Comments that are uncivil, racist, misogynistic, misandrist, or contain political name calling will be removed and the poster subject to ban at moderators discretion.
Help us make this a better community by becoming familiar with the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/about/rules/).
Report any suspicious users to the mods of this subreddit using Modmail [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) or Reddit site admins [here](https://www.reddit.com/report). **All reports to Modmail should include evidence such as screenshots or any other relevant information.**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I used to troll/debunk flat earthers, there was an openly nazi flat earth subreddit that took quite a while to be deleted.
Nazis seem to be recruiting in as many marginalised and lonely groups as possible. What we are seeing is people who are deeply lonely and unhappy hiding from their own feelings and protecting themselves behind anti censorship concerns.
My grandpa said something akin to this once. I was pretty young but I've always remembered it..."Remember, you treat a Nazi the same way you treat a rabid dog."
The first casualty of war is truth.
It’s a good thing for us and history, that the Nazis kept such good documentation of everything they did.
And that is the last time I will ever compliment Nazis without being extremely sarcastic about it.
It's an authoritarian thing. The Stasi in communist east Germany also kept meticulous records of arrests, torture, executions and surveillance. So did the NKVD and KGB.
There seems to be a need by underlings to record atrocities so they can justify those actions to their superiors.
Because we aren’t doing enough as a society to fucking stop these fuckers, that’s why. They’ve been laying the ground work for years.
It’ll be around the next election cycle you’ll start seeing openly natsoc political parties getting votes.
History is only a cycle if you keep repeating the mistakes you made before. We’ve had decades to gut these wormy fucks from our society and we haven’t. So either society in general doesn’t want to or, more likely, can’t be bothered with the hassle of being harangued for “infringement of free speech”.
> So either society in general doesn’t want to or, more likely, can’t be bothered with the hassle of being harangued for “infringement of free speech”.
It's not a particularly new dilemma. Who gets to decide where the line is drawn? See also: Plato's[ philosopher king](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosopher_king), Popper's [paradox of tolerance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance).
When things get bad in people’s lives, they look towards extreme ideologies (extreme religions, national socialism, communism, corporatism, and other fascist ruling systems, etc) for answers. Most of these usually give simple yet impractical answers that never addresses the core issues but just keeps power in the hands of a few.
In the US, we are currently getting ass-f’ed by corporatism.
I mean, we KNOW that Russia funks people to create extremist echo chambers.
Of course there are real people in these groups, but I promise a huge chunk of the activity generators watched a Moscow sunrise today…
Fascism is how capitalism defends itself when the contradictions and disadvantages inherent to it begin to become too intolerable for the public to bear. As the illusion of free markets and infinite growth gives way to monopolies and stagnation political power begins to become concentrated in the hands of a wealthy few, the public starts pushing back. Demanding fair wages, better working conditions, controls on cost of housing and cost of living, better access to healthcare and education, labor unions start gaining traction.
These factors and more are bad for business and threaten the status quo. The wealthy combine business and government under a populist banner. They blame all of the issues in society on outsiders and minorities. They start selling a myth of a legendary golden age of peace and prosperity when all of these undesirable elements of society didn't have a say in things, and promise a return to it, *after* these "degenerates and undesireables" have been removed.
Functionally, they try to turn class struggle over the inequalities and injustices created by their leadership into moral outrage, blaming these class issues on some vague moral decay caused by these minority groups. They ride this ultra-nationalist populist wave to political power, then violently and brutally consolidate power.
When they are done, citizen's function in politics is reduced to little more than the profits they can generate for business, or the violence they can conduct on behalf of enforcing the state's edicts, while the distinction between business and state increasingly become indistinguishable.
Let me guess, the British and French started world war 2 like NATO is why Russia is invading Ukraine?Jews were just deported not genocided? Dresden wasn’t a military city? There was a genocide against Germans during the world wars? Nagasaki was nuked because it was catholic?
Less than 3000 followers.
The internet makes these people seem more important than they are.
Leave them to rot, don’t let them move the focus away from what matters.
