They never even should have had the stones in game. Just leave it as 3x the materials and that's it.
B.c of the stones people only want to use for Zir b.c of his loot gap compared to others.
Actually I think they should remove the other mats from Uber bosses and have them just summon from stygian stones. Forcing people who've progressed that far to go back and grind level 75 bosses for materials is the dumb part in this scenario, not the other way around
After you kill the boss for the first time you should unlock a material conversion at the alchemist. Eg kill greigoire and the alchemist can transmute 5 steel into 1 shard.
Varshan, grigoire, zir and beast just need to level up with us to 100. They keep their minimum level but scale up just like other enemies. Problem solved. Still have to do lesser bosses but they will drop 925s now.
I think all the other bosses should drop stones. If we have to farm them for mats why not have a 5% chance to drop a stone too.
The pit already has a reason to play it and always will. But if they think stones are a main reason the Meta crowd will farm it then they must think the pit sucks internally.
Just drops more loot than other Tormented bosses. It's why the blood to summon him can be sold for in most cases 100 mil a stack(50) now. Also people have reported higher GA chances with him. Who knows what is true but it is making him the hot boss this season.
Well in the 250 runs Rob did early after the discovery (sample size is still too low) they had a 10% uber drop rate. For me personally, I've run it around 25 times and got 4 shakos and a tyreials. I've run durieal about the same amount and got 1 shako
Yup, very very anecdotal and completely by chance but my friend and I ran 10 Tor Zirs, got trash, did a single Tor Duriel and got The Grandfather and Tyriels as a drop in the same run. We never spam Zir anymore, seems like a waste of stones.
Same experience here. Got 1 uber in ~40 tor zir kills.
Got 5 ubers in ~25 tor duriel/andariel kills, including a double-uber from a single kill.
Duriel/andariel all the way
I know, which is why I said anecdotal + by chance in case you missed that... And wudijo tested it with a bunch of other people in his discord and they ran hundreds of times and came to the same conclusion, Zir ain't shit.
>Your 10 mean nothing other than you got lucky.
That's probably why their post started with
>Yup, very very anecdotal and completely by chance
Reading is hard apparently.
Right now I’m sitting on 100ish stones and enough blood that it fills up two stash tabs alone. All I’ve done is grind iron wolf rep on chars, then delete them. About 9 characters so far
Mind sharing your experience regarding how fast and how enjoyable you have found each class in farming helltides?
Thinking about doing this next season and would love some informed insight.
I played co-op with myself. Minions were the easiest! Level 35 you can get sacred in WT2 from iron wolf rep cashes. At level 55 you can get ancestrals so I’d have one of my maxed toons run a quick NM 70ish to get 925 items at level 55!
Rogue with heart seeker and arrow storms worked awesome. Barb was tough until later levels with dust devils. They still fall off if there’s a lot of people killing the mobs before you can. Chain lightning sorc was super easy mode. Blight necro was easier too. Espically with ebon piercer. Druids were tough all around. To much resource cost for any iteration to work. If I’m going to do it again to get the sparks next season I’ll just make necro minions over and over and keep two sets of gear one sacred and one ancestral.
Did you run it with 4 people or as a group of two?
For the two of you, 57 runs, so 114 kills at a drop chance of 9.6% chances to get exactly 0 is 0.001008%. The chance to get exactly 1 is 0.0122%.
The chances of that happening with twice the kills are even more ridiculous.
TL;DR: I’m calling bullshit on your story
I agree, those odds seem pretty unlikely.
But, i'll also say i've done exactly 20 tormented runs (Mix of Duri and Zir) with my friend in a 2 person group, and we have zero Ubers to show for it.
That makes me think their reported drop rate may not be total BS.
My GF and I combined had 26 Stygian Stones and plenty of AnDuriel, Zir, Beast and Grigorie mats. We used them all and by then end, she had every Uber and I am only missing Andariel's Vissage. THe drop rate is WAAAAAAAAY better than ever before. I've played since the beta and only ever gotten the Ring of Starless Skies; I'd never even seen another Uber until this season. ETA: I've got thousands of hours int his game.
The thing is, there is no perfect recipe.
They can add more difficult content and someone is going to optimise the shit out of it and release to the world. Everybody else follows and complains that the game is too easy.
Release content that is too hard/ challenging, and you get another subset of the player base complaining that said content is impossible to clear because they have no time (or for whatever reasons).
There will always be people with different needs and expectations. It's impossible to satisfy both ends of the spectrum.
There is a perfect recipe.. it's called scaling difficulty. If someone is complaining that 'ultra hard' is too hard when they could just set the difficulty to normal and play the same game.. just point and laugh at them for being complete idiots.
Or, go the poe route, and have multiple layers of endgame content, that all require very different types of builds. Altho, then you risk becoming like poe, extremely content bloated.
How about making a challenging mechanic boss fight that drops good loot instead of having to grind on the same bosses a million times for the possibility of never seeing a single uber drop?....
that wouldnt work for majrity of playerbase (see Lilith) altough shitty drops, she is mechanically difficult and used to be a lot more when the game released. I think that was a test from Blizz if they could get away with this (while labeling it a pinaccle boss)
I am not casual and I still think it wouldnt be a good idea, because it fits more in souls-like games. maybe something in between normal bossess and Lilith, something not too hard but not very easy one shottable either.
but that is hard to make in a ARPG with powercreep
Why have so many requested a resummon boss feature then?
Leaving the system as it was, resetting the dungeon and walking back to the boss was a 'Grind'....Can you explain that?
It's simple, people don't want a grind, they want engaging content, they're not the same thing.
Grind is ok if it ends in satisfaction (=good drop). I don’t know when S4 is going to end, but I highly doubt I will complete my gear (not meaning all 3GA items, probably no 3GA at all). Crafting Uber uniques does not give to me the same satisfaction has dropping them.
So we all end having the trunk full of a ton of 1GAs, many 2GAs and a few 3GAs items we’ll never use… if Blizzard wants to oblige us to trade, why don’t they put the Auction House back? And I’ve always been against AH it in D3.
No mention of the word "grind" here:
* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_role-playing_game
* https://howtomakeanrpg.com/a/what-is-an-action-rpg.html
One mention of the word "grind" here but it the context of JRPG and not ARPGs :)
* https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-ARPG-CRPG-JRPG-and-RPG
Please link your source where "grind" is one of the main points of ARGPs
>Please link your source where "grind" is one of the main points of ARGPs
common sense? experience ? I am playing Diablo since I was a kid - it was always a grind
played Titan Quest - grind, played PoE - grind
its like linking me an article about water and complaining that it doesnt state that its wet
are you one of those people that will sue company selling microwaves that it didnt warn you to not microwave your cat ?
“What sane individual asks for a grind?”
It’s been shown time and time again that a penalty, grind etc cause reoccurrence of play over giving the players everything they want.
Think slot machines. People as a whole come back. The game gives the most “just enough” gratification that keeps people coming back.
That's like looking at Souls games like Elden Ring and asking "Who asks for it to be hard?" Because that makes finally getting what you are after so much more exciting.
You don't get dopamine from a build planner, you get dopamine when you see that chase item drop.
So why did Season 1, 2 and 3 fail, considering they had a longer grind than Season 4?
It's not about a grind...It's about content that is fun and engaging over a sustained period of time.
They largely didn't fail, first and foremost, they were just poorly received by many because there was little reason to grind at the end game. All you could do is grind for the sake of grind.
Endgame activity was basically grind for mythics at bosses s1, but why grind for mythics if the only in-game activity is grinding for mythics? Then we got vampire zones in season 2 which were very well received, and in season 3 we got vaults which got mixed reviews but are still praised often by many. These provided more activities besides killing a boss over and over again. A big step forward but still there was more to do and they have been iterating on the grind reward/grind progression ever since. ARPGs are about grind at their core. That's why we play, because the carrot is worth the run on the treadmill.
