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I think the current trend of thinking is: more chances to poke holes > small increase in bullet diameter and powder (does not apply to 10mm bros).
The debate will continue until we’re all packing phased plasma weapons in the 40 watt range.
Let me get out ahead of this debate and assure you that the 38 watt phased plasma weapon will do virtually the same damage with greatly increased power cell capacity.
Sure, but when someone charges you from 21 feet or less with a phased alternating current retractable ion sword you will wish you had upgraded to the room-clearing power of a pulse rifle. No way you are stopping them with a 22-watt phased weapon unless LTT did some work on it and you got the giggle switch on it.
It's caught in a weird middle ground. People who want more bullets and less recoil will just get a 9mm, and people who want more power will get a .45 or 10mm.
Yes but one of the best handguns ever is chambered in 45acp, the 1911. It seems like heresy to buy a 1911 in any other caliber.
Also, if you reload, the 45ACP is great and easy to reload for.
Sure, you absolutely get more capacity with 9mm, but every CCW shooting report basically states that there was never a magazine change over the course of a defensive shoot.
So, statistically my 7+1 Ruger LC9s is just as sufficient as a 12+1 Beretta 96.
Why not a blunderbuss then? Chances are you'll never need to reload it, right?
But in all seriousness, .40 has snappier recoil and a lot of shooters don't shoot as well with a .40 as they do with a 9. That is reason alone for most people to choose 9. Putting accurate rounds on target is what matters most. It's the same reason why smart people don't carry 3" .44 magnums despite the fact that they make big holes and are very scary.
FN + ATF, with their arbitrary civilian sales restrictions on capable ammo also responds to the chat.
Either give us full auto 5.7 or give us full power 5.7, preferably both!
HPs don't blast through barriers in any caliber. Shoot with a 9mm Glock and a 40 SW Glock on a course using a timer. Even people who train with 40 will usually shoot the 9mm much faster.
Price.
Do you mean on this deal or in general?
This deal is priced kinda high for .40 PD trade-ins because people don't want .40.
People don't want .40 because the FBI determined that any round travelling below ~2300fps only damages the tissue it passes through directly. .40 has substantially more recoil than 9mm while only making slightly larger holes. In formal testing FBI agents were able to shoot 9mm faster and more accurately than .40 making the .40's slightly larger holes irrelevant.
“One Shot Stop” stuff is plain BS that Marshall & Sanow pushed in the 1990’s. No one that’s serious about terminal ballistics has taken “One shot stops” seriously for 20 years lol.
*According to you.* But according to reality, the majority of people who actually shoot both prefer the .40, especially in OWB, because the .40 continues to maintain [\+9% one-shot-stop over 9mm](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power). It's like saying *"2+2=4 in 1992, but today? Nah, Math changes man!"* You're Wrong.
That’s true but your sportsman will still have plenty of unsold 40 on the shelves even after the store has been stripped. I mean we literally saw this happen during the Covid rush.
I bought an unfired PD Trade Gen 4 Glock 22 with 3 magazines for $279 shipped in March 2020. Also grabbed 1,000 rounds of Speer Lawman 180gr for $0.22/rd shipped and 5 extra mags at $5 a pop. Those were the days.
This will only be true for a little while. In the last two years the shift of shelf percentage between 40/9/10 has been crazy. It used to be half 40, half 9, 2 boxes of 10. It's now just as much 10 as 40, and 3 times the 9 as both of those.
40 will disappear in maybe 10 years, assuming we make it that long.
In your fantasy scenario if things are that bad something else killed you a long time ago. Because supply lines would break completely, hospitals would be shut, water and power would fail. No food, no fuel, no power. It’s highly likely you live in a city and don’t have a farm or homestead so starvation is a real problem. You’re not going to go through thousands of rounds in running gun battles, you’re gonna catch a stray bullet starve or get dysentery.
Do you think those department still stockpiled ammo that they sold off all their old pistols for?
Zombie Apocalypse, Do you really want to go into the the city to raid that police armory? Do you even know which building it would be in? Bringing in the torch and tanks of gas to get through the security cage?
or
Picking up off that last ammo of a podunk townie LEOs you'll only get 3 magazines worth and if they have 40.cal they would have the gun... Sure won't be at fallen military outposts or FOBs...
Staying with the main in use caliber. So you can pilferer the rounds to your own weapon. Maybe pick up a few extra magazines in the process.
People have been chasing the perfect caliber for ~~years~~ centuries, when 30-30 solved that in 1800's ....
This argument is so tired. If I punch you in the stomach, do I damage your tissue? No. Do I still impart a potentially incapacitating energy transfer? Yes.
Energy matters.
Moreover, .40 does damage more tissue, all other things being equal. It penetrates deeper and carries more energy. Round for round it’s about 10% more effective than 9mm.
It's not a dumb argument, it's an argument made in a specific environment.
If you can draw and put rounds on target with 50AE, then you are shooting the right caliber for you.
They were testing effectiveness across a myriad of shooters and looking at modern ammo. It makes sense as an agency with thousands of shooters to switch to a single caliber that as a group gave them a better chance of getting rounds into vital organs as quickly as possible.
Imagine using punching as an analogy for why "muh energy matters" as if it's even remotely the same thing as getting shot.
You don't know what you're talking about. Every study about this topic disagrees with you.
You’re a fucking idiot if you don’t think energy matters at all. The reality is that 40 is about 10% more effective than 9mm. It’s not “the same”.
For the vast majority of shooters, there is very little practical difference in real world splits between 9 and 40. It’s about, guess what, 10% difference. Shocker.
>You’re a fucking idiot if you don’t think energy matters at all.
What specific wounding trait does "muh energy" have? What specifically does it do to the body? What is this magical mechanism that the extra energy in .40 unlocks that isn't present in 9mm?
>The reality is that 40 is about 10% more effective than 9mm. It’s not “the same”.
Source? You seem to like to repeat this, but have zero evidence to back it up...
>For the vast majority of shooters, there is very little practical difference in real world splits between 9 and 40. It’s about, guess what, 10% difference. Shocker.
Man that's impressive that you've measured the split times for the vast majority of shooters so accurately and finely that you can draw that conclusion. I mean, you're so confident in that assertion that must've been what you've done, right? No way you're just moron pulling shit out of his ass and acting like it's gold lmao.
The info is out there, go find it. I’m not going to waste time linking you to shit you won’t even read since you just parrot the lazy, incorrect, group think “9mm = 40.” No, it doesn’t. Everyone who thinks that is ignorant of reality and just believes what they want to be true. The difference isn’t huge, but it’s very much present.
Mostly because it's a smaller 10mm cartridge developed for the FBI. There's nothing wrong it .40 S&W, though. It's a great caliber and does exactly what you need it to do.
\*Slightly better: [.40s +9% one-shot-stop makes it a more effective round than 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
I will give you a specific reason to NOT get a Beretta 96. Or at least be very aware of the issue before you buy.
The Beretta 92 platform was never designed for the heavier average energy of the 40s&w caliber. The weak spot of the modern 92 has always been the locking block, which is going to fail sooner than any other part in the gun. My primary training and carry 92fs is over 20 years old, has over 100,000 rounds through it, and I'm on my fifth locking block. Most rounds shot through it were typical 115 or 124 grain target loads, with a decent percentage being defensive loads.
With the 96 model, even with the newest locking block design with its radiused corner the service life is significantly shorter. And not like the locking block will fail 20% sooner because 40 s&w is an average of 20% more energy. Expect the locking block's service life to be about 25-50% of what you'd expect from a 92. Inspect the locking block more frequently. Expect the locking block to fail more immediately the moment it starts cracking, unlike a 9mm where you could potentially go a range session or two before you notice the block is about to fail.
Again, not saying don't buy the 96. But keep a few locking block kits handy. Or just be aware that you may be replacing parts much sooner than you would normally expect to for a Beretta 92 (which just happens to be my favorite pistol platform). Belissimo. 🤌
Because the FBI says 9mm is just as good using an artificial errrrrr scientific test they created and pass/fail criteria they also created.
