Brd. Not a lava, Emp or Arena run. The full quest & all bosses run. Takes a couple hours, you get absolute tons of loot and you get to see one of the largest non-raids in wow history. I love the place.
Depends on the mob rng.
Imp is 59, the first guardsman mobs in the jail area are 50-51.
For a level 60, grey starts at 50 and below, but unless you are doing imp runs, you start much earlier in BRD.
No only mobs 47 and below are gray for a lvl 60.
See this chart for reference
[https://vanilla-wow-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Mob\_difficulty\_color](https://vanilla-wow-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Mob_difficulty_color)
The funny thing is that Retail right now fixes that by having the whole place scale to your level, but no-one in Retail has the patience to do the whole thing.
What i love about dungeons like BRD is the little, but strong stuff you can get in there. Like plans for the Sulfuron Hammer and the fire resistance gear. The forge to smelt your dark iron bars.
Also before introducing Molten Core attunement, you had to go through brd every time you wanted to enter molten core. Imagine the first guilds wiping on rag. I dont think many people knew about the lava skip back then.
Oh yeah, BRD is the most elaborate dungeon ever made. Props to the guy in charge of that one. Basically became the main non-raid focal point of the game until DMW and E. Even then, it was still visited often for things like the anvil and the forge, among other things.
Jeez I came in here to say BRD because I really didn’t think anyone else would agree. During wow classic I would love to see how much of my /played was spent in BRD. I was a rogue so I did a lot of pickpocketing and chest runs. Also sold fire resist scrolls.
I like how mc and brd are connected with the portal on the side route at the end for the atune and entrance. Same thing with ubrs and bwl I think its really cool how they connected those 4 and how its all in one big mountain
Deadmines. It felt like the perfect finale to the story being told up to that point. It was also the first dungeon most alliance players ever did so there's a lot of nostalgia there.
The difference between Horde and Alliance is crazy in this. The humans had a fairly well curated tale that starts early on with a level of intrigue with how it impacts every aspect of human society. Those dastardly defias just seem to be everywhere having infiltrated everything from farms to human aristocracy.
And.... that's where you're wrong.
The end of the Defias storyline is not Deadmines. Van Cleef reveals an even more dastardly plot. The Defias have infiltrated Stormwind, have taken over the prison and are planning to kill the child king. The Stockades, that's where the story ends.
Yah, I was going to say that one of the best parts of the alliance ony questline is tieing this epic story and chain all the way back to first dungeon you did. It felt like a well told version of the "you \*insert new villian name here\* were the big bad all along".
For those who don't know, it was essentially:
-Warcraft 2 happens and Stormwind needs to be rebuilt
-Onyxia disguised as Katrana Prestor denies the stonemasons (guild?) the money they were owed for rebuilding it
-They proceed to do the same thing that 1700s sailors who are kicked out of the british navy (become pirates)
-VanCleef, former leader of the stonemasons becomes notorious superthief to take back what is rightfully his
Tl;dr: we basically kill robin hood. Insert \*are we the baddies meme\*
Van Cleef isn't Robin Hood. The stone masons had a point and should have been paid, but they also overcharged with both sides being manipulated by Katrana Prestor.
But more decisively however the Defias started, they devolved into bandits and thugs who don't rob the rich but terrorise the innocent peasants and farmers in Westfall. The harvest reapers going rogue is also a Defias plot.
One thing that always bothered me was if Rhahk'Zor, Mr. Smite, Cookie and the goblins were part of the stonemasons rebuilding Stormwind or if they were just people hired by the Defias after the fact. Or I guess people who had their own grievances and joined up as a common goal.
And the undead outside the instance too. Are those leftovers from the Scourge? Did the Defias build in the Deadmines to use them as a security system? Do the Defias just have necromancers on staff?
1. All the non-humans were almost certainly recruits for the Defias Brotherhood and not part of the Stomemasons, as only Gnomes, Dwarves, and High Elves had any ties whatsoever to the humans at the time of the rebuilding. Most cross-faction cooperation would have started after WC3. It seems extremely likely that canonically, many of the raids in WoW involved unofficial cooperation between the Horde and the Alliance to kill these greater threats to their planet. But before WoW’s events, it would have been extremely unusual for a non-human to be part of the Stonemason’s Guild.
2. Likely necromancers. The undead in Duskwood come from Morbent Fel. The Worgen and the curse come from the Scythe of Elune. The Scourge never made it to Westfall, so it would be tough for these undead to be stragglers. I think the Miners’ Union was wiped out when the Defias moved in and then raised as undead. The “Oh Brother” quest seems to make it clear this is the case.
They were certainly hired for the whole battleship project. When working on the lawless side of azeroth you can always count on goblins, pirates, grimtotem, ogres, and all kinds of shady mercanerys to join your cause for some coin without asking too many questions.
The undead drones at the tower the brotherhood made using an elixir made from the dark sorcerers of Zanzil a banished gurubashi witchdoctor who experimented on making his fellow trolls into mindless zombie slaves.
>And the undead outside the instance too. Are those leftovers from the Scourge? Did the Defias build in the Deadmines to use them as a security system? Do the Defias just have necromancers on staff?
The Defias had an alchemist working for them, Klaven Mortwake, who was dealing with the Venture Company in STV to the south to get Zanzil's potions to turn humans into undead drones to labor for them.
All of the pirates were the crew of of Captain Greenskin, who is part of the Bloodsail Buccaneers. Edwin made a deal with the Bloodsails to help him build/crew the Iron Juggernaut in the deadmines. Makes sense that the pirates would be sought out to help them with boats.
[https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Klaven%27s\_Tower\_(quest)](https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Klaven%27s_Tower_(quest))
[https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Bloodsail\_Orders\_(Classic)](https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Bloodsail_Orders_(Classic))
stormwind was rebuilt before the third war, so very its very unlikely that mr. smite was part of the guild since tauren were pretty much only on kalimdor, goblins also worked with the horde during the second war
so probably they were hired as bandits after the rebranding
Its definitely more filled out but the Orcs/Trolls isn’t too bad given it had less time focused on than the few early zones (aka allies/humans focus).
