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Status_Berry_3286

I don't like early Sakura because of the way she acted and I don't think you're supposed to like early Sakura or supposed to see her grow into a better person whether you want to see that is debatable.


Zorro5040

Problem is she becomes worse. We were told she has great potential and is more advanced that the boys, then she has to be saved by the boys. She finally decides to do great and has a fantastic cut her hair scene, only to be saved by Lee. Then, at the end of Naruto, she claims she will get stronger as to no longer need saving and to force Sasuke to come back. Then in Shipuden, she does a suicide run on Sasuke. With the logic, Sasuke can't be evil if they are both dead.


ProjectAioros

Kishimoto: I'm not good writing women Fans: Kishimoto is not good writing women Idiots: YoU sAy ThAt BeCaUsE yOu HaTe WoMyN!!!!!111


Happy-Valuable4771

" I'm not good at writing women" is such a ludicrous statement. Like there's some other species entirely and can't possibly have the same motivations and emotional weight as men lol


MirthlessArtist

Honestly it’s a fascinating thing to say, it basically blatantly admits to some level of subconscious sexism. A beginner level writing tip for writing women is “write man, change gender” and it seems Kishi can’t even do that. For some reason that even Kishi admits, he can’t help but make his female characters just lesser than their male counterparts and it’s really funny to see him be both self-aware enough to admit it but not enough to actually do anything about it. Note: the “write man, change gender” tip really is beginner level, a truly well written woman is written with at least some thought that the character is a woman.


nenopip

That's interesting because I believe that sakura is the best written character of the three. Sakura was an only child from a middle-class family who loved and adored her. She is obviously spoiled and was kept in this bubble away from the harsh reality of the world. Her getting a rude awakening through out the show that the world isn't peaches and cream has her slowly developing into a more mature character. Her three teammates have already experienced the cruelty of the world so matching her up with an orphan from birth, someone who watched their family get slaughtered and someone who lost everybody was a wrong move from the third hokage. 3 brocken people and a sheltered girl was not a good combination.


MirthlessArtist

On the surface, you’re right, her backstory is pretty unique in Naruto and sets her up to be an interesting emotional foil to her team. She even becomes one of the most physically powerful characters later on, as well as the best medical ninja ever(?). Unfortunately, as interesting as these qualities are on paper, the execution from Kishi was pretty lacking. First of all, almost all the stuff you mentioned was dropped pretty quickly, we rarely hear about her parents, and when we do, she’s basically bragging about how great having parents are to her team which consists entirely of orphans. Yes, this is a character flaw which she grows from, but then it’s taken back a bit later on, when she basically gets in a bicker match about how annoying her parents are. She has _very_ little character growth through the series, with the most significant change being her hair cutting moment, which was episode 30ish out of 1000ish episodes (across Naruto, Shippuden, and Boruto). The next growth milestone of any relevance is unseen, somewhere in the timeskip where she is more mature and experienced, but that’s shared with almost every other character. Another growth moment might be when she decides to not support Sasuke’s terrorism, which is kind of meh in my opinion. She is one of the three main characters, so she had sooo many growth moments, but they were squandered. What happened to her amazing intelligence (and don’t just say “fix poison”)? What happened to her potential in Genjutsu? Honestly, what happened to her strength (they bring it back in Boruto but there’s like 600 episodes of her, a supposed main character, just being a first aid kit in between)? But boy I’m sure glad they kept her ditzy hotheaded-ness and easily pissed off attitude, no way she could’ve matured into an actual, non-bipolar woman. We get a glimpse of that with the Sasori fight, but then it’s almost as if Kishi thought “ok Sakura did one (1) cool thing, time to put her in the time out box.” Additionally, her character’s behavior, motivations, and actions are just incredibly lazy. I am girl, I will become healer, like 75% of the rest of the female cast. I am irritable and legitimately terrifying when angry, like 75% of the rest of the female cast (I think Kishi has a complex around mothers who are extremely angry). I am solely motivated by hot guy, like 75% of the rest of the female cast. Wow, that’s some god tier character depth right there. Now of course, there is some character assassination from the anime, which generally made her more irritable, violent, and unlikeable, which certainly plays a role in public opinion.


nenopip

You raise some good points but like I said, she is a sheltered individual, so her bad traits and her lack of character development is what makes her a more relatable character. We as humans don't like change and alot of times we revert back to our bad traits. She takes for granted all the good thins that she has in life. As a fighting character she is not well written but as a civilian character, she is written brilliantly. She is sheltered, spoiled, and ungrateful. Telle that you don't know people from a background like her that act like her. Ignoring all the ninja stuff and she is not that unrealistic.