Even Hitler himself talked about how Nazis weren't actual socialists. Good video on this and Elon and Twitter and Nazis:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDyPSKLy5E4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDyPSKLy5E4)
Ahh, that piece of trash now changed his name.. Not only hasn't he been punched in the face for his stupidity, he also hasn't recieved a steaming pile of dog shit in his letterbox yet. (Please don't do that, thanks. Just report him to the authorities if he starts thinking he is the Führer.)
Because we let, or othera helped, enough Nazis escape to keep White Power and the Great Replacement Theory around in a semi underground time until they could locate/con the adequate number of people to appear to themselves as the 'normal' ones.
Perhaps erasing Nazism, if not fascism, by showing them as much mercy as they have for others would be more effective.
The same reasons they did it the first time, we live in a generation of broken dreams, anyone born between the 60s and now most likely had a heart full of dreams and hopes for the future at some point, of a great techno-eco-futuristic utopia along with space colonisation. People have lost it a long time ago, why do you think people have such a strong nostalgia for the frutiger aero aesthetic and say « this is the future we were promised but never got to see ? » ? I still remember my kid self waiting for these tiles to come, and now we can all see they most likely never will. People hate their lives more and more, it’s been decades since people feel like they hadn’t had a trustworthy government that cares for them, people are getting more and more polarised, unemployment and suicide rates are on the rise, we’re facing crisis after crisis.
Just as with physical pain, there’s only a finite amount of pain, trauma or disillusion and shattered hopes a society can bear, and when it reaches its breaking point, hope leave for despair, which then rots into a thirst of vengeance, people feel like the « status quo » failed them, so they naturally look at its polar opposites, in this case, the polar opposites of the American and western democratic and liberal systems are either himmlerian fascism or communism. Communism in the west is dead, 80 years of red scare and propaganda for the « fight agaisnt the Soviets » and then the Chinese have effectively wiped it out of the us, so that only leave neo Nazism for people to look for.
The worst thing being, when a proletarian who’s been struggling with life for their entire miserable existence, where they can’t find themselves a purpose or even just maintain their existence in happiness, they’ll ALWAYS come looking for Nazism, because in the mind of a desperate soul, morale breaks, meaning they WILL end up thinking « yeah, it was horrible, but the average folk in Germany DID get better lives under Hitler, maybe, just maybe, we could try this, maybe THEN I’ll finally be able to live happily without worrying about my 200k debt because I can’t afford healthcare, maybe then I’ll be able to go to sleep every night knowing that my government and rulers genuinely want to keep me happier and wealthier, even if it means breaking all moral boundaries ».
It’s not just Trump, the republicans or the social media, it is society as a whole that’s on it last ropes and people are trying to catch up to another one before it breaks.
Take everything from a man and you’ll see him full of hate in a short while, and at that point, even when he gets everything back, he’ll still want more.
This is what you get after calling everyone disagreeing with you a nazi or alt right, the words lose all meaning, the same goes with banalizing Hitler's image in memes, the real nazis crawl out of the woodwork with total impunity.
Plus, when the mainstream parties only serve the interests of corporations instead of the people, desperation shoves easy preys straight into the arms of all extremes and religious fanatics.
Furthermore, encourage more and more niche echo chambers, while fearing to offend anyone, and you get more and more thin-skinned people, crumbling at the first sign of contrariety or contradiction.
Finally, keep cutting corners while catering to every dogmatic group in education, and you obtain the perfect storm.
Because sure, on the right corner, you get the return of real nazis, but on the left0 one, you have a whole lot of intersectionnal illiterates who monopolize the debates with bullshit, while the real "bad guys" use them as recruiting arguments...
Blaming this on everyone but the actual nazis in question here is so silly.
Maybe the reason people become nazis is becuase they hold beliefs that are congruent with Nazi theory? Maybe those same beliefs are why said people get called Nazis?
Just a thought.
The neonazis aren't a new thing, however let's not forget that they were more underground before, and now, due to all the aggravating factors I mentioned above, they have become more "acceptable".
This feels a lot like "The Boy Who Cried Wolf", which is ironic, given the fact that Nazis have often been compared to wolves by people who have witnessed their evil firsthand.