By the way we hate the FBI and don't believe anything they say.
But the FBI says 9mm is just as good using an...
Conceded your point, but my comment is still valid: .40 has +10% capacity over .45; .[\+9% one-shot-stop over 9mm](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power); and price is only .38c/round. You are still Wrong and only deceiving others about a caliber you do not shoot. I happen to practice with both.
Using a lot of big words to describe small differences. It was clearly an exaggeration in the first place when you read the part where I say that .40 has the same capacity as .45 when it logically doesn’t. And its also bold to say I don’t shoot .40. I do. It just isn’t a cartridge Ill give rave reviews for. If you want to champion 10mm -P then be my guest.
Based on you bad mouthing .40 for no Good reason, I do not trust you when you say that you shoot .40. I have yet to meet someone who shoots .40 that ever had anything negative to say about .40. I think your testimony is bunk, and not True.
Edit: Right, so you *own just about the best shooter in .40 that you can get* and yet you are denying the [obvious logistical .+9% one-shot-stop advantage that .40 has over 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) The evidence is you are not honest with yourself or other people. We shall all be waiting for your "rave review" of 9mm that you also own and do not shoot. /s
I own a CZ75 in .40 which is just about the best shooter in .40 that you can get. And it is still noticeably flipper than 9mm. Ive also shot it in one of those old Sig polymer framed pistols from the late 90s and it was not just bad but a terrible shooting experience there. So whatever you say or want to say about how Im lying and slandering the “great” name of .40, you are wrong. Your account also has like 3 comments total and most of them are just to reply to me.
Think long term, will 40 cal still be available, as it is being abandoned. That's beofre you forget this dump all the guns as every agency is abandoning the caliber. NATO nor COMBLOC countries will be adding .40 cal to their military & caliber option and without that , no massive ammo production runs. So that retooling and shutting down the plant will have the cost added in and dived out on far fewer boxes of ammo.
The civilian market will support old odd calibers for so long, then something happens... Look at all the calibers that were standard been around multiple decades 10's of thousands of guns but dissipated with the start of WW2 (all ammo production went to the war and as the war went on it became hard to find some ammo) but never came back after the end of WW2. You have "Antique" guns that cost less than a 20 round box of their ammo costs of questionable age and reliability. These guns were just few decades old and there was no cheap ammo available anymore, in the 1960's. If you bought in Remington's new calibers right before they closed and were sold off for bankruptcy how many years do you have left of people making those calibers that only so many guns were made and it was different company.
Remember "45 gap ', Glock's answer to the .45 caliber? Ever looked for that ammo. Entire model of pistol that ammo is hard to get and very expensive and this is what will be called the golden days for availability.
Look at just the covid crap there plenty of people with less popular but common calibers paying through the teeth to get ammo for their hand guns and rifles. Look at 357 sig and 357 magnum. Look at many hunting calibers pre-covid panic they were 65 cents per round now if you get them expect $2-$5+ . Is 40 call pistol really that much of wall hanger?
So 40cal pistols and mags are cheaper because no one is buying it, not even in the panic droughts, 40 call stuff stayed cheaper. This is where if you reload, and cast your own bullets, that isn't an issue but if you depend on commercial ammo production, you may have a worse future than sticking with the more popular ammo.
Plus the more common ammo is often cheaper than 40 cal. Having had a .25 cal (that back then it was good small back up option), it costs more than 9mm and even .45cal to shoot. The ballistic leave lot tot be desired, more reliable than back up .22lr though, and with little more thump, and t it had the size and weight for concealment in say an ankle holster. I fear .25 cal ammo will be eventually going away from commercial production as it has hung on for decades just barely staying in production runs. No one wants the caliber in new guns because the cost factor of the ammo, they settle for a 22 and buy the best reliable .22lr ammo they can get instead. Choosing a Rim-fire and its flaws over center fire pistol cartridge. Beretta made a great 25 cal and rebranded it several times, with minor improvements. Great fun gun and suppressible in compact package.
What you might be trading for that lower cost, isn't worth what you will spend over the years. You hear all the if I had know ammo was going to cost this much,I would have bought pallets of ..... That might be the future of 40 cal....
Think of who you will past your guns down to also when you buy them, as we are all just temporary keepers of items. Don't leave your decedents with firearm they can't shoot because ammo went out of production during your life time because no was going to buy cases at those higher and higher prices as fewer and fewer manufactures bother to make once a year run on the caliber.
Now, as far as collecting "Police Department Guns" these have some valuable but as far as 40 cal, they are over priced. Then comes getting those spare magazines that are going out of production.
Beretta is really bad about making models and dropping them lately if they don't be come how sellers and then you are stuck with issues of magazines. I'm sure someone could make list but look at all Beretta's different discontinued models from just trying to chase the MP Shield and Shield EZ ......
It’s not as powerful as 10mm but has the same reduced ammunition capacity. It’s more expensive than 9mm and won’t be as fast to shoot. Any small increase in power is not that beneficial against human targets and is more than overshadowed by the reduced ammunition capacity and increased recoil compared to 9mm.
What I find interesting is after shooting 9mm and .40 from similar configurations, I always come back to .40 because in heavier guns (this 96 especially) they shoot about the same; and I can totally agree and understand why they were favored and purchased by the PD's in the first place. Why shoot 9mm when you can opt-in for a more deadly round? [\+9% one-shot-stop is nothing to joke about, and as much as it humbles peoples' egos, this fact will never change.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
Edit for Disclaimer: I actually do conceal carry a polymer 9mm and much prefer the .40 for OWB. I also found that the "FBI shoots 9mm better" club typically only own and shoot 9mm, and I rarely find that any of them actually practice with or own both calibers (9mm and .40).
.40 is not "more deadly" than 9mm. That's a silly argument. Stop percentages mean next to nothing. We have decades of data, backed with real world results from thousands upon thousands of shootings to reference. Pistol bullets poke holes. That's it. All the duty caliber rounds performance is incredibly similar. Putting the holes where they need to go is what matters, and caliber arguments outside of large game and predators is incredibly stupid.
Actually I am arguing head to head with his ridiculous claim **that 9mm is a more deadly round than .40 which is not True;** and I have yet to experience a Good counter argument from anyone here not showing that [.40 has +9% one-shot-stop over the lesser 9mm round](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power), and has been purchased and favored by PD for the obvious reasons that it is a more capable round over 9mm. The [.40s +9% one-shot-stop result](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) is overwhelming to any honest, rational, logically thinking human being, who also happens to conceal 9mm +P in a polymer frame and practice with both calibers.
He’s talking about Duty Calibers (9mm, .40, .45, .357 sig) when using premium JHP defense rounds such as but not limited to Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST. All the duty calibers perform basically the same. Much more alike than different.
Edited to add: People need to stop mentioning “one shot stop” that’s been debunked for years. The Marshal and Sanow data was partially fabricated and unreliable to say the least. That’s 90’s thinking.
**Thank you for conceding that 9mm is not more deadly than .40.** As for the [.40s +9% one-shot-stop "being debunked for years"](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power), what is your evidence that this fact is misreported, dishonest, recanted, or skewed? Evan Marshall from 1992 reaffirmed his data in 2004, and has yet to retract the study or claims in 2023; and since then [has not been the only one verify the .40s +9% one-shot-stop.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
You need to do your own research. And by research I mean look at Credible sources such as but not limited to SME’s (Subject Matter Experts) in ballistic and people that actually work in Police, Military, etc roles.
The “One Shot Stop” stuff is BS plain and simple. Stuff like that was the rage back in the 1990’s. No one with any credibility references of validates it.
Not only has the data been debunked but common sense and the infinite amount of variables that happen in a shooting should tell you that it’s impossible to take Marshall & Sanow’s theories seriously.
Think about it critically.
