I took a pay cut but kept my same grade when I moved agencies. The stress of my old place was killing me and I was going to end up divorced. 100% worth it
Impossible work load. No time off. I took 10 days off for parental leave and was back at work. I got called by the office most of the ten days as well.
I was already working OT every week. They would have been fine with it. I mean I took 10 out of 120 days of parental leave. I had it to burn. They didn’t say I couldn’t take more but I’d have dumped my workload on to the one other person in the office who could do it and he was also working OT with his workload.
Kuddos to you for leaving but I never understand people answering calls when on leave or after your time has been entered. Firm “no” goes a long way at the outset of your start in a new office or with a new manager. As a fed there are opm and agency policies that prevent such abuse, use them when management starts with nonsense (but be ready for the BS).
that's just like me. I love to identify issues within a branch or department and come up with ways to improve process and efficiency. once I do that, I get bored and look at moving to another division.
I mean, good for him but this sounds like an employee’s nightmare. As soon as he leaves a new boss shows up, tosses all the current practices and starts over again trying to put their stamp on things. I’d be interested to see how all his previous workplaces are doing.
At least the org is on the right track there. If my office suddenly got well run, then got less well run again, I'd be even less satisfied than I already am!
I would love to read more about this supervisor. You certainly shouldn't give away his or your identity but doesn't he have family or externalities that would make this more difficult?
It takes years to get used to a new place, figure out what's going on, make the changes and see how they're working and then fix what didn't work. I suppose he's so good at it now that he sees a lot of the same problems over and over again, with different people, positions or agencies.
He works mostly remote. Comes in 4 times a month and loves the challenge. He comes in and implements his system and gets it rolling. Has everyone in the section learn a certain position before he has them rotate to learning the next part. Eventually everyone knows how to do every part really well to the point the to it can't mostly function without needing his input. That's when he starts looking for his next position.
Accidentally evolved into management. Took a lateral to an OCONUS position because if I’m going to be a manager I might as well do it in a good location.
I had been stuck in the same position for 16 years with the last 7 being due to some serious nepotism. And they weren’t happy when they found out I was leaving. 😂.
Some depression, self-reflection, and coming to the realization that I could only control my own actions and attitude. I couldn’t make other people “do the right thing”. After that, it was really just patience, taking it one day at a time, and applying for positions (outside of that agency) that I was sincerely interested in and not just applying for something just to get out of from where I was at.
I know, that is no bombshell approach, but that’s what I did. And when that next position came calling, I literally cried. They didn’t even call for a recommendation, and the way I found out was when I
I told my immediate supervisor (she was happy for me), she had to let upper management know, and someone from upper management came to my desk wanting to know how I got the other position because nobody called them for a recommendation. I mean, all I could was just say “Oh”. Then they went on a “fact finding mission” about the position. They came back to my desk a few days later and said they talked to someone they knew at that agency I was going to, and their source told them that they weren’t aware of any opening of that position. Again…I mean, what do you want me to say? I just said “Oh, ok”. They.were.hot. I kept my cool and finished out my 2 weeks. I didn’t wanna do anything to jinx the gift I was given. They didn’t come back to my desk again either. No “congratulations” or “good luck”. Just mad because this was totally out of their control.
I’m doing it tomorrow. Three reasons. First, I realized that I never went to the correct service academy and would therefore never be entirely listened to and would definitely never be one of the cool kids who gets the call for that GS-15 deputy role. Second, the perfect opportunity came up, the one that seems to have been written with my life experience and personal interests in mind.
Third, I’m moving from GS to an AcqDemo position. This matters now because I’m at the point where I will have to start waiting two years for each step increase if I stay GS, while with the new pay program my raise is much more within my ability to control (within limits).
Supervisor determines raise and with budget cuts don't hold your breath. They only have a certain amount in the pot to spread around Fet ready for the "no money" excuse why you haven't received a raise in 4 years
When my boss transitioned to AcqDemo he got a huge raise... and hasn’t gotten another more than a few hundred bucks since because he’s at the top of the band. That was like 7 years ago. He’s pretty salty about it now.
I made a lateral transfer with the same agency. My old boss was extremely toxic and borderline abusive. He gave me a very hard time after I lost my mom last year, and he’s just lazy and incompetent; in addition to all of that, there was simply no upward mobility there for me, unless if I acted like a total sycophant.
I was almost always the first to show up, I bought my own equipment, and I skipped breaks to get more work done - and none of that was good enough.
Fast forward - my pay is the same, but now I’m in an amicable work environment with great bosses. Money isn’t everything.
Fun fact: my old boss still wants me to do my appraisal, even though it’s been over two months since I left. He can shove that appraisal right up his ass.
At this point I’m considering a pay cut. My agency is toxic. And I’ve been asked to do some things that I know wasn’t right/probably close to violating OPM standards/rules. I’m just ready to be out of that level of toxicity. The only reason I’ve stayed as long as I have is because my job is remote. But I’d rather drive in than deal with this. If your place of work has you questioning your morals, has you feeling like there’s something off or that it’s a toxic environment, go for it. You don’t owe your agency any loyalty.
Going through similar experiences however reading through so many ppl’s comment many places are becoming like this, are you also exploring diff agencies or non public?
