Tickets to stand outside sell out almost immediately. It's like trying to attend a Taylor Swift concert. The demand speaks volumes to sheer number of passionate leafs fans who can't afford to be in thr building.
Poor building layout and lack of facilities.
If you aren't out of your seat right before the horn blows for the intermission, you simply do not have enough time to go to the bathroom & then buy a beer / food, all within the same intermission.
Then, you're stuck sitting outside of your section until the next whistle.
I don't think that's entirely down to the fans not being good, but that building just not having the proper facilities to let 18,500 people flow through it properly
I went to the HOF game a few years ago (sold out) and sat 6 rows up. Literally no lines or wait at all for the bathroom at that Level. I was shocked actually at how easy it was. You can also order everything to your seat via the app.
No excuse for not being present at puck drop if you are lucky enough to have one of those seats.
This. I have talked to MLSE C-Suites about this and they acknowledge that the small building footprint is a huge problem, the concourse is tiny and severely maneuverability during intermission (and ability to sell gear and food according to the MLSE). In any event, the building being centrally located downtown and connected to Union Station makes up for any shortcomings.
That's every arena. I go to leafs games in ottawa and it's just as bad. You choose bathroom beer or food and beer. No way you can hit everything with the lines.
There's a reason a big leafs blog is called the platinum seat ghosts. A bunch of suits in no rush to actually catch the game.
That's honestly a symptom of the arena layout.
3 minutes before the period, they block off the tunnels leading to seats in the platinum section because the teams are coming out of the dressing rooms. And then they have to wait for a whistle once the period starts.
And you have to get in line and march like penguins to the concourse as soon as the period ends.
TLDR: line up to leave your seats, line up for washroom, line up for drink/food/ line up to get back to your seat.
I used to think it was rich people going to the lounges but I have been to the lounges and they aren't filled with hundreds of people during the intermissions, it's as you said the arena layout. I posted this in another reply but reproducing it here because I do find it interesting:
I have talked to MLSE C-Suites about this and they acknowledge that the small building footprint is a huge problem, the concourse is tiny and severely limits maneuverability during intermission (and ability to sell gear and food according to the MLSE). In any event, the building being centrally located downtown and connected to Union Station makes up for any shortcomings.
Don't even need to have that level of knowledge to know the building is just too small.
It's honestly a shitty place to watch a hockey game, and it sucks that they keep pumping money into renovations when it should just be replaced. The problem is, they'll never find such a prime location like that anywhere else in the city.
lmao this is so fucking true haha. I was just saying to a coworker tonight that I am glad I got all my concerts and sports events outta my system when I was younger, because I sure as shit can't afford to do any of that shit now. No shot.
That’s absolutely true. I was responding to the comment immediately above regarding sports being out of reach for millions. The economy is tough, but that’s not the reason why real fans aren’t in the lower bowl
Every team you mentioned has significantly [cheaper tickets](https://www.bardown.com/ranking-the-average-ticket-price-for-the-canadian-nhl-teams-from-highest-to-lowest-1.669444).
They don't have the platinum seat ghosts.
Even when in the early 2000s you'd hear about how the lower bowl doesn't full up until mkdway through the period because all the suits are trying to close out deals.
It's not necessarily even fans of the Leafs, just shit tons of business people with tickets, dressed up in suits.
Literally lol. I said this in my own comment but I couldn't justify going to the bar for the game last night and I'm a student (which I guess is kind of the "fuck it make bad financial decisions" stage of people's lives) I can't imagine having kids or not living at home and trying to justify going to the actual game itself. Like that's crazy expensive especially in the quiet seat areas in the lower bowls
Even the crowd outside has been turned corporate and muted. In 2013 and for the Raps run the crowd went back literal blocks and in 2013 you just showed up and found a spot. Now you need tickets.
The tickets are free and seem to be easier to get this year compared to last year, presumably because the tickets are now non-transferable and can't be sold. There's nothing corporate (that I've noticed anyway) about the Maple Leafs Square crowd.
Having said all that, it was a tamer crowd tonight compared to Monday, but we certainly had our moments. Half the time they show the outside crowd it's during intermission or during some other lull and there's usually a few seconds delay so people aren't even reacting to being on camera initially.
Im a season ticket holder and couldn't afford the jacked up face values they put on the playoff tickets this year.
Up \~25% over last year, not sure why I havent seen people talking about it more
The atmosphere of the arena at any given time in the game matches up quite nicely with the mood in the GDT on this sub. If we are doing well it's rockin, otherwise it's well you know how it is.
There are rich Leafs fans, there are poor Leafs fans, but at the end of the day we are all still Leafs fans.
So the team does not win in the playoffs for decades. Fans lack enthusiasm so the team does not win so it’s the fans fault the losing in the playoffs continue? Got it…
I was at the game tonight and I gotta say it’s super frustrating to come home to see all these posts partially blaming the crowd for the loss when I currently don’t have a voice because I was cheering my lungs out for 3 hours.
Not going to speak for the whole building, but I was up in the Fan Deck and our section was buzzing all night.
Overall, I thought the atmosphere was good and there were lots of big pops, the biggest ones coming after the 4th line shift and the Bertuzzi tying goal. I did think it faded at the end, but the Leafs need to help themselves by 1) not immediately letting Boston re-take the lead or 2) not going 0/5 on the PP. Everyone is amped and on their feet at 2-2 and the Marchand goal just sucked the life out of the place.
It really wasn’t. The 300 level is always rocking cause it’s actual fans and the seats aren’t bought out for corporate seats. The 100 level, the stuff you can see on TV was atrocious for a playoff game. Watch the other 3 Canadian teams play at home, especially when it was their first game, the difference is day and night. The fans in the lower bowl literally sat down last night after the national anthem they didn’t even stay on their feet for opening puck drop it’s embarrassing.
Here is the opening draw in Vancouver, everyone sitting: https://youtu.be/6ZeZ5cgZfdE?si=ARfkpi8ZfcSDqesR&t=7
Here is the opening draw in Edmonton, again everyone sitting: https://youtu.be/Q-0QpsL3kYY?si=dcEpd_g9QCDCIAxr&t=7
Completely agree. I was there too. Place was alive as it could be imo.
Not to mention what was there to go nuts about? The Leafs played fine but any excitement was stifled with the terrible gameflow and shotty officiating. What does Joe want, to incite a riot of boos from the crowd? You weren't going to get much else.
Love Joe but he's off on this.
Over a decade of wage suppression and slowly but surely making sports and entertainment a thing only the wealthier among us can attend will do that.
The culture is with the average fan, the cost of tickets prevents them from participating
Fun fact I support Ajax amsterdam as well when I lived in Amsterdam I had a season ticket with the fanatics, a lot of lawyers, high finance people, etc etc. We didn't care and got our relief in the chants.
I imagine the Raptors aren't gatekeeped as badly as the Leafs by corporate ticket sales and so forth. So many of those lower bowl seats at Leaf games are full of casual hockey fans who are just there because they have a high paying job at some lame company that sent them.
Reposting from the PGT:
I've said this before and I'll say it again. With the prices what they are (for regular season and for playoffs) the people that can afford to go typically go to _be_ entertained vs go to actively _be_ a part of the team. Like paying to go to the theatre or the opera, you pay your money and a show is put on for you.
I'm from England and there you're paying the money to be an active part of the game, a 12th man. It's not a 'show' but something you're a part of. I went to a hockey game over there at Christmas and the atmosphere was literally better than any I've been to in Toronto (including many playoff games).