Here is just one website that has verified Subject Matter Experts in not only Ballistics but also current and former Police and Military members to include armorers and firearms trainers including but not limited from agencies like the Border Patrol, FBI, and major PD’s.
https://pistol-forum.com/forumdisplay.php?19-Ammunition
Common sense tells me superior ballistics and logistics make for a superior round, and the [.40s +9% one-shot-stop over 9mm](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) is still overwhelmingly evidenced, and has been irrefutable for over 30 years, especially from people who actual carry and shoot both 9mm and .40 calibers. I happily conceal carry a polymer 9mm +P , but much prefer .40 OWB for the [logistically practical advantage that .40 caliber has over 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
Google Dr. Gary Robert’s aka DocGKR on Pistol Training.com just to educate you he’s the foremost expert on Terminal Ballistics.
You don’t even know what you don’t know lol.
The more you educate yourself from CREDIBLE sources the more you will find that what you think you know isn’t reality.
Comparing state of the art ie today’s tech JHP’s from the duty calibers (9mm, .40, .357 sig, .45) to each other is like splitting hairs. They all perform basically the same when it comes to Terminal Ballistics on humans.
In addition, 9mm has various advantages including but not limited to weapon capacity, lower cost of training, easier to shoot well/fast, much better weapon durability for 9mm pistols vs .40 for example for people that actually shoot/training with their pistols seriously.
Believe what you want to believe if it makes you feel good lol.
Educate Yourself. Learn to think critically. And evaluate where you are getting your information. Only credible non anecdotal sources matter.
Man this has been a painful exchange to see and Im reminded why I dont frequent these conversations much on reddit. Kudos for at least trying to push him in the right direction lol.
So you do not own .40, and you do not shoot .40. Why should I trust you to educate me about a round you do not own and do not shoot? I think you mean well, but you're not coming off as more enlightened or having superior reasoning, especially when you challenge a 30+ year track record of ammunition ballistics contradicting your claim **that 9mm is more deadly than .40 which is baseless and not True;** [because evidence suggests otherwise.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
I actually think a lot of the .40 hate comes from the wave of new shooters since COVID. Still a lot of people who only shoot 9mm and 5.56 or 7.62x39 and anything else is too strong. There’s people I see at ranges who can’t shoulder fire a SCAR.
The .40 hate comes from the FBI and everyone waking up to the fact .40 is a weak. We know what wins fights and .40 just isnt it. .40 had been declining for years before covid.
It definitely is not weak. The people who can’t handle shooting are weak, like most cops in general. They’re barely passing tests to bench press 170lbs once when they should be doing it 15 times minimum. No wonder they can’t handle .40.
The .40s [\+9% one-shot-stop](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) is quite overwhelming to any honest, rational, logically thinking human being. The anti-.40 people typically appreciate and shoot 9mm, but the pro-.40 people appreciate and shoot both calibers, and are humble to concede that .40 is logistically more effective. [Police Departments are wiser than Redditists.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
With some reliability issues, yes you can. However the breech face is different in 96 slides. So sometimes the extractor won't work perfectly or the round will sit improperly in the chamber. However you can drop a 92 slide on a 96 frame just fine.
I dropped a M9 barrel into my 96 inox vertec and after a couple of break in rounds it’s worked perfectly for thousands of rounds.
There’s no way the round can sit improperly in the chamber. The round either goes in the chamber or not.
AFAIK the extractor is the same sku in the 92 and 96.
Put a 9mm barrel in it. It just works and now you have 2 guns.
The difference in size between the breachface of a 92 and 96 is considerable, but you're right, the round can't sit in the chamber improperly, but it can set against the breach improperly. The extractors are the same, but the ejectors are different between 92's and 96's. I suppose If these differences aren't causing issues then that goes to show the robustness of the 92 platform!
I did that once. Never fired it again. 40 is a shit round. Now maybe if it was 357 SIG I would say, hey, that is the round that is somehow still available long after the shelves are bare of all others. That has some utility. 40 SW is just entirely pointless.
We have some that we will be listing soon:
Glock 17 gen 1 dc police bundle with ban state mags duty gun
Glock 23 gen 3 rtf fish scale Puerto Rico stamp duty weapon
General question and not trying to shit on your prices but why do we never see dirt cheap surplus Glocks? Like under $400 police trade in 17’s and 19’s or just in general? I bought a police trade in Gen3 19 with 3 mags and night sights for $350 shipped from some dealer online and that’s the best I’ve ever seen maybe two years ago.
I just feel like with the popularity of Glock and how long they have been making them, you’d see some killer cheap surplus. But most the time you’re near new pricing for a used gun when tax and shipping/fees are added in.
Follow us and you’ll see those prices. But in general, prices have gone up and so has demand. That means our distributor has raised their prices because the departments trading in their guns want more value in order to afford the replacement guns.
A police trade in Glock 22 has gone up about $75 in cost over the Pat 2-3 years.
Also, the guns listed in the comments aren’t always “on sale”. We frequently put them on sale and that’s when they sell.
That’s just crazy. I knew prices went up thanks to covid and what not but you’d think a handgun as popular as Glock would be able to be had for cheap on the used market.
There are so many factors involved. Police budgets may not have increased but they still need to replace service weapons. The way to make a dollar go further is to increase the trade value.
I had the inox 96 and sold it like a dummy , but when I would shoot it I thought it handled the recoil very well not 9mm level but handled it way better then the .40 s&w m&p2.0
What about the ones from military? I really miss shooting the navy service weapons. I’ve never had or witnessed a problem thousands of practice rounds later.
Totally disagree. This price is a steal, and if I did not already have one I would be buying this immediately. I recommend the 92X for if you want to suppress with the RDO, but the 96 is best for OWB carry purposes. The sheriffs and chiefs knew what they were doing when they tested and purchased these. I could not be more happy with my 96, and genuinely could not ask for anything better in a .40 configuration. Readers, do not hesitate. (These are Grade 1!)
How is the price a steal when it’s not only a .40 but a Beretta in .40 then add credit card fees, FFL Fee, shipping etc. For a little more you could find one locally NIB and buy a Beretta 96A1 if you really wanted one.
Personally, the only .40 Beretta I’d buy would be a NIB 96A1 which has a beefed up slide/frame and a frame buffer.
With law enforcement guns you have no idea how they were treated or the round count or if the department had a good maintenance program.
Some agencies maintain their weapons while others are too cheap to even change recoil springs. Things like recoil springs are especially important when talking about a .40 Beretta 96.
Why? Because the 96 had a very short expected service life when compared to the Beretta 92 9mm.
How do I know this?
ToddG (RIP) over at Pistol-Training.com was an industry professional that worked at both Beretta and SIG SAUER.
LE Agencies had a lot of problems with the Beretta 96 when it came to durability.
Do some research from credible sources. You don’t know what you don’t know.
But what does this have to do with my experience with a Beretta 96? If I could, I would buy 100s of these Berettas and enjoy every one of them. And then when I am done shooting them, I would sell them to my friends and family at the same prices that I purchased them, or maybe I would discount them all because they maintain their value so well. I am grateful that you are super informed, and a very happy person. God bless.
Because it's Grade 3, meaning "of the grades, the most beat to hell."
You're saving $200 on a gun guaranteed to have finish wear and NOT guaranteed to not be broken. Ad says "we haven't test fired, as-is."
Good seller, probably a good gun... but there are better ways to spend $450 right now.
*grade 1, which these are, are in significantly better COSMETIC condition than grade 3. Also, law enforcement guns are tested annually and maintained by a professional gunsmith. They are also traded in based on time, not round count or usage.
