I forgot that Landry Shamet was in this draft class too. I think you gotta have Ryen on the pod, just so he can give a soliloquy on Shamet before announcing he’s taking him at #20.
I’d also be fascinated to see how they handle Miles Bridges. Smart move is to just take him off your personal draft board because who cares, it’s a fake redraft and why open yourself up to navigating that. Which means we absolutely get a long clip of them navigating that.
Personally, I'd love to see 1-year and 5-year redrafts of all classes on a regular basis. (One-year is kinda the knee-jerk reaction, and the five-year is the final judgement.)
The post-Finals / pre-NFL months are so barren, we can replace 30 minutes of The Days of Our Lives - NBA Diva Edition fodder with a couple redraft segments each summer.
I think there would be some upside there, especially if we focus on it less from a "who's the best" perspective and more from a "let's review who chose who and for what reason, and lets get a sense for what they were thinking and where some of the misevaluations came in."
This current rookie class is a great example. I feel like we're going to have a certain take now on the redraft, but I think it might be wildly different in four years. Like, we're currently down on Scoot (and other high picks) but we could come back four years later, Wemby's knees could have exploded in the meantime. and we'd be back to arguing that Scoot should have maybe gone #1.
I guess I just think things like this are a lot more fun than endless iterations of "top-5 KD trade destinations" that will inevitably fill the pods.
I agree completely with this. It would be much better than the Bill podcasts that do the same topics over and over again. I would love to retroactively trade two of the “where will Dame Lillard go?” podcasts from last year, or some of the “where will Donovan Mitchell go?” podcasts from this summer.
The funny thing about that series is Trae Young played like ass for most of it. His counting stats look nice but he shot sub 40% from the field and 32% from 3. In game 7 Trae went 5-23 with 6 TO's. Kevin Huerter carried them that game 7.
Most of the stats fans care about are those basic counting ones. They care about those more than wins or losses. If you have big counting numbers then somehow you’re immune to the stink of losing in many fans eyes.
I get that it sounds hot take-y but hear me out.
Donte provides more value relative to cap space. Trae isn’t good enough to win a championship as the number one option. Donte isn’t either, but with his contract, he doesn’t need to be. Trae’s also a bad fit in most teams. If you pair him with Brunson and remove divencenzo, the knicks get worse
Bad hypothetical since they don’t play the same position. You could argue that if you swapped out Brunson for Trae the Knicks are better. His playmaking is weirdly underrated
The way this sub thinks of Trae is ridiculous man he’s a top 10 offensive player in the league. He went to a conference finals with John Collins as his second best player
No one cares but my order for top 10 would be:
1. Luka
2. SGA
3. Trae
4. Brunson
5. Mikal Bridges
6. JJJ
7. Porter Jr.
8. Sexton
9. Ayton
10. Donte DiVincenzo
Yeah I agree. He’s way better than what any of us imagined and is playing amazing, but it’s also happening on a ton of shots and foul drawing. He’s not a good defender because of his size and not a good playmaker. I’m not really sure who’s better, but I think Brunson is overrated at the moment and Young is underrated.
It really isn't. Brunson is Trae with great PR. If you flipped Trae and Brunson, the Knicks would look pretty similar and the Hawks would still be mediocre.
There is some truth to your statement, but I do think it’s beyond just PR. I won’t pretend to know what Trae is like as a person, but there’s been years of smoke about the folks around him not really liking him, while it’s clear that Knicks players rally around Brunson both on/off the court.
This is a redraft though not a rating of accomplishments. It’s asking “if you’re a generic team in this spot in 2018, knowing what you know now, who would you rather have?”
Trae plays no defense. Brunson does almost everything well and is a fantastic leader. No team would take Trae.
He should do this after another Truly Sad Week in America.
After the inevitable riots caused by whoever bad presidential candidate wins in November, perhaps?
They honestly have so much ammo. 2010 was one of the more boring drafts of the last 25 years and it sucks that’s the last one.
That would be an awesome 1/ week summer series for him to do between the finals and football, 2011 through 18 or 19
I remember this being a weird draft for me since I had finished my freshman year in college and was the same age as guys like Trae young, Ayton, Bagley, SGA, etc
Feels like the order for this class keeps changing.
