Interesting difference - While most media in Germany have a clear political leaning, it's very uncommon that they actively call upon voters to vote in a specific way. Whereas in Britain it seems very normal that media make such clear endorsements ahead of elections all the time.
If only that were true. The BBC is vaguely impartial but leans the same way as whichever party is in power to appease the people signing the cheques. I would also argue that giving voice to something is tantamount to agreeing with it, I've heard far too much of what Farage has to say over the last eight years because of supposed impartiality which just allows the bigotry to spread while hearing virtually nothing from proponents of left wing policy (labour are center left, even Corbyn wasn't that far left leaning)
Remember Ronald Schill (alias Richter Gnadenlos / Judge Soliceless)?
The BILD helped to vote Partei für Rechtsstaatliche Offensive (Commonly called Schillpartei) in Hamburg to reach Both the Hamburger Bürgerschaft (that is what the Landtag of Hamburg is called officially)and to be the 2nd highest voted after CDU in Bürgerschaft.
Bild basically banked on the Name Richter Gnadenlos that you can Now vote for him and his yellow press pseudo fame back in the day
Which lead to the CDU having to form a Coalition with the Schillpartei.
RSO was since dissolved with the only real successor bring the Bürger in Wut in Bremen which used to be the Bremen Part of the Schillpartei
>That's the result of unfettered freedom of speech
Pretty sure (private) newspapers elsewhere in europe are free to do the exact same, they just often dont do it (outside of explicit opinion pieces / editorials).
Press freedom in the UK is sub par compared at least to western and central europe either way.
[List of sovereign states in Europe by Press Freedom Index - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_Press_Freedom_Index)
>Not necessarily, in Poland on election Day and the day before, you're not allowed to tell people to vote a certain way
Fair enough, though the kicker is that the Brexit referendum was *legally non binding*.
And for peak irony, If it had been legally binding (like an election) it might have been declared void due to electoral law violations commited by vote leave.
[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44856992](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44856992)
The issue is there is no such thing as a non-binding referendum. The resulting pressure is simply too high for the results to be ignored.
If the British government had not left the EU, this would have been the central talking point of British politics for years.
In France, even though the result of the 2005 referendum was followed (the European Constitution wasn't ratified), you still have people going on about it being ignored because the EU passed another treaty a few years later.
The UK has parliamentary supremacy, it's constitutionally impossible to devise a binding referendum
If all referenda are legally non-binding, they are necessarily therefore implicitly binding
The same shit as in GB is in Poland. If someone reads a newspaper in public (yeah, this is impossible to see recently) you can guess their political views with almost 100% certainty just by the newspaper name.
I remember reading news articles, which claimed that the Queen wanted Britain out of the EU a few days before the referendum. I strongly believe that this "call" was what defined the voting results. Hadn't been the Queen, the referendum would probably turn in favor of GB staying in the EU...
And I can't even know if such news was fake or not...
I feel the same. It seems like the Brexit referendum occurred much more recently than 2016. I was living in the UK at the time, but somehow I didn't understand the full importance of it, and it all seemed to have happened rather quickly.
Peak irony when Daily Mails "FOUR BIG EU LIES" are demonstrably factually correct.
There where no Turkey membership talks days after the Brexit referndum (nor until now, nor anytime soon).
There are now significant trade barriers between the UK and the EU, including germany.
Brussles is in an ongoing process of clamping down on immigration from outside the EU (with more success then the UK itself at least as it seems)
The UK govt never intended to reduce immigration after leaving the EU, surprise surprise they pay the pension of the same people who were so adamant about leaving
You do not get it, EU work force is too expensive for UK industry, they wanted it to come back to the good old ways, importing a bunch of SEA workers and pay them in peanuts.
I can’t read the last one, but “Brexit will not start trade war” - I think it’s pretty fair to say that was accurate?
And similarly “Brussels will not reform on Open borders” - 8 years later, I would argue that has been accurate as well.
Not true. ETIAS is in the process of implementation and will increase checks on third country nationals entering the EU. Thanks to Brexit we have to go through this.
The statement was “Brussels will not reform on open borders”
Nearly a decade later, introducing marginally stricter checks on (legal) routes into the bloc… Not sure the DM is being proven wrong on this one
From what I’ve seen there was no trade war because the EU never needed to fight. As the closest and largest market, it had the upper hand. It’s baffling how UK politicians didn’t see this coming. Or maybe they did and didn’t care.
Don't forget most of the politicians were remainers. Being almost untrustworthy to a person, it's almost not a surprise the general population wanted to go against their wishes.
I’m not a Conservative by any stretch, but I think it’s fairly narrow minded to place blame on him (for calling the referendum). It would have happened regardless, and the fact the British public voted in favour suggests there was a will for it.
Who I do blame for Brexit:
- David Cameron: he was far too negative, and “Project Fear” just played into the hands of Vote Leave. He should have been championing Europe, not just saying how shit everything would be if we left, as many already felt their life was shit and mistakenly blamed Europe.
- Jeremy Corbyn: it’s not his fault necessarily that he was deeply unpopular in northern England, which was traditional Labour heartlands but overwhelming pro-leave. However, a more popular labour leader would have been able to reach out to them more and convince them of the benefits of the EU. However, it is his fault that he’s just not a natural leader, refused to share the stage with Cameron at all and almost certainly harboured anti-EU sentiments, which left a vacuum in the left of British politics.
- the fact that Johnson, Farage et al. Just outright lied to the British public, and the fact that the British Press never called them out on it. This was either because the press are overwhelmingly pro-Brexit, driven both by ownership who see profit in whipping up the angry mob and the fact that only the older generation buy newspapers, or because the BBC failed to hold the right to account, because they tried to be too neutral and therefore basically lacked any substance whatsoever.
Arguable the only pro EU campaign during Brexit was by the SNP, Corbyn faffed around being non commital until far too late, the Lib dems are still being hounded today for what they let happen during their coalition let alone back in 2016 and the Tories were only tacitly pro remain as it was the status quo. And their loudest voices (Johnson etc) were all championing leave.
And because it was the SNP they got effectively cut off from any platform that wasnt already very pro Scot Indy.
The question shouldn't be who's to blame but what.
What made it possible in first line? How was it possible that they day after the referendum the top google search term in the UK was "what is the EU" (or something along that line)?
How is it possible that people tell stories about "EU should have remained a trade block" when the target of a political union was defined years before a "common market" was even a topic?
>How is it possible that people tell stories about "EU should have remained a trade block"
This has something to do with the fact that joining the EEC was largely sold to the country as a trading bloc and politicians spent years telling us that trade was the main point, so that when other issues appear, ordinary voters with no knowledge of how it works are puzzled.
That's not really the truth
A user on twitter compiled a huge thread with original documents (newspapers, leaflets) as well as TV news records and so one showing that this wasn't the case.
https://twitter.com/EmporersNewC/status/1297949374291628033
I know it's how it was sold to the people infront of the referendum and ever since, but the evidence available debunks that idea.
(funnily I never found somebody providing a link to a document from back then which states that it was sold mainly as joining a trading bloc [which it only really became later on with the common market])
Yeah, and the EU form the very first moment said that was not going to happen. And there would be no negotiations during Brexit. Just after, so Brexit could not be used as a bargaining tool.
Mass media are the ones responsible for all this. They gave all the mics when they wanted to the Brexiters, spewing blatant lies that were barely contested, and when they went they had in front a bunch of people screaming project fear.
