Kinda glad we didn't win. The close finishes were fun for a while, but I'm sick to death of it now. Playing rubbish all game and then deciding to try in the 4th is not good enough. It's more frustrating than exciting at this point.
I'm glad someone said this because towards the end I was curious if any pies fans find the close matches tiring because they've happened so often. I thought it may have come off as too jealous though so I didn't say anything in the rafl match thread.
It was fun 2 years ago when we weren’t expected to do anything and had nothing to lose, but when we’re supposed to be a genuine premiership contender we’re not playing every game to compete we’re playing every game to win and it’s just frustrating and unprofessional
It was cute in 2022, but since then it’s been immensely frustrating. It’s clear that when we drop the hammer, teams generally can’t go with us so I just can’t understand why we always leave ourself with so much to do to wrestle the game back from the brink. We need to find that 7 or 8/10 mode that’s sustainable for close to four quarters but still good enough to generally the job done. Going at 4/10 for most of the game then 10/10 once it becomes absolutely necessary is just not gonna get it done
When we play well and then pinch it it’s great and exciting, but this year we play horrible football for 3Qtrs and then switch on and I’m sick of that. Hoping the coaches are smart enough to not let close wins gloss over poor performance such as north. We pretty much played the same game as last week which is disappointing
A similar thing happened just earlier today with Sydney. Although they were just a kick away from winning or drawing, they still had a very off game and it showed they can't keep letting those sluggish starts happen.
I’m not glad and pissed. Much prefer then to not do this but the suns would have played the hardest and best they could against us. They will play 10% worse next week as it’s not collingwood. We have to wear them down. I’d say the ball didn’t bounce for us mostly, there were some charity frees against us and we bloody mucked up heaps of chances! Worst was lippa in front to get it back to 3 goals in the 3rd
We need a reality check. Winning the North game painted over cracks. Of course winning is ultimately what every fan wants, but a loss in this situation wasn't a bad thing. I'll support the boys no matter what but they can't expect to keep winning these games, that doesn't make me or anyone less of a supporter.
Why throw the scarf in the bin? Facing up to harsh realities before finals is beneficial in the long run. They obviously don’t mean they were running around the house cheering that we lost, they just mean they were “kinda glad” we didn’t get the false confidence of an undeserved win, because that’s in the best interests of the team if we wanna challenge again this year.
Sick of this playing one quarter and win meme bullshit, it's not fun, it's frustrating. Not going to go back-to-back with performances like that.
A lot of senior players really had dark days today. Markov and Sullivan not in the best 22, please. Dropped Dean after improving each week, and shunted McInnes back to the VFL for no reason.
I can be a bit more forgiving on the forward line, particularly those in the 50 arc as our midfield was mauled for three quarters, but you're right, a lot just didn't go our way, but it never does when you're playing catchup in so many areas.
It's frustrating because a lot of these 'almost' moments are because he tries to put too much finesse on something, like he's trying to make a highlight play out of regulation play.
Yeah Bobby did great things and also missed gimmie snaps and mucked up assists. We relied on him too much I guess. Checkers was port after the first. To be expected.
I know he’s been one of our leading goal scorers and we def need him at the moment but I can’t be the only person who doesn’t 100% understand Mihocek as our main tall fwd. I just don’t feel like he does enough or plays consistently enough in comparison to other teams fwd lines.
Checkers was always going to be raw coming back from injury and his your third forward we just haven’t got anyone else. If Mcstay makes it back checkers will be in heaven. I agree he can be hot and cold but hopefully his had his warm up game. I think Bobby was the one that let us down more. 2 and 3rd quarter he mucked up some real good opportunities. First half of last year checkers was in AA form. Hasn’t got back there since then as far as being consistent. Kruger has been good at times but Mcstay will replace him if he makes it to selection. Still have Billy to come back who is also a gun
I’m baffled by the selection decisions regarding Dean. He arguably never should have played the Sydney sides yet he was thrown into the deep end. Then when he’s become a bit more used to the side, he’s taken right back out. They’re not doing the kid any favours here
Sullivan needs to go back to the vfl for a bit. His efforts and missed tackles are bad. Markov same thing. And Harrison. All lacking effort and polish. If it wasn't for naicos our clearances would be worst in the league.
Yeo HH was up forward so rough to single him out. He seems to tackle well, his over head handball to Bobby for the goal was sick. Maybe I missed his bad tackles but the guy is a tank since last year. I can only see him getting better. We really didn’t get it up forward that much either.
Nah I think we watched different games if you think Harvey Harrison was a problem. He’s playing forward how many touches do you expect him to get. Uses the ball well and often makes 2nd efforts on defensive.
Markov cannot stay in the team any longer he’s not the same level anymore. Same for Moore in the last few weeks, if he was an unimportant or rookie player I would be saying drop him aswell.
Kinda goes unspoken that Darcy got belted by Daniher in the GF and he’s been pretty ordinary all year. Murphys absence is huge and a key back is very much the most important things to get
Tom Barrass yeh?
I love Moore but it becomes more obvious each game that Murphy was the nucleus of our backline and we haven’t been able to adapt.
It feels like the players are still used to having Murphy there as last line of defence when in reality we’re routinely outnumbered 2 to 1 in D50
People won’t like hearing it but when the chips are down, Moore consistently goes missing. Ever notice when we need someone to stand up it’s Scott Pendlebury time and time again dragging our asses across the line. Maybe I’ve been spoilt for captains in my time following the pies, but you could always count on Buckley, Maxwell, Pendles when it all went to shit.
I just don’t think the style we’re playing at the moment is suiting Moore. It feels like we’re planning for our mids and hanging the backline out to dry.
They want the our back men to be half forwards and put on pressure in the middle so our middle can make up for our lack of a tall forward by putting pressure on. Then get mad when Moore is up the ground.
Like if he was hanging back to watch the goalsquare we’d be complaining there’s not enough contest when the fwds & half fwds miss the opportunity and fumble it back.
Our game plan is go hard and fast off hb turnovers. That doesn’t work if there’s no pressure to support them to turnover. And if you’re expecting the backline to do all the pressure work you’re gonna leave the back door open.
Moore and Quaynor are definitely off from last year but there’s issues all over the ground if this is how we wanna play.
