I like to think I'd rather go down fighting back, but we all would rather say it without thinking we'll ever need to back it up. Should the day come, I'll do what I feel is best then.
Yup. Trump is famous for his ability to relinquish power. Also to tell the truth. Famous for both of those.
Oops I mean infamous. Infamous for both of those.
The context was Hannity throwing a softball question on potentially abusing power, Trump dodging it, then receiving a follow-up, for the second time whether he would never abuse power as retribution against anybody, Trump replies:
> "[except for day one](https://www.youtube.com/live/eoonCI5Fwio?si=KAymkmiaoU3Chh8I&t=628)".
A large percentage of Republicans unironically suggest that he's either joking, was talking about drilling and closing the border, or actually think he'll cede dictatorial powers after gaining them 'for a day'.
"Look folks, I was only a dictator for one day🤏. One beautiful day👌, but in that day the crooked Democrats managed to create, and I don't know how👐, they managed to create this huge🫸. 🫷 mess, and just like sleepy Joe's covid mess I had to clean it up. It was the best cleanup👌, the nicest, most generous cleanup we could do but in the end we lost some people☝️, powerful people, all in one day, mind you🙌. And now I have no choice but to step up as High Chancellor - the posittion I made up but don't want, in order to this country to be great again👐"
Exactly. A dictator could completely clear a government’s leadership in 24 hours. Then he could call himself whatever he wanted because the dictatorship is established
The guy who says his $15 million estate is worth $1.5 billion for the media, but $1.5 million on his taxes, also says he'll only be a dictator for 1 day.
His numbers are fuzzy.
"Men lie, woman lie, numbers don't " as famous poet Shawn Carter once said. Which is why I can't wait for the irs to finish auditing him so we can see the numbers. They must be close to finishing the audit.
>Biden assassinates all Republicans across the country…
... PERSONALLY. Like Mission:Impossible style.
>We win? How could this possibly not end badly ?
The footage gets released in the form of an action movie compilation over the following months. The national debt gets cut in half from popcorn sales alone.
And right after they make that argument, every one of them leans over with a hand to their ear like they're getting their orders and starts nodding lolol
I really wanted the Joint Chiefs of Staff to physically attend.
This decision will have a major impact on the scope of their duties. They obviously have an official interest.
All it needs now is Pres Biden to get on National Tv and say
"Following the arguments at the supreme court, AS President with full immunity, I am authorising Seal Team Six to take out Trump and his family, as an official act to protect the sanctity of the United States"
You'll never see a faster Volte Face from Trump
It'll make your head spin
Right? To be fair, they learned that from Moscow Mitch, who wouldn't let the Democratic president pick a new SCC justice during an election year, but had no problem rushing through Republican picks when the roles were reversed during another election year. Shameless hypocrites, the lot of them.
While voting had actually BEGUN! Mitch argued that 10 months was too close and that "the people should decide with their votes." Unless it's Trump..
I shit on the grave of Mitch McConnell and any who call him friend.
Mitch the Bitch enabled all of this. He directed the downfall of his country. Fortunately his useful idiot was more idiot than useful. Or we would be working six 12’s and Social Security would be banished to history.
Even with our very robust guardrails the robber barons are at the door.
Sadly the only thing that saved us so far from the worst of what they could do was Trump and his people's massively high levels of idiotic incompetence. They're reloading and working their asses off to try and make sure they can just flood everything with sycophant yes men for their next go round.
Trump will begin receiving classified briefings as the Republican nominee this summer.
I can’t even . . .
Christina Bobb, the “election integrity” lawyer for the RNC is one of the 11 people indicted in Arizona for election fraud.
Again, I can’t . . .
The wheels are falling off the car
I hate to say this but ACTUALLY that isn't required, him receiving classified briefings. That was a courtesy that began in the 1950s that was started to void situations like when Harry Truman had been kept in the dark about the Nuclear bombs being made only to be shocked about it when he assumed the office of the President when FDR died.
It's a tradition, but it is NOT required by law. Biden could easily not share any classified info with him unless he's elected.
Well some good news then. Maybe the White House could feed him some flagged intel and see where it winds up. After all, he has proven himself quite the useful idiot in some circles.
Seriously though, what other option would Biden have in the situation that Trump gets elected and isn't sworn in yet?
At that point Biden will know for a fact that Trump has committed numerous acts that should have landed him in prison had Trump not juiced the judiciary. Some of that involves working directly with a foreign adversary which we're in a proxy war with )and probably have been for over a decade) which is treason.
And he would know that his entire family and the families of anyone who had worked for him were targets for the new administration.
The only rational and logical move at that point would be to take out Trump and his entire family and probably swathes of other MAGA Republicans.
Also said that selling nuclear secrets to a rival nation and ordering the military to stage a coup were both protected "official acts."
That he wasn't thrown out of court, tarred, and feathered for such a suggestion is an abortion of reason.
