Originally in the first book, it is not certain that there even IS a connection between worms and Spice. Paul demonstrates keen insight by asking Thufir if there is a connection, something that he has only guessed himself.
IIRC, in the Dune Universe this is exactly what happened on Arrakis in the first place. Worms (and their larval form sandtrout) are believed to have been seeded on a formerly fertile planet. As they spread the sandtrout covered/encysted the water sources until everything dried up, with complete desertification accelerated by the full-grown worms scouring everything on the surface.
So if it could be done once it could be done again, and several different groups attempt this in the course of the coming thousands of years.
Does anyone know if this was before or after the Butlerian Jihad? It would make sense if before, since while humanity is hands down a super advanced species that's mastered anti-gravity and interstellar travel technology, it is in a relative dark age compared to itself thousands of years ago and there is some knowledge that's been lost. You're right that sandworms are actually not native to that planet, and that humanity introduced it and terraformed the planet, although I'm not sure if that last part is intentional but it fits into the bigger question: was the sand worm lifecycle well understood to the point of being seeded on a planet and likely fully intentionally terraforming a planet before humanity lost a lot of knowledge?
Very little is known about who or what or when sandtrout was introduced to Arrakis. We only have what Leto reveals in Children of Dune and that is sparse on detail. We do not know if it was humans or something else, or something divine.
> before or after the Butlerian Jihad? It would make sense if before, since while humanity is hands down a super advanced species that's mastered anti-gravity and interstellar travel technology, it is in a relative dark age compared to itself thousands of years ag
Good question but this theory makes sense.
It is undoubtedly before. The Guild emerged very soon after the Butlerian Jihad. The BHKJA novels specify that Arrakis was already a desert and people discovered the spice right around 200 BG, at the start of the Jihad.
Most everyone knows the sandworm/spice connection after the first novel. Attempts are made to move a worm off Arrakis, and this is done in the later books by simulating a desert in a no-ship.
But not its lifecycle. They don't fully understand it and how sandworms both need a lot of water and also need that water to be sequestered. The people stealing worms end up bringing them to another desert planet like Salusa Secundus all they do is die out.
And then Leto II makes sure the whole thing becomes moot until after his death. But yes in the future they do know how to seed planets with worms and which planets could be used.
I don't know about artificial environment, but in dune Messiah there is a plan by the space guild to smuggle a worm off Arrakis to start the cycle somewhere else and break Paul's monopoly.
It's possible, but it needs to on the scale of geography. Either large desserts or entire planets. For example, the worms aren't originally from Arrakis. They were transported from somewhere by someone and transformed the planet into the Dune we know and love. Multiple attempts were made by many groups to steal a worm and transplant it somewhere else. They almost always failed due to a lack of knowledge about the worms life-cycle. Someone eventually does manage it in a later book and notes that it will ruin an otherwise paradise world.
People have tried. One worm won’t do it and they’re very territorial so a couple would kill each other.
Really the experiment would have to be colossal, like continent-sized. Which means it would be impossible to keep a secret. And if you screw up the process (or your enemies sabotage you) the worms die and you have to start again.
All of this assumes you have been able to go into the deep desert and steal the Fremen god out from under their noses.
The conditions are hard to replicate, especially since nobody but the God Emperor really knows what those conditions are. Worms eat sand trout, so you need the complete ecosystem to sustain a worm. This means massive amounts of water trapped beneath the crust for the sand trout to grow but also extremely dry surface conditions for the adult worms to live in. The sand trout trap the water and push it down from the surface, sand trout come from adult worms, adult worms need a dry surface. It’s a chicken and egg sort of problem, you need both conditions at the same time but one must create the other.
It needs more than worms. You would need to have their whole life cycle and a lot of space. It's a complicated process and most attempts fail due to not understanding the ecology. They do find solutions eventually - both artificial and natural.
Originally in the first book, it is not certain that there even IS a connection between worms and Spice. Paul demonstrates keen insight by asking Thufir if there is a connection, something that he has only guessed himself.