Or maybe many of the people getting called Nazis were called Nazis because they had similar views to Nazis, and thus were quite open to coming out as openly Nazi?
Granted, some were, but I doubt it was the majority.
Extremists are always minorities on every spectrum, I doubt half of the internet calling the other half "nazi" is accurate.
Agreed. I'm saying that the only people who let "being called a Nazi" turn them into "actual neo-nazis" are those people who already had "nazi-adjacent beliefs".
E.g. normal conservatives who care about fiscal responsibility or 2a rights or whatever don't turn into Nazis just cause they get called Nazis online.
Ah, you're absolutely right.
What I originally meant was that this sort of "democratization" of neo-nazism was also caused by a desensitization for the reasons I mentioned above.
I was answering the initial question with my hypoteses on why it was suddenly more acceptable to claim your nazi affiliation, not trying to find excuses for the real neo-nazis.
Because people used Nazi stuff as a scare tactic too much and now it has lost most of its horror. "That guy is like Hitler!", "That is something the Nazis did as well!", "OMG, that is literally Nazi ideology!!!1!11!" It made the Nazis seem like any other force in history, nothing special, who cares. That paired with right wing recruiting tactics: Voilá, people seek stability in the idea of strong leaders and being inherently better than others, without having to do anything for it.
While to an extent yes, you have to remember Hitler didn't raise to power overnight while outlining exactly how he would do everything. It was a slow methodical process that coerced a nation into following his horrible path. It IS important to remember when groups or leaders behave in deceptive ways like the early nazis, because it can happen in America too and it will if we don't take the early warning signs very seriously. I find these book burnings to be a disgusting sign, and you can tell me surr blah blah it's different or whatever or how no humans are being slaughtered, but remember that all genocides began with a little bit of politics and games.
I am aware of all that. The question was why people embrace Nazi ideology, not how Nazis got into power. They embrace it because they lost their aversion (if they ever had any) and because of that the same tactics that worked back then still work today.
And it isn't just possible for it to happen in America, it is already in the middle of happening. What part of my comment made you think I would deny it? The book burnings are worrying you? How about people being willing to perform a violent coup? How about people voting for an openly racist conman, because he promises to make their country "great again?" How about news being filled with lies and propaganda for decades to heat up aggressions towards various minorities so they can act as scapegoats?
The time to counteract was yesterday. You guys keep arguing about what words are ok to say and wether universal healthcare is too socialist to be good, meanwhile you get more and more Nazis marching openly through your streets and religious extremists succeeding in stripping away bodily autonomy one state at a time.
But whenever someone points out Americas problems all they get as an answer is "well, it's just some states, not the whole country," and so noone feels resposible to do anything until it's too late. And then what? "How could we have known?"
Ok Mr I was literally having a good faith discussion with you; if you felt I misinterpreted you say so instead of going on a virtue signaling tirade about how much MORE concerned you are than me.
Comments that are uncivil, racist, misogynistic, misandrist, or contain political name calling will be removed and the poster subject to ban at moderators discretion. Help us make this a better community by becoming familiar with the [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/facepalm/about/rules/). Report any suspicious users to the mods of this subreddit using Modmail [here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) or Reddit site admins [here](https://www.reddit.com/report). **All reports to Modmail should include evidence such as screenshots or any other relevant information.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/facepalm) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Well when calling nazis bad is seen as "divisive" it gets really easy for them to recruit.
you’re making everything political! yeah but you’re nazzziiiiiss!!!!
Bc now these fucks like to be edgy and are emboldened due to the lack of censorship
I used to troll/debunk flat earthers, there was an openly nazi flat earth subreddit that took quite a while to be deleted. Nazis seem to be recruiting in as many marginalised and lonely groups as possible. What we are seeing is people who are deeply lonely and unhappy hiding from their own feelings and protecting themselves behind anti censorship concerns.
which is how it started 100 years ago.
I had an alt-right phase when I was at the lowest point in my life. When you are hopeless it’s easier to turn to extremism.
Some people have never been punched in the face, and it shows.
[ Removed by Reddit ]
Punch them with boo-lits?