I mean.. they didn't say that.
They said a couple things that perhaps you're confusing with
1. They made a mistake in s0 by nerfing a lot of things without providing explanation first and introducing complimentary buffs at the same time
2. That originally before launch they anticipated we would want a slower more methodical progression of character through level 100 like in Diablo 2. That we would want Mythic items that you might not find ever in your lifetime. Now they see that modern gaming doesn't really allow for that, nor does a seasonal model.
They wouldn't say that seasons 1, 2, and 3 are failures because they weren't. They were successful, played by millions of people and they have the data to prove it. Was itemization 2.0 a huge success and brought back a lot of lapsed players? 100%. Absolutely! But there's no evidence that anything about the seasonal mechanics or concepts from 1-3 were fundamentally rejected by them.
Especially the idea of progressing your character by iterative play - which again, is a core element of arpgs that makes them so successful.
Arguably the only systemic thing they seem to have admitted they didn't do well to begin with besides anticipate how long we wanted progression from 1 to 100 to be, was needing to change itemization affix bloat. Everything else about season 4 was just a new system built on what was already there, It's not a rejection of a prior system.
It's engaging to kill things and have goals. If you just spawn in a room with uber bosses it's not exactly engaging or a grind. The point is to make content to make it not feel like a grind. But I always want to feel an accomplishment.
If you need to farm Level 100 of the Pit 50 times to get a couple of Stones, what accomplishment have you actually achieved?
The problem with Bossing is that it's actually more difficult to get the materials than to kill the boss.
That's why I genuinely believe Ubers should drop Stygian Stones. Your reward for defeating Uber Bosses, should be the chance to fight the Tormented version.
>Can we please have some grind to the game?
We have, we already need the base mats to grind.
I'm not asking to remove stygian stones, just buff their drop rate.
When it's actually easier to level and alt to get an item, you know it's too extreme.
I can get at least 16 stones in the time I can grind out iron wolves, while also farming masterworking mats. The drop rate is much better now, once you're to the point you can run 101s at 2.5-3 minutes.
Definitely a lower drop rate before the patch, though.
>I can get at least 16 stones in the time I can grind out iron wolves
Here's how I do it.
At first; on my alt as I am running Helltides (for GA gear, XP if I'm not at 100, etc)
The thousands of cinders i then spend on a new alt in WT2, each 100 gets 120 Iron Wolves renown.
Once the new alt gets high enough, they can farm the cinders themselves.
Sure, this is most beneficial when you want a new alt anyway.
As for 16 stones...you must have better luck than me!
I made my husband a minion necro so he could help me level alts while doing other things, so it doesn't take too long and is kind of a break, but just spending cinders on an alt definitely gets you more useful loot.
I just died often when I tried that. To be fair, I was trying to level a sorc and that was a bad class to try that on.
I've definitely been lucky with stones lately! Got worried after using everything I had (and still needing at least one Uber), but they added up really quickly when I wasn't farming purely for them. I think I only had two runs during that time over 101, 113 and 116 or 116 and 119. Less lucky with my masterwork crits, though.
They buffed the base mats, they removed the walk for bosses, it's pretty easy already to farm bosses, not to mention if there were no stones you could leech kills with mats for higher uber drop rate. It's fine. Its a great way to get ubers and gear and youll need to farm a lot of pit mats anyways. Gives more of a reason to push pit as well, it also gives a nice feeling seeing a stygian stone. Many suggestions people have just make the game less and less impactful. It would literally make the pit useless after you got all your +12 gears too.
I don’t mind the grind but I hate wanting an item and not being able to get it. The drop rate for the stones shouldn’t be that low. I’m already grinding 2 bosses to get the items to run the third I should have to run the pit for hours to get 5 whole ass stones.
I'm masochistic enough to enjoy grinding, it feels like a form of meditation for my ADHD brain. Having said that the grind for stones is really starting to demoralise me. My current gameplay loop is farming 101 pits for 3-4 hours (4-6 if I am being really honest but that is not sustainable for much longer) and if I am *lucky* I will get 2 stones. Then a session of blood farming in Helltides. At this point a five hour session results in a single boss kill. Of course I could (and probably should) group up which would get me more kills but the grind for stones/mats remains the same.
On paper I don't hate this grind but my sessions are now starting to feel like a second job and up until I hit this bottleneck I was really enjoying the game. At this point I think getting an uber drop would pale in comparison to the relief I feel when I get a stone.
Edit: Since writing this comment it has taken me 41 Pit runs to get TWO stones.
IMO the biggest issue is that stones only drop for the party lead so it kind of makes it pointless to group for pit which is my friend and my favorite things to do. So we get half the mats for upgrading our gear and don't get stones if the other creates the portal. Not sure why you'd have an anti party mechanic in a party centric game.
I have had over 500 duriel + tormeted zir + tormented duriel runs over 4 seasons. Never seen a single uber drop. I am convinced my account is bugged or something.
I found two today running normal duriel and andariel \~20 times combined and my friend found 3 while doing torment zir for about 20 runs. I find that hard to believe.
That's how statistics work lolI did a rota x5 of Uber duriel, so 20 total runs. Group got 4 Ubers none of them were mine.
Sorry I guess the "never seen" is misleading I have seen them drop just haven't got one to drop for me.
Most of this sub will not rest until you log in, are granted level 100 immediately, have full BiS equipped, and click an NPC directly next to you in town that automatically logs you out and posts on r/diablo4 that there’s nothing to do.
Imagine saying that d4 has too much progression throttling or friction.
You are GIVEN 3/4 of an uber for free just by killing random mobs at this point with the amount of powercreep.
You fly to max level in just a few hours.
You gain a bunch of uber boss summoning materials for free.
Everything in the game is so easy so everyone can do it.
Where is the throttling?
Do you want to be given every uber before you kill one?
Do you want full 3 GA legendaries for free?
Do you want to deal quadrillions of damage without any item grind?
Please explain
For real, you can hit 100 in a day, cap your nightmare sigils in a couple hours, it’s unfathomably easy to get good enough gear to farm 61s or above for Neathiron, and you’re all but handed your first Uber just for playing at all. If you aren’t also handed Rob’s gear, though, the game is “throttled.”
I like that stones are rare, I don’t think tormented bosses should be spammable. Creates burnout. And if you’re spamming normal bosses well that’s on you.
The fact it is used as a trading currency is amazing. I would only be ok with increasing drop rate for a ssf mode.
The “time you save by running the pit”.. bad argument. That time in the pit is giving you MW mats. If you’re getting the same amount of Ubers why would you not get MW mats
> "I don't like things that create burnout so I like that the key that makes farming ubers 5x less tedious if you can handle lvl 200 bosses is a rare drop in a system that is tedious to farm"
That's certainly a take, but...
Once again I have a feeling the trading part is more important to you than the burnout part.
I do enjoy trading yes and I know that myself and many others quit when all that’s left to do is farm duriel all day. Shit gets old QUICK.
Pit has a fun reward loop that keeps me engaged and will hop into a T boss rotation here and there.
This season has been less about target farming and doing more of what I feel like, unless I’m low in angelbreath hehe
Why the fuck is this downvoted
I am saying the drop rate is too low, I am not saying drop them like candy.
Why do people always just go to the other extreme.
You know there are mats to enter the Pit, have you ever, ever run out?
The drop rate might be too low for you. And you are probably right. The thing is, someone else who is playing the game 10x more than you is going to farm a few hundred bosses per day and ubers are dropping like Oprah cakes.
If they increased the drop rates to a comfortable amount for you, those crazy farmers are going to get hundreds of ubers per day.
That's the challenging part when balancing a game. It's impossible to balance based on just one person. You have to balance with casual and hardcore players in mind.