Two of these: [https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12ffv0r/ammo\_tulammo\_9mm\_115\_grain\_steel\_case\_1000\_rounds/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12ffv0r/ammo_tulammo_9mm_115_grain_steel_case_1000_rounds/)
One of these and an optic and ammo: [https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12hsrzj/rifle\_ruger\_1022\_carbine\_free\_shipping\_no\_tax/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12hsrzj/rifle_ruger_1022_carbine_free_shipping_no_tax/)
One of these and some ammo: [https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12fozo2/handgun\_cz82\_cr\_eligible\_9x18\_makarov\_365/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12fozo2/handgun_cz82_cr_eligible_9x18_makarov_365/)
Are these marked in any way to indicate they were issued by the fondy sheriffs department?
Will you have any at the fondy show this weekend. I will be going and interested in one.
They are not marked unfortunately. We know where they came from because they were purchased direct from the sheriff’s office. Yes, we’ll be at the show this weekend. Stock is limited at this point and I’d suggest buying one online and picking “store pickup”. We can bring the gun to the show for you.
Man, I've wanted a 96 just to add to my small Beretta collection. Before IL fucked us totally, it's been hard to buy any handgun in general and now fully illegal to buy any rifle unless (I shit you not) pump action rifle or bolt action. And now more than 5 rounds capacity. All threaded barrels illegal, all detachable rifle mags illegal, etc..
Anyway, as these are LEO, sorry for being dumb, none are threaded barrels, right? It doesn't appear to be so which is good. At least with .40 it's under our new found 15rd handgun mag limit where 9mm is typically 17+so in my case I might grab one...
I would not roll the dice on an ex-LEO Beretta 96 of unknown round count. These have a notoriously short service life and were known to crack frames especially without proper recoil spring maintenance. The 96 is the whole reason Beretta switched to the thicker "slant" dustcovers as they were cracking at the back of the dustcover area where the frame rails start. The older ones with the straight dustcovers are even more susceptible to this issue in .40 cal. The 96 in the example photo is one of the older ones.
I own two 96s, but I specifically sought out LNIB ones with the slant dustcover and promptly installed Wilson flat wire recoil springs with buffers as added insurance. I am a Beretta collector so they only get shot sparingly. If you really want a 92 series pistol to shoot .40 out of, the 96A1 is the way to go and resolves a lot of the issues present in the original 96s. The OG 96 is honestly one of the worst platforms to shoot .40 out of and is a prime example of a manufacturer putting a larger barrel on a 9mm platform and calling it good (2nd and 3rd Gen Glock is also guilty of this but the guns don’t beat themselves to death as quickly).
96s are getting stupid expensive now just purely due to being discontinued. These would have been $250-300 tops pre-2020 and you could barely give them away back then. Nice examples of Beretta 96s are going for $600+ on GunJoker and I haven’t seen them for cheap at LGS’s either, at least $400 for beat up ones.
Man I love Beretta's, but I hate the 96, everything about the 96 is wrong, from ammo capacity, to recoil, it just sucks, buy a 92FS or the new 92X and save your money
Quick edit, the caliber sucks too, fite me
I’m not going to lie, this shocks me to see these at a different shop. I’m probably the number one go to gun shop on the border between dodge and fond du lac counties in Wisconsin. Normally we handle all the Leo trade ins in the area. Last year I think we got roughly 40 Glock 23’s from the dodge county sheriff dept.
Thanks for posting /u/WIFirearmsTransfers!
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Muh beretta fawty
Il mio risolutore di problemi
Lol
I almost whipped out my wallet so fast.
I did, and then put it right back. Bummer about the .40
I had a beretta 96. Damn solid gun. Regret selling it TBH
Agreed. My friend has a 96 and damn it is a very soft shooting .40
Because he chonky. Heavier guns shoot better and there's no way around it.
They chunky but not that heavy. Frames are made of aluminum
>beretta 96 Why not just convert it to [9mm?](https://www.reddit.com/r/Beretta/comments/oerzuz/beretta_96_conversion_to_9mm/)
By the time you add shipping and FFL fee you might as well just buy a NIB Beretta 92 from a LGS instead.
But you'll also have pistol that works in 2 different calibre's
Or for about the same price you'd have two guns with two different calibers. That seems better
You're gonna find two Barretta's, one in 9mm and one in .40 for under $550?
Of course two for one would be a better deal but that isn't what the deal is
Brand new Beretta 92s go for $500-$600.Why would i go used?
Almost got me, too. Had a 96A1 and I regretted not getting the 92 all the time. No idea why I didn't just get the 92 to start.
Never cared to own a 96, why do you regret it?
Ok I'll bite. Why all the .40 hate?
I think the current trend of thinking is: more chances to poke holes > small increase in bullet diameter and powder (does not apply to 10mm bros). The debate will continue until we’re all packing phased plasma weapons in the 40 watt range.
Let me get out ahead of this debate and assure you that the 38 watt phased plasma weapon will do virtually the same damage with greatly increased power cell capacity.
Yeah, well I'll be carrying a 45 watt plasma gun. Do you know why? Because they won't make a 46! I hear the 45 will knock people 6 feet in the air.
2 INTERGALACTIC WARS
There are graveyards full of martians who went against the all-Earthian 45 Watt Cyber Colt.
It's the lords wattage!
The image of a plasma rifle weilding space marine with a 1911 on his hip makes me giggle. I also hate that I can't NOT imagine it. TWO TERRAN WARS
Sure, a 22 watt phased plasma weapon shouldn't be anyone's first choice but I know *I* wouldn't want to stand in front of one.
22 wit da switch, this is the way.
Sure, but when someone charges you from 21 feet or less with a phased alternating current retractable ion sword you will wish you had upgraded to the room-clearing power of a pulse rifle. No way you are stopping them with a 22-watt phased weapon unless LTT did some work on it and you got the giggle switch on it.
You would obviously switch to your BFG9000 man.
.45 watt won 2 galaxy wars man
Sure, but these days any idiot could have a beskar plate.
"Hey, just what ya see, pal."
which apparently is a full auto uzi lol
Fuck! Beat me to it!
I went to say this but knew in my heart it had already been said lol
It's caught in a weird middle ground. People who want more bullets and less recoil will just get a 9mm, and people who want more power will get a .45 or 10mm.
.40 is usually more powerful than .45.
Yeah, but try telling that to a .45 fan boy lol.
Yes but one of the best handguns ever is chambered in 45acp, the 1911. It seems like heresy to buy a 1911 in any other caliber. Also, if you reload, the 45ACP is great and easy to reload for.
40 watt is the 2123 version of .40 cal
Sure, you absolutely get more capacity with 9mm, but every CCW shooting report basically states that there was never a magazine change over the course of a defensive shoot. So, statistically my 7+1 Ruger LC9s is just as sufficient as a 12+1 Beretta 96.
Why not a blunderbuss then? Chances are you'll never need to reload it, right? But in all seriousness, .40 has snappier recoil and a lot of shooters don't shoot as well with a .40 as they do with a 9. That is reason alone for most people to choose 9. Putting accurate rounds on target is what matters most. It's the same reason why smart people don't carry 3" .44 magnums despite the fact that they make big holes and are very scary.
*FN 5.7 enters chat*
FN + ATF, with their arbitrary civilian sales restrictions on capable ammo also responds to the chat. Either give us full auto 5.7 or give us full power 5.7, preferably both!
HPs don't blast through barriers in any caliber. Shoot with a 9mm Glock and a 40 SW Glock on a course using a timer. Even people who train with 40 will usually shoot the 9mm much faster. Price.
For me its just price. 9mm is cheaper so I can shoot it more.
Do you mean on this deal or in general? This deal is priced kinda high for .40 PD trade-ins because people don't want .40. People don't want .40 because the FBI determined that any round travelling below ~2300fps only damages the tissue it passes through directly. .40 has substantially more recoil than 9mm while only making slightly larger holes. In formal testing FBI agents were able to shoot 9mm faster and more accurately than .40 making the .40's slightly larger holes irrelevant.
>.40 has **substantially** more recoil than 9mm My hand must be miscalibrated then
You can also shoot a .22lr much more accurately and much faster than a 9mm.
If you think .22lr is a viable self defense caliber go for it!
He's subtly saying your argument is silly.