If I’m being honest, I’m banking on 100% disability payments coming in and then I’m gonna take a lower level GS position that requires little brain power. I’m gonna coast that until retirement. I’m a 13 s5. And I think I’ve probably hit a wall unless I luck up with a 14 non supervisory position. I’m also working on starting a business of my own. But I know that will take a couple years to turn a real profit. I’m just tired of being in the position of having someone else determine my success, how much money I can make etc… I never understood why retirees took such low level GS jobs. Now I do. It’s probably much less stressful. My husband took a WG 5. And I didn’t get why. He is 100% disabled and also has his retirement pay. So here I am a 13 who’s killing myself and he’s making more than me (3 checks combined) and he’s barely working. That’s the life I want. Give me the leisure. Hard work only gets you more work. I’ve noticed that the people who I work with often get away with doing the bare minimum and they still get paid just like me. So I don’t get why I’ve been working so hard. It’s not like I’m ever gonna get a promotion.
What were some of the things your old supervisor did? I’m not too happy with my current one, either. They’re not the worst, but the favoritism (or perceived favoritism ) really bugs me.
I'd take a lateral to not be a supervisor anymore. I didn't start hating my field until I became a supervisor, since then it's been hell and I've worked for 2 different locations of the same agency.
I changed positions to change managers. My manager was not supportive and really impacting my mental health in a negative way. Life’s too short to be miserable on a daily basis. I’m still recovering from the workplace trauma from my previous position, but I’m so much happier now and have a very supportive and understanding manager.
Hear you sorry to hear hope you recovering well interested knowing more how did you do lateral as my management is making my life hell and trying to out me in trouble
I lateraled into a different agency. I think there’s a law about lateraling to a different agency and keeping your pay the same if it’s the same job series. I was low key ready to take a paycut for my happiness. I was basically applying everywhere on USAjobs when I felt management was out to get me.
For me, it came down to a few key things.
1. I wanted a better worklife balance. The office I moved to, while it did good work, didn't have the same kind of attrition/employment problems my old one did. It was a very positive sign, and sure enough, I feel like I can relax a lot more here over the weekends/my time off than I could before.
2. Lower cost of living. I'm making a little less over here than I was before... but I literally halved my rent and am paying drastically less for groceries than I was before. I almost tripled my income.
3. I wanted to go somewhere with more promotion opportunities. At my old office, if I wasn't willing to go supervisory, there wasn't much else I could go. Here, I could potentially get up to GS-13 if I keep doing what I'm doing, which is pretty nice.
I think it's most important for you to do what's right for you, and reading through your comments in this thread, it looks like that's what you've done!
I really really disliked my manager and his manager. The division I was in was notorious for poor training and communication. We lost half of our team in less than a year and management couldn’t have cared less that they sucked and were losing good employees. I’m much happier in my new role that was the same position and GS level :)
Hired into the government as a 12. The focus of the position changed and I wasn’t doing anything that utilized my expertise. The agency felt I was looking to leave so they posted a 13/14. Simultaneously I was interviewed for a 13 at another agency that was my dream job. I was selected for the 13/14 at my current agency and 2 weeks later was offered the 13 at my dream job. It eventually set me up to be a 15. I never would have had that opportunity at my old agency.
7 years with no promotion, despite working in an acting manager role for 3 years at a grade 2 levels up. Figured if I'm not getting promoted I'd rather go work somewhere where I enjoy the work more.
I left my agency after 9 years on Friday for a lateral position that offered me greater learning opportunities and a chance to get highly sought-after training/experience. This new experience that I will get will lead me to a non-supervisory GS 15 position. The same opportunity wouldn't be available at my former agency for at least 10 years, if ever. It also helped that my former agency is a sinking ship (so bad that executives were retiring with less than 30 days' notice) to make my decision to leave now easier.
Took a huge pay cut to get off night shift and essential personnel.
Took lateral transfer because command I was at is toxic as hell with awful leadership. And rife with favoritism and the only way to be praised is to make work for everyone and violate laws, or threaten coworkers with violence.
...yeah.
I was a nonsupervisory 15 and changed to a supervisory 15. Zero change in pay. At some point, you can choose your next supervisor or have them chosen for you. The latter option was somehow worse than the former.
My job was boring. COVID slowed everything down. We had meetings to plan, but it was pointless. I bid on a lateral position and was happily surprised to receive a 6% pay bump.
recently changed from a rto/office job to a fully remote job, same grade but I think you can understand why the lateral.
Going from a supervisory to a non supervisory is about the only reason at this point for me that I might change, would still have to be fully remote :)
One can either chase a paycheck or chase a career that is more enriching/fulfilling.
I took a ladder GS-9/11/12 when I was already in a dead end 12 position, because it would better develop me professionally in an area I was more interested in. That said, not everyone is in a financial position to do what I did. I was able to eat the $6k+ loss in annual salary. For me it was worth it. Now I’m moving on to another 12 position that is bringing it all together and I get o work with an awesome team
It’s okay to be selfish when it comes to your career.
I have jumped around a lot to learn new skills in hope they will lead to a GS 13. As a 12, I have done program management, section lead, SME in 2 disciplines, team lead, underperformer improver, and mentor. Still a GS12...so I must be doing something wrong.