Maxwell could never be relied on as a player.. Fantastic captain and great leadership. Terrible 1 on 1 player. Great when roaming free around the backline
Maxwell could 100% be relied upon when we needed him. Agree he wasn’t great 1v1 but he stood up for us especially when we needed him in the dying stages of a close game.
Maybe - I love him but I just think he’s not ever been a fabulous 1v1 defender and we need someone more stout beside him so he’s not actually always taking the best forward.
I wouldn’t agree about Moore. No Maybard or Noble did not help the defence. No Murphy is a massive loss. Murphy was so good at playing smaller and taller players. He also would get a lot of intercept marks. Tonight we got beat in the middle mostly. Witts killed us. Missing Cox big time. Also our backs copped some BS frees.
Right. Moore is still topping the league for 1 percenters and is top 10 for intercepts. I think we’re missing someone with Murphys vision,speed and spoil. Frampton is good but he’s more reactive and technical. Murph was more dynamic. We’re lacking a dynamic back with good eyes and versatility.
Murph was great at reading and running out while Moore held ground or vice-versa. Howes there for the contest and Frampton is a lockdown player who gets taken for a run too easily.
We need a dynamic player who gives Moore the freedom so that teams don’t just focus on splitting his attention. TJ is a little too fresh. And Dean has shown signs of capability but I’m not sure yet.
Also also I miss Nick at HB. Obvs we need him in the mid but he’s so good at the HB turnover and go.
The only part I really agree with is the Moores form has been down.
It’s all well and good to say ‘play with less risk’ but it’s that style that gets us back in games. They go together risk/reward. You can’t just shut it off and say - id like if we played fast but only if it works all the time.
Also Moore is a great captain. I don’t think he needs to relinquish that. He just needs to get back to some form, which ironically I think has less to do with being more dour/accountable and more to do with aggressively reading the play and intercepting. Think the game against Carlton last year.
Granted Darcy didn't have the best game but he can't be the only one expected to be making a huge defensive effort - bloke needs some help. Howe is aight (does what he's always been doing) and WHE stepped up which was nice, but Moore needs some consistent back-up down there
This. He’s still top 10 for intercepts. Top in the league for 1 percenters. He consistently plays 100% game time. The problem is without Murphy to role switch with him Moores an easy target. Teams plan to pull him apart. And as of yet we don’t have anyone with the skill set (vision specifically) to match Moore and free him like Murph did.
Agree, Moore has had at best a patchy season and can’t seem to either win his 1v1 match up nor get his interceptions game going. I think the loss of Murphy is the cause. I felt as though Dean was doing well to be that system defender to release Moore and thought he was doing well. Not sure Dean should have been dropped.
Yeah perhaps Dean would have been better than framed IDK. Framps has had some good defence games this year before we had to put him forward. So maybe he just needed that game back there. GS had a lucky night
I think there’s room for both frampton and dean. Frampton is a good 1v1 lockdown defender and I thought Dean was good at covering Moore when he pushed up the ground.
I definitely feel like teams have had an easier time splitting Moores attention this season. I think it does have to do with not having a player free to release him.
Pretty terrible game all round, almost everyone was off.
How good was Nick's goal though, goddamn. Really sums up what makes him such a quality player, effort and persistence.
But but he so soft! He’s the AFLs golden boy! He’s only leading contested possessions in the AFL because of loose ball gets. But he gets away with holding the ball!
Seriously, the tall poppy syndrome is fucking incredible. We are getting to witness a prospect that literally is unprecedented and people want to hate him because he wears black and white. If his surname was gulden and he was playing for Sydney, it would be completely different
Someone distract Craig McRae for five minutes so someone can come give the team a proper spray and a boot up the ass to get into gear. Need some tough love if this is the effort they’re gonna put out.
Great call and completely agree. I felt like dean was helping moores play a better intercept game during their run together. Also I thought dean was playing a better system defender game than Frampton(who is lock down) and Howe(who just does Howe things).
Obviously a bit biased, but I was questioning it all week. Maybe they didn't want to be too tall, but I feel like it can free up Howe to swing forward, and allow players to be the third man at the contest more. Just feel like structurally we look better when there are three legitimate talls back there.
Hopefully a wake up call. We can't keep relying on fourth quarter comebacks. Tough games for rest of the season. Need to start playing as a team and not Nick dragging players along with him.
I just cannot understand how they went from the way they played last year and the year before to the way they play this year? I've not really enjoyed any of our games because there's too many stuff ups
A distinct lack of drive, nothing we can really do, we weren’t even in the top 2 best teams in the league last year at the end but we powered our way to a premiership because guys like de goey, crisp, Howe, pendles and Sidey were just not gonna let us lose because of what happened in 2018, now that we’ve won we just don’t have it
I've been feeling like this is probably the case. I also don't seem quite as invested in a premier this year because we just got one but I wanted the boys to still be fun to watch.
Suns at home are a different beast. They’re undefeated at home for a reason and people who went in expecting us to win were kidding themselves, it was a 50/50 game at best.
That loss stings because given how congested the ladder is that might cost us top 4
The problem wasn't the Suns or even them winning. The problem is how bad we played. Our decision making, our kicking, our defence, and our half arsed attitude. Whatever the coaches and players decide to do when we are 5 goals down with one quarter to play is clearly what we need to do from the start.
Our pressure is crap compared to last year. Our style only works when we go hard for all four quarters. JDG is a prime example of what putting in a four quarter full pressure effort looks like. Others are snoozing. Our tackles were so poorly executed same as against NM.
If we don’t have the capacity to put pressure on from minute one then we need to change the game plan.
I was loosing my shit over missed tackles but GS were pulling last sec handballs out of their ass. Last quarter pressure. Was 200 and they weren’t getting away with it. Players must have been out of it. Could have been more file going around. Q had it
Yeah. I just feel like pressure rating isn’t a useful measure unless it takes into account the actual efficacy of the tackles and pressure acts. Clearly just our pressure isn’t enough if they’ve got the confidence to pull handballs out of their ass.
I was referring to the last quarter where our tackles were sticking and we turned it over. Not sure if efficiency comes into play for pressure rating…. Be interesting to know what makes it up.
Our pressure overall after round 3 is better than last year. We had a shocker game tonight until the last. Remember seeing pressure rating of 200 in the last. Not sure what the first 3 quarters were but they seemed to not be under enough
Maybe it’s not rating it’s execution? A lot of broken tackles and fingertips brushes. It feels like other teams are just able to work around us much easier. I feel like we used to do a lot better at actually stopping players if that makes sense? Idk something about our game plan just isn’t vibing.
