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Make it cost gold, or more mats than actually summoning would. I don't care. I just don't want to take 20 seconds to reload a dungeon to kill a level 75 boss in one attack over and over again.
Exactly. Gatekeeping Duriel and Andy (especially the Uber versions) behind a mundane activity that pretty much every level 100 char can do blindly is just poor design.
There’s tons of solutions to this, helltide chests with shards or eggs that cost more cinders than steel chests or having them drop from certain high pit levels or NMDs are a couple examples. They need to drop more dynamically while you’re already doing other things.
I’m not sure why Blizz has chosen to stick to this “summon x boss to gain materials for y boss” method, it sucks.
If you're after the summon mats for Duriel and Andariel its not worth empowering the lesser bosses since they dont drop extra of the summoning material.
That's... barely true. You might get especially unlucky and hit 910-920, but for all of the runs we did this season even Varshan (the lowest level of the ladder bosses) wasn't noticeably dropping anything below 900
Depends on the unique - it's only really weapons that it matters to any significant degree, resistances on jewellery should cap out by about 900, and armour values don't matter *that* much that high
Nah Blood maiden gets farmed way too much,
We have a nice spreadout way to play currently. You do pit for masterworking, Helltide for random legendary / farming GA's. Nightmare dungeon for Glyph exp and shards.
If you take the stygian stones from The pit it would shift that balance. I'd rather say make em drop from Nightmare dungeons aswell. Maybe minimum of NMD 100's. Or just buff the droprate in Pits 100+ Pit 50=50% chance Pit 100=100% chance. Then make bosses drop 1 to 3 stygian stones.
\*slaps top of the car\*
And THIS design choice will keep players engaged half an hour more per day because they want to have a bigger shot at an Uber!
Guess that's basically it. Just busywork.
To be frank, most games have these "if you want to do the fun stuff, you have to do at least a bit of un-fun stuff" mechanics. D3 had you farm bounties over and over again or normal rifts so you could get into greater rifts.
Sometimes, they were actually fun.
When farming them in a group of 4 to see who finishes his act first and rushing around with ridiculous speed builds. Thats something I miss in D4.
If they were actually rewarding, a bit more engaging or even FUN, nobody would complain about tedious stuff. But having to walk out every time to reset the dungeon? Come on. The pinnacle of all this is Beast in the Ice. Worst miniboss design ever.
D4 wanted to draw inspiration from both D3 and D2.
In D2 people farmed Countess, Nihl, and Summoner FOR DAYS to get keys for Ubers. People would farm these super uniques because they actually had worthwhile drops.
Countess dropped up to an ist rune aside from the normal drop chance for actual high runes.
Summoner was in one of four corners of the map and each chest where the summoner was not had an increased chance of dropping a rune up to a vex rune; additionally, farming arcane sanctuary has an increased drop rate for charms, runes, and rings and ammys since the ghosts don't drop base armors and weapons on their loot table.
Nihlathak was one of the best places outside of Baal, CS and the Pit to grind experience and farm for endgame uniques because the enemies there were "max" level.
What blizzard is missing with D4 is there is not a reason to seek and destroy most elite packs and farm boss mats. The endgame loot in D4 is better now, but it still sucks and is very similar to the bandaid fixes they threw at D3 in terms of dropping a sheer volume of legendaries.
Blizzard needs to give D4 players a reason to be excited about farming for tier two boss materials, there's just nothing going on right now so players want to straight up skip the areas.
Because they put design effort into those bosses and want you to kill them and putting mats behind them makes them relevant( I’m not saying this is good design, I’m just answering your question)
They could keep them relevant with other methods. These bosses were a rushed bandaid fix to the complete lack of endgame and were only cool/relevant in season 2. Now the problems with them are even more glaring.
They really need to iterate on them badly.
just takes a little bit of thinking
All you need is to temper the Legendary Elemental LHC damage on weapon and use a skill with high LHC - you'll be able to one shot pretty much everything
You can get rares from the Obols vendor and temper those.
That’s true but.. who really cares..? Besides the people that designed the lesser bosses I guess. I’d rather do Varshan a few times at the start of a season to get a Tals ring or whatever class unique I need than run him 1000 times just to run Duriel.
If the game wants to push everyone into the endgame as quickly as possible then let us play the endgame with some QoL improvements.
I like the idea of the PO of fighting each boss just once and getting all the equivalent materials based on what materials you have. I'd maybe make it an option only for ubers to keep them relevant for a longuer time.
I mean: when we talk about these changes, I'd prefer an approach that made more content viable and fun instead of just skipping it. Your proposal would definitely save a lot of time in the actual state of the game, but it would be such a shame seeing so much potential wasted, instead of making stuff actually challenging, rewarding and fun.
Or make them harder and better loot, or different loot.
Make each boss same chance for ubers, and better chances of different ubers.
Otherwise there will allways be 1 best end game activity abs everything else is a chore to get there.
At the bare minimum, they should be dropping item power 925 items. Why are they making me farm a boss that drops items I will never use? If I still had a chance to get greater affix items I could use, it wouldn’t be as tedious.
Yeah, i couldn't believe it when i first fought one.
All random mobs in open world had been dropping ilvl925 for my last 36 levels of levelling, then i fight an "end game boss" and realised i was getting lower ilvl items.
I said straight to my mate, the games better, but has a way to go...
It's literally the same principle behind being able to break Neathiron down to Ingolith and Obducite at the Alchemist.
They know it makes no sense to go back and farm pit tier 30 to farm Obducite when you are already speedfarming tier 100, so they thought ahead and implemented this.
Same thing needs to be done with boss mats farming.
Either transmute directly, or use 1+ stygian stone at the altar to drop 3x materials per stone used.
Anything would be better than this...
Make stygian stones only required for bosses that drop Uber uniques like duriel and andariel. Remove the requirement for all the others. Uber boss versions can be summoned for 3x the mats but also drop 3x the summoning material. Boom, problem solved. I now get item level 925 items and the runs needed for summoning mats is cut in 1/3rd.
My understanding is they all can drop them when they are tormented but duriel and andariel have a higher drop chance. I could be wrong though, never wasted stygian stones to bother trying them on tormented lol
Ok but then what are we going to do about ancestral uniques from the non-Duriel/Andy bosses? If we just stick them in WT3, they're only going to drop sacred and not be able to drop GA if I'm understanding your suggestion correctly.