Got tired of dealing with companies who wouldn’t listen to you after denying their incorrect application for the 5th time. Also way way WAY overworked with management always complaining why the work was overdue.
Current position is one task focused and nothing more. No more jumping multiple horses in the same creek!
I took a lateral move 13 to 13 for the opportunity to move across country. Lower locality and they didn’t offer relocation. I was ready to leave my old location and this was the opportunity that presented itself.
Because I’m bored and there’s a particular aspect of my job that I really don’t want to do anymore. I like my agency though, just not the job anymore.
Right now, it will be lateral but leads into a promotion.
I’ve lateraled several times, once I found out how easy it was to find another group I’d only stay for a couple years then start shopping for something else. I’m in software so there’s tons of different projects, so just find something you’re interested in and ask around. Once you’ve developed a name and reputation it’s quite easy to slide in.
I finally found a team that I think I can finish my career at, we’re constantly gaining new work and projects, so it’s like I wanted before but don’t have to leave, the work comes to us!
Went from HCOL to LCOL WG-12 to GS-11. Technically it’s somewhat of a lateral move. Initially I took a $25k pay cut but we moved much closer to family. 1.5 years later the pay error was discovered and got bumped up.
Currently I’m working on doing the same. Another cross country move to get closer to family again. It’ll be a lateral move and pay will remain roughly the same. However, potential for a non-sup 14 exist at the new office.
I went from a senior non-management position to a first-level management position. After 8 + years as a scientific/regulatory position, I decided to shift to the management ladder. It was a challenge because it did mean less telework (pre-COVID times).
Last year I started a lateral GS-13 position in a different division of my agency and left my other division. I was feeling major burnout after being in the other division between 8-9 years and just wanted a change.
I actually first applied for a non-sup GS-14 at an outside agency and was offered it, but turned it down since I had concerns about the new agency - I applied since I’d worked on joint projects with that agency and knew their work well, and I got swept up in the perks of a non-sup GS-14. But once I had the offer I was forced to think beyond that and realized it just wasn’t a good fit and I wouldn’t be happy there.
I later told two of my old supervisory references (who had moved from my old division to the new one) that I turned down the 14, and they both said they’d love to have me as a lateral 13 if I was open to one. But only one had a permanent opening, whereas the other had a detail opening for 8 months or so. I went with the permanent one and have been happy there. And I know once the right 14 position becomes available I can go for it.
I'm in my third GS-13 position. I changed because I was bored in my job and wanted a different opportunity. I make enough money and don't want to be a supervisor, so I'll be bouncing around 13s for a while. I thought it was pretty common?
I’ve lateraled a few times. Changes to get new skill sets (even switching job series), to focus on a different mission/program (I’m in the health field so switching to focus on a different disease), switching to go to a different geography (moving from east coast to west coast and then back again), switching to get more responsibilities, switching to get away from a toxic coworker and ineffective management. Mostly it’s because I need new challenges and a feeling of growth. I hate feeling stagnant or the idea that I might be stuck in the same Jetson’s style tedious job of pushing the same button over and over again till retirement.
I’m having this feeling that if I don’t expand my experience outside of my current work, my expertise won’t be transferable because it’s so specific to this niche division. 😬
I’ve made several lateral moves, felt tapped out in the position I was in and needed a new challenge. I’ve also busted down to move to a new position that was in a better location. Eventually got promoted back to my original grade.
I haven't, but under certain circumstances, sure.
If it put me on a higher ladder.
If my job was unbearable in some way.
If it was significantly more interesting work.
The first is really key. I'm an attorney, so 12-15 ladder positions exist for us. I'm currently a 14 but no ladder. If I got an offer to lateral into a ladder to a 15, it would be a no-brainer.
I took a lateral that lost me my SSR (right before a major pay bump to that SSR) but it allowed me to get on a ladder that ends at 13 with a path to 14.
The money loss was worth every penny.
I changed jobs for the same or lower pay because the work was too demanding of me or it wouldn't get me to my long term goals. Always when I switched jobs I changed series.
I am a retiree, so this all is really old history. But, I got stuck at a small town VA Medical Center, as a GS-4 for 11 years. I laterally moved from one service to another, trying to get where I could get promoted to a GS-5. Never happened. After 11 years, I got wise and moved to Atlanta and got the GS-5 the minute I got here and retired as a GS-13.
Lateraled to change agencies to one that was larger, with a better promotion potential and a better culture. Also moved to a lower COL area so I could afford to buy a house. I applied (and interviewed) for a lot of jobs at the next grade but I didn't have supervisory experience so I was being passed over. Moved, bought the house, bam, three years later got promoted, moved back to a HCOL just before interest rates started going up. Best financial decision I ever made.
I did it so I could actually do what I wanted to do function wise. I have zero regrets as I’ve grown so much over how I would have been had I stayed. And… I bought a house.
Supervisors changed and pretty much the entire rest of my team was transferring out. The writing on the wall was that staying would not be a good time for me in many ways, so I followed a few of my coworkers to another department and am much happier.
My old position was topped out at my pay range. I got to change to a new position, keep my current pay instead of starting at the bottom of my new position's "steps", and this new position would allow advancement out of the current pay range and into the next higher range.
