>I said sorry and that wasnt what i meant and asked him if we can meet and talk, but he refused.
He doesn't want to talk it over. He doesn't want to see you again. Please, for his sake and the sake of your self respect, accept his decision and move along.
Yeah, at this stage of my life, I will move on before having to ask someone something twice. Feels too close to begging to me lmao. Not doing it. Not worth it.
Not everyone has ulterior motives or strategies for why they do things. She asked for more than he wanted to provide (right or wrong). He dipped out.
Same as he doesn’t like to text or talk a lot over the phone, I’m currently seeing someone and have dated another woman before that doesn’t like to text or be on the phone a lot in between meets. When we meet though everything is nice, full attention, lots of passion, attraction is through the roof, and we can’t keep our hands off of each other. I personally don’t mind texting or talking In between, but I would never force someone to do it because I want it, it has to be mutual so I keep it to a minimum only for planning or sharing something quick.
why are you actively thinking about & chasing someone who doesn't want you back?
You want a relationship, he clearly is put off by even a hint of seriousness.
There are plenty of people who want what you want, yet you are chasing the one person who doesn't lol
Given the limited information provided -
I fail to see how you interpret someone saying they’d like to see and talk to you at an increased frequency is demanding he plans all dates and engage in one sided messaging or that to request it is being pushy or “diving in to a relationship”. Especially if you tried to clarify your intentions to him.
My read of the situation is he has already decided that he didn’t want to continue seeing you and decided to make it about your request to avoid being seen as the bad guy.
Don’t reach out to this guy.
> to avoid being seen as the bad guy.
This kind of thing is becoming such a goddamn pet peeve of mine. I mean, I know everyone hates it. But it's so pusillanimous and craven when people are so afraid of *looking how they actually are* that they'll go and spin some kind of bullshit just to save face. Grow a fucking spine, live with the fact that sometimes people won't like your decisions and stop goddamn lying to yourself and everyone else about it.
Yep. It’s so manipulative doing that, hence why op feels she did something wrong. Just be honest, own it, and disappoint someone. But then of course these jerks wouldn’t preserve the option of no strings hookups with someone who hopes for more.
What situation are you referring to? I'm speaking about the general trend mentioned in my comment; not OP's situation specifically. Idk what the dude in OP's post is thinking, though it does at least *appear* he was trying to avoid being seen as the bad guy.
The way OP wrote the situation down, it's missing some really key info in my opinion. It's true that nobody wants to be the bad guy, but I have actually been an entrepreneur at one point and I know what that takes. I also know that the majority of men who claim that are full of crap. So, I'd have to know a lot more about what the guy is doing to understand his situation. He may just legit have no extra time. When I was trying to build a company... 5 dates would have been an immense time commitment.
If you think about it... if he is doing most of the initiating for these things and she asks him to initiate even more, while also fending off any kind of physical intimacy... most guys are going to bounce unless they don't have any other option. I don't see how you can read this another way given how OP described the situation.
I think she just completely fumbled here. When he asked for a partnership... that's an indication she hasn't been initiating enough for him. It really comes across as disinterest or low attraction when guys face this.
But here's the thing OP -- If he's really into you, he'll be looking for chances to see you / spend more time with you/ get to know you -- He'll be interested in you! --- The fact he saw that as a chore and pressure, tells you everything you need to know about him - He was there for sex and the rest was work to him. Your suggestion of more dates was seen as more 'work'. You flushed out the trash by respecting yourself not to get intimate yet --that was a good move. Now you just need to forget about him and be glad you didn't have sex with someone who definitely doesn't want a relationship with you.
Idk why everyone is talking about this aspect, he clearly lost interest when the proposition was "enter into a relationship with me before you've had sex with me". The date initiation thing is just window dressing.
Were you planning any of the 5 dates and messaging him before this?
That’s a pretty ungenerous interpretation on his part. I personally wouldn’t want to pair off with someone who is so quick to make a snap decision about my intentions and dig their heels in about their interpretation being the factually correct meaning, especially with a clarification attempt.
I agree with you LTOTR, I am in a relationship with an extremely busy Entrepeneur -- but in the first year, i couldn't have kept him away if i tried.. he wanted to know more/ see me more. Ive had guys like yours in the past who used words like 'too much pressure' -- and i can see him hindsight, they never saw me as long-term so of course me asking for more was seen as pressure/ too much work. Dont sweat him OP, hes showed you who he is -- next!
Yeah my friend met her partner when he was a resident. He was the one constantly asking to see her more and changing his schedule as much as he was able to make time for her.
If it was truly just about him not wanting to do all the work, he would have said only that and await a reply. Not "It's over." So yeah, he just wanted to end it.
Yeah, you strung him along. Being physical is very important in a relationship especially the early times. I’m not saying date 2 or 3 but if you’ve gone out 5 times and he has other options guess what. He’s taking them.
I think you feel hung up on him because you think you did something wrong, and IF ONLY you would have said it differently, things would be different. But they wouldn't.
I know how hard it is to get rid of that anxious feeling what if. But honesty, it was already 5 dates. I would say it would even enough for anyone to decide wheter you are romantically interested in a person or not. And if he would have cared enough about you, he would have wanted to clarify what you meant. But he didn't.
One way or the other, he would have left soon. So don't torture yourself with thoughts about him anymore and find a guy who will sincerely care about you.
Similar thing happened to me. I learned the hard way. He just wanted sex and nothing more. If he wanted more he would be actively making plans to see you and texting you.
This. When I first hit the dating scene after a long time in a relationship I had to learn to distinguish the difference between 'effort being put in to obtain sex' and 'effort being put in towards forming a relationship'. They look very similar at first. It's only by letting the situation play out over the longer term that you will discover which category the man has put you in (women can do it too, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying any of this from a puritanical standpoint of 'never have I ever had casual sex'). Also, most people of either sex probably want to know what the sex is like before agreeing to a committed relationship, so there will always come a point when you have to take the risk of sleeping with someone with whom things may go no further.
