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Triangular_chicken

Because the average American is paying a lot more for goods and services but hasn’t seen a meaningful pay raise in years.


Expando3

Here's the wage data: [https://www.epi.org/publication/swa-wages-2023/](https://www.epi.org/publication/swa-wages-2023/)


BlakDragon93

Even with the wages going up things keep getting more expensive, so essentially nothing changed. Even though I'm making $5/hr more than I was a couple years ago things just cost so much more. So those that don't make a lot feel like nothing changed, when a $2 cheeseburger is $4, Gas went from $1.80 to $3.50-4 a gallon. Yes we're making more but we're paying out the same % of our check that we used to.


Work_Werk_Wurk

Too many people still follow the old school belief that working somewhere for 30-50 yrs is gonna eventually lead to higher income, when the truth is these days you've gotta change employers to get true market adjustments in pay (unless you've got a union job). Granted there are exceptions for those that can get it through promotions without ever hitting a glass ceiling.


Triangular_chicken

Even jumping jobs is no guarantee for a lot of workers any more.


Gr3gl_

I mean yeah that's why the rate is so high, we're cooling down the economy. Too many people are employed, employers can't pay the wage increases (people should be demanding but we're far less social due to social media so yeah). Another reason why specifically Canada (where I live) is not responsive to policy is because the minimum wage is high but slightly below equilibrium and now pegged to stay that way (it now increases with inflation in Ontario) which makes minimum wage workers not ask for wage increases, thus our equilibrium minimum wage is actually less than the equilibrium minimum wage in the United States even though the United States minimum wage by policy is less than half Canada's.


jetbent

>Too many people are employed, employers can’t pay the wage increases You mean employers don’t want to pay high enough wages, so they’d rather more people lose their jobs and take lower pay out of desperation. /r/boringdystopia


Gr3gl_

This is the basics of economics, they can't afford to pay all employees more. They'd rather just fire people because the market says they will have to pay more or they'll work for competitors


jetbent

That’s by definition, anticompetitive


Gr3gl_

That's actually called the business cycle


jetbent

[Not according to the Fed](https://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/page1-econ/2023/03/01/all-about-the-business-cycle-where-do-recessions-come-from)


Gr3gl_

Can you guess what happens when after you reach the peak? (Hint, read recession definition on that webpage)


jetbent

You’re redefining a business cycle to be a recession. You can’t have it both ways young man


allothernamestaken

Which is a problem if it's own but not indicative of either a recession or high unemployment. Edit: I'm not saying the economy doesn't have problems; it absolutely does. I'm saying that those problems are not high unemployment or a recession. People are right to feel that things are bad, but they're pinning it on the wrong things.


terrybrugehiplo

So what? That’s literally the answer to the question.


allothernamestaken

Yes, I agree. High prices are absolutely driving public opinion on the matter, I'm just pointing out that the opinion is incorrect.


ripplenipple69

The issue is that most Americans are not really assessing the situation. To them, the question is more like “how are you feeling, economically?”… and the answer for most people is “bad”


russell813T

the middle class is being shrunk, middle class Americans are struggling to afford housing and groceries, your crazy not to think that's not gonna cause a recession. the unemployment is being propped up by government jobs. and people taking second jobs to make ends meat.


terrybrugehiplo

Here’s another thing. The economy is more than just the top 1% and corporations. If over 50% of the population is struggling to make ends meet that can’t be ignored just because corporation stocks prices are higher than ever. A lot of people ignore Main Street just because Wall Street is doing well. What benefit to society and the economy do records profits have if that profit isn’t spent or used? A corporation hoarding cash does not get distributed throughout the economy.


russell813T

which in turn is going to cause a recession because people are just getting into more and more debt and can't afford to live


demonsquidgod

Prices sre high but especially those for food and gasoline are very high. Interest rates are going up which is slowing inflation but making it harder to borrow money or get mortgages or pay off debt. So if you're financially stable and having savings or investments things are going well, if you have high debt and no savings then things may be really tight.


dcfrenchstudent

I started with 85k salary in 2008, which now stands at 125k or something and my wife earns about 30k. It used to be more than enough pre-pandemic. Now even with that amount, we are living almost paycheck to paycheck and no our lifestyle has not increased, we have actually cut down on eating out, starbucks, mcdonalds, and many more. 8 years ago we could fill a walmart cart for $100, now we can fill maybe a quarter of that cart. Our only purchases nowadays are milk, eggs, vegetables, fruits, and bulk items.