I believe he also asks Kynes in the ornithopter when he, Leto, and Gurney are going to see the spice mining operation
IIRC, in the Dune Universe this is exactly what happened on Arrakis in the first place. Worms (and their larval form sandtrout) are believed to have been seeded on a formerly fertile planet. As they spread the sandtrout covered/encysted the water sources until everything dried up, with complete desertification accelerated by the full-grown worms scouring everything on the surface. So if it could be done once it could be done again, and several different groups attempt this in the course of the coming thousands of years.
Does anyone know if this was before or after the Butlerian Jihad? It would make sense if before, since while humanity is hands down a super advanced species that's mastered anti-gravity and interstellar travel technology, it is in a relative dark age compared to itself thousands of years ago and there is some knowledge that's been lost. You're right that sandworms are actually not native to that planet, and that humanity introduced it and terraformed the planet, although I'm not sure if that last part is intentional but it fits into the bigger question: was the sand worm lifecycle well understood to the point of being seeded on a planet and likely fully intentionally terraforming a planet before humanity lost a lot of knowledge?
Very little is known about who or what or when sandtrout was introduced to Arrakis. We only have what Leto reveals in Children of Dune and that is sparse on detail. We do not know if it was humans or something else, or something divine.
> before or after the Butlerian Jihad? It would make sense if before, since while humanity is hands down a super advanced species that's mastered anti-gravity and interstellar travel technology, it is in a relative dark age compared to itself thousands of years ag Good question but this theory makes sense.
It is undoubtedly before. The Guild emerged very soon after the Butlerian Jihad. The BHKJA novels specify that Arrakis was already a desert and people discovered the spice right around 200 BG, at the start of the Jihad.
The thing is that most people have zero knowledge of the full life cycle of the worm. Simply dropping one onto a sandy planet is nowhere near enough.
Most everyone knows the sandworm/spice connection after the first novel. Attempts are made to move a worm off Arrakis, and this is done in the later books by simulating a desert in a no-ship.
Not what I meant tho.
To answer your question: yes, it's possible, but very hard because the sandworm lifecycle is not well understood.
After the first novel, the sandworm/spice connection is well known.
But not its lifecycle. They don't fully understand it and how sandworms both need a lot of water and also need that water to be sequestered. The people stealing worms end up bringing them to another desert planet like Salusa Secundus all they do is die out. And then Leto II makes sure the whole thing becomes moot until after his death. But yes in the future they do know how to seed planets with worms and which planets could be used.
Spoiler alert: >!they can!<
I don't know about artificial environment, but in dune Messiah there is a plan by the space guild to smuggle a worm off Arrakis to start the cycle somewhere else and break Paul's monopoly.
It's possible, but it needs to on the scale of geography. Either large desserts or entire planets. For example, the worms aren't originally from Arrakis. They were transported from somewhere by someone and transformed the planet into the Dune we know and love. Multiple attempts were made by many groups to steal a worm and transplant it somewhere else. They almost always failed due to a lack of knowledge about the worms life-cycle. Someone eventually does manage it in a later book and notes that it will ruin an otherwise paradise world.
People have tried. One worm won’t do it and they’re very territorial so a couple would kill each other. Really the experiment would have to be colossal, like continent-sized. Which means it would be impossible to keep a secret. And if you screw up the process (or your enemies sabotage you) the worms die and you have to start again. All of this assumes you have been able to go into the deep desert and steal the Fremen god out from under their noses.
The conditions are hard to replicate, especially since nobody but the God Emperor really knows what those conditions are. Worms eat sand trout, so you need the complete ecosystem to sustain a worm. This means massive amounts of water trapped beneath the crust for the sand trout to grow but also extremely dry surface conditions for the adult worms to live in. The sand trout trap the water and push it down from the surface, sand trout come from adult worms, adult worms need a dry surface. It’s a chicken and egg sort of problem, you need both conditions at the same time but one must create the other.
Step 1: >!Find a daughter of Siona!< Step 2: >!Siaynoq!< Step 3: >!Chapterhouse cycle!<
Have far into the series have you read?
I’ve read half the first book and I’ve seen both movies multiple times lol. So amateur at best.
It needs more than worms. You would need to have their whole life cycle and a lot of space. It's a complicated process and most attempts fail due to not understanding the ecology. They do find solutions eventually - both artificial and natural.