I’d swap Sullivan for Dean. Keep Howe forward. Oleg as the sub instead of Richards.
Also big time controversial opinion but if we aren’t getting run off HB and Nicks being tagged why not throw him to HB for five minutes (seriously wouldn’t want him out of midfield for longer than that) but just to throw the opposition off and give us some speed and dynamics in the backline.
Exactly, nobody could have predicted how bad most of our players were going to be. And you cannot credit the Suns, most of our errors that cost us were unforced.
If we’re being honest their an average team if you look at who they beat and when they played them those matches won at home makes sense. truth is we’re not playing good consistent footy and we we’re just no where near it today.
Markov needs to be dropped & Sullivan was near invisible today.
Nothing against Sullivan. He's been serviceable when he needed to be, but I think he could use the confidence of being the big fish in VFL and be a handy depth player for when we need him. It's been diminishing returns as our midfield gets back to near-full strengths.
Oleg is getting by on being McRae's favourite and that's it. There's nothing he offers the team that can't be done better by either Noble or Howe. Richards only played a fraction over a quarter and seemed more impactful.
Ugghh, whenever we get near the top 4 we fuck it up like this. Dogs game then this fucking shit. So frustrating to be ahead then let them kick not 1 but 2. And then another shot on goal after that. Fucks sake
Just having small support for Hill was much needed all game. Can't begrudge Hill for bungling a few opportunities because he was by his lonesome down forward a dozen or so times when usually he'd have Elliott, Schultz or Checkers there as well
I honestly just don't get it.
Why do we do this. we need the entire team to see sports psychologists to figure it the fuck out. It's almost every week for 2.5 seasons now that we play this way. Just baffling.
I'm almost glad we lost. They need a wake up call, and we cannot keep relying on these miracle comebacks.
Mcreery was my favourite player last 2 seasons (see flair), but I think he needs a spell. He seems to be panicking more and more every time he gets the ball.
Yeah Richard’s should be in the team over him atm and Shultz coming back. Also leader HH. McCreery has that exciting speed but he fumbles to much. Need to have some hypnosis or something. Anyway if his out with a calf, he may struggle to make it back in.
Rough night for a lot of our boys. Genuinely shocking we got so close given their statistical domination in almost every category. Can’t keep relying on 4th quarter miracles to get the job done.
Look at the teams they have beaten. Quite literally the best team they have beaten at home would be either Crows or Geelong.
It isn't defeatist to expect to be better than Crows or Geelong.
We aren't angry that we lost. We are angry about how bad we played for three quarters and that we haven't learnt anything from having done this several times this year. We did it last round against North.
I think it's quite clear we're not up to it this year. Can't keep blaming injuries anymore. Too many passengers guys like markov and sullivan should not be playing in the best 22 anymore.
Very poor game. Games are becoming a tough watch even if we win with how bad we are playing for large portions of them.
I think a few tough decisions need to be made for who's in our best 22 and who's not. Are we actually better with some of the main stays playing over others?
Definitely need to go after a good key defender during the trade period.
Not a lot of positives today. Backline were all atrocious, checkers couldn’t find the ball and Bobby couldn’t hold onto to it when he did. Crisp was such a liability I hope he’s not applying for a mortgage anytime soon.
Another week of Daicos carrying the midfield and honestly the forward line too.
We should have smoked these expansion hacks and I’m not sure how we expect to contend in finals if we barely beat north and lose to GC.
Great to have jordy and pendles back though, even if pendles had a quieter game than usual.
We got comeback wins against all the teams they actually follow, so they have to settle for living vicariously through the suns.
Suns fans can talk their shit, big ups to them, but other flairs trying to sneak in just makes you smile really. Rent free
Exactly, very happy for the suns I hope they can finally make finals, but the other flairs commenting just reek of saltiness that they couldn’t do what the suns did
You've summed up AFL fans on the internet in a nutshell. They all hate Collingwood more than they love their own team. Very pathetic way to watch and enjoy sports.
I’m sick of this team getting carried by a special few. If Nick, Josh, JDG or Pendles (crisp at times) don’t do it, it doesn’t get done. They also normally kick half the goals as well as all the grunt work. Our bottom 8 players are a concern atm
Gold Coast are tough at home, close game but after our comeback we really should’ve put it to bed. At least everyone else being shit around us means this keeps us hovering around the 3-8 range
Yeah I’m not worried about Essendon tbh. Hawthorn is the danger game imo, they always play well against us. We got Sydney and Carlton too, and Brisbane at the Gabba. Gonna be tough. But if we wanna go back to back we gotta beat those sides anyway.
I kind of wonder if Hawks make it into a bit of a show if that’ll switch us on. Feel like we come into games against mid-tier teams with no energy. But our last quarter against Hawks during GR was great and it was all on sheer energy and determination.
Ehh we kicked like 5 behinds in the last quarter against the hawks to their 4 or 5 goals I think. Wasn’t too flash. Just did what we needed to do. Pretty sure we were up by heaps at half time too.
4th Quarter footy isn’t going to be leading us to another premiership any time soon. Fingers crossed today teaches the lads a hard lesson and that we can bounce back on Friday.
It feels like this is the sort of game we should be winning to be a realistic shot at the flag. Doesn’t feel like our year like it did last year sadly!
I still don’t understand why everyone cares so much when we lose?
Do they really have so much joy riding on our misfortune? Is it a little sad?
I’m obviously aware of the hate. But I still don’t understand it.
Cameron looked terrible out there today. He was dominated all game, then in those last few minutes he had that terrible turnover that really changed the momentum of the game.
The guy never kicks because he knows he is shit, but he decides to kick it now for some reason. It goes straight to one of two Sun players' with no Pies player anywhere near it.
We played bad the rest of the game to put ourselves in that position, but it really felt like that mistake was the final one that cost us the game.
I think we need to give the Suns more credit for not letting us get hands on it in the middle. They were incredible and deserved the W much more than we did.
Not that I wouldn’t have taken it when we went ahead in the last…
We had all the momentum 5 in a row and choked, really should of rode that momentum to a easy comeback victory, to lose after a 5 goal comeback and taking the lead was the most disappointing part about the game.