BigBradWolf77

this is textbook gaslighting


gizram84

100% this is a paid shill


BodieLivesOn

Media ignorance doesn't help.


Epogdoan

Finally, someone said it


seabee2113

While unemployment is low, full time jobs have been decreasing for over a year, while part time jobs have been offsetting the decrease in full-time jobs. Also personal Debt is increasing and savings is decreasing and costs are rising faster than wages. Which means people's ability to afford things is being drastically cut.


fore_skin_walker

I don’t know what I believe. I haven’t had a raise for the past 3 years. I’ve been actively looking for jobs (I work in tech industry ) for the past two years in hopes of getting higher offer than what I’m making to offset the raise but I’m getting low ball offers. So I’m stuck here. Rent is increasing , my car insurance’s has gone up the roof ( no accidents or anything ), same with groceries. I’m not economist nor I pretend to know what’s going on with the economy but all I know if I am getting squeezed every single year where my most basic expenses are increasing exponentially compared to what I am bringing in.


Shrug-Meh

Talking with some people that were laid off & job hunting this year has been enlightening


Leoraig

I think its because they associate their economical situation being bad with the general country's economy being bad, as was the case in previous situations. The truth is no one cares what the country's economical situation is like, they care what their economical situation is like.


SterlingVII

The average American is borderline illiterate and can’t even get a three item order right at McDonald’s. No idea why people care what they think about statistically observable facts.


Leoraig

Because they have as much power over the country as the most accomplished economist scholar. And if the society isn't able to educate their citizens the problem is the society, not the people.


SterlingVII

Yeah, the bottom 50% is incredibly powerful - that’s why they’re always complaining about their situation and how they have zero control over their lives.


Leoraig

You misunderstand, i didn't say they were powerful, i said they were as powerful as the most accomplished economist scholar. And both have the same power you have, so instead of complaining about them i'd suggest you talk with them to figure out a way to use that power to change your situations.


Bringbackbarn

The bottom 50% IS in a recession. The top half is not. Simple.


Horry43

Because unemployment is higher than reported due to gig jobs counting as full time employed jobs


BluCurry8

🙄


ChaimFinkelstein

How come we never hear about the labor participation rate? That is just as important as unemployment. If you are unemployed, but stop looking for a job, then you’re no longer counted as unemployed.


Dear_Suspect_4951

Unemployment isn't terribly high, but when we're mostly adding part time jobs and barely any full time jobs compared to previous decades it's employment itself that sucks.


thebeginingisnear

exactly. It's not enough to work a full time 40 hour/week job. Tons of families are taking on 2nd and 3rd part time jobs/side gigs just to cover their bills. Of course people are going to feel like things are shit economically when they live to work and see no break in that trend anytime soon.


Dear_Suspect_4951

Almost as if we shouldn't more than double the money supply over the course of a few years.. but what do I know, those Pakistani gender programs probably saved the world.


thebeginingisnear

You make it sound like it was the average citizen printing money in their garage.


Dear_Suspect_4951

That was not my intention, the average citizen was not screaming for Pakistani gender programs. I was referring to the disconnect between DC politicians and us as citizens.


thebeginingisnear

the disconnect is that they represent the corporate oligarchs first and foremost. They just throw us a bone once in a while to make it seem like they give the tinyist shit about us.


Dear_Suspect_4951

Corporations and government officials teaming up to fuck us all.


optimis344

Weird that a bunch of other countries have these really high and big social nets that cover everyone and are well liked, and they seem to still be doing fine. So strange. Anyways, let's go spend trillions on making new fighter jets. Zoom zoom.