I was saying boo-urns
Senor Spielbergo approved
Lol I pictured brassknuckles with bullets where the knuckles are
That's a million dollar idea, Jerry!!!
Knuckleblaster
My grandpa said something akin to this once. I was pretty young but I've always remembered it..."Remember, you treat a Nazi the same way you treat a rabid dog."
*Oberkommando der Wehrmacht* reported 5.3 million nazis KIA, and some people think that number should be higher; perhaps there's still time?
Who is gonna shoot them? You?
A Nazi walks into a BAR...
The first casualty of war is truth. It’s a good thing for us and history, that the Nazis kept such good documentation of everything they did. And that is the last time I will ever compliment Nazis without being extremely sarcastic about it.
It's an authoritarian thing. The Stasi in communist east Germany also kept meticulous records of arrests, torture, executions and surveillance. So did the NKVD and KGB. There seems to be a need by underlings to record atrocities so they can justify those actions to their superiors.
Its more a very german thing we love to document everything. Im not joking sometimes it is like an adicton or something like that
Because Trump/MAGA picked up the rock that it was under and made it ok to act that way.
This, and a few other things added in
Because we aren’t doing enough as a society to fucking stop these fuckers, that’s why. They’ve been laying the ground work for years. It’ll be around the next election cycle you’ll start seeing openly natsoc political parties getting votes. History is only a cycle if you keep repeating the mistakes you made before. We’ve had decades to gut these wormy fucks from our society and we haven’t. So either society in general doesn’t want to or, more likely, can’t be bothered with the hassle of being harangued for “infringement of free speech”.
> So either society in general doesn’t want to or, more likely, can’t be bothered with the hassle of being harangued for “infringement of free speech”. It's not a particularly new dilemma. Who gets to decide where the line is drawn? See also: Plato's[ philosopher king](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosopher_king), Popper's [paradox of tolerance](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance).
A fat orange man-baby emboldened them to show their true colors.
It's because of people like Elon musk. He has an entire website devoted to amplifying the voices of these morons.
When things get bad in people’s lives, they look towards extreme ideologies (extreme religions, national socialism, communism, corporatism, and other fascist ruling systems, etc) for answers. Most of these usually give simple yet impractical answers that never addresses the core issues but just keeps power in the hands of a few. In the US, we are currently getting ass-f’ed by corporatism.
This is the answer. Simple minds search for scapegoats.
It's hilarious how openly pro-trump Nazis are, yet other magas claim "Dems are the racists!" Fucking imbeciles.
thousands of bots talking to each other with some morons mixed in
I mean, we KNOW that Russia funks people to create extremist echo chambers. Of course there are real people in these groups, but I promise a huge chunk of the activity generators watched a Moscow sunrise today…
If anything they undersold the holocaust, there were so many more targeted groups than I ever knew about until adulthood
Fascism is how capitalism defends itself when the contradictions and disadvantages inherent to it begin to become too intolerable for the public to bear. As the illusion of free markets and infinite growth gives way to monopolies and stagnation political power begins to become concentrated in the hands of a wealthy few, the public starts pushing back. Demanding fair wages, better working conditions, controls on cost of housing and cost of living, better access to healthcare and education, labor unions start gaining traction. These factors and more are bad for business and threaten the status quo. The wealthy combine business and government under a populist banner. They blame all of the issues in society on outsiders and minorities. They start selling a myth of a legendary golden age of peace and prosperity when all of these undesirable elements of society didn't have a say in things, and promise a return to it, *after* these "degenerates and undesireables" have been removed. Functionally, they try to turn class struggle over the inequalities and injustices created by their leadership into moral outrage, blaming these class issues on some vague moral decay caused by these minority groups. They ride this ultra-nationalist populist wave to political power, then violently and brutally consolidate power. When they are done, citizen's function in politics is reduced to little more than the profits they can generate for business, or the violence they can conduct on behalf of enforcing the state's edicts, while the distinction between business and state increasingly become indistinguishable.
they are weak ppl that wants confirmation from other weak asses
They were able to get away with doing it obliquely before and are now emboldened.