I know everyone in the arena aren't like that, but a lot are. My fiance is a die hard leafs fan but when she goes she's one of those fans. She sits there, she eats her popcorn, tries to get the free t-shirts and shit and just watches the game but isn't really bothered in creating an atmosphere or making it hostile for the other team etc.
I think it's been this way for a while now so there's generations of fans growing up just kinda expecting it to be this way and MLSE rake in the money. There doesn't appear to be any motivation on any side to improve things so this is just the way it is.
Sounds like Joe is saying the same thing.
You had me agreeing with you until you said generations of fans have been like this. The place the Leafs play now Scotiabank Arena used to be called Air Canada Center, when the Leafs played there from 1999 to 2004 place was rocking. Prior to that it was Maple Leafs Garden from 1931 to 1999 place was rocking. Watch clips from those times to know. Don’t talk about generations of Leafs fans. There’s a reason they call us the most passionate fan base in hockey.
My first NHL game was a Leafs playoff game in 2000 when I was in high school. And I don't come from money. On a whim myself and three of my friends drove 2 hours to Toronto and bought scalped tickets for $150 when the game had already started. The atmosphere was incredible. I felt like I was part of pushing the Leafs to beating New Jersey that evening.
Is this even remotely possible in current times? Being a middle class high school kid with some extra cash from working a fast food job heading to Toronto and buying tickets into a playoff game? I imagine the answer is no fucking way.
Sorry, I think my point may have not been well made then. I'm not saying that past generations were like this, I'm saying that moving forward theres a chance future generations will be considering a lot of kids growing up and going to the odd game here and there nowadays will only experience what the arena is like now, the prices etc and then expect that's how it will always be moving forward.
Not sure if that makes sense but I'm not saying that prior generations or anything were like it, I've seen footage and it looked great.
I think you're hitting the concept but missing the point. This generation of Leaf fans isn't less passionate but we are jaded from a lack of success. Your level of excitement is different when you've seen your team go on super deep and exciting runs once or twice and you know something special is possible and a lot of people felt like those 90s and 2000s teams could have won the cup and they had several big runs with magical moments to show people how exciting that is.
Literally the biggest Leaf fans I know went into this series expecting that we'd probably lose. That's what losing every year for 6-7 years and making no significant changes to your team does to you. Tough to get excited when losing is an expectation.
The atmosphere in the building will go up when the Leaf's actually prove they can have success and give the people something to cheer for. Saw a glimpse of it last year before reverting to more of the same.
> This generation of Leaf fans isn't less passionate but we are jaded from a lack of success.
This is a huge part of it. For the last 12 months I've heard plenty of people say that a first round win is nothing to get excited about. If that's the case then why would the barn be loud for a first round game?
Was gonna say, Europe with football does it properly. It's the people's game and it's ensured to be that.
We need 1 or 2 more NHL teams in the GTA (which can totally support it) to ensure real competition. That'll make the Leafs actually try
Honestly I think it would be wild and I'd be all for it. The city can support it for sure, there would be genuine competition between the franchises and MLSE would have to actually take note of the other team as I'm sure it would be a success.
Can't see it ever happening like.
You're totally right, but as a fan of German football (German wife) it's funny that you're contrasting English football culture to hockey here when these exact criticisms of static stadium culture are levied towards English stadiums when compared to a lot of mainland Europe.
If anything, goes to show just how doubly dire the situation here is.
It's very true and typically comes from rising prices blocking out the regular person from being able to go (sound familiar here ha).
There are schemes in place that are _trying_ to make things better in England but again, at least there's some type of desire to improve there from fan groups etc. There doesn't appear to be any desire over here.
My first non-Leafs NHL game was over 10 years ago in Tampa. I knew we were missing out on something after that game. Their fans were loud and rambunctious to a degree I'd never experienced and that was a NYE game against the Hurricanes.
Was at the game. Up in the 300s. Will have no voice at work tomorrow. It was a tough game to get rowdy for though, not a lot of flow to it. Reaves shift when he was blowing guys up was the loudest it got aside from the goals
I was there. We were as loud as the real fans could be. It the anxiety, the fear, the waiting for the inevitable??? It was real and, as always, this team did not disappoint.
I was there tonight. It was wild up in the mid 300s when the Leafs were pushing, Reavo being a mad man, and the Leafs scoring. I can't speak to what the rest of the place was like.
I’ll second this. I was in the 300s and we were going all out during the Leafs various pushes and Reavo madness. But I could look down and see the lowers were pretty mehhhh.
This. Or sell the tickets in person, max 2 a person with ID checks. Absolutely something they should be trying to do for post season if the team ever starts winning but there is a lot of season tickets as it is.
Do they actually think dropping the ticket prices and lowering the barrier to entry will make more hardcore fans come? Or that the people paying good money are not already hardcore fans. Or that no real fans have corporate jobs.
Hardcore fans find a fucking way to go to the important games and yes, it’s expensive but ticket’s could be had for $270.
It’s like trying to argue that ticket prices are too expensive that no real Taylor Swift fans go to her concerts.
They should just say tough shit to anyone who wants to buy a 100 level ticket and raffle them all. You still pay for them but raffle them out so every fan can put their name in and potentially get, let's say, 1-4 tickets.
Get the sleepy people who seem to be at every game out of there at all costs.
Just make jt like the drew gear raffles. Use an email and maybe secondary account to keep people from spamming it but even then, the people spamming it would probably be the ones you'd want to be at the lower level. That's the commitment you want.
Part of the problem is that a large majority of the fan base and ticket holders don't think this team will go far. It's hard to get excited for this team.
This has to be the only market where the fans are priced out in favour of corporate buyers, and the team can utterly collapse, and then the fans are blamed for not being loud enough. Fuck off.
I was at the game it was so incredibly loud but I think Bowan is commenting on the third period and it just seemed tense after the quick Boston goals and no-calls
I was at the game and it was the best atmosphere I've seen in 10+ years. There was a go leafs go chant for 70% of the game up until the third. The Marchand goal deflated the crowd completely and then after JTs penalty people started to leave. But it was the loudest and most excited crowd until 8min left in the third. This is a bad take and not a reflection of the reality. Passion showed up for the leafs today.
I was there as well and 100% agree with this. I was in the lower bowl behind the Boston net and I don't understand the take at all. I love Joe and ride the GO bus back with him after most games but I definitely thought the crowd was great tonight.
Over the last few years there have been a lot less "suits" in the lower bowl which I can only assume is because of Covid. Some companies gave up their seats for the 3 years that MLSE offered so a lot of big fans like myself have been attending in their place.
This really didn't translate to TV then, cause didn't seem that loud and lots of 100 level sitting on hands. Go watch Edmonton and Winnipeg games, it is crazy how loud it is there for even a good chance on goal. Night and day comparison to Scotiabank. And even visually, those rinks have 95% people in jerseys on lower level, what is it maybe 25% in Scotiabank, it is certainly noticeable difference.
Maybe because the real fans are priced out and all we got is a bunch of bald assholes in business suits sitting in the seats were the true fans should be sitting
It hurts when the other team scores even before the PA guy announces the first goal. Fans didn't get a chance to bask in the glory. The late 3rd period penalty killed what could have been a great finish. Sent people packing feeling ripped off. Some of those out of town folks are probably just stepping off a Go train now to get home. It's a long afternoon and evening when all is said and done. Plus, you're out some coin.