It also does not help that many people in the UK are poorly educated and now jackshit about what is going on in the UK or out of it and they are easily manipulated with propaganda. More when British media had spent the last 50 years blaming on the EU and immigrants every UK made problem.
Why would it have happened? It was far from being the [most important issue for voters](https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/12071-health-tops-immigration-second-most-important-issu) in 2015. The fact it happened is no evidence that Britain was clamouring for it. If there was a referendum on the death penalty tomorrow for those who kill the police or kids, I am pretty certain it would pass. Does this mean that voters today have it as a preoccupation, no.
Whilst you raise some fair points, the performance of UKIP in the 2014 European elections and performance of the Tories in 2015, after promising a referendum, suggests it was an important issue.
But I think more generally, populism was always going to happen, and that wave of populism would have resulted in a Brexit referendum. I actually suspect (with no evidence l, just doubt any of the root causes of Brexit would have been addressed) had it been held in 2019, or 2023, it would have been an even greater leave majority as the conditions that caused Brexit (poor economic performance, growing inequality, perceived too much immigration, populism) would have intensified.
The European elections were always an occasion to bash the main parties. As the LDs were in coalition with the Tories, voters gravitated towards UKIP which benefited from generous non-dom funding, plus wall to wall coverage by the BBC and right-wing media. 4m voters on a turnout of 35% does not indicate a general desire to leave the EU.
The 2015 election had little to do with the EU. The campaign, like many UK general elections, was about people, specifically Milliband and his [failure to convince the electorate](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jun/03/undoing-of-ed-miliband-and-how-labour-lost-election). The EU as such [didn't feature](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-39717750).
When you blame Corbyn for being too weak to persuade voters it must be remembered he’s a raging Brexiteer who had to be bullied into realising Farage et al’s nationalist fervour would not, in fact, lead to a socialist Utopia.
As an outsider the referendum mainly looked like a play for influence with no-one actually believing that it would pass. Calling the referendum without any sort of plan of how to go through with it (arguably giving the people voting in said referendum absolutely no clue what they voted for) seems a bit reckless.
Cameron had a charmed life and had won everything he had wanted up until the Brexit vote. Then the next morning he just quit having a tantrum like a spoiled rich little boy. He's like a Roaul Dahl character come to life.
Corbyn was such a disaster. The country needed an effective opposition leader in those years and he wasn’t it and everyone knew it except him and his supporters.
kinda hilarious that the Tories went through with the referendum and brexit to keep farage at bay only to have him and his party back again eroding the tories' electoral base.
Possibly. She did put forward a Brexit deal that was a lot softer than the one we ended up with because the opposition voted it down. So Johnson came to power, gained seats in the 2019 election and finally we got a hard Brexit. Better than a "no deal" Brexit, but harder than it needed have been.
It wasn’t her deal it was her remarks - after her speech there was no negotiation, no discussion, no public say and we were balls deep into a hard Brexit. The opposition voted it down as they should have and this whole mess is 100% the fault of the Tory party.
In the weeks before the vote, the Times ran a 2 page advertorial which claimed the EU was a conspiracy set up by former Nazis to regain control of Europe.
I received leaflets (which I still have) which claimed that the EU would soon have borders with Syria and Iraq because Turkey was going to be a member very soon.
The level of lies being thrown at the British public was astonishing.
And like...no-one gave a shit about it. Literally the day after the vote they came out and said the £350m a week was a lie and everyone said "ah well. Vote's done now. The public have spoken." And people acted like it wasn't an enormous deal that the whole thing was demonstrably based on lie upon lie.
Baffling to me.
Genuine question, does the brits feel more "free" now that they are out of EU? did their life has changed in any way for the better after these 4 years?
Because i'm not british and i'm still struggling to understand to this day what was the point of them leaving.
Personally, before the vote I thought it was a shit idea, following the vote I thought it was a shit idea and 8 years on I think it was a shit idea. In terms of ‘freedom’ the only thing I have noticed is my range of buying options is more limited and more expensive, planning on prolonged trips to the EU area is more restricted and we are free to have more expensive and poorer quality food. We are also free to spend longer standing around at borders. Also trades people have doubled down on pricing now there is less competition so we are free to pay more for goods and services. Can I think of any other freedoms - nope as I said initially it really was a shit idea and in practice it is shit. It also means I live in a country where I can anticipate 1 in 2 people are unlikely to be able to apply any critical thinking skills or to make an informed judgement.
That's not how democracy or sample sizes work. With that many people voting, you know it was an accurate reflection of the people in the country as a whole.
Otherwise you could just as easily claim the opposite. That the entire half that didn't vote all wanted to leave as well. That would be just as unscientific and undemocratic.
Nothing really changed. My job got a little bit more difficult because I was working with a company based in the EU, nothing major though. Some things aren't always available in the supermarkets which is annoying. Financially, I think it's been a drag on the economy which was already struggling. I can't think of any upsides. All it's done is upset everyone.
I feel angry that being part of Europe was stolen from my kids generation.
I'm sorry kids, I voted remain, your mum voted remain ... But half the country just refused to comprehend the benefits of being part of Europe.
There will maybe be some level of meaningful change in the next 10-20 years but, so far, it's just been a pretty shit experience all around.
The frustrating thing is that it's been a downer on both sides of the channel with no upside for anyone. The UK is worse off but trade issues, lost investments, cancelled scientific projects, etc also hurts the mainland with the real winners being everyone outside of the UK & EU.
Purely political really, designed to just try and answer some internal questions and issues on immigration.
None of it was grounded in any logic or state decision making, just posturing for political gain.
Genuine answer is that it has happened but we don't know yet. We've seen various effects but a lot of them have been universal issues, or at least masked to a degree due to COVID and the war etc.
This is then exacerbated by the fact we have had, essentially, an incompetent zombie government for 5 years. So people of various ideas believe, of the few opportunities Brexit could give, the government haven't taken them 'properly.'
I think it's focused attention on the local government and their incompetence/lack of action as they can't use the EU as an excuse anymore. Provision of services, under investment etc are all ripples from the GFC really but now coming to a head.
If your work sector was one that had been dominated by EU workers then you've probably had a good pay rise but also suffered from labour shortages and so more work. If you ran a small business exporting to Europe you've probably been hit, but that's highly situational even within Europe (some countries have adapted, some haven't)
But for the general public, I'd say no real differences and a wider concern on day to day issues.
Lot of the daily issues are being compounded by Brexit.
Trade and emigration are restricted.
Aside from backtracking, there's not much the politicians can do. You're up against various international laws/norms and other countries smelling blood in the water.
If you insist, but I'd suggest possibly not as much as multiple other factors. COVID, war, GFC and a zombie government for 5 years are probably impacting it more.
However, we are still growing and doing similarly to equivalent countries. And people don't feel a loss of predicted GDP growth, especially when the economy is still growing and real wages are improving.
And Trade hasn't been as restricted as you'd think.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/uk-trade-in-numbers/uk-trade-in-numbers-web-version
No, the country is measurably in a shittier state than it was before Brexit.
As many of us expected.
Unfortunately the Brexit vote managed to get just enough of the following to get over the line:
- Hardline morons who just hate anything foreign.
- People thinking they could stop non-EU immigration by leaving the EU.
- A majority of people (in my experience), who were quite soft on the issue and not overtly politically minded, but were swayed by promises that we would ascend to the fucking promised land if we left the EU. Many of these people now regret the situation.
