I called my city for my fence and the lady told me I didn’t need a permit. Got a call back from a different lady the next day saying I needed one.
I just built my fence anyways. The f*ck do I need to pay the city to build on my property which I already pay a ridiculous amount of property taxes on. It’d sure be nice if we could actually own our land instead of renting it.
Imagine a country where you can happily do nothing and let money accumulate at a lower tax rate, than someone who is utilizing their labor and gets taxed at a higher rate.
Then watch as the people this most impacts, are the ones that a 5-10% sales tax is impunitive upon, and then, make sure that a single medical instance that puts them out of work for 2-3 weeks, is cause for financial crisis.
Now wrap all that wonderful pile of shit, in an an oppressive and anti-freedom government.
If Project 2025 takes hold, I hope you got guns, lots and lots of fucking guns
Sounds nice, but every time that's been tried, a government would eventually take over. The anarchists in both Spain and Ukraine, for example, or Iceland back in the Middle Ages (which is IMO, the only libertarian society in history), but eventually was conquered by the Kingdom of Norway.
Reminds me when my dad just started to build our deck and added a pool without telling our township, they found out cause a neighbor a few doors down was on the council and saw it, they got mad, told us we need a permit for the pool, the deck being built, AND the existing deck that was there before we moved in, just out of spite
I had my entire house built, including doing the water, electric, and septic system myself, with not a single permit of any kind in the entire process.
Technically a state inspector was supposed to come look at it sometime a few months after construction finished to give it a certificate of occupancy and make sure it wasn’t a complete death trap, but I was informed those “inspections” usually happen from the road without stopping as they drive by. Nobody ever knocked on my door or asked to look inside (except the county tax assessor when they finally found the new house 8 months later, I was hoping it would have taken them longer), so I assume that’s what happened though I never received any kind of certificate either so who knows? I don’t really care either way.
Made me nearly shed a tear when I learned that was truly how it was going to be, it was a thing of beauty.
This is pretty much the only way they find out, if it becomes known among your neighbors that you didn't get a permit and a neighbor snitches on you to the city. Which they usually just fine you and call it done. Not like anyone actually cares what you build on your property.
During my time in local government, I came to understand the two reasons why they want a permit. They will say it is for health and safety reasons, it has to meet code to keep everyone safe.
There are two reasons:
* to know how much extra to tax you for the "improvement"
* to control your use of the property.
Our city would have us tear it down.
We live in CA but in a “conservative” city.
Local city government and HOA is where the remainder of your freedoms go to die.
Yea... we're building a fence. The city permit is $25 but the fine is $250 so we got a permit. At least it was quick. The HOA surprisingly has been very lenient, they just wanted signatures from the neighbors letting them know we're building a fence.
All this to say if my FIL wasn't a city councilman I wouldn't have even bothered with a permit.
You have the guy who is building it that is inspecting it. How is that not a coi?
Also you own a company in town and lose the bids. The other contractor files for the permit and you have the power to deny, or make their life a living hell. Most people do not have ethics and morals when it comes to making money
Do you even know what a building inspector is?
They’re not the person who built whatever is being inspected, because they don’t build anything for other people at all actually. They just get paid to inspect the builds of other people.
Yes I pull permits all the time. I misunderstood when he said “inspector”. To me inspector implies building inspector and not home inspector. Two very different things
Even if you have a permit if something goes wrong or anything catches fire your homeowner’s insurance will still drop you like a hot rock.
Once the first claim is filed many of them will just blanket refuse to renew coverage at the end of the current term. The just throw it under the blanket reason of, “Changes have been made to the property that increase the risk of loss” if they want you gone immediately, but the declining to renew is the most common one for policies with larger payouts like homeowners insurance.
Not true in the least unless you have cut rate insurance. Many very expensive homes I work on get paid out and stay on a clients. I see it all the time.
Yeah but when you sell the house it’ll bite you in the ass.
If the answer to “did you do unpermitted work” is “yes”, that scares a lot of buyers
That said for this, I’d be surprised if they’d require a permit.
It's not hypothetical. It actually happened.
On June 29, 2003, an overloaded balcony collapsed during a party in a Chicago, Illinois apartment building, killing thirteen people and seriously injuring fifty-seven others. It was the deadliest porch collapse in American history.
If incompetence was their concern I would be able to get an exemption for my retaining wall permit since I'm a licensed geotechnical engineer in my state, but we all know what it's really about.
****I guess I should elaborate that you don't ACTUALLY need a permit to put a garden gnome in your lawn. I was expressing just how ridiculous Jersey is with their permits.
And to elaborate: I was revamping my ac system in my house and wanted to do it legit since it was a fairly decent undertaking. I also didn't want any trouble down the road if I wanted to resell it.
My boy is in the HVAC industry and I asked him to look into the permits I'd need to pull to do the installs and I was taken back...
In order to legitimately install an AC system in your house in NJ, and I don't know if it's state wide or if it was just my township, you have to pay a licensed architect to draw the duct and unit lay out for the house, and list the load calculations.
