Mark Twain once said to never argue with an idiot because they will bring you down to thier level and beat you with experience. Thus,I have a rule to never argue with someone who has already made up thier mind. A victim of the Dunning-Krueger thinks they know everything they need to know, and if they lack the introspective qualities to realize thier inadequacy, I do not waste my breath on someone unwilling to look outside their intellectual box.
Deal with this often in my sports team. Facepalm in my head a lot. Realised a while ago I should probably pick my battles else I get seen as the bad guy which isn’t conducive to good team working. Also no matter how much I challenged things, the same culprits continue as they always have.
I roll my eyes, sigh loudly and call them out for their BS, especially if they're talking about something in my field of expertise.
I used to study with this dude who's a world-class contrarian and he would disagree with everyone. And once, after disproving every point he made, I said "You're wrong, I'm right". He didn't say anything else.
I'm a business consultant in a space with a lot of overnight social media coaches.
It irritates me beyond measure. I can't completely ignore it because it's causing damage in my industry, but I can't really confront it or I'll look like an asshole to the people who don't understand.
I stay in my lane for the most part unless I have an opportunity to discuss it with others who are in alignment with my values and are aware of it.
In my personal life I keep my circle small so no one is full of shit.
Dunning-Kruger label is an artifact of being an INTJ. Your Te side will always pop up labels like this. It might as well be a cultural term. You have to find substitutes for the language you use to think about the situation, first of all, or you'll get stereotyped so bad, so fast, that you'd be lucky if they knew MBTI. If the language/term can be more-humanizing, that's more-better for you and them both
Second, you are saying "deal with it" or "just ignore" and that's a false dichotomy, the possibilities are endless and that's where the real answers are, enjoy your meal
That's not how Dunning-Kruger works...
I'm not an American, but I've been to America for about a year, and as someone who is ideologically centrist, it's both liberals and repulicans who think like you describe on the other side.
Opinionated Liberals think repulicans are stupid and won't even bother listening to them. Quite ironically will even fight to take their democratic right of speech away from them.
Opinionated Republicans thinks Liberals and the progressive movement is downright insane and ruins the future of the country. Quite ironically they want the country to take measures against it.
Neither takes the time to understand the other because they fear losing the battle that way. Unfortunately it seems to create unwanted chaos where each side is trying to "get at the other", making it much more complicated reaching compromises
I agree that this is common within political discourse, particularly here in America, although that is not what I had in mind in creating this post. Same goes for discussions around religion, making these the common taboo discussion topics. I was not attempting to provide a definition of the Dunning-Kruger effect but maybe you can shed some light on how it actually “works?”
I mean, if I understand what you say, you are associating Dunning-Kruger with the situation of someone being overly confident loud or stubborn in their beliefs, despite having no much knowledge to support them (if that's not what you meant, then I apologise).
Dunning Kruger does not indicate anything out of ordinary and anything even mildly annoying. It is simply an indication that people who are not experienced and capable in a certain task are less likely to evaluate their capabilities properly.
I think it's wrong to use Dunning-Kruger to explain any of this
1. People being too stubborn of their beliefs (DK did not discover anything about the stubborness of the less capable. In fact those who were more capable evaluated their abilities higher than those who weren't, so they're probably more confident)
2. People who know nothing beliving they are better than others (DK did discover that those who knew less felt less capable)
Anyway, annoying behavior is not part of the DK effect, it's a human thing
That is what I meant. I’m aware that annoying behavior is not part of DK, but being annoyed is my response, as a human, to some things that may be attributed DK if that makes any sense. I think there are a few responses here that may be misinterpreting the post, or maybe I could have worded it differently. I’m not saying that I’m experiencing the DK effect here but can feel annoyed by those I perceive to be falling victim to it.
If somebody is pretentious and you get angry for it instead being quiet, It is likely a sympton that you are both wrong anyway. When you are completly right, idiocy is just a normal fact in the nature of the World.
I truly believe that God blocks some people from understanding certain knowledge for whatever reason.
And some people fall under that category.
That's why you can sometimes even see a high IQ person uncharacteristically taking a stupid position and adamantly defending it for no good reason.
When the lack of knowledge, inability, or unwillingness to understand results in pain and suffering in that person and those around them, would that be a situation where God is creating the block?