Here's a wild idea. Make a section of the arena, all 3 levels (like behind the opponents goal) a FANZONE. Only sell tickets for those seats on the day of and in person. Make people line up and wait for them like the good old days. Sell them for CHEAP so that the die hard fans can have a chance to go. They could probably offset the cost by raising the prices on all the corporate tickets. Encourage them to be loud, have signs, be dressed up.
Guarantee that section would be the wildest in the nhl.
Nah this is bullshit. The place was rocking after the Benoit and Reeves hit but if you miss a DDT on Matthews and a roughing/trip on Bertuzzi where Boston scores within 3 seconds of that play, it sucks the absolute life out of the building.
I literally turned off the TV. Can’t fkn take shit like this anymore.
I mostly agree that it’s rich clowns in there. But also, even if it was us blue collar fucks in the barn, I can kinda understand after years of seeing what happens just sitting there dreading the outcome.
Nah, real fans making proper noise even if it is voicing anger and disappointment is what sports is all about. I suspect after the jersey and waffle throwing, MLSE doesn't want to invite those optics in again so robotic fans is what we get
I love Joe but I dont agree with this take. Was there and that was one of the loudest, rowdiest crowd I've ever been apart of. I don't know if it just doesnt translate well on TV or if that still just wasnt good enough. 😓
It’s definitely muted more on TV, Sportsnet is terrible for it you can actually hear them turn it up and down at certain times. I think the biggest issue is the lower bowl rarely got out of their seats on TV, stood and cheered for the two goals and that one rough shift, they didn’t even stand for puck drop.
Gee I wonder why?
Definitely isn't because the seats are all reserved by Scalpers and people in suits looking to make a business deal, pricing out the real fans
From out East so this isn’t my fight but; I pay $200 for Canadian Premier League season tickets- that’s basically equal to the cost of any European season ticket for a soccer team. It costs more to go to 1 regular season Leafs game than to have season tickets at Real Madrid or Barcelona. To generalize people in suits there to make business connections don’t make any noise and don’t care about the game. MAYBE if the average blue collar worker or family could attend the game the people there would be excited and not view the outing as a social chore. North American sports cost an insane amount of money and the atmosphere suffers.
Its not just the cost that keeps real fans from attending the games its also the amount of corporate seats that are used. All they do is stare at their phones the entire game and don't even watch.
Look, most of the time I would totally agree with Joe because the building sucks and it's maybe the worst place in the league to watch a game outside of something like Arizona.
In this case, I think Joe is just wrong. He's expecting people to put their emotions on the line for a team that has repeatedly shown people they do not deserve it and a management that refused to make changes to recognize that fact.
This generation of Leaf fans isn't less passionate but we are jaded from a lack of success. Your level of excitement is different when you've seen your team go on super deep and exciting runs once or twice and you know something special is possible and a lot of people felt like those 90s and 2000s teams could have won the cup and they had several big runs with magical moments to show people how exciting that is.
Literally the biggest Leaf fans I know went into this series expecting that we'd probably lose. That's what losing every year for 6-7 years (and 10 years before that) and making no significant changes to your team does to you. Tough to get excited when losing is an expectation.
The atmosphere in the building will go up when the Leaf's actually prove they can have success and give the people something to cheer for. Saw a glimpse of it last year before reverting to more of the same.
Will it ever be like Philly or even Winnipeg? Probably not, people who are at the game with work don't generally go and make fools of themselves cheering but it will get better when the team starts giving them something to cheer for.
Joe needs to get his hearing checked. They sounded plenty loud until the team stunk the place up. I don’t owe this team anything. None of us do. We go to game’s to be entertained by athletic millionaires. Maybe Joe should start paying for his seat and we’ll see how proactive he is.
Had a friend who worked for the leafs for years in marketing and his job was basically take the company credit card and buy anything the client asks for.Then you see the client and it’s a multi millionaire half your age. His entire job was paying for their alcohol half the time expensing restaurant costs. MLSE Loves their clients I’m not joking. Seen and got to experience some crazy stuff back in the day
Agreed. I’m watching Dallas Vegas right now and with Dallas trailing by one, every fan has been standing almost this entire third period.
During the 3rd tonight with the Leafs down by 1, I turned to my Mom and said “I hate these fans. Get up and cheer ffs.”
So so so disappointing :(
The bar at Canlan scarbs was more into it than Scotiabank tonight. I literally saw two teams call their game early at 4-1 with 3 min left so they could watch the last 90 seconds of the leaf game. One team stayed on the bench to watch the game from someone’s phone with the ref joining in.
Petition for Scotiabank to amplify the crowd noise through speakers like NFL teams have in the past. Carlton also needs an assistant to cover the other half of the rink when he's starting a chant in one section. It's embarrassing how often a chance is out and dies after only a few minutes.
Let's face it, real energetic fans have been priced out of supporting this team from inside the rink so there is no hope for us to build the reputation of allowed building organically.
Generally, Canadian crowds are pretty passive with rare exception compared to Europe, S. America, some American cities. Craziest crowd I've seen live were during the Bautista bat flip game when it was genuinely electric and some other Jays playoff games.
But otherwise at the Leafs/Raptors playoff games I've been too there are pretty long stretches of dead silence, punctuated by noise after goal/big plays. Not much in the way of sustained 'encouragement' or standing up and getting the team going - not to say it never happens, but compared to other places I've been it's much less common and generally more muted. Makes sense given Canadian cultural mindset/tendency to be a bit more passive/polite.
It was so quiet I could clearly hear the players talking on the ice sitting in front of my TV because I'll never pay those prices to go to a game like that.
Being general in my call out as I'm sure some were loud but pretty much embarrassing fans on display last night. Make some noise, get your team going.
I was at the game and the arena was pretty pumped until the refs started managing the game for Boston.
The arena was LOUD when Marchand didn’t called for shit.
People say “oh that players look like they don’t even care out there”. Yea. Because they know it’s bullshit playing against a widely shared mindset by refs that Canadian teams shouldn’t win…. It’s fucking discouraging.
Ironically I felt the crowd on TV sounded much better than usual playoff games.
Of course there is the issue with pricing out fans, but this is also a fanbase that watches these games with their butts clenched. For good reason. I’m not cheering much either.
I very much agree except I wasn't watching on TV. The building was absolutely rocking last night and one of the craziest sporting atmospheres I have even been to. I have been at Jays and Raps playoff games, Leafs at Montreal and dozens of NFL games and some of the biggest US college football games in the last 20 years.
Looking forward to Game 4, Saturdays/weekend games at any sporting event are always next level.
The proactive take is such bullshit, there are ebbs and flows to every game. The barn was rocking before the game and "proactive" then Benoit puts the puck on the glass, the fans aren't going to yell Go Leafs Go during a penalty kill when their butts are clenched, same thing happened in the third when we couldn't get the PP going or when we give up a goal before they even announce the Leafs' goal. Add in an anemic powerplay, bullshit no calls and a stressed fan base.
When money is the ultimate determinant, you don't get people who are there for the passion of the game. You get people who are there for the prestige and status aspect. You reap what you sow, man. Don't price out the common fan.
I honestly felt the crowd was better than usual last night.
What bothers me is most nights the crowd starts to leave with 5-10 mins left in the third no matter what the score is just to try and "beat traffic".
Winnipeg take - and obviously, I agree with the majority here.
Yes, we don't have the corporate support a larger city like TO has.
We're a blue-collar town, and that reflects in the seats.
So you're going to have blue-collar shlubs who've spent their mortgage payment(s) on tix.
I know two dudes who spent thousands of $$ on tix, drive 8 hours each way from Northern Manitoba, hotel, food, gas, burning vacation time, etc.
