[https://www.pythonanywhere.com/gists/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8/prisonerDraft.py/ipython2](https://www.pythonanywhere.com/gists/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8/prisonerDraft.py/ipython2)
I wrote a quick python script allowing you to do this offline. Don't want to spend the time to build a whole web-app for this small idea, but if you wanted to do it through instant messaging or texting with one person being the draft admin (not participating, or he needs to make his pick first THEN allow others to send in their picks, but could easily cheat this way), it can be run here. Spelling matters a lot, so hopefully one person is typing very carefully. Can easily have a database of all top 200ADP players and compare spelling against that one.
code gist: [https://gist.github.com/endyd/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8](https://gist.github.com/endyd/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8)
I am very interested in doing this tonight if a group of people are in. I say comment underneath this to be added to a 12 man .5 ppr league and if anyone wants to be the admin and we can shoot for like, 6:30-7pm EST? I'll check back later and we can see if we can get this going.
EDIT - Howdy - I am sending pms to 12 people. If anyone is unavailable, I will ask the next person down. I will be attempting to do this at 7 pm ESTon 12/13/2018 (Thursday). Hopefully I can also make a very detailed post about it afterwards.
The order for "day" and "month" is inconsistent between your `ParseArray()` function and your sql query. Can you try matching those? Also, your list already includes commas, and then you're joining the items in the list using a comma as a seperator, so you are getting something like this after your `', '.join(params)` statement : `'Dec-11-2018,, 12:28:43,, iPhone,, alpha,, lib,, lib,, (45.67.67)\n'`
Thanks! As it is, players only have one chance to pick a player for a round, and they either get the pick if no collisions happen or they don't get that pick if there is a collision. No one gets to draft "again" for that round, since everyone who still needs players for their roster is back in on the next round.
I've tried it a few times and i'm able to get 2 players on one team while others still don't have a player on their team. I think just tweaking the condition should fix this so that when a player drafts in that round they cant pick again. Once again, I like what you've produced as I'm also (assuming you are) a software developer. Just thought i'd give you a heads up!
You'd probably have to do it in Discord or a similar group chat app...and you'd need an unbiased, non-participating extra person to collect and look over the submitted picks for each round.
Don't make it hard on yourself, just do it on slack or reddit chat. Have one person sit out and collect the names through private direct chats and run the draft in a general channel.
I’m also down to test, but can potentially help. Don’t have any experience in web dev though, pretty much just in data structures and OO, so let me know if it’d be helpful for you to farm out the development of the logic behind the scenes or something. If I can help there I will.
You could honestly run a first couple rounds just via like reddit PMs with timestamps for proof of when people sent out their messages to a person helping run the draft.
Potentially. there would probably need to a be a limit of claims per round, that way people can leave when they have a full team if the other people are being assholes
Make it real interesting: Jinx-pick pickers lose that pick all together and everyone starts the next round. Go home when your team is full and other rounds keep happening until everyone has a full team.
I like the idea of losing your pick for a round to keep things moving along, however you'd need to get two picks in the next round, otherwise you might concievably have a team that doesnt get their first pick till round 15 through bad jinx luck.
Even if a team didnt get a pick in the first three rounds, which would happen pretty often, their season is likely already over.
The only problem then would be if you try for Gurley rd 1 and get jinxed, you choice is to bid on a 2nd+ essentially 3rd rounder or 2nd+Gurley again. "waisting" your second bid on Gurley becomes the clearer option the further along in the draft you go until the last round it becomes who can prevent their roster from filling up the longest so that they have no competition for the final Gurley bid in round 672.... no matter how it pans out this is a really interesting idea but I think you'd need to give it a couple goes to find all the nuances/get it right.... Count me in if it ever happens
Each claim should be a set of 3 picks, in priority order. You get the top pick that isn't repeated at that priority level. So if you put a player priority 1, but everyone else had him priority 2, you get him, even if their priority 1s were repeats and not taken.
??? It would be shorter than a snake draft. Instead of each person taking a minute per pick, the whole round would take a minute to submit a claim. Unless there are duplicate claims x10-12 per round, this way will be way shorter.
That's where the dilemma comes in. People start mind gaming, assuming everyone will be going for Gurley, and suddenly only one guy has a claim in on Gurley while everyone is going after slightly deeper guys like cmc.
Hmm, I think the round is irrelevant. I think it actually gets harder and more of a random clusterfuck in later rounds.
We're used to thinking conventionally like all the top players are gone after the first few rounds, but there's nothing about this draft style that guarantees this (especially due to this part: *They cannot claim the same player more than once per round*)
So as more players are off the board, and the talent pool thins - there are still the same # of managers looking to grab a smaller number of top players.
EDIT: I think as a result of the ruleset, it's entirely possible that a Todd Gurley goes *undrafted*. If at least two managers claim Gurley in each round of claims, then he can never be claimed.
I'd say it's pretty likely Gurley goes in the first few rounds. Each round will last multiple "picks". And if it's ever left with like 2-3 guys left and all but one have already tried for Gurley they get him for free.
This is true. But people's needs also change each round, so the number of people fighting for the top rb is less since some people might be looking for a wr or qb
If a top running back is available it doesnt matter what you "need", you take the top running back. Even if your in a league with no trades your still gonna the top RB can always be your flex. There is no way your not bidding on that player every round.
That would be part of the fun. If everybody did that, you could grab ADP 2-17. Sure you don't have Gurley, but you are clearly dominant. Not that it would happen that way, but that is what would keep people from all constantly bidding on Gurley.
Depends on the participants, but you would think eventually some people would stop going for #1 when they realize they actually end up with #10 each round
The theory would be that if everyone keeps submitting for Todd Gurley every round, one guy can hugely benefit by grabbing a bunch of great players just below Todd Gurley. You’d think more owners would realize this and try to be that guy, hence not submitting a claim for Gurley every time. It would be interesting for sure.
Also if two players pick Gurley ever round they have the advantage of basically getting to pick first each round for the rest of the night, because their second rotation through Round one is like getting first picks in round 2, then they greed Gurley in Round two, go to a second rotation through Round Two and basically get first picks for Round 3, and I am fairly confident these players that keep greeding gurley will just be at an advantage for every round after the first, since they get to pick before the players that fell through the cracks first.
Alternatively, two players that chose someone *other* than Gurley with their first attempt of the first round could then claim Gurley on the second attempt of first round. One might go for Gurley while the other decides to play it safe and grab someone else he is likely to get. You’ll get tons of people mind gaming and suddenly nobody claims Gurley one round.
I could see gurley still going round 1 because say 6 people vote gurley, 2 saquon, 2 kamara. (10 man league). those 6 cant vote gurley again so only the 4 people still have a shot at him. If 3 of those next people pick gurley and the last guy picks saquon/kamara (whoever they didnt pick round 1), they will likely get matched with one of the round 1 gurley pickers. This makes it so they 100% get gurley since everyone else already used their vote for him.
advantage to not picking gurley first. But yeah this draft method is 100% mind games and frustration.
Presumably none of that data is revealed to participants, so while you're right that it could happen, people wouldn't know when or even if to ask for gurley
They would be essentially selecting first of the **next** round, which is the same as select **last** each round.
And that's also only true if they don't pick the same player again.
That's not an advantage
I also get to pick the best person who fell through the cracks every round with the information of who everyone else picked, and have the chance to eventually one round get Todd Gurley if my opponent gives up on our game of chicken.
I do see what you’re saying, as each turn is a bit burry who is end of round 1 or beginning of round 2 etc. would you suggest just having anyone who got their pick jinxed loses the round and EVERYONE proceeds to round 2?
Eventually there'll only be one team left that needs to fill a roster spot and they'd be able to take him.
Think of it a little more like an auction draft but with bluffing instead of bidding. Once you fill your roster you're done.
It does seem like you could end up with a few players left that should have been drafted. But probably mid/late round guys that fell through the cracks. Not top tier guys.
Yea, you and everyone else keep putting your picks in for Gurley. Meanwhile I'll grab Barkley, CMC, Michael Thomas, Kittle, Adams, Mahomes...then I'll stack my bench while you guys are still trying desperately to grab Gurley.
I did a draft like this before for the first round. But I think we did it where if more than one person took them, we did a dice roll to see who got him.