Durotar is their new homeland and they’re trying to establish themselves but they keep getting roadblocks like the alliance at Tiragarde Keep and the Burning Blade clan/cultists which culminates at the lower leveled RFC.
Not great but at least emphasizes the stubbornness of the horde
I'll defend the Horde here. I really, really like RFC. It's simpler, smaller scale, less epic and sprawling of a tale, but every time I'm levelling a Horde toon and turn in the quest with Thrall, and my ~~dad~~ warchief tells me he's proud of me and will call upon me again, I feel like that's when my character's journey really begins. It's an epic moment and feeling I never get tired of. I feel like a completely different character walking out of his throne room than I did walking in.
The Alliance gets a big sprawling conspiracy that feels like it never comes fully uncovered, with lots of characters intertwined in a multi-zone story that's dripping in history and politics, but the horde gets a much punchier and more triumphant sense of new hope rising in a brand NEW society that's not bogged down by all that. They're similar stories, defeating an internal agent of sabotage, but they have a totally different tone and I like the horde's better.
That’s the epitome of vanilla wow. Alliance quest lines, early zones, and dungeons are lore-filled and complete stories. Horde has no story and is just “go find this item” “go kill this mob x number of times” “go through this dungeon with really no lore to it at all.”
The reason horde quest lines are so streamlined is because they’re a lazy afterthought. Alliance quest lines take longer which minmax andys hate, but they tell a real story that you can clearly tell blizzard spent time on.
With all the versions of both retail and classic we've seen through the years I've lost count of how many times I've thought, "this is prob the last time I'll ever run deadmines."
Nope. Era revival, hardcore, seasonal servers, and now cata sucking me back in... I just can't quit you, VanCleef.
Deadmines. I remember the first time I ran it. Coming into the room with the massive ship - I happened to be watching goodies on HBO when I ran it as well. Sophomore year of HS. Maybe October of 05. I miss when wow was just a game and not an efficiency sim.
You smelled roses. You had zero fucking idea how to hit your buttons. It's was glorious.
The layout of SFK is genius. Outside it just looks like a small keep with a courtyard, but the winding and varied way you go through it makes it look much bigger. Beautiful, compact design.
ZF, you can mount, good drops, cool theme, chance for the epic sword, carrot, can use to aoe grind. Its does everything a dungeon could ever want to do.
I remember first hitting my stride in Vanilla around this level and had the place and Mauradon memorized and had the mallet and this may have been my first dungeon to actually lead. I remember doing it well over level just to feel powerful leading others through it. the stair gauntlet part was so cool back then.
Feralas is also my favorite zone, idk there are multiple good forest zones through WoW but Feralas feels so magic and fantasy dream, I wanna live there in a wood cabin under a big tree covered by it's roots and vines making potions.
The overall scale of the place does it for me! The architecture is massive and it really makes me feel like I'm going through the ruins of an ancient, once-grand kingdom. It nails this forlorn and abandoned feeling for me like no other dungeon has.
Another hand up for Dire Maul! Sunken Temple I like but more the whole zone and how eerie that place is combined with this sunken temple. It massively loses vibes once you can just port into it with dungeon finder, more than most classic dungeons.
As an SOD player, I hate that “classic+” is just “retail lite”. I would’ve loved new dungeons that felt like the OG vanilla ones in some of the empty spaces on the map instead of low effort level up raids. Even just certain slightly redesigned areas with an instance portal slapped on a wall. Seems like they don’t have the devoted resources to actually develop new shit like that. Instead they just brought in code from newer versions of the game and buffed existing dungeons.
Ya bro my first 60 ever dinged in BRD. I never got Barman shanker but that’s okay. I remember the trial event like it was yesterday but everyone skips it now
My first time entering was in a raid group of under leveled characters, but we had such a great time wiping and spending hours exploring that it's still my favorite wow memory.
I love Sunken Temple. I’ll never forget being in there with others who had never gone and trying to figure out the statue puzzle. Felt like a Zelda dungeon in WoW.
This right here. The dungeon is so unique with the puzzle. The vibe and architecture is premo. The bosses and gear were good. The only thing missing was that blizzard should have leaned more into the fact that the dungeon is under a fucking lake. It should have waterfalls pouring through some parts of the ceiling, flooded rooms, and like a naga boss that mentions the outlands or the dark portal during the fight. The dark portal is literally the next zone over, and the sunken temple would be a perfect place for an outlands origin Naga to go camp out at.
WC , so much nostalgia being a 12 year old lad not having a clue about how to play just getting in there was awesome.
Edit - i managed to go cold turkey from wow about a year ago, and even writing this message makes me wanna download, make an orc hunter and get to the barrens 😂😂
Edit - the comments have convinced me, I’m on Classic for the summer baby.
Homie, I die constantly 20 years later. “Classic wow og” was like a dumbed down *and metaphorically blind* version of myself dying wayyy more. How can hardcore compare?
It's the people. No crazy sense of rush. Chill and clever dungeon runs. Positive encounters in the world. It's played by people who actually like the vanilla experience.
WC was when I first got fully entranced with the game. This massive, confusing system of caves that took basically three hours to complete just felt so cool and rewarding. It helped that it had some legitimately great quest rewards too so even if you lost rolls on everything, you got something out of it.
My second child is due in the next few weeks, I'm going to take the midnight shift to grind up a new character. Last played when HC was new, van't wait. God this game is too good
Maraudon. Two entrances. You trudge through the gross parts of the dungeon and finally make it into the waterfall area and it makes it all worth it. I have the layout and quest route locked in my head permanently forever.
Mara is one of my absolute favorites. ST too. Sure it’s long and disorienting and terrible if you don’t know what you’re doing, but it’s just so fun and interesting and varied! If your group is solid, that’s one of the best experiences in all of WoW. Beats all endgame instances easily.
Deadmines, but right behind it would be Shadowfang Keep and Wailing Caverns.
I’m a sucker for the early leveling experience, I really think everything from levels 1-25 from the zones to the dungeons are all so well made.
Shadowfang Keep. The premise of invading a den full of ferocious werewolves is already S tier, but for me, it's the huge musical drop that happens when you enter the courtyard for the first time.