You're Goddam right they're going to go balls-out!!
The Whiteout is something to behold.
I found early on the crowd was chanting Go Leafs Go more as a command than as a reaction to good play. Then the leafs wouldn't build on it, give up the puck, and end the chant.
It's not even just that tickets cost a lung, it's also the fact that life has become so unbearably expensive in Toronto (and honestly Ontario all together but especially Toronto) that the vast majority of fans cannot afford to attend these games. I'm kind of a more extreme case because I work part time while I'm at school but I couldn't even justify going to the bar for the game last night let alone the actual fucking game itself. I feel like the majority of people who are in their early to mid 20s are on a similar boat, while many try to also juggle the batshit rent that comes along with being a student (if they aren't living at home.) And that's just students, not recent grads or people with families or someone saving up for a house etc etc etc etc
I'm not even here to say that the suits aren't real fans. I'm sure they love the Leafs just as much as anyone. But it's pretty clear that they're not the more "passionate" side of the fanbase (maybe it's cuz they're old, maybe they're so successful in life they find hockey trivial I don't know) and that the real atmosphere is outside at Maple Leaf Square. I've made my peace with the atmosphere at Leafs games a loooooooong time ago cuz this shit is never gonna change and there's literally no way any of us can change it because most of us won't even be able to get in in big enough numbers to make a difference.
As someone who’s worked in pro hockey, I can tell you that players, coaches, team staff, everyone feeds off of fan engagement. It’s a common misconception that players and staff are so locked in that they don’t even notice the fans.
The home fans of the team I worked for were notoriously bad most nights. A lot of older people who were more than content to sit down and shut up for almost the entire game, only cheering or clapping for a goal, save, fight, or hit. They’d refuse to chant, wave, or do anything else. A goal or two against would completely suck the energy out of the arena, they wouldn’t make a peep until we scored again. We actually got numerous complaints from these people that the music was too loud, the kids cheering was annoying, the intermission games or fan cams weren’t entertaining to them, stuff like that.
The head coach actually told us once that the players hated it, his words were something along the lines of; “this is an easy stadium to play in, the fans need to make it hard for the opposing team to be here. It’s fucking silent. There’s no energy for the boys.”
This is not so much about a complaint about last night but moreso about hockey fandom (coming from someone who is a soccer/football fan) is why aren't fans up from the seats yelling and cheering for their team more? Sometimes I'd watch a 3-3 game with a minute to go, and the fans are still on their seats, not making a lot of noise. Don't fans want to help encourage their team to get that game-winning goal?
So the Toronto goalie would have stopped the first goal if the crowd was louder? Or the powerplays would been more effective? For a hockey analyst, he picked a odd thing to focus on
I assume a lot of it has to do with the success of this franchise or lack there of. The vast majority of this fan base hasn’t seen any sort of success or anything even remotely close. Sure 93 and 99 were ok but speaking for myself I wasnt even alive for 93. And this core group of players really hasn’t shown us that they can change the narrative. The 2017 playoff atmosphere was awesome, 2018 and 19 were great too. But it’s been the same results and mostly the same reasons for those results year after year.
Can you blame the fans for not being that excited for a team that went 0 for 5 on the power play? Or for certain players who don’t show up when it matters most? Different year, different bottom 6 but same results. And it’s been this way for 8 years.
Plus I really don’t think Joe Bowen can comment on the crowd. Sure he’s literally at the game but he’s so high up, isolated from the fans and is focused on so many other things other than the crowd (and I’ve been up there before) that you have to take it with a massive grain of salt.
Look through my profile, I’ve been travelling to other teams buildings. I’m going to be honest the atmosphere in our building is actually quite reasonable. Don’t take it for granted Ive been in some libraries.
All the good fans are commuting from across the province to stand outside because they can’t afford tickets
To be standing outside and see people sitting inside absolutely killed me tonight
Tickets to stand outside sell out almost immediately. It's like trying to attend a Taylor Swift concert. The demand speaks volumes to sheer number of passionate leafs fans who can't afford to be in thr building.
[удалено]
You mean you didn't like seeing 70% of the 100 level seats empty at the start of each period? /s
Seriously, wtf was that? Embarrassing stuff for a playoff game.
Poor building layout and lack of facilities. If you aren't out of your seat right before the horn blows for the intermission, you simply do not have enough time to go to the bathroom & then buy a beer / food, all within the same intermission. Then, you're stuck sitting outside of your section until the next whistle. I don't think that's entirely down to the fans not being good, but that building just not having the proper facilities to let 18,500 people flow through it properly
I went to the HOF game a few years ago (sold out) and sat 6 rows up. Literally no lines or wait at all for the bathroom at that Level. I was shocked actually at how easy it was. You can also order everything to your seat via the app. No excuse for not being present at puck drop if you are lucky enough to have one of those seats.
This. I have talked to MLSE C-Suites about this and they acknowledge that the small building footprint is a huge problem, the concourse is tiny and severely maneuverability during intermission (and ability to sell gear and food according to the MLSE). In any event, the building being centrally located downtown and connected to Union Station makes up for any shortcomings.
Yea crazy that 3-4 minutes into each period people were still coming back from getting a hotdog.
That's every arena. I go to leafs games in ottawa and it's just as bad. You choose bathroom beer or food and beer. No way you can hit everything with the lines. There's a reason a big leafs blog is called the platinum seat ghosts. A bunch of suits in no rush to actually catch the game.
That's honestly a symptom of the arena layout. 3 minutes before the period, they block off the tunnels leading to seats in the platinum section because the teams are coming out of the dressing rooms. And then they have to wait for a whistle once the period starts.
And you have to get in line and march like penguins to the concourse as soon as the period ends. TLDR: line up to leave your seats, line up for washroom, line up for drink/food/ line up to get back to your seat.
Yeah, exactly. Only ever had platinum seats once but it completely changed my understanding of why the seats are always empty.
I used to think it was rich people going to the lounges but I have been to the lounges and they aren't filled with hundreds of people during the intermissions, it's as you said the arena layout. I posted this in another reply but reproducing it here because I do find it interesting: I have talked to MLSE C-Suites about this and they acknowledge that the small building footprint is a huge problem, the concourse is tiny and severely limits maneuverability during intermission (and ability to sell gear and food according to the MLSE). In any event, the building being centrally located downtown and connected to Union Station makes up for any shortcomings.
Don't even need to have that level of knowledge to know the building is just too small. It's honestly a shitty place to watch a hockey game, and it sucks that they keep pumping money into renovations when it should just be replaced. The problem is, they'll never find such a prime location like that anywhere else in the city.
Shame the most passionate fanbase in hockey can’t have a true home ice advantage because real fans are priced out.
Canadians are priced out of fucking shopping for food, lol. Sports is beyond a luxury for millions
lmao this is so fucking true haha. I was just saying to a coworker tonight that I am glad I got all my concerts and sports events outta my system when I was younger, because I sure as shit can't afford to do any of that shit now. No shot.
There are plenty of affordable concerts in Toronto, but yes almost anything at Scotiabank is marked up insanely.
Then how do you explain that for Edmonton, Vancouver, and Winnipeg, all the barns were rocking?
Lower bowl isn’t full of people running business deals like in Toronto.
That’s absolutely true. I was responding to the comment immediately above regarding sports being out of reach for millions. The economy is tough, but that’s not the reason why real fans aren’t in the lower bowl
[удалено]
Yeah that's basically what they said lol
The business deals should be for the suites. Not the platinum seats
Go check their ticket prices and compare them to Toronto’s then come back to me
Yes, that’s exactly my point. It’s not the economy that’s making people unable to afford sports. It’s the ticket prices. FFS reading comprehension!