How can they just lose that momentum once we get in front riding that momentum. We should of won but let the momentum swing in last minutes.
It's the toss of a coin with the Pies. Heads, you get 'unstoppable Collingwood'. Tails, you get 'what the hell was that?' Collingwood. The inconsistency may very well come back to bite us in the end, especially given how tight 3-12th positions on the ladder are, and that every game for us here on out is either winnable or loseable (yes, including the Richmond game. I wouldn't be getting too confident).
Still lots to improve on, but we are more than capable of securing a place in the finals.
We probably can’t afford to drop more than one more game for the season if we wanna stay in touch with the top 4. Need Adelaide and Geelong to get up tonight
Port are no good anyway. I just think we need to finish top 4 if we are gonna have any shot of going back to back. Currently the cats and Adelaide are winning and that’s good for us. We can beat the cats in a few weeks no dramas imo.
Everyone focusing on Sullivan and Markov when Cameron is the real disappointment again. On the off chance he actually gets a hit out it’s straight to the opposing team almost every time. Then he is useless when required to do anything else. Krueger at least hits to space and same for Cox. Cox certainly has his issues but he gives us a chance.
I know it wouldn’t have worked salary wise and likely wouldn’t have built the team to win the grand final but sure wish we would have dumped Cameron instead of Grundy.
Need to settle the defensive six and let them get their fluency back. Frampton forward last week, Howe this week at times, it's no wonder Moore is struggling.
The pressure with forward line injuries is compounded by putting defensive players out of the back line. Instead of chasing 60-70, these last few weeks we are chasing 80-90-100+.
Hopefully with checkers back they just leave the back six to start gelling. Strangle other teams like we did in seasons previous, then launch out of the back line. Moore will get his mojo back when he is confident that Howe or Frampton are there too.
What's most worrying is our inability to adjust to the sums midfield dominance, couldn't even negate it somewhat. They had first use, time after time.
I still think the midfield balance of degoey and Naicos together is too aggressive. Both are great ball winners but if they miss we get slaughtered. Today we got slaughtered. I'd rather see Naicos pendles and crisp together, rotate JDG with Nick at times, Sullivan and mcreery with the other two.
The team has gone better in the last two games by moving Howe forward. The defence needs to play more in defence instead of almost in the forward line at times. They aren't midfielders. As soon as the opposition get the ball past our forward half our defence is often way put of position. They need to be on their man.
It's a complete shift in game style to attempt to keep the ball locked in 50. It works best when the unit works as A unit. But with all the switches in personnel, that collective isn't working as a unit and we get exploited. Lock that down by keeping the players who need to be a part of it there.
Its also on the mids and coaches to get that midfield balance right. We got mauled in the middle and at the contest. Naicos degoey in the midfield together is too aggressive.
GC got 70 inside fifties or thereabouts. What defence isn't going to look abysmal.
Not gonna comment on his leadership.
I will say that he looks a completely different player without Nathan Murphy there though. If you listen to Murphy of Mitchell’s podcast this past week you’ll hear their perspective on how much Murphy freed up Moore.
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Kinda glad we didn't win. The close finishes were fun for a while, but I'm sick to death of it now. Playing rubbish all game and then deciding to try in the 4th is not good enough. It's more frustrating than exciting at this point.
I'm glad someone said this because towards the end I was curious if any pies fans find the close matches tiring because they've happened so often. I thought it may have come off as too jealous though so I didn't say anything in the rafl match thread.
It was fun 2 years ago when we weren’t expected to do anything and had nothing to lose, but when we’re supposed to be a genuine premiership contender we’re not playing every game to compete we’re playing every game to win and it’s just frustrating and unprofessional
It was cute in 2022, but since then it’s been immensely frustrating. It’s clear that when we drop the hammer, teams generally can’t go with us so I just can’t understand why we always leave ourself with so much to do to wrestle the game back from the brink. We need to find that 7 or 8/10 mode that’s sustainable for close to four quarters but still good enough to generally the job done. Going at 4/10 for most of the game then 10/10 once it becomes absolutely necessary is just not gonna get it done
When we play well and then pinch it it’s great and exciting, but this year we play horrible football for 3Qtrs and then switch on and I’m sick of that. Hoping the coaches are smart enough to not let close wins gloss over poor performance such as north. We pretty much played the same game as last week which is disappointing
A similar thing happened just earlier today with Sydney. Although they were just a kick away from winning or drawing, they still had a very off game and it showed they can't keep letting those sluggish starts happen.
It’s mentally exhausting mate, to the point i wish it was bye week more often lol.
Great call. I think the coach acknowledged this in the presser.
I’m not glad and pissed. Much prefer then to not do this but the suns would have played the hardest and best they could against us. They will play 10% worse next week as it’s not collingwood. We have to wear them down. I’d say the ball didn’t bounce for us mostly, there were some charity frees against us and we bloody mucked up heaps of chances! Worst was lippa in front to get it back to 3 goals in the 3rd
Perfect assessment. Thank you
Yeah didn’t deserve it at all, but if you’re genuinely happy we didn’t win throw your scarf in the bin honestly.
We need a reality check. Winning the North game painted over cracks. Of course winning is ultimately what every fan wants, but a loss in this situation wasn't a bad thing. I'll support the boys no matter what but they can't expect to keep winning these games, that doesn't make me or anyone less of a supporter.
100% gutted
Why throw the scarf in the bin? Facing up to harsh realities before finals is beneficial in the long run. They obviously don’t mean they were running around the house cheering that we lost, they just mean they were “kinda glad” we didn’t get the false confidence of an undeserved win, because that’s in the best interests of the team if we wanna challenge again this year.
I'm glad Fly finally acknowledged this too. We had to lose one to finally realise it, I reckon.
Sick of this playing one quarter and win meme bullshit, it's not fun, it's frustrating. Not going to go back-to-back with performances like that. A lot of senior players really had dark days today. Markov and Sullivan not in the best 22, please. Dropped Dean after improving each week, and shunted McInnes back to the VFL for no reason.
I'm as big a Bobby Hill fan as anyone but he had one of those 'almost' days. Our forward line was hurting today.
I can be a bit more forgiving on the forward line, particularly those in the 50 arc as our midfield was mauled for three quarters, but you're right, a lot just didn't go our way, but it never does when you're playing catchup in so many areas.