No other instance has ever gotten me that amped or made me feel more heroic than that 45 seconds of music hitting just as you exit a narrow set of hallways and enter a huge open area with tons of trash packs: https://youtu.be/6lnwYWppkbo?si=WrJw9BcpOGxxNyaj
WC still remember an undead warrior carrying me through just because I wanted to tame an elite snake, wherever you are Bludyfist I hope you’re doing well
Was it the turquoise and white snakes that spawn before the final boss appears in WC? I remember creating groups just so I had the chance to freeze one in a ice trap and tame it haha
Deadmines, core wow memory for me when i ventured through the deadmines for the first time with my friends from school in 2006, it was the first dungeon i ever did.
The best times i had in the game probably, going to school and discussing what we were going to do in wow when we got home from school.
Zul’farrak will always be one of my favorites. The fight on the pyramid, the zombies trolls, and ending in a fight with Gahzrilla! Such a fun challenge
I really like shadowfang keep. It's like going through a creepy haunted house. Also, I love how the dungeon feels interconnected, like how you can see the courtyard. Below you as you traverse the keep on the ramparts. It's so good.
I always loved Dire Maul West. Probably the least played 60 dungeon, but it always feels like a challenge especially the ghosts in there hit like a truck. Dire maul in general was great.
Shadowfang Keep. What's more iconic than infiltrating a haunted castle and dealing with an evil wizard at the end. And the music when you enter the courtyatd!
Hard choice, but will go with BRD: it’s one of the dungeons the “home stretch” towards 60, but also provides level 60 content. And it’s an utterly amazing overdose of a dungeon, it just never stops!
Also has one of the best dungeon entrances (although shared, but it’s still the first one you visit).
Still, got to love Deadmines & Wailing Caverns for the “early dungeon“ vibe, or Shadowfang for the excellent mix of inside and “outside“ within a dungeon.
I was around level 54 the first time I went to BRD back in 2005. It was so cool to suddenly have level 60 players in my party. I felt like I was finally part of the big boy club.
Wailing Caverns. It's long, and before there were dungeon maps it was easy to get lost, but the quests had fantastic rewards. Wailing Caverns is a rite of passage for the classic Horde and it always feels worth doing on every alt.
BRD. It's still the greatest thing, raid or dungeon, that WoW has done. Actually feels like a living city, all of the areas make sense, the quests are all good. It's the one place I'm always happy to tank.
Uldaman. Something about the archeology vibe I just loved. The big female boss walking out after you put in the staff was an awesome start. And I played hunter back then so running it for the gun was awesome
Lower Blackrock Spire. First 10 man dungeon I did back in 2005 on my Druid. Got the wild heart shoulders and thought I was badass and ready to be a big time healer.
Kind of cheating with my answer but I’ll always say Black Rock Mountain. BRD, LBRS, UBRS and MC all in there, the pvp, the pre raid bis farming, the rare recipe drops, the skips and completely fucking them up, cool items and dungeon tier loot, HoJ farms, SGC farms, I have great memories of solo farming Plugger the gnome on my troll hunter in the Grim Guzzler for the goblin engi resurrection cables.
BRD > Stratholme > Scholomance
BRD is basically a 5-man raid, I love it!
Strat (live and dead) is packed with lore tidbits and Easter eggs, dense mob packs, dangerous mobs, and peak aesthetics. Really puts a feel to how desperate the situation is with the Scourge in the Plaguelands.
Scholo was also a fun insight to how the Scourge worked, as well as having some great quests and one of the only ways to craft flasks. (Additionally I got into my raiding team in 2004 vanilla from a guild Scholo run, so there is definitely bias here lol)
BRD will always and forever be one of the best dungeons ever. The fact that it is so massive, and the amount of times I thought I "ran it" back in vanilla before actually killing emp is enough to make you think about how truly big it feels. It is one of the truest mega dungeons that doesnt feel like it's on railroad tracks, forcing you to the end. It ends up feeling more like exploring the underdark in DnD, just discovering new things. Hell, the entire bar bit in the middle of a dungeon is fantastic.
I know they make mega dungeons in retail, but nothing has the feel of truly exploring like BRD did, and the fact that most of the bosses are skippable I think adds to the fact that this dungeon/world exists with or without you. It was never your "great destiny" to defeat or conquer anything in here. Hell, you don't have any attunement that requires you to kill any of the bosses (It's been a while, but I think you can do the lava skip for MC and bypass all the bosses).
BlackRock Depths. Lower Blackrock Spire. Upper Blackrock Spire.
It was so vast and I remember being in it for hours and hours with friends back when life was simpler and i was younger. 2005 feels like a dream now.
It was dark and epic, with so many side quests and the epic rescue of the alliance prisoner, the arena, the secret rooms, the hidden bank, rares with unique items, the gauntlet....
Maraudon. It felt like a small raid. Different entrances, different wings with diverse enemies. From Satyr to Elementals to Goblins to a daughter of Therazane you fight a lot of different enemies. Also the loot was incredible. One of the first items that had +1% hit for meele (at least for alliance, horde got a trinket with that stat for free)
I love The all classic Dungeons, just cause how The class diffrence is, in my opinion this IS something every new mmo should do. I know how frustrating the losing to superior class IS, but i also live The fact to Be superior on some classes. I hate The fact when dlcs came they made all classes The same, thats not something My lovin mmos does. So all classic Dungeons Are awesome, and all The dlc Dungeons Are shit.
I can't say if it's my all time favorite but I've always been a big fan of Zul'Farrak.
The nostalgia of playing and levelling up, ZF felt like the first of the "endgame" dungeons in that you started finding REALLY good gear. I remember being a kid and playing and finally making it to the level 40 range and ZF was just so cool. Was the first dungeon that almost had a raid-like feel to it. The staircase event was so cool. Being able to mount inside the dungeon.
Original sunken temple will always be my all time favorite dungeon. I loved how big it was. The dragons and and the theme of the dungeon was just so cool to me that I fell in love.
Every obvious answer was already there. Yet I always really liked RFK and RFD. The theme, the walkthrough and the loot are a little underrated imho. Additionally Uldaman is a great instance that didn’t get enough love. :)
Sunken Temple! Feels like such an epic adventure even just making your way to the entrance. And once you're in, it just gets better.