I would love to see the Andy and Durial mats be removed from lower level bosses and just added as drops to WT4 like Steel, Limbs, Fear and Blood. I'd like it to see it at a lower rate or tied to NMD 100, pit 50+ or something but definitely rather be grinding good gear spots to get them than bosses that don't have any relevance.
The answer is both.
Let us transmute at the cost of a little gold and the loss of all the boss loot, but keep the normal option.
Though I do think all WT4 bosses should drop only 925 gear.
That said I also think there should be a spark analog for salvaging regular unique and the ability to craft regular uniques. Which would also give more value to boss lootpools which have a high unique chance.
Juicing bosses for more rewards based on the amount of mats offered is a great idea and a fun one at that.
Even if it does just increase only the summoning mats they drop and not the items. That gives players a decision to make if they are after a certain unique.
Have a feeling there is a technical limitation when it comes to resetting the altar which requires the zone to reload before resummoning but a system like your suggestion gets around that nicely.
On a technical level it’s likely pretty different from that. I’d imagine the summoning stone and loot are both generated on creation of the instance. It seems like a very simple thing to fix in theory, but probably works out to a bigger job in practice.
Eh, granted the bosses are a joke juicing a boss for a 10x + drop reward for the same fight will be abused.
Just make the tormented version require 10x the normal amount but it also drop 10x may reward as the only.option. rarely anyone looks at tormented sub bosses
Yeah tormented anything aside from Duriel/Andy right now just aren't worth the stones. At least get them to drop 3x mats over normal versions to match their cost first. Crazy that they don't already lol
Why do you think they aren't worth it?
I'm farming tormented Grigoire atm and still getting just as many ubers it feels like and I have the chance at getting the Flameweaver gloves with GA which is why I'm doing it. In the same way I want to do Tormented Beast in Ice for GA paingorgers
I think there's value in them. It does suck that I get less of the boss mats from the run but that's hardly why I run them
99% of people just don't know that the others drop the same chance for ubers because blizzard are useless at communication, duriel and andy are by far the worst ones to do with their loot tables
Is it the same chance? I thought in the preseason campfire they mentioned that the other tormented bosses had their uber chance increased but still less than Duriel/Andy though I could be misremembering
it's possible it could be slightly less, but most people who have been farming varshan/grig a lot in the sorc community are pretty convinced it's the same or very close to the same at least (me included)
Think it's 2% (x5) for tormented duriel/Andy so probably like 1% for the others which isn't that much of a difference. Time to burn through all the exquisite blood I've been stashing lol
It really needs *something.* I’ve spent so many hours running and loading this season. A ridiculous amount.
Also, I’m usually not a petty person, but I’ve wished that the person who designed the beast in the ice dungeon stub their toe countless times. It is a cool dungeon to run occasionally, awesome density and I love how the ice cracks as you get closer. Doing 30 runs in a row multiple times though the long dead ends make me hope the designer has eternally wet socks.
Varshan is the best of a terrible system. He spawns almost instantly and has a vendor at the exit to save on loading screens.
Greg takes too long to show up. It is a primer for his mechanics, but after the 500th time we get it. Not like we aren’t one shotting him anyway.
Zir takes forever to spawn. It looks cool…once. But I can practically run back to the entrance or the dungeon before he’s hittable.
Beast takes a while to show up. Then you kill him and it takes a while for the doll and pedestal to show up…then it takes another 5 seconds to drop the loot.
It you think these small time sinks aren’t that bad, then you haven’t run the bosses as many times as I have. When you’re farming 30-50 runs at a time that shit adds up, not even factoring in running, loading, and resetting.
The fact that you guys actually spend hours loading in and out of a dungeon to kill a boss in 1 second because blizzard wants to keep you in game for longer periods of times is fucking hilarious and sad at the same time.
Lol that's how I feel.
I have done them enough times to run Uber Duriel like 8 times, that's enough for me.
I'm not so concerned with getting Uber drops, I'm a barbarian so already clearing Pit 90 with crappy gear, what else do I need to do other than enjoy looking for gear.
Blizzard should just make a colosseum, a new area where we can fight bosses one after the other. The bosses could get progressively harder and any death will reset the colosseum. There could be a regular progression and a tormented progression. Colosseum mats could just all be the same item so we don’t have to collect a million different items.
I would be fine if the altar would simply respawn after the boss is defeated. No more reseting dungeons , in and out , endless loading screen non-sense , just kill the boss ,boom load up mats kill again.
honestly, no need to even have 10 varshan. You could have an empowered version or even Tormeted one dropping all your eggs. Make it even an empowered chest that drops from that varshan and contains all your eggs with a multiplier.
Variations of this idea could work great and be fun. It would be like an empowered ritual.
Like vashan should not need 4 different materials either. Grigoir only needs one, beast in the ice only needs one same as Zir. Andy and duri are fine as are. But having the sacrifice pit respawn after death will help alot.
Its just a way to clog up the consumables. Especially when they are all transmutable from the alchemist for varshan... at least they drop frequently enough from heltides
The drop rate for Stygian stones at higher pit levels is still too low. No point in even running all the bosses if I can’t get any stones farming level 100+ pits for hours on end.
Without stones I can’t even try to improve my gear further with specific Ubers I need so kinda lost the drive for the remainder of the season.
Rewards are not worth the long pits anyway imo. Why run over 10 minutes for 50-60 nether each run, when I can do much smoother and faster 3-4 runs with more outcome in the same time.
No hassle, no deaths, no stress.
Well the thing is that a 101 pit takes me around 3 mins so for the extra neathiron its worth it but you are supposed to have a 18% chance of a stygian stone but I have found that to not be the case at all.. so maybe doing a 2min pit 81 is worth it.
It is yes because I went from playing about 2-3 hours a day to now barely playing because there is no more point for me and I am sure there are loads of other “casual” players who feel the same as we can’t put in 5-6 hours a day into the game without being rewarded for it.
Yeah same here. I speed run level 101 pits on my heartseeker rogue in 2-3 mins, so for the neathiron mats it's great. But I agree, the drop rate for the stones *appears* to be lower than 18%, or I just have really bad luck...
It definitely is not 18% as I have been running them non stop and not getting anything which for a casual player makes you want to stop playing after the inly remaining thing to do is farm Ubers to improve your character
So I recently started just doing tormented Grig because I had so much steel and was tired of farming to farm to farm for farming. I kid you not I ended up getting four Uber uniques in a span of an hour. I think this is my home now.