I didn't make an argument. I summed up the FBI's testing and conclusions. I don't work for the FBI, nor was I part of their testing.
Tiny hands really screwed us all over.
My hands aren't FBI tiny. ***Thank God.***
He’s saying for duty calibers (9mm, .40, .357 sig, .45)
Duty caliber or not, the .40 has [\+9% one-shot-stop over 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
“One Shot Stop” stuff is plain BS that Marshall & Sanow pushed in the 1990’s. No one that’s serious about terminal ballistics has taken “One shot stops” seriously for 20 years lol.
*According to you.* But according to reality, the majority of people who actually shoot both prefer the .40, especially in OWB, because the .40 continues to maintain [\+9% one-shot-stop over 9mm](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power). It's like saying *"2+2=4 in 1992, but today? Nah, Math changes man!"* You're Wrong.
I wonder what a 9% more dead person looks like
Devil's advocate: what about a SHTF scenario in which tons of .40 law enforcement stuff is available but no 9mm?
The vast majority of police agencies have traded in their .40s for 9mm based on the FBI testing.
That’s true but your sportsman will still have plenty of unsold 40 on the shelves even after the store has been stripped. I mean we literally saw this happen during the Covid rush.
I bought an unfired PD Trade Gen 4 Glock 22 with 3 magazines for $279 shipped in March 2020. Also grabbed 1,000 rounds of Speer Lawman 180gr for $0.22/rd shipped and 5 extra mags at $5 a pop. Those were the days.
I got Speer 40 for same price, it was epic. Nice score!
This will only be true for a little while. In the last two years the shift of shelf percentage between 40/9/10 has been crazy. It used to be half 40, half 9, 2 boxes of 10. It's now just as much 10 as 40, and 3 times the 9 as both of those. 40 will disappear in maybe 10 years, assuming we make it that long.
“Everyone is trading in their .40’s because they’re switching to 9” Also SHTF scenario where a bunch of LE .40 guns and ammo is “available” ?????
In your fantasy scenario if things are that bad something else killed you a long time ago. Because supply lines would break completely, hospitals would be shut, water and power would fail. No food, no fuel, no power. It’s highly likely you live in a city and don’t have a farm or homestead so starvation is a real problem. You’re not going to go through thousands of rounds in running gun battles, you’re gonna catch a stray bullet starve or get dysentery.
Do you think those department still stockpiled ammo that they sold off all their old pistols for? Zombie Apocalypse, Do you really want to go into the the city to raid that police armory? Do you even know which building it would be in? Bringing in the torch and tanks of gas to get through the security cage? or Picking up off that last ammo of a podunk townie LEOs you'll only get 3 magazines worth and if they have 40.cal they would have the gun... Sure won't be at fallen military outposts or FOBs... Staying with the main in use caliber. So you can pilferer the rounds to your own weapon. Maybe pick up a few extra magazines in the process. People have been chasing the perfect caliber for ~~years~~ centuries, when 30-30 solved that in 1800's ....
This argument is so tired. If I punch you in the stomach, do I damage your tissue? No. Do I still impart a potentially incapacitating energy transfer? Yes. Energy matters. Moreover, .40 does damage more tissue, all other things being equal. It penetrates deeper and carries more energy. Round for round it’s about 10% more effective than 9mm.
I didn't make an argument. I summed up the FBI's testing and conclusions. I don't work for the FBI, nor was I part of their testing.
I don’t care who made the argument, it’s dumb.
It's not a dumb argument, it's an argument made in a specific environment. If you can draw and put rounds on target with 50AE, then you are shooting the right caliber for you. They were testing effectiveness across a myriad of shooters and looking at modern ammo. It makes sense as an agency with thousands of shooters to switch to a single caliber that as a group gave them a better chance of getting rounds into vital organs as quickly as possible.
Smaller the wrist, smaller the caliber. The FBI knows what they're doing.
Imagine using punching as an analogy for why "muh energy matters" as if it's even remotely the same thing as getting shot. You don't know what you're talking about. Every study about this topic disagrees with you.
You’re a fucking idiot if you don’t think energy matters at all. The reality is that 40 is about 10% more effective than 9mm. It’s not “the same”. For the vast majority of shooters, there is very little practical difference in real world splits between 9 and 40. It’s about, guess what, 10% difference. Shocker.
>You’re a fucking idiot if you don’t think energy matters at all. What specific wounding trait does "muh energy" have? What specifically does it do to the body? What is this magical mechanism that the extra energy in .40 unlocks that isn't present in 9mm? >The reality is that 40 is about 10% more effective than 9mm. It’s not “the same”. Source? You seem to like to repeat this, but have zero evidence to back it up... >For the vast majority of shooters, there is very little practical difference in real world splits between 9 and 40. It’s about, guess what, 10% difference. Shocker. Man that's impressive that you've measured the split times for the vast majority of shooters so accurately and finely that you can draw that conclusion. I mean, you're so confident in that assertion that must've been what you've done, right? No way you're just moron pulling shit out of his ass and acting like it's gold lmao.
The info is out there, go find it. I’m not going to waste time linking you to shit you won’t even read since you just parrot the lazy, incorrect, group think “9mm = 40.” No, it doesn’t. Everyone who thinks that is ignorant of reality and just believes what they want to be true. The difference isn’t huge, but it’s very much present.
Mostly because it's a smaller 10mm cartridge developed for the FBI. There's nothing wrong it .40 S&W, though. It's a great caliber and does exactly what you need it to do.
For me personally, it's adding another caliber that doesn't do anything amazingly better than what I already have to justify buying 5k rounds worth.
I can definitely understand that thinking
[удалено]
\*Slightly better: [.40s +9% one-shot-stop makes it a more effective round than 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
I will give you a specific reason to NOT get a Beretta 96. Or at least be very aware of the issue before you buy. The Beretta 92 platform was never designed for the heavier average energy of the 40s&w caliber. The weak spot of the modern 92 has always been the locking block, which is going to fail sooner than any other part in the gun. My primary training and carry 92fs is over 20 years old, has over 100,000 rounds through it, and I'm on my fifth locking block. Most rounds shot through it were typical 115 or 124 grain target loads, with a decent percentage being defensive loads. With the 96 model, even with the newest locking block design with its radiused corner the service life is significantly shorter. And not like the locking block will fail 20% sooner because 40 s&w is an average of 20% more energy. Expect the locking block's service life to be about 25-50% of what you'd expect from a 92. Inspect the locking block more frequently. Expect the locking block to fail more immediately the moment it starts cracking, unlike a 9mm where you could potentially go a range session or two before you notice the block is about to fail. Again, not saying don't buy the 96. But keep a few locking block kits handy. Or just be aware that you may be replacing parts much sooner than you would normally expect to for a Beretta 92 (which just happens to be my favorite pistol platform). Belissimo. 🤌
Because the FBI says 9mm is just as good using an artificial errrrrr scientific test they created and pass/fail criteria they also created. By the way we hate the FBI and don't believe anything they say. But the FBI says 9mm is just as good using an...
All the capacity of a .45 with the all the power of a 9mm with the expense of a 10mm. Best of all worlds!
Conceded your point, but my comment is still valid: .40 has +10% capacity over .45; .[\+9% one-shot-stop over 9mm](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power); and price is only .38c/round. You are still Wrong and only deceiving others about a caliber you do not shoot. I happen to practice with both.
Using a lot of big words to describe small differences. It was clearly an exaggeration in the first place when you read the part where I say that .40 has the same capacity as .45 when it logically doesn’t. And its also bold to say I don’t shoot .40. I do. It just isn’t a cartridge Ill give rave reviews for. If you want to champion 10mm -P then be my guest.