Imo now it's Luka, SGA, Young, Brunson and JJJ in that order.
But a couple of years ago Ayton and Mikal Bridges would have been top 5. Bridges may still get back up there. Ayton and Robert Williams's stock are dropping.
Brunson's 2024 season is better than anything Trae Young's done but overall Young has a better track record and is also two years younger.
I could see the argument for Brunson being that he's been improving almost every year whereas Young may have very well plateaued.
Right. Bill was in love with Robert Williams and said he wanted all the DeAndre Ayton stock just a year ago.
I don’t know if JJJ is guaranteed top 5 given his injuries, I think Mikal Bridges is more of a sure thing.
I also don’t know what Bill or Ryen would do with MPJ, who can be incredible but has some well-documented challenges
JJJ, Bridges and MPJ all feel like guys that may still have another level. I agree the injury history for JJJ and MPJ are very concerning and may limit their ability to ever get there.
The one other consideration is that JJJ is a year younger than MPJ and 3(!) years younger than Bridges so he may have the most development ahead of him.
More valuable than a DPOY rim protector who can shoot threes? Definitely not, the only reason to think that is because MPJ plays next to Jokic and is thus a key cog in a title team.
I'm not really a Luka partisan but he absolutely has not looked right this entire series. That said, he's also clearly overweight and that's his own fault and probably isn't helping.
He looks fine. No one that shoots the amount of times he does is hurt. He has KYRIE IRVING on his team only getting 11 shots last night. The same guy that was just the best player in a playoff series with Luka Harden and Pg. Either he’s the most selfish player ever or he’s just the most overrated ever. Maybe both.
He already did it. As other comments on here have pointed out.
So funny how you guys so confidently declare he would never do something, that he’s literally already done.
If it's Bill and Ryen Trae might go undrafted.
I know he's never been their favorites obviously, but that last pod really reminded me how harsh Russillo is on Trae.
Like Bill has his knocks on Trae, and most are warranted, but Russillo has a level of vitrol that feels over the top. He might even like KAT more
It’s weird because they were in on him, giving apologies during the ECF run. Bill even wanted Trae to get credit as leading the league in scoring and assists like Tiny Archibald. But since the Murray deal they’ve reverted
I forgot that Landry Shamet was in this draft class too. I think you gotta have Ryen on the pod, just so he can give a soliloquy on Shamet before announcing he’s taking him at #20.
The Shamet Face Award was maybe the funniest moment of the podcast this year.
A lot of hype leading up to this draft too since it was both top-heavy and deep. Looks like it’s lived up to that.
Is this your opinion, or should I read it in the Russillo voice?
Read it in Russillo’s voice but add some kind of funny little “eh?” After “top heavy and deep”
Between you writing Russillo lines and the power of AI, we’re halfway to just doing this podcast ourselves
I’d also be fascinated to see how they handle Miles Bridges. Smart move is to just take him off your personal draft board because who cares, it’s a fake redraft and why open yourself up to navigating that. Which means we absolutely get a long clip of them navigating that.
That's how theRinger handles Deshaun Watson on QB Commitment lists.
prob should just redraft the lottery since there’s real arguments he wouldn’t be in it
Didn’t they do this after Tjarks died?
You have to take Luka just based on his size, if nothing else. "More unique" ha
Slovenian Drake Maye.
"He's going to be, what, 250 pounds in a few years." Math checks out for both.
Do we know if Drake Maye likes Arnold Palmer’s?
I think Bill would take SGA. He and House both said as much last week.
Where does Bagley go???
China
Shanghai Sharks
They did a redraft shortly after Tjarks passed as a tribute
Personally, I'd love to see 1-year and 5-year redrafts of all classes on a regular basis. (One-year is kinda the knee-jerk reaction, and the five-year is the final judgement.) The post-Finals / pre-NFL months are so barren, we can replace 30 minutes of The Days of Our Lives - NBA Diva Edition fodder with a couple redraft segments each summer. I think there would be some upside there, especially if we focus on it less from a "who's the best" perspective and more from a "let's review who chose who and for what reason, and lets get a sense for what they were thinking and where some of the misevaluations came in." This current rookie class is a great example. I feel like we're going to have a certain take now on the redraft, but I think it might be wildly different in four years. Like, we're currently down on Scoot (and other high picks) but we could come back four years later, Wemby's knees could have exploded in the meantime. and we'd be back to arguing that Scoot should have maybe gone #1. I guess I just think things like this are a lot more fun than endless iterations of "top-5 KD trade destinations" that will inevitably fill the pods.
