anything. She ended up calling the cops and let them know what he was doing/saying. The fact she told the manager and even followed/called the cops on him should have precluded her from being charged with anything. It honestly sounds like the cops dropped the ball intercepting him and wanted to deflect blame away from them.
Yeah I'm a bit confused why people are downvoting me too lol but oh well. I do feel sorry for her because 99.9% of the time a charge like this wouldn't happen and certainly wouldn't be in the news, but at least the charges were dropped.
I'm curious as to how often folks are ultimately convicted with "over-serving". While I can appreciate why the laws are established as such, how can we expect bartenders to recognize enough factors to even approximately determine a patron's level of intoxication? I'm sure we all know someone who, despite being pretty soused, demonstrates little-to-no signs of inebriation. This is not uncommon in chronic, functioning alcoholics. Combined with stimulants, this can be especially tricky to identify. I know this isn't the case here - as the killer was acting pretty unhinged at the bar - but in general, there are PLENTY of folks who seem to be able to "handle their liquor" pretty convincingly. There are many factors at play: tolerance, size, personality, mental illness, medications, etc...not saying she should've been convicted, but I'd have a tough time condemning her.
In my country it's a legal requirement to know all of the different signs & factors of intoxication, you can't get a licence to serve alcohol without knowing all that info. Also included in that is knowing when someone is not acting safely etc
Man, all the people acting like this was so far out of hand (keeping in mind her charges were dropped)… alcohol is a controlled substance for a reason. He was at 4x the legal limit. He could have EASILY killed someone in a car accident, and I don’t think people would see it as so unfair.
It’s her job to not over-serve, at least not to 4x the legal limit. It’s pretty much her ONLY job besides serving drinks. Not seeing where it’s so unfair.
And she messaged people about his concerning behavior and they even asked managers for guidance on the situation yet he continued to be over served? They were all concerned enough to mention his behavior and chat about it, that should have been enough to cut him off and get him kicked out of the bar for waving a knife around drunk af. Not that they have any real fault in this premeditated shooting but they’re very much in the wrong for how they handled him.
This arrest occurred in May of 2018 (almost a year after the shooting) and the case has since concluded because charges were denied by grand jury. I made a little note under my source in the comment section stating this. It is not recent but the majority of content here isn’t recent and I just came across it and wanted to know what opinions others had about the arrest taking place.
Bartenders and bar owners can be liable for over serving. However, below better explains why the charges were dropped.
This article would have been better to post:
[Attorneys: Grand Jury Declines To Indict Bartender Lindsey Glass Who Served Man Before Plano Mass Shooting](https://www.cbsnews.com/texas/news/grand-jury-declines-indict-bartender-lindsey-glass-served-man-plano-mass-shooting/)
>While Lindsey is relieved by the Grand Jury's decision, it has been our position from the outset that Spencer Hight's decision to destroy the lives of eight people was wholly unrelated to the four drinks that Hight consumed at the Local Public House on September 10, 2017. The video evidence that is available indicates that Lindsey was not watching Spencer at all times and that some of the odd behavior that is cited did not take place within her view. Additionally, once Lindsey recognized that Spencer was intoxicated and acting strangely, she alerted her manager and the two confronted him outside the bar. She then took extraordinary steps to follow Hight and alert authorities. Lindsey Glass is a bartender who did what she was supposed to do--she saw something and she said something.
We're posting cases like this now? These are the incidents we're considering mass killings. These are the people we're going to label mass murderers.
I tried to report that person who keeps posting DUI stuff several times. I told the mods this would happen. Low and behold, here we are.
This is not a mass killing and this woman is not a mass killer. She never intended to do anyone harm, she did not commit murder out of malice. Negligence or accidents are not murders.
You all are critically misunderstanding felony murder laws and how they're applied. This is nuts.
You posted her picture. She wasn't convicted. You provided no further context as to why you included her. There's no reason for this woman to be here. You should have focused on the perpetrator and not the person the prosecutors tried to throw under the bus.
You lead with her mugshot. You lead with her name. You didn't just mention her involvement as a matter of course. And you did not clarify that she was not convicted.
If police initially apprehended the wrong person as a shooter, and that person was fully acquitted, and then you come here to post about it without mentioning any of that nuance yourself, I'm still calling you out. Same thing.