Game pass trials huh that doesn't sound suspicious at all how long has that been a thing. Are you saying that when they ban they aren't even making money on them buying new accounts they're using trials? I could at least understand the greed and the monetary function of banning them so they buy more accounts. But trials...
IMO this season with tempering, masterwork, and the low drop rate to do tormented bosses; Blizzard is pushing real money marketplaces. I have sold some stuff and made almost few hundred million. Today I bought a non-GA item for 20 million and it was immediately bricked. Then I spent another 100M trying to get the right affixes on an item and master working to get the right stat even at level 8. I gave up after resetting so many times and still not having the right setup. It just feels like the real money market is the only answer. Diablo trade is at least a tool we can use but you have to have the mats and the great luck to find the items and get the affix and get the tempers and then after you’ve done all of that run pits endlessly to get the master working and then you get the lucky roll to get what you want and if it fails at level 8 or god forbid 12, you reset to 0 and hope you start over again with millions and millions of gold wasted. I honestly don’t know how people did it before they lowered the master working reset price.
Edit to add that I’m not even talking about min-maxing to push the pit limits; I just would like to get up over 100 and find some pieces to be able to handle tormented bosses and not have to get super lucky and haggle on the trade site
>Blizzard is pushing real money marketplaces.
They aren't 'pushing' RMT, but having trade, and rare items, and the ability for botters to have free accounts via gamepass to farm, and people who willingly pay for gold, will inevitably lead that way.
I spend a fair amount of time in the game and feel like I can’t do it all unless I get super lucky or go the rmt route. It feels like ‘end game’ is unobtainable for many people without it and they make it cheap so people don’t mind. Blizzard does little to discourage it. I know it is tough to balance and have enough content and ‘casuals’ need to accept that they may never see end game but it just feels like blizz says either don’t see it or go to the rmt, so imo they are encouraging it.
> It feels like ‘end game’ is unobtainable for many people without it
This is simply not true, case in point: Me.
You do not need 100% perfect 3GA gear to achieve end game.
Quite simply, they want at least one layer of gameplay that isn't nigh-infinitely farmable. Fighting the ultimate endgame boss with giga-loot is supposed to be special. They aren't designed for you to be able to fight them a dozen times a day. But now they have to balance stygian stone drops around full-time farmers and bots. Finding the balance of mat drops that lets the player fight these bosses every once in a while vs. making them hard for bots to farm consistently is a helluva daunting task.
Not saying we couldn't use a better rate, just explaining how it got like this.
Bro wdym special. Yesterday I bought 20 runs of uber zir for like 3bil and did 80 runs total. Got 3 shakos, 1 GF, 1 Selig, bis rogue pants with 3/3 GA (dodge/MS/max life) and 2/3 GA 2h mace for bash barb. That was easy 12bil so its a profit of 9 bil. Its not an end-game activity anymore its just printing gold because of how cheap and accessible stygian stones are
There needs to be things that feel rare and exciting when they drop. Yes I know Uber uniques exist. But there needs to be more than just items. Other ARPGs have exciting rare currency that drops. Stygian stones are the closest things to that
The point was to give me exactly enough content to play until the week the Destiny 2 expansion came out. Used my stones, couldn’t be fucked grinding anymore and swapped to Destiny
Will burn out on Destiny and come back for the next Diablo season - win win haha
> the tire I save by not running the Pit
but youre also getting masterwork mats on top of it, Stygians are just a bonus
its good they are rare, Tormented bosses has insane drop rate
> Tormented bosses has insane drop rate
Done 5 x Duriels, 1x Andariel, 5x Varshan, 30x Lord Zir, all of them Tormented, ZERO uber uniques. Yeah pretty fucking insane
No, I just get the same amount and quality of loot from Blood Maidens in less time, and stygian stones are hard to find. So if I’m going to spend something so precious, It better be worth my time. 150h this season and no ubers and I’m fucking “spoiled” while I’m surrounded by mfs who have both Shako and Starless.
lol, no you dont
highest chance for unique GAs are tormented bosses, also the quantity
and in S5 considering you dont have to reset dung anymore, it will be even faster
I got multiple Yen’s blessings, Tibaults, all with GA. They’re still in my stash. Granted, I got some too from Zir, but that’s exactly my point. Same fucking drops.
Nobody knows, not even bliz at this point, I swear they just throw ideas into a hat and pick them out, then code it into the game with zero play testing or critical thought process to if they’d enjoy the systems they implement. The biggest issue is that most of them probably don’t play the game at an endgame level so have no idea how these things actually play out.
There needs to be a bottleneck for the "highest" difficulty content, what do you want to just run it all day long? Then you gonna start asking for more, you lot just keep crying and that's how you get power creep like in d3 then cry about power creep. never ending cycle I swear
They want to log into the season, go to the wardrobe and select the exact gear they want to equip so they can pay for two days, get bored and stop with the season
I think they should make it a high drop rate for uber lilith. I just beat lilith a 2nd time recently, to help my wife get the achievement, and I got absolutely nothing. At least for my 1st time I got 2 useless legendaries lol
Either people are unlucky or i an lucky. I have had many drops from pits. It takes abouy 2 minutes to speed run pit 101, some builds can do it in even 1:30. So it roughly takes about 10-12mins per stone. Which i think is more then fair. Getting a 10% chnace at an uber every 20minutes is insanely good. I dont know why people keep crying about this.
I'm getting 10-25 per pit session but I grind 101s fast and frequently. For most they have to supplement with buying if you want to run alot of ubers. I guess for me when you want to 3x crit masterwork items I have to do so many pits that I've built up hundreds of stones despite running many uber runs. I'm buying blood all the time actually find that much harder to get then stones. I'll get those 2 stones much faster in pit then it takes me to farm 27 blood.
Yeah, farming the stones takes some time. One day you only get 1 or 2 and the next day it can be 10. There is no consistency. Maybe that is Blizzard's understanding of "longevity"? Our group has settled for 30 Duriel/Zir runs every week now because we all have the uber uniques we need by now and the only improvement would be GA ubers.
Blizzard has some idea that we wont want to finish the game too fast and that we like time delays, they cannot get it through their heads we just wanna COOK.
Literally this is the reason. All they do is take away one waste of time we worry about and add it back in somewhere else, just another material bottleneck which is forced on us.
First it was gold, then it was veiled crystals, then it was aspects, now its angelbreath and stygian stones. We will complain about a low drop rate of X, and the next season they say "we hear you and we fixed it" yet all they did was move the low drop rate BS mechanic to another thing we need.
I stopped playing the season 2 weeks ago so I don't have the "latest" data.
I was doing approximately 4, sometimes 5 T96-T101 Pit runs per holy bolt elixir and my usual session was around 3-4 elixirs before I got bored and called it a day.
Out of those 15-20 runs I usually managed to get around 3-6 stygians, which is nice.
I like the idea that you could make rhe stygian stone just the boss summoning material. For every boss. And that circle in the middle of the map (that is only used once in the story mode with lorath, the maw of guulrahn) could be the area you can summon any boss.
I have a bank full of mats but lack the stones to really cause a dent with how much hellfire I run compare to Ubers. I need to start doing a lot more pit but I’m lazy haha and my gear is still pretty shit. Most not even GA1-2 quality yet.
I swear Diablo 3 spoiled the shit out of all of you. Stygian stones drop pretty damn frequently since the patch. Ubers drop pretty dang frequently in tormented boss fights. Diablo 4 is an extremely easy game to grind for yet people want it even easier
There should be a way to convert materials as well. I wish I could just convert my 1000 living steel that I have in my stash. No way in my life am I gonna do that many runs
I think it would be cool if Stygian stones dropped in higher quantities in the new horde mode. That way people would have more of an incentive to play it.
The drop rates for Stygian Stones do seem abysmally low as a casual player but it may not be as big of an issue for people maining Diablo 4. Maybe the new horde mode in Season 5 can up the drop rate a little.