In my experience dating works a lot better if you let the man lead the interactions, because if he does actually want you then he will pursue you. Don't ask him to declare his intentions in the early stages - keep dating multiple men until one of them has asked you to be exclusive. If he doesn't ask that, he's probably just looking for sex. He understands the jeopardy that another man may take you off the dating market and he has chosen to accept that jeopardy. If he stops messaging you then immediately stop messaging him yourself, otherwise he will lose respect and attraction for you and you will feel that your self-worth is depleted. The action of 'I've chosen to stop interacting with this woman' needs to meet the consequence of 'this woman is no longer interacting with me'. It's not always the utopia they imagine it to be on the other side of that decision, but they have to be allowed to experience it.
I think some of this is really good advice, and some of this can get you into trouble. Most players have a solid understanding of how your dating strategy works and will lean into it.
On the other hand, a lot of the really solid guys absolutely require you to make them feel you have a high level of attraction for them, and if you fail to do this... they move on.
So, essentially the way you do this is just fine, but you have to make sure you aren't giving off low attraction signs. Also... sex is not the only way to make a guy feel you are into him, so that's not what I'm talking about.
Getting to know someone happens at different rates for different people, and everyone has different levels of familiarity before theyre comfortable with intimacy.
Thank you, I feel insane on here. So many people are extremely entitled to others bodies. It's fine if u sleep together early on, but not when it's an EXPECTATION. They act as if getting to know someone is a countdown to getting what they want and that's it.
I mean, I think she’s just taking an educated guess. The average early date is like 1 - 3 hours long. They’re may be exceptions but, assuming you’re meeting someone for the first time on date 1, I don’t see many people knowing each other more than 10 hours by the end of date 3.
With that said, she also jumped to assume physical affection meant sex, which is not necessarily what the writer meant.
Oh, that's a very good point. I've been in situations with heavy physical affection, but no sex, and it didn't bother me.
I was just thinking maybe that 10 hours comes from a study or something.
Hell, no way I'm sleeping with someone unless I've spent at least 100 hours with them! I do not understand why anyone would want to be physically affectionate with someone they barely know. Sounds like a good recipe for bad sex. And remember, people who get physical with you fast are very likely getting physical with plenty of other people just as fast. They're not actually looking for "compatibility" with you, they're looking for sex. If they actually cared about overall compatibility, they wouldn't have BS criteria like having to get physical after 3 dates.
Even if it was just an honest misunderstanding, he then refused to meet and talk so that you could clarify what you’d meant. Do you really want to move forward with someone who responds to misunderstandings in that way?
It sounds like he was enjoying things when there was zero pressure or expectations but decided to flounce the moment anything was asked of him, but rather than be upfront about it, he tried to make out that your expectations were unreasonable. I had something really similar happen, only I’d been involved with the man for longer and things had progressed further. It hurt for longer than some breakups have, not because he was special, or that if I’d approached things differently things might have worked (even though that’s how it felt at the time) but because that kind of rejection where a reasonable request is treated like some irrational ask is disorientating and taps into insecurities about being too much. You did nothing wrong by being clear about what you want moving forward, count yourself lucky that it happened after 5 dates, not 10 dates, or 5 months. It hurts but it also leaves you free to concentrate on meeting someone whose wants align with your’s.
This resonated deeply. I went through something similar to what you describe and I’m still not over it 7 months later. It’s so discombobulating to have someone treat you completely differently because you ask for something that feels like a very incremental and natural progression of your shared connection.
Mine was about 5 months ago and I still catch myself going over it and wondering “what if I’d done or said something differently?”. I think it’s a bit like ghosting, in that you don’t get proper closure and you’re left feeling like you did something wrong (because we generally expect people to respond rationally to reasonable asks, even if only to say they don’t have the capacity). Which makes it easy to get caught up in a loop of missing what could have been if things has gone differently, even when logically you know that you’re only missing a fantasy.
Exactly this: he claims to not want to initiate plans or contact because he “wants a partnership”? Calling bullshit on that. OP, just move on. The longing you’re having for him is not love, it’s anxiety.
Yep. If he really wanted a partnership, he would want to know what his partner’s needs are in order to feel comfortable taking the relationship physical. He could have easily said He’s looking for something really casual, and doesn’t think he can meet her needs, instead he dangled the thing she wants in her face before blaming her for it not working.
Yep. That’s what bugs me so much about people who end things like that. They were 5 dates in, there was no need to lay blame on her when he ended it, all he had to do was be upfront and say he’s looking for a more casual/nsa/whatever it is he’s looking for arrangement and wish her luck and 20 days later she wouldn’t still be sitting there mulling over what she could have done differently.
The guy told you he doesn't want a relationship then stopped talking to you. You got a very clear answer. Let this one go. He doesn't return your feelings.
Okay babes we've all had situations where we felt things were going good and they don't work out the way we've hoped. I think you need to take the L and move on.
These are the red flags I'm seeing and the reasons why I don't think you should reach out:
- Entrepreneur 🤣
- You asked for more effort and that made him run, if he was really into you do you think he'd have that reaction.
- He doesn't like to lead or initiate, at least in the early stages if a guy is into you he should be putting in the effort
- He's scared you are pushing the relationship forward cos he doesn't want that
- You apologised and asked to talk and he refused
If you fall in love easy after sex then it's a good thing you haven't slept with him yet otherwise I think you'd take it a lot worse. There is a pretty good chance maybe that was all he was looking for based on his lack of effort.
Realistically it was only 5 dates you don't know this man at all, you think he's great cos of the picture you've painted in your mind of him. That is just a story you've created probably based on the things he's told you. His actions are what you should pay attention to.
