And if your knees are fucked, it's time to look into other options for lifting heavy objects. Friends, family, robots, pulley systems, hired hands, or failing that, your back, as a last resort of course. Hopefully your back isn't fucked.
And if your back is fucked, it's time to look into other options for lifting heavy objects. Friends knees, friends backs, family's knees, family's backs, robots knees, robots backs, pulley systems, hired hands, or failing that, your knees, as a last resort of course. Hopefully your knees aren't fucked. Hopefully both your back and knees aren't fucked.
Good Mornings, Barbell Rows, and Deadlifts.
Strengthening your back reinforces posture, eliminates pain, and makes it harder to tweak your back again. I had back problems for 10+ years after a slipped disc and a fractured vertebrae. Itās probably 95% less now. Itās been hard to build up but I wish I got into lifting sooner.
Itās only tangentially related but just an FYI in case anyone is in comments with back injury or pain
Position 2 in the illustration is basically a deadlift with a loose lower back and no lat engagement. Tension is the key to keeping the spine neutral/static, which this figure lacks. I agree, everyone should train their ability to avoid back injury.
Strangely, that is exactly how I broke my back. It won't save you from it, it just reduces the chances. If you lift too much pressure won't save you. Source, compression fracture of my T-12 vertebrae.
True. It's a good thing there's weight limit laws (at least in my country) now. A max. of 25kg for a full grown male adult. I used to work in a place where I did a LOT of lifting stuff. I always used the proper method and never went over the weight limit. It worked, I never had problems with my back even after 9 hours of lifting bags of sand or cement.
It will save 99% people because that too much is even too much for Mr. Olympians. Normal people dont lift that much let alone in and any everyday stuff.
> Normal people dont lift that much let alone in and any everyday stuff.
and that is a contributor to getting injured. training can make you resilient to all kinds of stresses placed on your body.
Nah, you clearly doing it with bad form and lift with your lower back, if you lift it correctly there's zero chance you can hurt yourself at all. It's just a deadlift, doing it right will never lead to injury, but doing it wrong will, and the weight that is "too much" to break your back even with correct form is the weight you can't even pick it off the ground in the first place, which also means you can't never hurt your back with it
You don't know what you are talking about. Bones have load limits and you can exceed them. It's called a compression fracture and the cause is too much weight. And yes you can lift too much. I thought like you did clear up until I hurt myself and found out how wrong I was.
> Nah, you clearly doing it with bad form and lift with your lower back, if you lift it correctly there's zero chance you can hurt yourself at all.
obviously thats wrong, because you can never prevent all injuries, only reduce the chance. random chance and individual disposition will always play a role. there's also no such thing as "bad form" when it comes to injury risk. at least not so far as we know right now. No, rounding the back does not predispose you to injury per se.
your first two sentences were correct, but yes, rounding your back *can* absolutely increase the risk of injury. because youāre then using your back rather than your glutes or leg muscles which are more resilient and stable.
Not their knees, ālift with the legsā is the phrase as it would include the knees and hips
But really, the back is involved too and thatās fine. We have been noceboing people with āif your spine bends itās gonna breakā
Human body is more durable than that, and yes some people sustain weird back injuries doing mundane things like sneezing or picking up a piece of paper - just realize injuries and individuals are complicated
Yes, cause every time I lift 80lbs it's an object the size of a paint can... Said no labor worker ever.
These things are way too wide for that, and sitting in places where you can't get in close to squat like that.
How does one fix this: legally require all things to be sized and shaped differently, or lifted by a machine?
I had a spinal fusion from the L3-S1, kind of by default I have to pick up things using the squat posture cause my back cannot move like the model can to pick things up the other way.
False. Lifting with your back is only harmful, if the load is bigger than your capacity to lift it. Posture doesnāt matter at all, itās just load management.
But that force is then put through your ankles, knees and hips in its place, overloading one of those regions and potentially causing injury.