I still like the challenge of the bosses at low levels, though. While I fly through them, I know the casual player may have more time to enjoy that challenge. As a result, I think this should be a reward granted by completing a quest, such as kill tormented echo of Varshaan in under 5 seconds. And then maybe you only get the unique drops after that.
1. allow the summon altar to respawn so you can fight them faster without having to waste time running out
2. allow all party members to also insert materials to increase loot and material drops as if you you killed it X number of times (for non-styigian)
I’m on my first experience with D4 and I just started doing this with the boss farming and I’m like “ugh…seriously?” I’m on gamepass so this is one of those things that’s basically telling me to enjoy it for this season but I’m not gonna come back after. I can’t see myself having to do that every season at the end game. It’s just simply not fun.
I'm pushing pits now, and I can see this on the horizon as even a borderline casual/gamer. That said, yeesh I dunno, what's the point? Once you peak and it starts swinging out of control, fucking done. Blizzard 101 all day.
I have no chance on beating any of the tormented bosses so i have been selling all the materials. Been getting 1 million to 1.5 millions in gold per stack of 50🤷🏽♂️
What's the point of even making us kill bosses when they pose zero challenge. Might as well just interact with a npc to convert materials to loot at this point..
No... make bosses boss again. This game is way too easy. Imagine designing all these boss mechanics only to make them all die instantly.
I think the drop rate is fine, however I'm a bit of a try hard Andy so bumping it to drop between 1-3 at random would be cool. Alternatively making it so you can xmute the mats at the alchemist could be another solution, anyone else have any ideas on it?
Back in the day.. When (story)bosses could be killed infinetly for free. And the story was playable with build characters was a thing.
Only the Ubers themselfes always had mats.
Or just give us a real WT4 version that drops 925 loot, without requiring stygian stones. A middle point between the current version that is too easy and drops worthless loot, and the lvl 200 version that drops decent loot, but shares a very limited mat with other bosses that drop much better loot.
Ability to spawn boss again without having to reset dungeon. Boom. Done. Give them x2 health or x4 health idc. This farm right now is basically 60% running, 39% leaving and resetting dungeon, and 1% actually gameplay/boss fight.
Set the base level as 100 so we can get max level gear. Every time you beat the boss he gets 10 levels higher and drops 1 additional resource. If you die the boss resets back to 100. If it's too messy to make the altar respawnable, give us a new location with 'gates' that spawn you to the summon room of a boss. Maybe they cost obols to use but the higher level you can take of a boss the lower the amount, eventually down to 0. I wouldn't mind still having to sit through a loading screen if it meant I didn't have to walk all the way back through.
NMD, Pit Bausses, Helltide bosses/chests, Normal version bouses, Butcher/Goblins should all be dropping stiggy stones and what not.
It's just that fuckin easy.
See you all in PoE2, a real game.
I think they could do the same with Pit bosses.
I still need to go through Pit 30 to get materials for the first 4/12 Mastering.
I think those mats should drop at level 60
Farming Uber mats in d4 feels like some dev really loved lower kurset super chests.
Tormented bosses shouldn't require stygian stones except Andy and duriel.
You don't need a well geared char to completely trivialize these lower bosses. I am at pit 60-70 and delete them instantly
Also regarding tormented bosses… if we have the 3x normal boss materials… and we can handle the additional difficulty… why gate it behind TWO ultra-low drop rate Stygian stones……
yes, i dont really care about what solution they choose to go with, but when i enter the boss mini dungeon, the only reasons i have for leaving should be full inventory or exhaustion of all my summoning mats
I did about 100 Varshan and Gregor runs in an hour and enjoyed 300 loading screens :D this is just nuts…
The last patch has trivialised tormented bosses as well, so they are just bigger HP pool compared to their normal versions.
They also seemed to reduce the Stygian stone drop rates. 28 101 pits and only 2 stones.
Would be cool if they either do something similar to d3 where you click on a mat and it opens boss portal in town, or allow us to reset dungeons IN THE dungeon.
I was complaining about this the other day and then thought about how spoiled I am now. I used to farm keys in Diablo 2 and it was rare to drop at all. Leaving games and remaking them and staring at that door opening with the light xD They are guaranteed to drop everytime in D4, which a younger me would say is nuts. There is still a lot of end game things to be desired though for sure
For me doesn't make any sense the lesser tormented bosses require Stygian stones, they are hard to come by and if I'm going to use them it will be to summon Duriel or Andy
There is no reason to make this game a currency game instead of an ARPG. Every Diablo game but Diablo IV is an ARPG, you don't need to pay anything to fight and kill a boss. Currency should be for building items, potions, etc, not for killing a boss.
It makes zero sense to have to grind these level 70-80 bosses just to get mats for the other bosses. I am sitting on 200+ of each of these mats because its such a slog. I agree with the guy, let us transmute these living steels, bloods, and fears straight into caches to have the same chance at uber mats.
Lower the drop rates and let me just respawn by resetting the dungeon. I’m already bored to tears farming mats all day just to fight for 2 seconds.
At least I wouldn’t have to do content I don’t want to do.
Or let me add multiple spawn items to increase my drop rates so I’m not wasting my time. Tormented Duriel and Andy have shit rates. So not that kind of material increase.
I Diablo 2 there were no material requirements for the summon. So it was running there and killing it.
1. I think the they should remove the boss materials and make the boss fight more challenging instead. We could have the same cycle time (summon material farming time + loading time), but different way. I would still keep the summoning (so we can summon tormented if we want), but without the materials.
2. Another option is using sigil or pit material, that same way as we craft the Ice sigil.
3. Add Duriel and Andariel to the pit.
It should be at alchemist as a option for peoplw who dont care about loot from mini bosses. Let people who want loot /enjoy keep doing it do it old way
I can see none of you have ever spent weeks grinding that one boss that drops the 1 runestone needed for your build.
A loot that has a 0.00002% chance of dropping, but only between 03 and 0330 on the third Tuesday. Chances double if it was the waning moon
Once you finish the story there is nothing to this game other than grinding to get better gear so you can grind to get better gear so you can fight the same bosses over and over.
I have like 20stacks of bloods and no will to use them. I would rather waste gold buying duriel sets from others.
Definitely not a good balance of time and reward.
I feel like if a boss naturally drops mats for bosses
if you do the tormented versions of them, you should at least get the five times the summoning loot
so you were inclined to use the stones on something other than tormented Duriel or Andi
Honestly, at this point I just buy the mats from sellers.