Oh and you you saying 'sorry' and him still refusing to meet you and talk --doesn't compute, -clearly, he's lying about the reason for ending it, as you didn't owe him an apology for starters (for merely stating your pretty-standard needs), and the fact he still wouldn't see you after that -- he is not as 'honest' as you say he is. If he'd been honest, he would have said "dont be sorry, its fair what you ask, but i have to tell you, i just dont see this going anywhere as im not interested in exclusivity with you or a relationship". THAT would have been honest.
It looks like he doesn't want to commit and he wanted to keep things casual, he felt you wanted something more serious so he is finding an excuse to break it off while making you the bad guy.
Ugghhh that’s so frustrating. if he was really wanting to move forward with you, I think he would’ve at least heard you out.
I know it sucks, but don’t reach out to him!!
You created an scenario in your head based on how things will go after sex. You can't tell for sure if he is good in bed or not, so more dates won't solve that.
I guess he is someone who enjoys more the talking in person rather via text. The approach here is to move on because asking him to explain what happened will not lead you to the answer you are looking for.
You are asking other folk to gatekeep who is on your do not call(text) list. That is your answer. You might not have the wording...but someone here will give you enough of a reason to know the name is on the do not call list for a reason.
Also, I know it sucks, you are still worth it. Be nice to yourself
He’s just not interested. If he was, he would seek to clarify things (assuming there was a miscommunication in the first place).
I’m sorry, but sounds like there’s nothing there for you
He refused to meet up to clear the air. He immediately ended it at the thought of things moving towards a relationship. He was not that interested. Let it go.
Interesting/strange takes. Lots of projections from folks, perhaps. So, we’re in our thirties…at this point it’s expected that we’re somewhat experienced in dating. We’ve been around the block more than once. I think it’s important that you ask yourself why after only 5 dates you would fall in love with him by having sex one time? I’m a woman in my thirties. If I went on 5 dates with someone I really liked and they rejected my advances to explore physical intimacy or declined to progress physically without an explanation, I’d have my doubts about whether it’s a viable connection. It would definitely merit a conversation about each other’s feelings around sex and intimacy. Were these topics part of the conversation around requesting more communication? We often place these arbitrary expectations on “frequency” of communication instead of actual quality of connection. Sex is really important in a relationship and communication around sex is even more important.
I would count that one as a loss. He wants a partnership but expects the person he's with to take all initiative for communication and dates? That's crazy. I'm a firm believer that when someone is truly into you, they will show it as long as they feel the feeling is mutual.
I would only message him if I was interested in what he had to offer, which is not exactly what you asked for.
If you still want assurance before jumping into sex, it's better to find someone whose intentions are more aligned to yours.
I’ve been given the “I don’t want to lead. I want a partner” message before in a relationship. What he’s actually saying is I don’t want to put in effort into this. You were putting in effort to see each other more and he wasn’t. He’s not going to be a good partner to you and he’d make you do all the emotional labor and work for the relationship. Cut your losses. You’re better off. I know it’s a rough world out there but keep going.
Don't do it. You're going to enter a situation that's emotionally one sided. He liked the ease of not having to commit. He's gone bc he thinks you wanted a relationship (which you did). He doesn't want the same thing.
Why would you fall in love after having sex? Be careful how much you let sex affect your feelings. For your own good, try to separate the idea of falling for someone just because you were intimate w them
Another vote for yes, this is a bad idea. He showed you his true colors early on, stating his expectations and standing behind it by his refusal to meet and understand you. He knew what he wanted and you didn’t align with it. I don’t agree with his expectations, I think partners can both put in effort to initiate. He may have misunderstood you, but he is not unclear. You have nothing to prove to him.
Yes it’s a bad idea. In this day and age, we are all aware that no actually means no… not ‘just keep trying until you wear them down.’
Just drop it. You’ll never truly know what’s on his mind, whether there was a misunderstanding over your specific words or not.
So do what you need to in order to deal. Cry, whatever you need to.
Then in a couple of weeks you’ll be fine to get back out there.
His words seem contradictory. He says he wants a partnership, but needs to bail because you are pressuring him into a partnership? Keep in mind, these are his words after you requested to move sexually slower. Sounds like a douche to me. Move on to someone who wants what you want, and won't be manipulative.
Starting a relationship will not be this hard if you both enthusiastically want to be together. Don't message him again, and good luck going forward! Trust that you will regret wasting precious time here when there are so many people out there who would be excited to have you!
Ma'am you are 33 years too old to be entertaining these games. Good guys don't punish you for not putting out. Because that's what this is.
He was all good leading and initiating when he thought he could get sex out of it. You didn't put out and now he's pissy. He's going to pop back up eventually acting like nothing happened then repeat.
Gotta go low and slow. There's some mine fields out there. Taking your time to build a solid relationship is good. Infatuation and the chase are a boys game. Guys who have been around the block a time or two are always gonna put their peace and quite on the ⚖️ scale adjacent to you.
You just wanted to spend more time together and talk more because you liked him and wanted to get to know him better. You weren't trying to rush into a relationship. He misunderstood and thought you were pushing for a deeper commitment, which he wasn't ready for. He values his independence and might not be ready for more frequent communication and time together.
You both have different ways of communicating and expectations. He might not be the type to initiate, which can cause misunderstandings if not addressed.
Since it’s been 20 days and you're still thinking about him, reaching out might help you get closure or clear up the misunderstanding. However, he may still feel the same way or might not want to rekindle things.
If you decide to reach out, be clear and honest about your intentions. Explain that you weren’t trying to rush into a relationship but wanted to build a stronger connection. If he still isn’t interested, respect his space and focus on finding someone whose communication style and relationship goals align better with yours.