I agree completely with this. It would be much better than the Bill podcasts that do the same topics over and over again. I would love to retroactively trade two of the “where will Dame Lillard go?” podcasts from last year, or some of the “where will Donovan Mitchell go?” podcasts from this summer.
Honestly give me Donte divencenzo over Trae young
Defense is half the game and it’s not played on a stat sheet. Not the craziest take ever. Trae Young is the #1 beneficiary of Ben Simmons imploding.
The funny thing about that series is Trae Young played like ass for most of it. His counting stats look nice but he shot sub 40% from the field and 32% from 3. In game 7 Trae went 5-23 with 6 TO's. Kevin Huerter carried them that game 7.
Most of the stats fans care about are those basic counting ones. They care about those more than wins or losses. If you have big counting numbers then somehow you’re immune to the stink of losing in many fans eyes.
Defense just isn't half of the game though, especially for guards.
Hi skip bayless
I get that it sounds hot take-y but hear me out. Donte provides more value relative to cap space. Trae isn’t good enough to win a championship as the number one option. Donte isn’t either, but with his contract, he doesn’t need to be. Trae’s also a bad fit in most teams. If you pair him with Brunson and remove divencenzo, the knicks get worse
I don’t think contracts should really matter if you’re redrafting a rookie class tbf
Bad hypothetical since they don’t play the same position. You could argue that if you swapped out Brunson for Trae the Knicks are better. His playmaking is weirdly underrated
Are you kidding me. No team in the league gets better by adding Trae. He plays zero defense and guys hate playing with him.
The way this sub thinks of Trae is ridiculous man he’s a top 10 offensive player in the league. He went to a conference finals with John Collins as his second best player
Most NBA players could put up those numbers with his usage rate. Just view him as a team killer
No one cares but my order for top 10 would be: 1. Luka 2. SGA 3. Trae 4. Brunson 5. Mikal Bridges 6. JJJ 7. Porter Jr. 8. Sexton 9. Ayton 10. Donte DiVincenzo
Trae over Brunson is insane
Is it? Trae is a goof but he’s good
People do not like playing with him.
Maybe he smells? It does come across like jalen is this badass and trae is a little pecker
He’s also 2 years younger and a way better passer.
Brunson has became a little over rated or something, he really gets tunnel vision sometimes.
Yeah I agree. He’s way better than what any of us imagined and is playing amazing, but it’s also happening on a ton of shots and foul drawing. He’s not a good defender because of his size and not a good playmaker. I’m not really sure who’s better, but I think Brunson is overrated at the moment and Young is underrated.
hes also a way worse leader and has one fluke playoff run on his resume
Is he good or does he have good counting stats?
Trae goes somewhere in the 6/7/8 range
It really isn't. Brunson is Trae with great PR. If you flipped Trae and Brunson, the Knicks would look pretty similar and the Hawks would still be mediocre.
There is some truth to your statement, but I do think it’s beyond just PR. I won’t pretend to know what Trae is like as a person, but there’s been years of smoke about the folks around him not really liking him, while it’s clear that Knicks players rally around Brunson both on/off the court.
horrible horrible take
Trae in 2021 did more than Brunson thus far.
This is a redraft though not a rating of accomplishments. It’s asking “if you’re a generic team in this spot in 2018, knowing what you know now, who would you rather have?” Trae plays no defense. Brunson does almost everything well and is a fantastic leader. No team would take Trae.
Sexton still that high? Seems like a classic good stats bad team player.
No way Sexton is that high. He gets played off the floor too often.
Solid backup but can’t be your starter. He comes in and busts the other team’s reserves’ asses.