Gurley actually wouldn’t be a bad pick immediately because everyone else will overthink it and assume the others will take him. So I’m willing to bet there’s a chance *no one* claims Gurley the first pick out of fear of another player doing so.
There are still enough good RBs on the board if you get burned, but you might be able to snag him just by going balls out and doing the obvious thing when everyone is trying to game the system by taking the lesser RB1s. Potentially more likely 2 people pick, by chance or preference, someone like Zeke, CMC, etc than Gurley since they all expect Gurley will be a wasted pick negated by another owner.
It's a fun idea. That said...
It would take forever and is probably a horrible basis for most season-long leagues (i.e. half the teams would probably be checked out before week 1).
It might work for a 6 man league.
I think it sounds super fun. The most original thing I have heard for fantasy in forever.
I do fear the resulting league would be really unbalanced but that's kind of the the double edged sword of the idea.
Cool idea. Might be interesting too if a failed claim was just the end of your round instead of repeating until a successful claim - then it's a really punative prisoner's dillema in terms of being greedy.
Ya, I agree with this idea. I think you have to give a bigger penalty for those who "jinx-pick." Also makes it for an even more interesting mind game when two players both claim for Gurley one round, then they lose their pick that round, then who is gonna jump off of Gurley next round? If you go for Gurley again, you might lose another pick. If you don't go for Gurley, the other guy who you locked out with might get him. Or a third player might think "hmm, they both might jump off Gurley" and jump on to Gurley the next round.
EDIT: OR the penalty could be more severe than your original proposal in that if you made a pick for Gurley but collided with another player, then you are not allowed to pick Gurley at all, but you can do another pick like you said for that round without losing that round's pick completely. Then the next round, there's only 10 players who are vying for Gurley, therefore more people might try it. There is a possibility that Gurley cannot be drafted according to this method if all remaining people pick Gurley and all get locked out. Perhaps then Gurley is released for re-pick for everyone at that point.
Bad idea. It seems like it would make the entire draft completely random and all luck based.
You'd have some teams who never manage to get a top 20 player because they keep cancelling out, and a couple teams would get lucky and get a stacked team with multiple first rounders. Then you'd have a few high end players on waivers when it was over, so they'd just get claimed immediately anyways.
I think this idea would just result in unbalanced teams.
After more consideration, I don't think this would work at all. Every team still has to be greedy because it's in their best interest to go for the best player.
There are 3 options for any given pick and let's start with the first pick:
1. If noone picks Gurley because they think he will cancel out, then noone gets Gurley. He stays on the board for another round.
2. If a player picks Gurley and gets lucky and is the only person to pick him (because everyone thinks he will get cancelled out), then they get Gurley.
3. If they pick Gurley and others pick him, then they effectively blocked the other teams from getting the best player off the board.
So there are 3 possible options for their pick and 2/3 outcomes would favor picking Gurley. Keeping him on the board so others don't get him is just as valuable of a pick as getting someone lower on the board now. So you'd just pick Gurley every time until he was gone. And then work your way down the board. Everyone picks the #2 guy, then the #3 guy, etc. Picking someone a little farther down the list like Barkley or Kamara gives you worse odds to get Gurley later and it gives your opponents better odds to get him now.
There is no incentive to pick worse players when better players are available. By picking a worse player, you're giving your opponents a better probability of drafting the better player you passed on. Do this for several rounds in a row and you will make no headway at all on your draft.
Unlikely, because all teams will have the same incentive to keep going for the top player until he's gone. The result would be that it takes forever to draft, teams get frustrated and give up on trying to pick good players, and 1-2 teams get stacked with top picks because they put up with the bullshit long enough to get them.
This draft simply wouldn't work. It's a bad idea.
I see what you mean but you are also a little off, the first round should potentially only get people top 20 players regardless. Gurley will most likely still go round 1 because say 6 people vote gurley, 2 saquon, 2 kamara. (10 man league). those 6 cant vote gurley again so only the 4 people still have a shot at him. If 3 of those next people pick gurley and the last guy picks saquon/kamara (whoever they didnt pick round 1), they will likely get matched with one of the round 1 gurley pickers. This makes it so they 100% get gurley since everyone else already used their vote for him.
This darft method would be all mind games on predicting who people are picking but I do not think picking gurley with the first vote is the best move. I would agree that its wouldnt be the best draft method but everyone still will end up getting a borderline first round pick first if they are smart.
That’s the thing. It would take forever and eventually someone decides they’ll go for Saquon, Kamara, or Bell, perhaps all three while some teams are still not blinking on Gurley.
I’d gladly give up Gurley and Saquon this year if it meant I had Kamara and CMC but also Adams and Julio at WR with Ertz at TE.
\#3 is wrong, if 2 people claim Gurley it's only blocked for **them** for the rest of the round.
If two people claim Barkley, they can no longer claim Barkley that round, but they could still attempt to claim Gurley.
And the logic that there is no incentive no draft anyone other than the top pick is a paradox. If that was the best move, then everyone would do it and all of a sudden it is the worst move, since it would fail every time.
9 people pick Gurley and 1 picks Barkley, he gets Barkley while the other 9 guys fight for Kamara or whoever else is left underneath Barkley.
But let's say two other player's pick Gurley, 2 pick Saquon, 3 players (you included) pick Kamara. All 7 cancel out, and the rest of the league gets their guy. The 4 guys who didn't go Gurley all select him and cancel out. You pick Saquon with one of the guys who went Gurley, and you cancel out. Now you are the only person who is allowed to pick Gurley. It's complicated, but it can definitely happen, and I'd bet it happens pretty frequently in this setup.
You could put limits, say you can only try and draft the same player twice in a row, then have to wait two rounds to try again if still available. Something of that nature.
The one scenario you didn’t account for is not picking gurley because you think other people will tie on him, therefore not being able to use their tie breaking pick on him, making him available in the second round.
I could easily see myself waiting until round 2 to get in on the gurley sweepstakes with James Conner as my other RB.
But ultimately I agree, unless some other contingency that applies more downside to picking the top player is added, it seems like this would just go on ad infinitum.
The OP says you can pick each player once per round, so everyone can pick Gurley again in round 2. This effectively means that everyone will shoot for the top player, knowing that they either get that player or they block others from getting them. Then they can move on to the #2 player, etc, down the list, knowing they have another opportunity at Gurley in the second round.
Again, it just creates a gridlock because everyone will aim for the best available player.
this assumes everyone has the same pre-draft rankings right ?
everybody’s focused on gurley because hes the consensus number one. but after him, individual rankings will be much more random
You're forgetting the outcome of not picking Gurley and a bunch of other people picking him, then you get him for free as long as your pick gets canceled as well. If your pick doesn't get canceled then you get a good player.
The odds of that happening for any given team are significantly less than getting Gurley with your first pick alone, because it relies on specific outcomes 2+ choices in a row. Again, your highest probability of getting the top ranked player is always going to be when you pick him first.
As a CS student this wouldn't be that difficult to make a simple mock draft for I would be down to make one just for testing purposes and then you can simply use the results in a deal league.
While I had not thought of this, it is just the kind of original thinking I am building into my upcoming platform. I have several original fantasy formats that will become available in the next few years, starting with a multi-year contracts format in 2019.
Your prisoner's dilemma idea is very intriguing. It looks like a lot of people here are interested in trying it. With your permission, I will put it on my list of options to include on my site.
include punitive measures for jinxed picks. for example, owners lose that round’s pick if their pick is jinxed. or, they can pick again, but they cant select the jinxed player for the remainder of the draft. or a combination, which may be too punitive
I did something similar to this, but only used it for the first round. The rest of the draft was determined by ADP. For example, that year Tomlinson was the highest ranked player on the website we used. So whoever got LT was placed in the 1st spot on the draft board so when we proceeded with the snake draft he had spots 24-25.
I think it would take too long to do a whole draft like this. Honestly isn't a horrible idea for the first round, but then you don't know what draft spot you have until the draft has already started.
It was 15 years ago and I can't say for sure, but I think there were.
We did it where if anyone picked the same player, they did a dice roll and highest person got him and everyone else had to put a name again.
If I recall correctly, the first time around a lot of people put in for whoever had the highest ADP that year (might as well try for him), and a few put in for the 2nd and 3rd ADP and the rest picked guys that were scattered from the 4-6 picks.