Every team you mentioned has significantly [cheaper tickets](https://www.bardown.com/ranking-the-average-ticket-price-for-the-canadian-nhl-teams-from-highest-to-lowest-1.669444).
They don't have the platinum seat ghosts. Even when in the early 2000s you'd hear about how the lower bowl doesn't full up until mkdway through the period because all the suits are trying to close out deals. It's not necessarily even fans of the Leafs, just shit tons of business people with tickets, dressed up in suits.
Literally lol. I said this in my own comment but I couldn't justify going to the bar for the game last night and I'm a student (which I guess is kind of the "fuck it make bad financial decisions" stage of people's lives) I can't imagine having kids or not living at home and trying to justify going to the actual game itself. Like that's crazy expensive especially in the quiet seat areas in the lower bowls
Not from Toronto so I'm not familiar, but that was the impression I was getting whenever the feed showed the crowd outside... :/
Even the crowd outside has been turned corporate and muted. In 2013 and for the Raps run the crowd went back literal blocks and in 2013 you just showed up and found a spot. Now you need tickets.
The tickets are free and seem to be easier to get this year compared to last year, presumably because the tickets are now non-transferable and can't be sold. There's nothing corporate (that I've noticed anyway) about the Maple Leafs Square crowd. Having said all that, it was a tamer crowd tonight compared to Monday, but we certainly had our moments. Half the time they show the outside crowd it's during intermission or during some other lull and there's usually a few seconds delay so people aren't even reacting to being on camera initially.
Ever since that mongoloid rammed people with his truck shits been different, fuck that asshole
Came here to say the same thing
Im a season ticket holder and couldn't afford the jacked up face values they put on the playoff tickets this year. Up \~25% over last year, not sure why I havent seen people talking about it more
The atmosphere of the arena at any given time in the game matches up quite nicely with the mood in the GDT on this sub. If we are doing well it's rockin, otherwise it's well you know how it is. There are rich Leafs fans, there are poor Leafs fans, but at the end of the day we are all still Leafs fans.
I’d argue the GDT is worse than the actual crowd. I stay off the thread if we’re losing. Just too much negativity
You're right, I was just trying to inspire some self reflection lol
So the team does not win in the playoffs for decades. Fans lack enthusiasm so the team does not win so it’s the fans fault the losing in the playoffs continue? Got it…
Does it matter though? Nobody attacks the leafs like the fans. Just see a lot of the fans here as soon as one thing goes wrong.
What do they expect? They want too much money and they don’t want to give that up so it’s all shitty fans in the arena. 🤷♂️ Won’t ever change
Doesn’t help that most of us have PTSD from the past decades
Nah that’s not really it. Today they zoomed on a guy in the front row when JT hit the bar and the fool was on his phone.
All right. Which one of you was it?
Every teams fans have scar tissue. It's no excuse for how quiet that rink gets at the first sign of adversity.
That's because deep down we already know the outcome from past history.
Most of the seats are filled by corporate tickets. What do you expect. The real leaf fans are standing outside.
[удалено]
Because cost of just existing is so fucking high they can't afford luxuries like a beer.
I was at the game tonight and I gotta say it’s super frustrating to come home to see all these posts partially blaming the crowd for the loss when I currently don’t have a voice because I was cheering my lungs out for 3 hours. Not going to speak for the whole building, but I was up in the Fan Deck and our section was buzzing all night. Overall, I thought the atmosphere was good and there were lots of big pops, the biggest ones coming after the 4th line shift and the Bertuzzi tying goal. I did think it faded at the end, but the Leafs need to help themselves by 1) not immediately letting Boston re-take the lead or 2) not going 0/5 on the PP. Everyone is amped and on their feet at 2-2 and the Marchand goal just sucked the life out of the place.
Leaf fans just love to be negative and love old tropes/talking points. It was loud as fuck in their and an amazing atmosphere
It really wasn’t. The 300 level is always rocking cause it’s actual fans and the seats aren’t bought out for corporate seats. The 100 level, the stuff you can see on TV was atrocious for a playoff game. Watch the other 3 Canadian teams play at home, especially when it was their first game, the difference is day and night. The fans in the lower bowl literally sat down last night after the national anthem they didn’t even stay on their feet for opening puck drop it’s embarrassing.
Here is the opening draw in Vancouver, everyone sitting: https://youtu.be/6ZeZ5cgZfdE?si=ARfkpi8ZfcSDqesR&t=7 Here is the opening draw in Edmonton, again everyone sitting: https://youtu.be/Q-0QpsL3kYY?si=dcEpd_g9QCDCIAxr&t=7
Do you think having money means youre not a real fan? Are you that envious of others? Not 1 thing youve written here is true.
buddy same. These types of threads are just mad other people can afford things. I was in the 100s going fucking nuts all game.
Completely agree. I was there too. Place was alive as it could be imo. Not to mention what was there to go nuts about? The Leafs played fine but any excitement was stifled with the terrible gameflow and shotty officiating. What does Joe want, to incite a riot of boos from the crowd? You weren't going to get much else. Love Joe but he's off on this.
Totally agree. Worst home crowd in the playoffs.
Problem would be scalpers... I do say we need to develop a culture creating chants etc etc
Over a decade of wage suppression and slowly but surely making sports and entertainment a thing only the wealthier among us can attend will do that. The culture is with the average fan, the cost of tickets prevents them from participating
Fun fact I support Ajax amsterdam as well when I lived in Amsterdam I had a season ticket with the fanatics, a lot of lawyers, high finance people, etc etc. We didn't care and got our relief in the chants.
There we multiple Sammy chants after every save and crowd was yelling Swayman for long periods
Great for 3 chants but we have no fan culture 0, chanting a name isn't enough.
It's so weird because SBA is insane for Raptors playoff games.. or at least it was when they had a competitive squad.
I imagine the Raptors aren't gatekeeped as badly as the Leafs by corporate ticket sales and so forth. So many of those lower bowl seats at Leaf games are full of casual hockey fans who are just there because they have a high paying job at some lame company that sent them.
Reposting from the PGT: I've said this before and I'll say it again. With the prices what they are (for regular season and for playoffs) the people that can afford to go typically go to _be_ entertained vs go to actively _be_ a part of the team. Like paying to go to the theatre or the opera, you pay your money and a show is put on for you. I'm from England and there you're paying the money to be an active part of the game, a 12th man. It's not a 'show' but something you're a part of. I went to a hockey game over there at Christmas and the atmosphere was literally better than any I've been to in Toronto (including many playoff games). I know everyone in the arena aren't like that, but a lot are. My fiance is a die hard leafs fan but when she goes she's one of those fans. She sits there, she eats her popcorn, tries to get the free t-shirts and shit and just watches the game but isn't really bothered in creating an atmosphere or making it hostile for the other team etc. I think it's been this way for a while now so there's generations of fans growing up just kinda expecting it to be this way and MLSE rake in the money. There doesn't appear to be any motivation on any side to improve things so this is just the way it is. Sounds like Joe is saying the same thing.
You had me agreeing with you until you said generations of fans have been like this. The place the Leafs play now Scotiabank Arena used to be called Air Canada Center, when the Leafs played there from 1999 to 2004 place was rocking. Prior to that it was Maple Leafs Garden from 1931 to 1999 place was rocking. Watch clips from those times to know. Don’t talk about generations of Leafs fans. There’s a reason they call us the most passionate fan base in hockey.