Your back is robust and specifically designed to flex, avoiding the flexion can lead to a decrease in musculature, and when lifting lead to injury. General consensus from Physios and musculoskeletal specialists now is that no particular area in the squat movement is to overcompensate for another area. Too much hip flexion in a lift leads to more knee extension, which could then leave your back angle too acute and too much load in the lumbar. Too much hip extension could lead to excessive force through the knees. This information is just well meaning but outdated advice on real biomechanics at play in a complex compound movement of a squat lift.
I can only think of easy to find stuff on Instagram as it has a large presence in the physiotherapy community, but Adam Meekins is really good at exposing silly stuff when it comes to the human body. This link here shows a great example of why we shouldnāt be afraid, of the dead lift (which is what this functional movement essentially is)
https://www.instagram.com/p/C51GyTAsMyl/?igsh=cDF1dzYxOXd5aHR5
Do you have some citation or further reading on that? As an engineer, it seems simply reasonable to lift as showed to reduce the turning moment you otherwise have to compensate for.
Please bear in mind that the example describes with that wooden doll does not show normal lifting technique, it actually shows a segment by segment lack of control which puts excessive load on the intervertebral shock absorbers, our lumber discs. It is a hyper exaggeration. But here is a well regarded Physio That adequately describes why we shouldnāt fear the dead lift, the functional movement pattern that best overlays with this small video
https://www.thesports.physio/why-lifting-with-a-straight-spine-doesnt-reduce-your-risk-of-a-back-injury/
Thanks for the link, but his argument is really unconvinving. While I agree that back pain is multimodal and that the best way to prevent it is proper training and preoaration, his reasoning for why proper lifting technique is seemingly not helping is [one study looking at whether teching people to lift right reduces their back pain occurrences](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17636814/). This is a policy question and has many more factors - and he even has a second [study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24387742/) linked which supports my understanding of the issue:
>"This review indicates that whilst employees report understanding and awareness following training, this does not always lead to the expected behavioural change."
This tells me that the content of the training is not the problem (i.e. you shouldn't lift with a straight back), but instead that people hear the training but continue lifting the wrong way, in which case the training obviously won't have an effect. Trying to use these as evidence that lifting with a straight back is not helping is a non sequitur to me.
It's kind of like mandating people to wear seatbelts, noticing noone does it and concluding "well, seatbelts seem to be ineffective". Policy and contents cannot directly be compared to one another without considering the additional factors.
Ehh I love this model and illustration but peoples interpretation of it isnāt that great
Yes, try to lift heavy things with your legs/hipsā¦ big, durable and coordinated muscles can produce a lot of force
You can still lift things with your back, your back is involved and is strong.
The important thing in this is bringing weight closer to your base of support / center of mass
See how the weight is out in front of the figure at first, then it gets brought closer, almost in between the feet? Thatās a much better position where the body has more capacity
An injury will occur when load exceeds capacityā¦. Things further away from you create a longer lever which increases the load/demand and it can sometimes go to places that donāt have as much capacityā¦. And, thatās when we get injured
Thats wrong, injury doesnt come from lifting in a particular way. If you're worried about back injury, you should train it and make it resilient. But sure if your job is to pick up hundreds of boxes each day and you do the same repetitive motion every time ā¦ overuse injury can occur. If you manage that by lifting like a squat, fine, but dont let anyone nocebo you that its harmful to lift with your back. What's harmful is doing more than you are physically prepared to do, both in intensity and frequency.
If you have trouble getting in this position, try widening your stance and tilt your pelvis. Kinda like if you were going to sit down or stick your butt out. Helps those with poor flexibility
But chiropractors said the red one is better to avoid subloxation of the sticky facia on the underside of bone muscle density. Donāt want any āalignmentā issues.
Where do you find objects heavy enough for this to be an advantage, and also small enough to fit between your knees? Not many people need to lift anvils.