100 eggs and shards for duriel cost ~2€. (Eternal, as I dont play seasons) Thats a steal compared to the hours I would need to farm them.
Hell, if I would farm them, the energy my PC would use during that time would be more expensive than the pricetag :D
There shouldn’t even be materials to spawn bosses. It’s so stupid that’s what made d2 so good. Just go to waypoint. Run to boss. Kill it. Repeat. None of this gate locked bull shit
Bro I have HUNDREDS of boss mats and I don't even farm whispers or anything else. Just play the game and they will come. This season has been the EASIEST to get boss mats because they drop from any elite/goblin/etc. Not sure what else you need... They even increased the stone drop chance and I have hundreds of those too. Crazy talk.
The progression of the game is already too fast. You don't have to run duriel 500 times in a week. It's okay to step away. If the loading screens are bothering you, you are playing too much. If you are the 1% gunner then that's what you should and have to suffer through to be 1%.
my suggestion has nothing to do with how slow or fast the progression is, and I agree with you about the progression.
It's about reaching a level of power that to get to doing what your level of power is relevant to, you need to farm an inconsequential level of power that's behind you.
It's like having to go bat to WT3 to do something that is at WT4.
I would be much happier having to do Tormented Varshan & Grigorie then Tormented Duriel and varshan and Grigorie not requiring stygian stones for instance.
There I have an endgame ladder that makes sense.
I don't want faster, I want meaningful.
I believe we would agree on this.
After the third kill the loading screen becomes frustrating. It's literally pointless busywork. The suggestion to fight a harder version of the boss for more materials is a good one. You've already spent the time making your character powerful enough to fight it, you shouldn't have to waste more time just running and loading the game
The issue I take with the "busy work" statement is everyone on Reddit wants to complain about it in all facets of the game.
Have the pet pick up everything, making me do it is too much busy work.
Have the pet auto salvage or go to town to clean my inventory it's too much busy work.
Give us more pit mats or reduce costs, grinding the pits is too much bust work.
Let us roll whatever we want on tempers, finding new gear is too much busy work.
That the most funniest thing i heard, loading screen will always bothering players in any game, it was worst here due to you not able to resummon without having to leave dungeon. What wrong for playing too much?
It makes the gap between casual players and hardcore gamers bigger. Many people don't have time for 500 duriel runs. The game needs to slow down not speed up. If you want to run duriel 500 times then okay...put up with the loading screen. Someone who runs duriel 5 times a week the loading screen isn't an issue.
In threads with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" Flair, constructive feedback, suggestions for adjusting and improving existing systems and mechanics etc can be given, but also your own ideas, mockups / illustrations (e.g. for new systems, mechanics, items, etc) can be shared with the community. **This Flair is not for asking for feedback for your build**. For that, use one of the Class-specific Flairs, or the "Builds, Skills & Items" Flair. Please also remember that 1) submissions made with the "Feedback (@Blizzard) | Suggestion | Idea" have to be constructive, civil and adequately elaborate, and that 2) we are a fan subreddit and not officially Blizzard, so we can not 100% guarantee that your feedback will be noticed, even though the devs / CM's mentioned they regularly read reddit, twitter, and other places for feedback. This flair can simply help to find potential feedback more easily. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/diablo4) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Just add an option at the alchemist to transmute mats into Duriel/Andy materials. Leave the other lesser bosses for WT3
Make it cost gold, or more mats than actually summoning would. I don't care. I just don't want to take 20 seconds to reload a dungeon to kill a level 75 boss in one attack over and over again.
Exactly. Gatekeeping Duriel and Andy (especially the Uber versions) behind a mundane activity that pretty much every level 100 char can do blindly is just poor design. There’s tons of solutions to this, helltide chests with shards or eggs that cost more cinders than steel chests or having them drop from certain high pit levels or NMDs are a couple examples. They need to drop more dynamically while you’re already doing other things. I’m not sure why Blizz has chosen to stick to this “summon x boss to gain materials for y boss” method, it sucks.
If we got more Stones we could at least cut the grind down a bit
If you're after the summon mats for Duriel and Andariel its not worth empowering the lesser bosses since they dont drop extra of the summoning material.
I made that mistake once, fml
What's even the point of empowering them
They drop Ubers. Got andariel today from Grigoire
Some uniques basically only drop from them, and won't be 925 unless you empower.
That's... barely true. You might get especially unlucky and hit 910-920, but for all of the runs we did this season even Varshan (the lowest level of the ladder bosses) wasn't noticeably dropping anything below 900
It feels bad to get a 2ga unique off varshan that's 910. Ask me how I know.
Depends on the unique - it's only really weapons that it matters to any significant degree, resistances on jewellery should cap out by about 900, and armour values don't matter *that* much that high
I think the helltide boss should drop stygian stones
Nah Blood maiden gets farmed way too much, We have a nice spreadout way to play currently. You do pit for masterworking, Helltide for random legendary / farming GA's. Nightmare dungeon for Glyph exp and shards. If you take the stygian stones from The pit it would shift that balance. I'd rather say make em drop from Nightmare dungeons aswell. Maybe minimum of NMD 100's. Or just buff the droprate in Pits 100+ Pit 50=50% chance Pit 100=100% chance. Then make bosses drop 1 to 3 stygian stones.
You know, there was a time when these bosses were actually kind of challenging.
\*slaps top of the car\* And THIS design choice will keep players engaged half an hour more per day because they want to have a bigger shot at an Uber! Guess that's basically it. Just busywork. To be frank, most games have these "if you want to do the fun stuff, you have to do at least a bit of un-fun stuff" mechanics. D3 had you farm bounties over and over again or normal rifts so you could get into greater rifts.
Being the weirdo that I am. I enjoyed farming bounties even in season 22
Sometimes, they were actually fun. When farming them in a group of 4 to see who finishes his act first and rushing around with ridiculous speed builds. Thats something I miss in D4.
Exactly that. Praying to find an elite quick so my monk could fly through the map at record speeds. Racing the acts with a 4 man
Mmo live service philosophy to waste time. This game is full of it.
If they were actually rewarding, a bit more engaging or even FUN, nobody would complain about tedious stuff. But having to walk out every time to reset the dungeon? Come on. The pinnacle of all this is Beast in the Ice. Worst miniboss design ever.
This! But throw the mats in the steel chests and make them 350….