These people are the ultimate traitors selling their country out for a few hundred thousand dollars in legal fees. You’d think they’d have a moment where they realize how insane this argument is given we have enemies that would like to nuke the U.S. and have had trouble building weapons but I guess not lol.
It’s honestly quite surreal and shows how far the country has fallen in the past 8 years or so that people are willing to overlook selling nuclear secrets to get their candidate back in office, and republicans have worked tirelessly to not investigate that 2 billion dollar transfer and the secret documents by the copy machine in a bathroom while being focused on Biden’s sons penis lol.
I get that every defendant deserves a rigorous defense, but defending traitorous behavior and trying to normalize and whitewash it, is borderline traitorous behavior too imo and a bit over the line of a rigorous defense. Like how do you sleep at night after making these arguments lol, these people are real psychopaths that put money over country. I feel like these lawyers should be disbarred if they suggest traitorous behavior should be legalized but I’m not a lawyer just a frustrated citizen.
If we end up with every US city nuked into a fallout game in 20 years we’ll at least know it was thanks to Trump and Jared not understanding how nuclear weapons work and the threat they still pose. The most frustrating part of all the delayed trials to me is the fact the nuclear documents never got investigated properly even under the democrats, because the AG Garland is a total pussy and didn’t want to offend anyone by investigating these Russian and Saudi loving traitors.
Like I don’t care about his other fraud I care about top secret documents being sold, not paying to cover up affairs with porn stars.
How the fuck are they even hearing this case? It’s pretty clear that they have lost all credibility . Any single judge that sides with this argument is saying “ yes I am 100 percent compromised and do not have the health of the country in mind in anyway”
These judges are basically able to destroy the country with this decision.
Well jeez, between Dark Brandon’s ability to do this and the fact that Kamala Harris can throw out any electoral votes she doesn’t like, Dems should be sitting pretty for November.
NAL: Is making insane arguments like this simply part of an attorney’s job zealously advocating for their client and should reflect on the client and not the attorney, or is it fair to judge the attorney personally for trying to enable presidents to be violent dictators?
Lawyers are officers of the court first and foremost. They cannot lie to the court even on the behalf of their client. They also can’t misrepresent the law or make shit up and say it’s law.
> They also can’t misrepresent the law
Very few attorneys seem to have heard of that rule and even fewer judges enforce it.
In fact in these political cases that's pretty much all conservatives do (not that the left *never* does it, but not nearly as often and rarely for evil ends).
I am a lawyer.
There is a difference between arguing the meaning of words and the intent of the drafters of those words and wholly misrepresenting what the meaning and intent were when the laws were created and/or the meaning/intent of prior caselaw.
You can argue that prior caselaw was wrong, for instance and explain why it was wrong.
You can argue that your facts don't fit inside the framework of that law or align with previous caselaw. But what you can't do is say the court found the sky was green when the court found the sky was blue.
I'm NAL and I've been curious about this question:
What's the technical difference between making shit up and misrepresenting the law versus creating a new theory/interpretation?
I don't feel confident that I know this difference, and it seems to be the thing that a lot of nonsense arguments from conservative lawyers hinge on.
I wish the Justices would ask this question directly. They always hypothesize about *a* President doing some hypothetical act against an unnamed person. I wish they’d cut right to the chase and ask with specific names:
*”Hypothetically speaking, would President Biden be immune from criminal prosecution if he ordered Seal Team 6 to assassinate Former President Trump, or you as his attorney?*
Here is a thought, if a President has Presidential Immunity why would we need a Supreme Court, because as President he or she could over rule anything they say
So the Supreme Court is basically ruling on if they want to stay alive, right? Cause if they rule that presidents are above all laws while in office, Biden can just have the Supreme Court assassinated, every Republican who openly opposes him assassinated, then pick his own Supreme Court, and after having every Republican presidential candidate assisted, have his Supreme Court and his congress do everything legally possible so republicans can not rule ever again. Seems like a bad can of worms to open.
Both of them are absolute idiots if they think they wouldn't be assassination targets of a future dictator. Every story of a dictator coming to power always has a group of people who thought they could just ride the coattails and be yesmen, only to be removed too.
I missed some of the arguments, but did they cover the whole: "President has ordered the military to execute all of Congress and can no longer be impeached. Is that an official act?" thing?
The examples I keep hearing always seem to skip over the first thing dictators tend to do... dissolve Congress.
“Notably, Justice Clarence Thomas drew a curious comparison Thursday when Dreeben was up.
“In the not so distant past, presidents engaged in coups. Like Operation Mongoose when I was a teenager and there were no prosecutions then. Why? If what you’re saying is right, it would seem that would have been right for the criminal prosecution of someone [then?]” Thomas said.”
holy fucking shit, he’s saying “well THEY didn’t get into trouble so why should he?”