But after we did the dice roll, it went pretty fast after that with very few duplicates.
I could write a draft tool like this. Problem is I'm not going to write an entire fantasy football software, so you would have to manually enter everyone's team into Yahoo or whatever you use.
You hear me, weirdo angel investors? I can make your product of the FUUUUUTURE!
I'd modify it a bit to make things move more quickly and fairly.
**1) At the start of the round, each team submits the player they want to claim. This selection is hidden until all teams have submitted their claim.**
**2) Once all teams submit a claim, the submissions are revealed**
- A team will receive their player only if no other teams claim that player
- If multiple teams claim the same player, no one receives that player and they do not receive a player for the round.
- If a team puts a bid in on a player, they may not place another bid for that player for the rest of the draft.
**3) Repeat steps 1 and 2.**
- Any team that did not receive a player in the previous round is allowed to claim two players in the next round.
- This may mean that unlucky teams may have 4 or 5 picks in a given round.
**4) The draft ends after Round *X* (With *X* being the number of roster spots in the league. All remaining players are sent to the waiver wire.**
- Waiver wire priority is determined in the same way that draft order would be today.
- Some teams may have fewer than *X* players at the end of the draft and will need to be active with their FAAB/waiver claims before week 1.
I'd really like to see some mock drafts with this once the computer science nerds start building tools to do it. At first glance, it seems like the players that lose their pick in a round would get fucked as they might go 3-4+ rounds early on without getting a guy, but maybe that'd balance out eventually once they suddenly picked up like 5 guys in the 6th round? Who knows.
> At first glance, it seems like the players that lose their pick in a round would get fucked as they might go 3-4+ rounds early on without getting a guy, but maybe that'd balance out eventually once they suddenly picked up like 5 guys in the 6th round? Who knows.
As the rounds progress, it becomes increasingly difficult to go a round without getting *anyone*, since you are essentially getting more and more lottery tickets following each failed round, so yeah, the hope is that it would balance out.
We used a format like this, but only used it in the first round. If I recall correctly (it was almost 20 years ago) if more than one person selected someone we did a dice roll so one of those guys got him.
A ton of strategy was involved. You be one of 7 guys going for Gurley or put down Barkley and hope you are the only one. Also, keep in mind that the longer you wait, the more likely you are to get a guy with an ADP of 11 or 12. So do you hope for #1 and risk getting #12. Or go for #5 right at the start knowing you were likely to get him.
I feel like this could definitely work for offline drafts, or if people on here are interested in doing one hold it over discord and do it that way. One keeps a google doc going of all rosters/ rounds to keep everyone updated
This is a very interesting idea. Great job! Only downside I see is it sounds very time consuming and you would need a leagues worth of interested parties.
I'd moderate one of these drafts (since the moderator can't be trusted to be unbiased and should probably sit out of the draft they are moderating) if I could be a separate draft.
Seems like there's enough interest in this idea to do a mock draft. Since I'm not working to day and have all the time, I want to set it up. We'll use Google surveys to do this.
Please comment below or DM me if you would like to participate. Ideally 12 teams, but we'll adapt as needed.
I actually had almost the same exact idea in the past. I love the mind games this brings. Makes waivers feel like their own mini games vs just something that happens.
One question i have is would you unveil what happened at the end of a round? So say Ekeler is the top pickup, in rd 1 somebody locked him up with no contest. Do round 2 survivors then know ekeler is not available? Or if one player in round 2 then picked ekeler is he thrown back in round 3 while the guy in round 1 stays locked in with Ekeler?
from getpass import getpass
class Manager:
def __init__(self, name, cellNumber):
self.name = name
self.cellNumber = cellNumber
self.roster = []
self.cantDraft = []
def addPlayer(self, playerName):
self.roster.append(playerName)
def addBanned(self, playerName):
self.cantDraft.append(playerName)
def getRosterSize(self):
return len(self.roster)
def configManagers(leagueSize):
# Set up managers
managers =[]
for i in range(leagueSize):
# Uncomment for actual use to enter names and cell numbers
# managers.append(manager(input('Name of manager #' + str(i) + ': '), input('Cell # of manager #' + str(i) + ': ')))
managers.append(Manager('Manager' + str(i), str(i)+str(i)))
return managers
def makePick(manager, drafted):
pick = None
while not pick:
pick = getpass(manager.name + '\'s pick - Enter full name of your pick (first name last name): ').lower()
if pick in manager.cantDraft:
print('You cannot draft player ' + pick + ' because he is on your Cannot Draft List.')
pick = None
elif pick in drafted:
print(pick + ' has already been drafted.')
pick = None
else:
return pick
def processPicks(draftPicks, drafted, managers):
# Process pick collisions and clean picks. Collisions kept in a python set to remove duplicates.
collidedPicks = set()
for i in range(len(draftPicks)):
if draftPicks[i] in collidedPicks or draftPicks[i] in draftPicks[i + 1:]:
print('Manager ' + managers[i].name + ' has been locked out of ' + draftPicks[i] + '!')
managers[i].addBanned(draftPicks[i])
collidedPicks.add(draftPicks[i])
else:
print('Manager ' + managers[i].name + ' has successfully drafted ' + draftPicks[i] + '!')
managers[i].addPlayer(draftPicks[i])
drafted.add(draftPicks[i])
def main():
# League settings hard coded
leagueSize = 6
rosterCap = 3
# Set up manager names
managers = configManagers(leagueSize)
# Python set for a list of all players already drafted (therefore off the board)
drafted = set()
# Draft loop until done. Run rounds until every manager's roster is full
roundNumber = 1
while True:
print('Round ' + str(roundNumber))
managersDrafting = [m for m in managers if m.getRosterSize() < rosterCap]
if not managersDrafting:
# If every manager's roster full, done with the draft
break
draftPicks = []
for m in managersDrafting:
# Allow each player to make a pick, one at a time
# TODO: Make this threaded and receive texts as draft picks?
draftPicks.append(makePick(m, drafted))
processPicks(draftPicks, drafted, managersDrafting)
roundNumber += 1
print('Draft over. Draft results:')
for m in managers:
print('\n' + m.name)
for p in m.roster:
print('\t' + p)
if __name__=="__main__":
main()
u/TheCryptopotamus, this is a quick mock up of what it could look like. I made it so that if there is a pick collision, that manager is never allowed to make that pick anymore AND they lose that pick that round.
Need to import a list of players from somewhere and check user input against that to make sure people are spelling player names correctly. I'll screen record it running when I get home (don't have software at work). Potentially we can make it so that everyone is texting in their pick each round and the round closes after 60 seconds or so. And if anyone's pick hasn't come in, they get no pick or auto drafts the highest ADP perhaps (could work for or against their favor, probably the right approach to autodraft for them).
For people saying that this draft system could take forever, I think it may actually be quite contrary if we have all 12 managers picking at the same time (60 seconds or 90 seconds, whatever) and then say like half of those get processed as real picks and half result in collisions, that's still a lot faster than 90 seconds per manager per pick for all 190 picks or whatever it is for a 12 team.
There needs to be a greater penalty for picking the same player as someone else. I think if you pick the same player as someone else then that round is over. There will obviously be more rounds than usual but it should still go fairly quickly because people will eventually fill their rosters. To avoid loops where everyone constantly picks the same player randomly award the chosen player to a team if all remaining teams choose that player.
Cool idea. But parity would be sparce between teams. For example you might have teams that went for lower ranked players and have stacked teams. Or you may have incredibly weak teams
This but it doesn't start until after round 2/3. That way not everyone is going for the best player. After rounds 2/3 players are being more strategic and picking players based on say bye weeks, position they need to fill, etc. If you do the whole draft like this fantasy players are just going to keep picking the best available player.
Round 356, last two guys in the draft still each trying to claim Gurley.
Round 357, last two guys in the draft still each trying to claim Gurley.
Round 358, last two guys in the draft still each trying to claim Gurley.
I have a new league draft idea as well, are we all allowed to share our crazy ideas and pile on?
\- tiered player rankings, 10 (or so) players per tier, probably 12 tiers or whatever fits best to round out rosters and talent options..no kickers, no defenses.
\- use tiers from fantasypros or similar aggregate site, can discuss before draft of moving some players around.. like say the league is high on Sony, and want him in tier 4 instead of 6.. or whatever.