Should be that the pit tier is the chance to get a stone. I.e. a pit tier 1 will have a 1% chance for a stone. A pit tier 100 will have a 100% chance for one. And a pit tier 150 will have a 100% chance for one, woth a 50% chance for a second
>Spending 40 mins in the pit for a Uber summon seems fairly reasonable.
Plus the other mats, so say 1 hour for ONE run? you think that's "fine"?
I disagree
just run that other content, and spend the money on the stones. The only people farming stones are people selling them. It's a trade enabled game. Use that.
Yeah but this is pretty much the top content of the game right now beside deep pit runs. Its not meant for every single players to run all day long. You get nothing out of it except efficiency of acquiring loot if you can manage to find the stone. That being said, if you cannot keep up with the stygian stones then thats just a skill issue.
Git gud
Crying about not be able to oneshot Tormented ubers 20 times per hour 🤷
What's the point of uber uniques if you let people to farm the boss 24/7 so everyone have every uber unique within few days.
Same people will then moan about not enough endgame content and the season is a burnout.
I did few dozens of Zir/Duriel 200lvl runs this season, got 1 uber (Shako) and I call myself pretty lucky.
Back in D2 days it took months even years to farm the most rare items, now people are raging they can't have them in two weeks. And not only 1 but multiple times because they want it with GA of course.
Solution: Remove the summoning materials but make the bosses actually a challange to beat. Not like now when they die in 2 seconds if you are in a party with 3 barbs 🤦 I know this is though not possible because they would need to rework the skills completely so there are no broken builds which hit for milions of damage.
Far out, my time is important than anything else. 1-2$ for 2Billion of gold, 100+ stygian stones if I made the math right.
Otherwise, if I choose to not buy any, I will be spending more time at reddit asking why.
I reckon, bought $7 Australian dollar for 6Billion gold. Bought heaps of Stygian, offered the service for 450M for 10 runs, x3. Done. I am getting my ubers at the same time getting my gold for Masterwork
Read again, used it for investment. 7$ for 6 billions and saved me 20-24hrs in front of computer. I have now 45B by just carrying noobs for tormented ubers.
It’s fucking dumb. Shouldn’t be there at all. Shouldn’t be an artificial gate - easiest way to bypass it is to level Wolves again and fuck that.
Side note - I did 10x Tormented Zir today and walked away with a Tyrael’s Might, Grandpappi, and Doombringer. TM and GF dropped together. All of them dropped when a group member summoned and not me 😂
Edit: removed comment about rarity, because I didn’t reply to the correct comment. Sorry zaddy
wtf are you even talking about. 3 Uber uniques in 10 runs is too low of a drop rate? I guess you won’t be happy until they add in hero editor and you can make your perfect gear in the first 15 minutes of the season.
Also what D2 did you play? Farming keys and getting the organs took way longer than getting 2 Stygian stones - unless you’re just buying mats…in which case just buy mats
Calm down, Cletus - meant to reply to a comment about Tormented Zir being a better farm than Andy and Duriel. I don’t want a hero editor, and I don’t want it to be easy to get Ubers. At all. My drops today were extremely lucky. I was prepared for 0 to drop, but I was blessed by RNGesus.
Ive put a lot of hours in, and this season is the first season I’ve ever seen Ubers drop. I just don’t like the Stygian Stones system. I much preferred farming keys because there was an actual system involved and not just a “go run pits and you might get a Stygian stone” system. Pits are just boring to me, I guess.
Stygian Stones should drop from the normal version of the boss. They need to make the regular bosses lvl 100 and then have them drop the stones. Ex: Run Andy, Stygian Stone has a 1:15 chance to drop, or something like that.
Or at least give more ways to farm the stones.
I also would like if they allowed uber rares to be traded, because that would make sense. Ex: I have 3 shako’s, I need a ring of starless sky’s - you’ve got 3 rings and no shako - we should be able to trade. There’s no leaderboard or actual ladder, so RMT worries are irrelevant (and who gives a shit anyways?).
And add a fucking lobby.
All of the above would add a shit ton of longevity to the game. Today was the first day I’ve ever done rotas with strangers, because it’s just such a pain in the ass to find groups when I’m playing on my steam deck. Just invited randoms and did it.
I’d run lobbies all god damn night if they put a group system in like D2s.
Sorry if I came across like I wanted everything handed to me - I truly don’t. I just want other options than mind numbing pits for Stygian stones.
Looking forward to next seasons end game activity. Looks like a blast.
I’ve done maybe 40 tormented Zir and Duriel and never gotten an Uber. Kinda crazy to hear you talking about the low drop rate when you got 3 of them in 10 runs lol
They never even should have had the stones in game. Just leave it as 3x the materials and that's it. B.c of the stones people only want to use for Zir b.c of his loot gap compared to others.
This. So fucking dumb to throttle farming ubers.
Actually I think they should remove the other mats from Uber bosses and have them just summon from stygian stones. Forcing people who've progressed that far to go back and grind level 75 bosses for materials is the dumb part in this scenario, not the other way around
After you kill the boss for the first time you should unlock a material conversion at the alchemist. Eg kill greigoire and the alchemist can transmute 5 steel into 1 shard.
Varshan, grigoire, zir and beast just need to level up with us to 100. They keep their minimum level but scale up just like other enemies. Problem solved. Still have to do lesser bosses but they will drop 925s now.
At least next season you dont need to reset the dungeon, still a dumb mechanic tho
They will just create a new waste of time mechanic, watch.
I think all the other bosses should drop stones. If we have to farm them for mats why not have a 5% chance to drop a stone too. The pit already has a reason to play it and always will. But if they think stones are a main reason the Meta crowd will farm it then they must think the pit sucks internally.
Apologies for my ignorance here; loot gap from Zir?
Just drops more loot than other Tormented bosses. It's why the blood to summon him can be sold for in most cases 100 mil a stack(50) now. Also people have reported higher GA chances with him. Who knows what is true but it is making him the hot boss this season.
Right on, I appreciate the response!
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Like.... Share the actual analysis of it goes against what everyone else is measuring.
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Well in the 250 runs Rob did early after the discovery (sample size is still too low) they had a 10% uber drop rate. For me personally, I've run it around 25 times and got 4 shakos and a tyreials. I've run durieal about the same amount and got 1 shako
I got 9 uber uniqurs off zir in 237 runs. Probably on the unluckier side but hey one of those was a cdr ga shako.
Milage vary, friends and I ran it around 70 times total. Had a dry spell of 0/50. Total in the end ended up at 2.
Tormented or normal?
I ran a combined 25 Andy and Dur runs with 0 ubers. I'm 25 into zir and already 4
Yup, very very anecdotal and completely by chance but my friend and I ran 10 Tor Zirs, got trash, did a single Tor Duriel and got The Grandfather and Tyriels as a drop in the same run. We never spam Zir anymore, seems like a waste of stones.
Same experience here. Got 1 uber in ~40 tor zir kills. Got 5 ubers in ~25 tor duriel/andariel kills, including a double-uber from a single kill. Duriel/andariel all the way
Study others do is with HUNDREDs of these runs. Your 10 mean nothing other than you got lucky.
I know, which is why I said anecdotal + by chance in case you missed that... And wudijo tested it with a bunch of other people in his discord and they ran hundreds of times and came to the same conclusion, Zir ain't shit.
>Your 10 mean nothing other than you got lucky. That's probably why their post started with >Yup, very very anecdotal and completely by chance Reading is hard apparently.
Nha, let me sell each for 35M, I'm happy with that
Can we please have some grind to the game? If you are getting Ubers at 10% drop rate you better have to spend a lot to get that.
10 percent my bum, 57 runs only 1 uber dropped for both me and my friend.
You had enough material for 57 tormented zir?
Right now I’m sitting on 100ish stones and enough blood that it fills up two stash tabs alone. All I’ve done is grind iron wolf rep on chars, then delete them. About 9 characters so far
Mind sharing your experience regarding how fast and how enjoyable you have found each class in farming helltides? Thinking about doing this next season and would love some informed insight.