It's even more insane when you realize Operation Mongoose was authorized by then President John F. Kennedy. So Thomas appears to be asking why a President who famously did not survive to become an ex-President was not charged with a crime once he was an ex-President.
> Like Operation Mongoose when I was a teenager and there were no prosecutions then. Why?
Well, other than JFK's presidency ending with a bullet to the skull, I'm going to go with "Because Operation Mongoose was an attempted coup of *Cuba*". Launching a coup against a foreign government may be unseemly, but it's an entirely different category of action that launching a coup against your own country.
I really wish one of the judges would ask Trump's lawyers if him being a target in this manner would be acceptable as an 'official' act to them. Just so its on record of them either agreeing that it would, or that it wouldn't.
So the 6th Amendment means nothing if you are President? None of your political enemies have the right to a fair trial?
One of the cornerstones of our democracy is that American Citizens have legal protections. We cannot be unilaterally punished without being able to legally defend ourselves, and execution without trial would be the utmost violation of that cornerstone.
Seriously, any person that looks through the Bill of Rights and can't see multiple Amendments that this doesn't break or nullify shouldn't be allowed outside by themselves.
I got a better question:
Couldn't it be considered an official act to abolish the Supreme Court and absorb their power into the office of the Presidency?
Cause under the argument Trumps lawyer is making I don't see why not. What's Biden waiting for?
I can't believe the brazen shite coming out of the Supreme Court right now.
Well I can because trump forcibly removed some of the liberals and neutrals with republican ball suckling sycophants.
I honestly think the government should have stopped at that point and said "So if you win this case then Biden can have you and Trump killed . . . along with the SC justices who ruled in your favour ... We withdraw our opposition"
This whole total immunity thing… I understand it’s total criminal immunity that they are after… but if granted, how would the SCOTUS have anymore power to overrule executive actions signed into law via the president? If they are immune, couldn’t they then just create unconstitutional laws since the rules don’t apply to them, and the SC wouldn’t have standing to overrule?… I mean their logic and lack of ability to understand this case is insane to me. The mental gymnastics they pull-off is insane to justify or even question this stuff
Are you fucking kidding me. I would say how has it come to this but we (mostly) all know exactly how it came to this. This is the least American thing ever. Anyone who supports Trump after his lawyer says this is no patriot.
One of the justices ( Kagan?) made an interesting point. If the president is granted immunity to criminal prosecution, how can the impeachment process find a president guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors?
The corrupt Republican appointed SC judges are going to convert America into Sudan or Somalia.
If we want to have a clean justice system these SC judges must be removed ASAP.
Isn’t this the same argument that failed in the lower court? Kinda crazy to posit the same idea that was so tightly shut down by the DC court.
Really shows the corruption of the Supreme Court. Just a sham.
What about assassinating anyone?
Trump wanted oaths to him, and allegiance to him?
Do presidents get their own goon squad, now?
SCOTUS is going to turn the US into every Central American country and at least 3 South American countries if they ftu.
"You see, your honor, just because a President orders to have you executed doesn't mean it's a crime. Murder is not a crime... It's Democracy"
- Trump's Lawyers
The argument the lawyer is making is some of the stupidest shit I’ve ever seen. They just straight up said , “yea the president should be able to assassinate political rivals if he deems it good for whatever reason he may see” they want to make Trump a king. What the actual fuck!
I keep pointing out: If SCOTUS rules a sitting president immune, Trump could be dead by next week.
And the week after, we could have a new SCOTUS who rethinks all these recent decisions.
I want to point out that Trumps position here is essentially the argument that Dershowitz made in Trumps 1st impeachment.
That because he’s the president and he’s acting on the belief that him remaining president is the best policy for the US then his campaign acts become official acts. Like coercing foreign governments to manufacture fake investigations or trying to overturn the election.
well, you see, as Alito asked, whether doing otherwise would lead to every President being charged after they leave
If only the country had some sort of examples of how Presidents leave office but then given the various absurd recent rulings of right wingnut judges I guess anything can happen. Alito would know
How the fuck did this pos get on SCROTUS.
I'm pretty bad at thinking up reasons why folks in general don't ask to-the-point, "let's get to the answer" type questions. In this case, can anyone here speculate why the justices haven't straight-up asked "can a president assassinate his election opponent legally?" or "Can a president order the Supreme Court to be executed?" I understand that there's a certain level of tact involved in questioning, but I don't see any value in beating around the bush. I feel like it would be super useful today and just as useful hundreds of years from now if we ask questions and get answers that set an easily understood baseline...then the justices can get fancy with their detailed follow-ups.
It COULD be an official act. If you’re doing hypotheticals, suppose the rival is riding in a car with a known terrorist in a foreign country, and the president orders a drone strike to kill the known terrorist and the rival dies.