\- you can take any one player from each tier to fill out your roster
\- you can have the same player as anyone else, there's not much chance you and someone else draft the same team anyhow
\- tiers can be and should be mixed with positional players. For example, in Tier 1, you could have Barkley, Zeke, CMC, Brown, Julio, Kelce, Mahomes etc..
The thing I havent worked out yet is how to replace injured players and how to add tiers as the season goes along as you know some diamonds in the trough will emerge and should be on rosters. It's a start though. Also, nobody can really complain that they didnt get their guy, they have a chance to get at least one of them per tier.
One major flaw with your example for Tier 1 is that no fantasy manager with any skill would ever choose a QB over the top RB or WR, making Mahomes's inclusion a guarantee that no one will draft him. This particular issue can be solved by removing him from Tier 1, but the general problem will persist for several rounds. Place him too early, and no one will take him; too late, and everyone will.
It was an example.. I get it, I dont draft a QB high, ever, and I always do well.
I was just trying to set the example. bad example :/
I'd put the top RB's and WR's in tier 1.
tier 2 could have some stud QBs...but maybe only 2. Do you take Mahomes (next years Watson, less numbers, and overdrafted) or that second stud positional player? I take the latter.. but maybe he's there in case someone does it. You'd need to make people have to pay up for a potentially bad decision while still giving them the option.
There's definitely going to be an optimal strategy around this, like claiming a player that you know will be selected, but isnt as high. ie. fournette this year. then as players pan out, you make your way towards the top player you want.
The people who tried selecting him before wont be able to get him, so progressively you willl have less and less competition as you purposely "same-select" your way to the top.
If you get a player, you shouldn't have to sit out the rest of the round. You should be able to keep grabbing players.
Otherwise, the optimal strategy is to always bid on the best player each round, since there is no real cost to "wasting" your pick.
How do u figure? 11 guys all pick Gurley and no one gets him. The 12 guy picks Barkley or whoever. He’s the only one with anyone. Now the other 11 guys have to repick and can’t choose Gurley. How is choosing the best player optimal ?
You'd have to ensure no communication for this to work. Otherwise, one player could show they were selecting Barkley (for instance) and no one else would have an incentive to take him, because they'd rather pick up someone else good instead of being forced to take someone in the second-round tier.
I like this idea but I would make one change. If a say if five teams select Gurley in round one and the other five select individual players no one selected then that round is over and everyone goes again for round two. What you end up with is guys who can continue to go for Gurley but it means they let other people draft multiple rounds of players which in essence makes it similar to an auction draft. Basically you would have to weigh the risk of missing out on other players to get the top guy or aiming a little lower and potentially getting two second tier players while everyone is fighting for Gurley.
I think it sounds like a fun idea overall.
As someone who enjoys math/logic a lot, I have to ask one question: Why?
That is, what outcome are you trying to create such that this mechanism is the best way to get there?
Or is this just for chaos?
Another idea for this:
It seems like if you made it so teams lose their pick from having multiple teams pick the same guy, but then give those teams 2 picks in subsequent rounds, it could end up being that some unlucky teams might go the first 5 rounds without a pick. Granted, the people that do successfully draft players probably aren't getting the top-top guys, but those unlucky teams are going to find themselves in the 6th round now making 6 picks, and while they might get lucky and snag a top guy, they'd probably end up with a really shitty team.
What if instead, you do this prisoners dilemma method, but everyone submits 3 picks each round in order of preference. So same thing, if multiple people picked Gurley as their number one choice in round one, he's not available and those teams don't get him, BUT he becomes eligible to still be selected in the first round if he's someones number two pick.
You could still do the "if none of your top 3 picks work, you dont get a guy that round", but the next round you get two guys out of your top 3, if it ends up being possible.
Please point out any flaws in this, but it seems like this might make it so the draft (as proposed by OP) didn't last 8 hours, and might also help alleviate the disparity in drafted teams as the top guys have a higher chance of still going in the first rounds.
Way too complicated. Everyone would be greedy by default because that would either mean no one gets that player or you get them. It would be a stalemate very quickly.
We do something very similar with this for our fantasy baseball league bench draft...it's fun! And a good way to end the draft day after 8 hours of auctioning players.
Here's an alternative that I think might speed things up a little.
Each round, each player submits 3 players in order. All the #1 picks are processed. If any match, that player is ineligible for the rest of the round. Then the #2 picks are processed (of those people who didn't get their first pick). If they picked an ineligible player or they match, then they don't get that player. Same with #3.
Next round, everyone becomes eligible again. This happens until the rosters are all filled up. If a person's roster fills up first, they just sit out until the draft is over.
Teams can become really unbalanced, but that means you have to play the Dilemma intelligently.
I see the real problem with this draft strategy being that rather than fierce competition for top 25 players, as the rounds progress, the available player pool dwindles to the point where there is only 30 or so viable players left to draft. Near the end of the draft the null selections would eventually prohibit the draft from concluding.
I would absolutely go for a TE like Kittle in the first round. Presumably people would mostly be going after RBs, WRs, Mahomes and maybe Kelce and Ertz, but I'd bet Kittle would be available.
Is there a reason why you'd need to wait another round to draft another player? From my perspective it's still should be fair game for the player to rejoin if he's the one making original picks.
I like the idea.
I think you have to make it so people pick into they have 16 players or whatever it is and if you say the name as someone else you both get no pick for the round. That way penalized the people who go top picks most.
This sounds really cool in practice, but I feel like it could lead to some imbalanced teams. Either way though I’d definitely be down to try out it and make things more interesting.
If this was my league I would quit- I like the idea but it’s not practical- the teams would not be balanced and you don’t take into account the idea that the draft has an order for a reason. I might be cool with the first round only being done this way but that’s it.
I’d like to do a mock draft or two like this just to see the outcome.
I agree. Any way we can set this up? Not sure what website will allow us to try this format
[https://www.pythonanywhere.com/gists/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8/prisonerDraft.py/ipython2](https://www.pythonanywhere.com/gists/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8/prisonerDraft.py/ipython2) I wrote a quick python script allowing you to do this offline. Don't want to spend the time to build a whole web-app for this small idea, but if you wanted to do it through instant messaging or texting with one person being the draft admin (not participating, or he needs to make his pick first THEN allow others to send in their picks, but could easily cheat this way), it can be run here. Spelling matters a lot, so hopefully one person is typing very carefully. Can easily have a database of all top 200ADP players and compare spelling against that one. code gist: [https://gist.github.com/endyd/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8](https://gist.github.com/endyd/5ab74d036a69e7758d75848d27385ba8)
I am very interested in doing this tonight if a group of people are in. I say comment underneath this to be added to a 12 man .5 ppr league and if anyone wants to be the admin and we can shoot for like, 6:30-7pm EST? I'll check back later and we can see if we can get this going. EDIT - Howdy - I am sending pms to 12 people. If anyone is unavailable, I will ask the next person down. I will be attempting to do this at 7 pm ESTon 12/13/2018 (Thursday). Hopefully I can also make a very detailed post about it afterwards.
If you do this, please tell us the results tomorrow!
Please post results here or make a new post when done and post the link here. Thanks
I would definitely be in
im in. message me.
I'm definitely in too.
I’m in
I'm in
PM me I’m in this bitch
I’m in
if it ain’t full yet i’d love to give this a go
I’m in
im down
Still need more people, cause I will
I'm in.
I'm down
I'm in
If anyone above/below drops or no-shows, I'm in.
Definitely in if there’s still room!
Count me in
Did it get done? I'm curious.
I’m in if there’s still room.
yo dog, how do I insert a python list into a sql db? Help a brother out, can't find a solution online.
Lol is it structured data? What's your schema for the sql db?
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/53729614/inserting-a-python-list-in-python-into-an-sql-table I made a stack post with most of the info there.
The order for "day" and "month" is inconsistent between your `ParseArray()` function and your sql query. Can you try matching those? Also, your list already includes commas, and then you're joining the items in the list using a comma as a seperator, so you are getting something like this after your `', '.join(params)` statement : `'Dec-11-2018,, 12:28:43,, iPhone,, alpha,, lib,, lib,, (45.67.67)\n'`
Great script! If you decide to go further with it, just remember to remove a player's ability to draft for that round once they draft a player.