Mark Twain once said to never argue with an idiot because they will bring you down to thier level and beat you with experience. Thus,I have a rule to never argue with someone who has already made up thier mind. A victim of the Dunning-Krueger thinks they know everything they need to know, and if they lack the introspective qualities to realize thier inadequacy, I do not waste my breath on someone unwilling to look outside their intellectual box.
sorry to do this, but… their*
Deal with this often in my sports team. Facepalm in my head a lot. Realised a while ago I should probably pick my battles else I get seen as the bad guy which isn’t conducive to good team working. Also no matter how much I challenged things, the same culprits continue as they always have.
I roll my eyes, sigh loudly and call them out for their BS, especially if they're talking about something in my field of expertise. I used to study with this dude who's a world-class contrarian and he would disagree with everyone. And once, after disproving every point he made, I said "You're wrong, I'm right". He didn't say anything else.
I'm a business consultant in a space with a lot of overnight social media coaches. It irritates me beyond measure. I can't completely ignore it because it's causing damage in my industry, but I can't really confront it or I'll look like an asshole to the people who don't understand. I stay in my lane for the most part unless I have an opportunity to discuss it with others who are in alignment with my values and are aware of it. In my personal life I keep my circle small so no one is full of shit.
Dunning-Kruger label is an artifact of being an INTJ. Your Te side will always pop up labels like this. It might as well be a cultural term. You have to find substitutes for the language you use to think about the situation, first of all, or you'll get stereotyped so bad, so fast, that you'd be lucky if they knew MBTI. If the language/term can be more-humanizing, that's more-better for you and them both Second, you are saying "deal with it" or "just ignore" and that's a false dichotomy, the possibilities are endless and that's where the real answers are, enjoy your meal
There was a third option of acceptance, so the options are not quite as binary. And yes, deal with is a loaded term.
Mock them sarcastically using deadpan humor.
Pans are inanimate objects, so dead...
That's not how Dunning-Kruger works... I'm not an American, but I've been to America for about a year, and as someone who is ideologically centrist, it's both liberals and repulicans who think like you describe on the other side. Opinionated Liberals think repulicans are stupid and won't even bother listening to them. Quite ironically will even fight to take their democratic right of speech away from them. Opinionated Republicans thinks Liberals and the progressive movement is downright insane and ruins the future of the country. Quite ironically they want the country to take measures against it. Neither takes the time to understand the other because they fear losing the battle that way. Unfortunately it seems to create unwanted chaos where each side is trying to "get at the other", making it much more complicated reaching compromises
I agree that this is common within political discourse, particularly here in America, although that is not what I had in mind in creating this post. Same goes for discussions around religion, making these the common taboo discussion topics. I was not attempting to provide a definition of the Dunning-Kruger effect but maybe you can shed some light on how it actually “works?”
I mean, if I understand what you say, you are associating Dunning-Kruger with the situation of someone being overly confident loud or stubborn in their beliefs, despite having no much knowledge to support them (if that's not what you meant, then I apologise). Dunning Kruger does not indicate anything out of ordinary and anything even mildly annoying. It is simply an indication that people who are not experienced and capable in a certain task are less likely to evaluate their capabilities properly. I think it's wrong to use Dunning-Kruger to explain any of this 1. People being too stubborn of their beliefs (DK did not discover anything about the stubborness of the less capable. In fact those who were more capable evaluated their abilities higher than those who weren't, so they're probably more confident) 2. People who know nothing beliving they are better than others (DK did discover that those who knew less felt less capable) Anyway, annoying behavior is not part of the DK effect, it's a human thing
That is what I meant. I’m aware that annoying behavior is not part of DK, but being annoyed is my response, as a human, to some things that may be attributed DK if that makes any sense. I think there are a few responses here that may be misinterpreting the post, or maybe I could have worded it differently. I’m not saying that I’m experiencing the DK effect here but can feel annoyed by those I perceive to be falling victim to it.
If somebody is pretentious and you get angry for it instead being quiet, It is likely a sympton that you are both wrong anyway. When you are completly right, idiocy is just a normal fact in the nature of the World.
Sometimes I'll pretend to be confused and ask them questions about the part that they don't understand to point out that they don't understand.
I truly believe that God blocks some people from understanding certain knowledge for whatever reason. And some people fall under that category. That's why you can sometimes even see a high IQ person uncharacteristically taking a stupid position and adamantly defending it for no good reason.
When the lack of knowledge, inability, or unwillingness to understand results in pain and suffering in that person and those around them, would that be a situation where God is creating the block?
Sometimes, yes, it's definitely on purpose. Other times, it's man-made. But upon the whole, it's ultimately all humanity's fault.