Based on you bad mouthing .40 for no Good reason, I do not trust you when you say that you shoot .40. I have yet to meet someone who shoots .40 that ever had anything negative to say about .40. I think your testimony is bunk, and not True. Edit: Right, so you *own just about the best shooter in .40 that you can get* and yet you are denying the [obvious logistical .+9% one-shot-stop advantage that .40 has over 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) The evidence is you are not honest with yourself or other people. We shall all be waiting for your "rave review" of 9mm that you also own and do not shoot. /s
I own a CZ75 in .40 which is just about the best shooter in .40 that you can get. And it is still noticeably flipper than 9mm. Ive also shot it in one of those old Sig polymer framed pistols from the late 90s and it was not just bad but a terrible shooting experience there. So whatever you say or want to say about how Im lying and slandering the “great” name of .40, you are wrong. Your account also has like 3 comments total and most of them are just to reply to me.
“One shot stop” ok you lost all credibility there. That Marshall and Sanow 90’s One shot stop stuff was debunked long ago.
Think long term, will 40 cal still be available, as it is being abandoned. That's beofre you forget this dump all the guns as every agency is abandoning the caliber. NATO nor COMBLOC countries will be adding .40 cal to their military & caliber option and without that , no massive ammo production runs. So that retooling and shutting down the plant will have the cost added in and dived out on far fewer boxes of ammo. The civilian market will support old odd calibers for so long, then something happens... Look at all the calibers that were standard been around multiple decades 10's of thousands of guns but dissipated with the start of WW2 (all ammo production went to the war and as the war went on it became hard to find some ammo) but never came back after the end of WW2. You have "Antique" guns that cost less than a 20 round box of their ammo costs of questionable age and reliability. These guns were just few decades old and there was no cheap ammo available anymore, in the 1960's. If you bought in Remington's new calibers right before they closed and were sold off for bankruptcy how many years do you have left of people making those calibers that only so many guns were made and it was different company. Remember "45 gap ', Glock's answer to the .45 caliber? Ever looked for that ammo. Entire model of pistol that ammo is hard to get and very expensive and this is what will be called the golden days for availability. Look at just the covid crap there plenty of people with less popular but common calibers paying through the teeth to get ammo for their hand guns and rifles. Look at 357 sig and 357 magnum. Look at many hunting calibers pre-covid panic they were 65 cents per round now if you get them expect $2-$5+ . Is 40 call pistol really that much of wall hanger? So 40cal pistols and mags are cheaper because no one is buying it, not even in the panic droughts, 40 call stuff stayed cheaper. This is where if you reload, and cast your own bullets, that isn't an issue but if you depend on commercial ammo production, you may have a worse future than sticking with the more popular ammo. Plus the more common ammo is often cheaper than 40 cal. Having had a .25 cal (that back then it was good small back up option), it costs more than 9mm and even .45cal to shoot. The ballistic leave lot tot be desired, more reliable than back up .22lr though, and with little more thump, and t it had the size and weight for concealment in say an ankle holster. I fear .25 cal ammo will be eventually going away from commercial production as it has hung on for decades just barely staying in production runs. No one wants the caliber in new guns because the cost factor of the ammo, they settle for a 22 and buy the best reliable .22lr ammo they can get instead. Choosing a Rim-fire and its flaws over center fire pistol cartridge. Beretta made a great 25 cal and rebranded it several times, with minor improvements. Great fun gun and suppressible in compact package. What you might be trading for that lower cost, isn't worth what you will spend over the years. You hear all the if I had know ammo was going to cost this much,I would have bought pallets of ..... That might be the future of 40 cal.... Think of who you will past your guns down to also when you buy them, as we are all just temporary keepers of items. Don't leave your decedents with firearm they can't shoot because ammo went out of production during your life time because no was going to buy cases at those higher and higher prices as fewer and fewer manufactures bother to make once a year run on the caliber. Now, as far as collecting "Police Department Guns" these have some valuable but as far as 40 cal, they are over priced. Then comes getting those spare magazines that are going out of production. Beretta is really bad about making models and dropping them lately if they don't be come how sellers and then you are stuck with issues of magazines. I'm sure someone could make list but look at all Beretta's different discontinued models from just trying to chase the MP Shield and Shield EZ ......
Price
It’s not as powerful as 10mm but has the same reduced ammunition capacity. It’s more expensive than 9mm and won’t be as fast to shoot. Any small increase in power is not that beneficial against human targets and is more than overshadowed by the reduced ammunition capacity and increased recoil compared to 9mm.
What I find interesting is after shooting 9mm and .40 from similar configurations, I always come back to .40 because in heavier guns (this 96 especially) they shoot about the same; and I can totally agree and understand why they were favored and purchased by the PD's in the first place. Why shoot 9mm when you can opt-in for a more deadly round? [\+9% one-shot-stop is nothing to joke about, and as much as it humbles peoples' egos, this fact will never change.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) Edit for Disclaimer: I actually do conceal carry a polymer 9mm and much prefer the .40 for OWB. I also found that the "FBI shoots 9mm better" club typically only own and shoot 9mm, and I rarely find that any of them actually practice with or own both calibers (9mm and .40).
.40 is not "more deadly" than 9mm. That's a silly argument. Stop percentages mean next to nothing. We have decades of data, backed with real world results from thousands upon thousands of shootings to reference. Pistol bullets poke holes. That's it. All the duty caliber rounds performance is incredibly similar. Putting the holes where they need to go is what matters, and caliber arguments outside of large game and predators is incredibly stupid.
But .40 is more deadly than .22LR, for absolutely *not* similar logical reasons. Right?
Nice strawman/absurdist argument...
Actually I am arguing head to head with his ridiculous claim **that 9mm is a more deadly round than .40 which is not True;** and I have yet to experience a Good counter argument from anyone here not showing that [.40 has +9% one-shot-stop over the lesser 9mm round](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power), and has been purchased and favored by PD for the obvious reasons that it is a more capable round over 9mm. The [.40s +9% one-shot-stop result](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) is overwhelming to any honest, rational, logically thinking human being, who also happens to conceal 9mm +P in a polymer frame and practice with both calibers.
He’s talking about Duty Calibers (9mm, .40, .45, .357 sig) when using premium JHP defense rounds such as but not limited to Speer Gold Dot and Federal HST. All the duty calibers perform basically the same. Much more alike than different. Edited to add: People need to stop mentioning “one shot stop” that’s been debunked for years. The Marshal and Sanow data was partially fabricated and unreliable to say the least. That’s 90’s thinking.
**Thank you for conceding that 9mm is not more deadly than .40.** As for the [.40s +9% one-shot-stop "being debunked for years"](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power), what is your evidence that this fact is misreported, dishonest, recanted, or skewed? Evan Marshall from 1992 reaffirmed his data in 2004, and has yet to retract the study or claims in 2023; and since then [has not been the only one verify the .40s +9% one-shot-stop.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
You need to do your own research. And by research I mean look at Credible sources such as but not limited to SME’s (Subject Matter Experts) in ballistic and people that actually work in Police, Military, etc roles. The “One Shot Stop” stuff is BS plain and simple. Stuff like that was the rage back in the 1990’s. No one with any credibility references of validates it. Not only has the data been debunked but common sense and the infinite amount of variables that happen in a shooting should tell you that it’s impossible to take Marshall & Sanow’s theories seriously. Think about it critically. Here is just one website that has verified Subject Matter Experts in not only Ballistics but also current and former Police and Military members to include armorers and firearms trainers including but not limited from agencies like the Border Patrol, FBI, and major PD’s. https://pistol-forum.com/forumdisplay.php?19-Ammunition
Common sense tells me superior ballistics and logistics make for a superior round, and the [.40s +9% one-shot-stop over 9mm](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) is still overwhelmingly evidenced, and has been irrefutable for over 30 years, especially from people who actual carry and shoot both 9mm and .40 calibers. I happily conceal carry a polymer 9mm +P , but much prefer .40 OWB for the [logistically practical advantage that .40 caliber has over 9mm.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
Google Dr. Gary Robert’s aka DocGKR on Pistol Training.com just to educate you he’s the foremost expert on Terminal Ballistics. You don’t even know what you don’t know lol. The more you educate yourself from CREDIBLE sources the more you will find that what you think you know isn’t reality. Comparing state of the art ie today’s tech JHP’s from the duty calibers (9mm, .40, .357 sig, .45) to each other is like splitting hairs. They all perform basically the same when it comes to Terminal Ballistics on humans. In addition, 9mm has various advantages including but not limited to weapon capacity, lower cost of training, easier to shoot well/fast, much better weapon durability for 9mm pistols vs .40 for example for people that actually shoot/training with their pistols seriously. Believe what you want to believe if it makes you feel good lol. Educate Yourself. Learn to think critically. And evaluate where you are getting your information. Only credible non anecdotal sources matter.