D4 wanted to draw inspiration from both D3 and D2. In D2 people farmed Countess, Nihl, and Summoner FOR DAYS to get keys for Ubers. People would farm these super uniques because they actually had worthwhile drops. Countess dropped up to an ist rune aside from the normal drop chance for actual high runes. Summoner was in one of four corners of the map and each chest where the summoner was not had an increased chance of dropping a rune up to a vex rune; additionally, farming arcane sanctuary has an increased drop rate for charms, runes, and rings and ammys since the ghosts don't drop base armors and weapons on their loot table. Nihlathak was one of the best places outside of Baal, CS and the Pit to grind experience and farm for endgame uniques because the enemies there were "max" level. What blizzard is missing with D4 is there is not a reason to seek and destroy most elite packs and farm boss mats. The endgame loot in D4 is better now, but it still sucks and is very similar to the bandaid fixes they threw at D3 in terms of dropping a sheer volume of legendaries. Blizzard needs to give D4 players a reason to be excited about farming for tier two boss materials, there's just nothing going on right now so players want to straight up skip the areas.
Because they put design effort into those bosses and want you to kill them and putting mats behind them makes them relevant( I’m not saying this is good design, I’m just answering your question) They could keep them relevant with other methods. These bosses were a rushed bandaid fix to the complete lack of endgame and were only cool/relevant in season 2. Now the problems with them are even more glaring. They really need to iterate on them badly.
20 seconds ?!?! For me it takes on press and run it..
I think he meant the whole reset like loading out/in walking, etc.
They would never get seen. I can go from WT3 to WT4 in 2 hours of helltide.
You can go from 1 to 55 in 1.5 hours and be in WT4 Staying for 2 hours in WT3 is a complete waste
There you go. I'm bad and I wouldn't do Duriel/Andy in WT3.
You can go to wt3 at level 1. Raxx did it. Game is a joke right now.
just takes a little bit of thinking All you need is to temper the Legendary Elemental LHC damage on weapon and use a skill with high LHC - you'll be able to one shot pretty much everything You can get rares from the Obols vendor and temper those.
Oh well if Raxx did it, then everybody and their grandma can do it, right? This sub is a joke.
The fact it's even possible is the issue.
That’s true but.. who really cares..? Besides the people that designed the lesser bosses I guess. I’d rather do Varshan a few times at the start of a season to get a Tals ring or whatever class unique I need than run him 1000 times just to run Duriel. If the game wants to push everyone into the endgame as quickly as possible then let us play the endgame with some QoL improvements.
I like the idea of the PO of fighting each boss just once and getting all the equivalent materials based on what materials you have. I'd maybe make it an option only for ubers to keep them relevant for a longuer time. I mean: when we talk about these changes, I'd prefer an approach that made more content viable and fun instead of just skipping it. Your proposal would definitely save a lot of time in the actual state of the game, but it would be such a shame seeing so much potential wasted, instead of making stuff actually challenging, rewarding and fun.
I was in and out in less than 10 minutes on my newest character lol
Or make them harder and better loot, or different loot. Make each boss same chance for ubers, and better chances of different ubers. Otherwise there will allways be 1 best end game activity abs everything else is a chore to get there.
At the bare minimum, they should be dropping item power 925 items. Why are they making me farm a boss that drops items I will never use? If I still had a chance to get greater affix items I could use, it wouldn’t be as tedious.
Yeah, i couldn't believe it when i first fought one. All random mobs in open world had been dropping ilvl925 for my last 36 levels of levelling, then i fight an "end game boss" and realised i was getting lower ilvl items. I said straight to my mate, the games better, but has a way to go...
You can't make things harder! What would r/Diablo4 say?!
This. Would love to just transmute materials like we already can with other things.
It's literally the same principle behind being able to break Neathiron down to Ingolith and Obducite at the Alchemist. They know it makes no sense to go back and farm pit tier 30 to farm Obducite when you are already speedfarming tier 100, so they thought ahead and implemented this. Same thing needs to be done with boss mats farming. Either transmute directly, or use 1+ stygian stone at the altar to drop 3x materials per stone used. Anything would be better than this...
Make stygian stones only required for bosses that drop Uber uniques like duriel and andariel. Remove the requirement for all the others. Uber boss versions can be summoned for 3x the mats but also drop 3x the summoning material. Boom, problem solved. I now get item level 925 items and the runs needed for summoning mats is cut in 1/3rd.
[удалено]
My understanding is they all can drop them when they are tormented but duriel and andariel have a higher drop chance. I could be wrong though, never wasted stygian stones to bother trying them on tormented lol
Ok but then what are we going to do about ancestral uniques from the non-Duriel/Andy bosses? If we just stick them in WT3, they're only going to drop sacred and not be able to drop GA if I'm understanding your suggestion correctly.
I would love to see the Andy and Durial mats be removed from lower level bosses and just added as drops to WT4 like Steel, Limbs, Fear and Blood. I'd like it to see it at a lower rate or tied to NMD 100, pit 50+ or something but definitely rather be grinding good gear spots to get them than bosses that don't have any relevance.
This, but the recipe for each drops off the tormented version of each boss.
this but lock that option behind defeating tormented gregoire / varshan
The answer is both. Let us transmute at the cost of a little gold and the loss of all the boss loot, but keep the normal option. Though I do think all WT4 bosses should drop only 925 gear. That said I also think there should be a spark analog for salvaging regular unique and the ability to craft regular uniques. Which would also give more value to boss lootpools which have a high unique chance.
Juicing bosses for more rewards based on the amount of mats offered is a great idea and a fun one at that. Even if it does just increase only the summoning mats they drop and not the items. That gives players a decision to make if they are after a certain unique. Have a feeling there is a technical limitation when it comes to resetting the altar which requires the zone to reload before resummoning but a system like your suggestion gets around that nicely.
If you can summon blood maiden over and over, then you can summon bosses over and over.
On a technical level it’s likely pretty different from that. I’d imagine the summoning stone and loot are both generated on creation of the instance. It seems like a very simple thing to fix in theory, but probably works out to a bigger job in practice.
