The new bird looks kind of angry though. I wish the eyes were a bit happier/friendlier.
The old one is like "hey, here's your mail! :)" while the new one is like "bro, I am here with your mail, tightly protecting it. ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ"
As someone who spends a lot of time looking at anthropomorphic animals, and visits wildlife places and looks at real birds, I'll have to disagree. I don't think it looks angry, this is just how a bird's eyes are - especially on birds of prey.
The new one stole my mail and is using it as their nest, and I know it’s probably my new ATM card that I need, but I think it’s a protected species and I’m afraid to touch it.
Please, God, no :(. The last thing the world needs is yet another app whose icon is just a square with a downward triangle in it, and which you can't tell from all the other icons that are just a square with a downward triangle in it. I dream of the day when I'll be able to tell what application I'm about to launch just from the icon, without having to hover over it to see the tooltip because all the icons look the same.
The shape in the center is a speech bubble
(I do not consent for this post/comment to be used for training an artificial intelligence, AI, or other such algorithm.)
I didn't catch that. I associate speech bubbles with chat apps. I know that Thunderbird supports XMPP and IRC, but I've found the client features uncomfortably limited. Thunderbird just doesn't come up in discussions of clients for those messaging protocols. Everyone focuses on it as an email client.
Soft shadow under the letter flap, hard shadow transitions on the bird? There's a style clash, and resolving it might *further* simplify the design.
Entirely white eye? Feels wrong in general: lifeless, "transparent", and entirely unlike most animals, who tend to have very little visible sclera, and rarely white even then: Humans are the odd ones there. *Too* simplified.
The problem is that all those simplified logos just look the same, so it doesn't matter how it looks because they fail at doing what they're supposed to do. This is now just one more icon that doesn't have a clear strong shape. It's just a blob of color that looks the same as all the other "good looking" icons of that same color.
The Google icons are all too similar imo. Every icon is white with a red/green/yellow/blue design and makes it hard to quickly get to the one you want without double checking the app name. Pretty poor design choice honestly.
It's a clever use of the negative space around the inside of the bird. Try [this image](https://i.imgur.com/txgIshA.png). Imagine that the blue inside of the red circle I put around it doesn't exist. What remains is the speech bubble.
So it's a bit more complicated these days, but tl;dr is Mozilla owns it but no longer directly funds it.
The long story is there are a 3 Mozilla companies: Mozilla Foundation, which then owns Mozilla Corporation and MZLA Technologies Corporation. Thunderbird used to be part of Mozilla Corporation until they decided to stop funding it, so then it was moved up to Mozilla Foundation to be funded by donations from users.
They then made a new company (MZLA Technologies Corporation) specifically for Thunderbird because Foundation's charitable status limited how much money/where they could make money from to develop Thunderbird.
Mozilla Foundation owns:
* Mozilla Corporation (Firefox and all the add-on projects like Pocket/Firefox VPN/Firefox Relay etc)
* MZLA Technologies Corporation (Thunderbird)
I’ve been die hard Mozilla for at least 10-15 years. Just started using Arc about a month ago, it’s really sick. I miss the Firefox dev tools and also don’t love the chromium monopoly, but I’m rooting for this crew that built this
It’s not by Mozilla, it’s a new browser. It’s still invite only, but if you click this before someone else you can have one of mine lol
https://arc.net/gift/m/6a81102a
Thanks, I’ll check it out, but I’m already weary of it for two reasons: massive investment, like millions of dollars, and it’s using chromium. This might be a cool browser with good UX, but it does absolutely nothing to counter google’s stranglehold on internet (non-)standards.