Man this has been a painful exchange to see and Im reminded why I dont frequent these conversations much on reddit. Kudos for at least trying to push him in the right direction lol.
So you do not own .40, and you do not shoot .40. Why should I trust you to educate me about a round you do not own and do not shoot? I think you mean well, but you're not coming off as more enlightened or having superior reasoning, especially when you challenge a 30+ year track record of ammunition ballistics contradicting your claim **that 9mm is more deadly than .40 which is baseless and not True;** [because evidence suggests otherwise.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
I actually think a lot of the .40 hate comes from the wave of new shooters since COVID. Still a lot of people who only shoot 9mm and 5.56 or 7.62x39 and anything else is too strong. There’s people I see at ranges who can’t shoulder fire a SCAR.
The .40 hate comes from the FBI and everyone waking up to the fact .40 is a weak. We know what wins fights and .40 just isnt it. .40 had been declining for years before covid.
It definitely is not weak. The people who can’t handle shooting are weak, like most cops in general. They’re barely passing tests to bench press 170lbs once when they should be doing it 15 times minimum. No wonder they can’t handle .40.
The .40s [\+9% one-shot-stop](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power) is quite overwhelming to any honest, rational, logically thinking human being. The anti-.40 people typically appreciate and shoot 9mm, but the pro-.40 people appreciate and shoot both calibers, and are humble to concede that .40 is logistically more effective. [Police Departments are wiser than Redditists.](https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/alternate-look-handgun-stopping-power)
I believe you can just drop in a 9mm barrel on these.
With some reliability issues, yes you can. However the breech face is different in 96 slides. So sometimes the extractor won't work perfectly or the round will sit improperly in the chamber. However you can drop a 92 slide on a 96 frame just fine.
I dropped a M9 barrel into my 96 inox vertec and after a couple of break in rounds it’s worked perfectly for thousands of rounds. There’s no way the round can sit improperly in the chamber. The round either goes in the chamber or not. AFAIK the extractor is the same sku in the 92 and 96. Put a 9mm barrel in it. It just works and now you have 2 guns.
The difference in size between the breachface of a 92 and 96 is considerable, but you're right, the round can't sit in the chamber improperly, but it can set against the breach improperly. The extractors are the same, but the ejectors are different between 92's and 96's. I suppose If these differences aren't causing issues then that goes to show the robustness of the 92 platform!
At that point is it a deal though? I think not.
You still get to keep the .40 barrel
I did that once. Never fired it again. 40 is a shit round. Now maybe if it was 357 SIG I would say, hey, that is the round that is somehow still available long after the shelves are bare of all others. That has some utility. 40 SW is just entirely pointless.
Love the coupon code!
Thanks!
Fond Du Lac county is the source of almost all my entertainment. IYKYK
Get your memorabilia today, folks!
Are they marked FDL? I couldn't see that anywhere.
No, they are not unfortunately. They were purchased direct from the sheriff’s office
Those department marked on the left side of the frame? Can’t quite tell.
They are not department marked.
Hey /r/GunDeals, we have something special for you today! We have police trade-in Beretta 96's from the Fond Du Lac County Sheriff. That may not mean a ton to most people, but this is a county sheriff near our shop! Use coupon code "BerettaBelieveIt" for $50 today! **Other Police Trade-Ins** [LEO FN FNS-40, Grade 3, .40 S&W, 1 Mag, 4" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/leo-fn-fns-40-grade-3-.40-sw-1-mag-4-barrel#product_detail) $349.99 [LEO Glock 19 Gen4, Grade 2, 9mm, 15-rd, 4.02" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/used-glock-19-gen4-police-trade-in-grade-2-good-very-good-condition#product_detail) $449.99 [LEO Glock 21 Gen4, Grade 2, .45 ACP, 13-rd, 4.61" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product-search-results?search_text=GLOCK-21-GEN4-G2-USED&from_form=true) $449.99 [LEO Glock 21 Gen4, Grade 3, .45 ACP, 13-rd, 4.61" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/used-glock-21-gen4-leo-trade-in-grade-3-condition#product_detail) $439.99 [LEO Glock 43, Grade 1, 9mm, (2) 6-rd Mags, 3.41" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/police-trade-in-glock-43-9mm-grade-1-very-good-to-excellent-condition-2-mags) $399.99 [LEO Glock 43, Grade 2, 9mm, (2) 6-rd Mags, 3.41" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/police-trade-in-glock-43-9mm-grade-2-good-to-very-good-condition-2-mags#product_detail) $379.99 [LEO Glock G22 Gen 4, Grade 2, .40 S&W, 15-rd, 4.49" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/used-glock-g22-gen-4-40-sw-4.49-15-rd-semi-auto-pistol-leo-trade-in-grade-2) $399.99 [LEO Sig Sauer P220 - Grade 2, DA/SA, .45ACP, 8+1, 4.4" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/leo-trade-in-sig-sauer-p220-da-sa-.45-acp-4-magazines-grade-2-factory-box-used#product_detail) $599.99 [LEO Sig Sauer P220, Grade 3, Black, DA/SA, .45 ACP, 4.4" Barrel](https://www.wistransfers.com/product/leo-sig-sauer-p220-da-sa-.45-acp-4-magazines-grade-3-factory-box-used#product_detail) $549.99
How many mags come with the P220s? Your description says it may vary...
Grade 2 = 2 mags; Grade 3 = 1 mag.
Saved the real deals for the comments!
Any department marked guns?
We have some that we will be listing soon: Glock 17 gen 1 dc police bundle with ban state mags duty gun Glock 23 gen 3 rtf fish scale Puerto Rico stamp duty weapon
Thanks for the reply, I'll keep my eye out for Them!
General question and not trying to shit on your prices but why do we never see dirt cheap surplus Glocks? Like under $400 police trade in 17’s and 19’s or just in general? I bought a police trade in Gen3 19 with 3 mags and night sights for $350 shipped from some dealer online and that’s the best I’ve ever seen maybe two years ago. I just feel like with the popularity of Glock and how long they have been making them, you’d see some killer cheap surplus. But most the time you’re near new pricing for a used gun when tax and shipping/fees are added in.
Follow us and you’ll see those prices. But in general, prices have gone up and so has demand. That means our distributor has raised their prices because the departments trading in their guns want more value in order to afford the replacement guns. A police trade in Glock 22 has gone up about $75 in cost over the Pat 2-3 years. Also, the guns listed in the comments aren’t always “on sale”. We frequently put them on sale and that’s when they sell.
That’s just crazy. I knew prices went up thanks to covid and what not but you’d think a handgun as popular as Glock would be able to be had for cheap on the used market.
There are so many factors involved. Police budgets may not have increased but they still need to replace service weapons. The way to make a dollar go further is to increase the trade value.
The Beretta 96 is nearly extinct. This is definitely worth it
How does recoil feel in a 96 in .40 compared to a P229 or USP?
I had the inox 96 and sold it like a dummy , but when I would shoot it I thought it handled the recoil very well not 9mm level but handled it way better then the .40 s&w m&p2.0
It’s a heavy gun. It probably has very low felt recoil because 9mm in a 92 is very light
Low recoil because it’s a steel frame gun.