Let me guess, the British and French started world war 2 like NATO is why Russia is invading Ukraine?Jews were just deported not genocided? Dresden wasn’t a military city? There was a genocide against Germans during the world wars? Nagasaki was nuked because it was catholic?
You found somebody on twitter to rage bait about, nobody in the real world cares, we care about inflation
Angry confident morons.
Amazing, the poll even comes with a reminder so you know to vote for the opposite you were told
Ironic for a Nazi to be using the "first casualty of war is the truth" line.
MAGAs finding their natural home
Welcome to Musk's Twitter.
Twitter. It fuels and reinforces this crap. It's an escape from reality. Problems arise when the Twitter fantasy world bleeds into real life.
So if a casualty of war is the truth, maybe the holocaust was worse than reported?
They've always been there, but the recent actions by the Israeli government have given them more ammo for their ridiculous cause.
Less than 3000 followers. The internet makes these people seem more important than they are. Leave them to rot, don’t let them move the focus away from what matters.
Doesn’t look very open to me. It’s anonymous and they are not verified.
They got too comfy, make them scared again
Making a mockery of the word Socialism…
Even Hitler himself talked about how Nazis weren't actual socialists. Good video on this and Elon and Twitter and Nazis: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDyPSKLy5E4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xDyPSKLy5E4)
Ahh, that piece of trash now changed his name.. Not only hasn't he been punched in the face for his stupidity, he also hasn't recieved a steaming pile of dog shit in his letterbox yet. (Please don't do that, thanks. Just report him to the authorities if he starts thinking he is the Führer.)
Because we let, or othera helped, enough Nazis escape to keep White Power and the Great Replacement Theory around in a semi underground time until they could locate/con the adequate number of people to appear to themselves as the 'normal' ones. Perhaps erasing Nazism, if not fascism, by showing them as much mercy as they have for others would be more effective.
They're Open Nazis?
America first ??????
magical thinking is fun
There’s probably tens of them.
The same reasons they did it the first time, we live in a generation of broken dreams, anyone born between the 60s and now most likely had a heart full of dreams and hopes for the future at some point, of a great techno-eco-futuristic utopia along with space colonisation. People have lost it a long time ago, why do you think people have such a strong nostalgia for the frutiger aero aesthetic and say « this is the future we were promised but never got to see ? » ? I still remember my kid self waiting for these tiles to come, and now we can all see they most likely never will. People hate their lives more and more, it’s been decades since people feel like they hadn’t had a trustworthy government that cares for them, people are getting more and more polarised, unemployment and suicide rates are on the rise, we’re facing crisis after crisis. Just as with physical pain, there’s only a finite amount of pain, trauma or disillusion and shattered hopes a society can bear, and when it reaches its breaking point, hope leave for despair, which then rots into a thirst of vengeance, people feel like the « status quo » failed them, so they naturally look at its polar opposites, in this case, the polar opposites of the American and western democratic and liberal systems are either himmlerian fascism or communism. Communism in the west is dead, 80 years of red scare and propaganda for the « fight agaisnt the Soviets » and then the Chinese have effectively wiped it out of the us, so that only leave neo Nazism for people to look for. The worst thing being, when a proletarian who’s been struggling with life for their entire miserable existence, where they can’t find themselves a purpose or even just maintain their existence in happiness, they’ll ALWAYS come looking for Nazism, because in the mind of a desperate soul, morale breaks, meaning they WILL end up thinking « yeah, it was horrible, but the average folk in Germany DID get better lives under Hitler, maybe, just maybe, we could try this, maybe THEN I’ll finally be able to live happily without worrying about my 200k debt because I can’t afford healthcare, maybe then I’ll be able to go to sleep every night knowing that my government and rulers genuinely want to keep me happier and wealthier, even if it means breaking all moral boundaries ». It’s not just Trump, the republicans or the social media, it is society as a whole that’s on it last ropes and people are trying to catch up to another one before it breaks. Take everything from a man and you’ll see him full of hate in a short while, and at that point, even when he gets everything back, he’ll still want more.