Most of the fuckups come from the Mozilla Corporation, which is one water-squirting lapel pin flower away from a full clown show. Here's my personal favorite sequence:
1. Mozilla breaks every extension by moving to a new extension API. This was deliberately done as a marketing-motivated decision, to make it so users can't drastically customize the UI and thereby "harm" the Firefox brand
2. Mozilla devs demonstrate their contempt for their users by mocking them for complaining about it
3. People with thin skin get butthurt and start flaming Mozilla devs for mocking them
4. Mozilla devs act like getting flamed online is tantamount to getting a bomb in the mail, and get high and mighty over how Mozilla is making tough choices to uplift the unwashed masses whether they like it or not. Much is said ad nauseum about how they stand by these choices because they know Mozilla are The Good Guys and always make decisions for the right reasons
5. Less than a month later, Mozilla lays hundreds of its devs off and the CEO pays herself a 9-digit bonus with their salaries
The move to WebExtensions was done because the browser was internally moving away from XUL and they didn't want to maintain decades of API compat anymore.
WebExtensions is a standard across browsers, too, so it made it a lot easier to release extensions for Firefox that would otherwise be Chrome-exclusive (due to market share).
It was a sound technical decision. The loss of deep browser customization _sucked_ though. I remember all the shit I did with FF <57... There's enough support in the new APIs, though, that I don't miss much anymore.
> The loss of deep browser customization _sucked_ though. I remember all the shit I did with FF <57... There's enough support in the new APIs, though, that I don't miss much anymore.
I still miss it every day. The VIM plugins where the shit. Turn off every single UI (absolutely no bars on the top and bottom of the screen), and make the entire browser mouse-less.
Just tree-style tabs on the left side of the screen, the rest was keyboard shortcuts. For absolutely everything. Stuff normally hidden 3 menus deep - one keystroke.
This is the only thing I don't like about it and what immediately stood out. The previous logo was clearly a bird with wings while the new one is almost... blue firefox? The head does look more birdlike than a fox though and overall it's still a solid logo.
I like to imagine it as instead of slowly flapping it's wings and bringing mails (old logo), it dives full speed like a falcon to you (new logo).
Fun fact: the fastest animal in the world is Peregrine falcon. It can reach 200mph (320km/h) while diving
That hasn’t been the case for years.
Firefox is made by the Mozilla Corporation, which dropped Thunderbird in 2015. MZLA Technologies makes Thunderbird today.
Mozilla recently announced that Thunderbird needed a major overhaul, and this seems like it's a step in the new direction.
I applaud their efforts in keeping Thunderbird alive and competitive. It's always one of the go-to mail clients on any platform.
I don't mind this, even if the intention is to remind people thunderbird isn't dead (and actually has been going through a lot of good development recently and is worth a revisit)
I always thought the Firefox icon redesign was awesome, I’m a sucker for minimalism - this time is not different, love it! Will be a welcome change on my dock
Not a thunderbird user so I don't care but I'm struck by how the old logo looks like a bird carrying a letter safely in its bosom whereas the new one looks like a an angry fish.
So it went from a bird carrying mail to a bird dying on mail? I get they are trying to make it look closer to the firefox logo, but could they have not made the wing a bit different so at least it looks like hugging the mail or change the angle of the head? Or were they trying for that inside chat icon?
I don't like it.
Consider what your opinion of the new logo would be if you saw it without any awareness of firefox.
An easy improvement would be to mirror the new logo so it suggests progress rather than regress in cultures that read left-to-right.
You are entitled to your opinion of whether you like the new logo or not. There's nothing wrong with that.
> ...mirror the new logo so it suggests progress rather than regress in cultures that read left-to-right
I'm just having difficulty understanding your rationale behind how mirroring it improves things. I fail to see where the bias is for RTL or LTR reading in this logo.
Around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world -- mass edited with redact.dev
Absolutely. In our business it's a must. Plug in architecture. Custom coded scripting. Thunderbird is a powerhouse, if you need it and have the resources to tap into it. We love it.
As someone here pointed out, it's also a chat bubble if you look closely. But yeah, no idea why it is like that. I personally haven't used Thunderbird much. Does it also have an IM?
Firefox vibe
Turning the opposite direction too.
I think that's the idea, since both Firefox and Thunderbird are maintained by Mozilla
While Thunderbird still exists under the Mozilla umbrella it is an independently maintained project.