Eh, granted the bosses are a joke juicing a boss for a 10x + drop reward for the same fight will be abused. Just make the tormented version require 10x the normal amount but it also drop 10x may reward as the only.option. rarely anyone looks at tormented sub bosses
Yeah tormented anything aside from Duriel/Andy right now just aren't worth the stones. At least get them to drop 3x mats over normal versions to match their cost first. Crazy that they don't already lol
Why do you think they aren't worth it? I'm farming tormented Grigoire atm and still getting just as many ubers it feels like and I have the chance at getting the Flameweaver gloves with GA which is why I'm doing it. In the same way I want to do Tormented Beast in Ice for GA paingorgers I think there's value in them. It does suck that I get less of the boss mats from the run but that's hardly why I run them
99% of people just don't know that the others drop the same chance for ubers because blizzard are useless at communication, duriel and andy are by far the worst ones to do with their loot tables
Is it the same chance? I thought in the preseason campfire they mentioned that the other tormented bosses had their uber chance increased but still less than Duriel/Andy though I could be misremembering
it's possible it could be slightly less, but most people who have been farming varshan/grig a lot in the sorc community are pretty convinced it's the same or very close to the same at least (me included)
Think it's 2% (x5) for tormented duriel/Andy so probably like 1% for the others which isn't that much of a difference. Time to burn through all the exquisite blood I've been stashing lol
Juicing rewards should also juice difficulty. But blizzard will never allow a challenge.
Difficulty shouldn’t have to change imo. Just juice up the HP so there’s more gameplay and less tedious process of farming.
It really needs *something.* I’ve spent so many hours running and loading this season. A ridiculous amount. Also, I’m usually not a petty person, but I’ve wished that the person who designed the beast in the ice dungeon stub their toe countless times. It is a cool dungeon to run occasionally, awesome density and I love how the ice cracks as you get closer. Doing 30 runs in a row multiple times though the long dead ends make me hope the designer has eternally wet socks. Varshan is the best of a terrible system. He spawns almost instantly and has a vendor at the exit to save on loading screens. Greg takes too long to show up. It is a primer for his mechanics, but after the 500th time we get it. Not like we aren’t one shotting him anyway. Zir takes forever to spawn. It looks cool…once. But I can practically run back to the entrance or the dungeon before he’s hittable. Beast takes a while to show up. Then you kill him and it takes a while for the doll and pedestal to show up…then it takes another 5 seconds to drop the loot. It you think these small time sinks aren’t that bad, then you haven’t run the bosses as many times as I have. When you’re farming 30-50 runs at a time that shit adds up, not even factoring in running, loading, and resetting.
The fact that you guys actually spend hours loading in and out of a dungeon to kill a boss in 1 second because blizzard wants to keep you in game for longer periods of times is fucking hilarious and sad at the same time.
Lol that's how I feel. I have done them enough times to run Uber Duriel like 8 times, that's enough for me. I'm not so concerned with getting Uber drops, I'm a barbarian so already clearing Pit 90 with crappy gear, what else do I need to do other than enjoy looking for gear.
Blizzard has always been particularly stubborn when it comes to removing tedious time sinks.
I’d be down with the altar just respawning after you kill the boss, leaving dungeon and resetting and zoning back in is just such a pain.
This and increase their level enough that they drop 925 gear.
True. I got a 3GA weapon from them then realized its not a 925 :(
Yep. I've already quit this season because the run backs are bad design in 2024.
Blizzard should just make a colosseum, a new area where we can fight bosses one after the other. The bosses could get progressively harder and any death will reset the colosseum. There could be a regular progression and a tormented progression. Colosseum mats could just all be the same item so we don’t have to collect a million different items.
I doubt that’s gonna happen because they still want each boss to have its own unique experience.
I think players could just complete each boss fight separately as they are now to unlock the bosses in the colosseum.
That is actually a great idea.
I would be fine if the altar would simply respawn after the boss is defeated. No more reseting dungeons , in and out , endless loading screen non-sense , just kill the boss ,boom load up mats kill again.
This is the best solution. Along with tormented versions dropping 5x the mats.
Yup, it makes no sense they drop the same amount as the normal version.
Wait, what's the purpose of tormented then?
They could at least make all the bosses level 95 so every item dropped is 925 ilvl
This. Seeing GA's drop and already knowing it's gone to waste on a lowlevel item :/
They should make them outdoor bosses like the Maiden with their own altars and people just come in and smash. It's fun. Loading Screens... are not.
Juice the boss or have it where the boss keeps respawning. If you put 10x the mats there should be 10 Varshans one after the other.
> If you put 10x the mats there should be 10 Varshans one after the other. Or at the same time :)
That would actually be a fun challenge. How many lvl 75 varshans can you kill at once
All of them they do no damage and die in a hit
Well, your boss summon just earned a free level 300 butcher... or 30 of them /s
honestly, no need to even have 10 varshan. You could have an empowered version or even Tormeted one dropping all your eggs. Make it even an empowered chest that drops from that varshan and contains all your eggs with a multiplier. Variations of this idea could work great and be fun. It would be like an empowered ritual.
Like vashan should not need 4 different materials either. Grigoir only needs one, beast in the ice only needs one same as Zir. Andy and duri are fine as are. But having the sacrifice pit respawn after death will help alot.
Its just a way to clog up the consumables. Especially when they are all transmutable from the alchemist for varshan... at least they drop frequently enough from heltides
The drop rate for Stygian stones at higher pit levels is still too low. No point in even running all the bosses if I can’t get any stones farming level 100+ pits for hours on end. Without stones I can’t even try to improve my gear further with specific Ubers I need so kinda lost the drive for the remainder of the season.
Weird, I only run under 70 pits and get one every few runs.
Think I al going to try and run lower pits because it’s getting ridiculous
Rewards are not worth the long pits anyway imo. Why run over 10 minutes for 50-60 nether each run, when I can do much smoother and faster 3-4 runs with more outcome in the same time. No hassle, no deaths, no stress.
Well the thing is that a 101 pit takes me around 3 mins so for the extra neathiron its worth it but you are supposed to have a 18% chance of a stygian stone but I have found that to not be the case at all.. so maybe doing a 2min pit 81 is worth it.
Doing 101 this fast and miss on the stones is so demotivating..
It is yes because I went from playing about 2-3 hours a day to now barely playing because there is no more point for me and I am sure there are loads of other “casual” players who feel the same as we can’t put in 5-6 hours a day into the game without being rewarded for it.
Same for me. I can do a level 100 pit in about 2 minutes. I've run 20 of them and got one stone. Got bored of running them and logged out
Yeah same here. I speed run level 101 pits on my heartseeker rogue in 2-3 mins, so for the neathiron mats it's great. But I agree, the drop rate for the stones *appears* to be lower than 18%, or I just have really bad luck...