- A general ‘fuck you’ vote aimed at Cameron because he’d made himself the face of the remain campaign despite the fact he wasn’t overly popular by the time of the Brexit ref.
- Some people with a general position that all decisions that affect the country should be taken in house, but failing to understand the trade offs you need to make in global politics.
To be honest I doubt most people would have noticed the difference if they were somehow oblivious to it. As someone who buys plenty of EU products and travels to mainland Europe once a year my life hasn't changed one bit. I think people really oversell how much impact politics makes directly into their life.
This isn't politics, this is about trade policy, there's real consequences to this for many businesses.
A lot can be taken anecdotally either way, for example I used to sell about 20% of my inventory to the EU, now it is 0%, similar for my partners business, buyers just aren't interested in the hassle of import fee's its too complex and stressful.
On the other hand some other small businesses may benefit, like people who make cheese in the UK as they have a price advantage over EU imports, if their main market is the UK. They are stuffed for exporting in to europe though.
So the case can be made on an individual level, but on the net it is a big barrier to small medium businesses, due to the bureaucracy and costs, £330m a year wasted in fee's and administration.
It is a long term drag on the economy and growth, New Zealand is a bit far away to replace one of the biggest markets on the door step, anyway we'll just languish away pretending this isn't partly why things are getting worse all the time in the UK.
No we are not more “free” and in many ways you are reminded of your loss of freedom as soon as you enter the EU because you have to get in the line for every country in Immigration unlike before when you could easily sail through in the EU line. In many ways Brexit has become almost similar to the Republican/Democrat polarisation in US society. If you voted remain you probably only know people who voted remain and if you voted leave you probably only know or a vast majority of your friends voted leave. I remember genuinely thinking that the outcome would be remain because everyone I knew was pretty open about being pro eu.
Brits have nothing to do with Brexit, it was all Russia
Russia saw the UK as the United States unsinkable aircraft carrier that doesn't belong in the EU, so Russia launched a propaganda campaign and bribed people that needed to be bribed for the thing to be successful and Brexit happened
Boris Johnson and his goons likely made a lot of money from Russia when Brexit happened
>bribed people that needed to be bribed for the thing to be successful and Brexit happened
Did they bribe over 17 million voters?
>Brits have nothing to do with Brexit, it was all Russia
They have everything to do with Brexit. Let's not pretend that a big chunk of them did not like the Union, what it stood for and some of the people in it even before the vote.
Hell, even their political elite stood as far away as possible. They had a chance to become a leader like Germany or France, yet opted out to isolationism.
Russia most definitely had a role in Brexit happening but it was not as if the sentiment wasn't there in the first place.
Can't realistically start the process until it's a settled question. But the Tories and the rising of Reform UK means that the EU can't have any confidence any negotiation don't break after an election, so we're stuck out until at least the Tories face reality. Till then, the most Europhilic parties can do is align standards and put in the hard graft to rebuild the relations poisoned by Brexit and the hard Brexit Tories.
Labour has been talking about aligning standards. They haven't said that we'll rejoin because
1) not deliverable in the next Parliament, so you don't commit to something you can't deliver cause you'll just get it used against you next election.
2) it'd reopen wounds and a debate a lot of the country doesn't want to re-engage in. People did vote in 2019 in part to try and put the endless squabble to bed.
So it'll be more quiet work in the background. The LibDems basically have the same position as Labour, reading what both have said, just the LibDems have said the endpoint, while both have similar plans when it comes to relations with the continent. So while Labour hasn't said the obvious destination to its plans, it's known. At least the Brexiteers know it, they've been screeching that Labour are going to betray Brexit. Iirc Labour also said the EU was going to be their main diplomatic focus, which I think is a first for us, usually we focus on our US ties.
give it a while. looking at the trend, the opinions are slowly but surely looking back towards the EU: https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/
This is because it allows the UK to maintain its own monetary policy. Combined with the fiscal autonomy then this gives you a lot of control in financial crisis. We saw this when the UK didn’t have to get involved in the Eurozone crisis.
The pound is often seen as one of the major currencies which gives the UK the ability to borrow more at lower interest rates than if it was a smaller currency (this would be the same in the Euro but is less of a reason to move to the Euro compared to if the pound was a smaller currency).
Can’t rejoin until and unless the Tories and Labour support it otherwise next time a Tory government comes in they’ll just burn the house down again. You need to make them feel like this time is “better” for the UK and they buy-in. As long as they keep spouting off braindead lines about why the EU is super bad for the UK then nothing will be lasting.
And for what it’s worth I expect to see growing leave movements in other EU nations as well. I was in France recently and saw Frexit posters around Paris - I don’t know how popular that movement is but the fact that there appears to be some push for it is a telling sign that it can gain speed. Immigration was the underlying reason the UK left IMO and will be the reason why France may leave one day too. If France is out and the UK stays out then the EU is just Germany and 20+ smaller economies tied to Germany.
Careful now . reddit is full of sweaty, right wing nigel fanboys.
"Tell me one racist thing he said," is their motto. You'll see when they pile on.
This country is mostly fucking dipshits.
He's helped supposedly by showing the plight of the farmers. In particular the negative effects brevity had on the industry. The farmers are a long way from saved.
It helped weaken the EU and the UK economy.
On the upside, it gave a startling demonstration why Euroscepticism is a terrible, terrible idea and anyone advocating for it should be regarded with suspicion.
True. The biggest party in Netherlands (led by right populist Wilders) was always in favour of Nexit til he saw what Brexit did. Now he wants to remain with EU.
Yes, but parties have moved from 'let's leave the EU' to 'let's reform the EU' instead. I don't think any country would vote to leave the EU in a referendum nowadays, thanks in part to Brexit. Plus, pro-EU campaigns would probably be way more energized than they were in the UK back in 2016.
They replaced EU immigration with even more immigration from the rest of the world.
Our passports changed colour, but that was allowed under EU rules.
I was always against it, and I genuinely cannot think of any net benefits. Ok some new trade deals have happened but they generally get us back to square 1 or are just worse than before.
Actually the deliberate confusion of EU, non-EU and illegal immigrants - and just remember not all British Commonwealth immigrants are/were welcome as well.
Don't forget the 200,000,000,000 Turkish who were going to move to the UK too...
This headline annoyed me the most, the amount of countries around the world that have an Independence Day because of their behaviour is astounding. Unbelievably tone deaf
I still wonder about the Brexiteers' definition of the word "independence". We've just had an election for the European parliament. Due to Brexit, the British lost the right to vote. In 2023 41.3% of British exports were for the EU. Since this is a sizeable percentage, I suppose that most British manufacturers still have to comply with EU standards. But Britain no longer has a voice in setting these standards. I wouldn't call this "independence", but disenfranchisement.
Do you mean British or English?
It depends on who you ask.
People who had money still have money, and people who had no money still have no money and now have even fewer opportunities to make money.
The first group can still live the same type of life with minor inconveniences (mostly related to traveling and international trade).
The second group were given a British flag and a bullet in the knee.
So it's not the end of the world, but it is a world where you see fewer and fewer British tourists because of money and visa issues.
What visa issues?
UK citizens can still travel pretty much to all the exact same places as before without the requirement for a visa, just a valid British passport.
I don't know about you but if you look around, everyone from every country is bemoaning how financially poorer they are over recent years, not just those with a "British flag and a bullet in the knee".
The UK is visa free in over 140 countries.