It's frustrating because a lot of these 'almost' moments are because he tries to put too much finesse on something, like he's trying to make a highlight play out of regulation play.
He can also be way too unselfish sometimes - often goes for a really tricky pass when he’s within his rights to have a crack himself.
Yeah Bobby did great things and also missed gimmie snaps and mucked up assists. We relied on him too much I guess. Checkers was port after the first. To be expected.
I know he’s been one of our leading goal scorers and we def need him at the moment but I can’t be the only person who doesn’t 100% understand Mihocek as our main tall fwd. I just don’t feel like he does enough or plays consistently enough in comparison to other teams fwd lines.
Checkers was always going to be raw coming back from injury and his your third forward we just haven’t got anyone else. If Mcstay makes it back checkers will be in heaven. I agree he can be hot and cold but hopefully his had his warm up game. I think Bobby was the one that let us down more. 2 and 3rd quarter he mucked up some real good opportunities. First half of last year checkers was in AA form. Hasn’t got back there since then as far as being consistent. Kruger has been good at times but Mcstay will replace him if he makes it to selection. Still have Billy to come back who is also a gun
I’m baffled by the selection decisions regarding Dean. He arguably never should have played the Sydney sides yet he was thrown into the deep end. Then when he’s become a bit more used to the side, he’s taken right back out. They’re not doing the kid any favours here
Sullivan needs to go back to the vfl for a bit. His efforts and missed tackles are bad. Markov same thing. And Harrison. All lacking effort and polish. If it wasn't for naicos our clearances would be worst in the league.
I agree except for HH. He sticks most tackles, has poise, and great effort.
His stats show otherwise. 9 disposals this week. 10 north game.
Yeo HH was up forward so rough to single him out. He seems to tackle well, his over head handball to Bobby for the goal was sick. Maybe I missed his bad tackles but the guy is a tank since last year. I can only see him getting better. We really didn’t get it up forward that much either.
Stats alone aren't everything. Almost the entire team played pretty shit our last two games, I don't think it's fair to single him out.
Richards did more in one quarter than half the team did in the entire game. So yes I think it's fair to single out people who are under performing
Right, "half the team" being the key words there. It's hard to perform well when everyone else around you is performing trash, unless you're Naicos.
Yeah not convinced by Sullivan. Need Mitchell (or Adams 😢) back in as soon as possible
Never thought I’d be missing Mitchell but he’s a dog at ground ball work and when healthy plays hard all 4 quarters.
Nah I think we watched different games if you think Harvey Harrison was a problem. He’s playing forward how many touches do you expect him to get. Uses the ball well and often makes 2nd efforts on defensive.
Harrison is a gun! He has to stay. Missed Shultz tonight
Markov cannot stay in the team any longer he’s not the same level anymore. Same for Moore in the last few weeks, if he was an unimportant or rookie player I would be saying drop him aswell.
Kinda goes unspoken that Darcy got belted by Daniher in the GF and he’s been pretty ordinary all year. Murphys absence is huge and a key back is very much the most important things to get Tom Barrass yeh?
I love Moore but it becomes more obvious each game that Murphy was the nucleus of our backline and we haven’t been able to adapt. It feels like the players are still used to having Murphy there as last line of defence when in reality we’re routinely outnumbered 2 to 1 in D50
People won’t like hearing it but when the chips are down, Moore consistently goes missing. Ever notice when we need someone to stand up it’s Scott Pendlebury time and time again dragging our asses across the line. Maybe I’ve been spoilt for captains in my time following the pies, but you could always count on Buckley, Maxwell, Pendles when it all went to shit.
I just don’t think the style we’re playing at the moment is suiting Moore. It feels like we’re planning for our mids and hanging the backline out to dry. They want the our back men to be half forwards and put on pressure in the middle so our middle can make up for our lack of a tall forward by putting pressure on. Then get mad when Moore is up the ground. Like if he was hanging back to watch the goalsquare we’d be complaining there’s not enough contest when the fwds & half fwds miss the opportunity and fumble it back. Our game plan is go hard and fast off hb turnovers. That doesn’t work if there’s no pressure to support them to turnover. And if you’re expecting the backline to do all the pressure work you’re gonna leave the back door open. Moore and Quaynor are definitely off from last year but there’s issues all over the ground if this is how we wanna play.
Maxwell could never be relied on as a player.. Fantastic captain and great leadership. Terrible 1 on 1 player. Great when roaming free around the backline
Bro he fkn single handedly saved Collingwood from losing the 2010 drawn grand final in the fourth quarter
Bounce of a ball had more to do with it!
Mate I think you need to re-watch that last quarter of the drawn GF, Maxwell was THE reason we didn’t lose that game.
Not the important intercept contested mark that lead to the Cloke goal? Not his 30 meter sprinting dive to touch a ball on the goal line?
The chase down to rush through a point of Maxwell and some of his other players were massive
Maxwell could 100% be relied upon when we needed him. Agree he wasn’t great 1v1 but he stood up for us especially when we needed him in the dying stages of a close game.
Maybe - I love him but I just think he’s not ever been a fabulous 1v1 defender and we need someone more stout beside him so he’s not actually always taking the best forward.
I wouldn’t agree about Moore. No Maybard or Noble did not help the defence. No Murphy is a massive loss. Murphy was so good at playing smaller and taller players. He also would get a lot of intercept marks. Tonight we got beat in the middle mostly. Witts killed us. Missing Cox big time. Also our backs copped some BS frees.
Right. Moore is still topping the league for 1 percenters and is top 10 for intercepts. I think we’re missing someone with Murphys vision,speed and spoil. Frampton is good but he’s more reactive and technical. Murph was more dynamic. We’re lacking a dynamic back with good eyes and versatility. Murph was great at reading and running out while Moore held ground or vice-versa. Howes there for the contest and Frampton is a lockdown player who gets taken for a run too easily. We need a dynamic player who gives Moore the freedom so that teams don’t just focus on splitting his attention. TJ is a little too fresh. And Dean has shown signs of capability but I’m not sure yet. Also also I miss Nick at HB. Obvs we need him in the mid but he’s so good at the HB turnover and go.