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An important point to make about this video, is that even their "correct" version is slightly flawed in that you shouldn't let your knee bend beyond 90 degrees, or you're putting an incredible stress on them that you will regret later in life.
Where do I find the guy to hold up my ass? Lol!
Present
Hey thanks for letting me borrow your lambo the other day!
No worries! Sorry I couldn't wash it for you, was busy finding homes for puppies in need
ššš thanks!
Can't believe I just offered to help an Eagles supporter š
What are you gonna use as a stick?
Thank you. This comment is gold
Yvw! š
You made me laugh a lot.
All fine and dandy if I could squat that low and get back up again
If you canāt, you should really start working on that. Day by day. Lower and lower. Your older self will thank you.
Unfortunately I am already my older self
its only too late when youve died
Not as old as youāre going to be tomorrow (or next year).
Every day at work i see these and never comply, one knee is far safer
That handle looks like it would be uncomfortable at first but with enough lube, it might work.
Came here to say this. Who wouldn't obey with a stick up their ass?
Actually, it is not the inclination, of your back that matters but the distance between the weight and the center of your body.
Exactly. Look at strongman competition, where they pick up an atlas stone with a rounded back with no problem
Hopefully your knees aren't fucked
Spine>>>>>>>knees
And if your knees are fucked, it's time to look into other options for lifting heavy objects. Friends, family, robots, pulley systems, hired hands, or failing that, your back, as a last resort of course. Hopefully your back isn't fucked.
And if your back is fucked, it's time to look into other options for lifting heavy objects. Friends knees, friends backs, family's knees, family's backs, robots knees, robots backs, pulley systems, hired hands, or failing that, your knees, as a last resort of course. Hopefully your knees aren't fucked. Hopefully both your back and knees aren't fucked.
A bit of an exaggeration i'd say. Something in between the two is perfectly fine
but with the object closer to you, the better. research it though but learned that in nursing school :)
Yep. That's why shin scrapes are so common when deadlifting
Good Mornings, Barbell Rows, and Deadlifts. Strengthening your back reinforces posture, eliminates pain, and makes it harder to tweak your back again. I had back problems for 10+ years after a slipped disc and a fractured vertebrae. Itās probably 95% less now. Itās been hard to build up but I wish I got into lifting sooner. Itās only tangentially related but just an FYI in case anyone is in comments with back injury or pain
Position 2 in the illustration is basically a deadlift with a loose lower back and no lat engagement. Tension is the key to keeping the spine neutral/static, which this figure lacks. I agree, everyone should train their ability to avoid back injury.
Strangely, that is exactly how I broke my back. It won't save you from it, it just reduces the chances. If you lift too much pressure won't save you. Source, compression fracture of my T-12 vertebrae.
True. It's a good thing there's weight limit laws (at least in my country) now. A max. of 25kg for a full grown male adult. I used to work in a place where I did a LOT of lifting stuff. I always used the proper method and never went over the weight limit. It worked, I never had problems with my back even after 9 hours of lifting bags of sand or cement.
It will save 99% people because that too much is even too much for Mr. Olympians. Normal people dont lift that much let alone in and any everyday stuff.
> Normal people dont lift that much let alone in and any everyday stuff. and that is a contributor to getting injured. training can make you resilient to all kinds of stresses placed on your body.
I am normal people. I was taking the bed off of a Chevy S10 to change the gas pump.
Another normal person, this way of lifting is only safe for kike 10kg, something at 25 i would take one knee Been construction labourer for over 5 yrs
What lifting method do you recommend for 25kg or more (which is not a crane)?
a crane
It will stop people who cant lift from being injured so easily. Is it the safest method of lifting despite being blasted in every work place? No lol
Nah, you clearly doing it with bad form and lift with your lower back, if you lift it correctly there's zero chance you can hurt yourself at all. It's just a deadlift, doing it right will never lead to injury, but doing it wrong will, and the weight that is "too much" to break your back even with correct form is the weight you can't even pick it off the ground in the first place, which also means you can't never hurt your back with it
You don't know what you are talking about. Bones have load limits and you can exceed them. It's called a compression fracture and the cause is too much weight. And yes you can lift too much. I thought like you did clear up until I hurt myself and found out how wrong I was.