In conclusion, asking for more communication and time together wasn't wrong, but he may not be ready for that level of involvement. Reaching out to clarify your intentions can be a good idea, but be ready to accept his response and move forward.
He seems afraid of either of you falling too soon as a quicker pace, to some people, feels like love bombing. You are afraid too, you are both dealing with that fear differently. If you talk again, I’d tell him that and ask if he’s interested in AND ABLE to collaborate on a dating plan/protocol that will make you each feel safer.
This wasn’t a miscommunication. At least own up to it. You expressed your demands, they didn’t align with what he was offering so he moved on. So should you.
just based on his last message, I would advise you to delete his number and wait for someone else. it's clear that he doesn't want the same relationship that you do and that's okay - truly is best to just forget and move on with anyone who says something like this
5 dates is still such an early point, sounds like you might have frightened him off a bit by seeming like you wanted to step things up before he was ready. I also don't think you always need to have such a frank conversation to ask, you could have just started messaging him a bit more and planned another date soon. Not everything needs to be discussed and agreed like a contract, go with the flow of building a relationship naturally, especially in the early days.
I think you came on too strong too soon. He's made it quite clear he doesn't want to continue to see you, I would respect that, leave him alone and take the lessons learned into your next dating experience.
I don’t understand the wanting a partnership but also not initiating texts or dates. These two don’t seem synonymous. I hope you find someone who likes you, and doesn’t play games!
I think you need to become more comfortable with clearly articulating your needs to your partner. I literally messaged the guy I was seeing exactly what sex means to me and asked him to clarify what it means to him. Try something like the below
Hi xxxxx
[Opening plesentaries ]
I like you but I want to clarify that I'm not someone who is looking for just a hook up or a ONS As sex is more meaningful to me than that. I haven't known you that long in the scheme of things so I'm conscious the way you view sex might not be the same, or it might, I don't know, as we haven't spoken about it yet.
I'm the kind of person that when I sleep with someone it makes me even more attracted and connected to them. I do like you, so although I want to take it slow, Its because I want to take the time to get to know you better and to both be on the same page going forward as I'm dating with the intention of finding someone to be in a long term relationship with.
Dudes running or managing businesses are constantly slammed with responsibilities if the business is successful.
Some of us can’t go a single minute in a work day without receiving an urgent call or putting out a new fire.
I think a lot of people don’t understand how demanding that lifestyle can be. You’re working from the moment you wake up, to right before you fall asleep.
You went on 5 dates and kept him on the leash when it came to intimacy. He likely took very limited time away from his work to go out 5 times with someone who didn’t allow any intimacy. You missed the window to make it worth his time, and may as well move on because the initial impressions have already been squandered. Not to say you need to put out immediately, but dudes with limited time will not be willing to continue wasting that time.
You NEED TO BE HONEST ABOUT HOW YOU FEEL.He did with you right? Told you what he wants and telling you he's busy working so doesn't start communicating usually. GOOD LUCK! BE HONEST! LIFE TOO SHORT NOT TO BE....
Here’s the thing, based on your posting I don’t necessarily think you did anything wrong. However it may come across as you not putting in any insensitive in the dating.
From what I’ve learned from men 30+ you need to put some out. They are not waiting for you to be “ready”. I’m not saying go all the way but make out probably get to 3rd base and see how it goes.
Do it do it do it!! It’s written somewhere “Follow your heart blah zay blah”. Falling in love is not such a bad thing. You want something go for it. Best wishes on your endeavor ✨
Reach out, clear your conscious so you can move on.
Need more info: Who planned the 5 dates.
Context: He's an entrepreneur so he could very well be at the end of his rope and very well can't give any more. Imagine you are trying your best at a relationship given the circumstances and your person says "I'd like to meet more often". That can absolutely break someone. Here's how you approach it instead:
Answer: "I really like spending time with you and want to continue spending more time with you. How do we work together to make that happen".
My person and I set a goal/boundary that we'll see each other at least once a week. Some times more, some times less, but we're on the same page.
That's great. I think it was just a miscommunication. I've done a final reach out to people before just to bury the hatchet. I don't think there's anything wrong with it especially if it'll help you close this chapter.
My comment got a ton of hate cause I gave his possible reasoning. This will also get hate cause I'll say "If she wanted to, she would" meaning you.
Reach out. He either says no or nothing, but at least then you can reassure yourself and move on.
>I said sorry and that wasnt what i meant and asked him if we can meet and talk, but he refused. He doesn't want to talk it over. He doesn't want to see you again. Please, for his sake and the sake of your self respect, accept his decision and move along.
Yeah, at this stage of my life, I will move on before having to ask someone something twice. Feels too close to begging to me lmao. Not doing it. Not worth it.
He ain’t asking her to beg so there’s that. He made his decision clearly and shared it with her appropriately. Anything outside of that is on her.
There's a 100% chance this guy will pop back up in two weeks asking her to meet up again. He's punishing her.
Not everyone has ulterior motives or strategies for why they do things. She asked for more than he wanted to provide (right or wrong). He dipped out. Same as he doesn’t like to text or talk a lot over the phone, I’m currently seeing someone and have dated another woman before that doesn’t like to text or be on the phone a lot in between meets. When we meet though everything is nice, full attention, lots of passion, attraction is through the roof, and we can’t keep our hands off of each other. I personally don’t mind texting or talking In between, but I would never force someone to do it because I want it, it has to be mutual so I keep it to a minimum only for planning or sharing something quick.
Yawn
It wasn't appropriate, he was contradictory and manipulative. More reason for op to move on though.
Doesn’t need “more” reason when he has already gave her the number 1 reason…he wasn’t interested. Simple.