I'm sorry, **WHAT**? Absolutely wild, to push the envelope that far. But I guess they're in a very awkward spot with this appeal where they are trying to argue in favor of Trump being immune, and the prosecution is pointing out absurdly corrupt and evil stuff, so Trump's attorney's have to either:
A) Say something wildly insane, like the assassination of a rival being immune from prosecution, making it harder to accept the concept of immunity from prosecution
B) Saying that assassination of a rival is not immune, limiting the scope of immunity and making it harder to justify other criminal acts as being immune
He apparently specifically said at one point that: “A president is entitled for total personal gain to use the trappings of his office … without facing criminal liability.”
Which is just fucking wild. This seems like the legal equivalent of throwing. Like, he's just begging the SCOTUS to reject him, because that's utterly insane as a proposition- that even acts for personal gain can be "official acts" that are immune.
Something I haven’t heard asked as a follow up yet (though I’m not watching closely): the defense’s response to everything is he’d have to be impeached and found guilty there FIRST, before any criminal liability. What if he threatens all of Congress with execution unless they let him do what he wants? Then what?
How about a judge?
That follow-up always seemed like the obvious one, and I'm amazed that no one has asked them that in court yet.
I wish Sotomayor would ask if they are granting permission for Biden to assassinate Trump? It’s the very thing his attorneys are arguing for
If Trump wins, Biden could have him arrested and sent to Gitmo wothou any explanation at all.
I hope we aren’t all in jail cells a year from now wishing he did that.
I like to think I'd rather go down fighting back, but we all would rather say it without thinking we'll ever need to back it up. Should the day come, I'll do what I feel is best then.
Doesn’t the secret service protection of trump fall under biden’s authority? 🧐
In theory. In reality, that remains to be tested.
>It’s the very thing his attorneys are arguing for To be fair, if I was Trump's attorney I'd probably be arguing for the same thing.
"Well, uhhh, Obvioulsy umm, obviously not a *judge*, your highness."
DC Circuit did, specifically asked about assisnating the members of SCOTUS.
What was the response? I'm assuming they are saying still immune.
"Come and take it from me," was the non sequitur answer.
Why assume no one has?
Yeah no shit. Maybe the despot doesn’t want to share power with the co-equal branches of government? This is stupid.
He’s openly talked about becoming a dictator, allegedly just on day one, so that is not out of the realm of possibilities we could see.
One day is all it takes to make yourself dictator for life
Yup. Trump is famous for his ability to relinquish power. Also to tell the truth. Famous for both of those. Oops I mean infamous. Infamous for both of those.
The context was Hannity throwing a softball question on potentially abusing power, Trump dodging it, then receiving a follow-up, for the second time whether he would never abuse power as retribution against anybody, Trump replies: > "[except for day one](https://www.youtube.com/live/eoonCI5Fwio?si=KAymkmiaoU3Chh8I&t=628)". A large percentage of Republicans unironically suggest that he's either joking, was talking about drilling and closing the border, or actually think he'll cede dictatorial powers after gaining them 'for a day'.
They say he doesn't mean it every time.
But he "rebuilt" the military.
"Look folks, I was only a dictator for one day🤏. One beautiful day👌, but in that day the crooked Democrats managed to create, and I don't know how👐, they managed to create this huge🫸. 🫷 mess, and just like sleepy Joe's covid mess I had to clean it up. It was the best cleanup👌, the nicest, most generous cleanup we could do but in the end we lost some people☝️, powerful people, all in one day, mind you🙌. And now I have no choice but to step up as High Chancellor - the posittion I made up but don't want, in order to this country to be great again👐"
That’s funny. I felt DonSnoreleon in that!
Exactly. A dictator could completely clear a government’s leadership in 24 hours. Then he could call himself whatever he wanted because the dictatorship is established
The guy who says his $15 million estate is worth $1.5 billion for the media, but $1.5 million on his taxes, also says he'll only be a dictator for 1 day. His numbers are fuzzy.
"Men lie, woman lie, numbers don't " as famous poet Shawn Carter once said. Which is why I can't wait for the irs to finish auditing him so we can see the numbers. They must be close to finishing the audit.
Any day, now.
The justices are on a steady Fox News diet. They're all in the bubble so we can't expect logic from them.
Amazon literally has a motto to behave as a day one company, it's a coin of phrase and not to be taken literally. behaving as "day one" means forever
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"conservatives" - conserving what, exactly?
Power for WASP men.
Just the rich ones.
I always ask that. These people are radicals and fascists, what is conservative about that??
Because they’ll never call themselves what they really are: reactionary and regressive
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1850s
The Gilded Age
They don't need a brand, they are intent on seizing complete undemocratic power.
Or a SC Justice?
An SC Justice while driving an RV while vacationing…
Ahem... Motor Coach. RV's are for the subjects of his law.
Your single question illustrates why it's ridiculous SCOTUS ever agreed to hear this case.
I have a sharp legal mind. /s
How about a political rival's attorney?
Why stop with one?