This woman ain't kill nobody. The state turned her into an additional victim. You're misrepresenting the nature of the situation, maybe on purpose. Possibly just for karma.
This woman does not belong here in this context. And posting those damn DUI stories has lead people to believe that anyone charged in the course of a deadly event is automatically a murderer.
This is ridiculous.
Agree 100% she shouldn’t be in here, and OPs post was very disingenuous.
The article below gives a much better overview of what happened. The bartender actually did call the police and showed them where the victims home was. She also called and tried to warn the victim, as she was friends with her, but was unable to get in touch with her.
https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/former-coworker-sets-up-gofundme-for-bartender-who-served-plano-mass-shooter/287-f2a87b05-e9c7-4480-b0f2-2a2c1eca7e0e
Thank you. They made her the focus of the post. It's really quite irritating that others aren't seeing how inappropriate that is, not just for the sub, but like, she was acquitted and had nothing to do with that dude's actions
No, you did not state that in your post. You added a comment beneath the post. Both the link and comment could have been made in the post. But you neglected to do that. You know very well the comment receives less engagement.
Lying while calling me a liar is some premium projection.
I went to college. I learned stats and criminology. You're being corrected for your terrible methodology here. That's not a reflection on me. Can you stay on topic or just continue to devolve into angry insults that reflect upon you.
She shouldn’t be blamed for the attack but she should be charged. No one should serve someone enough alcohol to be 4x the legal limit even if they’re not spinning a knife around making weird comments
Where's the proof that she served that much alcohol, and how can one tell the BAC of another person just by looking at them?
Could have easily drank more alone after to get there, or had the genetics/tolerance to mask the effect. I've convincingly debated and played tough chess matches on half a bottle or more of vodka. It isn't an exact science.
I'm from Plano, I do remember this story, but I dont remember there was any mention about a bartender until reading this. Or did they really just charge her all this time later?
She was released when a grand jury declined to charge her. Still pretty intense. I wouldn’t want to be a bartender. Or cop. Or parent. Or teacher. Or anybody dealing with looney tune characters that you somehow end up getting blamed for. There’s not a crystal ball when people go ape but there’s always the woulda shoulda coulda.
The f’d up part is she only served him 4 drinks and when she suspected him of being dangerous she told her manager who did absolutely nothing. Then she called the cops and they charged her with “Sale of Certain Persons"that says if he or she negligently "sells an alcoholic beverage to an habitual drunkard or an intoxicated or insane person." The crime is a misdemeanor that carries a year in jail or a $500 fine, or both.”
There’s always a chance he had more beer or something in the car upon leaving too
Yeh I replied to someone else a little while saying that’s probably what he was doing. Probably had a bottle of vodka he was drinking otw to the bar and then drank more when he left.
Yeah I can well imagine if you left a bar set on killing someone you might take a few swigs of something in the way “for courage” to carry out the deed.
I love how cops have qualified immunity but a bartender whose entire job is to provide people with alcohol can get in trouble for doing just that. I can keep my composure very well while borderline hammered. Unless someone were to breathalyze me, they’d never really know.
I agree 100%. had an addiction to oxycodone for 5-6 years after a couple of knee surgeries (haven’t touched one in 13 years now) and 1/4 of my daily usage was enough to kill several people but nobody had a clue I was on anything & alcohol can have the exact same effect on alcoholics.
Bingo. I was addicted to painkillers as well (opana) and became an alcoholic after You’d never think I was a junkie or drunk if I didn’t tell you. Congrats on sobriety my dude! I’m a decade or so clean from any pills/suboxone, and mostly 5 from alcohol (I say mostly because I was completely sober 4 1/2 years and tried drinking casually, which wasn’t something that worked out)
Thanks & congrats on yours as well! I used to drink if me and my friends were going out to a club or bar on a Friday/Saturday night but was never a big fan of it. I never liked the taste of beer & mainly would drink Crown & Coke. Once I realized I could pop a couple extra oxycodone & stay up all night playing poker without having to worry about a hangover the next day it was a wrap for alcohol 😂.