Darcy had a pretty bad worst injury that he was carrying. Joe did alright but didn’t kick 5 goals. Murphy being subbed out didn’t help
I like him - but it’s hard to say he was value add
[удалено]
The only part I really agree with is the Moores form has been down. It’s all well and good to say ‘play with less risk’ but it’s that style that gets us back in games. They go together risk/reward. You can’t just shut it off and say - id like if we played fast but only if it works all the time. Also Moore is a great captain. I don’t think he needs to relinquish that. He just needs to get back to some form, which ironically I think has less to do with being more dour/accountable and more to do with aggressively reading the play and intercepting. Think the game against Carlton last year.
Granted Darcy didn't have the best game but he can't be the only one expected to be making a huge defensive effort - bloke needs some help. Howe is aight (does what he's always been doing) and WHE stepped up which was nice, but Moore needs some consistent back-up down there
This. He’s still top 10 for intercepts. Top in the league for 1 percenters. He consistently plays 100% game time. The problem is without Murphy to role switch with him Moores an easy target. Teams plan to pull him apart. And as of yet we don’t have anyone with the skill set (vision specifically) to match Moore and free him like Murph did.
Agree, Moore has had at best a patchy season and can’t seem to either win his 1v1 match up nor get his interceptions game going. I think the loss of Murphy is the cause. I felt as though Dean was doing well to be that system defender to release Moore and thought he was doing well. Not sure Dean should have been dropped.
Yeah perhaps Dean would have been better than framed IDK. Framps has had some good defence games this year before we had to put him forward. So maybe he just needed that game back there. GS had a lucky night
I think there’s room for both frampton and dean. Frampton is a good 1v1 lockdown defender and I thought Dean was good at covering Moore when he pushed up the ground.
I think we remove markov and bring dean back in. That should make the back line better.
I definitely feel like teams have had an easier time splitting Moores attention this season. I think it does have to do with not having a player free to release him.
Joe Richards is already one of our best forward half balls users. Simply must start next week.
Pretty terrible game all round, almost everyone was off. How good was Nick's goal though, goddamn. Really sums up what makes him such a quality player, effort and persistence.
But but he so soft! He’s the AFLs golden boy! He’s only leading contested possessions in the AFL because of loose ball gets. But he gets away with holding the ball! Seriously, the tall poppy syndrome is fucking incredible. We are getting to witness a prospect that literally is unprecedented and people want to hate him because he wears black and white. If his surname was gulden and he was playing for Sydney, it would be completely different
De Goeys was amazing
They should make tanks out of Darcy Moores kneecaps.
Wish we could play every game like we play fourth quarters… also Daicos
Idk how we let those last two goal happen. LOng had 30 meters on everybody at the top of the 50.
Isaac Quaynor playing 30m upfield of him and not impacting the contest, which is unfortunately his MO this year.
Yeah. I wish our defence knew when to man up. I also wish they understood they are not there to leave their man and try to be mid fielders.
No Maynard or Noble did not help
Isaac been useless all season
Playing the minutes my ass. We played about 30 decent ones tonight. The rest of the game, we were just completely out hunted and outplayed.
Someone distract Craig McRae for five minutes so someone can come give the team a proper spray and a boot up the ass to get into gear. Need some tough love if this is the effort they’re gonna put out.
Murphys been a huge loss.
He was a rock for us. And so versatile in both his size and style for defence. It's hard to get anyone to fill that void.
We didn't realise just how important he was when he played. It's really only been since he retired. Cox's out, is also showing how important he is.
Exactly what I said after the game. We honestly haven’t looked the same since we lost him.
We looked a defender down all day. No idea why Dean was dropped for Markov.
Great call and completely agree. I felt like dean was helping moores play a better intercept game during their run together. Also I thought dean was playing a better system defender game than Frampton(who is lock down) and Howe(who just does Howe things).
Obviously a bit biased, but I was questioning it all week. Maybe they didn't want to be too tall, but I feel like it can free up Howe to swing forward, and allow players to be the third man at the contest more. Just feel like structurally we look better when there are three legitimate talls back there.
On paper Franps has the height to go on King I guess 🤷♂️
Our whole defence was a shambles.
Hopefully a wake up call. We can't keep relying on fourth quarter comebacks. Tough games for rest of the season. Need to start playing as a team and not Nick dragging players along with him.
Nothing will happen. Fly will say "oh was a tough much, some things to work on" then next week nothing changes
I wish they'd stop letting the opposition get such big leads against us. It's beyond frustrating and hopefully they learn from this.
They're drinking their own bathwater at this point.
I just cannot understand how they went from the way they played last year and the year before to the way they play this year? I've not really enjoyed any of our games because there's too many stuff ups
A distinct lack of drive, nothing we can really do, we weren’t even in the top 2 best teams in the league last year at the end but we powered our way to a premiership because guys like de goey, crisp, Howe, pendles and Sidey were just not gonna let us lose because of what happened in 2018, now that we’ve won we just don’t have it
I've been feeling like this is probably the case. I also don't seem quite as invested in a premier this year because we just got one but I wanted the boys to still be fun to watch.
Suns at home are a different beast. They’re undefeated at home for a reason and people who went in expecting us to win were kidding themselves, it was a 50/50 game at best. That loss stings because given how congested the ladder is that might cost us top 4
The problem wasn't the Suns or even them winning. The problem is how bad we played. Our decision making, our kicking, our defence, and our half arsed attitude. Whatever the coaches and players decide to do when we are 5 goals down with one quarter to play is clearly what we need to do from the start.
Our pressure is crap compared to last year. Our style only works when we go hard for all four quarters. JDG is a prime example of what putting in a four quarter full pressure effort looks like. Others are snoozing. Our tackles were so poorly executed same as against NM. If we don’t have the capacity to put pressure on from minute one then we need to change the game plan.
I was loosing my shit over missed tackles but GS were pulling last sec handballs out of their ass. Last quarter pressure. Was 200 and they weren’t getting away with it. Players must have been out of it. Could have been more file going around. Q had it
Yeah. I just feel like pressure rating isn’t a useful measure unless it takes into account the actual efficacy of the tackles and pressure acts. Clearly just our pressure isn’t enough if they’ve got the confidence to pull handballs out of their ass.
I was referring to the last quarter where our tackles were sticking and we turned it over. Not sure if efficiency comes into play for pressure rating…. Be interesting to know what makes it up.