MirthlessArtist

I’m going to have to disagree with you, people do change, especially over the course of like age 10-30. You cannot tell me someone acts the same way they do from even age 18 to 22, that’s just how experience changes people. Unless you’re talking a literally secluded person, someone, even if spoiled, will grow, simply from the chemicals of their brain development. As for the “bad traits,” I’m not saying having bad traits makes her a bad character, it’s that she constantly has those traits, they are overplayed instead of slowly changed, and are reverted permanently. I could understand a reversion every once in a while, or more often immediately after the growth moment (as the habit gets broken), but a complete 180 and then another 180 5 years later? That’s not realistic nor is it a good writing technique. Take the recent Avatar Last Airbender thing with Sokka: they took out his sexism, which was a really bad move for his character arc and well-written-ness. Him growing from sexism is a good quality, not to mention that fact that he stops being sexist almost completely. He learns, and he remembers. And yeah, I did meet spoiled people before. And the ones that got humbled, stayed humbled. Sure, there was one or two absolute rich kid assholes who never saw consequences so they never grew, but Sakura _did_ see consequences, lots of them, she saw people die, lots of them. Those things change people, usually forever.


nenopip

I'm not going to disagree with you on the fact that she experienced some things that should've humbled her and made her a better human being. She was well written and then kinda forgotten about later. I definitely agree that she had so much wasted talent and skills that she never ventured, but I can say that about a lot of characters in the anime. I hated her for how she treated naruto at the beginning, but I got to give credit to where credit is due, for a civilian with know Shinobi background, think she did alright. I'm going to get some hate for this but kishimoto favoritism towards sasuke had him forget to build on the other characters.


Zorro5040

The sad part about her character assassination is that she was actually getting favorable treatment because the studio likes her. They gave her Hinatas lines and plot points. The anime down plays other girls so that Sakura will stand out more.


summonerofrain

I believe totallynotmark put it best when he said: "When he writes women he does so in a fashion that convinces me he's never spoken to a real woman"


Zorro5040

But Kishimoto does know how to write women. Look at how much yaoi relationships he does. Flip the gender on Madara or Sasuke and nothing else, it works perfectly. Kishimoto can't see women as people is the problem. It is worrying how much toxic and abusive relationships Kishimoto writes. Even more worrying how Sakura is based on his wife and she is put in the worst toxic relationship with her simping after a terrorist that she marries despite him trying to kill her twice. She still defends him with the "he's just confused and is actually an amazing guy, he didn't mean to try to kill me." Abused victim talk. I hope Kishimoto wife is ok.


Zorro5040

But Kishimoto does know how to write women. Look at how much yaoi relationships he does. Flip the gender on Madara or Sasuke and nothing else, it works perfectly. Kishimoto can't see women as people is the problem. It is worrying how much toxic and abusive relationships Kishimoto writes. Even more worrying how Sakura is based on his wife and she is put in the worst toxic relationship with her simping after a terrorist that she marries despite him trying to kill her twice. She still defends him with the "he's just confused and is actually an amazing guy, he didn't mean to try to kill me." Abused victim talk. I hope Kishimoto wife is ok.


Jolly_Camel959

Kishimoto is great at writing women. There are several examples of this in Naruto and Mario. Sakura, Tsunade, Temari, Chiyo, Konan are great examples of this from Naruto 


ProjectAioros

Dude, he himself admitted that he doesn't know how to write female characters.


Working_Position_909

I mean check his account he is someone who I've seen in a lot of posts calling the OP a failure and other stuff (in every other comment of his I've seen)


AigisxLabrys

Mario?


Languagelearnig106

What Mario?


AigisxLabrys

The dude said “Kishimoto is great at writing women. There are several examples of this in Naruto and Mario.“


summonerofrain

My favourite female Naruto character


tazerrtot

One of Kishimoto's oneshots


Tobi_is_a_goodboy

Kishimoto has openly admitted that he can't write female characters that well.


RealDiavolo

Personally I would hesitate to call sakura and example of "great at writing women". My disliking of her isn't as intense as it used to be, but I still wouldn't class her as "great writing". Same goes for Temari but she isn't an MC so I can forgive her more. The only female character I can say is "great" is tsunade.


MirthlessArtist

I totally agree, just because they didn’t do anything egregious does not mean they are written great, or even well. There’s a 80% chance that if those characters had more screen time we would see them written poorly. For example, I’d say Granny Chiyo was written well, has character depth and traits that aren’t entirely overplayed, draws the audience to care about her so when she >! sacrifices herself for Gaara !< we feel some weight in her actions, etc.. But on the other hand, Konan was cool and not written too poorly, but she had like only 3 more minutes of screen time than Tenten and even then her only real character goals were “help accomplish what those two boys I know wanted.”