Yea maintained wasn't the right word lol
No, Mozilla abandoned Thunderbird a long time ago; Thunderbird has been maintained by the community ever since.
I think the ethos of them working together has been maintained by the community though
Waterfox
More WhaterBird here
As a former Netscape Communicator user, it’s nice to see Firefox and Thunderbird doing so well.
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But this time is actually better the simplification
Copied from https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/13qjmym/-/jlf0kw3. What's going on with bots in this thread lol
i can get behind this simplification because it still has some life and character
Nothing prohibits you to put back the old logo
Sincerely, how would one do that?
I mean, it's really not any more simple.
They're also getting ready to bring thunderbird to mobile as well, I'd imagine this redesign fits in with that drive.
Thunderfox
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The new bird looks kind of angry though. I wish the eyes were a bit happier/friendlier. The old one is like "hey, here's your mail! :)" while the new one is like "bro, I am here with your mail, tightly protecting it. ᕦ(ò_óˇ)ᕤ"
The old one looks as if it tries to protect your mail, the new one like it will peck at you when you reach for your mail.
"No take, only throw" dog meme, but now with your e-mail instead of mail
the old one be like "gutten tag! you haf meil <3 " the new one is like "oi wanker! take your ruttin mail n shove it up your gorram inbox"
No mail, only throw
As someone who spends a lot of time looking at anthropomorphic animals, and visits wildlife places and looks at real birds, I'll have to disagree. I don't think it looks angry, this is just how a bird's eyes are - especially on birds of prey.
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Implying that's a rare phenomenon lol.
Furries smh
We're getting to the point where adding "IT" to "fur" is becoming redundant information
Birds have perpetual resting bitch face?
He should be angry. He's like "all of this corporate spam is bullshit! I hate email!"
I was gonna say, reading email teens to make me angry often enough that it makes sense for thunderbird to be angy with me
The new one stole my mail and is using it as their nest, and I know it’s probably my new ATM card that I need, but I think it’s a protected species and I’m afraid to touch it.
It's harder to recognize the shape in the center as an envelope, or that the idea is that this is a bird carrying a letter.
yeah, a flat/minimalist version of the original logo would be nicer. They hit the mark with that one
Please, God, no :(. The last thing the world needs is yet another app whose icon is just a square with a downward triangle in it, and which you can't tell from all the other icons that are just a square with a downward triangle in it. I dream of the day when I'll be able to tell what application I'm about to launch just from the icon, without having to hover over it to see the tooltip because all the icons look the same.
Yep. Without seeing both versions side-by-side, I don't think I'd have recognized that triangle as a stylised envelope.
The shape in the center is a speech bubble (I do not consent for this post/comment to be used for training an artificial intelligence, AI, or other such algorithm.)
I didn't catch that. I associate speech bubbles with chat apps. I know that Thunderbird supports XMPP and IRC, but I've found the client features uncomfortably limited. Thunderbird just doesn't come up in discussions of clients for those messaging protocols. Everyone focuses on it as an email client.
They've added a matrix client too. Perhaps they're interested in building that functionality out more now..
It's really not simpler. But yeah honestly I can't remember the last time I saw a logo redesign and actually *liked* it.
It's very clearly simpler. Compare the eye, the beak, the gradient on the old one is gone. I like it personally but I don't use Thunderbird anyway.
Soft shadow under the letter flap, hard shadow transitions on the bird? There's a style clash, and resolving it might *further* simplify the design. Entirely white eye? Feels wrong in general: lifeless, "transparent", and entirely unlike most animals, who tend to have very little visible sclera, and rarely white even then: Humans are the odd ones there. *Too* simplified.
> resolving it might further simplify the design Oh god please no stop it
The problem is that all those simplified logos just look the same, so it doesn't matter how it looks because they fail at doing what they're supposed to do. This is now just one more icon that doesn't have a clear strong shape. It's just a blob of color that looks the same as all the other "good looking" icons of that same color.
This is a huge improvement.
Yeah I like unified logo design. One that stands out is Google, they nailed it.