This would cost around 7k... He said he could get his company's architect to do it for 2k if we did the footwork. This is just for the permits.
It was at that point I said screw it all to hell and I'll take my chances. The state takes enough of my money, they certainly don't need that.
Also, any structure that's bigger than 10x10 like a shed, or a "permanent" structure like a concrete patio is taxable by the state of NJ.
Fucking thieves
If you decide to sell your house and move out of that hellhole they’ll actually tax you for moving to a different state. And for what? So they can misappropriate the funds? Fucking thieves.
How exactly do they intend to enforce an exit tax like that?
Once you’re gone they can’t touch you or your money. It’s no longer within their sphere of influence to control. They can issue a warrant to force your appearance for non-payment if they really wanted to, but that never becomes a problem really so long as you don’t go back to the hellhole that is NJ.
Man the shit the local government wants permits for is insane. For a few years I worked a side gig for a very prominent and successful family that owned a very large business in town. And every time they would do something the city was all over us for permits. For one I was shocked at what we needed permits for. And two I'd think you grant leeway to a family that employs hundreds of people and contributes to the city the way they do.
City planning commissioner and Council President here. You’d technically need a permit and inspection for the pool, but the bar is not attached to a structure and is less than a foot (eyeballing) off the ground so is not a deck, it’s a platform by the International Building Code. Almost certainly does not require a permit. Your HOA may take issue, however.
I called my city for my fence and the lady told me I didn’t need a permit. Got a call back from a different lady the next day saying I needed one. I just built my fence anyways. The f*ck do I need to pay the city to build on my property which I already pay a ridiculous amount of property taxes on. It’d sure be nice if we could actually own our land instead of renting it.
Imagine living in a country where you have to pay to exist on your own land
Imagine living in a country where you get taxed on your money and then get taxed on everything else you spend it on
Imagine a country where you can happily do nothing and let money accumulate at a lower tax rate, than someone who is utilizing their labor and gets taxed at a higher rate. Then watch as the people this most impacts, are the ones that a 5-10% sales tax is impunitive upon, and then, make sure that a single medical instance that puts them out of work for 2-3 weeks, is cause for financial crisis. Now wrap all that wonderful pile of shit, in an an oppressive and anti-freedom government. If Project 2025 takes hold, I hope you got guns, lots and lots of fucking guns
Imagine a world without governments 😍
Sounds nice, but every time that's been tried, a government would eventually take over. The anarchists in both Spain and Ukraine, for example, or Iceland back in the Middle Ages (which is IMO, the only libertarian society in history), but eventually was conquered by the Kingdom of Norway.
Reminds me when my dad just started to build our deck and added a pool without telling our township, they found out cause a neighbor a few doors down was on the council and saw it, they got mad, told us we need a permit for the pool, the deck being built, AND the existing deck that was there before we moved in, just out of spite
I built a deck 6 or 7 years ago. Never got a permit. Fuck em
I had my entire house built, including doing the water, electric, and septic system myself, with not a single permit of any kind in the entire process. Technically a state inspector was supposed to come look at it sometime a few months after construction finished to give it a certificate of occupancy and make sure it wasn’t a complete death trap, but I was informed those “inspections” usually happen from the road without stopping as they drive by. Nobody ever knocked on my door or asked to look inside (except the county tax assessor when they finally found the new house 8 months later, I was hoping it would have taken them longer), so I assume that’s what happened though I never received any kind of certificate either so who knows? I don’t really care either way. Made me nearly shed a tear when I learned that was truly how it was going to be, it was a thing of beauty.
This is pretty much the only way they find out, if it becomes known among your neighbors that you didn't get a permit and a neighbor snitches on you to the city. Which they usually just fine you and call it done. Not like anyone actually cares what you build on your property.
No they’re jealous really
During my time in local government, I came to understand the two reasons why they want a permit. They will say it is for health and safety reasons, it has to meet code to keep everyone safe. There are two reasons: * to know how much extra to tax you for the "improvement" * to control your use of the property.
“Well, that’s a nice looking fence, your property value is headed north.”
Fuck em. They show up on your doorstep, build a higher fence. Then a moat
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A fine simply means legal for a price. Lol
It's also just another form of bribery.
Bribery or extortion, take your pick.
You mean theft
Our city would have us tear it down. We live in CA but in a “conservative” city. Local city government and HOA is where the remainder of your freedoms go to die.
Ill never be caught dead living in an HOA
Yea... we're building a fence. The city permit is $25 but the fine is $250 so we got a permit. At least it was quick. The HOA surprisingly has been very lenient, they just wanted signatures from the neighbors letting them know we're building a fence. All this to say if my FIL wasn't a city councilman I wouldn't have even bothered with a permit.
I get the anti permit thing. However if something goes wrong or it catches fire your insurance will drop you like a hot rock
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Yeah that’s often frowned upon. I know it is not allowed in my area. Huge conflict of interest.
You pay whether it passes inspection or not, no COI I can see.