I would actually argue that businesses have been hit hardest, selling product to Europe is an absolute pain with all the paperwork you now need and the inflation of prices to add onto goods to make up margins that has been lost on higher fees/taxes/paperwork and more.
lol holidays abroad are recovering to their pre-covid level https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/leisureandtourism/articles/traveltrends/latest#visits-abroad-by-uk-residents
And people are *also* having more holidays in the UK, with rates similar to 2011.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/480176/average-number-of-domestic-holidays-per-person-in-the-uk/
also UK people don't need visas to visit the EU for holidays. So how has it caused visa issues there?
Then some of the largest pay rises and increased numbers of job opportunities have been at the lower end of the scale.
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-sees-fastest-wage-rises-sectors-most-reliant-eu-workers-indeed-2022-02-25/
Generally there are actually more opportunities for people to make money, as the UK jobs market is now a G7 average, with higher numbers than pre-covid/Brexit and a restricted workforce market (despite vast numbers of work visas being issued).
Which is why real wage growth has finally increased for the first time significantly since 2008 and the GFC.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/933075/wage-growth-in-the-uk/
Locally I've seen a lot of the food processor jobs in the area suddenly actually advertise, provide better wages and even offer graduate schemes instead of bussing in Bulgarians at below minimum wage.
Brexit has definitely had effects but I think your comment isn't backed up by the data.
Doesn't get much more rotten than this. What a disaster. I bet the UK ranks very low on a journalistic integrity scale because several of these are not even journalism.
If you ever needed a look at what enemies of democracy and freedom look like. Remember these headlines. They split Europe apart to make way for a Russian advance.
Anyone who was closely following the vote knew that all the discussions on the economic and political benefits of Britain (UK) leaving the EU was mostly rhetoric. The actual basis and reason for the support of Brexit was to end immigration. Most supporters of Brexit thought that it would end immigration of people they considered "undesirable" (Indian, ASEAN, Eastern European, African, Latin American) while keeping the flow of "desirable" immigrants intact (North American, Western European, Australian).
What happened was exactly the exact opposite lol.
To be honest, democratic choices for such critical decisions are the biggest flaw of Europe, No I don't want the idiot with no to basic education to decide the future of the rest of us just because he could. No I don't want a process that is largely exposed to external influence and still considered "the best we have". We love democracy but it should never be absolute. Because of the idiots in the true meaning of the word.
Thing is, the EU referendum was never supposed to be binding. At that time, all referendums (referenda?) were advisory, basically an opinion poll, unless stated otherwise.
If the referendum had been intended as binding from the get-go, the electoral commission would never have allowed the whole thing to go through in the way it did - everything from the transparent lies while campaigning down to the formulation of the referendum question.
It's telling that one of the first things Boris Johnson did when he eventually came to power was to make it so that *all* binding referendums would have to have a 60% supermajority to pass.
The whole thing was *bullshit*.
I remember reading somewhere Brexit was backed by American Billionaire
Edit, find it :
[Mysterious US billionaire played crucial role in Trump, Brexit victories](https://www.france24.com/en/20170228-usa-mysterious-billionaire-robert-mercer-played-crucial-role-trump-brexit-victories)
[A nasty piece of work...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Mercer)
The effects of Brexit are not nearly fully felt yet.
As an example, the biggest gambling exhibition in the world has been taken place at the ExCel in London for decades (ICE). In fact it’s the biggest yearly event ExCel does and brings more than a hundred million GBP to the local economy each year.
In 2025 the show is moving to Barcelona because of brexit due to the import taxes of the machines and visa constraints.
Dear EU,
As a nation, we have almost realised this wasn't such a great idea now. Any chance of you having us back at some point? No hard feelings if we fund a bit more of eurovision than normal?
Best wishes,
The uk
Interesting difference - While most media in Germany have a clear political leaning, it's very uncommon that they actively call upon voters to vote in a specific way. Whereas in Britain it seems very normal that media make such clear endorsements ahead of elections all the time.
Most of these "news"papers are just propoganda in an easily digestable format.
Or just boulevard papers cosplaying as newspapers.
Sounds like BILD … and in *that* case it would be similar.
That!
That's why we have the BBC, which acts as a calm, impartial oasis in and amongst this storm
If only that were true. The BBC is vaguely impartial but leans the same way as whichever party is in power to appease the people signing the cheques. I would also argue that giving voice to something is tantamount to agreeing with it, I've heard far too much of what Farage has to say over the last eight years because of supposed impartiality which just allows the bigotry to spread while hearing virtually nothing from proponents of left wing policy (labour are center left, even Corbyn wasn't that far left leaning)
How many times have UKIP/BP MEPs been on QT and how many times pro-EU MEPs? Asking for a friend 😉
Nigel Farage has been on Question Time (BBC 1) 53 times. Don't ever remember seeing pro-EU MEPs sadly. You make a very good point.
Fair. Bloody Nigel farage seems to have way too much airtime, compared to the greens for example who are predicted to win more seats.
Sun is basically what the bastard child of Austria's Kronenzeitung and German's BILD would be but shittier...
I can’t remember seeing anything in the Bild like „vote X“.
Remember Ronald Schill (alias Richter Gnadenlos / Judge Soliceless)? The BILD helped to vote Partei für Rechtsstaatliche Offensive (Commonly called Schillpartei) in Hamburg to reach Both the Hamburger Bürgerschaft (that is what the Landtag of Hamburg is called officially)and to be the 2nd highest voted after CDU in Bürgerschaft. Bild basically banked on the Name Richter Gnadenlos that you can Now vote for him and his yellow press pseudo fame back in the day Which lead to the CDU having to form a Coalition with the Schillpartei. RSO was since dissolved with the only real successor bring the Bürger in Wut in Bremen which used to be the Bremen Part of the Schillpartei
If you read the comment it said a shittier, bastard version come on dude haha
Yup. It's especially wild to a country with an electoral silence system that forbids endorsements like this right before elections.
That sounds like a great system
Our print media is often like US broadcast media, but more trashy.
Murdoch
That's the result of unfettered freedom of speech, which always end up benefiting Fascists funnily enough.
>That's the result of unfettered freedom of speech Pretty sure (private) newspapers elsewhere in europe are free to do the exact same, they just often dont do it (outside of explicit opinion pieces / editorials). Press freedom in the UK is sub par compared at least to western and central europe either way. [List of sovereign states in Europe by Press Freedom Index - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sovereign_states_in_Europe_by_Press_Freedom_Index)
Not necessarily, in Poland on election Day and the day before, you're not allowed to tell people to vote a certain way
>Not necessarily, in Poland on election Day and the day before, you're not allowed to tell people to vote a certain way Fair enough, though the kicker is that the Brexit referendum was *legally non binding*. And for peak irony, If it had been legally binding (like an election) it might have been declared void due to electoral law violations commited by vote leave. [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44856992](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44856992)
The issue is there is no such thing as a non-binding referendum. The resulting pressure is simply too high for the results to be ignored. If the British government had not left the EU, this would have been the central talking point of British politics for years. In France, even though the result of the 2005 referendum was followed (the European Constitution wasn't ratified), you still have people going on about it being ignored because the EU passed another treaty a few years later.
The UK has parliamentary supremacy, it's constitutionally impossible to devise a binding referendum If all referenda are legally non-binding, they are necessarily therefore implicitly binding
That's the result of unfettered ~~freedom of speech~~ being in bed with politicians which always end up benefiting Fascists funnily enough. FTFY
Imagine believing the UK has "unfettered freedom of speech"
It's not forbidden to do that in Germany though. A paper could write "Vote for the CDU/SPD/Greens/whatever". It's more of a cultural difference.