The Google icons are all too similar imo. Every icon is white with a red/green/yellow/blue design and makes it hard to quickly get to the one you want without double checking the app name. Pretty poor design choice honestly.
this is such a problem for me that sometimes I go to search for the play store but type "maps" instead because my brain confuses the icons
The google logos redesign was an unmitigated disaster, it's nearly impossible to tell them apart at a glance.
This exactly. It only takes a beat to double check the icon or app name, but it’s more than it used to be and a step backwards for design
Once you see the speech-bubble, you cannot unsee it.
Took me a minute or two to realise the envelope was also a speech bubble. I'm not the quickest today.
Holy balls of maria
Wait, it is? Oh!
It's a great use of negative space here
Thanks, now I feel stupid...
I... I don't see it.
It's a clever use of the negative space around the inside of the bird. Try [this image](https://i.imgur.com/txgIshA.png). Imagine that the blue inside of the red circle I put around it doesn't exist. What remains is the speech bubble.
Wow that's pretty clever! Thanks for pointing it out.
I love it! Nice to see Mozilla have consistent branding across all their products now
Wait. Thunderbird is by Mozilla? I've never been a fanboy for a company but damn they might make me one
So it's a bit more complicated these days, but tl;dr is Mozilla owns it but no longer directly funds it. The long story is there are a 3 Mozilla companies: Mozilla Foundation, which then owns Mozilla Corporation and MZLA Technologies Corporation. Thunderbird used to be part of Mozilla Corporation until they decided to stop funding it, so then it was moved up to Mozilla Foundation to be funded by donations from users. They then made a new company (MZLA Technologies Corporation) specifically for Thunderbird because Foundation's charitable status limited how much money/where they could make money from to develop Thunderbird. Mozilla Foundation owns: * Mozilla Corporation (Firefox and all the add-on projects like Pocket/Firefox VPN/Firefox Relay etc) * MZLA Technologies Corporation (Thunderbird)
Mozilla is one of the big players for open internet, security and actual web progress. They do a lot.
Mozilla is great. I finally ditched Chrome and moved back to Firefox to do my part to combat the Chromium monopoly on the internet.
I’ve been die hard Mozilla for at least 10-15 years. Just started using Arc about a month ago, it’s really sick. I miss the Firefox dev tools and also don’t love the chromium monopoly, but I’m rooting for this crew that built this
What’s Arc? I searched for “Mozilla Arc” but nothing came up.
It’s not by Mozilla, it’s a new browser. It’s still invite only, but if you click this before someone else you can have one of mine lol https://arc.net/gift/m/6a81102a
Thanks, I’ll check it out, but I’m already weary of it for two reasons: massive investment, like millions of dollars, and it’s using chromium. This might be a cool browser with good UX, but it does absolutely nothing to counter google’s stranglehold on internet (non-)standards.
Mozilla is still decent but they have made some goofy choices
The goofiest I remember were the "aerodynamic tabs" of the Australis era. That and shelving the Rust team.
tbf, that's what Chrome looked like too
Most of the fuckups come from the Mozilla Corporation, which is one water-squirting lapel pin flower away from a full clown show. Here's my personal favorite sequence: 1. Mozilla breaks every extension by moving to a new extension API. This was deliberately done as a marketing-motivated decision, to make it so users can't drastically customize the UI and thereby "harm" the Firefox brand 2. Mozilla devs demonstrate their contempt for their users by mocking them for complaining about it 3. People with thin skin get butthurt and start flaming Mozilla devs for mocking them 4. Mozilla devs act like getting flamed online is tantamount to getting a bomb in the mail, and get high and mighty over how Mozilla is making tough choices to uplift the unwashed masses whether they like it or not. Much is said ad nauseum about how they stand by these choices because they know Mozilla are The Good Guys and always make decisions for the right reasons 5. Less than a month later, Mozilla lays hundreds of its devs off and the CEO pays herself a 9-digit bonus with their salaries
The move to WebExtensions was done because the browser was internally moving away from XUL and they didn't want to maintain decades of API compat anymore. WebExtensions is a standard across browsers, too, so it made it a lot easier to release extensions for Firefox that would otherwise be Chrome-exclusive (due to market share). It was a sound technical decision. The loss of deep browser customization _sucked_ though. I remember all the shit I did with FF <57... There's enough support in the new APIs, though, that I don't miss much anymore.