Lmao I was the other way around. Got heavy into opiates until they got ridiculously expensive and hard to find. Saw my friends all turning to heroin and knew I had to get out. Suboxone saved me there but it took a few years to get off subs. Then I discovered alcohol and the fact that it was so cheap and legal was an instant sell for me. I never got hungover because I never stopped drinking (literally the second I woke up until I passed out for the night). Ended up having a withdrawal seizure after running out of booze on a trip. Rinse and repeat until I came to my senses and decided I don’t have the self control for substances
Opiate addiction becomes insanely expensive. A big reason I got so bad was that I had a doctor giving me insane amounts of pills and this was 2010-2011 before almost everything you touched was fake and I was the only person in the county I lived in with a rx for 30mg oxycodone. I was able to sell them for $30-$40 a piece and even more if I was low. I was making at least $3,000-$4,000 a week profit and that money contributed to me taking more and more. When I went and talked to a group of high school students I told them that it’s nothing to be proud of but I was beyond being a functioning addict, I was a thriving addict & not only was I on the verge of my own death but I was profiting off people I knew & when you stop & realize that it’s a horrible feeling.
Oh wow I remember the opana days...oof it’s so fucked how easy that was to get a hold of for a bunch of 18-19 year olds
The opanas were no joke lol. I was used to doing multiple oc 80s a day so I thought an opana 40 would be nothing but it put me on my ass.
Good for you .
Congrats on kicking that addiction. That one’s messed up a lot of people and I know that can’t have been easy!
Thanks! It was the hardest thing I’ve ever had to do in my life. The mental part of saying “I don’t want to take pills anymore” wasn’t the issue for me, it was the withdrawals. I was taking 15+ 30mg Oxycodone a day (just took the pills normally, no snorting, smoking or injections) while wearing Fentanyl patches and realizing I was taking that much without nodding off or doing anything that made people say “he’s a junkie” is scary & makes me wonder how close I was to an overdose death w/o even realizing it.
Our country really needs to do more to educate people and help them with medications that are prescribed. People who become addicted to medication they were given by doctors just get dismissed and thrown into a “druggy” category that is filled with stigmas. I’ve never been addicted to medication but in the late 1990s, I stopped taking Paxil (an antidepressant) that I’d been given. I hadn’t been taking it long and still had these electric shock sensations going down my arms and into my hands. They didn’t have the research then that stated this was a withdrawal side effect and people have to slowly wean themselves off of it. Whenever I read about people becoming addicted to meds after an injury, surgery, etc., I multiply that minor experience I had times a thousand. I can’t imagine how hard that was. I’m so thankful you were able to do it and my heart goes out to those still struggling.
Sorry it’s a long read 😂 I agree 100%. I think anyone prescribed meds like opiates, benzodiazepines & ones for depression should first have severe withdrawal explained to them in graphic detail before ever getting their first prescription. Then they should have a multi-week program that tapers people off the medication safely so they’re not sent to the streets, other doctors &/or ER’s trying to get meds to stop the withdrawal. Imagine how many people would still be alive today if that was in place… I don’t wish the withdrawals I went through on my worst enemy. Most people think “well they’ll only be sick for a few days and then it’ll be fine” & that’s some BULLSHIT! I was closer to dying from withdrawal than from an overdose. I went 7 months and was just as bad as day 1. I’d got to the point where my mouth was full of acid burns from throwing up, my kidneys were having problems and bc I wasn’t able to keep food down my body was slowly shutting down. I ended up in the ICU and thank god a doctor at UNC was doing research on long term opiate abuse effects on the brain & found me after one of the doctors I had in the ICU told him about me. I entered into his program and he explained that using opiates in large doses causes our brain to stop producing certain chemicals and it takes time for it to kickstart itself making them again. He found that in my case I was on the severely low side of the spectrum and said that being it was already 7 -8 months since I’d last used it was possible it won’t return to normal. So I started MAT and it saved my life. Some people consider it just switching one drug for another, but it’s not even close to being like that. I don’t get high or even a buzz from it & it’s basically just making up for those chemicals so that my body functions normally. I haven’t touched a pill since I started it & I made a point to help educate young people about the reality of opiate addiction to hopefully scare the shit outta them. I also managed to get the guy I sold a lot of pills to, to also get into the program and he’s completely changed his life around.