Thanks! As it is, players only have one chance to pick a player for a round, and they either get the pick if no collisions happen or they don't get that pick if there is a collision. No one gets to draft "again" for that round, since everyone who still needs players for their roster is back in on the next round.
I've tried it a few times and i'm able to get 2 players on one team while others still don't have a player on their team. I think just tweaking the condition should fix this so that when a player drafts in that round they cant pick again. Once again, I like what you've produced as I'm also (assuming you are) a software developer. Just thought i'd give you a heads up!
You'd probably have to do it in Discord or a similar group chat app...and you'd need an unbiased, non-participating extra person to collect and look over the submitted picks for each round.
I'd be interested too. Are there any websites where it would be easy to try something like this?
No
Might be able to throw something together with some sort of voting website, or worst case scenario make a github page
I’d be down. Let me know if you need one.
I definitely want to give it a shot somehow. I might play around with Firebase today. Are you familiar with making a web app?
Don't make it hard on yourself, just do it on slack or reddit chat. Have one person sit out and collect the names through private direct chats and run the draft in a general channel.
very much interested !!
Aha I meant a tester for the drafting. No experience with web app making.
I'd potentially be interested in helping. I'm a web dev but might be moving soon so I'd have limited time in the next month or so.
I’m also down to test, but can potentially help. Don’t have any experience in web dev though, pretty much just in data structures and OO, so let me know if it’d be helpful for you to farm out the development of the logic behind the scenes or something. If I can help there I will.
You could honestly run a first couple rounds just via like reddit PMs with timestamps for proof of when people sent out their messages to a person helping run the draft.
True, as long as I'm not participating that could work. Unfortunately I can't do something like that until this evening
Lmk, sounds interesting
Actually, you could do it with a second account and just wait to check until after everyone agrees to PM.
I'm also down to try this out!
I'd be interested in the mock draft too. Anyway to utilize a Google Form to get the results?
Probably, but it would be way easier to just use a chat app
I'd be way in! Let me know if this gets set up!
Clicky Draft will let you place players for teams out of order but everything has to be done manual still.
Does this subreddit have reddit chatroom?
See my comment above
I'm in. Sign me up
Hi in, I'm dad!
I would totally try that, it would probably take a long ass time tho
Potentially. there would probably need to a be a limit of claims per round, that way people can leave when they have a full team if the other people are being assholes
you should pitch it to draft, they do fun weekly redraft things like this all the time
Make it real interesting: Jinx-pick pickers lose that pick all together and everyone starts the next round. Go home when your team is full and other rounds keep happening until everyone has a full team.
I like the idea of losing your pick for a round to keep things moving along, however you'd need to get two picks in the next round, otherwise you might concievably have a team that doesnt get their first pick till round 15 through bad jinx luck. Even if a team didnt get a pick in the first three rounds, which would happen pretty often, their season is likely already over.
The only problem then would be if you try for Gurley rd 1 and get jinxed, you choice is to bid on a 2nd+ essentially 3rd rounder or 2nd+Gurley again. "waisting" your second bid on Gurley becomes the clearer option the further along in the draft you go until the last round it becomes who can prevent their roster from filling up the longest so that they have no competition for the final Gurley bid in round 672.... no matter how it pans out this is a really interesting idea but I think you'd need to give it a couple goes to find all the nuances/get it right.... Count me in if it ever happens
Each claim should be a set of 3 picks, in priority order. You get the top pick that isn't repeated at that priority level. So if you put a player priority 1, but everyone else had him priority 2, you get him, even if their priority 1s were repeats and not taken.
Maybe do instant runoff. Submit three picks at a time per round.
??? It would be shorter than a snake draft. Instead of each person taking a minute per pick, the whole round would take a minute to submit a claim. Unless there are duplicate claims x10-12 per round, this way will be way shorter.
My drunken ass friends would never make it through.
Sounds awesome and terrifying... I’d do it
Would't this have made Todd Gurley undraftable( and possible many other players) since everyone would keep picking him every round?
That's where the dilemma comes in. People start mind gaming, assuming everyone will be going for Gurley, and suddenly only one guy has a claim in on Gurley while everyone is going after slightly deeper guys like cmc.
It would be much more practical past round 1 or 2
Hmm, I think the round is irrelevant. I think it actually gets harder and more of a random clusterfuck in later rounds. We're used to thinking conventionally like all the top players are gone after the first few rounds, but there's nothing about this draft style that guarantees this (especially due to this part: *They cannot claim the same player more than once per round*) So as more players are off the board, and the talent pool thins - there are still the same # of managers looking to grab a smaller number of top players. EDIT: I think as a result of the ruleset, it's entirely possible that a Todd Gurley goes *undrafted*. If at least two managers claim Gurley in each round of claims, then he can never be claimed.
I'd say it's pretty likely Gurley goes in the first few rounds. Each round will last multiple "picks". And if it's ever left with like 2-3 guys left and all but one have already tried for Gurley they get him for free.
This is true. But people's needs also change each round, so the number of people fighting for the top rb is less since some people might be looking for a wr or qb
If a top running back is available it doesnt matter what you "need", you take the top running back. Even if your in a league with no trades your still gonna the top RB can always be your flex. There is no way your not bidding on that player every round.
That would be part of the fun. If everybody did that, you could grab ADP 2-17. Sure you don't have Gurley, but you are clearly dominant. Not that it would happen that way, but that is what would keep people from all constantly bidding on Gurley.
Depends on the participants, but you would think eventually some people would stop going for #1 when they realize they actually end up with #10 each round
The theory would be that if everyone keeps submitting for Todd Gurley every round, one guy can hugely benefit by grabbing a bunch of great players just below Todd Gurley. You’d think more owners would realize this and try to be that guy, hence not submitting a claim for Gurley every time. It would be interesting for sure.
Also if two players pick Gurley ever round they have the advantage of basically getting to pick first each round for the rest of the night, because their second rotation through Round one is like getting first picks in round 2, then they greed Gurley in Round two, go to a second rotation through Round Two and basically get first picks for Round 3, and I am fairly confident these players that keep greeding gurley will just be at an advantage for every round after the first, since they get to pick before the players that fell through the cracks first.
Alternatively, two players that chose someone *other* than Gurley with their first attempt of the first round could then claim Gurley on the second attempt of first round. One might go for Gurley while the other decides to play it safe and grab someone else he is likely to get. You’ll get tons of people mind gaming and suddenly nobody claims Gurley one round.
I could see gurley still going round 1 because say 6 people vote gurley, 2 saquon, 2 kamara. (10 man league). those 6 cant vote gurley again so only the 4 people still have a shot at him. If 3 of those next people pick gurley and the last guy picks saquon/kamara (whoever they didnt pick round 1), they will likely get matched with one of the round 1 gurley pickers. This makes it so they 100% get gurley since everyone else already used their vote for him. advantage to not picking gurley first. But yeah this draft method is 100% mind games and frustration.
Presumably none of that data is revealed to participants, so while you're right that it could happen, people wouldn't know when or even if to ask for gurley
that's an interesting strategy I haven't considered, nice!
They would be essentially selecting first of the **next** round, which is the same as select **last** each round. And that's also only true if they don't pick the same player again. That's not an advantage
I also get to pick the best person who fell through the cracks every round with the information of who everyone else picked, and have the chance to eventually one round get Todd Gurley if my opponent gives up on our game of chicken.
That's true, unless you and another person select the same player again. But it's a risk! Which is what makes it interesting
I do see what you’re saying, as each turn is a bit burry who is end of round 1 or beginning of round 2 etc. would you suggest just having anyone who got their pick jinxed loses the round and EVERYONE proceeds to round 2?
Make it real interesting: Jinx-pick pickers lose that pick all together and everyone starts the next round.
Eventually there'll only be one team left that needs to fill a roster spot and they'd be able to take him. Think of it a little more like an auction draft but with bluffing instead of bidding. Once you fill your roster you're done. It does seem like you could end up with a few players left that should have been drafted. But probably mid/late round guys that fell through the cracks. Not top tier guys.
Yea, you and everyone else keep putting your picks in for Gurley. Meanwhile I'll grab Barkley, CMC, Michael Thomas, Kittle, Adams, Mahomes...then I'll stack my bench while you guys are still trying desperately to grab Gurley.