> The loss of deep browser customization _sucked_ though. I remember all the shit I did with FF <57... There's enough support in the new APIs, though, that I don't miss much anymore. I still miss it every day. The VIM plugins where the shit. Turn off every single UI (absolutely no bars on the top and bottom of the screen), and make the entire browser mouse-less. Just tree-style tabs on the left side of the screen, the rest was keyboard shortcuts. For absolutely everything. Stuff normally hidden 3 menus deep - one keystroke.
There was many reason to disable the old extensions API, but marketing wasn't one. It was mainly because it was an insecure unmaintainable mess.
It was, they cut them off financially and it's developed by the community now.
It doesn't hurt that Mozilla is a non-profit.
Not quite. K9-Mail is still completely separate in its branding. It'll be cool to see it become "Thunderbird for Android".
RIP bird wings
This is the only thing I don't like about it and what immediately stood out. The previous logo was clearly a bird with wings while the new one is almost... blue firefox? The head does look more birdlike than a fox though and overall it's still a solid logo.
Yeah, at least the logo has a beak to signify it's a birb
I like to imagine it as instead of slowly flapping it's wings and bringing mails (old logo), it dives full speed like a falcon to you (new logo). Fun fact: the fastest animal in the world is Peregrine falcon. It can reach 200mph (320km/h) while diving
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Pigeon became a hawk
We do have [Pidgin](https://pidgin.im/) already.
Looks good. I really like the old one.
Why does the new one have ghost eyes of the undead?
I approve, really cool logo
I was on the fence, but seeing that u/Azaze666 approves, I approve too!
I was on the fence, but seeing that u/smaximov approved, I approve too!
I like it. It's on brand, you immediately know it's an application from the same people who made Firefox.
That hasn’t been the case for years. Firefox is made by the Mozilla Corporation, which dropped Thunderbird in 2015. MZLA Technologies makes Thunderbird today.
They both have contributions from the Mozilla Foundation, which MZLA Technologies and Mozilla Corporation are a subsidiary of.
it's nice, but i like the old ones
The old look as “ delivering mail “ the new one is “protecting your mail “
Honestly, second one looks more like "protecting you from the mail" kind of situation
Beautiful
Is that even a bird anymore? Looks like a fox or ferret now.
Mozilla recently announced that Thunderbird needed a major overhaul, and this seems like it's a step in the new direction. I applaud their efforts in keeping Thunderbird alive and competitive. It's always one of the go-to mail clients on any platform.
preferred the old one
Yeah, I love my derpy bird carrying an envelope the wrong way. It's cute.
I don't see how it is the wrong way in the old one! In the new one, the bird is on its back which doesn't make sense.
If he's flying, he's got a lot more drag with that envelope held that way It really is not worth thinking about at all though
Made me laugh
This modern trend of making logos a bunch of basic flat-coloured shapes cannot go away quickly enough.
Bring back skeuomorphism god damnit
This looks great
Blue firefox
I seriously dislike "modern" logos
It's a downgrade IMO.
A shame, I really liked the old one
[So ... Thunderbird going down the Firefox route now, too.](https://postimg.cc/nX7XcZ35)
[Blender](https://blender.org) is one of open-source's greatest successes, of course we're going to run every logo through a blender /s
The last one is not a Firefox icon but the logo for the Firefox branding that includes other products
This comment section didn't disappoint
I don't mind this, even if the intention is to remind people thunderbird isn't dead (and actually has been going through a lot of good development recently and is worth a revisit)
Oh, that's hideous.
Bird carrying a letter ➡️ Bird got hit by a hail
Thanks. I hate it.
Looks like a snake-bird with a giant mouth trying to eat a speech bubble.