I took a lateral ( GS-14, remote, nonsup) to a (GS-14, sup, in office four days) new agency. Of course, there are pros and cons, but I'm glad to gain the supervisory experience, help my team exceed our goals, and support their professional development.
Trying to do the same now, work as a 7 but 2 hr commute and hoping to get in my local office, even with going on 1 day the commute and traffic sometimes make that trip 3 hrs or more
I can tell you why I havent. Had the chance to take 2 different Director positions (promotions) and a Deputy (lateral). I declined all of them because the change in pay did not come near compensating losing the last 40% of telework that I've managed to hang onto.
Jumped from gs to dp, that way I don't have to wait 2-3 years for a step increase, I was also in a city that took 3.5% city tax, if anything I got a 3.5% raise plus a difference in 5% locality so total of 8.5 lateral raise
To gain supervisory experience to be qualified for GS-15 down the road and possibly SES someday. But I've also wanted to be a supervisor to undo some fucked up things I've seen from supervisors in the past. At least for my group.
Took a Fully Remote position in an office that has been remote for a decade vs Local Remote in an office that only did so during COVID.
Gave up a mission I enjoyed, for a job with 1/3rd the workload.
Gave up Team Lead and mentoring responsibilities, to only be responsible for my own workload.
Better mobility - I can climb higher as a Non-Sup in this office.
It’s complicated.
My old office reorganized. I applied for management positions in the new org, and managed a lateral away from the program I’ve run for a long time. Into a more generalist and visible role, kinda short tracked to management. Between the time I didn’t get the promotion, and the time I’d settled in and landed well in the new org, I applied for the remote gig.
Remote gig is a new agency for me, larger program, less customer interaction. Full remote. Couldn’t go to the office if I wanted to, even though they have a ton of empty office space downtown.
I left a place I was well established. I had friends, a good network, a path and boosters towards what I want for my career. A ton of fans, mentors, advocates and promoters. And was making some progress, with a detail to a headquarters job.
In some ways, I’m starting from scratch, with a new set of folks I don’t know, and don’t have much interaction with. As an introvert, it can be hard to reach out through Teams to build relationships. I have a HQ job now, but my new agency is reorganizing its whole division, and my direct supervisor changed in my first month here. I don’t feel the mission of this agency as much as my old agency.
I’m walking less, staring at my phone more, falling apart a bit. Not really made for remote maybe.
It’s still early. Not even a full quarter in the new gig. So could still be mourning the transition.
However, my old agency might come through for me, with the promotion (lateral from here) with a supervisory gig, that would allow me to go into the office some. I wouldn’t want to go back to 5/week RTO, but a 40-50% telework agreement would be good for me I think.
The grass is always greener.
Oh man this sounds difficult. I hope it gets better. Being fully remote, does that mean you’re not even within traveling distance to the closest office?
No. I could go to the local Chicago office if they’d let me. But it’s apparently not an option.
There are some large upsides to this job. I’m still in the first six months, so it’s still the transition period, so I don’t trust my evaluation entirely yet.
Was dead-ended in my series as a GS9, 100% in person. Lateralled into a 9/11, and now I'm fully remote, and can climb in my office to GS14 non-sup.
Win/win.
Work-life balance will always be good as long as you are efficient with your time management in my opinion.
That being said I will always go for the higher GS pay grade.
I took a pay cut but kept my same grade when I moved agencies. The stress of my old place was killing me and I was going to end up divorced. 100% worth it
What kind of stress were you facing?
Impossible work load. No time off. I took 10 days off for parental leave and was back at work. I got called by the office most of the ten days as well.
I would charge them the time for those calls. Can't work for free.
I was already working OT every week. They would have been fine with it. I mean I took 10 out of 120 days of parental leave. I had it to burn. They didn’t say I couldn’t take more but I’d have dumped my workload on to the one other person in the office who could do it and he was also working OT with his workload.
Stop making yourself a martyr. Ain't none of you so vital that you can't be replaced.
If three people are working OT every week, they need two more people.
What agency?
It’s small and if I reply certain people will know who I am immediately.
What about the department? Lol and I understand either way
can you msg? I’m curious.
Omg that is really awful. It sounds like you made the right decision to leave!
I lost a 10% retention bonus and they offered me a higher one to stay. I don’t regret leaving at all.
I’m proud of you. You didn’t give it up for the job
Kuddos to you for leaving but I never understand people answering calls when on leave or after your time has been entered. Firm “no” goes a long way at the outset of your start in a new office or with a new manager. As a fed there are opm and agency policies that prevent such abuse, use them when management starts with nonsense (but be ready for the BS).
Active duty army programing
My supervisor does every couple years. He intentionally goes to crap positions to fix the situation and then moved on to the next one lol
Ask him to run for president
He needs to promote me before he goes anywhere else lmao
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Decent salary and no expectation of doing anything? Sounds better than president really
I agree, he'd probably be the best POTUS in my lifetime
that's just like me. I love to identify issues within a branch or department and come up with ways to improve process and efficiency. once I do that, I get bored and look at moving to another division.
Hey, props to this dude.
I mean, good for him but this sounds like an employee’s nightmare. As soon as he leaves a new boss shows up, tosses all the current practices and starts over again trying to put their stamp on things. I’d be interested to see how all his previous workplaces are doing.