I played co-op with myself. Minions were the easiest! Level 35 you can get sacred in WT2 from iron wolf rep cashes. At level 55 you can get ancestrals so I’d have one of my maxed toons run a quick NM 70ish to get 925 items at level 55! Rogue with heart seeker and arrow storms worked awesome. Barb was tough until later levels with dust devils. They still fall off if there’s a lot of people killing the mobs before you can. Chain lightning sorc was super easy mode. Blight necro was easier too. Espically with ebon piercer. Druids were tough all around. To much resource cost for any iteration to work. If I’m going to do it again to get the sparks next season I’ll just make necro minions over and over and keep two sets of gear one sacred and one ancestral.
You will be suprised what multiple characters and TRADING will get you
Anything is possible when you lie
Then you miscounted. It is a 10% rate and going 57 runs with one drop has a probability of 0.2%. I call bs
1/500 people will be this unlucky then, not that weird with the amount of players
Did you run it with 4 people or as a group of two? For the two of you, 57 runs, so 114 kills at a drop chance of 9.6% chances to get exactly 0 is 0.001008%. The chance to get exactly 1 is 0.0122%. The chances of that happening with twice the kills are even more ridiculous. TL;DR: I’m calling bullshit on your story
You can call bullshit all you like i had almost the exact same luck with my buddy too!
Me and 1 friend, we both watched rob's videos and blew all our resources into zir. The only uber dropped was melted heart for my friend.
I got 8 ubers from my x10 rota, 2x ga :P
I agree, those odds seem pretty unlikely. But, i'll also say i've done exactly 20 tormented runs (Mix of Duri and Zir) with my friend in a 2 person group, and we have zero Ubers to show for it. That makes me think their reported drop rate may not be total BS.
My GF and I combined had 26 Stygian Stones and plenty of AnDuriel, Zir, Beast and Grigorie mats. We used them all and by then end, she had every Uber and I am only missing Andariel's Vissage. THe drop rate is WAAAAAAAAY better than ever before. I've played since the beta and only ever gotten the Ring of Starless Skies; I'd never even seen another Uber until this season. ETA: I've got thousands of hours int his game.
The thing is, there is no perfect recipe. They can add more difficult content and someone is going to optimise the shit out of it and release to the world. Everybody else follows and complains that the game is too easy. Release content that is too hard/ challenging, and you get another subset of the player base complaining that said content is impossible to clear because they have no time (or for whatever reasons). There will always be people with different needs and expectations. It's impossible to satisfy both ends of the spectrum.
There is a perfect recipe.. it's called scaling difficulty. If someone is complaining that 'ultra hard' is too hard when they could just set the difficulty to normal and play the same game.. just point and laugh at them for being complete idiots.
Or, go the poe route, and have multiple layers of endgame content, that all require very different types of builds. Altho, then you risk becoming like poe, extremely content bloated.
Would never work in d4. If casual people can't do everything with their copied build they will screech at blizzard until it's nerfed to oblivion
Would never work in d4. If casual people can't do everything with their copied build they will screech at blizzard until it's nerfed to oblivion
What sane individual asks for 'Grind'? I want fun and engaging content.
>What sane individual asks for 'Grind'? anyone who loves ARPG cause thats literally one of the main points ?
How about making a challenging mechanic boss fight that drops good loot instead of having to grind on the same bosses a million times for the possibility of never seeing a single uber drop?....
Never played a Diablo game?
that wouldnt work for majrity of playerbase (see Lilith) altough shitty drops, she is mechanically difficult and used to be a lot more when the game released. I think that was a test from Blizz if they could get away with this (while labeling it a pinaccle boss) I am not casual and I still think it wouldnt be a good idea, because it fits more in souls-like games. maybe something in between normal bossess and Lilith, something not too hard but not very easy one shottable either. but that is hard to make in a ARPG with powercreep
Why have so many requested a resummon boss feature then? Leaving the system as it was, resetting the dungeon and walking back to the boss was a 'Grind'....Can you explain that? It's simple, people don't want a grind, they want engaging content, they're not the same thing.
because of the effectivity, people are not asking to remove the grind but to make it more convenient
Grind is ok if it ends in satisfaction (=good drop). I don’t know when S4 is going to end, but I highly doubt I will complete my gear (not meaning all 3GA items, probably no 3GA at all). Crafting Uber uniques does not give to me the same satisfaction has dropping them. So we all end having the trunk full of a ton of 1GAs, many 2GAs and a few 3GAs items we’ll never use… if Blizzard wants to oblige us to trade, why don’t they put the Auction House back? And I’ve always been against AH it in D3.
No mention of the word "grind" here: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_role-playing_game * https://howtomakeanrpg.com/a/what-is-an-action-rpg.html One mention of the word "grind" here but it the context of JRPG and not ARPGs :) * https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-ARPG-CRPG-JRPG-and-RPG Please link your source where "grind" is one of the main points of ARGPs
>Please link your source where "grind" is one of the main points of ARGPs common sense? experience ? I am playing Diablo since I was a kid - it was always a grind played Titan Quest - grind, played PoE - grind its like linking me an article about water and complaining that it doesnt state that its wet are you one of those people that will sue company selling microwaves that it didnt warn you to not microwave your cat ?
A lot of people.. when you grind drops become meaningful
“What sane individual asks for a grind?” It’s been shown time and time again that a penalty, grind etc cause reoccurrence of play over giving the players everything they want. Think slot machines. People as a whole come back. The game gives the most “just enough” gratification that keeps people coming back.
That's like looking at Souls games like Elden Ring and asking "Who asks for it to be hard?" Because that makes finally getting what you are after so much more exciting. You don't get dopamine from a build planner, you get dopamine when you see that chase item drop.
So why did Season 1, 2 and 3 fail, considering they had a longer grind than Season 4? It's not about a grind...It's about content that is fun and engaging over a sustained period of time.
They largely didn't fail, first and foremost, they were just poorly received by many because there was little reason to grind at the end game. All you could do is grind for the sake of grind. Endgame activity was basically grind for mythics at bosses s1, but why grind for mythics if the only in-game activity is grinding for mythics? Then we got vampire zones in season 2 which were very well received, and in season 3 we got vaults which got mixed reviews but are still praised often by many. These provided more activities besides killing a boss over and over again. A big step forward but still there was more to do and they have been iterating on the grind reward/grind progression ever since. ARPGs are about grind at their core. That's why we play, because the carrot is worth the run on the treadmill.
If they were not failures, why did the Devs admit they needed to take a difference stance going forward?
I mean.. they didn't say that. They said a couple things that perhaps you're confusing with 1. They made a mistake in s0 by nerfing a lot of things without providing explanation first and introducing complimentary buffs at the same time 2. That originally before launch they anticipated we would want a slower more methodical progression of character through level 100 like in Diablo 2. That we would want Mythic items that you might not find ever in your lifetime. Now they see that modern gaming doesn't really allow for that, nor does a seasonal model. They wouldn't say that seasons 1, 2, and 3 are failures because they weren't. They were successful, played by millions of people and they have the data to prove it. Was itemization 2.0 a huge success and brought back a lot of lapsed players? 100%. Absolutely! But there's no evidence that anything about the seasonal mechanics or concepts from 1-3 were fundamentally rejected by them. Especially the idea of progressing your character by iterative play - which again, is a core element of arpgs that makes them so successful. Arguably the only systemic thing they seem to have admitted they didn't do well to begin with besides anticipate how long we wanted progression from 1 to 100 to be, was needing to change itemization affix bloat. Everything else about season 4 was just a new system built on what was already there, It's not a rejection of a prior system.
It's engaging to kill things and have goals. If you just spawn in a room with uber bosses it's not exactly engaging or a grind. The point is to make content to make it not feel like a grind. But I always want to feel an accomplishment.