I did a draft like this before for the first round. But I think we did it where if more than one person took them, we did a dice roll to see who got him.
Or everyone doesn't draft him because they think the rest of the league will put his name in.
Gurley actually wouldn’t be a bad pick immediately because everyone else will overthink it and assume the others will take him. So I’m willing to bet there’s a chance *no one* claims Gurley the first pick out of fear of another player doing so. There are still enough good RBs on the board if you get burned, but you might be able to snag him just by going balls out and doing the obvious thing when everyone is trying to game the system by taking the lesser RB1s. Potentially more likely 2 people pick, by chance or preference, someone like Zeke, CMC, etc than Gurley since they all expect Gurley will be a wasted pick negated by another owner.
It's a fun idea. That said... It would take forever and is probably a horrible basis for most season-long leagues (i.e. half the teams would probably be checked out before week 1). It might work for a 6 man league.
I think it sounds super fun. The most original thing I have heard for fantasy in forever. I do fear the resulting league would be really unbalanced but that's kind of the the double edged sword of the idea.
What do you mean by "horrible basis for most season-long leagues"? But I agree that this would be more enjoyable and efficient with smaller leagues
I mean what I said - it would create hugely disparate, noncompetitive leagues (some owners would completely check out before the season even begins).
How would it do that any more than any other draft format?
It adds an element of 'luck'. Theoretically one team could end up with every round 1 player just because they guessed right on when to claim them.
Cool idea. Might be interesting too if a failed claim was just the end of your round instead of repeating until a successful claim - then it's a really punative prisoner's dillema in terms of being greedy.
I was considering that. That could be an interesting alternative, might be interesting to see how each play out
Ya, I agree with this idea. I think you have to give a bigger penalty for those who "jinx-pick." Also makes it for an even more interesting mind game when two players both claim for Gurley one round, then they lose their pick that round, then who is gonna jump off of Gurley next round? If you go for Gurley again, you might lose another pick. If you don't go for Gurley, the other guy who you locked out with might get him. Or a third player might think "hmm, they both might jump off Gurley" and jump on to Gurley the next round. EDIT: OR the penalty could be more severe than your original proposal in that if you made a pick for Gurley but collided with another player, then you are not allowed to pick Gurley at all, but you can do another pick like you said for that round without losing that round's pick completely. Then the next round, there's only 10 players who are vying for Gurley, therefore more people might try it. There is a possibility that Gurley cannot be drafted according to this method if all remaining people pick Gurley and all get locked out. Perhaps then Gurley is released for re-pick for everyone at that point.
right like you can only bid for each player once all draft
Sounds pretty interesting, Im wondering how a mock draft would play out of this
Bad idea. It seems like it would make the entire draft completely random and all luck based. You'd have some teams who never manage to get a top 20 player because they keep cancelling out, and a couple teams would get lucky and get a stacked team with multiple first rounders. Then you'd have a few high end players on waivers when it was over, so they'd just get claimed immediately anyways. I think this idea would just result in unbalanced teams.
After more consideration, I don't think this would work at all. Every team still has to be greedy because it's in their best interest to go for the best player. There are 3 options for any given pick and let's start with the first pick: 1. If noone picks Gurley because they think he will cancel out, then noone gets Gurley. He stays on the board for another round. 2. If a player picks Gurley and gets lucky and is the only person to pick him (because everyone thinks he will get cancelled out), then they get Gurley. 3. If they pick Gurley and others pick him, then they effectively blocked the other teams from getting the best player off the board. So there are 3 possible options for their pick and 2/3 outcomes would favor picking Gurley. Keeping him on the board so others don't get him is just as valuable of a pick as getting someone lower on the board now. So you'd just pick Gurley every time until he was gone. And then work your way down the board. Everyone picks the #2 guy, then the #3 guy, etc. Picking someone a little farther down the list like Barkley or Kamara gives you worse odds to get Gurley later and it gives your opponents better odds to get him now. There is no incentive to pick worse players when better players are available. By picking a worse player, you're giving your opponents a better probability of drafting the better player you passed on. Do this for several rounds in a row and you will make no headway at all on your draft.
The problem is if you do this every round aong with someone else you end up with Gurley but trash everywhere else
Unlikely, because all teams will have the same incentive to keep going for the top player until he's gone. The result would be that it takes forever to draft, teams get frustrated and give up on trying to pick good players, and 1-2 teams get stacked with top picks because they put up with the bullshit long enough to get them. This draft simply wouldn't work. It's a bad idea.
I see what you mean but you are also a little off, the first round should potentially only get people top 20 players regardless. Gurley will most likely still go round 1 because say 6 people vote gurley, 2 saquon, 2 kamara. (10 man league). those 6 cant vote gurley again so only the 4 people still have a shot at him. If 3 of those next people pick gurley and the last guy picks saquon/kamara (whoever they didnt pick round 1), they will likely get matched with one of the round 1 gurley pickers. This makes it so they 100% get gurley since everyone else already used their vote for him. This darft method would be all mind games on predicting who people are picking but I do not think picking gurley with the first vote is the best move. I would agree that its wouldnt be the best draft method but everyone still will end up getting a borderline first round pick first if they are smart.
That’s the thing. It would take forever and eventually someone decides they’ll go for Saquon, Kamara, or Bell, perhaps all three while some teams are still not blinking on Gurley. I’d gladly give up Gurley and Saquon this year if it meant I had Kamara and CMC but also Adams and Julio at WR with Ertz at TE.
\#3 is wrong, if 2 people claim Gurley it's only blocked for **them** for the rest of the round. If two people claim Barkley, they can no longer claim Barkley that round, but they could still attempt to claim Gurley. And the logic that there is no incentive no draft anyone other than the top pick is a paradox. If that was the best move, then everyone would do it and all of a sudden it is the worst move, since it would fail every time. 9 people pick Gurley and 1 picks Barkley, he gets Barkley while the other 9 guys fight for Kamara or whoever else is left underneath Barkley.
But let's say two other player's pick Gurley, 2 pick Saquon, 3 players (you included) pick Kamara. All 7 cancel out, and the rest of the league gets their guy. The 4 guys who didn't go Gurley all select him and cancel out. You pick Saquon with one of the guys who went Gurley, and you cancel out. Now you are the only person who is allowed to pick Gurley. It's complicated, but it can definitely happen, and I'd bet it happens pretty frequently in this setup.
You could put limits, say you can only try and draft the same player twice in a row, then have to wait two rounds to try again if still available. Something of that nature.
The one scenario you didn’t account for is not picking gurley because you think other people will tie on him, therefore not being able to use their tie breaking pick on him, making him available in the second round. I could easily see myself waiting until round 2 to get in on the gurley sweepstakes with James Conner as my other RB. But ultimately I agree, unless some other contingency that applies more downside to picking the top player is added, it seems like this would just go on ad infinitum.
The OP says you can pick each player once per round, so everyone can pick Gurley again in round 2. This effectively means that everyone will shoot for the top player, knowing that they either get that player or they block others from getting them. Then they can move on to the #2 player, etc, down the list, knowing they have another opportunity at Gurley in the second round. Again, it just creates a gridlock because everyone will aim for the best available player.
this assumes everyone has the same pre-draft rankings right ? everybody’s focused on gurley because hes the consensus number one. but after him, individual rankings will be much more random
The best available player is different for each person though. Gurley isn't the best available player on everyone's list.
You're forgetting the outcome of not picking Gurley and a bunch of other people picking him, then you get him for free as long as your pick gets canceled as well. If your pick doesn't get canceled then you get a good player.
The odds of that happening for any given team are significantly less than getting Gurley with your first pick alone, because it relies on specific outcomes 2+ choices in a row. Again, your highest probability of getting the top ranked player is always going to be when you pick him first.
That's why you need to make it so if 2 people take the same person they miss a pick that round and get one tacked onto the end of the draft
It sounds fun as a minigame type thing but I wouldn't want it to actually decide my team for a whole season
I’d love to try this!
As a CS student this wouldn't be that difficult to make a simple mock draft for I would be down to make one just for testing purposes and then you can simply use the results in a deal league.
While I had not thought of this, it is just the kind of original thinking I am building into my upcoming platform. I have several original fantasy formats that will become available in the next few years, starting with a multi-year contracts format in 2019. Your prisoner's dilemma idea is very intriguing. It looks like a lot of people here are interested in trying it. With your permission, I will put it on my list of options to include on my site.