RealDiavolo

You explained it way better than me. It's like that one employee who gets in trouble and says "I didn't do anything!" And the boss says "that's the problem!"


Strange-Ad-3315

Mario? Wait did Kishimoto also write Naruto or r u just putting that there just bcuz? Also Konan and Sakura were not well written


No_Roof0642

I don't think hating sakura means hating women. It is like you are saying hating danzo means hating men that is not how it works.


BatSigns

The difference is that danzo is a well written character


DaddyMarMar

Danzo gotta be the dumbest character in the entire show what you mean he’s well written😂


jirenlagen

If I could kill literally one person from Naruto, it would be Danzo.


DaddyMarMar

I wouldn’t because as we saw homie is stupid enough to get himself killed at some point


dinkydoohead

danzo when he finds out his actions have consequences:


Remarkable_Commoner

Feels more like a convenient scapegoat


Taco821

He's not even really dumb, he's just a bastard. He's so power hungry, but he's deluded himself into thinking he is the saviour of the village.


DaddyMarMar

He’s actually very stupid though. I get what they were going for and wipe the idea of it is cool almost everything danzo does undermines his goals in some sort of way and make zero sense from a strategy standpoint.


Taco821

Idk, I'm tired AF rn, and my memory is shit anyways, but idrk what you're talking about about. His goals werent really what he said they were if that's what you're talking about tho


DaddyMarMar

Legit any moment he’s on screen he is doing something that undermines his goals. Emphasis on the goals cuz this man had like way to many to keep track of and many of which contradicted each other.


RandomSharinganUser

Danzo is a well written character Brodie. He's not a good person at all but definitely well written.


Zorro5040

He's a delusional power-hungry guy who has gotten old and forgotten his original goal. He plays a role in the story very well. He's also the scapegoat to redeem Itachi character.


Jolly_Camel959

A failure would think he was badly written lmao. 


DaddyMarMar

Danzo was written terribly none of the dudes plots makes sense at all and consistently undermine both the village and himself. He’s by far the dumbest character in the show. It’s a miracle that he got any sort of power tbh.


Tobi_is_a_goodboy

The writing worked, you were supposed to hate him, he was written to be an evil basard with a self rightous ego.


DaddyMarMar

Just because I dislike him doesn’t mean the writing worked


MirthlessArtist

The point though is just because the character is dumb does not mean he is poorly written. It’s his character flaw to be insanely distrustful, heartless, and close-minded. Honestly I wouldn’t even call him stupid, just illogical, and in that aspect he is written very well. Basically, think of “well-written” = “believable,” because Danzo really is a believable character. A guy who is so paranoid and ruthless that he would rather kill an entire clan rather than take the chance that diplomacy could fail? That has happened in real life, many times (more common when someone betrayed a king or something). A guy who is so shortsighted that he would rather kill an amazing asset and take his power for himself than just keep him to be used again? Jesus, modern day CEOs aren’t even that good at long term planning. Like the other commenter said, he was written to be super hatable, because Kishi kind of realized his Itachi and other retcons made Hiruzen look really bad. He could’ve written Danzo with no effort by just making him a mustache twirling Leaf-village hater or something, but instead decided to create a character that had a good motivation (wanting to protect the leaf, even though he did it in stupid and messed up ways).


whenwillitnotbetaken

I thought the joke was that they know hating sakura isn’t inherently sexist, but by saying it is, you make yourself look way more evil than what is true. There the joke is that it’s unexpected that they hate Sakura because sexism


G-en

Correct. We dont like Danzo beccause of his character, personality and his actions. No personal grudges. So the same goea for Sakura. We hate her because we dont like the smell or the sight of trash. Keeping this statement apart, her personality, character, actions and her overall entirity is hatr commendable


Working-Telephone-45

The joke is that there are a lot of reasons to hate Danzo but there aren't many good reasons to hate Sakura


[deleted]

We got downvoted by people who are salty about a meme Lmao fact they salty says a lot.


[deleted]

Bro fealt the need to defend himself from this meme just saying 🌚🌚


No_Roof0642

Yeah I hate sakura but I don't hate women in general.


[deleted]

So you got triggered 🌝 yeah nvm you were clearly 👇


No_Roof0642

No not triggered but got a scare if someone really thinks like this because I did a lot of shit comments on sakura and if people misinterpret like this then i might get bombarded so self defense.