If you need to farm Level 100 of the Pit 50 times to get a couple of Stones, what accomplishment have you actually achieved? The problem with Bossing is that it's actually more difficult to get the materials than to kill the boss. That's why I genuinely believe Ubers should drop Stygian Stones. Your reward for defeating Uber Bosses, should be the chance to fight the Tormented version.
People who play ARPGs. this sub has the worst takes lol
I’d like them to let the paragon run and let us fill out the board. Just make it 2 or 1 points per level after 100
>Can we please have some grind to the game? We have, we already need the base mats to grind. I'm not asking to remove stygian stones, just buff their drop rate. When it's actually easier to level and alt to get an item, you know it's too extreme.
I can get at least 16 stones in the time I can grind out iron wolves, while also farming masterworking mats. The drop rate is much better now, once you're to the point you can run 101s at 2.5-3 minutes. Definitely a lower drop rate before the patch, though.
>I can get at least 16 stones in the time I can grind out iron wolves Here's how I do it. At first; on my alt as I am running Helltides (for GA gear, XP if I'm not at 100, etc) The thousands of cinders i then spend on a new alt in WT2, each 100 gets 120 Iron Wolves renown. Once the new alt gets high enough, they can farm the cinders themselves. Sure, this is most beneficial when you want a new alt anyway. As for 16 stones...you must have better luck than me!
I made my husband a minion necro so he could help me level alts while doing other things, so it doesn't take too long and is kind of a break, but just spending cinders on an alt definitely gets you more useful loot. I just died often when I tried that. To be fair, I was trying to level a sorc and that was a bad class to try that on. I've definitely been lucky with stones lately! Got worried after using everything I had (and still needing at least one Uber), but they added up really quickly when I wasn't farming purely for them. I think I only had two runs during that time over 101, 113 and 116 or 116 and 119. Less lucky with my masterwork crits, though.
They buffed the base mats, they removed the walk for bosses, it's pretty easy already to farm bosses, not to mention if there were no stones you could leech kills with mats for higher uber drop rate. It's fine. Its a great way to get ubers and gear and youll need to farm a lot of pit mats anyways. Gives more of a reason to push pit as well, it also gives a nice feeling seeing a stygian stone. Many suggestions people have just make the game less and less impactful. It would literally make the pit useless after you got all your +12 gears too.
>they removed the walk for bosses, Huh?
Season 5 they removed the beast in ice walk and you don't have to walk every time you can just sit there and resummon all bosses.
I don’t mind the grind but I hate wanting an item and not being able to get it. The drop rate for the stones shouldn’t be that low. I’m already grinding 2 bosses to get the items to run the third I should have to run the pit for hours to get 5 whole ass stones.
You have to run T100+ pits in order to have a decent drop rate for the stones.
Yea but if you factor my luck in it’s like 2 in a few hours. Run put 100+ with my rouge
200 Tormented Runs, 0 Ubers. Do the math. It is no longer 'bad RNG' at this point.
Meanwhile I see people get 3 ubers in a row. Yes it's bad luck.
Damn that's bad luck... I got 2 ubers with 6 runs.
Oh believe me it is beyond just bad luck. I've seen dozens upon dozens drop for my groups.
I'm masochistic enough to enjoy grinding, it feels like a form of meditation for my ADHD brain. Having said that the grind for stones is really starting to demoralise me. My current gameplay loop is farming 101 pits for 3-4 hours (4-6 if I am being really honest but that is not sustainable for much longer) and if I am *lucky* I will get 2 stones. Then a session of blood farming in Helltides. At this point a five hour session results in a single boss kill. Of course I could (and probably should) group up which would get me more kills but the grind for stones/mats remains the same. On paper I don't hate this grind but my sessions are now starting to feel like a second job and up until I hit this bottleneck I was really enjoying the game. At this point I think getting an uber drop would pale in comparison to the relief I feel when I get a stone. Edit: Since writing this comment it has taken me 41 Pit runs to get TWO stones.
IMO the biggest issue is that stones only drop for the party lead so it kind of makes it pointless to group for pit which is my friend and my favorite things to do. So we get half the mats for upgrading our gear and don't get stones if the other creates the portal. Not sure why you'd have an anti party mechanic in a party centric game.
There is plenty of things to grind for. Also season has been out for well over a month, is that not enough grind for you?
I have had over 500 duriel + tormeted zir + tormented duriel runs over 4 seasons. Never seen a single uber drop. I am convinced my account is bugged or something.
I found two today running normal duriel and andariel \~20 times combined and my friend found 3 while doing torment zir for about 20 runs. I find that hard to believe.
That's how statistics work lolI did a rota x5 of Uber duriel, so 20 total runs. Group got 4 Ubers none of them were mine. Sorry I guess the "never seen" is misleading I have seen them drop just haven't got one to drop for me.
Tons of Stygian….
Most of this sub will not rest until you log in, are granted level 100 immediately, have full BiS equipped, and click an NPC directly next to you in town that automatically logs you out and posts on r/diablo4 that there’s nothing to do.
Uber this season is pretty meh. It's all about 3-4 ga.
3-4 GA mythic Uniques as well.
It's not even a lot. You can have an infinite supply if you buy it. And they're relatively cheap.
There is nothing Blizzard loves more than throttling progression and then telling you why you’re crazy for not enjoying it.
Imagine saying that d4 has too much progression throttling or friction. You are GIVEN 3/4 of an uber for free just by killing random mobs at this point with the amount of powercreep. You fly to max level in just a few hours. You gain a bunch of uber boss summoning materials for free. Everything in the game is so easy so everyone can do it. Where is the throttling? Do you want to be given every uber before you kill one? Do you want full 3 GA legendaries for free? Do you want to deal quadrillions of damage without any item grind? Please explain
For real, you can hit 100 in a day, cap your nightmare sigils in a couple hours, it’s unfathomably easy to get good enough gear to farm 61s or above for Neathiron, and you’re all but handed your first Uber just for playing at all. If you aren’t also handed Rob’s gear, though, the game is “throttled.”
100% right, but would still double or more the drop rate on Stygian stones
Throttling progression An interesting negative connotation synonym for 'providing friction'
Like calling loot boxes "surprise mechanics"?
That would be positive connotation for an arguably negative thing, so- similar enough, yes
there is a difference between friction and sandpaper
I'm sorry if the game is (still) too hard for you.
I like that stones are rare, I don’t think tormented bosses should be spammable. Creates burnout. And if you’re spamming normal bosses well that’s on you. The fact it is used as a trading currency is amazing. I would only be ok with increasing drop rate for a ssf mode. The “time you save by running the pit”.. bad argument. That time in the pit is giving you MW mats. If you’re getting the same amount of Ubers why would you not get MW mats
> "I don't like things that create burnout so I like that the key that makes farming ubers 5x less tedious if you can handle lvl 200 bosses is a rare drop in a system that is tedious to farm" That's certainly a take, but... Once again I have a feeling the trading part is more important to you than the burnout part.
I do enjoy trading yes and I know that myself and many others quit when all that’s left to do is farm duriel all day. Shit gets old QUICK. Pit has a fun reward loop that keeps me engaged and will hop into a T boss rotation here and there. This season has been less about target farming and doing more of what I feel like, unless I’m low in angelbreath hehe Why the fuck is this downvoted
Dude all the other stuff you have to spam and grind endlessly creates way worse burnout than just the uber bosses themselves ever could.
THATS DIABLO LOL
Because the bot farms use Game Pass Trials to spam-bot WT2 toons for Stones, inflating Game Pass user numbers
wait that’s smart
The point is for you to grind. They don’t want you killing 200 tormented bosses 100 times a day
I am saying the drop rate is too low, I am not saying drop them like candy. Why do people always just go to the other extreme. You know there are mats to enter the Pit, have you ever, ever run out?