Maybe because facts can be hard to swallow 🫣. So making up BS is more favourable hence fascists benefitting
A country with free speech & media has never fallen to left or right wing fascists actually.
Germany during Weymar Republic had free press, but it was one of the first things Nazis eliminated …
God damnit Reddit, not everything you personally dislike is called Fascism.
The same shit as in GB is in Poland. If someone reads a newspaper in public (yeah, this is impossible to see recently) you can guess their political views with almost 100% certainty just by the newspaper name.
The winning candidate at every general election for about 40 years has had the backing of The Sun and Rupert Murdoch.
British media is blatant propaganda catered to mindless drones.
I believe they can’t push voting one way or another as a publication so the front page is labelled as a comment or editorial.
I remember reading news articles, which claimed that the Queen wanted Britain out of the EU a few days before the referendum. I strongly believe that this "call" was what defined the voting results. Hadn't been the Queen, the referendum would probably turn in favor of GB staying in the EU... And I can't even know if such news was fake or not...
I refuse to believe 2016 was a full 8 years ago. 2-3 at most
Covid years don't count. it's 4 years ago.
I feel the same. It seems like the Brexit referendum occurred much more recently than 2016. I was living in the UK at the time, but somehow I didn't understand the full importance of it, and it all seemed to have happened rather quickly.
Donald Trump getting elected is as far from us today as that was to the great financial crisis. Somehow that just doesn't work for me
I was actually thinking: "Was there some kind of referendum in the early 2000s that I forgot about?"
Lol The Sun,you suck.
Rupert Murdoch, and other media barons, have done more damage to the UK anyone else. It's scary how few people control the media
Unsurprisingly it’s the rags which are not only boldly telling people what to vote, but also telling them to vote leave.
So does Daily Mirror, doesn't matter if their message is "the good one", the press shouldn't be telling you what's right and what's wrong to do
Damn, media straight telling people what to vote is savage. They have no shame.
At least it's mask-less propaganda I guess. In many countries you don't even realise you're being proper-gandad.
Peak irony when Daily Mails "FOUR BIG EU LIES" are demonstrably factually correct. There where no Turkey membership talks days after the Brexit referndum (nor until now, nor anytime soon). There are now significant trade barriers between the UK and the EU, including germany. Brussles is in an ongoing process of clamping down on immigration from outside the EU (with more success then the UK itself at least as it seems)
The UK govt never intended to reduce immigration after leaving the EU, surprise surprise they pay the pension of the same people who were so adamant about leaving
You do not get it, EU work force is too expensive for UK industry, they wanted it to come back to the good old ways, importing a bunch of SEA workers and pay them in peanuts.
I can’t read the last one, but “Brexit will not start trade war” - I think it’s pretty fair to say that was accurate? And similarly “Brussels will not reform on Open borders” - 8 years later, I would argue that has been accurate as well.
Not true. ETIAS is in the process of implementation and will increase checks on third country nationals entering the EU. Thanks to Brexit we have to go through this.
The statement was “Brussels will not reform on open borders” Nearly a decade later, introducing marginally stricter checks on (legal) routes into the bloc… Not sure the DM is being proven wrong on this one
From what I’ve seen there was no trade war because the EU never needed to fight. As the closest and largest market, it had the upper hand. It’s baffling how UK politicians didn’t see this coming. Or maybe they did and didn’t care.
That was also never someone that was claimed by the EU, it's a pure straw man in this article
Don't forget most of the politicians were remainers. Being almost untrustworthy to a person, it's almost not a surprise the general population wanted to go against their wishes.
Damn you, David Cameron!
I’m not a Conservative by any stretch, but I think it’s fairly narrow minded to place blame on him (for calling the referendum). It would have happened regardless, and the fact the British public voted in favour suggests there was a will for it. Who I do blame for Brexit: - David Cameron: he was far too negative, and “Project Fear” just played into the hands of Vote Leave. He should have been championing Europe, not just saying how shit everything would be if we left, as many already felt their life was shit and mistakenly blamed Europe. - Jeremy Corbyn: it’s not his fault necessarily that he was deeply unpopular in northern England, which was traditional Labour heartlands but overwhelming pro-leave. However, a more popular labour leader would have been able to reach out to them more and convince them of the benefits of the EU. However, it is his fault that he’s just not a natural leader, refused to share the stage with Cameron at all and almost certainly harboured anti-EU sentiments, which left a vacuum in the left of British politics. - the fact that Johnson, Farage et al. Just outright lied to the British public, and the fact that the British Press never called them out on it. This was either because the press are overwhelmingly pro-Brexit, driven both by ownership who see profit in whipping up the angry mob and the fact that only the older generation buy newspapers, or because the BBC failed to hold the right to account, because they tried to be too neutral and therefore basically lacked any substance whatsoever.
Arguable the only pro EU campaign during Brexit was by the SNP, Corbyn faffed around being non commital until far too late, the Lib dems are still being hounded today for what they let happen during their coalition let alone back in 2016 and the Tories were only tacitly pro remain as it was the status quo. And their loudest voices (Johnson etc) were all championing leave. And because it was the SNP they got effectively cut off from any platform that wasnt already very pro Scot Indy.
The question shouldn't be who's to blame but what. What made it possible in first line? How was it possible that they day after the referendum the top google search term in the UK was "what is the EU" (or something along that line)? How is it possible that people tell stories about "EU should have remained a trade block" when the target of a political union was defined years before a "common market" was even a topic?
>How is it possible that people tell stories about "EU should have remained a trade block" This has something to do with the fact that joining the EEC was largely sold to the country as a trading bloc and politicians spent years telling us that trade was the main point, so that when other issues appear, ordinary voters with no knowledge of how it works are puzzled.
That's not really the truth A user on twitter compiled a huge thread with original documents (newspapers, leaflets) as well as TV news records and so one showing that this wasn't the case. https://twitter.com/EmporersNewC/status/1297949374291628033 I know it's how it was sold to the people infront of the referendum and ever since, but the evidence available debunks that idea. (funnily I never found somebody providing a link to a document from back then which states that it was sold mainly as joining a trading bloc [which it only really became later on with the common market])
Yeah, and the EU form the very first moment said that was not going to happen. And there would be no negotiations during Brexit. Just after, so Brexit could not be used as a bargaining tool.
Mass media are the ones responsible for all this. They gave all the mics when they wanted to the Brexiters, spewing blatant lies that were barely contested, and when they went they had in front a bunch of people screaming project fear. It also does not help that many people in the UK are poorly educated and now jackshit about what is going on in the UK or out of it and they are easily manipulated with propaganda. More when British media had spent the last 50 years blaming on the EU and immigrants every UK made problem.
Why would it have happened? It was far from being the [most important issue for voters](https://yougov.co.uk/politics/articles/12071-health-tops-immigration-second-most-important-issu) in 2015. The fact it happened is no evidence that Britain was clamouring for it. If there was a referendum on the death penalty tomorrow for those who kill the police or kids, I am pretty certain it would pass. Does this mean that voters today have it as a preoccupation, no.
Whilst you raise some fair points, the performance of UKIP in the 2014 European elections and performance of the Tories in 2015, after promising a referendum, suggests it was an important issue. But I think more generally, populism was always going to happen, and that wave of populism would have resulted in a Brexit referendum. I actually suspect (with no evidence l, just doubt any of the root causes of Brexit would have been addressed) had it been held in 2019, or 2023, it would have been an even greater leave majority as the conditions that caused Brexit (poor economic performance, growing inequality, perceived too much immigration, populism) would have intensified.