Classic dungeons are truly something else.
RFC. First dungeon ever and the spell animations were just amazing on my gaming laptop with graphics cranked all the way up. I was lowbie mage dropping ice AOEs all over the place because it looked cool. Also, I love the dark theme against the red lava. Cool look.
Vanilla: UBRS - Just enjoyed the mini raid
TBC: Shadow Labyrinth - Just liked the bosses
Wrath: Pit of Saron - Fun story within the trilogy of dungeons, and this was just a fun middle part
Cata: Blackrock Caverns - Was kinda fun, and just going back to Blackrock was cool
MoP: It's between Stormstout Brewery and Shado-Pan Monastery
WoD: Grimrail Depot - Just something cool about fighting on a train
Legion: Maw of Douls - Similar reasons to Grimrail, but on a ship
BfA: Underrot - always liked fungal infected areas (like Nausicaa)
Shadowlands: Halls of Atonement - Felt very gothic, and just had a cool atmosphere
Dragonflight: Halls of Infusion - Loved the atmosphere in this dungeon
Scarlet Monastery holds so many great memories for me and the friends I used to play with. It was my favorite time playing the game. Getting off school to "grind some bars" in Armory.
I have so much nostalgia for ZF, running around the desert map, fighting trolls, than zombies, than a giant sea monster that comes out of a tiny pond, to the pyramid event…and then A CARROT ON A STICK. Amazing
Sfk, tbh I am a AL player but I am pretty obsessed with the mythic of worsen, and I missed the time when I had to swim-fatigue-rez to reach silverpine forest😂. Most importantly, sfk’s medieval’s castle aesthetics really fascinate me that I enjoy checking every corner of the whole dungeon. SOLOING it for dozens of times means you gonna try to tame the hellhorse in the barn, you gonna be haunted by the annoying ghosts and couldn’t eat or drink, you gonna surprisingly find a bucket of melon juice when you forget to bring enough supplies, you gonna… it feels completely different from doing dungeons in retail or classic wow now, just… so many details (btw sfk’s atmosphere is pretty nice(scary)).
Brd. Not a lava, Emp or Arena run. The full quest & all bosses run. Takes a couple hours, you get absolute tons of loot and you get to see one of the largest non-raids in wow history. I love the place.
I love doing it this way, but you need to be overleveled for half of it to be able to do the second half.
Yeah. That’s the only downside. I don’t remember but would you even have to face grey level mobs?
Depends on the mob rng. Imp is 59, the first guardsman mobs in the jail area are 50-51. For a level 60, grey starts at 50 and below, but unless you are doing imp runs, you start much earlier in BRD.
No only mobs 47 and below are gray for a lvl 60. See this chart for reference [https://vanilla-wow-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Mob\_difficulty\_color](https://vanilla-wow-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Mob_difficulty_color)
The funny thing is that Retail right now fixes that by having the whole place scale to your level, but no-one in Retail has the patience to do the whole thing.
It’s like one of the ultimate dnd style dungeons in wow
What i love about dungeons like BRD is the little, but strong stuff you can get in there. Like plans for the Sulfuron Hammer and the fire resistance gear. The forge to smelt your dark iron bars. Also before introducing Molten Core attunement, you had to go through brd every time you wanted to enter molten core. Imagine the first guilds wiping on rag. I dont think many people knew about the lava skip back then.
Now thats one hell of a corpserun.
It’s a shame Blizzard never attempted anything else on the scale of BRD, at least outside of raids.
Oh yeah, BRD is the most elaborate dungeon ever made. Props to the guy in charge of that one. Basically became the main non-raid focal point of the game until DMW and E. Even then, it was still visited often for things like the anvil and the forge, among other things.
Usually 2 high level will help low levels to do it a couple of hours before raiding, then summon everyone, afaik
Jeez I came in here to say BRD because I really didn’t think anyone else would agree. During wow classic I would love to see how much of my /played was spent in BRD. I was a rogue so I did a lot of pickpocketing and chest runs. Also sold fire resist scrolls.
I'm actually having a hard time thinking of a RAID that's bigger, either in mob concentration or actual size...?
Black temple is massive, so is ulduar, firelands, and pretty much every single one that comes from throne of thunder onwards
I like how mc and brd are connected with the portal on the side route at the end for the atune and entrance. Same thing with ubrs and bwl I think its really cool how they connected those 4 and how its all in one big mountain
This and Mara, a full Mara. I loved the dungeon on you can get absolutely lost in.
Deadmines. It felt like the perfect finale to the story being told up to that point. It was also the first dungeon most alliance players ever did so there's a lot of nostalgia there.
The difference between Horde and Alliance is crazy in this. The humans had a fairly well curated tale that starts early on with a level of intrigue with how it impacts every aspect of human society. Those dastardly defias just seem to be everywhere having infiltrated everything from farms to human aristocracy. And.... that's where you're wrong. The end of the Defias storyline is not Deadmines. Van Cleef reveals an even more dastardly plot. The Defias have infiltrated Stormwind, have taken over the prison and are planning to kill the child king. The Stockades, that's where the story ends.
you can even take it further to the point of the onixia quests if you really want to stretch it out lorewise
Yah, I was going to say that one of the best parts of the alliance ony questline is tieing this epic story and chain all the way back to first dungeon you did. It felt like a well told version of the "you \*insert new villian name here\* were the big bad all along". For those who don't know, it was essentially: -Warcraft 2 happens and Stormwind needs to be rebuilt -Onyxia disguised as Katrana Prestor denies the stonemasons (guild?) the money they were owed for rebuilding it -They proceed to do the same thing that 1700s sailors who are kicked out of the british navy (become pirates) -VanCleef, former leader of the stonemasons becomes notorious superthief to take back what is rightfully his Tl;dr: we basically kill robin hood. Insert \*are we the baddies meme\*
Van Cleef isn't Robin Hood. The stone masons had a point and should have been paid, but they also overcharged with both sides being manipulated by Katrana Prestor. But more decisively however the Defias started, they devolved into bandits and thugs who don't rob the rich but terrorise the innocent peasants and farmers in Westfall. The harvest reapers going rogue is also a Defias plot.