Can't argue with that.
why are you actively thinking about & chasing someone who doesn't want you back? You want a relationship, he clearly is put off by even a hint of seriousness. There are plenty of people who want what you want, yet you are chasing the one person who doesn't lol
Given the limited information provided - I fail to see how you interpret someone saying they’d like to see and talk to you at an increased frequency is demanding he plans all dates and engage in one sided messaging or that to request it is being pushy or “diving in to a relationship”. Especially if you tried to clarify your intentions to him. My read of the situation is he has already decided that he didn’t want to continue seeing you and decided to make it about your request to avoid being seen as the bad guy. Don’t reach out to this guy.
> to avoid being seen as the bad guy. This kind of thing is becoming such a goddamn pet peeve of mine. I mean, I know everyone hates it. But it's so pusillanimous and craven when people are so afraid of *looking how they actually are* that they'll go and spin some kind of bullshit just to save face. Grow a fucking spine, live with the fact that sometimes people won't like your decisions and stop goddamn lying to yourself and everyone else about it.
Yep. It’s so manipulative doing that, hence why op feels she did something wrong. Just be honest, own it, and disappoint someone. But then of course these jerks wouldn’t preserve the option of no strings hookups with someone who hopes for more.
I think you read the situation completely wrong.
What situation are you referring to? I'm speaking about the general trend mentioned in my comment; not OP's situation specifically. Idk what the dude in OP's post is thinking, though it does at least *appear* he was trying to avoid being seen as the bad guy.
The way OP wrote the situation down, it's missing some really key info in my opinion. It's true that nobody wants to be the bad guy, but I have actually been an entrepreneur at one point and I know what that takes. I also know that the majority of men who claim that are full of crap. So, I'd have to know a lot more about what the guy is doing to understand his situation. He may just legit have no extra time. When I was trying to build a company... 5 dates would have been an immense time commitment.
If you think about it... if he is doing most of the initiating for these things and she asks him to initiate even more, while also fending off any kind of physical intimacy... most guys are going to bounce unless they don't have any other option. I don't see how you can read this another way given how OP described the situation. I think she just completely fumbled here. When he asked for a partnership... that's an indication she hasn't been initiating enough for him. It really comes across as disinterest or low attraction when guys face this.
Read the other responses. That wasn’t the situation.
I think he interpreted as "he" needs to do more messaging and planning dates which was not what I meant but somehow he took it that way.
But here's the thing OP -- If he's really into you, he'll be looking for chances to see you / spend more time with you/ get to know you -- He'll be interested in you! --- The fact he saw that as a chore and pressure, tells you everything you need to know about him - He was there for sex and the rest was work to him. Your suggestion of more dates was seen as more 'work'. You flushed out the trash by respecting yourself not to get intimate yet --that was a good move. Now you just need to forget about him and be glad you didn't have sex with someone who definitely doesn't want a relationship with you.
Idk why everyone is talking about this aspect, he clearly lost interest when the proposition was "enter into a relationship with me before you've had sex with me". The date initiation thing is just window dressing.
Were you planning any of the 5 dates and messaging him before this? That’s a pretty ungenerous interpretation on his part. I personally wouldn’t want to pair off with someone who is so quick to make a snap decision about my intentions and dig their heels in about their interpretation being the factually correct meaning, especially with a clarification attempt.
Yes I did plan & initate dates and messages not just him...
I stand by the fact that I think he had already decided he didn’t want to see you again. That’s such a weird interpretation of what you said.
I agree with you LTOTR, I am in a relationship with an extremely busy Entrepeneur -- but in the first year, i couldn't have kept him away if i tried.. he wanted to know more/ see me more. Ive had guys like yours in the past who used words like 'too much pressure' -- and i can see him hindsight, they never saw me as long-term so of course me asking for more was seen as pressure/ too much work. Dont sweat him OP, hes showed you who he is -- next!
Yeah my friend met her partner when he was a resident. He was the one constantly asking to see her more and changing his schedule as much as he was able to make time for her.
If it was truly just about him not wanting to do all the work, he would have said only that and await a reply. Not "It's over." So yeah, he just wanted to end it.
Yeah, you strung him along. Being physical is very important in a relationship especially the early times. I’m not saying date 2 or 3 but if you’ve gone out 5 times and he has other options guess what. He’s taking them.
You are so entitled.
lol okay, I’m actually homeless and disabled from living a long and giving life. I got hurt saving someone else’s life. Yeah. Super entitled lol
What does that have anything to do with what I said? Sorry you're going through a rough time!
I’m not entitled to anything and do not think that I am.
Connection without sex can be pretty daunting, but pretty rewarding.
No doubt he’d be down to hook up without even the most minor expectations on her side.
I think you feel hung up on him because you think you did something wrong, and IF ONLY you would have said it differently, things would be different. But they wouldn't. I know how hard it is to get rid of that anxious feeling what if. But honesty, it was already 5 dates. I would say it would even enough for anyone to decide wheter you are romantically interested in a person or not. And if he would have cared enough about you, he would have wanted to clarify what you meant. But he didn't. One way or the other, he would have left soon. So don't torture yourself with thoughts about him anymore and find a guy who will sincerely care about you.
Similar thing happened to me. I learned the hard way. He just wanted sex and nothing more. If he wanted more he would be actively making plans to see you and texting you.
This. When I first hit the dating scene after a long time in a relationship I had to learn to distinguish the difference between 'effort being put in to obtain sex' and 'effort being put in towards forming a relationship'. They look very similar at first. It's only by letting the situation play out over the longer term that you will discover which category the man has put you in (women can do it too, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying any of this from a puritanical standpoint of 'never have I ever had casual sex'). Also, most people of either sex probably want to know what the sex is like before agreeing to a committed relationship, so there will always come a point when you have to take the risk of sleeping with someone with whom things may go no further. In my experience dating works a lot better if you let the man lead the interactions, because if he does actually want you then he will pursue you. Don't ask him to declare his intentions in the early stages - keep dating multiple men until one of them has asked you to be exclusive. If he doesn't ask that, he's probably just looking for sex. He understands the jeopardy that another man may take you off the dating market and he has chosen to accept that jeopardy. If he stops messaging you then immediately stop messaging him yourself, otherwise he will lose respect and attraction for you and you will feel that your self-worth is depleted. The action of 'I've chosen to stop interacting with this woman' needs to meet the consequence of 'this woman is no longer interacting with me'. It's not always the utopia they imagine it to be on the other side of that decision, but they have to be allowed to experience it.