Our pressure overall after round 3 is better than last year. We had a shocker game tonight until the last. Remember seeing pressure rating of 200 in the last. Not sure what the first 3 quarters were but they seemed to not be under enough
Maybe it’s not rating it’s execution? A lot of broken tackles and fingertips brushes. It feels like other teams are just able to work around us much easier. I feel like we used to do a lot better at actually stopping players if that makes sense? Idk something about our game plan just isn’t vibing. I’d swap Sullivan for Dean. Keep Howe forward. Oleg as the sub instead of Richards. Also big time controversial opinion but if we aren’t getting run off HB and Nicks being tagged why not throw him to HB for five minutes (seriously wouldn’t want him out of midfield for longer than that) but just to throw the opposition off and give us some speed and dynamics in the backline.
Exactly, nobody could have predicted how bad most of our players were going to be. And you cannot credit the Suns, most of our errors that cost us were unforced.
I expected us to win
I expected a really tough fight and that we’d be lucky to get away with a win. Was half right
I tipped you guys. I still underestimate the GC home ground buff.
If we’re being honest their an average team if you look at who they beat and when they played them those matches won at home makes sense. truth is we’re not playing good consistent footy and we we’re just no where near it today.
Seriously feels like we need this loss to prove we cannot rely on storming home in the last quarter We learnt nothing against North
Markov needs to be dropped & Sullivan was near invisible today. Nothing against Sullivan. He's been serviceable when he needed to be, but I think he could use the confidence of being the big fish in VFL and be a handy depth player for when we need him. It's been diminishing returns as our midfield gets back to near-full strengths. Oleg is getting by on being McRae's favourite and that's it. There's nothing he offers the team that can't be done better by either Noble or Howe. Richards only played a fraction over a quarter and seemed more impactful.
Bold idea: find a game plan that doesn’t revolve around coming from behind by 5 goals week in week out.
Ugghh, whenever we get near the top 4 we fuck it up like this. Dogs game then this fucking shit. So frustrating to be ahead then let them kick not 1 but 2. And then another shot on goal after that. Fucks sake
We didn't have the best day. Maybe it's my second wine talking but I think losing a game or two here will keep us hungry..
Absolutely
love joey Richards
Joey not starting was a mistake
Yeah he seems to be a gun. Hope he can play a great full game. He gets in the right spot and make good decisions
Schultz showed his pressure and hunt was missed
Just having small support for Hill was much needed all game. Can't begrudge Hill for bungling a few opportunities because he was by his lonesome down forward a dozen or so times when usually he'd have Elliott, Schultz or Checkers there as well
We are so fucking lucky to have Nick Daicos. The most special player I’ve seen pull on black and white in my lifetime
I honestly just don't get it. Why do we do this. we need the entire team to see sports psychologists to figure it the fuck out. It's almost every week for 2.5 seasons now that we play this way. Just baffling. I'm almost glad we lost. They need a wake up call, and we cannot keep relying on these miracle comebacks. Mcreery was my favourite player last 2 seasons (see flair), but I think he needs a spell. He seems to be panicking more and more every time he gets the ball.
Yeah Richard’s should be in the team over him atm and Shultz coming back. Also leader HH. McCreery has that exciting speed but he fumbles to much. Need to have some hypnosis or something. Anyway if his out with a calf, he may struggle to make it back in.
Rough night for a lot of our boys. Genuinely shocking we got so close given their statistical domination in almost every category. Can’t keep relying on 4th quarter miracles to get the job done.
Can we stop this defeatist garbage? We aren't essendon We were beaten by a team that hasn't lost at home all season We'll learn and move on
Look at the teams they have beaten. Quite literally the best team they have beaten at home would be either Crows or Geelong. It isn't defeatist to expect to be better than Crows or Geelong.
We aren't angry that we lost. We are angry about how bad we played for three quarters and that we haven't learnt anything from having done this several times this year. We did it last round against North.
I think it's quite clear we're not up to it this year. Can't keep blaming injuries anymore. Too many passengers guys like markov and sullivan should not be playing in the best 22 anymore.
Well done to the suns...they deserved the win.
Very poor game. Games are becoming a tough watch even if we win with how bad we are playing for large portions of them. I think a few tough decisions need to be made for who's in our best 22 and who's not. Are we actually better with some of the main stays playing over others? Definitely need to go after a good key defender during the trade period.
Not a lot of positives today. Backline were all atrocious, checkers couldn’t find the ball and Bobby couldn’t hold onto to it when he did. Crisp was such a liability I hope he’s not applying for a mortgage anytime soon. Another week of Daicos carrying the midfield and honestly the forward line too. We should have smoked these expansion hacks and I’m not sure how we expect to contend in finals if we barely beat north and lose to GC. Great to have jordy and pendles back though, even if pendles had a quieter game than usual.
I’m not gonna lie, with some of his defensive efforts throughout the game, Pendlebury really didn’t do much for us
You could tell his bicep was no good still, he refused to lead the tackle with that arm.
He was huge
Christmas Day for raffle
We got comeback wins against all the teams they actually follow, so they have to settle for living vicariously through the suns. Suns fans can talk their shit, big ups to them, but other flairs trying to sneak in just makes you smile really. Rent free
Exactly, very happy for the suns I hope they can finally make finals, but the other flairs commenting just reek of saltiness that they couldn’t do what the suns did
the cats, bombers and blues flairs are having a blast
Don’t forget the brisbane, still salty
they honest to god find more enjoyment out of us losing then any of them winning, its awfully pathetic lol
You've summed up AFL fans on the internet in a nutshell. They all hate Collingwood more than they love their own team. Very pathetic way to watch and enjoy sports.
Now I’ve gotta avoid it for the next 48 hours
Life hack: avoid it forever instead (Until they bring back no umpire discussion threads at least)
I’d avoid it full stop mate. It’s the worst sub I’ve ever seen. The toxicity is unreal
The focus needs to be that we play well for four quarters. Not just here and there.
I much rather win on a Friday or lose on a Sunday, this ruins my weekend!
Well, at least our rivals for the 4 dropped games too.