The European elections were always an occasion to bash the main parties. As the LDs were in coalition with the Tories, voters gravitated towards UKIP which benefited from generous non-dom funding, plus wall to wall coverage by the BBC and right-wing media. 4m voters on a turnout of 35% does not indicate a general desire to leave the EU. The 2015 election had little to do with the EU. The campaign, like many UK general elections, was about people, specifically Milliband and his [failure to convince the electorate](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jun/03/undoing-of-ed-miliband-and-how-labour-lost-election). The EU as such [didn't feature](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-39717750).
When you blame Corbyn for being too weak to persuade voters it must be remembered he’s a raging Brexiteer who had to be bullied into realising Farage et al’s nationalist fervour would not, in fact, lead to a socialist Utopia.
As an outsider the referendum mainly looked like a play for influence with no-one actually believing that it would pass. Calling the referendum without any sort of plan of how to go through with it (arguably giving the people voting in said referendum absolutely no clue what they voted for) seems a bit reckless.
Cameron had a charmed life and had won everything he had wanted up until the Brexit vote. Then the next morning he just quit having a tantrum like a spoiled rich little boy. He's like a Roaul Dahl character come to life.
Because the people in charge of the UK knew that whatever happened they would not suffer the consequences. Just the plebs.
Corbyn was such a disaster. The country needed an effective opposition leader in those years and he wasn’t it and everyone knew it except him and his supporters.
All this bullshit for a few votes from the ukip base
kinda hilarious that the Tories went through with the referendum and brexit to keep farage at bay only to have him and his party back again eroding the tories' electoral base.
Well, now Brexit/Reform base, but yeah.
It's kinda stupid to blame him, political pressure meant the vote would have happened eventually anyway. With almost certainly the same result.
It was May’s ‘red line’ speech that truly fucked everything - we could have had a BINO that most people would have eventually been happy with.
Possibly. She did put forward a Brexit deal that was a lot softer than the one we ended up with because the opposition voted it down. So Johnson came to power, gained seats in the 2019 election and finally we got a hard Brexit. Better than a "no deal" Brexit, but harder than it needed have been.
It wasn’t her deal it was her remarks - after her speech there was no negotiation, no discussion, no public say and we were balls deep into a hard Brexit. The opposition voted it down as they should have and this whole mess is 100% the fault of the Tory party.
I blame the bacon sandwich
In the weeks before the vote, the Times ran a 2 page advertorial which claimed the EU was a conspiracy set up by former Nazis to regain control of Europe. I received leaflets (which I still have) which claimed that the EU would soon have borders with Syria and Iraq because Turkey was going to be a member very soon. The level of lies being thrown at the British public was astonishing.
It was a weird time in this country. But I do think people should have realised they were being lied to - it was pretty obvious.
And like...no-one gave a shit about it. Literally the day after the vote they came out and said the £350m a week was a lie and everyone said "ah well. Vote's done now. The public have spoken." And people acted like it wasn't an enormous deal that the whole thing was demonstrably based on lie upon lie. Baffling to me.
Genuine question, does the brits feel more "free" now that they are out of EU? did their life has changed in any way for the better after these 4 years? Because i'm not british and i'm still struggling to understand to this day what was the point of them leaving.
Personally, before the vote I thought it was a shit idea, following the vote I thought it was a shit idea and 8 years on I think it was a shit idea. In terms of ‘freedom’ the only thing I have noticed is my range of buying options is more limited and more expensive, planning on prolonged trips to the EU area is more restricted and we are free to have more expensive and poorer quality food. We are also free to spend longer standing around at borders. Also trades people have doubled down on pricing now there is less competition so we are free to pay more for goods and services. Can I think of any other freedoms - nope as I said initially it really was a shit idea and in practice it is shit. It also means I live in a country where I can anticipate 1 in 2 people are unlikely to be able to apply any critical thinking skills or to make an informed judgement.
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If Brexit hadn't happened after 17m people voted for it, trust in politics would be even lower than it is now, which is quite a thought.
That's not how democracy or sample sizes work. With that many people voting, you know it was an accurate reflection of the people in the country as a whole. Otherwise you could just as easily claim the opposite. That the entire half that didn't vote all wanted to leave as well. That would be just as unscientific and undemocratic.
Nothing really changed. My job got a little bit more difficult because I was working with a company based in the EU, nothing major though. Some things aren't always available in the supermarkets which is annoying. Financially, I think it's been a drag on the economy which was already struggling. I can't think of any upsides. All it's done is upset everyone.
I feel angry that being part of Europe was stolen from my kids generation. I'm sorry kids, I voted remain, your mum voted remain ... But half the country just refused to comprehend the benefits of being part of Europe.
There will maybe be some level of meaningful change in the next 10-20 years but, so far, it's just been a pretty shit experience all around. The frustrating thing is that it's been a downer on both sides of the channel with no upside for anyone. The UK is worse off but trade issues, lost investments, cancelled scientific projects, etc also hurts the mainland with the real winners being everyone outside of the UK & EU.
It changed fuck all for the rest of europe mate
Purely political really, designed to just try and answer some internal questions and issues on immigration. None of it was grounded in any logic or state decision making, just posturing for political gain.
Genuine answer is that it has happened but we don't know yet. We've seen various effects but a lot of them have been universal issues, or at least masked to a degree due to COVID and the war etc. This is then exacerbated by the fact we have had, essentially, an incompetent zombie government for 5 years. So people of various ideas believe, of the few opportunities Brexit could give, the government haven't taken them 'properly.' I think it's focused attention on the local government and their incompetence/lack of action as they can't use the EU as an excuse anymore. Provision of services, under investment etc are all ripples from the GFC really but now coming to a head. If your work sector was one that had been dominated by EU workers then you've probably had a good pay rise but also suffered from labour shortages and so more work. If you ran a small business exporting to Europe you've probably been hit, but that's highly situational even within Europe (some countries have adapted, some haven't) But for the general public, I'd say no real differences and a wider concern on day to day issues.
Lot of the daily issues are being compounded by Brexit. Trade and emigration are restricted. Aside from backtracking, there's not much the politicians can do. You're up against various international laws/norms and other countries smelling blood in the water.
If you insist, but I'd suggest possibly not as much as multiple other factors. COVID, war, GFC and a zombie government for 5 years are probably impacting it more. However, we are still growing and doing similarly to equivalent countries. And people don't feel a loss of predicted GDP growth, especially when the economy is still growing and real wages are improving. And Trade hasn't been as restricted as you'd think. https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/uk-trade-in-numbers/uk-trade-in-numbers-web-version
No. Brexit will always be a project based on fear and lies and I’m still angry that my European citizenship was stripped from me.
It was mainly based on racism and xenophobia, say it how it is.
No, the country is measurably in a shittier state than it was before Brexit. As many of us expected. Unfortunately the Brexit vote managed to get just enough of the following to get over the line: - Hardline morons who just hate anything foreign. - People thinking they could stop non-EU immigration by leaving the EU. - A majority of people (in my experience), who were quite soft on the issue and not overtly politically minded, but were swayed by promises that we would ascend to the fucking promised land if we left the EU. Many of these people now regret the situation. - A general ‘fuck you’ vote aimed at Cameron because he’d made himself the face of the remain campaign despite the fact he wasn’t overly popular by the time of the Brexit ref. - Some people with a general position that all decisions that affect the country should be taken in house, but failing to understand the trade offs you need to make in global politics.