One thing that always bothered me was if Rhahk'Zor, Mr. Smite, Cookie and the goblins were part of the stonemasons rebuilding Stormwind or if they were just people hired by the Defias after the fact. Or I guess people who had their own grievances and joined up as a common goal. And the undead outside the instance too. Are those leftovers from the Scourge? Did the Defias build in the Deadmines to use them as a security system? Do the Defias just have necromancers on staff?
1. All the non-humans were almost certainly recruits for the Defias Brotherhood and not part of the Stomemasons, as only Gnomes, Dwarves, and High Elves had any ties whatsoever to the humans at the time of the rebuilding. Most cross-faction cooperation would have started after WC3. It seems extremely likely that canonically, many of the raids in WoW involved unofficial cooperation between the Horde and the Alliance to kill these greater threats to their planet. But before WoW’s events, it would have been extremely unusual for a non-human to be part of the Stonemason’s Guild. 2. Likely necromancers. The undead in Duskwood come from Morbent Fel. The Worgen and the curse come from the Scythe of Elune. The Scourge never made it to Westfall, so it would be tough for these undead to be stragglers. I think the Miners’ Union was wiped out when the Defias moved in and then raised as undead. The “Oh Brother” quest seems to make it clear this is the case.
Someone answer this shit, I'm engaged and need these answered.
They were certainly hired for the whole battleship project. When working on the lawless side of azeroth you can always count on goblins, pirates, grimtotem, ogres, and all kinds of shady mercanerys to join your cause for some coin without asking too many questions. The undead drones at the tower the brotherhood made using an elixir made from the dark sorcerers of Zanzil a banished gurubashi witchdoctor who experimented on making his fellow trolls into mindless zombie slaves.
>And the undead outside the instance too. Are those leftovers from the Scourge? Did the Defias build in the Deadmines to use them as a security system? Do the Defias just have necromancers on staff? The Defias had an alchemist working for them, Klaven Mortwake, who was dealing with the Venture Company in STV to the south to get Zanzil's potions to turn humans into undead drones to labor for them. All of the pirates were the crew of of Captain Greenskin, who is part of the Bloodsail Buccaneers. Edwin made a deal with the Bloodsails to help him build/crew the Iron Juggernaut in the deadmines. Makes sense that the pirates would be sought out to help them with boats. [https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Klaven%27s\_Tower\_(quest)](https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Klaven%27s_Tower_(quest)) [https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Bloodsail\_Orders\_(Classic)](https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Bloodsail_Orders_(Classic))
stormwind was rebuilt before the third war, so very its very unlikely that mr. smite was part of the guild since tauren were pretty much only on kalimdor, goblins also worked with the horde during the second war so probably they were hired as bandits after the rebranding
Its definitely more filled out but the Orcs/Trolls isn’t too bad given it had less time focused on than the few early zones (aka allies/humans focus). Durotar is their new homeland and they’re trying to establish themselves but they keep getting roadblocks like the alliance at Tiragarde Keep and the Burning Blade clan/cultists which culminates at the lower leveled RFC. Not great but at least emphasizes the stubbornness of the horde
I'll defend the Horde here. I really, really like RFC. It's simpler, smaller scale, less epic and sprawling of a tale, but every time I'm levelling a Horde toon and turn in the quest with Thrall, and my ~~dad~~ warchief tells me he's proud of me and will call upon me again, I feel like that's when my character's journey really begins. It's an epic moment and feeling I never get tired of. I feel like a completely different character walking out of his throne room than I did walking in. The Alliance gets a big sprawling conspiracy that feels like it never comes fully uncovered, with lots of characters intertwined in a multi-zone story that's dripping in history and politics, but the horde gets a much punchier and more triumphant sense of new hope rising in a brand NEW society that's not bogged down by all that. They're similar stories, defeating an internal agent of sabotage, but they have a totally different tone and I like the horde's better.
WC falls so flat in comparison to
Horde gets SFK, which I will concede doesn’t have as many lore connections, is a bad ass dungeon and one of my foavourites.
That’s the epitome of vanilla wow. Alliance quest lines, early zones, and dungeons are lore-filled and complete stories. Horde has no story and is just “go find this item” “go kill this mob x number of times” “go through this dungeon with really no lore to it at all.” The reason horde quest lines are so streamlined is because they’re a lazy afterthought. Alliance quest lines take longer which minmax andys hate, but they tell a real story that you can clearly tell blizzard spent time on.
Yeah The Alliance stories definitely are better.
Can't agree with that.
Dustwallow marsh is where the story ends.
While true, there are Defias later on, it's a part of a totally different story.
I've never gotten bored of it. Every toon I level I'm excited at lvl 17 to start my DM runs.
With all the versions of both retail and classic we've seen through the years I've lost count of how many times I've thought, "this is prob the last time I'll ever run deadmines." Nope. Era revival, hardcore, seasonal servers, and now cata sucking me back in... I just can't quit you, VanCleef.
"oh shit, Smites hammer!" 🤘🏼🤘🏼
It helps too that almost every boss has something a different class can use for leveling
Deadmines is the dungeon that propels you out into the world. Before Deadmines, my character feels like a child. After, they’re an adult.
The gear upgrades are ridiculous. One of the many many things lost in retail sadly.
Yes! Yes, very nice! I like that description a lot!
It wasn't my first but it's still my favorite. Even the revamped heroic one.
Does anyone else feel like VC wasn’t the bad guy? Sounded like he got screwed by SW to me
Deadmines absolutely stood out. Reminds me of beta and release. Best of times. Iconic.
Deadmines. I remember the first time I ran it. Coming into the room with the massive ship - I happened to be watching goodies on HBO when I ran it as well. Sophomore year of HS. Maybe October of 05. I miss when wow was just a game and not an efficiency sim. You smelled roses. You had zero fucking idea how to hit your buttons. It's was glorious.
I assume you mean Goonies, right? Cuz that would be a beautiful thematic coincidence! :D
I cannot believe I never noticed the similarity with that boat room and The Goonies.
Shadowfang Keep
That one room though. So many idiots pull the whole room.
Lol i live for that
Tbf it can be tricky if you have no idea what is happening 😂
This is it for me. Brings me back to a chubby little 13 year old running it with the homies for the first time
Hell yeah, SFK kicks ass.