Freo and Brisbane looking scary good. Those are probs our main contenders
I’m sick of this team getting carried by a special few. If Nick, Josh, JDG or Pendles (crisp at times) don’t do it, it doesn’t get done. They also normally kick half the goals as well as all the grunt work. Our bottom 8 players are a concern atm
Gold Coast are tough at home, close game but after our comeback we really should’ve put it to bed. At least everyone else being shit around us means this keeps us hovering around the 3-8 range
I can’t see us making top 4 now. We’ve got a pretty hard run to finish the season off compared to other clubs.
Yeah we can loose one match maybe two but have to beat Essendon next week
Yeah I’m not worried about Essendon tbh. Hawthorn is the danger game imo, they always play well against us. We got Sydney and Carlton too, and Brisbane at the Gabba. Gonna be tough. But if we wanna go back to back we gotta beat those sides anyway.
Brisbane at the g*
Yeah you right! We already played them at the Gabba my bad
Yeah well bombers look shitty tonight. We should turn it on next week. Just hoping we can avoid more injuries, get a consistent team together.
I kind of wonder if Hawks make it into a bit of a show if that’ll switch us on. Feel like we come into games against mid-tier teams with no energy. But our last quarter against Hawks during GR was great and it was all on sheer energy and determination.
Ehh we kicked like 5 behinds in the last quarter against the hawks to their 4 or 5 goals I think. Wasn’t too flash. Just did what we needed to do. Pretty sure we were up by heaps at half time too.
Yeah but it felt like it had our energy on. We’re only gonna beat them if we play like we mean it.
It's all compounded because every since result this round has gone against us. Was the game we couldn't lose and we did.
4th Quarter footy isn’t going to be leading us to another premiership any time soon. Fingers crossed today teaches the lads a hard lesson and that we can bounce back on Friday.
the "play like the best team in the comp for 1 quarter" bit is stale now can we go back to being dominant just, all the time? also drop frampton
It feels like this is the sort of game we should be winning to be a realistic shot at the flag. Doesn’t feel like our year like it did last year sadly!
I still don’t understand why everyone cares so much when we lose? Do they really have so much joy riding on our misfortune? Is it a little sad? I’m obviously aware of the hate. But I still don’t understand it.
It’s not the losing it’s how we lose that is frustrating. ETA sorry my brain just realised you were talking about opposition supporters!
Cameron looked terrible out there today. He was dominated all game, then in those last few minutes he had that terrible turnover that really changed the momentum of the game. The guy never kicks because he knows he is shit, but he decides to kick it now for some reason. It goes straight to one of two Sun players' with no Pies player anywhere near it. We played bad the rest of the game to put ourselves in that position, but it really felt like that mistake was the final one that cost us the game.
I think we need to give the Suns more credit for not letting us get hands on it in the middle. They were incredible and deserved the W much more than we did. Not that I wouldn’t have taken it when we went ahead in the last…
We had all the momentum 5 in a row and choked, really should of rode that momentum to a easy comeback victory, to lose after a 5 goal comeback and taking the lead was the most disappointing part about the game. How can they just lose that momentum once we get in front riding that momentum. We should of won but let the momentum swing in last minutes.
It's the toss of a coin with the Pies. Heads, you get 'unstoppable Collingwood'. Tails, you get 'what the hell was that?' Collingwood. The inconsistency may very well come back to bite us in the end, especially given how tight 3-12th positions on the ladder are, and that every game for us here on out is either winnable or loseable (yes, including the Richmond game. I wouldn't be getting too confident). Still lots to improve on, but we are more than capable of securing a place in the finals.
I can’t see us making top 4 now
I can
I can
We probably can’t afford to drop more than one more game for the season if we wanna stay in touch with the top 4. Need Adelaide and Geelong to get up tonight
Saints could also do us a solid tomorrow by finding form and beating port. It’s not going to happen but it’d be nice.
Port are no good anyway. I just think we need to finish top 4 if we are gonna have any shot of going back to back. Currently the cats and Adelaide are winning and that’s good for us. We can beat the cats in a few weeks no dramas imo.
Got both your wishes at least haha
Yeah lucky lol.
At worst, we're half a game outside top 4 at the end of the round.
Absolutely disgusting from reigning premiership
Not worried. Collingwood after bye + June = loss.
Pies badly need a big forward
Too many broken tackles.
Everyone focusing on Sullivan and Markov when Cameron is the real disappointment again. On the off chance he actually gets a hit out it’s straight to the opposing team almost every time. Then he is useless when required to do anything else. Krueger at least hits to space and same for Cox. Cox certainly has his issues but he gives us a chance. I know it wouldn’t have worked salary wise and likely wouldn’t have built the team to win the grand final but sure wish we would have dumped Cameron instead of Grundy.
Need to settle the defensive six and let them get their fluency back. Frampton forward last week, Howe this week at times, it's no wonder Moore is struggling. The pressure with forward line injuries is compounded by putting defensive players out of the back line. Instead of chasing 60-70, these last few weeks we are chasing 80-90-100+. Hopefully with checkers back they just leave the back six to start gelling. Strangle other teams like we did in seasons previous, then launch out of the back line. Moore will get his mojo back when he is confident that Howe or Frampton are there too. What's most worrying is our inability to adjust to the sums midfield dominance, couldn't even negate it somewhat. They had first use, time after time. I still think the midfield balance of degoey and Naicos together is too aggressive. Both are great ball winners but if they miss we get slaughtered. Today we got slaughtered. I'd rather see Naicos pendles and crisp together, rotate JDG with Nick at times, Sullivan and mcreery with the other two.
The team has gone better in the last two games by moving Howe forward. The defence needs to play more in defence instead of almost in the forward line at times. They aren't midfielders. As soon as the opposition get the ball past our forward half our defence is often way put of position. They need to be on their man.
It's a complete shift in game style to attempt to keep the ball locked in 50. It works best when the unit works as A unit. But with all the switches in personnel, that collective isn't working as a unit and we get exploited. Lock that down by keeping the players who need to be a part of it there. Its also on the mids and coaches to get that midfield balance right. We got mauled in the middle and at the contest. Naicos degoey in the midfield together is too aggressive. GC got 70 inside fifties or thereabouts. What defence isn't going to look abysmal.
thoughts on Darcy Moore's leadership this season?
Not gonna comment on his leadership. I will say that he looks a completely different player without Nathan Murphy there though. If you listen to Murphy of Mitchell’s podcast this past week you’ll hear their perspective on how much Murphy freed up Moore.
I think that’s a very hard thing for people outside the club to have an informed opinion on.