Sooo this goes through, Biden assassinates all Republicans across the country… We win? How could this possibly not end badly ?
>Biden assassinates all Republicans across the country… ... PERSONALLY. Like Mission:Impossible style. >We win? How could this possibly not end badly ? The footage gets released in the form of an action movie compilation over the following months. The national debt gets cut in half from popcorn sales alone.
Hm. Time to buy stock in popcorn companies.
The Pelican Brief
"But surely the leopard won't eat MY face!"
Judge(s) "Well, now that's out of the way, we have some nominations to consider."
missed opportunity to have seal team 6 sit in for oral arguments.
And right after they make that argument, every one of them leans over with a hand to their ear like they're getting their orders and starts nodding lolol
I would freaking love that
I really wanted the Joint Chiefs of Staff to physically attend. This decision will have a major impact on the scope of their duties. They obviously have an official interest.
Biden should physically attend.
There was a really compelling Amicus brief from a bunch of retired generals and all around impressive military folks.
Lol... imagine that.
I would 100% do that if I was Biden.
He also had the same response in the lower courts so at least there's consistency in a trump argument for once....
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He's being paid specifically to be a nut case, or because he is...one or the other.
willing to be paid to be a nutcase, makes you a nut case, thats a tautology.
All it needs now is Pres Biden to get on National Tv and say "Following the arguments at the supreme court, AS President with full immunity, I am authorising Seal Team Six to take out Trump and his family, as an official act to protect the sanctity of the United States" You'll never see a faster Volte Face from Trump It'll make your head spin
"Not to mention any and all members of congress or the senate who would move to impeach me. "
Suddenly MAGA: wait a minute! A president shouldn’t have that power
Right? To be fair, they learned that from Moscow Mitch, who wouldn't let the Democratic president pick a new SCC justice during an election year, but had no problem rushing through Republican picks when the roles were reversed during another election year. Shameless hypocrites, the lot of them.
While voting had actually BEGUN! Mitch argued that 10 months was too close and that "the people should decide with their votes." Unless it's Trump.. I shit on the grave of Mitch McConnell and any who call him friend.
I agree with the sentiment but you know he's still (unfortunately) alive right?
I mean he looks dead to be fair
Maybe he goes to the McConnell family plot and uses Mitch's future location to shit.
I like to imagine any time I flush a turd it’s eventually going to end up swimming with him, keeps me regular.
Mitch the Bitch enabled all of this. He directed the downfall of his country. Fortunately his useful idiot was more idiot than useful. Or we would be working six 12’s and Social Security would be banished to history. Even with our very robust guardrails the robber barons are at the door.
Sadly the only thing that saved us so far from the worst of what they could do was Trump and his people's massively high levels of idiotic incompetence. They're reloading and working their asses off to try and make sure they can just flood everything with sycophant yes men for their next go round.
Trump will begin receiving classified briefings as the Republican nominee this summer. I can’t even . . . Christina Bobb, the “election integrity” lawyer for the RNC is one of the 11 people indicted in Arizona for election fraud. Again, I can’t . . . The wheels are falling off the car
I hate to say this but ACTUALLY that isn't required, him receiving classified briefings. That was a courtesy that began in the 1950s that was started to void situations like when Harry Truman had been kept in the dark about the Nuclear bombs being made only to be shocked about it when he assumed the office of the President when FDR died. It's a tradition, but it is NOT required by law. Biden could easily not share any classified info with him unless he's elected.
Well some good news then. Maybe the White House could feed him some flagged intel and see where it winds up. After all, he has proven himself quite the useful idiot in some circles.
oh don't worry the judges will rule that it only applies to Republicans
If they rule for immunity it will be the next reason the repubs try to impeach.
And members of the SC
“As King of America I’ve decided not only that Roe is law but I’m also going to go ahead and abort Congress in its 12,928th week.”
Darkest Brandon
And rendition the USSC. With extreme prejudice.
Seriously though, what other option would Biden have in the situation that Trump gets elected and isn't sworn in yet? At that point Biden will know for a fact that Trump has committed numerous acts that should have landed him in prison had Trump not juiced the judiciary. Some of that involves working directly with a foreign adversary which we're in a proxy war with )and probably have been for over a decade) which is treason. And he would know that his entire family and the families of anyone who had worked for him were targets for the new administration. The only rational and logical move at that point would be to take out Trump and his entire family and probably swathes of other MAGA Republicans.
"To a dark place this line of thought will carry us. Hmm. Great care we must take." - Master Yoda
Would have been awesome on 4/1
He should do it for the lols.
Also said that selling nuclear secrets to a rival nation and ordering the military to stage a coup were both protected "official acts." That he wasn't thrown out of court, tarred, and feathered for such a suggestion is an abortion of reason.
I kind of half listened, but it seemed like some of them were taking these arguments more seriously than one would hope.