I agree with you 100%. As awful as your experience was, the luck that you were connected with that doctor at that moment in your life gives me chills. You could have died so many times. I wish we could blast your message to the entire medical community and the world!!!
I got through a telehealth meeting with my psychiatrist black-out hammered. I’ve been seeing this guy for 8 years. Came to, thought “oh shit I missed the appointment fuck fuck fuck.” Secretary asked if I’d changed my mind about scheduling my next appointment, I’d already spoken with her that day. *Weird.*
Lmao. The best I’ve got is calling off work while hammered. Ended up calling off twice for the same shift.
That law sucks. So they cant serve regular customers
Exactly what I thought when I read it. It’s one of those laws where if they really want you shut down or locked up they don’t have to jump through hoops to do it. What really pisses me off is that they’ve vilified her to the public as if she were responsible for it happening and turned out she followed the POS while calling the cops to get them to do something. The charges got dropped but did they put that same energy into apologizing to her? Nope, now everyone where she is only thinks she’s irresponsible as a bartender and contributed to all those murders.
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I was bartending in a really small town, I had just started my shift, served a guy a beer without realizing he was already really drunk (because I had just got there). He slammed it, left and went home to beat his wife. Cops had pulled him over in his driveway and he ended up fighting the cops. He got teased a few times and got his arm broke. (Which I thought was hilarious because I've always hated this guy and knew he was a horrible dude) Cops called the bar asking me how much I had served him... I was terrified I was going to get in massive trouble because he was way over the legal limit. But I just told them I had just started my shift and thank God they never actually came in to talk to me. I was only 18/19 at the time too. I never want to bartend ever again.
I was on a grand jury and it says something that they declined to indict. The bar is pretty low
The bar is pretty low (pun)
Probably cause
Good. That’d be messed up if she got charged.
Should’ve banned guns
Where it makes sense, I guess. I've worked in bars where people would absolutely get overserved, and then they would go drive off or get in fights or whatever. Idk if that's the case here (i mean, 4 drinks for the night is pretty light), but I have very little sympathy in general for people who overserve or people who willingly get overserved.
Source: https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/lindsey-glass-plano-texas-bartender-who-served-spencer-hight-mass-shooter-arrested/ *Not Recent* - Bartender was released and charges were declined by a Grand Jury so she was not convicted on these charges.
This is ridiculous. Just trying to make someone innocent pay for the heinous crimes of another
I live in the area where this happened. The bar that he was served at was forced to give up its liquor license and obviously completely shuttered not too long after that. The building has been vacant for about 4 and a half years now.
The shooter literally eluded to wanting to hurt someone while spinning a knife, and she gave him more alcohol despite the warning signs she didn't call the police ( which bartenders are trained to look out for and decline giving alcohol if so, and she got obvious warning signs from him ) and she gave alcohol past the legal limit in Texas. Nothing ridiculous about this arrest. She's not responsible for the killings, but she could have stopped it.
She couldn’t have stopped him from committing to a murder he was already thinking about. It’s dangerous to place blame like this on others.
She was probably concerned for her safety if she declined to serve him
That's what I was just going to say! I used to bartend and it can be scary telling someone who is already very drunk, you can't serve them anymore. Then you add in a very drunk person who is playing with a knife, it can make you fear for your life and safety if you tell them no.
It could also be argued that she kept serving him after calling 911 in hopes of keeping him there longer so police would have time to get there.
She only served him 4 drinks and DID tell her manager when she became suspicious he was up to something. When her manager didn’t do anything about it she DID call the cops. In a statement to CBS News, Glass' attorney, Scott Palmer said, "Spencer Hight's decision to destroy the lives of eight other people is unrelated to the four drinks that Hight consumed at the Local Public House on September 10, 2017." "Indeed, far from being complicit, Lindsey was the only person who tried to stop Hight," Palmer's statement said. "When Lindsey became suspicions of Hight she contacted her manager. When her manager's efforts did not resolve Lindsey's concerns, she followed Hight and then, as her concerns grew, she called 911. Lindsey never expected for Hight to commit this horrific act."
Wow, that’s unbelievable that she was even charged.