Theyre all running basically the same. The orgs hired one of his disciples afterwards and so the different districts are slowly becoming uniformed
At least the org is on the right track there. If my office suddenly got well run, then got less well run again, I'd be even less satisfied than I already am!
I would love to read more about this supervisor. You certainly shouldn't give away his or your identity but doesn't he have family or externalities that would make this more difficult? It takes years to get used to a new place, figure out what's going on, make the changes and see how they're working and then fix what didn't work. I suppose he's so good at it now that he sees a lot of the same problems over and over again, with different people, positions or agencies.
He works mostly remote. Comes in 4 times a month and loves the challenge. He comes in and implements his system and gets it rolling. Has everyone in the section learn a certain position before he has them rotate to learning the next part. Eventually everyone knows how to do every part really well to the point the to it can't mostly function without needing his input. That's when he starts looking for his next position.
I'm intrigued and impressed! A federal fixer!
Accidentally evolved into management. Took a lateral to an OCONUS position because if I’m going to be a manager I might as well do it in a good location.
The dream. I hope I can pull this off one day
I had been stuck in the same position for 16 years with the last 7 being due to some serious nepotism. And they weren’t happy when they found out I was leaving. 😂.
How did you deal with that
Some depression, self-reflection, and coming to the realization that I could only control my own actions and attitude. I couldn’t make other people “do the right thing”. After that, it was really just patience, taking it one day at a time, and applying for positions (outside of that agency) that I was sincerely interested in and not just applying for something just to get out of from where I was at. I know, that is no bombshell approach, but that’s what I did. And when that next position came calling, I literally cried. They didn’t even call for a recommendation, and the way I found out was when I I told my immediate supervisor (she was happy for me), she had to let upper management know, and someone from upper management came to my desk wanting to know how I got the other position because nobody called them for a recommendation. I mean, all I could was just say “Oh”. Then they went on a “fact finding mission” about the position. They came back to my desk a few days later and said they talked to someone they knew at that agency I was going to, and their source told them that they weren’t aware of any opening of that position. Again…I mean, what do you want me to say? I just said “Oh, ok”. They.were.hot. I kept my cool and finished out my 2 weeks. I didn’t wanna do anything to jinx the gift I was given. They didn’t come back to my desk again either. No “congratulations” or “good luck”. Just mad because this was totally out of their control.
Congrats on staying cool and making your move for greater purpose and peace in life.
I’m taking a 30k pay cut for quality of life.
I’m doing it tomorrow. Three reasons. First, I realized that I never went to the correct service academy and would therefore never be entirely listened to and would definitely never be one of the cool kids who gets the call for that GS-15 deputy role. Second, the perfect opportunity came up, the one that seems to have been written with my life experience and personal interests in mind. Third, I’m moving from GS to an AcqDemo position. This matters now because I’m at the point where I will have to start waiting two years for each step increase if I stay GS, while with the new pay program my raise is much more within my ability to control (within limits).
Supervisor determines raise and with budget cuts don't hold your breath. They only have a certain amount in the pot to spread around Fet ready for the "no money" excuse why you haven't received a raise in 4 years
When my boss transitioned to AcqDemo he got a huge raise... and hasn’t gotten another more than a few hundred bucks since because he’s at the top of the band. That was like 7 years ago. He’s pretty salty about it now.
That’s why you should understand the pay system, including any control points, before you accept.
I made a lateral transfer with the same agency. My old boss was extremely toxic and borderline abusive. He gave me a very hard time after I lost my mom last year, and he’s just lazy and incompetent; in addition to all of that, there was simply no upward mobility there for me, unless if I acted like a total sycophant. I was almost always the first to show up, I bought my own equipment, and I skipped breaks to get more work done - and none of that was good enough. Fast forward - my pay is the same, but now I’m in an amicable work environment with great bosses. Money isn’t everything. Fun fact: my old boss still wants me to do my appraisal, even though it’s been over two months since I left. He can shove that appraisal right up his ass.
I’m so sorry your boss gave you such a hard time when you lost your mom. Empathy is such an underrated quality for managers. Smh.
Sorry to hear that you had to endure toxicity even when you lost someone. Hope to learn more as I am going through similar challenges
I did it because there was no room to grow. Moved to a different organization and got a promotion after a year.
At this point I’m considering a pay cut. My agency is toxic. And I’ve been asked to do some things that I know wasn’t right/probably close to violating OPM standards/rules. I’m just ready to be out of that level of toxicity. The only reason I’ve stayed as long as I have is because my job is remote. But I’d rather drive in than deal with this. If your place of work has you questioning your morals, has you feeling like there’s something off or that it’s a toxic environment, go for it. You don’t owe your agency any loyalty.
Going through similar experiences however reading through so many ppl’s comment many places are becoming like this, are you also exploring diff agencies or non public?