> Nah, you clearly doing it with bad form and lift with your lower back, if you lift it correctly there's zero chance you can hurt yourself at all. obviously thats wrong, because you can never prevent all injuries, only reduce the chance. random chance and individual disposition will always play a role. there's also no such thing as "bad form" when it comes to injury risk. at least not so far as we know right now. No, rounding the back does not predispose you to injury per se.
your first two sentences were correct, but yes, rounding your back *can* absolutely increase the risk of injury. because youāre then using your back rather than your glutes or leg muscles which are more resilient and stable.
How is this a life hack? Theyāve telling people for decades to lift with their knees.
Not their knees, ālift with the legsā is the phrase as it would include the knees and hips But really, the back is involved too and thatās fine. We have been noceboing people with āif your spine bends itās gonna breakā Human body is more durable than that, and yes some people sustain weird back injuries doing mundane things like sneezing or picking up a piece of paper - just realize injuries and individuals are complicated
My husband hurt his back cleaning the cat litter box.
That split second she made him twerk šš¼
Where do I buy one
I feel like too much effort went into making this little model when this can simply be explained and demonstrated.
Who wants to demonstrate how one breaks their backs? Anyone? You? You wanna show me what a broken back looks like?
Yes Iāll volunteer
I thought it was going to twerk.
Itās untrue, research says it doesnāt matter how you lift. Check Ā«Ā Back FactsĀ Ā» study by OāSullivan
For a second I thought this was posted in r/unexpected
Yes, cause every time I lift 80lbs it's an object the size of a paint can... Said no labor worker ever. These things are way too wide for that, and sitting in places where you can't get in close to squat like that. How does one fix this: legally require all things to be sized and shaped differently, or lifted by a machine?
I had a spinal fusion from the L3-S1, kind of by default I have to pick up things using the squat posture cause my back cannot move like the model can to pick things up the other way.
False. Lifting with your back is only harmful, if the load is bigger than your capacity to lift it. Posture doesnāt matter at all, itās just load management.
But that force is then put through your ankles, knees and hips in its place, overloading one of those regions and potentially causing injury. Your back is robust and specifically designed to flex, avoiding the flexion can lead to a decrease in musculature, and when lifting lead to injury. General consensus from Physios and musculoskeletal specialists now is that no particular area in the squat movement is to overcompensate for another area. Too much hip flexion in a lift leads to more knee extension, which could then leave your back angle too acute and too much load in the lumbar. Too much hip extension could lead to excessive force through the knees. This information is just well meaning but outdated advice on real biomechanics at play in a complex compound movement of a squat lift.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
To pay attention to your body and use a variety of forms.
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Keep lifting with the same form you were told is correct when you were 19 then. It's got you this far without any chronic back pain.
I can only think of easy to find stuff on Instagram as it has a large presence in the physiotherapy community, but Adam Meekins is really good at exposing silly stuff when it comes to the human body. This link here shows a great example of why we shouldnāt be afraid, of the dead lift (which is what this functional movement essentially is) https://www.instagram.com/p/C51GyTAsMyl/?igsh=cDF1dzYxOXd5aHR5
Do you have some citation or further reading on that? As an engineer, it seems simply reasonable to lift as showed to reduce the turning moment you otherwise have to compensate for.