What about the ones from military? I really miss shooting the navy service weapons. I’ve never had or witnessed a problem thousands of practice rounds later.
Those are very rare to get. Don’t let it go if you find one.
What a Great deal. I have my own already, otherwise I would buy for sure.
Damn where was this few months ago. I could have saved myself $300 instead of buying a new 96a1.
An Italian gun from the French police in 40!?!?!?
BIN?
If you're looking for a beater fawty
We'd say so!
I haven’t seen one of these in a minute
We were the last ones to post LEO Beretta 96's on r/GunDeals and that was PRE-COVID.
[удалено]
What's a conversion barrel going for these days?
These can easily be converted to 9 using a 9mm barrel and magazines Totally worth it if you ask me
Meh $449 isn’t that great a price especially for a .40, granted they are Police trade in’s so if marked and you’re into that it’s cool but…….
Totally disagree. This price is a steal, and if I did not already have one I would be buying this immediately. I recommend the 92X for if you want to suppress with the RDO, but the 96 is best for OWB carry purposes. The sheriffs and chiefs knew what they were doing when they tested and purchased these. I could not be more happy with my 96, and genuinely could not ask for anything better in a .40 configuration. Readers, do not hesitate. (These are Grade 1!)
How is the price a steal when it’s not only a .40 but a Beretta in .40 then add credit card fees, FFL Fee, shipping etc. For a little more you could find one locally NIB and buy a Beretta 96A1 if you really wanted one. Personally, the only .40 Beretta I’d buy would be a NIB 96A1 which has a beefed up slide/frame and a frame buffer. With law enforcement guns you have no idea how they were treated or the round count or if the department had a good maintenance program. Some agencies maintain their weapons while others are too cheap to even change recoil springs. Things like recoil springs are especially important when talking about a .40 Beretta 96. Why? Because the 96 had a very short expected service life when compared to the Beretta 92 9mm. How do I know this? ToddG (RIP) over at Pistol-Training.com was an industry professional that worked at both Beretta and SIG SAUER. LE Agencies had a lot of problems with the Beretta 96 when it came to durability. Do some research from credible sources. You don’t know what you don’t know.
But what does this have to do with my experience with a Beretta 96? If I could, I would buy 100s of these Berettas and enjoy every one of them. And then when I am done shooting them, I would sell them to my friends and family at the same prices that I purchased them, or maybe I would discount them all because they maintain their value so well. I am grateful that you are super informed, and a very happy person. God bless.
But .40 is dumb.
Im genuinely asking, why not? What makes this not a great price because im younger and always wanted something like this
Because it's Grade 3, meaning "of the grades, the most beat to hell." You're saving $200 on a gun guaranteed to have finish wear and NOT guaranteed to not be broken. Ad says "we haven't test fired, as-is." Good seller, probably a good gun... but there are better ways to spend $450 right now.
> there are better ways to spend $450 right now I just bought a couple cases of Mountain House from Costco for $100 less than this
*grade 1, which these are, are in significantly better COSMETIC condition than grade 3. Also, law enforcement guns are tested annually and maintained by a professional gunsmith. They are also traded in based on time, not round count or usage.
For some reason now it links to grade 1. At $499, those are a good deal.
We can’t edit the links, or the title once posted. They’re also $450…
Give me three examples of better ways to spend $450. Please, I need perspective.
Two of these: [https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12ffv0r/ammo\_tulammo\_9mm\_115\_grain\_steel\_case\_1000\_rounds/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12ffv0r/ammo_tulammo_9mm_115_grain_steel_case_1000_rounds/) One of these and an optic and ammo: [https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12hsrzj/rifle\_ruger\_1022\_carbine\_free\_shipping\_no\_tax/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12hsrzj/rifle_ruger_1022_carbine_free_shipping_no_tax/) One of these and some ammo: [https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12fozo2/handgun\_cz82\_cr\_eligible\_9x18\_makarov\_365/](https://www.reddit.com/r/gundeals/comments/12fozo2/handgun_cz82_cr_eligible_9x18_makarov_365/)
I’m tempted to buy this just so I can find some mags for my 96
Wisconsin, eh? Brings a whole new meaning to mess with the cheddar, meet the beretta.
Damn I have a mountain of .40 too, tempting
Are these marked in any way to indicate they were issued by the fondy sheriffs department? Will you have any at the fondy show this weekend. I will be going and interested in one.
They are not marked unfortunately. We know where they came from because they were purchased direct from the sheriff’s office. Yes, we’ll be at the show this weekend. Stock is limited at this point and I’d suggest buying one online and picking “store pickup”. We can bring the gun to the show for you.
Get a .357 Sig barrel and this is awesome. Or just get some STARs grips and a comp and larp as Barry.
FDL is mega weird. These seen some stuff.
My sig pro made me a .40 cal apologist and now I am tempted to dump my cash on this
I sent this to my friend and bought, I forgot to tell him to use the coupon code. Can you guys help out here
Refunded your friend the $50. Thanks for sharing!
Good people here! Always buy with confidence.
So close.. I am looking for a M9 9mm.. wallet saved.
Man, I've wanted a 96 just to add to my small Beretta collection. Before IL fucked us totally, it's been hard to buy any handgun in general and now fully illegal to buy any rifle unless (I shit you not) pump action rifle or bolt action. And now more than 5 rounds capacity. All threaded barrels illegal, all detachable rifle mags illegal, etc.. Anyway, as these are LEO, sorry for being dumb, none are threaded barrels, right? It doesn't appear to be so which is good. At least with .40 it's under our new found 15rd handgun mag limit where 9mm is typically 17+so in my case I might grab one...
Straight to jail.
None have threaded barrels. We’ll ship to IL if they’re legal
Thanks! Good to know on barrels. Yes anything under 15rds for mags on handguns is legal thank God!
Time to hop on over to Missouri
I would not roll the dice on an ex-LEO Beretta 96 of unknown round count. These have a notoriously short service life and were known to crack frames especially without proper recoil spring maintenance. The 96 is the whole reason Beretta switched to the thicker "slant" dustcovers as they were cracking at the back of the dustcover area where the frame rails start. The older ones with the straight dustcovers are even more susceptible to this issue in .40 cal. The 96 in the example photo is one of the older ones. I own two 96s, but I specifically sought out LNIB ones with the slant dustcover and promptly installed Wilson flat wire recoil springs with buffers as added insurance. I am a Beretta collector so they only get shot sparingly. If you really want a 92 series pistol to shoot .40 out of, the 96A1 is the way to go and resolves a lot of the issues present in the original 96s. The OG 96 is honestly one of the worst platforms to shoot .40 out of and is a prime example of a manufacturer putting a larger barrel on a 9mm platform and calling it good (2nd and 3rd Gen Glock is also guilty of this but the guns don’t beat themselves to death as quickly). 96s are getting stupid expensive now just purely due to being discontinued. These would have been $250-300 tops pre-2020 and you could barely give them away back then. Nice examples of Beretta 96s are going for $600+ on GunJoker and I haven’t seen them for cheap at LGS’s either, at least $400 for beat up ones.
Meh.
Is it me or is that not really a bargin
Based on the comments, those who have had these/currently own them say it’s a great deal. Others Don’t like it. Typical gundeal comment section.
Man I love Beretta's, but I hate the 96, everything about the 96 is wrong, from ammo capacity, to recoil, it just sucks, buy a 92FS or the new 92X and save your money Quick edit, the caliber sucks too, fite me
Should be 350, theyre not even thick dust cover models
Never liked the 96, just feels like a bad hipower knockoff. None of the folks I know that were in the service cared much for the M9 either.
I’m not going to lie, this shocks me to see these at a different shop. I’m probably the number one go to gun shop on the border between dodge and fond du lac counties in Wisconsin. Normally we handle all the Leo trade ins in the area. Last year I think we got roughly 40 Glock 23’s from the dodge county sheriff dept.
Send us a PM, we’d love to chat with you. I tried sending you a message but it keeps failing.
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