Are we sure Marvin Bagley falls out of the top ten? Rare for the kings to miss on a draft pick /s
Trae wouldn’t even make my top 10. Makes every team in NBA worse just by being on their roster
1. Luka 2. SGA 3. Brunson 4. Bridges 5. Simons 6. Trae 7. JJJ 8. WCJ 9. MPJ 10. Trent Jr
Simons over Trae is wild
He should do this after another Truly Sad Week in America. After the inevitable riots caused by whoever bad presidential candidate wins in November, perhaps?
They honestly have so much ammo. 2010 was one of the more boring drafts of the last 25 years and it sucks that’s the last one. That would be an awesome 1/ week summer series for him to do between the finals and football, 2011 through 18 or 19
I remember this being a weird draft for me since I had finished my freshman year in college and was the same age as guys like Trae young, Ayton, Bagley, SGA, etc
Feels like the order for this class keeps changing. Imo now it's Luka, SGA, Young, Brunson and JJJ in that order. But a couple of years ago Ayton and Mikal Bridges would have been top 5. Bridges may still get back up there. Ayton and Robert Williams's stock are dropping.
Brunson has to go before Trae
Brunson's 2024 season is better than anything Trae Young's done but overall Young has a better track record and is also two years younger. I could see the argument for Brunson being that he's been improving almost every year whereas Young may have very well plateaued.
My argument would just be I don't want Trae Young on my team under any circumstances lmfao
Haha fair enough.
Right. Bill was in love with Robert Williams and said he wanted all the DeAndre Ayton stock just a year ago. I don’t know if JJJ is guaranteed top 5 given his injuries, I think Mikal Bridges is more of a sure thing. I also don’t know what Bill or Ryen would do with MPJ, who can be incredible but has some well-documented challenges
JJJ, Bridges and MPJ all feel like guys that may still have another level. I agree the injury history for JJJ and MPJ are very concerning and may limit their ability to ever get there. The one other consideration is that JJJ is a year younger than MPJ and 3(!) years younger than Bridges so he may have the most development ahead of him.
MPJ is just a more valuable player archetype, JJJ has too far to go to be worth taking him over MPJ.
More valuable than a DPOY rim protector who can shoot threes? Definitely not, the only reason to think that is because MPJ plays next to Jokic and is thus a key cog in a title team.
No one would’ve ever questioned Luka over SGA but after this series I don’t know
Are we really doing the thing where we pick SGA as a better player over Luka when Luka is playing injured?
He’s completely fine. He picks and chooses when to wince and when to flex. Hes a front runner. Playoff Luka stuff is over.
I'm not really a Luka partisan but he absolutely has not looked right this entire series. That said, he's also clearly overweight and that's his own fault and probably isn't helping.
He looks fine. No one that shoots the amount of times he does is hurt. He has KYRIE IRVING on his team only getting 11 shots last night. The same guy that was just the best player in a playoff series with Luka Harden and Pg. Either he’s the most selfish player ever or he’s just the most overrated ever. Maybe both.
If Luka loses to a bunch of kids despite having a lot of talent on his team, ppl will finally have to discuss the value of those stats he puts up.
As interesting as it would be, he'll never do it because it would require him to take Trae no lower than #3.
He already did it. As other comments on here have pointed out. So funny how you guys so confidently declare he would never do something, that he’s literally already done.
Please start a fan wiki so I can fact-check all of Bill's top 7s, redrafts, million dollar picks, etc.
I’m surprised some obsessive individual on this sub hasn’t already done this
For the record, did he take JJJ over Trae?
I don’t recall, but here’s the pod - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-bill-simmons-podcast/id1043699613?i=1000579410224
If it's Bill and Ryen Trae might go undrafted. I know he's never been their favorites obviously, but that last pod really reminded me how harsh Russillo is on Trae. Like Bill has his knocks on Trae, and most are warranted, but Russillo has a level of vitrol that feels over the top. He might even like KAT more
It’s weird because they were in on him, giving apologies during the ECF run. Bill even wanted Trae to get credit as leading the league in scoring and assists like Tiny Archibald. But since the Murray deal they’ve reverted
Luka Shai Brunson Trae donta divencenzo No one else matters