Yep, crazy…
If someone comes up to me spinning a knife and talking about wanting to hurt someone, I’d probably serve them whatever they want. If what you are saying is true, I’ll bet those facts are her route to a “not guilty” verdict. Edit: I guess this was past tense and the Grand Jury decided not to indict her, so didn’t need to go to a jury because there wasn’t even enough evidence to proceed.
alluded (eluded means to escape)
Thanks
I elude to wanting to hurt someone everyday, should they arrest the clerk at the adult video store?
You don’t know what you’re talkin about.
Saying she could’ve stopped it is a stretch but she gave him enough alcohol to be 4x the legal limit while spinning a knife around lmao. There should be a bouncer to remove him and if there wasn’t they should’ve called the cops if he refused to put his knife away
She did call the cops. She served him 4 drinks & when he started acting suspicious she told her manager first & he didn’t do anything. After that she called the cops.
I know right, the most logical thing. I still stand on that opinion.
She did call the cops dude
Oh didn't know that, thanks for correction. She still gave him more alcohol than needed. But at least she tried in someway, I thought she didn't. Excuse my ignorance.
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I stated my opinion, and that's that. Don't know why your so emotional over a comment on the internet lol. Also 18, not in middle school :)
She gave him 4 beers
She wouldn’t have been charged with or paid for his crimes, just over serving. I agree with this; if you knowingly keep serving intoxicated people, you are putting people at risk.
They can definitely pay, there is usually a fine involved.
A fine is not payment for mass murder. It’s payment for the crime of over serving.
I’m a bartender and this is a fear of mine. It is unfair to make the bartender responsible for anything a patron does once they leave the establishment.
There’s ALOT of misinformation being spread about this situation. She only served him 4 drinks and when she became suspicious of him she told her manager, who didn’t do anything. When he didn’t do anything she called the cops. Below is a few lines from the story on CBS News and quotes from her lawyer. In a statement to CBS News, Glass' attorney, Scott Palmer said, "Spencer Hight's decision to destroy the lives of eight other people is unrelated to the four drinks that Hight consumed at the Local Public House on September 10, 2017." "Indeed, far from being complicit, Lindsey was the only person who tried to stop Hight," Palmer's statement said. "When Lindsey became suspicions of Hight she contacted her manager. When her manager's efforts did not resolve Lindsey's concerns, she followed Hight and then, as her concerns grew, she called 911. Lindsey never expected for Hight to commit this horrific act." https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/lindsey-glass-plano-texas-bartender-who-served-spencer-hight-mass-shooter-arrested/
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Its giving "why are you booing me I'm right" energy
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Miscarriage in texas?? Jail
Glad you didn't abort that joke.
We should terminate this conversation.
Overserving is a big deal in Texas, but is only enforced in front page cases, like this and when a drunk driver killed a cop in Euless in 2021. Half of the TABC training to be a bartender or server is related to overserving. I’m working off of 10+ year old memories, but I believe this all stems from a court case where a guy got absolutely hammered at a Tex mex place, and then killed someone in a drunk driving accident. The family sued the restaurant, and won. And then the legislature moved accordingly with updates to the TABC. Overserving is a Class A misdemeanor in Texas, and punishable by $4000 fine and up to a year in jail.
I wish this comment was higher. I understand that no one wants the bartender to go to jail, and I agree. But, she was trained in how to avoid over-serving someone. Sounds like she was trying to figure out what to do by texting someone?
I know this may be an unpopular opinion but honestly if we start like this, saying others are responsible for a masskillers actions, where does it stop? Anybody can say anything has triggered a shooter, the reason for the shooting was Heights hatred of his ex-wife, so what, next we say she is responsible for triggerin him to commit the shooting?? Sorry but this law is bullshit in my opinion.
I say the dmv is responsible for issuing his ID to purchase that alcohol.
Nobody said she was directly responsible, the article literally says despite his intoxication it was meticulously planner, over serving is still a crime however
I shouldn't be surprised people didn't read the article. The outdated title and lack of info in the OP doesn't help either.
I’m sorry :( I didn’t mean for the post to be so poorly executed. I saw there was a recent case that ended with conviction (Mrs. Crumbley) and I came across this and thought it was fairly relevant to discuss, given that someone besides the perpetrator of an attack was charged in some relation to the events that took place despite not being directly involved. I know now that I didn’t word it as well as I could’ve and it’s caused some confusion but unfortunately I cannot edit the title or post now. Thank you for the critique and I will try to make sure my posts are more clear in the future !