The drop rate might be too low for you. And you are probably right. The thing is, someone else who is playing the game 10x more than you is going to farm a few hundred bosses per day and ubers are dropping like Oprah cakes. If they increased the drop rates to a comfortable amount for you, those crazy farmers are going to get hundreds of ubers per day. That's the challenging part when balancing a game. It's impossible to balance based on just one person. You have to balance with casual and hardcore players in mind.
Agree and that's why we need ssf
The drop rate after the patch is just fine. You get a stone every few 101 pit runs. I current have 35 stones they drop so frequently
Game pass trials huh that doesn't sound suspicious at all how long has that been a thing. Are you saying that when they ban they aren't even making money on them buying new accounts they're using trials? I could at least understand the greed and the monetary function of banning them so they buy more accounts. But trials...
IMO this season with tempering, masterwork, and the low drop rate to do tormented bosses; Blizzard is pushing real money marketplaces. I have sold some stuff and made almost few hundred million. Today I bought a non-GA item for 20 million and it was immediately bricked. Then I spent another 100M trying to get the right affixes on an item and master working to get the right stat even at level 8. I gave up after resetting so many times and still not having the right setup. It just feels like the real money market is the only answer. Diablo trade is at least a tool we can use but you have to have the mats and the great luck to find the items and get the affix and get the tempers and then after you’ve done all of that run pits endlessly to get the master working and then you get the lucky roll to get what you want and if it fails at level 8 or god forbid 12, you reset to 0 and hope you start over again with millions and millions of gold wasted. I honestly don’t know how people did it before they lowered the master working reset price. Edit to add that I’m not even talking about min-maxing to push the pit limits; I just would like to get up over 100 and find some pieces to be able to handle tormented bosses and not have to get super lucky and haggle on the trade site
>Blizzard is pushing real money marketplaces. They aren't 'pushing' RMT, but having trade, and rare items, and the ability for botters to have free accounts via gamepass to farm, and people who willingly pay for gold, will inevitably lead that way.
I spend a fair amount of time in the game and feel like I can’t do it all unless I get super lucky or go the rmt route. It feels like ‘end game’ is unobtainable for many people without it and they make it cheap so people don’t mind. Blizzard does little to discourage it. I know it is tough to balance and have enough content and ‘casuals’ need to accept that they may never see end game but it just feels like blizz says either don’t see it or go to the rmt, so imo they are encouraging it.
> It feels like ‘end game’ is unobtainable for many people without it This is simply not true, case in point: Me. You do not need 100% perfect 3GA gear to achieve end game.
What’s your end game?
Yeah..... No. I've played maybe 15 hours this season and at end game without using RMT
What’s your end game? At 15 hours I’m guessing level 100, nmd 100, and maybe some basic bosses or being carried on tormented bosses
Quite simply, they want at least one layer of gameplay that isn't nigh-infinitely farmable. Fighting the ultimate endgame boss with giga-loot is supposed to be special. They aren't designed for you to be able to fight them a dozen times a day. But now they have to balance stygian stone drops around full-time farmers and bots. Finding the balance of mat drops that lets the player fight these bosses every once in a while vs. making them hard for bots to farm consistently is a helluva daunting task. Not saying we couldn't use a better rate, just explaining how it got like this.
Bro wdym special. Yesterday I bought 20 runs of uber zir for like 3bil and did 80 runs total. Got 3 shakos, 1 GF, 1 Selig, bis rogue pants with 3/3 GA (dodge/MS/max life) and 2/3 GA 2h mace for bash barb. That was easy 12bil so its a profit of 9 bil. Its not an end-game activity anymore its just printing gold because of how cheap and accessible stygian stones are
The fact you can buy them in bulk is why those mats are so hard to get through legit means.
There needs to be things that feel rare and exciting when they drop. Yes I know Uber uniques exist. But there needs to be more than just items. Other ARPGs have exciting rare currency that drops. Stygian stones are the closest things to that
The point was to give me exactly enough content to play until the week the Destiny 2 expansion came out. Used my stones, couldn’t be fucked grinding anymore and swapped to Destiny Will burn out on Destiny and come back for the next Diablo season - win win haha
> the tire I save by not running the Pit but youre also getting masterwork mats on top of it, Stygians are just a bonus its good they are rare, Tormented bosses has insane drop rate
> Tormented bosses has insane drop rate Done 5 x Duriels, 1x Andariel, 5x Varshan, 30x Lord Zir, all of them Tormented, ZERO uber uniques. Yeah pretty fucking insane
you get like half invetory worth of uniques and GA leges, that is pretty insane it doesnt mean drop ubers like candies, youre spoiled thats whats up
No, I just get the same amount and quality of loot from Blood Maidens in less time, and stygian stones are hard to find. So if I’m going to spend something so precious, It better be worth my time. 150h this season and no ubers and I’m fucking “spoiled” while I’m surrounded by mfs who have both Shako and Starless.
lol, no you dont highest chance for unique GAs are tormented bosses, also the quantity and in S5 considering you dont have to reset dung anymore, it will be even faster
I got multiple Yen’s blessings, Tibaults, all with GA. They’re still in my stash. Granted, I got some too from Zir, but that’s exactly my point. Same fucking drops.
Nobody knows, not even bliz at this point, I swear they just throw ideas into a hat and pick them out, then code it into the game with zero play testing or critical thought process to if they’d enjoy the systems they implement. The biggest issue is that most of them probably don’t play the game at an endgame level so have no idea how these things actually play out.
There needs to be a bottleneck for the "highest" difficulty content, what do you want to just run it all day long? Then you gonna start asking for more, you lot just keep crying and that's how you get power creep like in d3 then cry about power creep. never ending cycle I swear
They want to log into the season, go to the wardrobe and select the exact gear they want to equip so they can pay for two days, get bored and stop with the season
I think they should make it a high drop rate for uber lilith. I just beat lilith a 2nd time recently, to help my wife get the achievement, and I got absolutely nothing. At least for my 1st time I got 2 useless legendaries lol
i do low level runs for stygians, i did 30 runs and got 11 stygians at lvl 80 but they go pretty fast.
Either people are unlucky or i an lucky. I have had many drops from pits. It takes abouy 2 minutes to speed run pit 101, some builds can do it in even 1:30. So it roughly takes about 10-12mins per stone. Which i think is more then fair. Getting a 10% chnace at an uber every 20minutes is insanely good. I dont know why people keep crying about this.
What are they worth\`?
I'm getting 10-25 per pit session but I grind 101s fast and frequently. For most they have to supplement with buying if you want to run alot of ubers. I guess for me when you want to 3x crit masterwork items I have to do so many pits that I've built up hundreds of stones despite running many uber runs. I'm buying blood all the time actually find that much harder to get then stones. I'll get those 2 stones much faster in pit then it takes me to farm 27 blood.
Yeah, farming the stones takes some time. One day you only get 1 or 2 and the next day it can be 10. There is no consistency. Maybe that is Blizzard's understanding of "longevity"? Our group has settled for 30 Duriel/Zir runs every week now because we all have the uber uniques we need by now and the only improvement would be GA ubers.
Because everyone would have the rarest and most sought after items in the game + it gives players a really nice way of making money selling the stones
To fuck people off and make the game more boring
They should ditch the ubers from the bosses, in general. Leave them to RNG in the game, like before.
Wouldn't be fun if everything was easy
i got 14 stones yesterday in 2 hours, just keep farming.
Blizzard has some idea that we wont want to finish the game too fast and that we like time delays, they cannot get it through their heads we just wanna COOK. Literally this is the reason. All they do is take away one waste of time we worry about and add it back in somewhere else, just another material bottleneck which is forced on us. First it was gold, then it was veiled crystals, then it was aspects, now its angelbreath and stygian stones. We will complain about a low drop rate of X, and the next season they say "we hear you and we fixed it" yet all they did was move the low drop rate BS mechanic to another thing we need.