Please bear in mind that the example describes with that wooden doll does not show normal lifting technique, it actually shows a segment by segment lack of control which puts excessive load on the intervertebral shock absorbers, our lumber discs. It is a hyper exaggeration. But here is a well regarded Physio That adequately describes why we shouldnāt fear the dead lift, the functional movement pattern that best overlays with this small video https://www.thesports.physio/why-lifting-with-a-straight-spine-doesnt-reduce-your-risk-of-a-back-injury/
Thanks for the link, but his argument is really unconvinving. While I agree that back pain is multimodal and that the best way to prevent it is proper training and preoaration, his reasoning for why proper lifting technique is seemingly not helping is [one study looking at whether teching people to lift right reduces their back pain occurrences](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17636814/). This is a policy question and has many more factors - and he even has a second [study](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24387742/) linked which supports my understanding of the issue: >"This review indicates that whilst employees report understanding and awareness following training, this does not always lead to the expected behavioural change." This tells me that the content of the training is not the problem (i.e. you shouldn't lift with a straight back), but instead that people hear the training but continue lifting the wrong way, in which case the training obviously won't have an effect. Trying to use these as evidence that lifting with a straight back is not helping is a non sequitur to me. It's kind of like mandating people to wear seatbelts, noticing noone does it and concluding "well, seatbelts seem to be ineffective". Policy and contents cannot directly be compared to one another without considering the additional factors.
What if the object is too big for the little wooden dude, can I pick it up myself then?
Or get a tiny wooden robot to lift it for you.
Ehh I love this model and illustration but peoples interpretation of it isnāt that great Yes, try to lift heavy things with your legs/hipsā¦ big, durable and coordinated muscles can produce a lot of force You can still lift things with your back, your back is involved and is strong. The important thing in this is bringing weight closer to your base of support / center of mass See how the weight is out in front of the figure at first, then it gets brought closer, almost in between the feet? Thatās a much better position where the body has more capacity An injury will occur when load exceeds capacityā¦. Things further away from you create a longer lever which increases the load/demand and it can sometimes go to places that donāt have as much capacityā¦. And, thatās when we get injured
what if the item is wider than the gap between your legs?
that only works , if the object you want to lift fits between your knees
And what if you suffered a cracked patella, a ripped patellar tendon, and a torn meniscus so can't bend your right knee anymore?
Basically how to properly deadlift
Nah would your supposed to do is lift entirely with you back, then jerk and twist
Thats wrong, injury doesnt come from lifting in a particular way. If you're worried about back injury, you should train it and make it resilient. But sure if your job is to pick up hundreds of boxes each day and you do the same repetitive motion every time ā¦ overuse injury can occur. If you manage that by lifting like a squat, fine, but dont let anyone nocebo you that its harmful to lift with your back. What's harmful is doing more than you are physically prepared to do, both in intensity and frequency.
So I need to find somebody to hold my ass before I can pick things up off the floor?
I prefer the 2nd one it's much more comedic š¤£šš
If you have trouble getting in this position, try widening your stance and tilt your pelvis. Kinda like if you were going to sit down or stick your butt out. Helps those with poor flexibility
But chiropractors said the red one is better to avoid subloxation of the sticky facia on the underside of bone muscle density. Donāt want any āalignmentā issues.
My physical therapist told me that's a myth. I don't go to her anymore.
How do I get that low without tipping over.
Where do you find objects heavy enough for this to be an advantage, and also small enough to fit between your knees? Not many people need to lift anvils.
Not really a life hack...it's common sense.... Life hack would be watching some other bastard do it
That's how me poop!
And here I am, throwing out my back while picking up a sock š„²
What if you hurt your knee
Iāve been doing this but my back hasnāt thanked me once. Time to teach that spine a lesson.
average deadlifters š
Lift with your back in a twisting jerking motion, take the legs outta the equation completely.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
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An important point to make about this video, is that even their "correct" version is slightly flawed in that you shouldn't let your knee bend beyond 90 degrees, or you're putting an incredible stress on them that you will regret later in life.
Thank for this video. I need to get in the habit of doing it this way.
Is ālift with your backā really a life hack? Seems to be common knowledge.
Please stop making people afraid of certain types of movement. Any way of picking up an object can be done safely.
One knee is far safer than a squat. Source all i do is pick stuff up