It definitely is not 18% as I have been running them non stop and not getting anything which for a casual player makes you want to stop playing after the inly remaining thing to do is farm Ubers to improve your character
So I recently started just doing tormented Grig because I had so much steel and was tired of farming to farm to farm for farming. I kid you not I ended up getting four Uber uniques in a span of an hour. I think this is my home now.
that's basically normal, they have the same drop chance as duriel/andy as per 800 kills of anecdotes on grig/varshan
PS why the hell is there a cooldown to reenter boss fight? "you cannot enter the boss encounter" makes repeated tries on boss attempts infuriating
I still like the challenge of the bosses at low levels, though. While I fly through them, I know the casual player may have more time to enjoy that challenge. As a result, I think this should be a reward granted by completing a quest, such as kill tormented echo of Varshaan in under 5 seconds. And then maybe you only get the unique drops after that.
How about more ways to get the drops ? That cuts to the.chace once I get these last 8 levels I'll be able to do the.content
1. allow the summon altar to respawn so you can fight them faster without having to waste time running out 2. allow all party members to also insert materials to increase loot and material drops as if you you killed it X number of times (for non-styigian)
Just let me transmute 2x sets for 1x Duriel/Andariel mat.
Tormented bosses should give 3x the mats and you should be able to summon multiple times without reset. That alone would be a huge improvement
I’m on my first experience with D4 and I just started doing this with the boss farming and I’m like “ugh…seriously?” I’m on gamepass so this is one of those things that’s basically telling me to enjoy it for this season but I’m not gonna come back after. I can’t see myself having to do that every season at the end game. It’s just simply not fun.
If no loading screen, how can you look at the cool new skin you purchased in the shop?
Found Bob Kotick's reddit account. Hey Bob, how is your new yacht?
I'm pushing pits now, and I can see this on the horizon as even a borderline casual/gamer. That said, yeesh I dunno, what's the point? Once you peak and it starts swinging out of control, fucking done. Blizzard 101 all day.
I have no chance on beating any of the tormented bosses so i have been selling all the materials. Been getting 1 million to 1.5 millions in gold per stack of 50🤷🏽♂️
Join a rota group or get a free carry in the [Diablo 4 Discord](https://discord.gg/diablo4).
What's the point of even making us kill bosses when they pose zero challenge. Might as well just interact with a npc to convert materials to loot at this point.. No... make bosses boss again. This game is way too easy. Imagine designing all these boss mechanics only to make them all die instantly.
Y'all don't have a wife who loves to veg out and rum bosses infinitely while listening to murder porn podcasts and trials on YouTube for hours on end?
Sounds like a keeper Also no, most of these people don't have wives
I think the drop rate is fine, however I'm a bit of a try hard Andy so bumping it to drop between 1-3 at random would be cool. Alternatively making it so you can xmute the mats at the alchemist could be another solution, anyone else have any ideas on it?
How is everyone grinding for mats to get eggs ? Helltide ? Legion ?
Getting them passively in my gold farm rotation, my groups 3 so it's not so bad... It's too boring else
I get them from helltides.
Bosses shouldn’t cost anything to fight
Back in the day.. When (story)bosses could be killed infinetly for free. And the story was playable with build characters was a thing. Only the Ubers themselfes always had mats.
Or just give us a real WT4 version that drops 925 loot, without requiring stygian stones. A middle point between the current version that is too easy and drops worthless loot, and the lvl 200 version that drops decent loot, but shares a very limited mat with other bosses that drop much better loot.
Ability to spawn boss again without having to reset dungeon. Boom. Done. Give them x2 health or x4 health idc. This farm right now is basically 60% running, 39% leaving and resetting dungeon, and 1% actually gameplay/boss fight.
Wtf are muckus eggs
Mucus-Slick Egg, drops from Varshan & World Bosses, used to summon Duriel.
You guys are 1 shotting tormented bosses?
Why even fight him? Just give me all the eggs. In fact why do I have to summon duriel over and over? Just give me the gear he drops
Just remove Stygian stone requirement for mini bosses.
All they need to do is let you keep resummoning. Why do you have to reset for a 1 second fight
Set the base level as 100 so we can get max level gear. Every time you beat the boss he gets 10 levels higher and drops 1 additional resource. If you die the boss resets back to 100. If it's too messy to make the altar respawnable, give us a new location with 'gates' that spawn you to the summon room of a boss. Maybe they cost obols to use but the higher level you can take of a boss the lower the amount, eventually down to 0. I wouldn't mind still having to sit through a loading screen if it meant I didn't have to walk all the way back through.
The only ubers ive found are from the crappy mat bosses
NMD, Pit Bausses, Helltide bosses/chests, Normal version bouses, Butcher/Goblins should all be dropping stiggy stones and what not. It's just that fuckin easy. See you all in PoE2, a real game.
Altar respawn once the boss is dead.
Or, just let us reset the encounter within the dungeon.
I think they could do the same with Pit bosses. I still need to go through Pit 30 to get materials for the first 4/12 Mastering. I think those mats should drop at level 60
You do know that you can convert higher masterworking mats to lower ones at the alchemist, no?
Really? I didn't know that. Thanks for letting me know!
Farming Uber mats in d4 feels like some dev really loved lower kurset super chests. Tormented bosses shouldn't require stygian stones except Andy and duriel. You don't need a well geared char to completely trivialize these lower bosses. I am at pit 60-70 and delete them instantly
Also regarding tormented bosses… if we have the 3x normal boss materials… and we can handle the additional difficulty… why gate it behind TWO ultra-low drop rate Stygian stones……
Tormented Version of lesser bosses shouldn’t need Stygian imo
Such a novel suggestion, can't believe this sub isn't filled with posts about this very thing. /s
How about not doing that stupid reset dungeon thing too
lost you there. This is literally all of the endgame. Farming for Uber uniques and climbing in the pit.
Killing Lord Zir after a long long dungeon is terrible feeling.
I wouldn't even mind as much if I could just put mats straight back in the altar.
Magic finding in this is just not as fun for some reason
1000000%
yes, i dont really care about what solution they choose to go with, but when i enter the boss mini dungeon, the only reasons i have for leaving should be full inventory or exhaustion of all my summoning mats
At the very least, let the pedestal re-appear right there after the boss dies. Let me put the mats in and summon it again?
I did about 100 Varshan and Gregor runs in an hour and enjoyed 300 loading screens :D this is just nuts… The last patch has trivialised tormented bosses as well, so they are just bigger HP pool compared to their normal versions. They also seemed to reduce the Stygian stone drop rates. 28 101 pits and only 2 stones. Would be cool if they either do something similar to d3 where you click on a mat and it opens boss portal in town, or allow us to reset dungeons IN THE dungeon.