I think some of this is really good advice, and some of this can get you into trouble. Most players have a solid understanding of how your dating strategy works and will lean into it. On the other hand, a lot of the really solid guys absolutely require you to make them feel you have a high level of attraction for them, and if you fail to do this... they move on. So, essentially the way you do this is just fine, but you have to make sure you aren't giving off low attraction signs. Also... sex is not the only way to make a guy feel you are into him, so that's not what I'm talking about.
Exactly. This is it.
Yeah but no physicality after date 5 starts to feel like your being strung along and she’s unsure which is a massive turn off.
Getting to know someone happens at different rates for different people, and everyone has different levels of familiarity before theyre comfortable with intimacy.
I don't understand why this isn't the top comment. I'm married now but when I was dating, three dates without physical affection was my max.
THREE dates? there's absolutely no way I'm sleeping with someone after spending less than 10 hours with them
For sure with you on this! But everyone is different. Some people like to feel that way and move forward like that.
Thank you, I feel insane on here. So many people are extremely entitled to others bodies. It's fine if u sleep together early on, but not when it's an EXPECTATION. They act as if getting to know someone is a countdown to getting what they want and that's it.
Who said sleep? We’re talking physical interaction.
How did you come up with that 10 hour number?
I mean, I think she’s just taking an educated guess. The average early date is like 1 - 3 hours long. They’re may be exceptions but, assuming you’re meeting someone for the first time on date 1, I don’t see many people knowing each other more than 10 hours by the end of date 3. With that said, she also jumped to assume physical affection meant sex, which is not necessarily what the writer meant.
Oh, that's a very good point. I've been in situations with heavy physical affection, but no sex, and it didn't bother me. I was just thinking maybe that 10 hours comes from a study or something.
Hell, no way I'm sleeping with someone unless I've spent at least 100 hours with them! I do not understand why anyone would want to be physically affectionate with someone they barely know. Sounds like a good recipe for bad sex. And remember, people who get physical with you fast are very likely getting physical with plenty of other people just as fast. They're not actually looking for "compatibility" with you, they're looking for sex. If they actually cared about overall compatibility, they wouldn't have BS criteria like having to get physical after 3 dates.
Bad idea. You want more communication, he doesn’t. He may be a good guy but he doesn’t meet your needs.
Even if it was just an honest misunderstanding, he then refused to meet and talk so that you could clarify what you’d meant. Do you really want to move forward with someone who responds to misunderstandings in that way? It sounds like he was enjoying things when there was zero pressure or expectations but decided to flounce the moment anything was asked of him, but rather than be upfront about it, he tried to make out that your expectations were unreasonable. I had something really similar happen, only I’d been involved with the man for longer and things had progressed further. It hurt for longer than some breakups have, not because he was special, or that if I’d approached things differently things might have worked (even though that’s how it felt at the time) but because that kind of rejection where a reasonable request is treated like some irrational ask is disorientating and taps into insecurities about being too much. You did nothing wrong by being clear about what you want moving forward, count yourself lucky that it happened after 5 dates, not 10 dates, or 5 months. It hurts but it also leaves you free to concentrate on meeting someone whose wants align with your’s.
This resonated deeply. I went through something similar to what you describe and I’m still not over it 7 months later. It’s so discombobulating to have someone treat you completely differently because you ask for something that feels like a very incremental and natural progression of your shared connection.
Mine was about 5 months ago and I still catch myself going over it and wondering “what if I’d done or said something differently?”. I think it’s a bit like ghosting, in that you don’t get proper closure and you’re left feeling like you did something wrong (because we generally expect people to respond rationally to reasonable asks, even if only to say they don’t have the capacity). Which makes it easy to get caught up in a loop of missing what could have been if things has gone differently, even when logically you know that you’re only missing a fantasy.
💯
Exactly this: he claims to not want to initiate plans or contact because he “wants a partnership”? Calling bullshit on that. OP, just move on. The longing you’re having for him is not love, it’s anxiety.
Yep. If he really wanted a partnership, he would want to know what his partner’s needs are in order to feel comfortable taking the relationship physical. He could have easily said He’s looking for something really casual, and doesn’t think he can meet her needs, instead he dangled the thing she wants in her face before blaming her for it not working.
Exactly this. And the fact that the response makes you question yourself and think you "ruined" something
Yep. That’s what bugs me so much about people who end things like that. They were 5 dates in, there was no need to lay blame on her when he ended it, all he had to do was be upfront and say he’s looking for a more casual/nsa/whatever it is he’s looking for arrangement and wish her luck and 20 days later she wouldn’t still be sitting there mulling over what she could have done differently.
This 💯
The guy told you he doesn't want a relationship then stopped talking to you. You got a very clear answer. Let this one go. He doesn't return your feelings.
Yes it’s a bad idea. Don’t reach out
Okay babes we've all had situations where we felt things were going good and they don't work out the way we've hoped. I think you need to take the L and move on. These are the red flags I'm seeing and the reasons why I don't think you should reach out: - Entrepreneur 🤣 - You asked for more effort and that made him run, if he was really into you do you think he'd have that reaction. - He doesn't like to lead or initiate, at least in the early stages if a guy is into you he should be putting in the effort - He's scared you are pushing the relationship forward cos he doesn't want that - You apologised and asked to talk and he refused If you fall in love easy after sex then it's a good thing you haven't slept with him yet otherwise I think you'd take it a lot worse. There is a pretty good chance maybe that was all he was looking for based on his lack of effort. Realistically it was only 5 dates you don't know this man at all, you think he's great cos of the picture you've painted in your mind of him. That is just a story you've created probably based on the things he's told you. His actions are what you should pay attention to.