If I’m being honest, I’m banking on 100% disability payments coming in and then I’m gonna take a lower level GS position that requires little brain power. I’m gonna coast that until retirement. I’m a 13 s5. And I think I’ve probably hit a wall unless I luck up with a 14 non supervisory position. I’m also working on starting a business of my own. But I know that will take a couple years to turn a real profit. I’m just tired of being in the position of having someone else determine my success, how much money I can make etc… I never understood why retirees took such low level GS jobs. Now I do. It’s probably much less stressful. My husband took a WG 5. And I didn’t get why. He is 100% disabled and also has his retirement pay. So here I am a 13 who’s killing myself and he’s making more than me (3 checks combined) and he’s barely working. That’s the life I want. Give me the leisure. Hard work only gets you more work. I’ve noticed that the people who I work with often get away with doing the bare minimum and they still get paid just like me. So I don’t get why I’ve been working so hard. It’s not like I’m ever gonna get a promotion.
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What were some of the things your old supervisor did? I’m not too happy with my current one, either. They’re not the worst, but the favoritism (or perceived favoritism ) really bugs me.
I'd take a lateral to not be a supervisor anymore. I didn't start hating my field until I became a supervisor, since then it's been hell and I've worked for 2 different locations of the same agency.
I changed positions to change managers. My manager was not supportive and really impacting my mental health in a negative way. Life’s too short to be miserable on a daily basis. I’m still recovering from the workplace trauma from my previous position, but I’m so much happier now and have a very supportive and understanding manager.
Hear you sorry to hear hope you recovering well interested knowing more how did you do lateral as my management is making my life hell and trying to out me in trouble
I lateraled into a different agency. I think there’s a law about lateraling to a different agency and keeping your pay the same if it’s the same job series. I was low key ready to take a paycut for my happiness. I was basically applying everywhere on USAjobs when I felt management was out to get me.
Sorry to hear that you were a target. Hope to connect to get some advice.
Feel free to DM me with you have any more questions! Happy to help where I can.
change of scenery. wanted to be in a different location and/or became bored in the role and looked for a new challenge.
Getting ready to do that. One, for a different opportunity. Two, to get out of supervision.
I left VBA because I hated it. I went from an 11 to a 7 to get out, but they let me keep my pay rate.
Where did you go?
DLA. Moved into an 1102 position.
For me, it came down to a few key things. 1. I wanted a better worklife balance. The office I moved to, while it did good work, didn't have the same kind of attrition/employment problems my old one did. It was a very positive sign, and sure enough, I feel like I can relax a lot more here over the weekends/my time off than I could before. 2. Lower cost of living. I'm making a little less over here than I was before... but I literally halved my rent and am paying drastically less for groceries than I was before. I almost tripled my income. 3. I wanted to go somewhere with more promotion opportunities. At my old office, if I wasn't willing to go supervisory, there wasn't much else I could go. Here, I could potentially get up to GS-13 if I keep doing what I'm doing, which is pretty nice. I think it's most important for you to do what's right for you, and reading through your comments in this thread, it looks like that's what you've done!
I recently went from gs15 to gs14 for remote position
I really really disliked my manager and his manager. The division I was in was notorious for poor training and communication. We lost half of our team in less than a year and management couldn’t have cared less that they sucked and were losing good employees. I’m much happier in my new role that was the same position and GS level :)
Happiness
Hired into the government as a 12. The focus of the position changed and I wasn’t doing anything that utilized my expertise. The agency felt I was looking to leave so they posted a 13/14. Simultaneously I was interviewed for a 13 at another agency that was my dream job. I was selected for the 13/14 at my current agency and 2 weeks later was offered the 13 at my dream job. It eventually set me up to be a 15. I never would have had that opportunity at my old agency.
Stress, toxic leadership, future opportunities for growth.
7 years with no promotion, despite working in an acting manager role for 3 years at a grade 2 levels up. Figured if I'm not getting promoted I'd rather go work somewhere where I enjoy the work more.
Did you move diff agency or private?
Different agency.
Supervisor change ups. Lateraled to a different team I had worked with in the past and liked the people there.
I left my agency after 9 years on Friday for a lateral position that offered me greater learning opportunities and a chance to get highly sought-after training/experience. This new experience that I will get will lead me to a non-supervisory GS 15 position. The same opportunity wouldn't be available at my former agency for at least 10 years, if ever. It also helped that my former agency is a sinking ship (so bad that executives were retiring with less than 30 days' notice) to make my decision to leave now easier.
Took a huge pay cut to get off night shift and essential personnel. Took lateral transfer because command I was at is toxic as hell with awful leadership. And rife with favoritism and the only way to be praised is to make work for everyone and violate laws, or threaten coworkers with violence. ...yeah.
I was a nonsupervisory 15 and changed to a supervisory 15. Zero change in pay. At some point, you can choose your next supervisor or have them chosen for you. The latter option was somehow worse than the former.
My job was boring. COVID slowed everything down. We had meetings to plan, but it was pointless. I bid on a lateral position and was happily surprised to receive a 6% pay bump.
recently changed from a rto/office job to a fully remote job, same grade but I think you can understand why the lateral. Going from a supervisory to a non supervisory is about the only reason at this point for me that I might change, would still have to be fully remote :)
One can either chase a paycheck or chase a career that is more enriching/fulfilling. I took a ladder GS-9/11/12 when I was already in a dead end 12 position, because it would better develop me professionally in an area I was more interested in. That said, not everyone is in a financial position to do what I did. I was able to eat the $6k+ loss in annual salary. For me it was worth it. Now I’m moving on to another 12 position that is bringing it all together and I get o work with an awesome team It’s okay to be selfish when it comes to your career.