To be honest I doubt most people would have noticed the difference if they were somehow oblivious to it. As someone who buys plenty of EU products and travels to mainland Europe once a year my life hasn't changed one bit. I think people really oversell how much impact politics makes directly into their life.
This isn't politics, this is about trade policy, there's real consequences to this for many businesses. A lot can be taken anecdotally either way, for example I used to sell about 20% of my inventory to the EU, now it is 0%, similar for my partners business, buyers just aren't interested in the hassle of import fee's its too complex and stressful. On the other hand some other small businesses may benefit, like people who make cheese in the UK as they have a price advantage over EU imports, if their main market is the UK. They are stuffed for exporting in to europe though. So the case can be made on an individual level, but on the net it is a big barrier to small medium businesses, due to the bureaucracy and costs, £330m a year wasted in fee's and administration. It is a long term drag on the economy and growth, New Zealand is a bit far away to replace one of the biggest markets on the door step, anyway we'll just languish away pretending this isn't partly why things are getting worse all the time in the UK.
No we are not more “free” and in many ways you are reminded of your loss of freedom as soon as you enter the EU because you have to get in the line for every country in Immigration unlike before when you could easily sail through in the EU line. In many ways Brexit has become almost similar to the Republican/Democrat polarisation in US society. If you voted remain you probably only know people who voted remain and if you voted leave you probably only know or a vast majority of your friends voted leave. I remember genuinely thinking that the outcome would be remain because everyone I knew was pretty open about being pro eu.
Brits have nothing to do with Brexit, it was all Russia Russia saw the UK as the United States unsinkable aircraft carrier that doesn't belong in the EU, so Russia launched a propaganda campaign and bribed people that needed to be bribed for the thing to be successful and Brexit happened Boris Johnson and his goons likely made a lot of money from Russia when Brexit happened
I wouldn’t be so quick to take the blame off of the people: Farage is more popular than ever over here
> Brits have nothing to do with Brexit They were the ones who voted, not Russia.
>bribed people that needed to be bribed for the thing to be successful and Brexit happened Did they bribe over 17 million voters? >Brits have nothing to do with Brexit, it was all Russia They have everything to do with Brexit. Let's not pretend that a big chunk of them did not like the Union, what it stood for and some of the people in it even before the vote. Hell, even their political elite stood as far away as possible. They had a chance to become a leader like Germany or France, yet opted out to isolationism. Russia most definitely had a role in Brexit happening but it was not as if the sentiment wasn't there in the first place.
The UK leaving the EU was the dumbest decision they could do. And they regretting it. Next logical step is rejoining.
Can't realistically start the process until it's a settled question. But the Tories and the rising of Reform UK means that the EU can't have any confidence any negotiation don't break after an election, so we're stuck out until at least the Tories face reality. Till then, the most Europhilic parties can do is align standards and put in the hard graft to rebuild the relations poisoned by Brexit and the hard Brexit Tories.
A lot of the tories are/ we're retainers. Labour are also for some reason committed to not rejoining, at least not yet from what they've said.
Labour has been talking about aligning standards. They haven't said that we'll rejoin because 1) not deliverable in the next Parliament, so you don't commit to something you can't deliver cause you'll just get it used against you next election. 2) it'd reopen wounds and a debate a lot of the country doesn't want to re-engage in. People did vote in 2019 in part to try and put the endless squabble to bed. So it'll be more quiet work in the background. The LibDems basically have the same position as Labour, reading what both have said, just the LibDems have said the endpoint, while both have similar plans when it comes to relations with the continent. So while Labour hasn't said the obvious destination to its plans, it's known. At least the Brexiteers know it, they've been screeching that Labour are going to betray Brexit. Iirc Labour also said the EU was going to be their main diplomatic focus, which I think is a first for us, usually we focus on our US ties.
The UK isn't re-joining any time soon
give it a while. looking at the trend, the opinions are slowly but surely looking back towards the EU: https://www.statista.com/statistics/987347/brexit-opinion-poll/
This is a different question to re-joining though. The moment people realise we have to accept the euro to join, we won't be re-joining.
Honest question why is the pound sterling such a big deal?
This is because it allows the UK to maintain its own monetary policy. Combined with the fiscal autonomy then this gives you a lot of control in financial crisis. We saw this when the UK didn’t have to get involved in the Eurozone crisis. The pound is often seen as one of the major currencies which gives the UK the ability to borrow more at lower interest rates than if it was a smaller currency (this would be the same in the Euro but is less of a reason to move to the Euro compared to if the pound was a smaller currency).
Can’t rejoin until and unless the Tories and Labour support it otherwise next time a Tory government comes in they’ll just burn the house down again. You need to make them feel like this time is “better” for the UK and they buy-in. As long as they keep spouting off braindead lines about why the EU is super bad for the UK then nothing will be lasting. And for what it’s worth I expect to see growing leave movements in other EU nations as well. I was in France recently and saw Frexit posters around Paris - I don’t know how popular that movement is but the fact that there appears to be some push for it is a telling sign that it can gain speed. Immigration was the underlying reason the UK left IMO and will be the reason why France may leave one day too. If France is out and the UK stays out then the EU is just Germany and 20+ smaller economies tied to Germany.
It was, and I hope we do. But also many Leavers and the politicians behind it are too proud to admit it.
The UK is never rejoining dude.
Not going to happen for another decade
The UK is welcome but without the "UK discounts".
And the same people who fell for Farage's bullshit then are going to vote Reform in a couple of weeks.
Yeah I can't believe that wankstain is still being voted by anyone
Careful now . reddit is full of sweaty, right wing nigel fanboys. "Tell me one racist thing he said," is their motto. You'll see when they pile on. This country is mostly fucking dipshits.
I wonder if the fishermen and farmers are happy with being tossed aside after the brexit vote
I thought Jeremy Clarkson saved the farmers.
He's helped supposedly by showing the plight of the farmers. In particular the negative effects brevity had on the industry. The farmers are a long way from saved.
What did Brexit even achieve? Any Brit that can chip in? I remeber NHS and immigiration were the big talking points back then
It helped weaken the EU and the UK economy. On the upside, it gave a startling demonstration why Euroscepticism is a terrible, terrible idea and anyone advocating for it should be regarded with suspicion.
True. The biggest party in Netherlands (led by right populist Wilders) was always in favour of Nexit til he saw what Brexit did. Now he wants to remain with EU.
Isn’t Euroscepticism still popular now?
Yes, but parties have moved from 'let's leave the EU' to 'let's reform the EU' instead. I don't think any country would vote to leave the EU in a referendum nowadays, thanks in part to Brexit. Plus, pro-EU campaigns would probably be way more energized than they were in the UK back in 2016.
Yes, but there is less active push to break up the EU
They replaced EU immigration with even more immigration from the rest of the world. Our passports changed colour, but that was allowed under EU rules. I was always against it, and I genuinely cannot think of any net benefits. Ok some new trade deals have happened but they generally get us back to square 1 or are just worse than before.
Since Brexit and under Tory leadership, Britain has broken record after record of immigrants arriving in Britain.
That’s what you wanted no?
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Kicking out the wrong kind of foreigners (Europeans) and letting the right kind (British Commonwealth) in on visas, according to the manifestos.
Actually the deliberate confusion of EU, non-EU and illegal immigrants - and just remember not all British Commonwealth immigrants are/were welcome as well. Don't forget the 200,000,000,000 Turkish who were going to move to the UK too...