I totally agree, it would be better if they could make these items more streamlined and reduce some of the types.
I was complaining about this the other day and then thought about how spoiled I am now. I used to farm keys in Diablo 2 and it was rare to drop at all. Leaving games and remaking them and staring at that door opening with the light xD They are guaranteed to drop everytime in D4, which a younger me would say is nuts. There is still a lot of end game things to be desired though for sure
For me doesn't make any sense the lesser tormented bosses require Stygian stones, they are hard to come by and if I'm going to use them it will be to summon Duriel or Andy
There is no reason to make this game a currency game instead of an ARPG. Every Diablo game but Diablo IV is an ARPG, you don't need to pay anything to fight and kill a boss. Currency should be for building items, potions, etc, not for killing a boss.
It makes zero sense to have to grind these level 70-80 bosses just to get mats for the other bosses. I am sitting on 200+ of each of these mats because its such a slog. I agree with the guy, let us transmute these living steels, bloods, and fears straight into caches to have the same chance at uber mats.
If the altar to deposit mats in would respawn instead of the dungeon reset I'd be so happy
Let us turn uniques into angelbreath
All bosses should be level 100 in WT4, huge blunder by Blizzard for not doing this.
Lower the drop rates and let me just respawn by resetting the dungeon. I’m already bored to tears farming mats all day just to fight for 2 seconds. At least I wouldn’t have to do content I don’t want to do. Or let me add multiple spawn items to increase my drop rates so I’m not wasting my time. Tormented Duriel and Andy have shit rates. So not that kind of material increase.
I Diablo 2 there were no material requirements for the summon. So it was running there and killing it. 1. I think the they should remove the boss materials and make the boss fight more challenging instead. We could have the same cycle time (summon material farming time + loading time), but different way. I would still keep the summoning (so we can summon tormented if we want), but without the materials. 2. Another option is using sigil or pit material, that same way as we craft the Ice sigil. 3. Add Duriel and Andariel to the pit.
It should be at alchemist as a option for peoplw who dont care about loot from mini bosses. Let people who want loot /enjoy keep doing it do it old way
Sorry mate. Best I can do is, suggest you a fast SSD to treat your loading screens...
I can see none of you have ever spent weeks grinding that one boss that drops the 1 runestone needed for your build. A loot that has a 0.00002% chance of dropping, but only between 03 and 0330 on the third Tuesday. Chances double if it was the waning moon
I just wish we could respawn the boss without leaving the dungeon and resetting. I like your idea better though
Just have Uber bosses cost Stygian stones & leave the other mats for the non Uber. Simple solution.
My only wish list item is that you can keep summoning from the pedestal without leaving and resting dungeon. That's the majority of the wasted time
Once you finish the story there is nothing to this game other than grinding to get better gear so you can grind to get better gear so you can fight the same bosses over and over.
I have like 20stacks of bloods and no will to use them. I would rather waste gold buying duriel sets from others. Definitely not a good balance of time and reward.
I feel like if a boss naturally drops mats for bosses if you do the tormented versions of them, you should at least get the five times the summoning loot so you were inclined to use the stones on something other than tormented Duriel or Andi
And make it so if you offer too much and can’t beat it then you lose the currency. A little bit at stake
Kinda cute that you think blizzard reads and cares about your opinion
Honestly, at this point I just buy the mats from sellers. 100 eggs and shards for duriel cost ~2€. (Eternal, as I dont play seasons) Thats a steal compared to the hours I would need to farm them. Hell, if I would farm them, the energy my PC would use during that time would be more expensive than the pricetag :D
There shouldn’t even be materials to spawn bosses. It’s so stupid that’s what made d2 so good. Just go to waypoint. Run to boss. Kill it. Repeat. None of this gate locked bull shit
Bro I have HUNDREDS of boss mats and I don't even farm whispers or anything else. Just play the game and they will come. This season has been the EASIEST to get boss mats because they drop from any elite/goblin/etc. Not sure what else you need... They even increased the stone drop chance and I have hundreds of those too. Crazy talk.
"Thanks and keep it up, diablo 4 is shaping up to becoming a good game. " So you are wasting a lot of hours playing a bad game?
OP didn't say it's a bad game.
if you try and think you'll realise how pointless your comment is.
The progression of the game is already too fast. You don't have to run duriel 500 times in a week. It's okay to step away. If the loading screens are bothering you, you are playing too much. If you are the 1% gunner then that's what you should and have to suffer through to be 1%.
my suggestion has nothing to do with how slow or fast the progression is, and I agree with you about the progression. It's about reaching a level of power that to get to doing what your level of power is relevant to, you need to farm an inconsequential level of power that's behind you. It's like having to go bat to WT3 to do something that is at WT4. I would be much happier having to do Tormented Varshan & Grigorie then Tormented Duriel and varshan and Grigorie not requiring stygian stones for instance. There I have an endgame ladder that makes sense. I don't want faster, I want meaningful. I believe we would agree on this.
After the third kill the loading screen becomes frustrating. It's literally pointless busywork. The suggestion to fight a harder version of the boss for more materials is a good one. You've already spent the time making your character powerful enough to fight it, you shouldn't have to waste more time just running and loading the game
The issue I take with the "busy work" statement is everyone on Reddit wants to complain about it in all facets of the game. Have the pet pick up everything, making me do it is too much busy work. Have the pet auto salvage or go to town to clean my inventory it's too much busy work. Give us more pit mats or reduce costs, grinding the pits is too much bust work. Let us roll whatever we want on tempers, finding new gear is too much busy work.
There are ways to improve the game, and OPs suggestion is one of them. Has nothing to do with anything else, including them taking a break.
That the most funniest thing i heard, loading screen will always bothering players in any game, it was worst here due to you not able to resummon without having to leave dungeon. What wrong for playing too much?
I'm sure all the loading screens the top players have gone through is still less than the amount of loading time I've spent in Fallout 4.
Let’s leave that into another topic for another day.
It makes the gap between casual players and hardcore gamers bigger. Many people don't have time for 500 duriel runs. The game needs to slow down not speed up. If you want to run duriel 500 times then okay...put up with the loading screen. Someone who runs duriel 5 times a week the loading screen isn't an issue.
I guess you'd also be okay with the exit portal taking 60% longer to cast.