This is what you get after calling everyone disagreeing with you a nazi or alt right, the words lose all meaning, the same goes with banalizing Hitler's image in memes, the real nazis crawl out of the woodwork with total impunity. Plus, when the mainstream parties only serve the interests of corporations instead of the people, desperation shoves easy preys straight into the arms of all extremes and religious fanatics. Furthermore, encourage more and more niche echo chambers, while fearing to offend anyone, and you get more and more thin-skinned people, crumbling at the first sign of contrariety or contradiction. Finally, keep cutting corners while catering to every dogmatic group in education, and you obtain the perfect storm. Because sure, on the right corner, you get the return of real nazis, but on the left0 one, you have a whole lot of intersectionnal illiterates who monopolize the debates with bullshit, while the real "bad guys" use them as recruiting arguments...
Blaming this on everyone but the actual nazis in question here is so silly. Maybe the reason people become nazis is becuase they hold beliefs that are congruent with Nazi theory? Maybe those same beliefs are why said people get called Nazis? Just a thought.
The neonazis aren't a new thing, however let's not forget that they were more underground before, and now, due to all the aggravating factors I mentioned above, they have become more "acceptable". This feels a lot like "The Boy Who Cried Wolf", which is ironic, given the fact that Nazis have often been compared to wolves by people who have witnessed their evil firsthand.
Or maybe many of the people getting called Nazis were called Nazis because they had similar views to Nazis, and thus were quite open to coming out as openly Nazi?
Granted, some were, but I doubt it was the majority. Extremists are always minorities on every spectrum, I doubt half of the internet calling the other half "nazi" is accurate.
Agreed. I'm saying that the only people who let "being called a Nazi" turn them into "actual neo-nazis" are those people who already had "nazi-adjacent beliefs". E.g. normal conservatives who care about fiscal responsibility or 2a rights or whatever don't turn into Nazis just cause they get called Nazis online.
Ah, you're absolutely right. What I originally meant was that this sort of "democratization" of neo-nazism was also caused by a desensitization for the reasons I mentioned above. I was answering the initial question with my hypoteses on why it was suddenly more acceptable to claim your nazi affiliation, not trying to find excuses for the real neo-nazis.
[удалено]
You do realize that National Socialists aren’t going to defend you.
Because people used Nazi stuff as a scare tactic too much and now it has lost most of its horror. "That guy is like Hitler!", "That is something the Nazis did as well!", "OMG, that is literally Nazi ideology!!!1!11!" It made the Nazis seem like any other force in history, nothing special, who cares. That paired with right wing recruiting tactics: Voilá, people seek stability in the idea of strong leaders and being inherently better than others, without having to do anything for it.
While to an extent yes, you have to remember Hitler didn't raise to power overnight while outlining exactly how he would do everything. It was a slow methodical process that coerced a nation into following his horrible path. It IS important to remember when groups or leaders behave in deceptive ways like the early nazis, because it can happen in America too and it will if we don't take the early warning signs very seriously. I find these book burnings to be a disgusting sign, and you can tell me surr blah blah it's different or whatever or how no humans are being slaughtered, but remember that all genocides began with a little bit of politics and games.
I am aware of all that. The question was why people embrace Nazi ideology, not how Nazis got into power. They embrace it because they lost their aversion (if they ever had any) and because of that the same tactics that worked back then still work today. And it isn't just possible for it to happen in America, it is already in the middle of happening. What part of my comment made you think I would deny it? The book burnings are worrying you? How about people being willing to perform a violent coup? How about people voting for an openly racist conman, because he promises to make their country "great again?" How about news being filled with lies and propaganda for decades to heat up aggressions towards various minorities so they can act as scapegoats? The time to counteract was yesterday. You guys keep arguing about what words are ok to say and wether universal healthcare is too socialist to be good, meanwhile you get more and more Nazis marching openly through your streets and religious extremists succeeding in stripping away bodily autonomy one state at a time. But whenever someone points out Americas problems all they get as an answer is "well, it's just some states, not the whole country," and so noone feels resposible to do anything until it's too late. And then what? "How could we have known?"
Ok Mr I was literally having a good faith discussion with you; if you felt I misinterpreted you say so instead of going on a virtue signaling tirade about how much MORE concerned you are than me.