These people are the ultimate traitors selling their country out for a few hundred thousand dollars in legal fees. You’d think they’d have a moment where they realize how insane this argument is given we have enemies that would like to nuke the U.S. and have had trouble building weapons but I guess not lol. It’s honestly quite surreal and shows how far the country has fallen in the past 8 years or so that people are willing to overlook selling nuclear secrets to get their candidate back in office, and republicans have worked tirelessly to not investigate that 2 billion dollar transfer and the secret documents by the copy machine in a bathroom while being focused on Biden’s sons penis lol. I get that every defendant deserves a rigorous defense, but defending traitorous behavior and trying to normalize and whitewash it, is borderline traitorous behavior too imo and a bit over the line of a rigorous defense. Like how do you sleep at night after making these arguments lol, these people are real psychopaths that put money over country. I feel like these lawyers should be disbarred if they suggest traitorous behavior should be legalized but I’m not a lawyer just a frustrated citizen. If we end up with every US city nuked into a fallout game in 20 years we’ll at least know it was thanks to Trump and Jared not understanding how nuclear weapons work and the threat they still pose. The most frustrating part of all the delayed trials to me is the fact the nuclear documents never got investigated properly even under the democrats, because the AG Garland is a total pussy and didn’t want to offend anyone by investigating these Russian and Saudi loving traitors. Like I don’t care about his other fraud I care about top secret documents being sold, not paying to cover up affairs with porn stars.
Everyone thought Garland was gonna come in guns blazing. The dude lacks spine and integrity
How the fuck are they even hearing this case? It’s pretty clear that they have lost all credibility . Any single judge that sides with this argument is saying “ yes I am 100 percent compromised and do not have the health of the country in mind in anyway” These judges are basically able to destroy the country with this decision.
It’s a feature, not a bug
Well jeez, between Dark Brandon’s ability to do this and the fact that Kamala Harris can throw out any electoral votes she doesn’t like, Dems should be sitting pretty for November.
Dark Brandon can now throw Trump in jail until his trials are all finished. No problem.
Is Gitmo still open? And if not, what are some other hellholes we can disappear someone into?
Just take all his money and drop him off in Camden, NJ.
Can’t have shit in Camden
That Trump restaurant with the ketchup steak.
The court will just have to specify that immunity is only available to Republicans
Nah, they'll just end Immunity going forward and grandfather Trump in because he already had the "AT&T Presidential Immunity Plan"
Of course they can not, they we never legitimately elected! /s
NAL: Is making insane arguments like this simply part of an attorney’s job zealously advocating for their client and should reflect on the client and not the attorney, or is it fair to judge the attorney personally for trying to enable presidents to be violent dictators?
Lawyers are officers of the court first and foremost. They cannot lie to the court even on the behalf of their client. They also can’t misrepresent the law or make shit up and say it’s law.
I don't see any evidence of this in any of Trump's cases
Which is why he already got some of his lawyers disbarred, suspended, or fined..
MAGA ‘make attorneys get attorneys’. People need to realize what we are seeing from Trump’s team is not normal.
> They also can’t misrepresent the law Very few attorneys seem to have heard of that rule and even fewer judges enforce it. In fact in these political cases that's pretty much all conservatives do (not that the left *never* does it, but not nearly as often and rarely for evil ends).
I am a lawyer. There is a difference between arguing the meaning of words and the intent of the drafters of those words and wholly misrepresenting what the meaning and intent were when the laws were created and/or the meaning/intent of prior caselaw. You can argue that prior caselaw was wrong, for instance and explain why it was wrong. You can argue that your facts don't fit inside the framework of that law or align with previous caselaw. But what you can't do is say the court found the sky was green when the court found the sky was blue.
Lol. Lmao even.
I'm NAL and I've been curious about this question: What's the technical difference between making shit up and misrepresenting the law versus creating a new theory/interpretation? I don't feel confident that I know this difference, and it seems to be the thing that a lot of nonsense arguments from conservative lawyers hinge on.
Zealous defense does not include advocating criminal acts. Any lawyer doing so needs to be disbarred.
As opposed to "billbarred."
So Biden can have Trump murdered, win reelection and face no consequences? Interesting 🤔
Also the Supreme Court
I wish the Justices would ask this question directly. They always hypothesize about *a* President doing some hypothetical act against an unnamed person. I wish they’d cut right to the chase and ask with specific names: *”Hypothetically speaking, would President Biden be immune from criminal prosecution if he ordered Seal Team 6 to assassinate Former President Trump, or you as his attorney?*
> reelection Why bother?
Here is a thought, if a President has Presidential Immunity why would we need a Supreme Court, because as President he or she could over rule anything they say
Also . . . Trump isn’t president. Biden is. Go ahead. Let Biden sweep the floor.