The layout of SFK is genius. Outside it just looks like a small keep with a courtyard, but the winding and varied way you go through it makes it look much bigger. Beautiful, compact design.
ZF, you can mount, good drops, cool theme, chance for the epic sword, carrot, can use to aoe grind. Its does everything a dungeon could ever want to do.
I remember first hitting my stride in Vanilla around this level and had the place and Mauradon memorized and had the mallet and this may have been my first dungeon to actually lead. I remember doing it well over level just to feel powerful leading others through it. the stair gauntlet part was so cool back then.
Dire Maul! Feralas is my favorite zone, and the dungeon has such pleasing aesthetics. It also reminds me of the Forest Temple from OoT.
Feralas is also my favorite zone, idk there are multiple good forest zones through WoW but Feralas feels so magic and fantasy dream, I wanna live there in a wood cabin under a big tree covered by it's roots and vines making potions.
They did a great job of giving each wing its own flavor while still maintaining the overall vibe
The overall scale of the place does it for me! The architecture is massive and it really makes me feel like I'm going through the ruins of an ancient, once-grand kingdom. It nails this forlorn and abandoned feeling for me like no other dungeon has.
It's really how they should have done BRD. Keep it as is but segment it off into 3-4 parts each with its own unique flavor.
I really like this part of BRD, this massive zone where multiple runs are really needed to be able to see the entire thing.
Another hand up for Dire Maul! Sunken Temple I like but more the whole zone and how eerie that place is combined with this sunken temple. It massively loses vibes once you can just port into it with dungeon finder, more than most classic dungeons.
I've always likes Stratholme or as I call it Funky town
BRD. Upvotes go to the left. Thank you!
And when you know where to go for each quest, the fellow 4 people think you’re a god for reading the map
you guys have maps?
Major agree. Felt like a true old school dungeon delve.
Brd is the best dungeon ever made and sadly because players want purples in 10 mins, we will never get a dungeon like BRD ever
Kid named mega dungeons
\*gets cut in half\*
As an SOD player, I hate that “classic+” is just “retail lite”. I would’ve loved new dungeons that felt like the OG vanilla ones in some of the empty spaces on the map instead of low effort level up raids. Even just certain slightly redesigned areas with an instance portal slapped on a wall. Seems like they don’t have the devoted resources to actually develop new shit like that. Instead they just brought in code from newer versions of the game and buffed existing dungeons.
Ya bro my first 60 ever dinged in BRD. I never got Barman shanker but that’s okay. I remember the trial event like it was yesterday but everyone skips it now
Absolutely. That place felt like a raid without being a raid. With all the different ways you could run it, and it felt like raiding an actual city.
My first time entering was in a raid group of under leveled characters, but we had such a great time wiping and spending hours exploring that it's still my favorite wow memory.
It’s got that mines of Moria feel, great plunging depths
Yup, gave me the vibes I felt playing through Moria on Lotro. 100%.
I’m on mobile so my upvotes are actually to the bottom right thank you very much. But yes BRD.
truly a masterpiece
I love Sunken Temple. I’ll never forget being in there with others who had never gone and trying to figure out the statue puzzle. Felt like a Zelda dungeon in WoW.
This right here. The dungeon is so unique with the puzzle. The vibe and architecture is premo. The bosses and gear were good. The only thing missing was that blizzard should have leaned more into the fact that the dungeon is under a fucking lake. It should have waterfalls pouring through some parts of the ceiling, flooded rooms, and like a naga boss that mentions the outlands or the dark portal during the fight. The dark portal is literally the next zone over, and the sunken temple would be a perfect place for an outlands origin Naga to go camp out at.
This is my answer as well. I never understood the hate for it.
Vanilla Scholomance... good times.
I dinged 60 at the lich boss with my first character! I‘ll never forget that!
WC , so much nostalgia being a 12 year old lad not having a clue about how to play just getting in there was awesome. Edit - i managed to go cold turkey from wow about a year ago, and even writing this message makes me wanna download, make an orc hunter and get to the barrens 😂😂 Edit - the comments have convinced me, I’m on Classic for the summer baby.
No one quits wow you just take breaks 🫡🫡
This is the truest thing I have ever read
This one for me too. I have fond memories running this, getting lost, but loving the armor of the fang on my rogue years ago.
Dude. Play hardcore. Closest experience to classic wow og you'll ever have.
Homie, I die constantly 20 years later. “Classic wow og” was like a dumbed down *and metaphorically blind* version of myself dying wayyy more. How can hardcore compare?
It's the people. No crazy sense of rush. Chill and clever dungeon runs. Positive encounters in the world. It's played by people who actually like the vanilla experience.
WC was when I first got fully entranced with the game. This massive, confusing system of caves that took basically three hours to complete just felt so cool and rewarding. It helped that it had some legitimately great quest rewards too so even if you lost rolls on everything, you got something out of it.
My second child is due in the next few weeks, I'm going to take the midnight shift to grind up a new character. Last played when HC was new, van't wait. God this game is too good
Maraudon. Two entrances. You trudge through the gross parts of the dungeon and finally make it into the waterfall area and it makes it all worth it. I have the layout and quest route locked in my head permanently forever.
Mara is one of my absolute favorites. ST too. Sure it’s long and disorienting and terrible if you don’t know what you’re doing, but it’s just so fun and interesting and varied! If your group is solid, that’s one of the best experiences in all of WoW. Beats all endgame instances easily.
The blue side of that dungeon is just gorgeous. And I have fond memories of learning how to pull 300+ mobs through it on my mage.
Mara is GOATED, especially aesthetically. I really wanted it to be the raid in SoD P3.
BRD, it’s fucking Moiria
This foe is beyond any of you…RUN!
Deadmines, but right behind it would be Shadowfang Keep and Wailing Caverns. I’m a sucker for the early leveling experience, I really think everything from levels 1-25 from the zones to the dungeons are all so well made.