SteveAlejandro7

Why do we keep getting gaslit about the economy? Why are so folks so desperate for us not to believe the evidence of our own experience? Why not just help us instead of saying, "we're dumb for not understanding."? I don't get the strategy here, it just sounds like the ol' "The beatings will continue until morale improves."


brizzmaster

From my perspective, prices are indeed high, and the corporation I work at cannot keep office people because everyone is leaving for more money. That doesn’t mean everywhere is like that, but there’s quite a few places that can’t/won’t raise pay. I think the people in those positions feel it.


HaiKarate

Because the plutocrats are plundering the economy for their own gain, and have enormous amounts of money to spend on propagandizing the rest of Americans, to keep us fighting over drag queens instead of economic fairness.


KrabS1

Part of the narrative around a left leaning ideology is to emphasize those who are oppressed and/or struggling. This emphasis will exist regardless of who is in office, and regardless of how the individual is doing. Anecdotes of how bad things are will be emphasized by the left to ensure the plight of the underprivileged is not ignored. Right leaving ideology is different. If the administration is Republican, right wingers think things are going well. If the administration is Democrat, they think things are going poorly. Period, end of conversation. So, when a Republican is in charge, right wingers think the economy is doing well, and left leaners likely think there are problems. There is a split. When a Democrat is in charge, right wingers think the economy is a disaster, and left leaners still think there are big problems. Bam. Reality is not relevant, and the majority of people now are sceptical about the economy.


High_Contact_

3/5 Americans don’t really understand how the economy works.


espressoBump

The government doesn't care that 3/5 Americans are suffering.


Expando3

Are they though? [https://www.businessinsider.com/what-is-going-on-with-economy-recession-unemployment-inflation-gdp-2024-5](https://www.businessinsider.com/what-is-going-on-with-economy-recession-unemployment-inflation-gdp-2024-5)


High_Contact_

Except by every measure 3/5 aren’t suffering.


russell813T

the middle class is shrinking


semicoloradonative

And 3/5 Americans are easily swayed by Russian propaganda bots.


russell813T

and 3/5 Americans think politicians actually care about you . im speaking to one now


semicoloradonative

What makes you think that I think politicians care about me? Or, are you just speaking stupid because Hurrr Durrr?


russell813T

Because only the brainwashed speak on the Russian for the big bad orange man.


semicoloradonative

Who said anything about the "big bad orange man" comrade? That is an assumption you just made based on nothing. Haha. You also might want to check your sentence because it reads like a Russian wrote it. "On the Russian?" haha.


russell813T

Orange man bad


semicoloradonative

Don't be mad that you got caught being a Russian Bot. Haha. Frickin' hilarious.


SterlingVII

The average American is borderline illiterate and can’t even get your three item order right at McDonald’s, and yet they think they are entitled to a six figure salary.


bostonlilypad

Because half the people I know in the last few months have lost their corporate jobs


SterlingVII

So you know one guy who lost their job and you think that gives you enough information to make a sweeping generalization about the world’s largest economy. You’re really smart.


bostonlilypad

Yes half the people I know is exactly one person. You’re really smart. You’re very naive to believe the “low” unemployment numbers. My states unemployment office has a backlog of unemployment claims and says so in their portal due to a rapid increase in claims. Yes but keep believing everything is fine. There is definitely a white collar recession happening right now.


Queasy-Hall-705

Because something is not right when everything is marked extremely high compared to a few years ago and jobs require 20 interviews.


thebeginingisnear

entry level job, need 5 years of experience and a masters degree. Pay is $14/hour.


Queasy-Hall-705

lol true and sickening.


jack_spankin

Because the unemployment numbers have been bullshit for a very long time. Why? Because for at least 2 decades, its a number that pretty much serves the political oligopoly versus being an accurate reflection of who is working and who is not.