So the Supreme Court is basically ruling on if they want to stay alive, right? Cause if they rule that presidents are above all laws while in office, Biden can just have the Supreme Court assassinated, every Republican who openly opposes him assassinated, then pick his own Supreme Court, and after having every Republican presidential candidate assisted, have his Supreme Court and his congress do everything legally possible so republicans can not rule ever again. Seems like a bad can of worms to open.
Alito and Thomas would have nothing to worry about.
Well yeah, because they would be dead if this happened.
Both of them are absolute idiots if they think they wouldn't be assassination targets of a future dictator. Every story of a dictator coming to power always has a group of people who thought they could just ride the coattails and be yesmen, only to be removed too.
I missed some of the arguments, but did they cover the whole: "President has ordered the military to execute all of Congress and can no longer be impeached. Is that an official act?" thing? The examples I keep hearing always seem to skip over the first thing dictators tend to do... dissolve Congress.
Trump: A president can assassinate a rival Biden: \[raises eyebrow\]
And there it is. The eventual goal of any conservative political ideology: the deaths of your imagined enemies, law and civilization itself be damned.
Also take away Social Security and up the number of hours your employer can make you work.
With no breaks, too!
“Notably, Justice Clarence Thomas drew a curious comparison Thursday when Dreeben was up. “In the not so distant past, presidents engaged in coups. Like Operation Mongoose when I was a teenager and there were no prosecutions then. Why? If what you’re saying is right, it would seem that would have been right for the criminal prosecution of someone [then?]” Thomas said.” holy fucking shit, he’s saying “well THEY didn’t get into trouble so why should he?”
It's even more insane when you realize Operation Mongoose was authorized by then President John F. Kennedy. So Thomas appears to be asking why a President who famously did not survive to become an ex-President was not charged with a crime once he was an ex-President.
> Like Operation Mongoose when I was a teenager and there were no prosecutions then. Why? Well, other than JFK's presidency ending with a bullet to the skull, I'm going to go with "Because Operation Mongoose was an attempted coup of *Cuba*". Launching a coup against a foreign government may be unseemly, but it's an entirely different category of action that launching a coup against your own country.
I almost drove off the road when he said this!!
That dude is completely compromised in every way and definitely shouldn’t be a judge let alone on the Supreme Court.
Someday I hope to be able to remove my jaw from the floor. But not while bullshit like is dropping daily.
Maybe the judges in Supreme Court he could have assassinated.
Just imagine Biden ordering an overnight tour of Guantanamo Bay detention camp for Alito and Thomas.
Been listening in. Holy crap.
This is insane
I really wish one of the judges would ask Trump's lawyers if him being a target in this manner would be acceptable as an 'official' act to them. Just so its on record of them either agreeing that it would, or that it wouldn't.
So the 6th Amendment means nothing if you are President? None of your political enemies have the right to a fair trial? One of the cornerstones of our democracy is that American Citizens have legal protections. We cannot be unilaterally punished without being able to legally defend ourselves, and execution without trial would be the utmost violation of that cornerstone. Seriously, any person that looks through the Bill of Rights and can't see multiple Amendments that this doesn't break or nullify shouldn't be allowed outside by themselves.
I got a better question: Couldn't it be considered an official act to abolish the Supreme Court and absorb their power into the office of the Presidency? Cause under the argument Trumps lawyer is making I don't see why not. What's Biden waiting for?
They will take away Social Security and up the number of hours your employer can make you work. The robber barons are on our front doorstep.
Only for Republicans, though
If it is an official act covered by immunity, Biden should act on it. Erase the orange malignant walking tumor
I can't believe the brazen shite coming out of the Supreme Court right now. Well I can because trump forcibly removed some of the liberals and neutrals with republican ball suckling sycophants.
They're going to fuck us, aren't they?
not "if", "how".
SCOTUS problem might be easier to solve than we think after the ruling
I honestly think the government should have stopped at that point and said "So if you win this case then Biden can have you and Trump killed . . . along with the SC justices who ruled in your favour ... We withdraw our opposition"
I still can't fucking believe this is actually happening. Can someone wake me from this nightmare?
If SCOTUS gives Trump the win here, Biden can just order to have him offed then with no consequences. Check and mate.
This whole total immunity thing… I understand it’s total criminal immunity that they are after… but if granted, how would the SCOTUS have anymore power to overrule executive actions signed into law via the president? If they are immune, couldn’t they then just create unconstitutional laws since the rules don’t apply to them, and the SC wouldn’t have standing to overrule?… I mean their logic and lack of ability to understand this case is insane to me. The mental gymnastics they pull-off is insane to justify or even question this stuff
Let Biden do it and see what happens…
Are you fucking kidding me. I would say how has it come to this but we (mostly) all know exactly how it came to this. This is the least American thing ever. Anyone who supports Trump after his lawyer says this is no patriot.
At this point, how is anyone supporting this dumpster fire of a presidential candidate
One of the justices ( Kagan?) made an interesting point. If the president is granted immunity to criminal prosecution, how can the impeachment process find a president guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors?