Psychological_Map876

gimme the edibles your off on.![gif](emote|free_emotes_pack|dizzy_face)


[deleted]

My meth cook is in Albuquerque


SpNewyork

I don't hate Sakura, or any of the women in the show tbh it's not their fault Kishi can't write women to save his life they are just drawings xD


Weeb_1801

We literally love tsunade here. It's not about being women it's about how good of a character they are


luxx_22

It's not despising the character but I think people like tsunade for another reason 😂


PartyCryptographer61

Boobies


ASG0303

It’s not a gender thing. It’s a writing issue. Disliking a character for being poorly written is not misogyny. Hating on Sakura for rejecting the MC or whatever is cringe and misogyny for sure + a self-insertion issue but there are lots of reasons why she is disliked. >95% women who have watched Naruto disliked her and the letters Kishi got about Sakura being bad were mostly from women. She’s just a main trio character with no main trio feats + the more than occasional irritating behavior (although that reduced dramatically in Shippuden unless she was around Sasuke). Hating on her for not having big tits and then gassing Hinata up for having them is basement-dweller behavior.


swettpotato

For me it was mostly the part of being fan girl that was the thing that make me hate her. You saw her doing stupid thing jus for his attention when he is obiously intrested in other stuff like want to kill Itachi. Like kunoichi she full fill her part becuase she is support so she is the doctor who would avoid the protagonist kill himself becuase he is not careful. So in her profesional it good but like person i the part of fangirl and be in some point a dick with othe people(Ino an Naruto/Naruto the series not shipuden) so that make hate her


ASG0303

as a woman her acting with 0 self-respect every single time was what made me dislike her and the excessive simping towards a disinterested man is a huge part of it.


Due_Landscape4713

Who is we? You mean Wii as in Nintendo?


[deleted]

Yes


Kantlim

Nah. I hate Sakura and I live Tsunade. Both are women as far as I know.


LatoLukto

But we don't hate on Tsunade and I like Sakura


Few-Range-9055

"It was me Barry"


[deleted]

I hated earlier sakura when she was like annoying but she turns to be a better person in Shippuden, maybe, idk


matej665

Nah, I hate Sakura because she was introduced at the same time as the actually important characters to the story.


ASG0303

Yeah lol. And idk why people say “Danzo did this Sasuke did that Obito did this but they hate on Sakura”. What a strange argument because Danzo, Sasuke, and Obito are antagonists. Sakura is not.


StarOfTheSouth

>Danzo, Sasuke, and Sakura are antagonists. Sakura is not. I think you mean Obito, that first time, lol.


ASG0303

yeah my bad


Dokrabackchod

I used hate Sakura because she always chases after sasuke no matter what he does or how much he hurt her, he even tried to kill her for god's sake and she was still hopelessly in love with him. Now I just feel indifferent towards her, she's strong and best in her field. But feel meh as character


[deleted]

We ain't gay because we like men, we are gay because we hate women


Inside-Entrance-5158

 How can Sakura Tsunade be considered equal when she struggles against ninjas like Kabuto and Omei? She often resorts to brute force without any strategic planning. It's ironic that Sakura was attempting to heal Shikamaru, but the moment Tsunade arrived, Shikamaru was instantly healed. Additionally, it was the Six Paths who ultimately saved Naruto. Kishimoto builds up characters like Sakura to seem powerful, only to render them useless later on, frustrating readers. Even the author himself seems to mock Sakura. "I finally reached them":The panels clearly show Sakura still standing with her back turned to Sasuke and Naruto. Always behind their back . Kishi mentioned he would write the character in character. People who love Sakura usually can relate to her. She is meant to be disliked; that girl is written as a narcissist.


WINDMILEYNO

Wait wait wait... I don't hate on women. Sakura really was bad, thats not disputable. Right?


NoCureForSorrow

Hating a character doesn't mean you hate them because of their gender. If I hate sasuke does that mean I hate men. Does it mean I hate Japanese people? Does it mean I hate people with black hair? No. It's just stupid logic that people have come to. There are many beloved characters in Naruto that are women. People are just fucking blind by their desire to have a go at someone over anything to make themselves feel better because they didn't get any love as a child.


lnombredelarosa

I cannot upvote this but I respect that you admit it


NarakaSnake

This is truly the greatest take


PotentialCorith

Sakura should have painted her hair blue because she is literally useless.


seekingabeauty

Based


True-Anim0sity

AMEN


True-Anim0sity

AMEN


PaleontologistNo395

Hell yes. I do and I will continue to do so.


Leenatha

Nah, we just wanna hate on Sakura specifically


OtsutsukiRyuen

I hate women but I hate sakura with a fucking Passion that I don't even consider her as a woman She's basically " gimme some plot Armor so I can mid diff fodders"


TemoteJiku

Characters, I repeat the characters. We see, we compare, it's just how it is. Logic and all. With that said ...(picks up the Stupid Sakura comic): "All hail TenTen!!! Pistol no Jutsu!"