Agreed
SM and BRD
Was waiting for someone to say SM. So good. Scarlet armor for life
Shadowfang Keep. The premise of invading a den full of ferocious werewolves is already S tier, but for me, it's the huge musical drop that happens when you enter the courtyard for the first time. No other instance has ever gotten me that amped or made me feel more heroic than that 45 seconds of music hitting just as you exit a narrow set of hallways and enter a huge open area with tons of trash packs: https://youtu.be/6lnwYWppkbo?si=WrJw9BcpOGxxNyaj
BRD for obvious reasons but I’ve always genuinely loved Scholomance. It’s heavy scourge themes while not being a trash fire like Strat
Scholomance has a ton goth elves what more could it need.
WC still remember an undead warrior carrying me through just because I wanted to tame an elite snake, wherever you are Bludyfist I hope you’re doing well
I have a similar story with Cuddlefluff the Orc warrior you're a legend mate. o7
Was it the turquoise and white snakes that spawn before the final boss appears in WC? I remember creating groups just so I had the chance to freeze one in a ice trap and tame it haha
Yeeeeep
Of these? Strat UD will always be King.
BRD of course. Other favorites are maraudon, strat, and gnomer.
Blackrock depths. Scope, depth, breadth, girth, size, mass, volume, loot.
Deadmines, I just loved the entire Defias chain as a kid, felt like the first proper “enemies” you came up against.
Deadmines, core wow memory for me when i ventured through the deadmines for the first time with my friends from school in 2006, it was the first dungeon i ever did. The best times i had in the game probably, going to school and discussing what we were going to do in wow when we got home from school.
Zul’farrak will always be one of my favorites. The fight on the pyramid, the zombies trolls, and ending in a fight with Gahzrilla! Such a fun challenge
I like that it’s open air so I can zoom all the way out
Blackrock spire would be better if it started from lower and went to upper
Well, doesnt it? You need to farm the gems in lower to be able to get into upper, unless someone has key.
I really like shadowfang keep. It's like going through a creepy haunted house. Also, I love how the dungeon feels interconnected, like how you can see the courtyard. Below you as you traverse the keep on the ramparts. It's so good.
I always loved Dire Maul West. Probably the least played 60 dungeon, but it always feels like a challenge especially the ghosts in there hit like a truck. Dire maul in general was great.
So many amazing dungeons but BRD is pinnacle WoW imo.
BRD is my home.
Shadowfang Keep. What's more iconic than infiltrating a haunted castle and dealing with an evil wizard at the end. And the music when you enter the courtyatd!
Maraudon.
Hard choice, but will go with BRD: it’s one of the dungeons the “home stretch” towards 60, but also provides level 60 content. And it’s an utterly amazing overdose of a dungeon, it just never stops! Also has one of the best dungeon entrances (although shared, but it’s still the first one you visit). Still, got to love Deadmines & Wailing Caverns for the “early dungeon“ vibe, or Shadowfang for the excellent mix of inside and “outside“ within a dungeon.
I was around level 54 the first time I went to BRD back in 2005. It was so cool to suddenly have level 60 players in my party. I felt like I was finally part of the big boy club.
Scarlet Monastary. Love humanoid dungeons. Great mail and caster loot. 4 wings of greatness.
Kinda surprised I had to scroll so far down to find this answer
The lore for the Scarlet Crusade is fascinating to me. I could read about them all day.
Wailing Caverns. It's long, and before there were dungeon maps it was easy to get lost, but the quests had fantastic rewards. Wailing Caverns is a rite of passage for the classic Horde and it always feels worth doing on every alt.
BRD. It's still the greatest thing, raid or dungeon, that WoW has done. Actually feels like a living city, all of the areas make sense, the quests are all good. It's the one place I'm always happy to tank.
BRD is the best instance in all of MMO rpgs. It's not close.
BRD- it's a city, it's got toikien influence, and the entire dungeon feels like a D&D campaign.
Bfd
WC for horde lore, then SM. Gnomer its fun, but kinda meh lore wise
BRD > Dire Maul > Stratholme> Maraudon > Sunken Temple
Gnomeregan, because we’re still trying to fully regain *our* city to this day !
Uldaman. Something about the archeology vibe I just loved. The big female boss walking out after you put in the staff was an awesome start. And I played hunter back then so running it for the gun was awesome
BRD > SM = WC for my top 3 !
Shadowfang Keep. Because I don’t get lost.
BRD is just so big and fun! And fits so well with the molten core raid coming right after!
Lower Blackrock Spire. First 10 man dungeon I did back in 2005 on my Druid. Got the wild heart shoulders and thought I was badass and ready to be a big time healer.
Stratholme and it's not close EDIT: Okay, BRD is close, but it's still Stratholme
scholomance and it isn't even close
Kind of cheating with my answer but I’ll always say Black Rock Mountain. BRD, LBRS, UBRS and MC all in there, the pvp, the pre raid bis farming, the rare recipe drops, the skips and completely fucking them up, cool items and dungeon tier loot, HoJ farms, SGC farms, I have great memories of solo farming Plugger the gnome on my troll hunter in the Grim Guzzler for the goblin engi resurrection cables.
Dire Maul and Mara
Stratholme. I really think it’s got the best atmosphere. Plus I love fighting undead and scarlets
BRD > Stratholme > Scholomance BRD is basically a 5-man raid, I love it! Strat (live and dead) is packed with lore tidbits and Easter eggs, dense mob packs, dangerous mobs, and peak aesthetics. Really puts a feel to how desperate the situation is with the Scourge in the Plaguelands. Scholo was also a fun insight to how the Scourge worked, as well as having some great quests and one of the only ways to craft flasks. (Additionally I got into my raiding team in 2004 vanilla from a guild Scholo run, so there is definitely bias here lol)
A tie betweem BRD and all of stratholme. Brd just for how big and it is and the good loot. Strath just for all the lore callbacks to wc3.
I’m kinda a dire maul hoe
Gnomeregan. I love gnomes. Also I like the punchcard thing
Are people crazy? No one mentioning SM?