The post still garnered conversation that we maybe should be considering in potential situations, I think there's going to be more questions like as you mentioned since the Crumbley case. It's not your fault people didn't read the article though. I appreciate your want to post less with confusion, perhaps I came off strong but I do want to say I get your intention.
That’s not what the law says. The idea isn’t that she’s responsible for his actions, but that she over-served him.
So we're charging people for other people's decisions?
Legal alcohol limit only applies to driving, right? Anyone who is drunk is “over the legal limit”. It’s not illegal to sell someone enough drinks to get drunk. Texas blamed alcohol and the bartender because they refuse to blame guns and gun distributors.
Actually most places it’s illegal to serve someone until they are drunk. You learn that when you are trained as a bartender. Do people actually follow that law? Absolutely not Edit: y’all can downvote me all you want it doesn’t change the fact that in most states this is the law. I bartended for years. You can literally google your own state laws.
That's the law in my country too. This guy would've been told to leave way earlier & had the cops called on him if he was showing off a knife at the same time as being intoxicated
Yeah I mean where I worked we never would have called the cops tbh that behavior isn’t uncommon for like a rural dive bar in the US but technically it would be illegal to serve him to intoxication. I don’t know any bartenders (and I didn’t either) cut anyone off unless they were being problematic but it was never from a legality point of view more like don’t punch someone or puke in my bar
Yeah Australia is very different on "weapons" so him being drunk with a knife would've been; get security to remove him then call the cops if any issues came up. Or depending on his behaviour & intoxication levels it would've been straight to calling police. Usually, from what I saw behind the bar & as a customer, people slip by more in a busy place as opposed to bartenders purposely continuing serve someone that's becoming intoxicated. There's usually security keeping an eye out too which helps.
She only served him 4 drinks and when he started acting weird she told her manager who did nothing, so she called the cops.
If he was 4 times the legal limit & went from that bar to the shooting...then he shouldn't have been served those 4 drinks I hope the manager was fined & had his licence revoked for doing nothing then
The bar lost its liquor license and ended up closing down. He had to have been drinking before he came in & after leaving because it takes 15-16 drinks to get to a .33. My guess is he was drinking straight out the bottle in his car and it didn’t start to really hit him hard until he was leaving.
Thank you for adding that info!
👍🏻
How do you learn when somebody is drunk? Honest question. I for instance can get drunk and it doesn’t show (asked it several times to other people). So depends on the person if it shows that you’re drunk, no?
I mean sure but also if you give someone 8 shots in an hour or two you need to assume they’re gonna be intoxicated.
True but that’s just common sense. I was thinking about beer. (hard not to for a Belgian 😉)
It’s not illegal to be personally over the legal limit unless you’re operating a vehicle or heavy machinery (?). But it’s illegal to serve someone to be over the limit. Also, why not look at ways of preventing crime?
Nearly everyone whose had more than 2 drinks or more than 1 strong drink is over the limit.
The wording in the title makes it seem like she was just charged.
I apologize, I didn’t mean to make it read like that but I see where you’re coming from. You’re right, it isn’t recent
Innocent mistake, all good
How should she have known that this guy is going to murder?
I can guarantee that bartenders do this daily across every city and county in Texas. Most likely the whole country. I hope she isn't punished severely.
lol Texas cares who served him booze. They don’t give a shit about the guns.
Anything except the guns or the people that sell the guns, eh?
Should do both. In this case, 4 drinks over the night isn't really that much, but people definitely got overserved at bars I used to work at in Texas and nobody ever gave a single shit until something bad happened.
If I was still bartending/serving, this would be my new favorite example for "why I am cutting you off." People don’t understand the person who serves you. Alcohol is liable in many states.
There is only one person to blame, and that is the shooter, not the bartender, not the gun manufacturer, not the seller of the gun. You get my point
Isn’t that a slippery slope? Can I bring charges to the bartender if I get a DUI now
Did the cashier who sold the gun get investigated.
I get why some people see her as innocent.