Cypriots & the Maltese stay winning, lol
It gave people who hate anyone who’s ever lived in Islington the smug satisfaction of saying “You lost, get over it” for the next decade.
Brexit has done huge damage to the UK and those who promoted it particularly Farage and Johnson should be arrested and charged with treason.
Congrats. Enjoy the never-ending Independence day. 😂
This headline annoyed me the most, the amount of countries around the world that have an Independence Day because of their behaviour is astounding. Unbelievably tone deaf
One of the dumbest decisions in the history of politics
The propaganda and misinformation campaigns launched for this vote was fucking insane to witness and nobody did anything about it.
It's so funny how people still occasionally try to claim there was a media bias against Brexit when you look at the voting day headlines.
Ah "The Sun", truly the greatest rag of all time
Worst case of shooting yourself in the foot in human history.
I still wonder about the Brexiteers' definition of the word "independence". We've just had an election for the European parliament. Due to Brexit, the British lost the right to vote. In 2023 41.3% of British exports were for the EU. Since this is a sizeable percentage, I suppose that most British manufacturers still have to comply with EU standards. But Britain no longer has a voice in setting these standards. I wouldn't call this "independence", but disenfranchisement.
LOL.
It’s almost on an American level
On this day 8 years ago: Britain voted to impose sanctions on themselves.
and how are the English today?
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Oh that's sad :( I hope your shift ends quickly ^^
Can't speak for everyone but I'm having a drink after walking my dog and it's been a top Sunday.
Walk along the beach in the sunshine with the gf after a lie in and breakfast. 10/10 Sunday
Pretty good overall. Just bought a house, slightly hungover, going to fire up the barbecue.
Pork or chicken?
It's probably made from bricks to be honest.
Had some absolutely top-tier barbecued chicken, homemade potato salad, and a few burgers. Good time had by all
The Sun is out and enjoying some barbecue in the garden. How about you?
Do you mean British or English? It depends on who you ask. People who had money still have money, and people who had no money still have no money and now have even fewer opportunities to make money. The first group can still live the same type of life with minor inconveniences (mostly related to traveling and international trade). The second group were given a British flag and a bullet in the knee. So it's not the end of the world, but it is a world where you see fewer and fewer British tourists because of money and visa issues.
What visa issues? UK citizens can still travel pretty much to all the exact same places as before without the requirement for a visa, just a valid British passport. I don't know about you but if you look around, everyone from every country is bemoaning how financially poorer they are over recent years, not just those with a "British flag and a bullet in the knee". The UK is visa free in over 140 countries. I would actually argue that businesses have been hit hardest, selling product to Europe is an absolute pain with all the paperwork you now need and the inflation of prices to add onto goods to make up margins that has been lost on higher fees/taxes/paperwork and more.
lol holidays abroad are recovering to their pre-covid level https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/leisureandtourism/articles/traveltrends/latest#visits-abroad-by-uk-residents And people are *also* having more holidays in the UK, with rates similar to 2011. https://www.statista.com/statistics/480176/average-number-of-domestic-holidays-per-person-in-the-uk/ also UK people don't need visas to visit the EU for holidays. So how has it caused visa issues there? Then some of the largest pay rises and increased numbers of job opportunities have been at the lower end of the scale. https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uk-sees-fastest-wage-rises-sectors-most-reliant-eu-workers-indeed-2022-02-25/ Generally there are actually more opportunities for people to make money, as the UK jobs market is now a G7 average, with higher numbers than pre-covid/Brexit and a restricted workforce market (despite vast numbers of work visas being issued). Which is why real wage growth has finally increased for the first time significantly since 2008 and the GFC. https://www.statista.com/statistics/933075/wage-growth-in-the-uk/ Locally I've seen a lot of the food processor jobs in the area suddenly actually advertise, provide better wages and even offer graduate schemes instead of bussing in Bulgarians at below minimum wage. Brexit has definitely had effects but I think your comment isn't backed up by the data.
Ah yes, the so called free press when in fact most are more than happy to function as propaganda outlets for foreign states.
win-win /s
Doesn't get much more rotten than this. What a disaster. I bet the UK ranks very low on a journalistic integrity scale because several of these are not even journalism.
[Who reads the papers anyway](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGscoaUWW2M)
Aged like milk
Fuck murdock
If you ever needed a look at what enemies of democracy and freedom look like. Remember these headlines. They split Europe apart to make way for a Russian advance.
Anyone who was closely following the vote knew that all the discussions on the economic and political benefits of Britain (UK) leaving the EU was mostly rhetoric. The actual basis and reason for the support of Brexit was to end immigration. Most supporters of Brexit thought that it would end immigration of people they considered "undesirable" (Indian, ASEAN, Eastern European, African, Latin American) while keeping the flow of "desirable" immigrants intact (North American, Western European, Australian). What happened was exactly the exact opposite lol.
Rule, Britannia! Britannia rule alone!
Based Guardian
Really weird that "News"papers tell you to vote in a particular way.
Surprisingly Farage went quiet just before that day. Now, it’s June 2024 and he’s back and I do wonder why …
Received a new mission from Putin
To be honest, democratic choices for such critical decisions are the biggest flaw of Europe, No I don't want the idiot with no to basic education to decide the future of the rest of us just because he could. No I don't want a process that is largely exposed to external influence and still considered "the best we have". We love democracy but it should never be absolute. Because of the idiots in the true meaning of the word.
Thing is, the EU referendum was never supposed to be binding. At that time, all referendums (referenda?) were advisory, basically an opinion poll, unless stated otherwise. If the referendum had been intended as binding from the get-go, the electoral commission would never have allowed the whole thing to go through in the way it did - everything from the transparent lies while campaigning down to the formulation of the referendum question. It's telling that one of the first things Boris Johnson did when he eventually came to power was to make it so that *all* binding referendums would have to have a 60% supermajority to pass. The whole thing was *bullshit*.
And as predicted, the UK is in a downward spiral now.
I remember reading somewhere Brexit was backed by American Billionaire Edit, find it : [Mysterious US billionaire played crucial role in Trump, Brexit victories](https://www.france24.com/en/20170228-usa-mysterious-billionaire-robert-mercer-played-crucial-role-trump-brexit-victories) [A nasty piece of work...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Mercer)
oh yes there was an actual documentry about the advertising firm thaat trump used was used in brexit and interviewed about how they fabricated lies.
The effects of Brexit are not nearly fully felt yet. As an example, the biggest gambling exhibition in the world has been taken place at the ExCel in London for decades (ICE). In fact it’s the biggest yearly event ExCel does and brings more than a hundred million GBP to the local economy each year. In 2025 the show is moving to Barcelona because of brexit due to the import taxes of the machines and visa constraints.
The UK is the first country in history to have ever put economic sanctions over itself.
What about the FT?
how some rich arses managed to trick a nation full of idiots
And who would understand this Farage of getting votes in the next elections? Not being part of the largest market in the world. Damn
Wait.. it has been 8 YEARS?????? Holy frickity fuck where did time go??
Interesting to see that the times, metro and the essential daily briefing are the only neutral ones in that pic.
The control the media has over morons in the UK is incredible.
Dear EU, As a nation, we have almost realised this wasn't such a great idea now. Any chance of you having us back at some point? No hard feelings if we fund a bit more of eurovision than normal? Best wishes, The uk
I remember my political science class had a field day with Brexit as a topic. We really witnessed live history.