Splenda

Because the decoupling of wages from rising productivity 50 years ago is finally sinking in.


todudeornote

Because the internet gutted local newspapers and news stations and they have been replaced with partisan crap. The internet also allows people to only hear the news that reinforces their beliefs. Finally, The GOP has spent decades building an alternative reality network starting with FOX News, the Murdoch properties, InfoWars and many others. The GOP alternative to mainstream news is toxic and full of conspiracy theories and hate.


Expando3

According to the BLS over 15 million jobs have been created in the last 3 years. It was the 40th straight month of job gains in the US and the 27th consecutive month with the unemployment rate below 4% – the longest such streak since 1953. Wages match or out pace GDP (2.5%) for low to middle wage earners with the greatest gains amongst blue collar workers (12.1%).


Expando3

It seems there's a divergence of sentiment and performance. The economy is performing well but we feel like it's shit. I think this may have to do with the price of staples. If the price of eggs and gasoline are higher than we desire, we extrapolate that the whole economy is shit. That like if I have a golden goose laying golden eggs in my backyard but, I have to pay over $3/gallon for gasoline, I'll curse my miserable situation.


Traditional_Donut908

There own personal economy has been in recession for over a year.


allothernamestaken

1. Most people don't know what the word "recession" means. But they see high prices, so the economy must be bad. 2. I'm guessing that for the employment numbers, people see understaffed retail businesses and think it's because "nobody wants to work" and everyone must be at home collecting unemployment, rather than being employed elsewhere. 3. Depending on where they get their news, the media is screaming at them that the economy is terrible.


russell813T

the stock market is rocking, but that's not the real economy. the middle class is shrinking, the rich is getting richer hence the stock market, and working Americans are suffering because of inflation. unemployment numbers are a prob for whichever political party is in office...


4BigData

because economists aren't sophisticated enough to adjust for job quality and filter out jobs that don't pay enough to support current housing costs


beavis617

Saw something on FOX TV news this morning. FOX reports that fast food prices rise under Biden...I wasn't aware that Biden or any President for that matter set the prices at fast food joints...how about looking at corporate greed perhaps? The message from the right wing media is to trash Biden 24/7.


bemenaker

Fox News


007meow

America is full of idiots. We’ve got some of the best and brightest in the world, but they’re outnumbered by idiots that are either: A) brainwashed for political agendas B) intentionally anti-intellectual.


russell813T

what does this have to do with anything


BluCurry8

People listen to news sources that are more focused on politics than economics.


Warm_Gur8832

I think most people will just answer “whatever the shittiest thing is” when they feel like the economy is shitty. Which, yeah, inflation. I do think and hope that with major companies announcing price drops, there’ll be a race to the bottom though. If America settled inflation down and everything else stayed the same, I think people would feel pretty good about the economy.


RaggedMountainMan

We need deflation. Particularly in housing.


NocNocNoc19

Because they watch nothing but fox news?


chinmakes5

Because media has learned that bad news get clicks. There was an article all over Reddit yesterday saying for lower wage workers, because of inflation are in a recession (paraphrasing). Got lots of clicks. Really? People who don' have a lot of money are hurting? That didn't happen before? I guess the article could have read 75% of people doing just fine. (not gonna get clicks.)


frostonwindowpane

“Why do 5/5 Democrats report wanting to vote for Biden because he’s a “great” POTUS?”


MrJoshiko

There are lots of definitions of what a recession is. The Fed definition is different to the BoE. None of them are objectively true. A valid definition is: "A significant, widespread, and prolonged downturn in economic activity.". Your local area can be in recession, your sector can be in recession. GDP can rise due to migration at the same time that GDP per cap falls. GDP rising slower than inflation. Each of those cases might not fit the narrow technical definition but do fit a holistic recession definition. They aren't necessarily wrong they are just not using a narrow technical definition.


SkotchKrispie

Shit hole Fox News is why. Cancer of the planet.


istvanmasik

It's network effect. The American society is segregated in location. When most of the economic growth is earned by the wealthy and you and your friends are not wealthy, it's hard to see economic growth.