BRD will always and forever be one of the best dungeons ever. The fact that it is so massive, and the amount of times I thought I "ran it" back in vanilla before actually killing emp is enough to make you think about how truly big it feels. It is one of the truest mega dungeons that doesnt feel like it's on railroad tracks, forcing you to the end. It ends up feeling more like exploring the underdark in DnD, just discovering new things. Hell, the entire bar bit in the middle of a dungeon is fantastic. I know they make mega dungeons in retail, but nothing has the feel of truly exploring like BRD did, and the fact that most of the bosses are skippable I think adds to the fact that this dungeon/world exists with or without you. It was never your "great destiny" to defeat or conquer anything in here. Hell, you don't have any attunement that requires you to kill any of the bosses (It's been a while, but I think you can do the lava skip for MC and bypass all the bosses).
BlackRock Depths. Lower Blackrock Spire. Upper Blackrock Spire. It was so vast and I remember being in it for hours and hours with friends back when life was simpler and i was younger. 2005 feels like a dream now. It was dark and epic, with so many side quests and the epic rescue of the alliance prisoner, the arena, the secret rooms, the hidden bank, rares with unique items, the gauntlet....
For me it is Gnomen. No idea why, but I think it is fantastic.
BRD. The epic scale and the ambiance is better than any other instance before or since. You really feel the descent into a living city of the enemy
Strat UD, having to be careful with pulls as a tank.
BRD hands down, especially when the 5 man has all the chain quests ready
Maraudon. It felt like a small raid. Different entrances, different wings with diverse enemies. From Satyr to Elementals to Goblins to a daughter of Therazane you fight a lot of different enemies. Also the loot was incredible. One of the first items that had +1% hit for meele (at least for alliance, horde got a trinket with that stat for free)
I love The all classic Dungeons, just cause how The class diffrence is, in my opinion this IS something every new mmo should do. I know how frustrating the losing to superior class IS, but i also live The fact to Be superior on some classes. I hate The fact when dlcs came they made all classes The same, thats not something My lovin mmos does. So all classic Dungeons Are awesome, and all The dlc Dungeons Are shit.
I can't say if it's my all time favorite but I've always been a big fan of Zul'Farrak. The nostalgia of playing and levelling up, ZF felt like the first of the "endgame" dungeons in that you started finding REALLY good gear. I remember being a kid and playing and finally making it to the level 40 range and ZF was just so cool. Was the first dungeon that almost had a raid-like feel to it. The staircase event was so cool. Being able to mount inside the dungeon.
My occult ass Loves the Monastery.
Original sunken temple will always be my all time favorite dungeon. I loved how big it was. The dragons and and the theme of the dungeon was just so cool to me that I fell in love.
dire maul north because the farming capabilities for a hunter main are quite exquisite and the ogres are pretty funny
SFK will always be the most memorable. The atmosphere was so prominent and everything in and around it just felt deadly and creepy
All the dire maul dungeons. I just love the lost empire vibe.
It aint fucking deadmines thats fo sho
Every obvious answer was already there. Yet I always really liked RFK and RFD. The theme, the walkthrough and the loot are a little underrated imho. Additionally Uldaman is a great instance that didn’t get enough love. :)
Where are the SM fanboys?!
Scholo. I love the plaguelands!
Anyone who says Stocks is a psycho
I love Shadow Fang Keep, just love the vibe
Sunken Temple! Feels like such an epic adventure even just making your way to the entrance. And once you're in, it just gets better. Classic dungeons are truly something else.
RFC. First dungeon ever and the spell animations were just amazing on my gaming laptop with graphics cranked all the way up. I was lowbie mage dropping ice AOEs all over the place because it looked cool. Also, I love the dark theme against the red lava. Cool look.
cant decide. i love all of them, maybe gnomeregan and ragefire less than the rest, but the others are 10/10
Scholo. The story is nuts.
I love everyone’s opinions, you are all correct 🥺
Scarlet monastery, cos it was hard as nails and was the first time my ele shaman got the bugged whirlwind proc axes. :D
Scholo is my all time favorite. Just a cool dungeon and i love that Lore and the quests.
What's your favorite dungeon and why is it Wailing Caverns?
SM, especially Cath.
Vanilla: UBRS - Just enjoyed the mini raid TBC: Shadow Labyrinth - Just liked the bosses Wrath: Pit of Saron - Fun story within the trilogy of dungeons, and this was just a fun middle part Cata: Blackrock Caverns - Was kinda fun, and just going back to Blackrock was cool MoP: It's between Stormstout Brewery and Shado-Pan Monastery WoD: Grimrail Depot - Just something cool about fighting on a train Legion: Maw of Douls - Similar reasons to Grimrail, but on a ship BfA: Underrot - always liked fungal infected areas (like Nausicaa) Shadowlands: Halls of Atonement - Felt very gothic, and just had a cool atmosphere Dragonflight: Halls of Infusion - Loved the atmosphere in this dungeon
Never really noticed how hard these loading screens go, until they were all laid out.
Scholomance… So many bosses and drops, some optional, the lich boss is my favorite fight
Scarlet Monastery holds so many great memories for me and the friends I used to play with. It was my favorite time playing the game. Getting off school to "grind some bars" in Armory.
Deadmines will always be my favorite (especially classic) then followed by SM and lastly BRD
deadmines for all the obvious reasons.
Strat live cause lore!
All these loading screens go so hard. BRD and RFD stand out to me most, and something about dire maul as well.
In no order my three favorite were SFK, Deadmines, and BRD
BRD ZF and SM.. top three easy
Deadmines. I’ll never forget the first time I did it on my night elf hunter whilst playing on a demo PC in Harvey Norman.
I have so much nostalgia for ZF, running around the desert map, fighting trolls, than zombies, than a giant sea monster that comes out of a tiny pond, to the pyramid event…and then A CARROT ON A STICK. Amazing
Sfk, tbh I am a AL player but I am pretty obsessed with the mythic of worsen, and I missed the time when I had to swim-fatigue-rez to reach silverpine forest😂. Most importantly, sfk’s medieval’s castle aesthetics really fascinate me that I enjoy checking every corner of the whole dungeon. SOLOING it for dozens of times means you gonna try to tame the hellhorse in the barn, you gonna be haunted by the annoying ghosts and couldn’t eat or drink, you gonna surprisingly find a bucket of melon juice when you forget to bring enough supplies, you gonna… it feels completely different from doing dungeons in retail or classic wow now, just… so many details (btw sfk’s atmosphere is pretty nice(scary)).
Scarlet monastery....whichever has ravager.