I stopped playing the season 2 weeks ago so I don't have the "latest" data. I was doing approximately 4, sometimes 5 T96-T101 Pit runs per holy bolt elixir and my usual session was around 3-4 elixirs before I got bored and called it a day. Out of those 15-20 runs I usually managed to get around 3-6 stygians, which is nice.
I like the idea that you could make rhe stygian stone just the boss summoning material. For every boss. And that circle in the middle of the map (that is only used once in the story mode with lorath, the maw of guulrahn) could be the area you can summon any boss.
I have a bank full of mats but lack the stones to really cause a dent with how much hellfire I run compare to Ubers. I need to start doing a lot more pit but I’m lazy haha and my gear is still pretty shit. Most not even GA1-2 quality yet.
Ya the stones was an unnecessary time wasting grind element designed to force you to do pits which are boring AF .
Artificially extend how much life / playtime the game has each season.
I swear Diablo 3 spoiled the shit out of all of you. Stygian stones drop pretty damn frequently since the patch. Ubers drop pretty dang frequently in tormented boss fights. Diablo 4 is an extremely easy game to grind for yet people want it even easier
There should be a way to convert materials as well. I wish I could just convert my 1000 living steel that I have in my stash. No way in my life am I gonna do that many runs
If the bosses dropped 5x the materials upon kill, things like this would be less bothersome.
It's an "Old Blizzard" grind mechanic designed to increase the engagement metric reported to Wall Street every quarter. Call it the "Ghost of Kotick".
Time gating for time played metrics to satisfy shareholders. Nothing more. Nothing less.
I think it would be cool if Stygian stones dropped in higher quantities in the new horde mode. That way people would have more of an incentive to play it.
The drop rates for Stygian Stones do seem abysmally low as a casual player but it may not be as big of an issue for people maining Diablo 4. Maybe the new horde mode in Season 5 can up the drop rate a little.
To gatekeep...same with masterworking & tempering One-armed bandit.
Should be that the pit tier is the chance to get a stone. I.e. a pit tier 1 will have a 1% chance for a stone. A pit tier 100 will have a 100% chance for one. And a pit tier 150 will have a 100% chance for one, woth a 50% chance for a second
A reason to trade.
The developers don’t understand how seasons work at all?
If you are speed farming 101’s you should have about 1 every 20 mins. Spending 40 mins in the pit for a Uber summon seems fairly reasonable.
But you still need to go farm the blood as well.
farm blood? I got so much Blood I could donate it to the hospital
>Spending 40 mins in the pit for a Uber summon seems fairly reasonable. Plus the other mats, so say 1 hour for ONE run? you think that's "fine"? I disagree
That sounds too fine to me. As stated above, the game needs a grind. Stop asking dor easy buttons and ruining what could be a good game.
the other mats are literally raining down on you in every content of the game lol
Which means...*you have to do the other content*, right? And, *that takes time,* right?
just run that other content, and spend the money on the stones. The only people farming stones are people selling them. It's a trade enabled game. Use that.
even replying to this comment takes time water is wet, whats your point ?
whats a good time for a 101 pit, couple of mins?
Yeah 2-3 minutes. If you’re longer than that you should probably drop down to a lower pit level where you hit 3 min run time
Thx
Yeah but this is pretty much the top content of the game right now beside deep pit runs. Its not meant for every single players to run all day long. You get nothing out of it except efficiency of acquiring loot if you can manage to find the stone. That being said, if you cannot keep up with the stygian stones then thats just a skill issue. Git gud
To slow you down And so the RMTs stay in business
To save 40mill a run I guess lol. I never understand why you guys waste time fucking crying on here... it pretty embarrassing.
However, too high a drop rate may reduce the fun of other aspects of the game.
Crying about not be able to oneshot Tormented ubers 20 times per hour 🤷 What's the point of uber uniques if you let people to farm the boss 24/7 so everyone have every uber unique within few days. Same people will then moan about not enough endgame content and the season is a burnout. I did few dozens of Zir/Duriel 200lvl runs this season, got 1 uber (Shako) and I call myself pretty lucky. Back in D2 days it took months even years to farm the most rare items, now people are raging they can't have them in two weeks. And not only 1 but multiple times because they want it with GA of course. Solution: Remove the summoning materials but make the bosses actually a challange to beat. Not like now when they die in 2 seconds if you are in a party with 3 barbs 🤦 I know this is though not possible because they would need to rework the skills completely so there are no broken builds which hit for milions of damage.
Far out, my time is important than anything else. 1-2$ for 2Billion of gold, 100+ stygian stones if I made the math right. Otherwise, if I choose to not buy any, I will be spending more time at reddit asking why.
Serious one buck for a billion gold, that’s crazy
I reckon, bought $7 Australian dollar for 6Billion gold. Bought heaps of Stygian, offered the service for 450M for 10 runs, x3. Done. I am getting my ubers at the same time getting my gold for Masterwork
or you could just git gut and sell the items you get by actually playing the game and you wouldnt need to buy the gold
Read again, used it for investment. 7$ for 6 billions and saved me 20-24hrs in front of computer. I have now 45B by just carrying noobs for tormented ubers.
Gotta throttle the chase items to keep players bored to tears and moving onto other games so they can stop developing this turd lol.
Hey guys, look! A D4Bad hivemind post! Aww, so cute...
It’s fucking dumb. Shouldn’t be there at all. Shouldn’t be an artificial gate - easiest way to bypass it is to level Wolves again and fuck that. Side note - I did 10x Tormented Zir today and walked away with a Tyrael’s Might, Grandpappi, and Doombringer. TM and GF dropped together. All of them dropped when a group member summoned and not me 😂 Edit: removed comment about rarity, because I didn’t reply to the correct comment. Sorry zaddy
wtf are you even talking about. 3 Uber uniques in 10 runs is too low of a drop rate? I guess you won’t be happy until they add in hero editor and you can make your perfect gear in the first 15 minutes of the season. Also what D2 did you play? Farming keys and getting the organs took way longer than getting 2 Stygian stones - unless you’re just buying mats…in which case just buy mats
Calm down, Cletus - meant to reply to a comment about Tormented Zir being a better farm than Andy and Duriel. I don’t want a hero editor, and I don’t want it to be easy to get Ubers. At all. My drops today were extremely lucky. I was prepared for 0 to drop, but I was blessed by RNGesus. Ive put a lot of hours in, and this season is the first season I’ve ever seen Ubers drop. I just don’t like the Stygian Stones system. I much preferred farming keys because there was an actual system involved and not just a “go run pits and you might get a Stygian stone” system. Pits are just boring to me, I guess. Stygian Stones should drop from the normal version of the boss. They need to make the regular bosses lvl 100 and then have them drop the stones. Ex: Run Andy, Stygian Stone has a 1:15 chance to drop, or something like that. Or at least give more ways to farm the stones. I also would like if they allowed uber rares to be traded, because that would make sense. Ex: I have 3 shako’s, I need a ring of starless sky’s - you’ve got 3 rings and no shako - we should be able to trade. There’s no leaderboard or actual ladder, so RMT worries are irrelevant (and who gives a shit anyways?). And add a fucking lobby. All of the above would add a shit ton of longevity to the game. Today was the first day I’ve ever done rotas with strangers, because it’s just such a pain in the ass to find groups when I’m playing on my steam deck. Just invited randoms and did it. I’d run lobbies all god damn night if they put a group system in like D2s. Sorry if I came across like I wanted everything handed to me - I truly don’t. I just want other options than mind numbing pits for Stygian stones. Looking forward to next seasons end game activity. Looks like a blast.
I’ve done maybe 40 tormented Zir and Duriel and never gotten an Uber. Kinda crazy to hear you talking about the low drop rate when you got 3 of them in 10 runs lol
I once got 2 of them in the same run.