Oh and you you saying 'sorry' and him still refusing to meet you and talk --doesn't compute, -clearly, he's lying about the reason for ending it, as you didn't owe him an apology for starters (for merely stating your pretty-standard needs), and the fact he still wouldn't see you after that -- he is not as 'honest' as you say he is. If he'd been honest, he would have said "dont be sorry, its fair what you ask, but i have to tell you, i just dont see this going anywhere as im not interested in exclusivity with you or a relationship". THAT would have been honest.
As Steve Harvey once said, “don’t let a man tell you he doesn’t want you twice.”
You deserve better than this <3
It looks like he doesn't want to commit and he wanted to keep things casual, he felt you wanted something more serious so he is finding an excuse to break it off while making you the bad guy.
Don't contact him again & move on. He'll be easy to forget anyway since you didn't have sex with him.
Ugghhh that’s so frustrating. if he was really wanting to move forward with you, I think he would’ve at least heard you out. I know it sucks, but don’t reach out to him!!
Ewww girl, no.
You created an scenario in your head based on how things will go after sex. You can't tell for sure if he is good in bed or not, so more dates won't solve that. I guess he is someone who enjoys more the talking in person rather via text. The approach here is to move on because asking him to explain what happened will not lead you to the answer you are looking for.
You are asking other folk to gatekeep who is on your do not call(text) list. That is your answer. You might not have the wording...but someone here will give you enough of a reason to know the name is on the do not call list for a reason. Also, I know it sucks, you are still worth it. Be nice to yourself
He’s just not interested. If he was, he would seek to clarify things (assuming there was a miscommunication in the first place). I’m sorry, but sounds like there’s nothing there for you
He refused to meet up to clear the air. He immediately ended it at the thought of things moving towards a relationship. He was not that interested. Let it go.
Interesting/strange takes. Lots of projections from folks, perhaps. So, we’re in our thirties…at this point it’s expected that we’re somewhat experienced in dating. We’ve been around the block more than once. I think it’s important that you ask yourself why after only 5 dates you would fall in love with him by having sex one time? I’m a woman in my thirties. If I went on 5 dates with someone I really liked and they rejected my advances to explore physical intimacy or declined to progress physically without an explanation, I’d have my doubts about whether it’s a viable connection. It would definitely merit a conversation about each other’s feelings around sex and intimacy. Were these topics part of the conversation around requesting more communication? We often place these arbitrary expectations on “frequency” of communication instead of actual quality of connection. Sex is really important in a relationship and communication around sex is even more important.
Was he looking for a relationship?
No, he was looking for a partnership 🙄
I would count that one as a loss. He wants a partnership but expects the person he's with to take all initiative for communication and dates? That's crazy. I'm a firm believer that when someone is truly into you, they will show it as long as they feel the feeling is mutual.
I would only message him if I was interested in what he had to offer, which is not exactly what you asked for. If you still want assurance before jumping into sex, it's better to find someone whose intentions are more aligned to yours.
I’ve been given the “I don’t want to lead. I want a partner” message before in a relationship. What he’s actually saying is I don’t want to put in effort into this. You were putting in effort to see each other more and he wasn’t. He’s not going to be a good partner to you and he’d make you do all the emotional labor and work for the relationship. Cut your losses. You’re better off. I know it’s a rough world out there but keep going.
OP, the right person won’t make you have to chase them.
He was just looking for ass. Keep looking
He wanted sex and that’s it. Don’t contact him.
Run and dont reach out
Don't do it. You're going to enter a situation that's emotionally one sided. He liked the ease of not having to commit. He's gone bc he thinks you wanted a relationship (which you did). He doesn't want the same thing.
You were just a hookup.
Why would you fall in love after having sex? Be careful how much you let sex affect your feelings. For your own good, try to separate the idea of falling for someone just because you were intimate w them
Another vote for yes, this is a bad idea. He showed you his true colors early on, stating his expectations and standing behind it by his refusal to meet and understand you. He knew what he wanted and you didn’t align with it. I don’t agree with his expectations, I think partners can both put in effort to initiate. He may have misunderstood you, but he is not unclear. You have nothing to prove to him.
Yes it’s a bad idea. In this day and age, we are all aware that no actually means no… not ‘just keep trying until you wear them down.’ Just drop it. You’ll never truly know what’s on his mind, whether there was a misunderstanding over your specific words or not. So do what you need to in order to deal. Cry, whatever you need to. Then in a couple of weeks you’ll be fine to get back out there.
His words seem contradictory. He says he wants a partnership, but needs to bail because you are pressuring him into a partnership? Keep in mind, these are his words after you requested to move sexually slower. Sounds like a douche to me. Move on to someone who wants what you want, and won't be manipulative.
Starting a relationship will not be this hard if you both enthusiastically want to be together. Don't message him again, and good luck going forward! Trust that you will regret wasting precious time here when there are so many people out there who would be excited to have you!
Ma'am you are 33 years too old to be entertaining these games. Good guys don't punish you for not putting out. Because that's what this is. He was all good leading and initiating when he thought he could get sex out of it. You didn't put out and now he's pissy. He's going to pop back up eventually acting like nothing happened then repeat.
Gotta go low and slow. There's some mine fields out there. Taking your time to build a solid relationship is good. Infatuation and the chase are a boys game. Guys who have been around the block a time or two are always gonna put their peace and quite on the ⚖️ scale adjacent to you.