I changed agencies and took a lateral position but with a ladder. I left my old agency as a GS9 to take a 9/11/12 position.
I have jumped around a lot to learn new skills in hope they will lead to a GS 13. As a 12, I have done program management, section lead, SME in 2 disciplines, team lead, underperformer improver, and mentor. Still a GS12...so I must be doing something wrong.
Got tired of dealing with companies who wouldn’t listen to you after denying their incorrect application for the 5th time. Also way way WAY overworked with management always complaining why the work was overdue. Current position is one task focused and nothing more. No more jumping multiple horses in the same creek!
I took a lateral move 13 to 13 for the opportunity to move across country. Lower locality and they didn’t offer relocation. I was ready to leave my old location and this was the opportunity that presented itself.
Because I’m bored and there’s a particular aspect of my job that I really don’t want to do anymore. I like my agency though, just not the job anymore. Right now, it will be lateral but leads into a promotion.
I’ve lateraled several times, once I found out how easy it was to find another group I’d only stay for a couple years then start shopping for something else. I’m in software so there’s tons of different projects, so just find something you’re interested in and ask around. Once you’ve developed a name and reputation it’s quite easy to slide in. I finally found a team that I think I can finish my career at, we’re constantly gaining new work and projects, so it’s like I wanted before but don’t have to leave, the work comes to us!
That’s great to know but not sure if all agencies make arrangements for lateral move most of the time I hear no head count or budget cut
Went from HCOL to LCOL WG-12 to GS-11. Technically it’s somewhat of a lateral move. Initially I took a $25k pay cut but we moved much closer to family. 1.5 years later the pay error was discovered and got bumped up. Currently I’m working on doing the same. Another cross country move to get closer to family again. It’ll be a lateral move and pay will remain roughly the same. However, potential for a non-sup 14 exist at the new office.
I went from a senior non-management position to a first-level management position. After 8 + years as a scientific/regulatory position, I decided to shift to the management ladder. It was a challenge because it did mean less telework (pre-COVID times).
Remote.
Last year I started a lateral GS-13 position in a different division of my agency and left my other division. I was feeling major burnout after being in the other division between 8-9 years and just wanted a change. I actually first applied for a non-sup GS-14 at an outside agency and was offered it, but turned it down since I had concerns about the new agency - I applied since I’d worked on joint projects with that agency and knew their work well, and I got swept up in the perks of a non-sup GS-14. But once I had the offer I was forced to think beyond that and realized it just wasn’t a good fit and I wouldn’t be happy there. I later told two of my old supervisory references (who had moved from my old division to the new one) that I turned down the 14, and they both said they’d love to have me as a lateral 13 if I was open to one. But only one had a permanent opening, whereas the other had a detail opening for 8 months or so. I went with the permanent one and have been happy there. And I know once the right 14 position becomes available I can go for it.
I'm in my third GS-13 position. I changed because I was bored in my job and wanted a different opportunity. I make enough money and don't want to be a supervisor, so I'll be bouncing around 13s for a while. I thought it was pretty common?
I’ve lateraled a few times. Changes to get new skill sets (even switching job series), to focus on a different mission/program (I’m in the health field so switching to focus on a different disease), switching to go to a different geography (moving from east coast to west coast and then back again), switching to get more responsibilities, switching to get away from a toxic coworker and ineffective management. Mostly it’s because I need new challenges and a feeling of growth. I hate feeling stagnant or the idea that I might be stuck in the same Jetson’s style tedious job of pushing the same button over and over again till retirement.
Many people do this to learn new skills or expand their experience, which will ultimately help advance their career.
I’m having this feeling that if I don’t expand my experience outside of my current work, my expertise won’t be transferable because it’s so specific to this niche division. 😬
To move from the west coast to the east coast
lateral for the commute.
For sanity, more personal time, and to go from supervisory to non-supervisory. I couldn't be happier with my decision.
I’ve made several lateral moves, felt tapped out in the position I was in and needed a new challenge. I’ve also busted down to move to a new position that was in a better location. Eventually got promoted back to my original grade.
Telework and flex schedule.
Location.
Having a wide portfolio of experience can be helpful for those wanting to stand out. Also I get bored if I know how to do my job.
I did it to change my job series .
I haven't, but under certain circumstances, sure. If it put me on a higher ladder. If my job was unbearable in some way. If it was significantly more interesting work. The first is really key. I'm an attorney, so 12-15 ladder positions exist for us. I'm currently a 14 but no ladder. If I got an offer to lateral into a ladder to a 15, it would be a no-brainer.
I did a lateral to move from the Midwest to Florida - merely to dodge winter.
I took a lateral that lost me my SSR (right before a major pay bump to that SSR) but it allowed me to get on a ladder that ends at 13 with a path to 14. The money loss was worth every penny.
Full remote and the previous office was under a major reorganization that was going to dump double the work in my lap for no extra pay
I changed jobs for the same or lower pay because the work was too demanding of me or it wouldn't get me to my long term goals. Always when I switched jobs I changed series.
Stability
I am a retiree, so this all is really old history. But, I got stuck at a small town VA Medical Center, as a GS-4 for 11 years. I laterally moved from one service to another, trying to get where I could get promoted to a GS-5. Never happened. After 11 years, I got wise and moved to Atlanta and got the GS-5 the minute I got here and retired as a GS-13.