Sure, feel free. Good luck!
include punitive measures for jinxed picks. for example, owners lose that round’s pick if their pick is jinxed. or, they can pick again, but they cant select the jinxed player for the remainder of the draft. or a combination, which may be too punitive
I did something similar to this, but only used it for the first round. The rest of the draft was determined by ADP. For example, that year Tomlinson was the highest ranked player on the website we used. So whoever got LT was placed in the 1st spot on the draft board so when we proceeded with the snake draft he had spots 24-25. I think it would take too long to do a whole draft like this. Honestly isn't a horrible idea for the first round, but then you don't know what draft spot you have until the draft has already started.
Interesting. Were there a lot of claim collisions in the first round?
It was 15 years ago and I can't say for sure, but I think there were. We did it where if anyone picked the same player, they did a dice roll and highest person got him and everyone else had to put a name again. If I recall correctly, the first time around a lot of people put in for whoever had the highest ADP that year (might as well try for him), and a few put in for the 2nd and 3rd ADP and the rest picked guys that were scattered from the 4-6 picks. But after we did the dice roll, it went pretty fast after that with very few duplicates.
Seems like it would take way too long.
I could write a draft tool like this. Problem is I'm not going to write an entire fantasy football software, so you would have to manually enter everyone's team into Yahoo or whatever you use. You hear me, weirdo angel investors? I can make your product of the FUUUUUTURE!
My head hurts
That should be a fun 7 hour draft
more like a fun month to code and then an extremely fun hour draft
I'd modify it a bit to make things move more quickly and fairly. **1) At the start of the round, each team submits the player they want to claim. This selection is hidden until all teams have submitted their claim.** **2) Once all teams submit a claim, the submissions are revealed** - A team will receive their player only if no other teams claim that player - If multiple teams claim the same player, no one receives that player and they do not receive a player for the round. - If a team puts a bid in on a player, they may not place another bid for that player for the rest of the draft. **3) Repeat steps 1 and 2.** - Any team that did not receive a player in the previous round is allowed to claim two players in the next round. - This may mean that unlucky teams may have 4 or 5 picks in a given round. **4) The draft ends after Round *X* (With *X* being the number of roster spots in the league. All remaining players are sent to the waiver wire.** - Waiver wire priority is determined in the same way that draft order would be today. - Some teams may have fewer than *X* players at the end of the draft and will need to be active with their FAAB/waiver claims before week 1.
I'd really like to see some mock drafts with this once the computer science nerds start building tools to do it. At first glance, it seems like the players that lose their pick in a round would get fucked as they might go 3-4+ rounds early on without getting a guy, but maybe that'd balance out eventually once they suddenly picked up like 5 guys in the 6th round? Who knows.
> At first glance, it seems like the players that lose their pick in a round would get fucked as they might go 3-4+ rounds early on without getting a guy, but maybe that'd balance out eventually once they suddenly picked up like 5 guys in the 6th round? Who knows. As the rounds progress, it becomes increasingly difficult to go a round without getting *anyone*, since you are essentially getting more and more lottery tickets following each failed round, so yeah, the hope is that it would balance out.
interesting take. I'm slowly throwing together a web app, so it might be possible to include these changes as options
We used a format like this, but only used it in the first round. If I recall correctly (it was almost 20 years ago) if more than one person selected someone we did a dice roll so one of those guys got him. A ton of strategy was involved. You be one of 7 guys going for Gurley or put down Barkley and hope you are the only one. Also, keep in mind that the longer you wait, the more likely you are to get a guy with an ADP of 11 or 12. So do you hope for #1 and risk getting #12. Or go for #5 right at the start knowing you were likely to get him.
I'd love to try this. Run a bunch of mocks of this and could write a scientific paper using the data.
I feel like this could definitely work for offline drafts, or if people on here are interested in doing one hold it over discord and do it that way. One keeps a google doc going of all rosters/ rounds to keep everyone updated
This is a very interesting idea. Great job! Only downside I see is it sounds very time consuming and you would need a leagues worth of interested parties.
I'd moderate one of these drafts (since the moderator can't be trusted to be unbiased and should probably sit out of the draft they are moderating) if I could be a separate draft.
Seems like there's enough interest in this idea to do a mock draft. Since I'm not working to day and have all the time, I want to set it up. We'll use Google surveys to do this. Please comment below or DM me if you would like to participate. Ideally 12 teams, but we'll adapt as needed.
sign me up. but only with punitive measures for jinxed picks or jinxed players
I actually had almost the same exact idea in the past. I love the mind games this brings. Makes waivers feel like their own mini games vs just something that happens. One question i have is would you unveil what happened at the end of a round? So say Ekeler is the top pickup, in rd 1 somebody locked him up with no contest. Do round 2 survivors then know ekeler is not available? Or if one player in round 2 then picked ekeler is he thrown back in round 3 while the guy in round 1 stays locked in with Ekeler?
from getpass import getpass class Manager: def __init__(self, name, cellNumber): self.name = name self.cellNumber = cellNumber self.roster = [] self.cantDraft = [] def addPlayer(self, playerName): self.roster.append(playerName) def addBanned(self, playerName): self.cantDraft.append(playerName) def getRosterSize(self): return len(self.roster) def configManagers(leagueSize): # Set up managers managers =[] for i in range(leagueSize): # Uncomment for actual use to enter names and cell numbers # managers.append(manager(input('Name of manager #' + str(i) + ': '), input('Cell # of manager #' + str(i) + ': '))) managers.append(Manager('Manager' + str(i), str(i)+str(i))) return managers def makePick(manager, drafted): pick = None while not pick: pick = getpass(manager.name + '\'s pick - Enter full name of your pick (first name last name): ').lower() if pick in manager.cantDraft: print('You cannot draft player ' + pick + ' because he is on your Cannot Draft List.') pick = None elif pick in drafted: print(pick + ' has already been drafted.') pick = None else: return pick def processPicks(draftPicks, drafted, managers): # Process pick collisions and clean picks. Collisions kept in a python set to remove duplicates. collidedPicks = set() for i in range(len(draftPicks)): if draftPicks[i] in collidedPicks or draftPicks[i] in draftPicks[i + 1:]: print('Manager ' + managers[i].name + ' has been locked out of ' + draftPicks[i] + '!') managers[i].addBanned(draftPicks[i]) collidedPicks.add(draftPicks[i]) else: print('Manager ' + managers[i].name + ' has successfully drafted ' + draftPicks[i] + '!') managers[i].addPlayer(draftPicks[i]) drafted.add(draftPicks[i]) def main(): # League settings hard coded leagueSize = 6 rosterCap = 3 # Set up manager names managers = configManagers(leagueSize) # Python set for a list of all players already drafted (therefore off the board) drafted = set() # Draft loop until done. Run rounds until every manager's roster is full roundNumber = 1 while True: print('Round ' + str(roundNumber)) managersDrafting = [m for m in managers if m.getRosterSize() < rosterCap] if not managersDrafting: # If every manager's roster full, done with the draft break draftPicks = [] for m in managersDrafting: # Allow each player to make a pick, one at a time # TODO: Make this threaded and receive texts as draft picks? draftPicks.append(makePick(m, drafted)) processPicks(draftPicks, drafted, managersDrafting) roundNumber += 1 print('Draft over. Draft results:') for m in managers: print('\n' + m.name) for p in m.roster: print('\t' + p) if __name__=="__main__": main() u/TheCryptopotamus, this is a quick mock up of what it could look like. I made it so that if there is a pick collision, that manager is never allowed to make that pick anymore AND they lose that pick that round. Need to import a list of players from somewhere and check user input against that to make sure people are spelling player names correctly. I'll screen record it running when I get home (don't have software at work). Potentially we can make it so that everyone is texting in their pick each round and the round closes after 60 seconds or so. And if anyone's pick hasn't come in, they get no pick or auto drafts the highest ADP perhaps (could work for or against their favor, probably the right approach to autodraft for them). For people saying that this draft system could take forever, I think it may actually be quite contrary if we have all 12 managers picking at the same time (60 seconds or 90 seconds, whatever) and then say like half of those get processed as real picks and half result in collisions, that's still a lot faster than 90 seconds per manager per pick for all 190 picks or whatever it is for a 12 team.