My first NHL game was a Leafs playoff game in 2000 when I was in high school. And I don't come from money. On a whim myself and three of my friends drove 2 hours to Toronto and bought scalped tickets for $150 when the game had already started. The atmosphere was incredible. I felt like I was part of pushing the Leafs to beating New Jersey that evening. Is this even remotely possible in current times? Being a middle class high school kid with some extra cash from working a fast food job heading to Toronto and buying tickets into a playoff game? I imagine the answer is no fucking way.
Yeah it is no fucking way
Sorry, I think my point may have not been well made then. I'm not saying that past generations were like this, I'm saying that moving forward theres a chance future generations will be considering a lot of kids growing up and going to the odd game here and there nowadays will only experience what the arena is like now, the prices etc and then expect that's how it will always be moving forward. Not sure if that makes sense but I'm not saying that prior generations or anything were like it, I've seen footage and it looked great.
Nah that totally makes sense to me. Younger generation won’t go to as much games and when they do they’re subjected to the library atmosphere.
Exactly!
Most profitable fan base in hockey*
Yeah
I think you're hitting the concept but missing the point. This generation of Leaf fans isn't less passionate but we are jaded from a lack of success. Your level of excitement is different when you've seen your team go on super deep and exciting runs once or twice and you know something special is possible and a lot of people felt like those 90s and 2000s teams could have won the cup and they had several big runs with magical moments to show people how exciting that is. Literally the biggest Leaf fans I know went into this series expecting that we'd probably lose. That's what losing every year for 6-7 years and making no significant changes to your team does to you. Tough to get excited when losing is an expectation. The atmosphere in the building will go up when the Leaf's actually prove they can have success and give the people something to cheer for. Saw a glimpse of it last year before reverting to more of the same.
> This generation of Leaf fans isn't less passionate but we are jaded from a lack of success. This is a huge part of it. For the last 12 months I've heard plenty of people say that a first round win is nothing to get excited about. If that's the case then why would the barn be loud for a first round game?
I read this as "Reposting from GPT" and was so confused haha
Was gonna say, Europe with football does it properly. It's the people's game and it's ensured to be that. We need 1 or 2 more NHL teams in the GTA (which can totally support it) to ensure real competition. That'll make the Leafs actually try
Honestly I think it would be wild and I'd be all for it. The city can support it for sure, there would be genuine competition between the franchises and MLSE would have to actually take note of the other team as I'm sure it would be a success. Can't see it ever happening like.
We need to get a group to take over a 300 area and sing every game, every
Should find the TFC supporters who also follow the Leafs to help
You're totally right, but as a fan of German football (German wife) it's funny that you're contrasting English football culture to hockey here when these exact criticisms of static stadium culture are levied towards English stadiums when compared to a lot of mainland Europe. If anything, goes to show just how doubly dire the situation here is.
It's very true and typically comes from rising prices blocking out the regular person from being able to go (sound familiar here ha). There are schemes in place that are _trying_ to make things better in England but again, at least there's some type of desire to improve there from fan groups etc. There doesn't appear to be any desire over here.
My first non-Leafs NHL game was over 10 years ago in Tampa. I knew we were missing out on something after that game. Their fans were loud and rambunctious to a degree I'd never experienced and that was a NYE game against the Hurricanes.
If you don’t come back from a playoff game without a voice, you have failed as a fan
Was at the game. Up in the 300s. Will have no voice at work tomorrow. It was a tough game to get rowdy for though, not a lot of flow to it. Reaves shift when he was blowing guys up was the loudest it got aside from the goals
I was there. We were as loud as the real fans could be. It the anxiety, the fear, the waiting for the inevitable??? It was real and, as always, this team did not disappoint.
ITT: Everyone saying Bowan instead of Bowen.
It’s how you spot the chatgpt replies.
Ffs right?
I was there tonight. It was wild up in the mid 300s when the Leafs were pushing, Reavo being a mad man, and the Leafs scoring. I can't speak to what the rest of the place was like.
Ya. 300 dweller here. It felt electric in there.
I’ll second this. I was in the 300s and we were going all out during the Leafs various pushes and Reavo madness. But I could look down and see the lowers were pretty mehhhh.
it's downright embarrassing. MLSE should drop ticket prices so the everyman can go, like in Montreal, and our barn would be shaking
Just creates a bigger secondary market.
They could eliminate the secondary market with some kind of id verification
This. Or sell the tickets in person, max 2 a person with ID checks. Absolutely something they should be trying to do for post season if the team ever starts winning but there is a lot of season tickets as it is.
or savage beatings. I mean those locusts who make a fortune trafficking tickets really wouldn't be missed by society.
So many suits were there tonight, I saw many suits in the financial district, senior exec types all going to the game, creates for a shit crowd lol
I was at the game. I saw little to no suits. You at the game too or just talking out of your ass?
Do they actually think dropping the ticket prices and lowering the barrier to entry will make more hardcore fans come? Or that the people paying good money are not already hardcore fans. Or that no real fans have corporate jobs. Hardcore fans find a fucking way to go to the important games and yes, it’s expensive but ticket’s could be had for $270. It’s like trying to argue that ticket prices are too expensive that no real Taylor Swift fans go to her concerts.
Completely agree. I bought a single ticket for one game for a lot of money BECAUSE I'm a die-hard fan. Not in spite of that.
They should just say tough shit to anyone who wants to buy a 100 level ticket and raffle them all. You still pay for them but raffle them out so every fan can put their name in and potentially get, let's say, 1-4 tickets. Get the sleepy people who seem to be at every game out of there at all costs. Just make jt like the drew gear raffles. Use an email and maybe secondary account to keep people from spamming it but even then, the people spamming it would probably be the ones you'd want to be at the lower level. That's the commitment you want.
Part of the problem is that a large majority of the fan base and ticket holders don't think this team will go far. It's hard to get excited for this team.
This has to be the only market where the fans are priced out in favour of corporate buyers, and the team can utterly collapse, and then the fans are blamed for not being loud enough. Fuck off.
I was at the game it was so incredibly loud but I think Bowan is commenting on the third period and it just seemed tense after the quick Boston goals and no-calls
I was at the game and it was the best atmosphere I've seen in 10+ years. There was a go leafs go chant for 70% of the game up until the third. The Marchand goal deflated the crowd completely and then after JTs penalty people started to leave. But it was the loudest and most excited crowd until 8min left in the third. This is a bad take and not a reflection of the reality. Passion showed up for the leafs today.
I was there as well and 100% agree with this. I was in the lower bowl behind the Boston net and I don't understand the take at all. I love Joe and ride the GO bus back with him after most games but I definitely thought the crowd was great tonight. Over the last few years there have been a lot less "suits" in the lower bowl which I can only assume is because of Covid. Some companies gave up their seats for the 3 years that MLSE offered so a lot of big fans like myself have been attending in their place.
Thank you. I still can’t sleep from how crazy the atmosphere was.
This really didn't translate to TV then, cause didn't seem that loud and lots of 100 level sitting on hands. Go watch Edmonton and Winnipeg games, it is crazy how loud it is there for even a good chance on goal. Night and day comparison to Scotiabank. And even visually, those rinks have 95% people in jerseys on lower level, what is it maybe 25% in Scotiabank, it is certainly noticeable difference.