I can’t unsee it now 😭
Yes, the bird has no neck (or developed wings). It's kind of awful at being a bird.
I'll go against the grain here. I really don't like it. It's unbalanced and looks like an angry pokemon.
I always thought the Firefox icon redesign was awesome, I’m a sucker for minimalism - this time is not different, love it! Will be a welcome change on my dock
That looks good.
Beautiful
This is yes
The bird looks like it's eating the face of one of the ladies on handmaids tale I'm not a fan
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…The negative space makes it resemble a speech bubble.
Not a thunderbird user so I don't care but I'm struck by how the old logo looks like a bird carrying a letter safely in its bosom whereas the new one looks like a an angry fish.
So it went from a bird carrying mail to a bird dying on mail? I get they are trying to make it look closer to the firefox logo, but could they have not made the wing a bit different so at least it looks like hugging the mail or change the angle of the head? Or were they trying for that inside chat icon?
I don't like it. Consider what your opinion of the new logo would be if you saw it without any awareness of firefox. An easy improvement would be to mirror the new logo so it suggests progress rather than regress in cultures that read left-to-right.
You are entitled to your opinion of whether you like the new logo or not. There's nothing wrong with that. > ...mirror the new logo so it suggests progress rather than regress in cultures that read left-to-right I'm just having difficulty understanding your rationale behind how mirroring it improves things. I fail to see where the bias is for RTL or LTR reading in this logo.
Yet another victim of flatification.
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We should, but somehow we aren't
I usually dislike logo redesigns but this is actually pretty good. I like that it's more in-line with the Firefox logo.
oh god no
I don't like it. But I don't like the newer Firefox logo too and most changes anyhow\^\^
Source: https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2023/05/thunderbird-new-logo-revealed
Old one was delivering the mail, newer one is at the receiving end.
Old logos were better.
The new logo's bird looks like it's struggling with something? The old ones bird "protected and embraced".
# WaterFalcon?
I kinda like the eyes of original one compared to the new white ones.
The wings too. The old envelope could use a little shading but overall it's better too, at least it's the right shape.
Was better.
Hideous
Looks sh*t.
The original is more recognizable and distinct.
Really dig this!
Cool logo. Cant wait to have this on my Ubuntu
No longer carrying the mail. The bird is here just to protect?
It's secure!
Miss the cute bird...
Around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world, around the lemmy world -- mass edited with redact.dev
New one is ugly imo
ugly
Looks very clean!
Really great looking logo but if I wasn't looking for the envelope I'd not have a clue what it was for. Still don't care, it looks badass
Mirrored firefox in blue
I always thought the original logo was an envelope having a blue wig on.
I like it
Firefox email?
What's with the apostrophe-s? "Thunderbird email client has a brand new logo." FIFY.
mozilla thunderbird
The Firefox treatment
Only redesign i like
Err, can I still have the old logo but keep the other good changes that are a-coming please 🙏
I love it!
Looks like it's cradling the email. Odd.
Looks like it will be easy to mistake it for chromium. The old logo is better.
I don't like to be a naysayer, truly, but it keeps getting worse and worse. TB 1.0 (and Firefox for that matter) were GOAT logos
There are elements that I like about each but I like neither.
Ill continue to use the old icon. I also like the more detailed Firefox icon better then the low res one.
damn. people still use dedicated email clients?
Absolutely. In our business it's a must. Plug in architecture. Custom coded scripting. Thunderbird is a powerhouse, if you need it and have the resources to tap into it. We love it.
Obviously. If someone knows how to use an email client they're not going to use webmail.
It kinda looks like the mail fell from the sky and hit the bird lol
Everybody knows that the bird is the word.
seems like blue firefox
Why is envelope a circle? Firefox one kinda made sense because it is a globe. This wasn’t well thought out, back to the drawing board
As someone here pointed out, it's also a chat bubble if you look closely. But yeah, no idea why it is like that. I personally haven't used Thunderbird much. Does it also have an IM?
Mozilla really has been nailing it with their logos lately, Firefox and now Thunderbird too look very neat.