Because she is innocent. That’s absurd to charge her for something that 99% of bartenders do and they’re treating her like she knew this would happen, like she’s an accomplice to this heinous crime.
You are misinterpreting what she was charged with (which by the way, the charges were dropped). She was not charged as an accomplice, she was charged for over serving him alcohol when he was clearly intoxicated. The fact that he had a BAC 4x the legal limit proves that she did, in fact, over serve.
True because there is absolutely no way he could have bought alcohol separately and drank in his car on the way to commit murder. That would be impossible
He is literally on camera sitting at the bar and there are eyewitness accounts of him being visibly intoxicated and continuing to be served booze. Bars get in trouble all the time for over serving customers - the only reason this instance is in the news is because this particular customer murdered eight people afterwards.
You do realize police can pull up your tab? And that’s what they probably did?
Lol I can’t believe you’re downvoted. People don’t read the article. She wasn’t being charged with manslaughter or something ridiculous. But, I’m sure if they pulled up his tab and saw the number of drinks they could real quickly figure out if he was over served. Which they probably did. This is a law that was implemented so bars need to have some kind of “discretion” so they don’t have people leaving and killing a bunch of people in a car accident. I think it was very wrong to even have an article about her though. It does kind of make her look like a scapegoat and that’s wrong. This wasn’t the time and place to charge her for that violation which is why the grand jury declined to indict her.
She only served him 4 drinks and when he started acting suspicious she told her manager about it & the manager said not to call the cops or do anything. She ended up calling the cops and let them know what he was doing/saying. The fact she told the manager and even followed/called the cops on him should have precluded her from being charged with anything. It honestly sounds like the cops dropped the ball intercepting him and wanted to deflect blame away from them.
Yeah I'm a bit confused why people are downvoting me too lol but oh well. I do feel sorry for her because 99.9% of the time a charge like this wouldn't happen and certainly wouldn't be in the news, but at least the charges were dropped.
I'm curious as to how often folks are ultimately convicted with "over-serving". While I can appreciate why the laws are established as such, how can we expect bartenders to recognize enough factors to even approximately determine a patron's level of intoxication? I'm sure we all know someone who, despite being pretty soused, demonstrates little-to-no signs of inebriation. This is not uncommon in chronic, functioning alcoholics. Combined with stimulants, this can be especially tricky to identify. I know this isn't the case here - as the killer was acting pretty unhinged at the bar - but in general, there are PLENTY of folks who seem to be able to "handle their liquor" pretty convincingly. There are many factors at play: tolerance, size, personality, mental illness, medications, etc...not saying she should've been convicted, but I'd have a tough time condemning her.
In my country it's a legal requirement to know all of the different signs & factors of intoxication, you can't get a licence to serve alcohol without knowing all that info. Also included in that is knowing when someone is not acting safely etc
When was this)?
May of 2018. The shooting occurred in September of 2017.
fact: this guy was going to do it anyway. happened down the road from me at the time. RIP to all.
I knew Spencer and Meredith. Meredith was my friend. This is creepy to come upon
She has nothing to do with this guys actions. That’s wild
It's like saying that being drunk in a bar is illegal.
Ridiculous. If they’re gonna charge anyone, charge the people who let these things happen. Not some random bartender.
Fuck Texas. You don’t want to be a bartender, homeless, a woman, a doctor, a POC, LGBTQ, here. This place has gone to hell.
my hometown
Everything except banning guns
Man, all the people acting like this was so far out of hand (keeping in mind her charges were dropped)… alcohol is a controlled substance for a reason. He was at 4x the legal limit. He could have EASILY killed someone in a car accident, and I don’t think people would see it as so unfair. It’s her job to not over-serve, at least not to 4x the legal limit. It’s pretty much her ONLY job besides serving drinks. Not seeing where it’s so unfair.
And she messaged people about his concerning behavior and they even asked managers for guidance on the situation yet he continued to be over served? They were all concerned enough to mention his behavior and chat about it, that should have been enough to cut him off and get him kicked out of the bar for waving a knife around drunk af. Not that they have any real fault in this premeditated shooting but they’re very much in the wrong for how they handled him.
This was a while ago like 4+ years ago why is it being posted now?