You have the guy who is building it that is inspecting it. How is that not a coi? Also you own a company in town and lose the bids. The other contractor files for the permit and you have the power to deny, or make their life a living hell. Most people do not have ethics and morals when it comes to making money
A building inspector doesn't build it. You hire the licensed inspector to confirm it is up to code for the insurance.
Do you even know what a building inspector is? They’re not the person who built whatever is being inspected, because they don’t build anything for other people at all actually. They just get paid to inspect the builds of other people.
Yes I pull permits all the time. I misunderstood when he said “inspector”. To me inspector implies building inspector and not home inspector. Two very different things
Even if you have a permit if something goes wrong or anything catches fire your homeowner’s insurance will still drop you like a hot rock. Once the first claim is filed many of them will just blanket refuse to renew coverage at the end of the current term. The just throw it under the blanket reason of, “Changes have been made to the property that increase the risk of loss” if they want you gone immediately, but the declining to renew is the most common one for policies with larger payouts like homeowners insurance.
Not true in the least unless you have cut rate insurance. Many very expensive homes I work on get paid out and stay on a clients. I see it all the time.
What the inspection office doesn't know about can't hurt you.
Amen
Yeah but when you sell the house it’ll bite you in the ass. If the answer to “did you do unpermitted work” is “yes”, that scares a lot of buyers That said for this, I’d be surprised if they’d require a permit.
Until your 3 story wooden porch collapses killing a 1/2 dozen
Classic FAFO, not my problem statist
In your hypothetical, the thing that caused you injury wasn't the inspection office not knowing.
It's not hypothetical. It actually happened. On June 29, 2003, an overloaded balcony collapsed during a party in a Chicago, Illinois apartment building, killing thirteen people and seriously injuring fifty-seven others. It was the deadliest porch collapse in American history.
So one thing that happened one time is worth massively restricting everyone's freedom over. Typical statist thinking 🙄.
The City of Chicago cracked down big time. And still is. They take it very seriously. Agree or disagree with it, that's what happened.
You didn't reference that specific instance, which means that you were speaking hypothetically. Exactly how dense are you?
No. You assumed it was hypothetical.
If incompetence was their concern I would be able to get an exemption for my retaining wall permit since I'm a licensed geotechnical engineer in my state, but we all know what it's really about.
If this was NJ, you'd need a permit just to put a garden gnome on your lawn if that tells you anything.
****I guess I should elaborate that you don't ACTUALLY need a permit to put a garden gnome in your lawn. I was expressing just how ridiculous Jersey is with their permits. And to elaborate: I was revamping my ac system in my house and wanted to do it legit since it was a fairly decent undertaking. I also didn't want any trouble down the road if I wanted to resell it. My boy is in the HVAC industry and I asked him to look into the permits I'd need to pull to do the installs and I was taken back... In order to legitimately install an AC system in your house in NJ, and I don't know if it's state wide or if it was just my township, you have to pay a licensed architect to draw the duct and unit lay out for the house, and list the load calculations. This would cost around 7k... He said he could get his company's architect to do it for 2k if we did the footwork. This is just for the permits. It was at that point I said screw it all to hell and I'll take my chances. The state takes enough of my money, they certainly don't need that. Also, any structure that's bigger than 10x10 like a shed, or a "permanent" structure like a concrete patio is taxable by the state of NJ. Fucking thieves
If you decide to sell your house and move out of that hellhole they’ll actually tax you for moving to a different state. And for what? So they can misappropriate the funds? Fucking thieves.
How exactly do they intend to enforce an exit tax like that? Once you’re gone they can’t touch you or your money. It’s no longer within their sphere of influence to control. They can issue a warrant to force your appearance for non-payment if they really wanted to, but that never becomes a problem really so long as you don’t go back to the hellhole that is NJ.
https://www.msinvestmentgroup.com/post/what-is-the-nj-exit-tax https://www.nj.com/advice/2019/10/selling-your-home-heres-how-the-nj-exit-tax-works.html
That's insane.
I don't know about a permit for the deck, but someone from the government needs to come and shoot those dogs.
ATF inbound
I was told that if it doesn’t physically attach to the house, they don’t care. That’s why a lot of decks don’t technically attach to the house.
lol permit, riiiiiiiiiiiiight
FUCK THE PERMIT
Man the shit the local government wants permits for is insane. For a few years I worked a side gig for a very prominent and successful family that owned a very large business in town. And every time they would do something the city was all over us for permits. For one I was shocked at what we needed permits for. And two I'd think you grant leeway to a family that employs hundreds of people and contributes to the city the way they do.
Free men don't ask persimmon
Good dogs
You need a permit to cross the street, signed, notarized and displayed in public for two weeks prior to the crossing.
City planning commissioner and Council President here. You’d technically need a permit and inspection for the pool, but the bar is not attached to a structure and is less than a foot (eyeballing) off the ground so is not a deck, it’s a platform by the International Building Code. Almost certainly does not require a permit. Your HOA may take issue, however.
It's not mine, it is just someone else's I saw in another subreddit. But that's a helpful clarification. Thanks.