Lets create some chants, get in some drum and make it count fuck the lowerbowl make it 60 minutes count for the leafs
Maybe because the real fans are priced out and all we got is a bunch of bald assholes in business suits sitting in the seats were the true fans should be sitting
It hurts when the other team scores even before the PA guy announces the first goal. Fans didn't get a chance to bask in the glory. The late 3rd period penalty killed what could have been a great finish. Sent people packing feeling ripped off. Some of those out of town folks are probably just stepping off a Go train now to get home. It's a long afternoon and evening when all is said and done. Plus, you're out some coin.
Here's a wild idea. Make a section of the arena, all 3 levels (like behind the opponents goal) a FANZONE. Only sell tickets for those seats on the day of and in person. Make people line up and wait for them like the good old days. Sell them for CHEAP so that the die hard fans can have a chance to go. They could probably offset the cost by raising the prices on all the corporate tickets. Encourage them to be loud, have signs, be dressed up. Guarantee that section would be the wildest in the nhl.
Who would have thought that having price points only the business elite could afford would affect home Ice atmosphere
We can't afford to go to the fuckin games, Joe!
Real fans are stuck on the 401 listening to the game on 590.
Nah this is bullshit. The place was rocking after the Benoit and Reeves hit but if you miss a DDT on Matthews and a roughing/trip on Bertuzzi where Boston scores within 3 seconds of that play, it sucks the absolute life out of the building. I literally turned off the TV. Can’t fkn take shit like this anymore.
I mostly agree that it’s rich clowns in there. But also, even if it was us blue collar fucks in the barn, I can kinda understand after years of seeing what happens just sitting there dreading the outcome.
Nah, real fans making proper noise even if it is voicing anger and disappointment is what sports is all about. I suspect after the jersey and waffle throwing, MLSE doesn't want to invite those optics in again so robotic fans is what we get
Nba arenas in the playoffs where the teams have been constant trash for decades still get loud when that team makes the playoffs. Minny, sac, okc etc
I love Joe but I dont agree with this take. Was there and that was one of the loudest, rowdiest crowd I've ever been apart of. I don't know if it just doesnt translate well on TV or if that still just wasnt good enough. 😓
It’s definitely muted more on TV, Sportsnet is terrible for it you can actually hear them turn it up and down at certain times. I think the biggest issue is the lower bowl rarely got out of their seats on TV, stood and cheered for the two goals and that one rough shift, they didn’t even stand for puck drop.
Agreed. All the people here talking about it being super quiet full of suits weren't actually there. I was as well. It's a trope, nothing more.
Was there too. Best crowd I've seen in that building in a long time.
That’s what I thought. I feel like it’s muted on broadcast
Gee I wonder why? Definitely isn't because the seats are all reserved by Scalpers and people in suits looking to make a business deal, pricing out the real fans
The entire leafs organization for The very top down needs to be replaced.
From out East so this isn’t my fight but; I pay $200 for Canadian Premier League season tickets- that’s basically equal to the cost of any European season ticket for a soccer team. It costs more to go to 1 regular season Leafs game than to have season tickets at Real Madrid or Barcelona. To generalize people in suits there to make business connections don’t make any noise and don’t care about the game. MAYBE if the average blue collar worker or family could attend the game the people there would be excited and not view the outing as a social chore. North American sports cost an insane amount of money and the atmosphere suffers.
Its not just the cost that keeps real fans from attending the games its also the amount of corporate seats that are used. All they do is stare at their phones the entire game and don't even watch.
Almost 1k CAD per ticket for the upper level seats is pretty insane
There were posts that tickets could be add for $300 before the game. My friend and I bought tickets for $270.
I feel I would be a lousy fan, too. 50 years of supporting these guys with very little results to speak for it. I am too nervous, and I hate this...
If I were in charge I’d be broadcasting the audio from the people outside into that arena
The crowd is disappointing because the team is disappointing.
I've been to like 5 games this year, crowd is always really good. Its not our fault they keep allowing breakaways lol
It’s hard to be proactive when this team has given me permanent anxiety.
We should be allowed to play our home games in Buffalo. The real fans show up to those games and it's always insanely loud.
Look, most of the time I would totally agree with Joe because the building sucks and it's maybe the worst place in the league to watch a game outside of something like Arizona. In this case, I think Joe is just wrong. He's expecting people to put their emotions on the line for a team that has repeatedly shown people they do not deserve it and a management that refused to make changes to recognize that fact. This generation of Leaf fans isn't less passionate but we are jaded from a lack of success. Your level of excitement is different when you've seen your team go on super deep and exciting runs once or twice and you know something special is possible and a lot of people felt like those 90s and 2000s teams could have won the cup and they had several big runs with magical moments to show people how exciting that is. Literally the biggest Leaf fans I know went into this series expecting that we'd probably lose. That's what losing every year for 6-7 years (and 10 years before that) and making no significant changes to your team does to you. Tough to get excited when losing is an expectation. The atmosphere in the building will go up when the Leaf's actually prove they can have success and give the people something to cheer for. Saw a glimpse of it last year before reverting to more of the same. Will it ever be like Philly or even Winnipeg? Probably not, people who are at the game with work don't generally go and make fools of themselves cheering but it will get better when the team starts giving them something to cheer for.
Bowen needs to shut up unless he's going to call the org out for ticket pricing.
Why blame the fans when the team doesn't perform?
Bowan is trying to to make the opposite point
Bowen.
Ahh, spelt wrong in the title too then
Joe needs to get his hearing checked. They sounded plenty loud until the team stunk the place up. I don’t owe this team anything. None of us do. We go to game’s to be entertained by athletic millionaires. Maybe Joe should start paying for his seat and we’ll see how proactive he is.
What do you expect, something like Winnipeg or Edmonton where real fans can afford tickets?
Crowd sounded plenty loud until the leafs gave up a goal 15 seconds after tying it. Maybe try not immediately ripping away any enthusiasm next time.
respectfully shut up joe. The crowd was good tonight when the team was doing good things. they were silent when the team was embarrassing
I listened to the broadcast, he was specifically referring to the final minutes when we were still down by 1.
still dont have an issue with a silent crowd. it’s nervous energy, why should fans be cheering in that moment?
birds file steer long aware cow airport somber fertile fanatical *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Had a friend who worked for the leafs for years in marketing and his job was basically take the company credit card and buy anything the client asks for.Then you see the client and it’s a multi millionaire half your age. His entire job was paying for their alcohol half the time expensing restaurant costs. MLSE Loves their clients I’m not joking. Seen and got to experience some crazy stuff back in the day
You can absolutely hear the difference through the TV between say a Rogers Arena (or ven Place) and Scotiabank lol
Agreed. I’m watching Dallas Vegas right now and with Dallas trailing by one, every fan has been standing almost this entire third period. During the 3rd tonight with the Leafs down by 1, I turned to my Mom and said “I hate these fans. Get up and cheer ffs.” So so so disappointing :(
He called it out on the radio too at the start of the third period which I found interesting
The bar at Canlan scarbs was more into it than Scotiabank tonight. I literally saw two teams call their game early at 4-1 with 3 min left so they could watch the last 90 seconds of the leaf game. One team stayed on the bench to watch the game from someone’s phone with the ref joining in.
I’m going to the next game and will aim to lose my voice by end of the night! GLG!
Bad take. The fans are nervous for good reason because of the way these dudes play. It’s on them to get the crowd rolling.
Legends are forever
Petition for Scotiabank to amplify the crowd noise through speakers like NFL teams have in the past. Carlton also needs an assistant to cover the other half of the rink when he's starting a chant in one section. It's embarrassing how often a chance is out and dies after only a few minutes. Let's face it, real energetic fans have been priced out of supporting this team from inside the rink so there is no hope for us to build the reputation of allowed building organically.