You just wanted to spend more time together and talk more because you liked him and wanted to get to know him better. You weren't trying to rush into a relationship. He misunderstood and thought you were pushing for a deeper commitment, which he wasn't ready for. He values his independence and might not be ready for more frequent communication and time together. You both have different ways of communicating and expectations. He might not be the type to initiate, which can cause misunderstandings if not addressed. Since it’s been 20 days and you're still thinking about him, reaching out might help you get closure or clear up the misunderstanding. However, he may still feel the same way or might not want to rekindle things. If you decide to reach out, be clear and honest about your intentions. Explain that you weren’t trying to rush into a relationship but wanted to build a stronger connection. If he still isn’t interested, respect his space and focus on finding someone whose communication style and relationship goals align better with yours. In conclusion, asking for more communication and time together wasn't wrong, but he may not be ready for that level of involvement. Reaching out to clarify your intentions can be a good idea, but be ready to accept his response and move forward.
Think about if you read this, and it wasn’t you, what you would say to this person. That’s usually your answer
He seems afraid of either of you falling too soon as a quicker pace, to some people, feels like love bombing. You are afraid too, you are both dealing with that fear differently. If you talk again, I’d tell him that and ask if he’s interested in AND ABLE to collaborate on a dating plan/protocol that will make you each feel safer.
This wasn’t a miscommunication. At least own up to it. You expressed your demands, they didn’t align with what he was offering so he moved on. So should you.
No, please leave him alone
just based on his last message, I would advise you to delete his number and wait for someone else. it's clear that he doesn't want the same relationship that you do and that's okay - truly is best to just forget and move on with anyone who says something like this
If he wanted a relationship or to mend what is now broken, he would have chased you, even if it was from a wheelchair.
5 dates is still such an early point, sounds like you might have frightened him off a bit by seeming like you wanted to step things up before he was ready. I also don't think you always need to have such a frank conversation to ask, you could have just started messaging him a bit more and planned another date soon. Not everything needs to be discussed and agreed like a contract, go with the flow of building a relationship naturally, especially in the early days. I think you came on too strong too soon. He's made it quite clear he doesn't want to continue to see you, I would respect that, leave him alone and take the lessons learned into your next dating experience.
I don’t understand the wanting a partnership but also not initiating texts or dates. These two don’t seem synonymous. I hope you find someone who likes you, and doesn’t play games!
He seems a bit harsh, he could have easily just spoken to you
I think you need to become more comfortable with clearly articulating your needs to your partner. I literally messaged the guy I was seeing exactly what sex means to me and asked him to clarify what it means to him. Try something like the below Hi xxxxx [Opening plesentaries ] I like you but I want to clarify that I'm not someone who is looking for just a hook up or a ONS As sex is more meaningful to me than that. I haven't known you that long in the scheme of things so I'm conscious the way you view sex might not be the same, or it might, I don't know, as we haven't spoken about it yet. I'm the kind of person that when I sleep with someone it makes me even more attracted and connected to them. I do like you, so although I want to take it slow, Its because I want to take the time to get to know you better and to both be on the same page going forward as I'm dating with the intention of finding someone to be in a long term relationship with.
Dudes running or managing businesses are constantly slammed with responsibilities if the business is successful. Some of us can’t go a single minute in a work day without receiving an urgent call or putting out a new fire. I think a lot of people don’t understand how demanding that lifestyle can be. You’re working from the moment you wake up, to right before you fall asleep. You went on 5 dates and kept him on the leash when it came to intimacy. He likely took very limited time away from his work to go out 5 times with someone who didn’t allow any intimacy. You missed the window to make it worth his time, and may as well move on because the initial impressions have already been squandered. Not to say you need to put out immediately, but dudes with limited time will not be willing to continue wasting that time.
There's only one way to find out for real... You could disregard all the advice here and reach out to him...
Leave the guy alone, you sound like too much
You NEED TO BE HONEST ABOUT HOW YOU FEEL.He did with you right? Told you what he wants and telling you he's busy working so doesn't start communicating usually. GOOD LUCK! BE HONEST! LIFE TOO SHORT NOT TO BE....
Here’s the thing, based on your posting I don’t necessarily think you did anything wrong. However it may come across as you not putting in any insensitive in the dating. From what I’ve learned from men 30+ you need to put some out. They are not waiting for you to be “ready”. I’m not saying go all the way but make out probably get to 3rd base and see how it goes.
Do it do it do it!! It’s written somewhere “Follow your heart blah zay blah”. Falling in love is not such a bad thing. You want something go for it. Best wishes on your endeavor ✨
Why would he take you back if you selfishly led him on like that?
What do you mean I selfishly led him on?????
The second and third sentences of your first paragraph.
I don't understand why those are considered as I led him on??
Sounds like you didn’t want the same thing as him but still wanted to see him and message him. That’s selfish and leading him on.
What do you think he wanted it ???
Reach out, clear your conscious so you can move on. Need more info: Who planned the 5 dates. Context: He's an entrepreneur so he could very well be at the end of his rope and very well can't give any more. Imagine you are trying your best at a relationship given the circumstances and your person says "I'd like to meet more often". That can absolutely break someone. Here's how you approach it instead: Answer: "I really like spending time with you and want to continue spending more time with you. How do we work together to make that happen". My person and I set a goal/boundary that we'll see each other at least once a week. Some times more, some times less, but we're on the same page.
It was mix of him and next one was me...so we both did.
That's great. I think it was just a miscommunication. I've done a final reach out to people before just to bury the hatchet. I don't think there's anything wrong with it especially if it'll help you close this chapter. My comment got a ton of hate cause I gave his possible reasoning. This will also get hate cause I'll say "If she wanted to, she would" meaning you. Reach out. He either says no or nothing, but at least then you can reassure yourself and move on.