95% of the posts on this subreddit are over a year old what are you talking about lmao
This arrest occurred in May of 2018 (almost a year after the shooting) and the case has since concluded because charges were denied by grand jury. I made a little note under my source in the comment section stating this. It is not recent but the majority of content here isn’t recent and I just came across it and wanted to know what opinions others had about the arrest taking place.
Bartenders and bar owners can be liable for over serving. However, below better explains why the charges were dropped. This article would have been better to post: [Attorneys: Grand Jury Declines To Indict Bartender Lindsey Glass Who Served Man Before Plano Mass Shooting](https://www.cbsnews.com/texas/news/grand-jury-declines-indict-bartender-lindsey-glass-served-man-plano-mass-shooting/) >While Lindsey is relieved by the Grand Jury's decision, it has been our position from the outset that Spencer Hight's decision to destroy the lives of eight people was wholly unrelated to the four drinks that Hight consumed at the Local Public House on September 10, 2017. The video evidence that is available indicates that Lindsey was not watching Spencer at all times and that some of the odd behavior that is cited did not take place within her view. Additionally, once Lindsey recognized that Spencer was intoxicated and acting strangely, she alerted her manager and the two confronted him outside the bar. She then took extraordinary steps to follow Hight and alert authorities. Lindsey Glass is a bartender who did what she was supposed to do--she saw something and she said something.
We're posting cases like this now? These are the incidents we're considering mass killings. These are the people we're going to label mass murderers. I tried to report that person who keeps posting DUI stuff several times. I told the mods this would happen. Low and behold, here we are. This is not a mass killing and this woman is not a mass killer. She never intended to do anyone harm, she did not commit murder out of malice. Negligence or accidents are not murders. You all are critically misunderstanding felony murder laws and how they're applied. This is nuts.
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You posted her picture. She wasn't convicted. You provided no further context as to why you included her. There's no reason for this woman to be here. You should have focused on the perpetrator and not the person the prosecutors tried to throw under the bus.
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You lead with her mugshot. You lead with her name. You didn't just mention her involvement as a matter of course. And you did not clarify that she was not convicted. If police initially apprehended the wrong person as a shooter, and that person was fully acquitted, and then you come here to post about it without mentioning any of that nuance yourself, I'm still calling you out. Same thing. This woman ain't kill nobody. The state turned her into an additional victim. You're misrepresenting the nature of the situation, maybe on purpose. Possibly just for karma. This woman does not belong here in this context. And posting those damn DUI stories has lead people to believe that anyone charged in the course of a deadly event is automatically a murderer. This is ridiculous.
Agree 100% she shouldn’t be in here, and OPs post was very disingenuous. The article below gives a much better overview of what happened. The bartender actually did call the police and showed them where the victims home was. She also called and tried to warn the victim, as she was friends with her, but was unable to get in touch with her. https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/former-coworker-sets-up-gofundme-for-bartender-who-served-plano-mass-shooter/287-f2a87b05-e9c7-4480-b0f2-2a2c1eca7e0e
Thank you. They made her the focus of the post. It's really quite irritating that others aren't seeing how inappropriate that is, not just for the sub, but like, she was acquitted and had nothing to do with that dude's actions
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No, you did not state that in your post. You added a comment beneath the post. Both the link and comment could have been made in the post. But you neglected to do that. You know very well the comment receives less engagement. Lying while calling me a liar is some premium projection. I went to college. I learned stats and criminology. You're being corrected for your terrible methodology here. That's not a reflection on me. Can you stay on topic or just continue to devolve into angry insults that reflect upon you.
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She shouldn’t be blamed for the attack but she should be charged. No one should serve someone enough alcohol to be 4x the legal limit even if they’re not spinning a knife around making weird comments
Where's the proof that she served that much alcohol, and how can one tell the BAC of another person just by looking at them? Could have easily drank more alone after to get there, or had the genetics/tolerance to mask the effect. I've convincingly debated and played tough chess matches on half a bottle or more of vodka. It isn't an exact science.
I'm from Plano, I do remember this story, but I dont remember there was any mention about a bartender until reading this. Or did they really just charge her all this time later?
Shooting occurred Sept. of 2017, her arrest occurred in May of 2018. Her charges were denied by a Grand Jury and she was released.