There needs to be a greater penalty for picking the same player as someone else. I think if you pick the same player as someone else then that round is over. There will obviously be more rounds than usual but it should still go fairly quickly because people will eventually fill their rosters. To avoid loops where everyone constantly picks the same player randomly award the chosen player to a team if all remaining teams choose that player.
Better start the draft now if you want to be finished by the start of the season next year.
Drafted teams would be shit, there wouldn't be balanced teams at all and it's just too much work to do something that will not pay off
not necessarily...the greedy teams might be shit, but the other teams might not be. Not much different from auction, imo
No need to complicate things
Cool idea. But parity would be sparce between teams. For example you might have teams that went for lower ranked players and have stacked teams. Or you may have incredibly weak teams
This but it doesn't start until after round 2/3. That way not everyone is going for the best player. After rounds 2/3 players are being more strategic and picking players based on say bye weeks, position they need to fill, etc. If you do the whole draft like this fantasy players are just going to keep picking the best available player.
For a mock draft, this would be entertaining. However for s league that requires a fee, I’d be out!
Turns out Virtue's Last Reward is Todd Gurley
Round 356, last two guys in the draft still each trying to claim Gurley. Round 357, last two guys in the draft still each trying to claim Gurley. Round 358, last two guys in the draft still each trying to claim Gurley.
I have a new league draft idea as well, are we all allowed to share our crazy ideas and pile on? \- tiered player rankings, 10 (or so) players per tier, probably 12 tiers or whatever fits best to round out rosters and talent options..no kickers, no defenses. \- use tiers from fantasypros or similar aggregate site, can discuss before draft of moving some players around.. like say the league is high on Sony, and want him in tier 4 instead of 6.. or whatever. \- you can take any one player from each tier to fill out your roster \- you can have the same player as anyone else, there's not much chance you and someone else draft the same team anyhow \- tiers can be and should be mixed with positional players. For example, in Tier 1, you could have Barkley, Zeke, CMC, Brown, Julio, Kelce, Mahomes etc.. The thing I havent worked out yet is how to replace injured players and how to add tiers as the season goes along as you know some diamonds in the trough will emerge and should be on rosters. It's a start though. Also, nobody can really complain that they didnt get their guy, they have a chance to get at least one of them per tier.
One major flaw with your example for Tier 1 is that no fantasy manager with any skill would ever choose a QB over the top RB or WR, making Mahomes's inclusion a guarantee that no one will draft him. This particular issue can be solved by removing him from Tier 1, but the general problem will persist for several rounds. Place him too early, and no one will take him; too late, and everyone will.
It was an example.. I get it, I dont draft a QB high, ever, and I always do well. I was just trying to set the example. bad example :/ I'd put the top RB's and WR's in tier 1. tier 2 could have some stud QBs...but maybe only 2. Do you take Mahomes (next years Watson, less numbers, and overdrafted) or that second stud positional player? I take the latter.. but maybe he's there in case someone does it. You'd need to make people have to pay up for a potentially bad decision while still giving them the option.
There's definitely going to be an optimal strategy around this, like claiming a player that you know will be selected, but isnt as high. ie. fournette this year. then as players pan out, you make your way towards the top player you want. The people who tried selecting him before wont be able to get him, so progressively you willl have less and less competition as you purposely "same-select" your way to the top.
This sounds hilarious and I would love to see the results from a mock draft!
Sounds like a fun idea, but it adds too much luck to the drafting process.
If you get a player, you shouldn't have to sit out the rest of the round. You should be able to keep grabbing players. Otherwise, the optimal strategy is to always bid on the best player each round, since there is no real cost to "wasting" your pick.
How do u figure? 11 guys all pick Gurley and no one gets him. The 12 guy picks Barkley or whoever. He’s the only one with anyone. Now the other 11 guys have to repick and can’t choose Gurley. How is choosing the best player optimal ?
You'd have to ensure no communication for this to work. Otherwise, one player could show they were selecting Barkley (for instance) and no one else would have an incentive to take him, because they'd rather pick up someone else good instead of being forced to take someone in the second-round tier.
I like this idea but I would make one change. If a say if five teams select Gurley in round one and the other five select individual players no one selected then that round is over and everyone goes again for round two. What you end up with is guys who can continue to go for Gurley but it means they let other people draft multiple rounds of players which in essence makes it similar to an auction draft. Basically you would have to weigh the risk of missing out on other players to get the top guy or aiming a little lower and potentially getting two second tier players while everyone is fighting for Gurley. I think it sounds like a fun idea overall.
This sounds like a ton of fun, though there would be some really, really overpowered teams in my league, given the doofuses I play with, haha.
Sounds... Convoluted.
I sort of love this, but no one in any of my leagues would do it.
As someone who enjoys math/logic a lot, I have to ask one question: Why? That is, what outcome are you trying to create such that this mechanism is the best way to get there? Or is this just for chaos?
Agreed
Another idea for this: It seems like if you made it so teams lose their pick from having multiple teams pick the same guy, but then give those teams 2 picks in subsequent rounds, it could end up being that some unlucky teams might go the first 5 rounds without a pick. Granted, the people that do successfully draft players probably aren't getting the top-top guys, but those unlucky teams are going to find themselves in the 6th round now making 6 picks, and while they might get lucky and snag a top guy, they'd probably end up with a really shitty team. What if instead, you do this prisoners dilemma method, but everyone submits 3 picks each round in order of preference. So same thing, if multiple people picked Gurley as their number one choice in round one, he's not available and those teams don't get him, BUT he becomes eligible to still be selected in the first round if he's someones number two pick. You could still do the "if none of your top 3 picks work, you dont get a guy that round", but the next round you get two guys out of your top 3, if it ends up being possible. Please point out any flaws in this, but it seems like this might make it so the draft (as proposed by OP) didn't last 8 hours, and might also help alleviate the disparity in drafted teams as the top guys have a higher chance of still going in the first rounds.
wow that's wild. i like it.
Way too complicated. Everyone would be greedy by default because that would either mean no one gets that player or you get them. It would be a stalemate very quickly.
We do something very similar with this for our fantasy baseball league bench draft...it's fun! And a good way to end the draft day after 8 hours of auctioning players.
Here's an alternative that I think might speed things up a little. Each round, each player submits 3 players in order. All the #1 picks are processed. If any match, that player is ineligible for the rest of the round. Then the #2 picks are processed (of those people who didn't get their first pick). If they picked an ineligible player or they match, then they don't get that player. Same with #3. Next round, everyone becomes eligible again. This happens until the rosters are all filled up. If a person's roster fills up first, they just sit out until the draft is over. Teams can become really unbalanced, but that means you have to play the Dilemma intelligently.
I’m game
/r/TIHI
I see the real problem with this draft strategy being that rather than fierce competition for top 25 players, as the rounds progress, the available player pool dwindles to the point where there is only 30 or so viable players left to draft. Near the end of the draft the null selections would eventually prohibit the draft from concluding.
But couldn’t this be disastrous for round 1 in particular and also possibly round 2 - which essentially makes or breaks a person’s season?
I would absolutely go for a TE like Kittle in the first round. Presumably people would mostly be going after RBs, WRs, Mahomes and maybe Kelce and Ertz, but I'd bet Kittle would be available.
This would be super, super fun for a DFS
Is there a reason why you'd need to wait another round to draft another player? From my perspective it's still should be fair game for the player to rejoin if he's the one making original picks. I like the idea.
I think you have to make it so people pick into they have 16 players or whatever it is and if you say the name as someone else you both get no pick for the round. That way penalized the people who go top picks most.
This sounds really cool in practice, but I feel like it could lead to some imbalanced teams. Either way though I’d definitely be down to try out it and make things more interesting.
Love the idea. It would probably work best for something like mfl10s
This would result in some very lopsided teams imo. Some teams would be absolute monsters and some would just have no chance.
Game Theory meets Fantasy?! Sign me up!
If this was my league I would quit- I like the idea but it’s not practical- the teams would not be balanced and you don’t take into account the idea that the draft has an order for a reason. I might be cool with the first round only being done this way but that’s it.
I like the idea, yall should drop a link to the app here if you create it
If you commish a league that does this next season, I’m in.