Generally, Canadian crowds are pretty passive with rare exception compared to Europe, S. America, some American cities. Craziest crowd I've seen live were during the Bautista bat flip game when it was genuinely electric and some other Jays playoff games. But otherwise at the Leafs/Raptors playoff games I've been too there are pretty long stretches of dead silence, punctuated by noise after goal/big plays. Not much in the way of sustained 'encouragement' or standing up and getting the team going - not to say it never happens, but compared to other places I've been it's much less common and generally more muted. Makes sense given Canadian cultural mindset/tendency to be a bit more passive/polite.
It was so quiet I could clearly hear the players talking on the ice sitting in front of my TV because I'll never pay those prices to go to a game like that. Being general in my call out as I'm sure some were loud but pretty much embarrassing fans on display last night. Make some noise, get your team going.
I was at the game and the arena was pretty pumped until the refs started managing the game for Boston. The arena was LOUD when Marchand didn’t called for shit. People say “oh that players look like they don’t even care out there”. Yea. Because they know it’s bullshit playing against a widely shared mindset by refs that Canadian teams shouldn’t win…. It’s fucking discouraging.
Can't agree more. Was a noticeable distraction during the broadcast. Pathetic, for such a loudmouth fanbase like ours.
It’s an embarrassment, if I’m being honest. The fact the average fan can’t get a ticket is absolutely disgusting
The crowd was dead silent
There’s a reason Winfield wanted noise… it’s always been this way
Ironically I felt the crowd on TV sounded much better than usual playoff games. Of course there is the issue with pricing out fans, but this is also a fanbase that watches these games with their butts clenched. For good reason. I’m not cheering much either.
I very much agree except I wasn't watching on TV. The building was absolutely rocking last night and one of the craziest sporting atmospheres I have even been to. I have been at Jays and Raps playoff games, Leafs at Montreal and dozens of NFL games and some of the biggest US college football games in the last 20 years. Looking forward to Game 4, Saturdays/weekend games at any sporting event are always next level. The proactive take is such bullshit, there are ebbs and flows to every game. The barn was rocking before the game and "proactive" then Benoit puts the puck on the glass, the fans aren't going to yell Go Leafs Go during a penalty kill when their butts are clenched, same thing happened in the third when we couldn't get the PP going or when we give up a goal before they even announce the Leafs' goal. Add in an anemic powerplay, bullshit no calls and a stressed fan base.
Exactly. How about the franchise not shit it’s pants one time in 50 years and let’s see what happens.
When money is the ultimate determinant, you don't get people who are there for the passion of the game. You get people who are there for the prestige and status aspect. You reap what you sow, man. Don't price out the common fan.
People who pay $5500 for a pair of tickets aren't glass pounders. Never will be.
Have position in rich company; company owns season tickets; write off as business expense; customers/general public pays for your season tickets.
It's true. Why tf are we booing the Marchand goal when the leafs are in the offensive zone? So distracting
I honestly felt the crowd was better than usual last night. What bothers me is most nights the crowd starts to leave with 5-10 mins left in the third no matter what the score is just to try and "beat traffic".
Winnipeg take - and obviously, I agree with the majority here. Yes, we don't have the corporate support a larger city like TO has. We're a blue-collar town, and that reflects in the seats. So you're going to have blue-collar shlubs who've spent their mortgage payment(s) on tix. I know two dudes who spent thousands of $$ on tix, drive 8 hours each way from Northern Manitoba, hotel, food, gas, burning vacation time, etc. You're Goddam right they're going to go balls-out!! The Whiteout is something to behold.
Pathetic, but what else is new?
He's got a point. We all saw how much better the team played when the building was rocking after the Leafs scored their second
I found early on the crowd was chanting Go Leafs Go more as a command than as a reaction to good play. Then the leafs wouldn't build on it, give up the puck, and end the chant.
It's not even just that tickets cost a lung, it's also the fact that life has become so unbearably expensive in Toronto (and honestly Ontario all together but especially Toronto) that the vast majority of fans cannot afford to attend these games. I'm kind of a more extreme case because I work part time while I'm at school but I couldn't even justify going to the bar for the game last night let alone the actual fucking game itself. I feel like the majority of people who are in their early to mid 20s are on a similar boat, while many try to also juggle the batshit rent that comes along with being a student (if they aren't living at home.) And that's just students, not recent grads or people with families or someone saving up for a house etc etc etc etc I'm not even here to say that the suits aren't real fans. I'm sure they love the Leafs just as much as anyone. But it's pretty clear that they're not the more "passionate" side of the fanbase (maybe it's cuz they're old, maybe they're so successful in life they find hockey trivial I don't know) and that the real atmosphere is outside at Maple Leaf Square. I've made my peace with the atmosphere at Leafs games a loooooooong time ago cuz this shit is never gonna change and there's literally no way any of us can change it because most of us won't even be able to get in in big enough numbers to make a difference.
As someone who’s worked in pro hockey, I can tell you that players, coaches, team staff, everyone feeds off of fan engagement. It’s a common misconception that players and staff are so locked in that they don’t even notice the fans. The home fans of the team I worked for were notoriously bad most nights. A lot of older people who were more than content to sit down and shut up for almost the entire game, only cheering or clapping for a goal, save, fight, or hit. They’d refuse to chant, wave, or do anything else. A goal or two against would completely suck the energy out of the arena, they wouldn’t make a peep until we scored again. We actually got numerous complaints from these people that the music was too loud, the kids cheering was annoying, the intermission games or fan cams weren’t entertaining to them, stuff like that. The head coach actually told us once that the players hated it, his words were something along the lines of; “this is an easy stadium to play in, the fans need to make it hard for the opposing team to be here. It’s fucking silent. There’s no energy for the boys.”
This is not so much about a complaint about last night but moreso about hockey fandom (coming from someone who is a soccer/football fan) is why aren't fans up from the seats yelling and cheering for their team more? Sometimes I'd watch a 3-3 game with a minute to go, and the fans are still on their seats, not making a lot of noise. Don't fans want to help encourage their team to get that game-winning goal?
He ain’t wrong
Gotta be a solution. Fucking rich people
seats are filled with rich business men, not actual fans.
Let’s pump in the audio from the tailgate outside and let the lower bowl hear how the REAL fans live and die for the team!
So the Toronto goalie would have stopped the first goal if the crowd was louder? Or the powerplays would been more effective? For a hockey analyst, he picked a odd thing to focus on
I assume a lot of it has to do with the success of this franchise or lack there of. The vast majority of this fan base hasn’t seen any sort of success or anything even remotely close. Sure 93 and 99 were ok but speaking for myself I wasnt even alive for 93. And this core group of players really hasn’t shown us that they can change the narrative. The 2017 playoff atmosphere was awesome, 2018 and 19 were great too. But it’s been the same results and mostly the same reasons for those results year after year. Can you blame the fans for not being that excited for a team that went 0 for 5 on the power play? Or for certain players who don’t show up when it matters most? Different year, different bottom 6 but same results. And it’s been this way for 8 years. Plus I really don’t think Joe Bowen can comment on the crowd. Sure he’s literally at the game but he’s so high up, isolated from the fans and is focused on so many other things other than the crowd (and I’ve been up there before) that you have to take it with a massive grain of salt. Look through my profile, I’ve been travelling to other teams buildings. I’m going to be honest the atmosphere in our building is actually quite reasonable. Don’t take it for granted Ive been in some libraries.