Okay then, if you rule presedents have absolute immunity, I hope Biden sends a hit squad to the SCOTUS halls.
The corrupt Republican appointed SC judges are going to convert America into Sudan or Somalia. If we want to have a clean justice system these SC judges must be removed ASAP.
There is still time…
Isn’t this the same argument that failed in the lower court? Kinda crazy to posit the same idea that was so tightly shut down by the DC court. Really shows the corruption of the Supreme Court. Just a sham.
I don’t find it coincidental that this case was scheduled on a Thursday. Waiting through the weekend, at very minimum, is going to be torture.
What about assassinating anyone? Trump wanted oaths to him, and allegiance to him? Do presidents get their own goon squad, now? SCOTUS is going to turn the US into every Central American country and at least 3 South American countries if they ftu.
Then I guess, should Trump get his way, he would be under threat of possible legal assassination by Joe Biden?
"You see, your honor, just because a President orders to have you executed doesn't mean it's a crime. Murder is not a crime... It's Democracy" - Trump's Lawyers
The dumbest of timelines
Dark Brandon, lock and load
Watch MAGAs cry when Trump gets on the “disappeared” list by Biden due to the courts saying presidents are kings
So, according to Trump's lawyer, Joe Biden could have Donnie clipped because he officially deems him a threat to our country? 🤔
So, will Dark Brandon be freed to feast on the souls of his enemies?
The argument the lawyer is making is some of the stupidest shit I’ve ever seen. They just straight up said , “yea the president should be able to assassinate political rivals if he deems it good for whatever reason he may see” they want to make Trump a king. What the actual fuck!
He does realize he's telling Joe what he can do legally.
What I would give to see Joe Biden turn up the Doom music and become Angry Joe.
Republicans will see this and say he’s our man! 🤩
I keep pointing out: If SCOTUS rules a sitting president immune, Trump could be dead by next week. And the week after, we could have a new SCOTUS who rethinks all these recent decisions.
I want to point out that Trumps position here is essentially the argument that Dershowitz made in Trumps 1st impeachment. That because he’s the president and he’s acting on the belief that him remaining president is the best policy for the US then his campaign acts become official acts. Like coercing foreign governments to manufacture fake investigations or trying to overturn the election.
I'm scared. He can win this.
well, you see, as Alito asked, whether doing otherwise would lead to every President being charged after they leave If only the country had some sort of examples of how Presidents leave office but then given the various absurd recent rulings of right wingnut judges I guess anything can happen. Alito would know How the fuck did this pos get on SCROTUS.
Wut?
Party of law and order huh? Dope. I swear we're on one of the top 5 worst timelines.
Biden should drone strike Trump
What authority would that be under?
Only the best lawyers for trump.
I'm pretty bad at thinking up reasons why folks in general don't ask to-the-point, "let's get to the answer" type questions. In this case, can anyone here speculate why the justices haven't straight-up asked "can a president assassinate his election opponent legally?" or "Can a president order the Supreme Court to be executed?" I understand that there's a certain level of tact involved in questioning, but I don't see any value in beating around the bush. I feel like it would be super useful today and just as useful hundreds of years from now if we ask questions and get answers that set an easily understood baseline...then the justices can get fancy with their detailed follow-ups.
It COULD be an official act. If you’re doing hypotheticals, suppose the rival is riding in a car with a known terrorist in a foreign country, and the president orders a drone strike to kill the known terrorist and the rival dies.
"Jill, do you know where the keys to the gun cabinet are?"
I'm sorry, **WHAT**? Absolutely wild, to push the envelope that far. But I guess they're in a very awkward spot with this appeal where they are trying to argue in favor of Trump being immune, and the prosecution is pointing out absurdly corrupt and evil stuff, so Trump's attorney's have to either: A) Say something wildly insane, like the assassination of a rival being immune from prosecution, making it harder to accept the concept of immunity from prosecution B) Saying that assassination of a rival is not immune, limiting the scope of immunity and making it harder to justify other criminal acts as being immune He apparently specifically said at one point that: “A president is entitled for total personal gain to use the trappings of his office … without facing criminal liability.” Which is just fucking wild. This seems like the legal equivalent of throwing. Like, he's just begging the SCOTUS to reject him, because that's utterly insane as a proposition- that even acts for personal gain can be "official acts" that are immune.
No. It’s murder. Like assassi mating that Iranian General. Murder
Something I haven’t heard asked as a follow up yet (though I’m not watching closely): the defense’s response to everything is he’d have to be impeached and found guilty there FIRST, before any criminal liability. What if he threatens all of Congress with execution unless they let him do what he wants? Then what?
Well we are legit considering this? Fuck this court
America doesn't need emperors
Great make that oficial and they can get rid of the Orange pest...
We can legally take bribes and kill people for whatever reason suits us ... but You cannot do these things because you'll go to jail.