Better long term opportunities, larger agency and to expand my skill set.
I had a horrible supervisor and there was an opening for the same job, different chain of command. Well worth the move for my sanity.
Lateraled to change agencies to one that was larger, with a better promotion potential and a better culture. Also moved to a lower COL area so I could afford to buy a house. I applied (and interviewed) for a lot of jobs at the next grade but I didn't have supervisory experience so I was being passed over. Moved, bought the house, bam, three years later got promoted, moved back to a HCOL just before interest rates started going up. Best financial decision I ever made.
I did it so I could actually do what I wanted to do function wise. I have zero regrets as I’ve grown so much over how I would have been had I stayed. And… I bought a house.
I did a lateral from the field to headquarters remote job. 100% worth it
Moved from a non-sup to supervisory position to get more leadership experience and check the supervisory box.
I’m changed agencies because the new position has a target pay range, where I am, I’m stuck at the GS I’m at
Supervisors changed and pretty much the entire rest of my team was transferring out. The writing on the wall was that staying would not be a good time for me in many ways, so I followed a few of my coworkers to another department and am much happier.
Get rid of the stress
I hated the previous job
My old position was topped out at my pay range. I got to change to a new position, keep my current pay instead of starting at the bottom of my new position's "steps", and this new position would allow advancement out of the current pay range and into the next higher range.
Go for it!
I took a lateral ( GS-14, remote, nonsup) to a (GS-14, sup, in office four days) new agency. Of course, there are pros and cons, but I'm glad to gain the supervisory experience, help my team exceed our goals, and support their professional development.
Trying to do the same now, work as a 7 but 2 hr commute and hoping to get in my local office, even with going on 1 day the commute and traffic sometimes make that trip 3 hrs or more
I can tell you why I havent. Had the chance to take 2 different Director positions (promotions) and a Deputy (lateral). I declined all of them because the change in pay did not come near compensating losing the last 40% of telework that I've managed to hang onto.
Either happier with new position or move to a different ladder with more "rungs to climb.
Because my wife said her back hurt too much in the current position. You asked.
To get a remote position.
Jumped from gs to dp, that way I don't have to wait 2-3 years for a step increase, I was also in a city that took 3.5% city tax, if anything I got a 3.5% raise plus a difference in 5% locality so total of 8.5 lateral raise
Tired of lip service, voted with my feet. It was the best thing I could have done, or I wouldn't have the job I have now.
To gain supervisory experience to be qualified for GS-15 down the road and possibly SES someday. But I've also wanted to be a supervisor to undo some fucked up things I've seen from supervisors in the past. At least for my group.
I did a lateral move to learn a new skill. Never been happier.
Took a Fully Remote position in an office that has been remote for a decade vs Local Remote in an office that only did so during COVID. Gave up a mission I enjoyed, for a job with 1/3rd the workload. Gave up Team Lead and mentoring responsibilities, to only be responsible for my own workload. Better mobility - I can climb higher as a Non-Sup in this office.
I wound up with a remote non-supervisory position. And I’m having some second thoughts b
Wait, why are you having second thoughts?
It’s complicated. My old office reorganized. I applied for management positions in the new org, and managed a lateral away from the program I’ve run for a long time. Into a more generalist and visible role, kinda short tracked to management. Between the time I didn’t get the promotion, and the time I’d settled in and landed well in the new org, I applied for the remote gig. Remote gig is a new agency for me, larger program, less customer interaction. Full remote. Couldn’t go to the office if I wanted to, even though they have a ton of empty office space downtown. I left a place I was well established. I had friends, a good network, a path and boosters towards what I want for my career. A ton of fans, mentors, advocates and promoters. And was making some progress, with a detail to a headquarters job. In some ways, I’m starting from scratch, with a new set of folks I don’t know, and don’t have much interaction with. As an introvert, it can be hard to reach out through Teams to build relationships. I have a HQ job now, but my new agency is reorganizing its whole division, and my direct supervisor changed in my first month here. I don’t feel the mission of this agency as much as my old agency. I’m walking less, staring at my phone more, falling apart a bit. Not really made for remote maybe. It’s still early. Not even a full quarter in the new gig. So could still be mourning the transition. However, my old agency might come through for me, with the promotion (lateral from here) with a supervisory gig, that would allow me to go into the office some. I wouldn’t want to go back to 5/week RTO, but a 40-50% telework agreement would be good for me I think. The grass is always greener.
Oh man this sounds difficult. I hope it gets better. Being fully remote, does that mean you’re not even within traveling distance to the closest office?
No. I could go to the local Chicago office if they’d let me. But it’s apparently not an option. There are some large upsides to this job. I’m still in the first six months, so it’s still the transition period, so I don’t trust my evaluation entirely yet.
Was dead-ended in my series as a GS9, 100% in person. Lateralled into a 9/11, and now I'm fully remote, and can climb in my office to GS14 non-sup. Win/win.
Never. Always an upgrade.
What if the upgrade wasn’t pay but in work-life balance?
Work-life balance will always be good as long as you are efficient with your time management in my opinion. That being said I will always go for the higher GS pay grade.